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Future Of The Forum - And Big Thought On The Specific Problem


Joe Bryant

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29 minutes ago, Maurile Tremblay said:

This is a correct statement of the rule. When you are suspended, wait it out. Don’t post under an alias.

Or what?

Not trying to be snarky or funny. But, this rule has been in place for a long time. Without consequences it's all bark and no bite. If the only thing at risk is a suspension, and someone is already suspended, then what do they really have to lose?

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14 minutes ago, KCitons said:

Or what?

Are you asking because you’re considering getting suspended and posting under an alias, and you’re trying to weigh the costs and benefits? Or are you asking because you’re concerned about another poster?

If the first, just please don’t do it. If the second, please don’t worry about other posters.

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2 hours ago, GoBirds said:

What is the current status on all the aliases, are they not allowed now? I know in the Kavanaugh thread a suspended party came back using an aliases and a staff member said aliases were ok, I had thought they weren’t until then? Hard to keep up sometimes. 

What @Maurile Tremblay said: When you are suspended, wait it out. Don’t post under an alias.

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1 minute ago, Maurile Tremblay said:

Are you asking because you’re considering getting suspended and posting under an alias, and you’re trying to weigh the costs and benefits? Or are you asking because you’re concerned about another poster?

If the first, just please don’t do it. If the second, please don’t worry about other posters.

I do my best to avoid posting things that would get me suspended and I don't have an alias to use. No need to worry about that. 

I'll let you do you. 

 

 

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From the FFA FAQ

0. Alias accounts



Are a pain for moderators. If you feel the need to create extra accounts just for trolling, this message board isn't for you. We see them; we close them. New accounts created in response to having your original account suspended/banned may also be axed.



Seems like the rule of thumb is that multiple accounts are okay as long as A) you're not using them to troll, and B) you're not using them to circumvent a suspension.
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3 minutes ago, Joe Summer said:

From the FFA FAQ
 

 

 


Seems like the rule of thumb is that multiple accounts are okay as long as A) you're not using them to troll, and B) you're not using them to circumvent a suspension.

 

Are you sure, it says they are a pain for moderators? Just curious, what are the instances where aliases would be needed not for the reasons mentioned that they don’t want them? I’m honestly just trying to understand it.....is it just to have multiple imaginary personalities online? Just something I’ve never understood. 

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5 minutes ago, Joe Summer said:

From the FFA FAQ
 

 

 


Seems like the rule of thumb is that multiple accounts are okay as long as A) you're not using them to troll, and B) you're not using them to circumvent a suspension.

 

It's right here in this thread today.  But LOL at providing "proof".  I mean come on just get rid of the rule if it's not going to be enforced.  

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10 minutes ago, GoBirds said:

Are you sure, it says they are a pain for moderators? Just curious, what are the instances where aliases would be needed not for the reasons mentioned that they don’t want them? I’m honestly just trying to understand it.....is it just to have multiple imaginary personalities online? Just something I’ve never understood. 

To have a conversation with yourself?

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Ramblin Wreck said:


It's right here in this thread today. But LOL at providing "proof". I mean come on just get rid of the rule if it's not going to be enforced.


I'm not going to question the decisions of the moderators, but I will point out that the FFA FAQ says "may be axed" (not "will always be axed").
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33 minutes ago, Ramblin Wreck said:

It's right here in this thread today.  But LOL at providing "proof".  I mean come on just get rid of the rule if it's not going to be enforced.  

LOL at all the posts pretending not to know the who and what. Hard to take any of the rules seriously when they dont apply to the regulars. 

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2 minutes ago, tonydead said:

LOL at all the posts pretending not to know the who and what. Hard to take any of the rules seriously when they dont apply to the regulars. 

Do you believe the moderators know a currently suspended poster is posting under an alias and are ignoring it?

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18 hours ago, GoBirds said:

Are you sure, it says they are a pain for moderators? Just curious, what are the instances where aliases would be needed not for the reasons mentioned that they don’t want them? I’m honestly just trying to understand it.....is it just to have multiple imaginary personalities online? Just something I’ve never understood. 

In the FFA sometimes people use aliases to discuss personal issues if they know other people here in the outside world.  Although that reasoning seems far less applicable to this forum.

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8 minutes ago, fatguyinalittlecoat said:

In the FFA sometimes people use aliases to discuss personal issues if they know other people here in the outside world.  Although that reasoning seems far less applicable to this forum.

Thanks, I honestly couldn't think of any scenario it made sense. That makes sense for FFA possibly like you said, probably not in here. Guess it makes it appear like there's more posters and polls more lopsided than they would be in reality if people really have that much extra time. 

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22 hours ago, Ramblin Wreck said:

It's right here in this thread today.  But LOL at providing "proof".  I mean come on just get rid of the rule if it's not going to be enforced.  

If you know a person is using an alias, report it. It's not complicated. 

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Remarkable to me that we all want to be forgiven our trespasses while many, perhaps most even, or perhaps the massively vocal and disproportionally vocal minority, seem to have vowed to never forgive those who trespass against them.

Me, I have been posting less.  I figure less chance to get on folks nerves.  I have also vowed to let at least one thing go whenever I open the site.  Not everything has to be stated or called out, some things can be left for others.

Edited by Ditkaless Wonders
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15 minutes ago, Ditkaless Wonders said:

Remarkable to me that we all want to be forgiven our trespasses while many, perhaps most even, or perhaps the massively vocal and disproportionally vocal minority seem to have vowed to never forgive those who trespass against them.

Me, I have been posting less.  I figure less chance to get on folks nerves.  I have also vowed to let at least one thing go whenever I open the site.  not everything has to be stated or called out, some things can be left for others.

It's human nature. And has been forever. 

We all want grace for ourselves. And justice for others. 

One of my biggest struggles with fellow Christians (and myself) is I think we sometimes focus on the wrong things. If we say we follow Jesus, interestingly enough he talked a good about stuff just like this. 

This one checks me every time. (bold is mine).

For you non bibleguys, a "parable" is just a story told to illustrate a point. Jesus used this method a ton. 

This one is commonly referred to as "The Parable of the Unforgiving Servant"

Quote

 

Matthew 18:21-35 English Standard Version (ESV)

21 Then Peter came up and said to him, “Lord, how often will my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? As many as seven times?” 22 Jesus said to him, “I do not say to you seven times, but seventy-seven times.

23 “Therefore the kingdom of heaven may be compared to a king who wished to settle accounts with his servants.[a] 24 When he began to settle, one was brought to him who owed him ten thousand talents. 25 And since he could not pay, his master ordered him to be sold, with his wife and children and all that he had, and payment to be made. 26 So the servant[c] fell on his knees, imploring him, ‘Have patience with me, and I will pay you everything.’ 27 And out of pity for him, the master of that servant released him and forgave him the debt. 

28 But when that same servant went out, he found one of his fellow servants who owed him a hundred denarii,[d] and seizing him, he began to choke him, saying, ‘Pay what you owe.’ 29 So his fellow servant fell down and pleaded with him, ‘Have patience with me, and I will pay you.’ 30 He refused and went and put him in prison until he should pay the debt. 

31 When his fellow servants saw what had taken place, they were greatly distressed, and they went and reported to their master all that had taken place. 32 Then his master summoned him and said to him, ‘You wicked servant! I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. 33 And should not you have had mercy on your fellow servant, as I had mercy on you?’ 34 And in anger his master delivered him to the jailers,[e] until he should pay all his debt. 35 So also my heavenly Father will do to every one of you, if you do not forgive your brother from your heart.”

 

 

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37 minutes ago, Joe Bryant said:

It's human nature. And has been forever. 

We all want grace for ourselves. And justice for others. 

One of my biggest struggles with fellow Christians (and myself) is I think we sometimes focus on the wrong things. If we say we follow Jesus, interestingly enough he talked a good about stuff just like this. 

This one checks me every time. (bold is mine).

For you non bibleguys, a "parable" is just a story told to illustrate a point. Jesus used this method a ton. 

This one is commonly referred to as "The Parable of the Unforgiving Servant"

 

Its as if there are potential lessons in that book whether or not one ultimately believes.

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4 hours ago, Ditkaless Wonders said:

 

Me, I have been posting less.  I figure less chance to get on folks nerves.  I have also vowed to let at least one thing go whenever I open the site.  Not everything has to be stated or called out, some things can be left for others.

Same here 

Whether people want to admit it or not, opinions that are outside the “groupthink” here are not welcome, called out and piled on by the same group. Every thread, every day 

I still read certain topics in here sometime, mostly to kill time. But rarely post. It’s like Groundhog Day up in here 

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8 minutes ago, Cowboysfan8 said:

Same here 

Whether people want to admit it or not, opinions that are outside the “groupthink” here are not welcome, called out and piled on by the same group. Every thread, every day 

I still read certain topics in here sometime, mostly to kill time. But rarely post. It’s like Groundhog Day up in here 

Things improved for a few days, but it’s back to “normal” in here.  

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8 minutes ago, Cowboysfan8 said:

Same here 

Whether people want to admit it or not, opinions that are outside the “groupthink” here are not welcome, called out and piled on by the same group. Every thread, every day 

I still read certain topics in here sometime, mostly to kill time. But rarely post. It’s like Groundhog Day up in here 

I miss your more frequent contributions, but nothing wrong with wanting to leave us hoping for more.

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Hi Joe much respect for a great product.

It’s your product do what you want. I would do things differently. People love to talk trash about football and politics.

Free speech and the constitution made this country great. I think you guys need to stop policing the forums entirely outside of the shark pool to keep out the who do I start stuff. Problem solved. Why waste any time, effort or energy controlling people’s speech, thoughts and ideas?

Let people say whatever they want to. If someone gets offended because someone else posted nanny nanny boo boo then that’s too bad. What people say on here has zero reflection on you, your product or anyone else. People only speak for and represent themselves.  We really don’t need this to be some safe space where only kind and happy words are allowed. Football fans tend to like to get rowdy and rowdy talk should be expected on a football chat.

The real problem here is implementing speech and thought control. If people get mad because someone said something they didn’t like on a message board that is totally their issue. Folks should be able to handle it without needing baby sitters or referees. I could understand if this was a Kindergarten class but it’s not. You should show your love for free speech and the constitution by ceasing all moderation outside of the shark pool and only on a very limited basis there too. That would be a reflection of you that most folks would respect highly.

Signed

football guy since 2002

Edited by pinkham13
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6 minutes ago, pinkham13 said:

Hi Joe much respect for a great product.

It’s your product do what you want. I would do things differently. People love to talk trash about football and politics.

Free speech and the constitution made this country great. I think you guys need to stop policing the forums entirely outside of the shark pool to keep out the who do I start stuff. Problem solved. Why waste any time, effort or energy controlling people’s speech, thoughts and ideas?

Let people say whatever they want to. If someone gets offended because someone else posted nanny nanny boo boo then that’s too bad. What people say on here has zero reflection on you, your product or anyone else. People only speak for and represent themselves.  We really don’t need this to be some safe space where only kind and happy words are allowed. Football fans tend to like to get rowdy and rowdy talk should be expected on a football chat.

The real problem here is implementing speech and thought control. If people get mad because someone said something they didn’t like on a message board that is totally their issue. Folks should be able to handle it without needing baby sitters or referees. I could understand if this was a Kindergarten class but it’s not. You should show your love for free speech and the constitution by ceasing all moderation outside of the shark pool and only on a very limited basis there too. That would be a reflection of you that most folks would respect highly.

Signed

football guy since 2002

I don’t understand this post. To the best of my knowledge, the moderators here have not banned any kind of expression of a reasonable idea. The only thing they are not allowing is bad language, insults, rude behavior, blatant racism or bigotry, obvious trolling, etc. What’s wrong with that? Do you have a specific complaint? 

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1 minute ago, timschochet said:

I don’t understand this post. To the best of my knowledge, the moderators here have not banned any kind of expression of a reasonable idea. The only thing they are not allowing is bad language, insults, rude behavior, blatant racism or bigotry, obvious trolling, etc. What’s wrong with that? Do you have a specific complaint? 

Unfortunately, I have seen and experienced quite arbitrary moderation so why do it at all. Words are just words banning them never helped anything or it wouldn’t have been made the first amendment.

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If somebody posts something that is clearly provocative, and if several others respond with disagreement- so what? So long as the people responding aren’t rude, so long as they are all addressing the issue and not the person who posted it, there’s nothing wrong with that. It’s not “ganging up”; it’s not “bullying”. It’s discussion. And if you think it’s unfair, stand your ground. If you think you’re right and they’re all wrong, refute them. Explain why you’re right. But don’t come running into this thread and complain that you’re being picked on. 

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1 minute ago, pinkham13 said:

Unfortunately, I have seen and experienced quite arbitrary moderation so why do it at all. Words are just words banning them never helped anything or it wouldn’t have been made the first amendment.

This is a privately owned website and the 1st Amendment isn’t relevant here. And of course banning certain words can help. There are certain words I don’t prefer to see here. 

But it would help me to discuss this with you if you could provide some specific examples that had caused your concern. 

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19 minutes ago, pinkham13 said:

Hi Joe much respect for a great product.

It’s your product do what you want. I would do things differently. People love to talk trash about football and politics.

Free speech and the constitution made this country great. I think you guys need to stop policing the forums entirely outside of the shark pool to keep out the who do I start stuff. Problem solved. Why waste any time, effort or energy controlling people’s speech, thoughts and ideas?

Let people say whatever they want to. If someone gets offended because someone else posted nanny nanny boo boo then that’s too bad. What people say on here has zero reflection on you, your product or anyone else. People only speak for and represent themselves.  We really don’t need this to be some safe space where only kind and happy words are allowed. Football fans tend to like to get rowdy and rowdy talk should be expected on a football chat.

The real problem here is implementing speech and thought control. If people get mad because someone said something they didn’t like on a message board that is totally their issue. Folks should be able to handle it without needing baby sitters or referees. I could understand if this was a Kindergarten class but it’s not. You should show your love for free speech and the constitution by ceasing all moderation outside of the shark pool and only on a very limited basis there too. That would be a reflection of you that most folks would respect highly.

Signed

football guy since 2002

Thanks for the thoughtful feedback. Most of the internet operates as you suggest. I've no doubt it works great for most. We're going to try and do it a little differently.

Is our way for sure the right way? I have no idea. I just know I think it's the right way and it's how we're going to try and do it. I hope you stick with us. 

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Just now, timschochet said:

This is a privately owned website and the 1st Amendment isn’t relevant here. And of course banning certain words can help. There are certain words I don’t prefer to see here. 

But it would help me to discuss this with you if you could provide some specific examples that had caused your concern. 

I saw a thread where team blue circumvented the language filter while arguing with someone from team red who also circumvented the filter. Only team red was cited.

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2 hours ago, Cowboysfan8 said:

 

Whether people want to admit it or not, opinions that are outside the “groupthink” here are not welcome, called out and piled on by the same group. Every thread, every day 

 

This is what I mean. First off I don’t admit it because it’s not true. Nobody says minority views aren’t welcome. By “called out” and “piled on” I assume you mean that a lot of people disagree with certain arguments. So what? If you’re reading such a discussion, and you agree with the minority and not the majority, why not post and explain why? Why complain about it in here? 

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4 minutes ago, timschochet said:

This is a privately owned website and the 1st Amendment isn’t relevant here. And of course banning certain words can help. There are certain words I don’t prefer to see here. 

But it would help me to discuss this with you if you could provide some specific examples that had caused your concern. 

I just got a notification that he responded to a post of mine from a month ago.  Apparently I said something that pissed him off....not sure what, but something.  I have no problem with him reporting me if he thinks I wronged him.  To be honest, I am not all that familiar with this user handle so I really don't know what's going on.

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3 minutes ago, Joe Bryant said:

Thanks for the thoughtful feedback. Most of the internet operates as you suggest. I've no doubt it works great for most. We're going to try and do it a little differently.

Is our way for sure the right way? I have no idea. I just know I think it's the right way and it's how we're going to try and do it. I hope you stick with us. 

Thanks for the response. I have found most boards and social media like Facebook also restrict speech and moderate interactions or information. So I think you are more on the mainstream side here. Like many have said it is your right to do it because it’s a privately owned business. I think Facebook is so big though they really are the town square now.

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3 minutes ago, pinkham13 said:

I saw a thread where team blue circumvented the language filter while arguing with someone from team red who also circumvented the filter. Only team red was cited.

Well first off I don’t think too many people here would prefer to be thought of as “team red” or “team blue”. I know I don’t. In this year of 2019, I lean Democrat most of the time, but not all of the time. There are times when I agree with the Republican POV. There are even times when I agree with Trump. So I don’t want to go there. 

Usually when there is an inconsistency in the moderation, such as you mention, it’s because they noticed a post, or that post was brought to their attention, but they didn’t notice another post. Or perhaps the two posts aren’t quite as similar as you think they are. 

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3 minutes ago, The Commish said:

I just got a notification that he responded to a post of mine from a month ago.  Apparently I said something that pissed him off....not sure what, but something.  I have no problem with him reporting me if he thinks I wronged him.  To be honest, I am not all that familiar with this user handle so I really don't know what's going on.

  Nothing you said made me mad. I just noticed the poster you were debating got cited for the same thing you did but we’re not cited for. No big deal just wanted to point out the arbitrary enforcement of rules.

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2 minutes ago, pinkham13 said:

  Nothing you said made me mad. I just noticed the poster you were debating got cited for the same thing you did but we’re not cited for. No big deal just wanted to point out the arbitrary enforcement of rules.

report it :shrug: 

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4 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Well first off I don’t think too many people here would prefer to be thought of as “team red” or “team blue”. I know I don’t. In this year of 2019, I lean Democrat most of the time, but not all of the time. There are times when I agree with the Republican POV. There are even times when I agree with Trump. So I don’t want to go there. 

Usually when there is an inconsistency in the moderation, such as you mention, it’s because they noticed a post, or that post was brought to their attention, but they didn’t notice another post. Or perhaps the two posts aren’t quite as similar as you think they are. 

Well Tim....if it gives you ANY clarity, I am "team blue" in his opinion :mellow: 

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2 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Well first off I don’t think too many people here would prefer to be thought of as “team red” or “team blue”. I know I don’t. In this year of 2019, I lean Democrat most of the time, but not all of the time. There are times when I agree with the Republican POV. There are even times when I agree with Trump. So I don’t want to go there. 

Usually when there is an inconsistency in the moderation, such as you mention, it’s because they noticed a post, or that post was brought to their attention, but they didn’t notice another post. Or perhaps the two posts aren’t quite as similar as you think they are. 

I like using team red and team blue because it points to how easily the elite has divided us into these opposing viewpoints. Divide and conquer right? Meanwhile there has been little to no real difference between team red and team blue leadership. I have voted for both teams in the past and have been beyond disappointed by both.

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4 minutes ago, pinkham13 said:

I like using team red and team blue because it points to how easily the elite has divided us into these opposing viewpoints. Divide and conquer right? Meanwhile there has been little to no real difference between team red and team blue leadership. I have voted for both teams in the past and have been beyond disappointed by both.

1. No idea what you mean by “the elite”. If you mean the establishment, then I certainly hope they continue to “conquer” us, since almost nothing but good things come from that. 

2. There are huge differences between the Democratic leadership and the Republican leadership on domestic issues. Less so on international issues (until Trump anyhow) which is the way it should be. 

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