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Is the USA the greatest country in the world?


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2 minutes ago, fatguyinalittlecoat said:

Also, our Constitution isn’t great, our flag is tacky, and our National Anthem is garbage. 

When Obama starts his third term and confiscates every single gun in America, it will make up for these shortcomings. 

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1 hour ago, fatguyinalittlecoat said:

I would say any country with a more robust social safety net is better.  As discussed earlier that includes Scandinavian countries and Canada.  Some other European countries too.  To me that’s way more of a factor than having a strong military.

Out of curiosity do you think the world is better or worse off with the US military getting involved in global issues?

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1 minute ago, Max Power said:

Out of curiosity do you think the world is better or worse off with the US military getting involved in global issues?

Compared to what?

If the U.S. used half of its current military budget on humanitarian foreign aid I think the world would be much better off.

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Just now, fatguyinalittlecoat said:

Compared to what?

If the U.S. used half of its current military budget on humanitarian foreign aid I think the world would be much better off.

Say America went the Switzerland route and remained neutral on all foreign conflict.  We send money out to other countries, but only use the military in a defensive capability. 

Is the world a better place?

I truly don't know.  I grew up thinking we stick our nose in places it doesn't belong, but now realize doing that is probably the lesser of two evils in many cases. 

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Historically?  Without question.  To quote colonel Jessup, the rest of the western democratic world sleeps (and has since World War II) under the blanket of security that America has provided and continues to provide.  I agree with MT that the relative benevolence with which America has wielded this power is about as good as anyone could hope for, notwithstanding some obvious mistakes.   

To live in now?   I don’t think so.  I would rather raise my kids in a number of other countries before America.  

And, I would never want to live in a country that did not provide universal healthcare.  

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35 minutes ago, zoonation said:

Historically?  Without question.  To quote colonel Jessup, the rest of the western democratic world sleeps (and has since World War II) under the blanket of security that America has provided and continues to provide.  I agree with MT that the relative benevolence with which America has wielded this power is about as good as anyone could hope for, notwithstanding some obvious mistakes.   

To live in now?   I don’t think so.  I would rather raise my kids in a number of other countries before America.  

And, I would never want to live in a country that did not provide universal healthcare.  

No offence, but, Americans see right through the phony Canadian arrogance. It should be an Americans only pole for obvious reasons. 

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35 minutes ago, tonydead said:

No offence, but, Americans see right through the phony Canadian arrogance. It should be an Americans only pole for obvious reasons. 

No offense taken bud.  I already know you have no idea what you are talking about.  

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4 hours ago, zoonation said:

No offense taken bud.  I already know you have no idea what you are talking about.  

Rofl at “phony Canadian arrogance”. America definitely seems to have more than it’s share of obnoxious, odious individuals.

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11 hours ago, Maurile Tremblay said:

But in other important areas, the U.S. is mostly above average but not at the top — a glance at the Human Development Index, the Index of Economic Freedom, the Human Freedom Index, and similar attempts at measuring national well-being shows the United States to consistently lag behind a handful of countries like Australia, Canada, Norway, the Netherlands...

There are some important areas where we’re not above average at all, but are near the bottom of developed countries. Incarceration rate, longevity, health care coverage rate, homicide rate...

I guess whether the U.S. is the greatest country in the world depends on how much weight you assign to its military might. If you don’t give that more weight than every other factor, I think it’s hard to rank the U.S. as the number one country overall, but still easy to put it in the top five or ten.

On the other hand, I think a strong case can be made that military might is extremely important because that’s what safeguards literally everything else we value as a nation.

We keep slipping in the general democracy rankings and that might bother me more than anything else. That's the area where we're supposed to be the global leaders and we keep rejecting practices that have been proven to be better.

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11 hours ago, Max Power said:

Say America went the Switzerland route and remained neutral on all foreign conflict.  We send money out to other countries, but only use the military in a defensive capability. 

Is the world a better place?

I truly don't know.  I grew up thinking we stick our nose in places it doesn't belong, but now realize doing that is probably the lesser of two evils in many cases. 

Is there oil involved?

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As a kid, i spent each July in Dun Laoghaire, the secondary port of Dublin. I knew it was different - less rules, but strange adults were freer to harsh you when you were muckin' about, family was much closer about you but fought a lot more, kids did more chores & got hit a lot more (except your humble servant, Prince of America that he was) but, all-in-all were allowed to make their own way earlier & better  - but i loved it like a fairyland and yearned for it when the trust which provided for it ended for me @ age 16. My last year there was the best because my closest cousin Tom had completed his schooling (they finished after sophomore year, to begin apprenticeships or work, unless they were prepping for university) and all grads were given a Summer of George, where they were allowed to do naught but what they pleased, when they pleased (even eat a block of cheese) and i was free to party along.

Eire rang romantic in me 'ead for all the years until i could afford to go back on my own, and then i understood why it wasn't a fairyland. I was given a hint by a study i'd read just before i went back. Cholesetrol & SatFat were new in the news and Time had a study about diet & heart disease. I noticed Ireland had the fattiest diet (which didnt surprise me cuz Aunt Maisie would cook up a pan of bacon, fry your eggs in that and pour the remainder over your spuds) but the second lowest rate of heart disease. More fairyland, eh?

I saw the truth when i went back over in my early twenties. Cousin Tom had completed his apprenticeship (furnaces), was all familied up, spent as much time as he could in the pub, an old man @ 22yo. I had spent years on rock & roll tour by that time and was beginning a career in radio. I hadn't even started. Tho happy in his way, Tom - not long before me closest mate - now a foreigner to me in mine. Suddenly i realized why they had so little heart disease. They had no stress. And why had they no stress?

No dreams. They went to school, entered the same field of work as their Da, married a nice girl, trained their sons, hoped their daughters married well, went to the pub. On & on & on & on & on. No dream, not even a thought of em. And that's why this ever-more-ridiculous country is the REAL fairyland. Dreams - not only can you have em, you're supposed to. And that's about the only place that says that.

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4 minutes ago, identikit said:

@wikkidpissah

 

As far as I'm concerned you are the FBG poet laureate.

 

Agree/disagree doesn't matter, I read your submissions with joy.

Thank you for saying so. And you couldnt have used a better word to swell me heart. I try to fashion my words so that even hating them can be done with joy.

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1 minute ago, Statorama said:

Yes, and there's not even a close second

Would you rather be soaking up rays on a California beach or dodging moose turds in a Tim Horton's parking lot?

Canadian folk band name.

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45 minutes ago, Statorama said:

Yes, and there's not even a close second

Would you rather be soaking up rays on a California beach or dodging moose turds in a Tim Horton's parking lot?

Comparing the best part of one country to the worst of another is hardly convincing.  

You can dodge moose (or deer) turds in a dunkin donuts parking lot in North Dakota too.  

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Definitely not if you're talking about daily life for the average citizen.  Many Europeans for example, get more time off work, have better, affordable healthcare, and have better public transportation.  Food is a subjective thing, but I find it slightly better over there too.    

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2 minutes ago, VandyMan said:

Good info but, for the sake of clarity, those rankings are basically new immigrants as a percentage of population not total immigrants. Sorry to nitpick, it just seems relevant to properly understand the rankings you posted.

Where are you seeing that distinction? I'm failing to find it on that page.

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Just now, Gr00vus said:

Where are you seeing that distinction? I'm failing to find it on that page.

Just above the headers...

Quote

Net migration rate compares the difference between the number of persons entering and leaving a country during the year per 1,000 persons (based on midyear population).

 

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5 minutes ago, VandyMan said:

Just above the headers...

 

I did see that, I don't understand how that translates to what you're saying. Also, it's not tabulating just immigration, it's tabulating net migration - a rate based on the difference between the number of people immigrating to the country and those emigrating from the country. 

Maybe the distinction you're focusing on is that it's a rate, not a raw number? I thought I had indicated that when I said "CIA migration rates", but maybe that wasn't clear enough.

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Just now, Gr00vus said:

I did see that, I don't understand how that translates to what you're saying.

Maybe I misunderstood and the clarification was unnecessary. I thought you were linking the chart to indicate that Canada was receiving more immigrants than the US in 2017, but they only received more per capita.

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5 minutes ago, VandyMan said:

Maybe I misunderstood and the clarification was unnecessary. I thought you were linking the chart to indicate that Canada was receiving more immigrants than the US in 2017, but they only received more per capita.

Right, it's a per capita measurement. Which I think is more indicative of things than raw numbers if we're talking about trends in people immigrating/emigrating.

The question I have about that is, are they measuring residence change, and, if so, what are they using to determine whether someone has left/entered a country "permanently?" Citizenship change? Billing address change?

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3 hours ago, supermike80 said:

Silly question.

Depends on the person, situation, environment, heck even today's mood.

Is Led Zeppelin the best band ever?

Are hamburgers the best food ever?

Is summer the best season ever.

Silly silly questions.   

:shrug: I like to read people’s opinions on the best band, food, and season.  It can be fun to discuss a question that might not have a true, right answer. And silly can be OK sometimes. Even here in the Political Forum.

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I find the cross tabs based on political leaning interesting even if not surprising.  I knew it would be virtually a unanimous yes for conservatives.  I thought liberals would have even more noes but it’s within the ballpark I expected.

I think this fits with the idea that liberals are always looking for change while conservatives value tradition and caution. Liberals see the country’s negatives and areas needing improvement.  Conservatives like to focus on the country’s historical strengths.

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I have seen some brief discussion on this before, but I have never really delved into it. The United States is practically the only country in the world that does not have a mandatory minimal annual leave. Most countries have a minimum of 10 days, and probably half or more have 20 days. Also, most countries offer paid paternity leave, while the U.S. only guarantees 12 weeks of family medical leave, which does not guarantee pay. This is one reason we aren't the greatest in the world. All the talk of "family values", yet our values only seem to be corporate.

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It all depends on your grading system.  If you grade on who has the most leisure time and who gets the most free stuff, the US is down the list.

If you grade on accomplishments, the rest of the world combined lags far behind the US.  

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11 minutes ago, jon_mx said:

It all depends on your grading system.  If you grade on who has the most leisure time and who gets the most free stuff, the US is down the list.

If you grade on accomplishments, the rest of the world combined lags far behind the US.  

Depending on when those accomplishments happened, wouldn't it mean that the US was the greatest? Just not anymore.

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Quick note for those looking for the US to adopt government run (single payer) healthcare

Quote

Britain's national healthcare system said Thursday a record 4.4 million Britons are waiting for surgery -- a figure one medical leader called "unacceptable."

New statistics posted by the National Health Service also showed a 16 percent increase of patients who'd waited for more than 18 weeks for non-emergency operations, such as hip or knee replacements.

 

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6 hours ago, KCitons said:

Depending on when those accomplishments happened, wouldn't it mean that the US was the greatest? Just not anymore.

You really think the US is not accomplishing more than anyone else today?  We still dominate science and technology.  Look at the Nobel Peace Prizes for medicine.  US has 93 winners, the next two countries have 29 and 16.  We almost have as many as the rest of the world combined.  This is true across all categories, and 2018 was no different with the US dominating the sciences.  

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19 minutes ago, jon_mx said:

You really think the US is not accomplishing more than anyone else today?  We still dominate science and technology.  Look at the Nobel Peace Prizes for medicine.  US has 93 winners, the next two countries have 29 and 16.  We almost have as many as the rest of the world combined.  This is true across all categories, and 2018 was no different with the US dominating the sciences.  

Honestly, I don't know a lot about the specific subject. Looking at the list on wiki, it appears that our momentum is diminishing. US has 14, the rest of the world has 15. 

Yes, over the long run, US was great. Doesn't mean they still are. 

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44 minutes ago, KCitons said:

Honestly, I don't know a lot about the specific subject. Looking at the list on wiki, it appears that our momentum is diminishing. US has 14, the rest of the world has 15. 

Yes, over the long run, US was great. Doesn't mean they still are. 

4 of the last 5 were Americans.  US is really slacking off.  :rant:

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23 minutes ago, jon_mx said:

4 of the last 5 were Americans.  US is really slacking off.  :rant:

In terms of accomplishments, it is no contest.  America is the greatest country ever.

Live there right now?  Pass. 

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3 minutes ago, zoonation said:

In terms of accomplishments, it is no contest.  America is the greatest country ever.

Live there right now?  Pass. 

And that is a lifestyle choice, which is perfectly fine.  There are many fine countries where there is less stress.

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Just now, jon_mx said:

And that is a lifestyle choice, which is perfectly fine.  There are many fine countries where there is less stress.

I could counter the Nobel prize winners with how it trickles down to citizens. IE Health Care. 

Perhaps for the elite, US is the greatest country in the world. Everyone else ???

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On 8/8/2019 at 4:20 PM, Scoresman said:

Definitely not if you're talking about daily life for the average citizen.  Many Europeans for example, get more time off work, have better, affordable healthcare, and have better public transportation.  Food is a subjective thing, but I find it slightly better over there too.    

I've had dozens of great meals, for two, with a bottle of wine, for 50 euros or less. 

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I'm sure it's been said over and over again but i don't define great as the ability to make money without regard to the people who make it for you, the environment and society as a whole

What the US has done well is create a place where all the sociopaths of the world can converge and not care about anything but themselves.  Also done a great job of taking a population and making them so easily influenced that you don't ever have to worry about being improper.

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This is really like those discussions about the "best baseball player or football player" ever.  Things change so much over time, it's a virtually useless question and we don't even get to the point of defining what "greatest" means.  For every person, there's a different answer to that question.  There are some things we have that are the "greatest" in my opinion.  There are some things where we fall WAY short.

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