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Turkey invades Syria: Update- ISIS rebuilds


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1 minute ago, butcher boy said:

I dont' understand liberals.  Let's vilify Bush I and Bush II for sending troops to the middle east and saying we shouldn't fight wars for oil etc etc, but lets demonize Trump for wanting to get us out of there and bring our boys home.  

i supported the liberation of kuwait and taking down al queda in afghanistan post 9/11........

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It’s not to distract. There are better ways to distract. It’s to please Erdogan or Putin for some reason related to Trump’s personal interests, as opposed to U.S. national interests.

I know it's against board policy to say that Trump is a moron or idiot or whatever.  But I honestly don't know how what other conclusion I'm supposed to draw.  Whether it's an innately low IQ (doubtfu

Wait 'till the guy on the left hears about the guy on the right.

3 minutes ago, butcher boy said:

I dont' understand liberals.  Let's vilify Bush I and Bush II for sending troops to the middle east and saying we shouldn't fight wars for oil etc etc, but lets demonize Trump for wanting to get us out of there and bring our boys home.  

I don't understand these Trump supporters.  It's not about bringing our boys home.  It's about honoring your commitments and supporting your allies.  About supporting those who gave their lives fighting alongside of you and not leaving them to die when they ask the same of you.

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33 minutes ago, cosjobs said:

And the Ruskies were busy covering their own asses in Stalingrad

And what about the rest of NATO?

England helped a little.

Italy and France were nowhere to be found.

But the worst was Germany. Not only did they not help us at Normandy, they tried to stop it. Ungrateful SOBs.

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6 minutes ago, butcher boy said:

I dont' understand liberals.  Let's vilify Bush I and Bush II for sending troops to the middle east and saying we shouldn't fight wars for oil etc etc, but lets demonize Trump for wanting to get us out of there and bring our boys home.  

Because you don’t seem to understand that Bush 1 was justified in his actions and Bush 2 made crap up to invade.

This isn't about bringing our boys home.  Its about delivering what Putin and Erdogan want and leaving our allies to die.

 

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10 minutes ago, butcher boy said:

I dont' understand liberals.  Let's vilify Bush I and Bush II for sending troops to the middle east and saying we shouldn't fight wars for oil etc etc, but lets demonize Trump for wanting to get us out of there and bring our boys home.  

The reason that we had special forces helping the Kurds was so that we COULD bring most of our boys home.

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12 minutes ago, butcher boy said:

I dont' understand liberals.  Let's vilify Bush I and Bush II for sending troops to the middle east and saying we shouldn't fight wars for oil etc etc, but lets demonize Trump for wanting to get us out of there and bring our boys home.  

i dont unserstand trumpers supporting a policy that abandons our allies....

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8 minutes ago, timschochet said:

The reason that we had special forces helping the Kurds was so that we COULD bring most of our boys home.

Right, that was my understanding. We were providing support for the Kurds correct? And our presence and pledge of support would deter Turkey from interfering. Is that accurate?

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37 minutes ago, butcher boy said:

I dont' understand liberals.  Let's vilify Bush I and Bush II for sending troops to the middle east and saying we shouldn't fight wars for oil etc etc, but lets demonize Trump for wanting to get us out of there and bring our boys home.  

I thought we were at less than a 1000 troops- I know I read Trump approved getting us down to 400 months ago. I believe the difference is the pledge of support. I think of it like if there is a odd duckling HS kid who is a target for bullies but the school wrestling team is teaching him some moves and has adopted him as an honorary member. That going to deter bullies because they know to cross the kid is to bring the wrath of the wrestling team. The scrawny kid doesn't need 20 wrestlers following him everywhere he goes, just the knowledge that they have his back keeps him safe. However, if the wrestling team formally announces that he is on his own and no longer has their protection, it makes him a potential target again.

Also, I think it is kind of a false set-up that liberals don't want troops in the ME fighting ISIS. They aren't happy with the Iraq Invasion, but that is a separate issue. The candidate who ran on bringing the troops home was Trump more so than anyone else. 

Edited by Ilov80s
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40 minutes ago, butcher boy said:

I dont' understand liberals.  Let's vilify Bush I and Bush II for sending troops to the middle east and saying we shouldn't fight wars for oil etc etc, but lets demonize Trump for wanting to get us out of there and bring our boys home.  

1. i don't think it's just liberals bro.

2. Pretty sure there are women over there too.

3. Now that we are bringing folks home, time to cut that military budget, no?

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1 hour ago, butcher boy said:

I dont' understand liberals.  Let's vilify Bush I and Bush II for sending troops to the middle east and saying we shouldn't fight wars for oil etc etc, but lets demonize Trump for wanting to get us out of there and bring our boys home.  

Are Conservatives always willing to start a war, look for help... and then leave that help to die? I cant understand them as such.

It always takes the liberals to be in power to try and take care of our debts and allies.

Signed by Carter https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugee_Act

https://www.govtrack.us/congress/votes/96-1979/s262

https://www.govtrack.us/congress/votes/96-1979/h670

Edited by BigSteelThrill
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9 hours ago, timschochet said:

Can i be frank? 

That would be cruel, savage, barbaric, against everything we believe...and better for us. 

Right. If real life were a game of "Risk."  

But it's not. 

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2 hours ago, Bucky86 said:

Jennifer Griffin

@JenGriffinFNC

I just spoke to a distraught US Special Forces soldier who is among the 1000 or so US troops in Syria tonight who is serving alongside the SDF Kurdish forces. It was one of the hardest phone calls I have ever taken. "I am ashamed for the first time in my career."

3:02 PM · Oct 9, 2019·Twitter Web App

610

 

 

 

2 hours ago, Bucky86 said:

Thread

Truly #MAGA

And she works for Fox News so this isn’t liberal media bias. Trump is such a distaste that it almost certainly has to be premeditated on his part. He’s a bad actor.

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4 hours ago, Kal El said:

There's always the outside chance we're seeing the emergence of an actual supervillain. 

Honestly, I don't believe he understands just how far reaching the consequences of his actions truly are. Millions of Kurds will now never trust us again, he's clearly asked multiple countries to make up dirt on political opponents, we already know what he wanted to do at the border, to say nothing of forcibly separating families and putting them in camps just because they wanted a better life but made the mistake of coming in illegally.

Natalie Portman was on Colbert a little over a year ago. He asked her about her friendship with Jared Kushner at Harvard.

She said something like its weird to see your friend turn into a supervillain.

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2 hours ago, Sinn Fein said:

I wonder how all of this fits into Jared's Middle East Peace Plan.

 

I suppose we will find out soon enough.

I’m personally disappointed he hasn’t brought peace there yet.  Really thought he’d lock that up in year 1.  

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4 hours ago, Bucky86 said:

Jennifer Griffin

@JenGriffinFNC

I just spoke to a distraught US Special Forces soldier who is among the 1000 or so US troops in Syria tonight who is serving alongside the SDF Kurdish forces. It was one of the hardest phone calls I have ever taken. "I am ashamed for the first time in my career."

3:02 PM · Oct 9, 2019·Twitter Web App

610

 

 

Article on Fox News

https://www.foxnews.com/world/turkey-syria-invasion-special-forces-soldier-kurds

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6 hours ago, timschochet said:

Damn those Kurds for not helping us at Normandy! The Chinese didn’t help us there either. 

Yeah, I'm not sure why the Germans didn't at least pledge their support either.

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15 hours ago, Henry Ford said:
15 hours ago, IvanKaramazov said:

I know it's against board policy to say that Trump is a moron or idiot or whatever.  But I honestly don't know how what other conclusion I'm supposed to draw.  Whether it's an innately low IQ (doubtful IMO) or dementia or some other form of mental illness, the guy exhibits serious cognitive impairment.

Maybe it'll be better received from a lifelong Republican like yourself

Na....now he's just a RINO and "leftist" around here...welcome to the dark side IK...you've been banished by "real conservatives" !

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16 hours ago, Bucky86 said:

Thread

Truly #MAGA

"This US Special Forces soldier wanted me to know: "The Kurds are sticking by us. No other partner I have ever dealt with would stand by us." Disappointed in the decisions coming from their senior leaders."

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Cal Thomas: Trump channels George McGovern with decision to abandon Syria

The year was 1972 and Americans wanted out of the Vietnam War; the right because it was not being won and the left because of the increasing body count and lies from generals and politicians about “progress” toward defeating the communists.

Democratic presidential candidate George McGovern’s slogan “Come Home, America” resonated with growing numbers of people. When Richard Nixon defeated McGovern in a landslide, even Nixon began planning for a U.S. withdrawal. “Peace with honor” was his slogan.

The late Al Qaeda leader Usama bin Laden cited that withdrawal as evidence that the U.S. had no stomach for long wars. He believed the U.S. would grow weary from the “War on Terror,” ceding the killing field to the terrorists.

JAMES CARAFANO: IS TRUMP SERIOUS ABOUT SYRIA? HERE'S WHAT YOU MUST ALWAYS REMEMBER

Now comes President Trump with another promise for a unilateral withdrawal of “between 50 and 100 troops,” from Syria. Many critics of the decision believe it is an invitation for Turkish president Recep Tayyip Erdogan to slaughter Kurdish forces, America’s loyal ally in the region in the fight against terrorism. The Kurds have served as a buffer, preventing an attack by Turkey’s powerful military.

Not surprisingly, it didn’t take Turkey long to press its advantage. Reuters reports, “Turkey’s military struck the Syrian-Iraqi border to prevent Kurdish forces using the route to reinforce northeast Syria, as Ankara prepares to launch an offensive there after a surprise U.S. troop pullback.”

Following a backlash, the White House appeared to reverse its Syria decision. An administration official, speaking under the condition of anonymity, said, the U.S. is not removing its forces from Syria in the face of a Turkish incursion. Which decision will ultimately prevail?

But Trump has gone further than announcing a unilateral withdrawal of forces, he has threatened Erdogan that if he attacks the Kurds and mistreats ISIS prisoners and does anything the president considers “inhumane,” “they could suffer the wrath of an extremely decimated economy.”

Erdogan is an Islamist and it appears he’s trying to take Turkey back to the days when it was an Islamic state. Does the president seriously believe Erdogan will bow to threats from one he likely considers an “infidel” leader of the “great Satan,” as another Islamist state, Iran, has called us?

The president says he is merely fulfilling a campaign promise to stop involving America in “endless wars.” It is a noble pursuit, but just as it takes two to tango, it also takes two warring sides to declare a ceasefire, or peace. When only one side abandons the battlefield — and with terrorism the battlefield is everywhere — guess which side wins?

Even some usually supportive Capitol Hill Republicans are critical of the president’s decision because it betrays a lack of policy objectives in the region. No one knows, or can articulate, U.S. foreign policy anywhere. Another example: the administration supports the toppling of the Maduro regime in Venezuela, but it is no closer to achieving that stated goal.

Former United Nations Ambassador Nikki Haley, who was praised by President Trump for her service when she announced her resignation, has joined the growing chorus of people alarmed by the president’s decision. Haley, a potential presidential candidate in the near future, has said that the new U.S. policy toward the Kurds (if one can call it a policy) amounts to “leaving them to die” and is “a mistake.”

Yes, the Middle East is a snake pit and the U.S. has spent a lot of money over many years trying to kill off the “snakes.” But stopping the killing of those who want to kill us almost guarantees they will return to the battle with renewed resolve and new recruits. What will the unilateral withdrawers say then?

Coming home is no guarantee the terrorists won’t come after us here. In fact, Iran has bragged of having their agents inside the U.S., awaiting instructions to inflict more death and destruction.

America’s withdrawal of troops from Vietnam ensured a communist victory, but that war was more about nationalism than communism. This war is different.

When he was president, George W. Bush said we are fighting terrorists over there, so we won’t have to fight them here. Withdrawing troops and risking the destruction of the Kurds is a step too far.

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2 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

its interesting to see liberals/left leaners greatly desiring war and conflict 

It seems like there is more conflict today then a week ago? It’s my understanding that our presence was more to provide support and stop this fighting. If we’re there, then Turkey can’t attack and the status quo, while a cluster, was better than this  

I don’t claim to speak for all liberals but I’ve also learned you can’t look at everything in a vacuum. Sure I don’t want to be there but we already were. Trump went after Obama for pulling out and creating ISIS, well what do you think the consequences here are?

 

 

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2 minutes ago, tuffnutt said:

It’s interesting to see people conflate desiring war with not abandoning our allies to genocide 

That was explained the last time he conflated what liberals were saying with this.  Rephrased and tried the bait again.

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14 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

its interesting to see liberals/left leaners greatly desiring war and conflict 

Seems to be quite a few Republicans agreeing with the left on this one. 

Edited by Mile High
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All these "liberal/left leaners"??

Quote

 

McConnell (R-Ky.), in a rare public split with Trump, said that a supermajority in the Senate disagreed with the president’s abrupt withdrawal announcement, raising the specter of veto-proof action to oppose the decision.

“A precipitous withdrawal of U.S. forces from Syria would only benefit Russia, Iran, and the Assad regime,” McConnell said in a statement Monday. “And it would increase the risk that ISIS and other terrorist groups regroup.”

 

Quote

"This betrayal of the Kurds will also severely harm our credibility as an ally the world over," Sen. Patrick J. Toomey (R-Pa.) said in a statement. "President Trump should rethink this decision immediately."

Quote

 

“So sad. So dangerous,” he said on Twitter. “President Trump may be tired of fighting radical Islam. They are NOT tired of fighting us.” - Lindsay Graham

"If reports about US retreat in #Syria are accurate, the Trump administration has made a grave mistake that will have implications far beyond Syria,” he said on Twitter. - Marco Rubio

 

I'm getting tired of copying/pasting at this point

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32 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

its interesting to see liberals/left leaners greatly desiring war and conflict 

Defending an ally is desiring war and conflict? 

Look, I'm a bit of an isolationist myself when it comes to foreign conflict, but we pledged allegiance to the Kurds and we backed out knowing they'd get attacked. First, that's just a weak, cowardly move. Second, we are demonstrating to the world that an allegiance with us may not be a sure thing. I don't see how that could be a good thing. 

Edited by Zow
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4 minutes ago, The Commish said:

All these "liberal/left leaners"??

I'm getting tired of copying/pasting at this point

Im more tired of their words and no action.

While they are disappointed...ol Mitch is still raising funds to defend Trump from impeachment.  And is still running cover and obstruction for him and not holding him actually accountable for anything..

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10 minutes ago, The Commish said:

wait...when did Trump become "liberal/left leaners" ??

It's frustrating that anybody who criticizes Trump is automatically labeled a "liberal." Several of us are/were registered Republicans. 

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2 minutes ago, Zow said:

It's frustrating that anybody who criticizes Trump is automatically labeled a "liberal." Several of us are/were registered Republicans. 

agreed...i've given up trying to fight that fight...they can have the party and label....I won't ever go back.

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5 minutes ago, Zow said:

Defending an ally is desiring war and conflict? 

Look, I'm a bit of an isolationist myself when it comes to foreign conflict, but we pledged allegiance to the Kurds and we backed out knowing they'd get attacked. First, that's just a weak, cowardice move. Second, we are demonstrating to the world that an allegiance with us may not be a sure thing. I don't see how that could be a good thing. 

:goodposting:

Nailed it

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17 hours ago, timschochet said:

The reason that we had special forces helping the Kurds was so that we COULD bring most of our boys home.

We don't need a massive presence.  A small support team of special forces, I believe (and as northern Syria has shown), is enough to keep (much of) the peace.  Yes, those forces are in harm's way.  But with zero U.S. involvement, things get ugly really fast, as we're sadly seeing.  

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