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Myles Garrett needs to be permanently suspended


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10 minutes ago, Beef Ravioli said:

As far as the history between the teams and eight seconds left. Did you watch the game? The whole game was chippy. The Browns came in with an edge (history played a part) and yeah it grew up to that point and obviously boiled over at the end. 

The Browns definitely were chippy.   They had three helmet to helmet hits on one play and the shot that Randall took on Dionte Johnson was the epitome of what the league is supposed to be trying to remove from the game.   Dionte Johnson was bleeding from the ear for God's sakes!

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11 minutes ago, Godsbrother said:

The Browns definitely were chippy.   They had three helmet to helmet hits on one play and the shot that Randall took on Dionte Johnson was the epitome of what the league is supposed to be trying to remove from the game.   Dionte Johnson was bleeding from the ear for God's sakes!

Yeah that Randall shot was absolutely ridiculous.  Had the Garrett thing not happened there would be a lot more talk about this terrible cheap shot today.

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10 hours ago, pbandy1 said:
10 hours ago, GregR said:

I don't think that's how it works usually. The prosecutor decides whether to press charges. It doesn't require a victim making a complaint. Very sure that's the case in many places for domestic charges, but I think the same is true for regular assault.

Though if I had to place a bet, I'd say no charges get filed here due to lack of injury.

There is always a victim. The victim has to either be Rudolph himself or the NFL. It certainly isn't going to be the state of Ohio lol.

Rudolph is the victim whether or not he files a complaint.  The state can file charges regardless of Rudolph's thoughts on the matter.

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criminal charges is going way too far. Arian Foster hits it pretty well:

https://ftw.usatoday.com/2019/11/arian-foster-myles-garrett

 

this seems more of a fandom thing than anything. Sure it was wrong, but we watch dudes get blasted in the head with long-term consequences every Sunday and cheer. Sure suspend Myles for a bit, but if Rudolph was able to take off his helmet are we assuming Mason doesn't throw a punch at Myles?  It was ugly, suspend Myles for a bit and move on

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3 minutes ago, modogg said:

criminal charges is going way too far. Arian Foster hits it pretty well:

https://ftw.usatoday.com/2019/11/arian-foster-myles-garrett

 

this seems more of a fandom thing than anything. Sure it was wrong, but we watch dudes get blasted in the head with long-term consequences every Sunday and cheer. Sure suspend Myles for a bit, but if Rudolph was able to take off his helmet are we assuming Mason doesn't throw a punch at Myles?  It was ugly, suspend Myles for a bit and move on

That's not a good point at all. 

You like the violence within the rules so you shouldn't object to the violence outside the rules.

It's like suggesting it is hypocritical for boxing fans to get outraged if a boxer were to hit his opponent with a tire iron instead of a boxing glove.

Stupid.

 

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5 hours ago, Ministry of Pain said:

Talk about an overreaction. 

I went to sleep before the end of the game, woke up and saw the replay of this and so perhaps I was not as emotionally charged as some. 

The guy who should be perma-banned is POUNCEY-PUNK

He kicked the helmet of Garrett while he was on the ground not once not twice but like 3 times because he graduated from the Aaron Hernandez School of Hard Knocks so if anyone is getting banned for life, it's him. 

I have no idea what transpired, I see Garrett ripped the helmet off, that alone is suspension. He then tries to hit him with it, that will be a suspension on top. I'm just saying multiple games perhaps but they're not going to ban him for life on the last play of a Pittsburgh-Cleveland Game no less with a lot of bad blood. 

Maybe Mike Tomlin should have just handed it off with 8 seconds left and down 21-7, game was over!

Can I get anyone some eggs n coffee while I head to the kitchen? Some chill pills maybe?

Bump

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It’s honestly amazing to me that there are numerous people who saw this and thought “well he’ll get 2-3 games max”. Makes you wonder how much people are willing to accept. This was the most obvious suspension in the history of the league and people still thought he’d be back by December. 

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The idea that this is a criminal matter is just stupid. The people who think it should be a criminal matter are probably the same people who bring up frivolous lawsuits. This is a brutal sport and this was obviously a brutal situation. If this was Vontez burfict you may have a point. Garrett may have had some late hits in his career but he doesn't have a reputation of being a dirty player.  This was an isolated event that escalated within seconds.  Do we really need to over respond and try to ruin every ones life who makes a mistake in the heat of the moment in what is already a violent sport? Garrett is going to pay dearly for this already. Lets not be dumb and abuse tax payer money because it makes us feel good to kick people when they are down(no pun intended). 

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55 minutes ago, mbuehner said:

There isnt going to be a prosecution, who's interest would that serve? NFL wants to adjudicate this and make it go away as quickly as possible. If somebody was hurt, sure, but the last the NFL wants is law enforcement to become part of the game.

Not up to the NFL.  There’s a history of professional athletes being charged criminally...mostly in the NHL.   The league has no say as to whether he will be charged.

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1 minute ago, Mongidig said:

The idea that this is a criminal matter is just stupid. The people who think it should be a criminal matter are probably the same people who bring up frivolous lawsuits. This is a brutal sport and this was obviously a brutal situation. If this was Vontez burfict you may have a point. Garrett may have had some late hits in his career but he doesn't have a reputation of being a dirty player.  This was an isolated event that escalated within seconds.  Do we really need to over respond and try to ruin every ones life who makes a mistake in the heat of the moment in what is already a violent sport? Garrett is going to pay dearly for this already. Lets not be dumb and abuse tax payer money because it makes us feel good to kick people when they are down(no pun intended). 

This would be a justification for an awful lot of crimes.  

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Finally, after 33 years there is a play that can replace Charles Martin's as the dirtiest play I have witnessed.  Sure, Hanesworth was right there too, but I think this does it, but then again, maybe not.  Martin's was premeditated.  I am still shamed by this as a Packer fan even though he was a fringe player and soon goon and even though the Bears had been asking for it, a bit.  In the end you don't act the ##### to prove your manhood.

 

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wilIF30NLRU

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Just now, -fish- said:

Not up to the NFL.  There’s a history of professional athletes being charged criminally...mostly in the NHL.   The league has no say as to whether he will be charged.

Thats incredibly naive. And the NHL doesnt have anything near the clout of the NFL.  That aside, nobody was hurt. Yes IN THEORY they could still prosecute, but thats just not how the world works.

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I was right on the money last night, I said the decision would be made by 12 noon today and I just heard that Garrett has been suspended without pay indefinitely for the remainder of the regular season and postseason for his role in last nights game.

$500,000 plus in fines. 

Pouncey got 3 games. 

Ogunjobi got 1 game and has already stated he’s appealing. 

Edited by The Claymaker
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3 minutes ago, mbuehner said:

Thats incredibly naive. And the NHL doesnt have anything near the clout of the NFL.  That aside, nobody was hurt. Yes IN THEORY they could still prosecute, but thats just not how the world works.

Huh.  I’ve been a lawyer for over 25 years and know how it is decided whether to bring criminal charges.  Please explain it to me.

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11 hours ago, -fish- said:

Kermit Washington got 26 games. 

Severe NHL suspensions have ranged from 20-41 games, so a max of half a season.

Burfict got what amounts to a 12 game suspension, but it was his 13th disciplinary infraction.

Haynesworth got 5 games for stomping on Andre Gurode.

Donte Stallworth got 1 year for literally killing someone.

Antonio Smith took off Richie Incongnito's helmet and started swinging it, but didn't connect.    1 game.

My guess is the rest of the season and 6 games next year.  No way it's more than the 2020 season.   

This incident will likely be more than any first transgression we've seen. Haynesworth and Antonio Smith are a decent comparison. I'm guessing an indefinite suspension is handed out  (so he's out for this season) with 2-4 more games to start next year to drive home the point (and ensure the shield stays shiny). Paired with the largest monetary fine for a first offense, as well. 8-10 games seems reasonable with a Burfict-esque microscope on everything he does going forward.

 

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11 minutes ago, Capella said:

Suspended indefinitely. Rest of season including playoffs. 

That's about right. NFL won't want to deal with this during the season. Reinstate him during a time in the offseason they are willing to deal with the headache until the next news cycle starts.

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3 minutes ago, mbuehner said:

Thats incredibly naive. And the NHL doesnt have anything near the clout of the NFL.  That aside, nobody was hurt. Yes IN THEORY they could still prosecute, but thats just not how the world works.

Wait, did you just call him naive then follow that up by saying as long as nobody was hurt there's no reason to prosecute?

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1 minute ago, MAC_32 said:

That's about right. NFL won't want to deal with this during the season. Reinstate him during a time in the offseason they are willing to deal with the headache until the next news cycle starts.

i am thinking they will require him to attend some sort of counseling and then will reinstate him in the offseason

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So the Browns and Kitchens lose their chance to have lead on this matter.  They wait to let the NFL do what they themselves should have done.  Missed opportunity.  Not surprised that they do not know what leadership looks like.   Too bad.  This could have been a moment where a team was forged, a culture set, legends born.  

WWLHD

 

What would Lombardi have done?

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6 minutes ago, Ditkaless Wonders said:

I disagree with suspending Pouncy longer than the Brown who knocked Rudolph back to the ground, from behind.  That guy joined the fray, after the fact, and went after a defenseless guy, from behind.  He victimized the victim.  It was cowardly, despicable.

Pouncey was punching and kicking a guy in the head even if deserved that's much worse than a shove. 

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1 minute ago, Pipes said:

Pouncey was punching and kicking a guy in the head even if deserved that's much worse than a shove. 

They are both bad but I have no problem with them being suspended.  I was expecting that Randall would get a game too but I guess that isn't happening

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Just now, Godsbrother said:

They are both bad but I have no problem with them being suspended.  I was expecting that Randall would get a game too but I guess that isn't happening

I think that could still be coming down, and should.  I think the NFL office is focusing on this fight first.  Randall deserves to sit too that was terrible. 

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Just now, Mongidig said:

No! It's just common sense.

No, it's not. That's what attempt crimes serve to do. To deter you from even allowing the possibility of serious injury or death. It doesn't matter how hurt the recipient of the action is, it's whether you intended, by your actions, to reasonably foresee that you might cause that person harm.

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2 minutes ago, Da Guru said:

Looks like Garrett is going to be mentioned in the same breath as Burflict and Suh going forward.  Garrett will have a target on his back the rest of his career now like Burflict and Suh.

Good. I can't think of anything either of those guys ever did that was as bad as this. Sure they had more incidents(Burfict especially) but nothing on this level.

10 minutes ago, Ditkaless Wonders said:

I disagree with suspending Pouncy longer than the Brown who knocked Rudolph back to the ground, from behind.  That guy joined the fray, after the fact, and went after a defenseless guy, from behind.  He victimized the victim.  It was cowardly, despicable.

100% agree. Ogunjobi wasn't even related to the fight, he just came over and hit a helmetless QB for no reason. I have to assume Pouncey's history played a role in his suspension being longer.

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Just now, Encumbrance said:

No, it's not. That's what attempt crimes serve to do. To deter you from even allowing the possibility of serious injury or death. It doesn't matter how hurt the recipient of the action is, it's whether you intended, by your actions, to reasonably foresee that you might cause that person harm.

This wasn’t an attempt crime.  It was assault, and potentially assault with a deadly weapon.  There was no attempt about it.

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Just now, -fish- said:

This wasn’t an attempt crime.  It was assault, and potentially assault with a deadly weapon.  There was no attempt about it.

True. But his broader point was that if you weren't injured, what was the point in charging him? We see, in attempt crimes, that criminal law doesn't follow that logic (the logic whereby the end result is what we judge).

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3 minutes ago, Encumbrance said:

No, it's not. That's what attempt crimes serve to do. To deter you from even allowing the possibility of serious injury or death. It doesn't matter how hurt the recipient of the action is, it's whether you intended, by your actions, to reasonably foresee that you might cause that person harm.

Yah and I think there should be harsher penalties for suicide bombers.

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1 minute ago, Encumbrance said:

True. But his broader point was that if you weren't injured, what was the point in charging him? We see, in attempt crimes, that criminal law doesn't follow that logic (the logic whereby the end result is what we judge).

His point was that he shouldn’t be charged because he doesn’t have a criminal history and that this was “in the heat of the moment.”  That’s pure nonsense.

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Just now, -fish- said:

His point was that he shouldn’t be charged because he doesn’t have a criminal history and that this was “in the heat of the moment.”  That’s pure nonsense.

Oh, I must have missed that. I thought he was saying he didn't really get hurt, therefore...

Consider me corrected.  

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6 minutes ago, -fish- said:

His point was that he shouldn’t be charged because he doesn’t have a criminal history and that this was “in the heat of the moment.”  That’s pure nonsense.

I know..."the law is the law"... "mandatory minimums"...Perpetuate the broken criminal justice system. More importantly, lets not use common sense and judge situations on an individual basis. Lets just make more laws to prevent this extremely isolated incident from ever happening again. I'm sure Garrett and all of those involved were contemplating the consequences of their behaviour in the heat of the moment. Lets just put these guys in an arena and let them pummel each other for 60 minutes and then throw the law at them when things get out of hand. Such a stupid society we live in.

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1 minute ago, Mongidig said:

I know..."the law is the law"... "mandatory minimums"...Perpetuate the broken criminal justice system. More importantly, lets not use common sense and judge situations on an individual basis. Lets just make more laws to prevent this extremely isolated incident from ever happening again. I'm sure Garrett and all of those involved were contemplating the consequences of their behaviour in the heat of the moment. Lets just put these guys in an arena and let them pummel each other for 60 minutes and then throw the law at them when things get out of hand. Such a stupid society we live in.

"Your honor, I know my client committed assault with a deadly weapon, but it's only because he was really mad at the time."

 

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