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TRUMP TO INFINITY AND BEYOND HQ - The Great and Positive Place (12 Viewers)

GoBirds said:
Interesting spin but wouldn’t the drug companies that actually develop the vaccines be more significant than these countries you are worried about? 
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So a global conspiracy led by the big pharma to suppress news of a vaccine - and withhold administering the vaccine which could save lives - until the US voted Biden in?  How deep does your conspiracy run here?

 
General Malaise said:
So a global conspiracy led by the big pharma to suppress news of a vaccine - and withhold administering the vaccine which could save lives - until the US voted Biden in?  How deep does your conspiracy run here?
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Man I really do enjoy how hard you work to protect your one sided narrative. You’ve defended conspiracies the past four years but now are against them....so weird.  :lmao:

 
pecorino said:
I put a lot (but obviously not all) of the blame of the pandemic on the inadequate response by the President. Look at other countries to see how it could have played out. Are things crappy in Canada or Germany or China? Yes. But relatively speaking, the US suffered more than other developed countries. It's a matter of degrees as to how much blame one puts on the President with respect to the consequences of Covid. I put a lot on him and clearly some folks feel as though the virus was going to do what it was going to do regardless. But data from other countries does not bear that out.
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How are we any worse than Canada or Germany? I have friends in Canada and they are suffering terribly right now with being locked down right now. 

While I dont agree with everything the president has done, one thing people tend to forget (IMO) is that unlike other counties, we are a nation of states. And those states had just as much power, if not more, to dictate their response to this pandemic. Then add to that the blatantly obvious pissing match between republican and democratic governors, and in turn the democratic governors vs the president, there is no way any plan pandemic would have been effective. 

IDK where you live but here in NY we have been bombarded with daily hissy fits directed at the white house by Gov Cuomo. Not a day goes by where he is not on TV cursing the feds for "not providing this..." or "denying that.." But why is it the fed's problem that the state was basically bankrupt before this and couldn't afford to or didn't have enough ventilators, to which the Fed bought them for NY. They also sent the USS Comfort and set up triage tents in Central park that went unused and the ship sent home after seeing only a handful of patients. For months we have been stuck between what seems like divorced parents who both are clearly only looking to outdo each other and DGAF about  what happens to the kids. 

Of the things you list in your original post, most of that I trace back to local control. you are taking pay cuts??.....most business here are still closed at the order of the Governor (not the President) and will/may never open again, while other states are allowing full or partial return to business. The schools are state run and controlled, not federal. Whatever regulations or funding you have are state orchestrated. I'm assuming you are a teacher or in education in some capacity, so IDK how the fed response dictates whatever it is your school is doing. Look around at other states and see who is doing or not doing. 

IMO if you want to blame anyone for your perceived lack of response, it starts locally. I am not absolving Trump of any blame, I think he should have indeed had a stronger message overall, if not to error on the side of caution. But anything that directly effects my day-to-day life is based on my states gov't 

 
glvsav37 said:
IMO if you want to blame anyone for your perceived lack of response, it starts locally. I am not absolving Trump of any blame, I think he should have indeed had a stronger message overall, if not to error on the side of caution. But anything that directly effects my day-to-day life is based on my states gov't 
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There is a lot of blame to go around.  You are absolutely right that our leaders at all levels have mostly failed us.  The reason Trump gets extra/unique blame is:

1. He was POTUS - buck stops with any POOTUS.  He has acknowledged this fact himself.

2. For me - His job was simple while local and state was hard.  He couldn’t even do that correctly - don’t downplay the virus, wear a mask, encourage everyone to take this seriously and wear a mask, give support to the states, get production going on the necessary materials

3. He used it as another means to divide the sides.  People rallied around Bush after 9/11 - not as many would have done that with Trump but many would have.  He would still be President today if he had just made millions of MAGA or Trump masks and passed them out.  Even just a generic patriotic mask.  Instead he thought his best chance to win was to convince people everything was fine when it obviously wasn’t.

 
AAABatteries said:
Instead he thought his best chance to win was to convince people everything was fine when it obviously wasn’t.
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Exactly.  Because he's not a leader.  He simply doesn't understand sacrifice for the greater good. He didn't want to be associated with a deadly pandemic that cratered the economy, so he engaged in magical thinking and tried to wish it away. 

 
First, while I’m not one to shy away from poking fun at The Donald, the following will be completely honest and genuine.  I am neither Democrat nor Republican and despise the 2-party system, but I try to be a realist and understand that is what we have now and look to understand both factions.

What is Trump now to the Republicans, what is his role moving forward?  Does he still represent the party or, with the way McConnell has forcefully worded his rebukes of him, has he been removed from the top?  Is the theory of Trump News Network correct, is he going to pull his supporters with him to some newly created medium or will he tone it down a tad and come back to the MSM?

I'm curious to see how his relationship with the party moves forward now that he’s officially no longer the president.  It seemed he certainly got ignored and shunned there at the end, for a personality so big the send off was quite the whimper.

 
That one guy said:
First, while I’m not one to shy away from poking fun at The Donald, the following will be completely honest and genuine.  I am neither Democrat nor Republican and despise the 2-party system, but I try to be a realist and understand that is what we have now and look to understand both factions.

What is Trump now to the Republicans, what is his role moving forward?  Does he still represent the party or, with the way McConnell has forcefully worded his rebukes of him, has he been removed from the top?  Is the theory of Trump News Network correct, is he going to pull his supporters with him to some newly created medium or will he tone it down a tad and come back to the MSM?

I'm curious to see how his relationship with the party moves forward now that he’s officially no longer the president.  It seemed he certainly got ignored and shunned there at the end, for a personality so big the send off was quite the whimper.
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Kingmaker.  If Congress takes away his ability run in 2024, that may make him even more influential to those that feel the new administration does not represent them.  

 
knowledge dropper said:
Kingmaker.  If Congress takes away his ability run in 2024, that may make him even more influential to those that feel the new administration does not represent them.  
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I think this role starts even before 2024.  If he wants, DJT and his associated PACs, talking heads, etc. can bankroll and push for GOP primary challengers in 2022.

 
I think all this talk of running again for president or starting a media empire is a bunch of malarkey.

I think he makes some noise the nest year or so but then starts to get tuned out by most people as they tire of his shtick. Then soon after, he fades away from everyday conversations like most ex-presidents

 
dawgtrails said:
I think all this talk of running again for president or starting a media empire is a bunch of malarkey.

I think he makes some noise the nest year or so but then starts to get tuned out by most people as they tire of his shtick. Then soon after, he fades away from everyday conversations like most ex-presidents
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I agree. Millions of people, sadly, were fooled by the Q nonsense.  I expect a large percentage of them aren't willing to be made a fool again. 

 
dawgtrails said:
I think all this talk of running again for president or starting a media empire is a bunch of malarkey.

I think he makes some noise the nest year or so but then starts to get tuned out by most people as they tire of his shtick. Then soon after, he fades away from everyday conversations like most ex-presidents
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100%.  He's done.  The further we move away from his presidency, the more it will be looked back on with horror.

 
glvsav37 said:
How are we any worse than Canada or Germany? I have friends in Canada and they are suffering terribly right now with being locked down right now. 

While I dont agree with everything the president has done, one thing people tend to forget (IMO) is that unlike other counties, we are a nation of states. And those states had just as much power, if not more, to dictate their response to this pandemic. Then add to that the blatantly obvious pissing match between republican and democratic governors, and in turn the democratic governors vs the president, there is no way any plan pandemic would have been effective. 

IDK where you live but here in NY we have been bombarded with daily hissy fits directed at the white house by Gov Cuomo. Not a day goes by where he is not on TV cursing the feds for "not providing this..." or "denying that.." But why is it the fed's problem that the state was basically bankrupt before this and couldn't afford to or didn't have enough ventilators, to which the Fed bought them for NY. They also sent the USS Comfort and set up triage tents in Central park that went unused and the ship sent home after seeing only a handful of patients. For months we have been stuck between what seems like divorced parents who both are clearly only looking to outdo each other and DGAF about  what happens to the kids. 

Of the things you list in your original post, most of that I trace back to local control. you are taking pay cuts??.....most business here are still closed at the order of the Governor (not the President) and will/may never open again, while other states are allowing full or partial return to business. The schools are state run and controlled, not federal. Whatever regulations or funding you have are state orchestrated. I'm assuming you are a teacher or in education in some capacity, so IDK how the fed response dictates whatever it is your school is doing. Look around at other states and see who is doing or not doing. 

IMO if you want to blame anyone for your perceived lack of response, it starts locally. I am not absolving Trump of any blame, I think he should have indeed had a stronger message overall, if not to error on the side of caution. But anything that directly effects my day-to-day life is based on my states gov't 
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I work at a private school so parents need to choose to send their kids here and pay a lot of money to do it. Many schools like ours are facing an existential crisis. We have done a good enough job that our school will survive but salaries are at risk.

Canada has seen 19,000 Covid cases per million people. Worldwide the number is 12,000 cases per million people. The US statistic is 74,000 cases per million. One can argue that we are more tightly packed here than in Canada (or on average throughout the world) but a 6-fold multiple of US cases versus Worldwide cases? A chunk of that is tied directly to failures at all levels of government. It's up to each person to decide how much of that lands at the feet of the Feds or on Trump.

 
glvsav37 said:
How are we any worse than Canada or Germany? I have friends in Canada and they are suffering terribly right now with being locked down right now. 

While I dont agree with everything the president has done, one thing people tend to forget (IMO) is that unlike other counties, we are a nation of states. And those states had just as much power, if not more, to dictate their response to this pandemic. Then add to that the blatantly obvious pissing match between republican and democratic governors, and in turn the democratic governors vs the president, there is no way any plan pandemic would have been effective. 

IDK where you live but here in NY we have been bombarded with daily hissy fits directed at the white house by Gov Cuomo. Not a day goes by where he is not on TV cursing the feds for "not providing this..." or "denying that.." But why is it the fed's problem that the state was basically bankrupt before this and couldn't afford to or didn't have enough ventilators, to which the Fed bought them for NY. They also sent the USS Comfort and set up triage tents in Central park that went unused and the ship sent home after seeing only a handful of patients. For months we have been stuck between what seems like divorced parents who both are clearly only looking to outdo each other and DGAF about  what happens to the kids. 

Of the things you list in your original post, most of that I trace back to local control. you are taking pay cuts??.....most business here are still closed at the order of the Governor (not the President) and will/may never open again, while other states are allowing full or partial return to business. The schools are state run and controlled, not federal. Whatever regulations or funding you have are state orchestrated. I'm assuming you are a teacher or in education in some capacity, so IDK how the fed response dictates whatever it is your school is doing. Look around at other states and see who is doing or not doing. 

IMO if you want to blame anyone for your perceived lack of response, it starts locally. I am not absolving Trump of any blame, I think he should have indeed had a stronger message overall, if not to error on the side of caution. But anything that directly effects my day-to-day life is based on my states gov't 
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:goodposting:

 
Redwes25 said:
I have no problem with this.  Like them or not they are targets at this point and think they should be protected by our government.  
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This may be the biggest understatement as well. Anyone whining about protecting them doesn’t really make sense after watching the last 4 years, can you imagine what they have ahead of them from the angry Left?

 
Redwes25 said:
I have no problem with this.  Like them or not they are targets at this point and think they should be protected by our government.  
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Most of it, neither do I.  But this part is a bit much...

Surprising Fact

A president opting to extend Secret Service protection isn’t unheard of, but Trump’s reported decision to cover 13 family members goes far beyond what has been done before. Trump’s three predecessors—Barack Obama, George W. Bush and Bill Clinton—extended protection for their daughters after leaving office.

Tangent

In addition to the numerous trips the Trumps take (12 times that of the Obamas during the first three years of Trump’s term, according to a 2020 watchdog report), other out of the ordinary expenses for the Secret Service have come while protecting the Trumps. According to The Washington Post, the Secret Service rented a studio for $3,000 a month near Ivanka Trump and Kushner’s Washington home to give agents access to a bathroom, given they were not allowed to relieve themselves in any of the home’s half-dozen bathrooms.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
gianmarco said:
Most of it, neither do I.  But this part is a bit much...

Surprising Fact

A president opting to extend Secret Service protection isn’t unheard of, but Trump’s reported decision to cover 13 family members goes far beyond what has been done before. Trump’s three predecessors—Barack Obama, George W. Bush and Bill Clinton—extended protection for their daughters after leaving office.

Tangent

In addition to the numerous trips the Trumps take (12 times that of the Obamas during the first three years of Trump’s term, according to a 2020 watchdog report), other out of the ordinary expenses for the Secret Service have come while protecting the Trumps. According to The Washington Post, the Secret Service rented a studio for $3,000 a month near Ivanka Trump and Kushner’s Washington home to give agents access to a bathroom, given they were not allowed to relieve themselves in any of the home’s half-dozen bathrooms.
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Yeah the Ivanka thing is absurd and I had read that before. The family is clearly a bunch of #######s. However still no issues protecting the full group of them. He has a lot of descendants - Obama and Bush each only had two daughters when they left office. You can’t really compare the two fact patterns. 

 
GoBirds said:
This may be the biggest understatement as well. Anyone whining about protecting them doesn’t really make sense after watching the last 4 years, can you imagine what they have ahead of them from the angry Left?
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Probably a better chance of it coming from a Q-Anon, or white supremacist type who feels betrayed.  The angry left is more dangerous to property, but the angry right seems more likely to cause violence to a person.  

 
On the bright side I don’t believe there were any significant riots or destruction of property last night? Good to see. 

 
Redwes25 said:
Yeah the Ivanka thing is absurd and I had read that before. The family is clearly a bunch of #######s. However still no issues protecting the full group of them. He has a lot of descendants - Obama and Bush each only had two daughters when they left office. You can’t really compare the two fact patterns. 
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The job of your secret service detail is to keep you safe and give their lives to do so if necessary, but they’re not allowed to use even one of the six restrooms in your house. Pretty despicable.

 
I gotta say....I'm a little disappointed in how Trump's last couple of days unfolded. Where was the confidence, the arrogance, the trolling of the libs? I was hoping for a few more jabs at the left, something, anything. It would have been so great if he had pardoned his kids and himself, while also kicking off his 2024 election campaign! That would have been the perfect final middle finger to the establishment, IMO. Instead, he kind of went out with a low-energy whimper. I think that's a sign that he's not going to run in 2024.

 
The Dude said:
Moderates on both sides need to join together and squash the fringes.  I am sure the platform can be acceptable to both.
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Doubtful in the short term - some of the issues these groups currently disagree on are very divisive, like abortion.  I think what the rest of us would call moderates on both sides would makeup a majority party of those 3 but that issue alone would make people not join up.

 
AAABatteries said:
Doubtful in the short term - some of the issues these groups currently disagree on are very divisive, like abortion.  I think what the rest of us would call moderates on both sides would makeup a majority party of those 3 but that issue alone would make people not join up.
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Good point - but would they compromise on that point to keep a moderate platform in control.

I have no idea what that compromise looks like.

 
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