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*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread


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3 minutes ago, jobarules said:

I remember I used to bring a small thing of hand sanitizer with me to the store. When I was done shopping, I would clean my hands before touching my car keys. Now I just wash my hands when I get home. I remember people in here baking their mail, wiping down groceries, and re-heating their pizza delivery. I hope nobody is doing that anymore.

I don't know about baking mail, but wiping down groceries is not 100% extinct, though in my circle far fewer do it now compared to April/May 2020.

I've more or less trained my wife off of demanding the groceries be sanitized, but sometimes she gets the no-logic willies about something we bought somewhere that's in a package and she'll ask me to wipe it down. I oblige, but it's only a now-and-then thing now.

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1 minute ago, Doug B said:

I can't remember if I posted it here or on another board ... but if I posted it here before, my apologies for repeating it:

It's looking apparent that except for vaccination efforts, we simply won't see the end of the pandemic coming. The cases will drop very low and we won't have the collective experience of having done anything different to make that happen. In a weird sense, vaccination efforts will get too much credit** for the end of the pandemic when it does come.
 

** don't read too much into that -- I just mean that, if you could isolate and quantify all variables (which you can't), the vaccinations might really deserve 60-70% credit for ending the pandemic but will be popularly thought of as having 99.9% credit. Percentages made up to make a point, no link.

If the trajectory continues down to almost non existent in the midwest I will have no issues saying the vaccine had little to do with it. 

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Again, very similar to the Spanish Flu. There still isn't a definitive explanation on why that one faded like it did and I think the reasons why we managed to defeat Covid will be debated for years as well.

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17 minutes ago, Doug B said:
21 minutes ago, Grace Under Pressure said:

There should certainly be a lot more focus on ventilation and air exchange. 

I was heartened to hear Joe Biden in a weekend interview make improved ventilation the second condition of schools re-opening safely. Others may have heard the interview, and CNN has been playing clips of it this morning. Let me see if I can get a link for the house.

It was an interview with Norah O'Donnell with CBS News. Here's the skinny:

Quote

 

In that interview, President Biden said it’s time to safely reopen schools — and the CDC could release their guidance as soon as Wednesday this week.

The President says there will need to be fewer people in the classroom and ventilation systems will have to be reworked.

He has said he wanted to get most K-12 schools open during his first 100 days in office with guidance from medical experts.

According to CNN, the CDC is actively working on the official guidance for reopening schools.

The head of the CDC has said there is increasing data to show schools can reopen safely and it doesn’t mean teachers have to be vaccinated for it to happen.

The President says it’s time to make it happen.

“Do you think it’s time for schools to reopen?” Norah O’Donnell asked President Biden.

“I think it’s time for schools to reopen safely. Safely. You have to have fewer people in the classroom. You have to have ventilation systems that have been reworked,” the President said.

 

 

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1 hour ago, jobarules said:

#s declining everywhere. Anyone know why? Is this just the normal pattern of viruses? I doubt anyone changed their routines in the last month. I know the holiday gatherings contributed to the spike. Is that it?

I think we had a bunch of holidays that caused spreader events, that have run their course, plus vaccinations and 1/3 of the population already likely having been infected . . . . now if the UK variant becomes the dominant strain (and it is taking a foothold in FL apparently) then these numbers could tick back up if vaccinations don't pick up the pace.

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15 minutes ago, parasaurolophus said:

If the trajectory continues down to almost non existent in the midwest I will have no issues saying the vaccine had little to do with it. 

The vaccines will prevent future localized/regional outbreaks, though -- those can still happen, especially if a "magic strain" develops as may have happened (finally) in South Africa.

I had been able to mentally sweep all the "variants!" news under the rug ... but I'm starting to get some more science-based "trustable" news about the SA variant, and it ain't good. The good news is that a vaccine against the SA variant can be developed and manufactured quickly IF the usual red tape is cleared away.

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10 minutes ago, Doug B said:

The vaccines will prevent future localized/regional outbreaks, though -- those can still happen, especially if a "magic strain" develops as may have happened (finally) in South Africa.

I had been able to mentally sweep all the "variants!" news under the rug ... but I'm starting to get some more science-based "trustable" news about the SA variant, and it ain't good. The good news is that a vaccine against the SA variant can be developed and manufactured quickly IF the usual red tape is cleared away.

Dont the SA numbers continue to plunge though? 

 

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3 hours ago, AcerFC said:

I apologize for this question since I know it has probably been answered, but I have not kept up with this thread

How long after getting the second dose do people generally start to feel achy or sick. My appointment is today. They said I can come any time. Trying to decide if I should go during my hour and a half off or if I should go after work. TIA

5-6 hours seems to be the same general ballpark answer I get from people that I know that have had ill effects from dose #2. That's for the onset. Then anywhere from 12-60 hours of feeling bad. Again, just an informal poll of people I personally know. Sample size of probably 10-12. 

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16 minutes ago, parasaurolophus said:

Don't the SA numbers continue to plunge though? 

Looks that way on Worldometers. But that may not necessarily be germane to the particular problem that it now looks like a vaccine-resistant variant is out there in the wild. We in the U.S. are probably going to be fortunate in that South Africa is not a frequent travel source/destination for American travelers like Europe and East Asia are.

I still hold out a little bit of hope that even the reliable-looking science-based news about the SA variant is, itself, going to prove to be overblown. Guess we'll see.

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1 hour ago, jobarules said:

I remember I used to bring a small thing of hand sanitizer with me to the store. When I was done shopping, I would clean my hands before touching my car keys. Now I just wash my hands when I get home. I remember people in here baking their mail, wiping down groceries, and re-heating their pizza delivery. I hope nobody is doing that anymore.

I still sanitize after visiting a store. I know in my head I probably don't need to but I also don't begrudge the habit as it probably has other benefits non-COVID related so I'm good with it. I wash up when I get home and before I eat. All good habits that I don't mind continuing after we are past this thing.

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Wife tested positive this weekend.  She woke up feeling lousy on Saturday, including fever/chills, some coughing and a bit of a sore throat.  Generally a very healthy person so we were pretty sure she got it somewhere.  Both me and the kids feel fine, although my almost-10-year-old daughter felt lousy enough this past Tuesday to stay home from school.  And there was one or two days last week where it felt like the weather was doing its normal thing to my head (but no fever/chills/sore throat).

She works at Starbucks so I think her being positive shuts her store down for 10 days.

Gonna quarantine for 10 days and hope that her symptoms stay fairly mild.  She takes supplements and is healthy so she should be OK.  

My parents are going to get tested just in case, since I saw them briefly last week.

Was hoping we'd avoid this whole thing but with the wife working retail and the kids in school and us letting them play with the neighborhood kids, I guess I see how it got to us.

Hoping I don't get any symptoms 'cuz I've never had the flu.  :( 

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28 minutes ago, nirad3 said:

Wife tested positive this weekend.  She woke up feeling lousy on Saturday, including fever/chills, some coughing and a bit of a sore throat.  Generally a very healthy person so we were pretty sure she got it somewhere.  Both me and the kids feel fine, although my almost-10-year-old daughter felt lousy enough this past Tuesday to stay home from school.  And there was one or two days last week where it felt like the weather was doing its normal thing to my head (but no fever/chills/sore throat).

She works at Starbucks so I think her being positive shuts her store down for 10 days.

Gonna quarantine for 10 days and hope that her symptoms stay fairly mild.  She takes supplements and is healthy so she should be OK.  

My parents are going to get tested just in case, since I saw them briefly last week.

Was hoping we'd avoid this whole thing but with the wife working retail and the kids in school and us letting them play with the neighborhood kids, I guess I see how it got to us.

Hoping I don't get any symptoms 'cuz I've never had the flu.  :( 

which starbucks :unsure: flying down to Seal Beach Thursday and don't want to get no HB infections while down there. Sugar Shack, Nicks, Volcano Burger, las barcas... oh my. Glad I'm vaccinated as I'll chance the 5% chance I get sick for all the tasty food down there. 

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2 minutes ago, jobarules said:
41 minutes ago, nirad3 said:

 Generally a very healthy person so we were pretty sure she got it somewhere. 

What did you mean by this? Everyone gets it from somewhere.

I don't want to put words in nirad's mouth, so I'll note specifically here that I am not talking about nirad3.

...

There is an idea out there -- and I see it peep out a bit on this board from time to time -- that there are:

a) people who are "supposed to get COVID" aka "the vulnerable" -- the elderly, cancer survivors, the immunocompromised, etc.

b) people who "deserve to get COVID" -- the deniers, the reckless, the smokers, the overweight and obese, etc.

c) people who "won't get COVID" -- the 'healthy', people who eat right and exercise, people who take COVID seriously and take precautions, and children.

When a person identified with a given group doesn't get the expected result, it can cause the all-too human response of wondering why things don't always go to plan? Why people get outcomes they either deserve or don't deserve? There's chaos inherent in the spread of a pandemic, and it's not always easy for a person to grapple with the proximate manifestations (e.g. among the "people I know").

Corollary: It's often thought that contracting COVID is a volitional act. There is an instinct to assign blame or wonder "What went wrong?" or "Who/what did this? I was being careful. I was following the rules."

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21 minutes ago, CGRdrJoe said:

which starbucks :unsure: flying down to Seal Beach Thursday and don't want to get no HB infections while down there. Sugar Shack, Nicks, Volcano Burger, las barcas... oh my. Glad I'm vaccinated as I'll chance the 5% chance I get sick for all the tasty food down there. 

She works at a location in Costa Mesa so you should be good.  Enjoy your stay and the food!  :)

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15 minutes ago, jobarules said:

What did you mean by this? Everyone gets it from somewhere.

:lol:  Just went back and re-read and honestly I don't know what I meant by that. I  think I was inbetween two separate thoughts and combined into a sentence that makes no sense.

Thought #1:  she's a generally very healthy person

Thought #2:  works retail 2-3 days/nights a week, goes shopping, has seen some friends in an outdoor/socially-distanced way

Sorry for the confusion.

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46 minutes ago, Doug B said:

I don't want to put words in nirad's mouth, so I'll note specifically here that I am not talking about nirad3.

...

There is an idea out there -- and I see it peep out a bit on this board from time to time -- that there are:

a) people who are "supposed to get COVID" aka "the vulnerable" -- the elderly, cancer survivors, the immunocompromised, etc.

b) people who "deserve to get COVID" -- the deniers, the reckless, the smokers, the overweight and obese, etc.

c) people who "won't get COVID" -- the 'healthy', people who eat right and exercise, people who take COVID seriously and take precautions, and children.

When a person identified with a given group doesn't get the expected result, it can cause the all-too human response of wondering why things don't always go to plan? Why people get outcomes they either deserve or don't deserve? There's chaos inherent in the spread of a pandemic, and it's not always easy for a person to grapple with the proximate manifestations (e.g. among the "people I know").

Corollary: It's often thought that contracting COVID is a volitional act. There is an instinct to assign blame or wonder "What went wrong?" or "Who/what did this? I was being careful. I was following the rules."

there is definitely an instinct to assign blame, but what makes this country what it is, is our inane ability to place and seek blame in every event there is.....

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46 minutes ago, Chemical X said:

there is definitely an instinct to assign blame, but what makes this country what it is, is our inane ability to place and seek blame in every event there is.....

We're definitely not playing the blame game here, but she is bummed that she "is a statistic" now.  😐 

Hell, I could have easily been the one to bring it into the house myself.  I admittedly have been not as careful as I should be in some respects.  

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6 hours ago, jobarules said:

Just looking at some #s in NY. Hospitals never got overwhelmed during the 2nd wave. NY was at around 15k cases a day. Deaths were around 150-200/day. Meanwhile during the 1st wave, NY cases were around 10k a day, hospitals were at their peak and deaths hit 1000/day at their peak. Why? I realize testing wasn't good then. So how many positive cases do we think NY had during the 1st wave? 5x as many? That would be around 75k cases a day. That's insane if true.

Random anti-body testing in NYC over the summer indicates about 20% of the population of NYC had the virus at that time.  That equals about 1.5mm cases.  So some massive under reporting due to testing issues.  

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2 hours ago, Chemical X said:

pet peeve; when the media says the nfl will have all 32 stadiums open for vaccinations, we all know there are only 30 stadiums and yell at the tv?

lol

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8 hours ago, AcerFC said:

I apologize for this question since I know it has probably been answered, but I have not kept up with this thread

How long after getting the second dose do people generally start to feel achy or sick. My appointment is today. They said I can come any time. Trying to decide if I should go during my hour and a half off or if I should go after work. TIA

You can go during your hour and a half,  my co-workers got hit the following day from the Moderna vaccine.

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Dumb question - how are some of you able to get the vaccine?  Are you in healthcare?  High-risk? 

According to everything I've read, the only folks getting vaccines in California are frontline healthcare workers and older folks.

Are things being done differently in other states?

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1 minute ago, nirad3 said:

Dumb question - how are some of you able to get the vaccine?  Are you in healthcare?  High-risk? 

According to everything I've read, the only folks getting vaccines in California are frontline healthcare workers and older folks.

Are things being done differently in other states?

NY has two groups. 1A are healthcare workers. 1B is police, teachers, people over 65

i am a teacher

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3 minutes ago, AcerFC said:

NY has two groups. 1A are healthcare workers. 1B is police, teachers, people over 65

i am a teacher

ny’s sites are limited and miles away from people.  also, not an appointment to be found.  1a and 1b will be complete by august at this rate.

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11 minutes ago, nirad3 said:

Dumb question - how are some of you able to get the vaccine?  Are you in healthcare?  High-risk? 

According to everything I've read, the only folks getting vaccines in California are frontline healthcare workers and older folks.

Are things being done differently in other states?

Ny is allowing those with co-morbidities to start Feb 15. Still very tough to get an appt though.

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They keep saying there will be these "mega sites" like NFL stadiums.  Do we even have enough vaccines on the ready to open these places up?  Or are they just planning way ahead of time for the spring/summer when we have a poo-ton of vaccines ready for the general public?

Not to get political, but I'm generally anti-government involvement in certain things, but this is something where I think the National Guard needs to be brought in to administer the process.  Get a ton of vaccines ready, open up NFL/college stadiums' parking lots set up with tents and let's get people driving through to get the shot.  Maybe I'm just not understanding, but this shouldn't be so difficult.  I understand the vaccine takes time to produce, but production should be running 24/7 and at higher rates than we've ever seen.

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6 minutes ago, nirad3 said:

They keep saying there will be these "mega sites" like NFL stadiums.  Do we even have enough vaccines on the ready to open these places up?  Or are they just planning way ahead of time for the spring/summer when we have a poo-ton of vaccines ready for the general public?

Not to get political, but I'm generally anti-government involvement in certain things, but this is something where I think the National Guard needs to be brought in to administer the process.  Get a ton of vaccines ready, open up NFL/college stadiums' parking lots set up with tents and let's get people driving through to get the shot.  Maybe I'm just not understanding, but this shouldn't be so difficult.  I understand the vaccine takes time to produce, but production should be running 24/7 and at higher rates than we've ever seen.

Can we tailgate after getting the jab?

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20 minutes ago, nirad3 said:

Dumb question - how are some of you able to get the vaccine?  Are you in healthcare?  High-risk? 

According to everything I've read, the only folks getting vaccines in California are frontline healthcare workers and older folks.

Are things being done differently in other states?

Based on people I know they fall into one of 3 categories:

1) over 65 or 75 depending on the state

2) medical field worker

3) relatively well off white person with “connections”

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16 minutes ago, Chemical X said:

ny’s sites are limited and miles away from people.  also, not an appointment to be found.  1a and 1b will be complete by august at this rate.

It’s not that hard. I was able to get appointments for everyone I know. My mom is the only one who has not gotten one yet. She had an appointment yesterday but they postponed due to snow. 

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My wife and I are both adjunct professors at Thomas Jefferson University.  We both received an invitation to get vaccinated.  We didn’t have to fill out any questionnaire to assess our health/exposure risk.  They’re just distributing it to employees and patients.  I technically do fall into a high risk category because I have Crohn’s disease and am currently on immunosuppressant medications.  But that had nothing to do with why I’m right now sitting in the waiting area after receiving my first dose 10 minutes ago.

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1 minute ago, fred_1_15301 said:

My wife and I are both adjunct professors at Thomas Jefferson University.  We both received an invitation to get vaccinated.  We didn’t have to fill out any questionnaire to assess our health/exposure risk.  They’re just distributing it to employees and patients.  I technically do fall into a high risk category because I have Crohn’s disease and am currently on immunosuppressant medications.  But that had nothing to do with why I’m right now sitting in the waiting area after receiving my first dose 10 minutes ago.

My wife is faculty in a very prominent school of public heath, which is across the street from a giant research hospital.  She will have to wait until Group 3.

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7 minutes ago, The Z Machine said:

My wife is faculty in a very prominent school of public heath, which is across the street from a giant research hospital.  She will have to wait until Group 3.

Yup bizarre.  I have no idea why we got invited.

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9 minutes ago, fred_1_15301 said:
16 minutes ago, The Z Machine said:

My wife is faculty in a very prominent school of public heath, which is across the street from a giant research hospital.  She will have to wait until Group 3.

Yup bizarre.  I have no idea why we got invited.

Are you and Z in the same state? This kind of stuff varies a ton between states. And if Thomas Jefferson University is a private entity ... they may have had their own route to get employees vaccinated completely outside of your state's public protocols.

...

In many parts of Alabama and Mississippi (and I presume parts of Louisiana), many in the first tier(s) are willfully refusing the vaccine. The effect has been that many places giving vaccinations almost always have a surplus of doses every day. Sometimes pharmacist (et al) are calling around to family and friends to hurry up and come down to get the shot. Some places are taking phone calls from the general public -- no tiers -- and making call lists: "We'll call you when we've got a surplus for the day."

Edited by Doug B
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11 minutes ago, Doug B said:

Are you and Z in the same state? This kind of stuff varies a ton between states. And if Thomas Jefferson University is a private entity ... they may have had their own route to get employees vaccinated completely outside of your state's public protocols.

...

In many parts of Alabama and Mississippi (and I presume parts of Louisiana), many in the first tier(s) are willfully refusing the vaccine. The effect has been that many places giving vaccinations almost always have a surplus of doses every day. Sometimes pharmacist (et al) are calling around to family and friends to hurry up and come down to get the shot. Some places are taking phone calls from the general public -- no tiers -- and making call lists: "We'll call you when we've got a surplus for the day."

Yup.  My wife's family is from Louisiana and her Mom is saying that they're giving doses away at Wal-Mart to just about anyone.

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1 hour ago, nirad3 said:

Dumb question - how are some of you able to get the vaccine?  Are you in healthcare?  High-risk? 

According to everything I've read, the only folks getting vaccines in California are frontline healthcare workers and older folks.

Are things being done differently in other states?

San Antonio:

Phase 1B: People 65+ or people 16+ with a health condition that increases risk of severe COVID‑19 illness, including but not limited to:

Cancer

Chronic kidney disease

COPD (chronic obstructive pulmonary disease)

Down Syndrome

Heart conditions, such as heart failure, coronary artery disease, or cardiomyopathies

Organ transplantation

Obesity

Pregnancy

Sickle cell disease

Type 2 diabetes

70% of San Antonio falls in this group (yes seriously).

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I started making a list tonight of the people around me that have gotten Covid. The number is pretty sobering.

Off the top of my head, 45 people I know have contracted it. Of the 45 people, the largest amount were co-workers and their immediate family. 7 coworkers were hospitalized. 2 may have permanent lung damage.

7 of the 45 people have died. In my immediate family both of my sons have had it, my daughter in law, and my grandson. Luckily we have avoided any serious complications or death in the family.

:(

 

 

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Parents got picked in the FL lottery and get Moderna Jab 1 Wednesday, 40 minutes before I get my Moderna Jab 2 down in Jacksonville, MS. (2.5hr drive) 

Ice storm coming in that night so getting it just in the nick of time... hopefully. :unsure: 

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6 hours ago, top dog said:

I started making a list tonight of the people around me that have gotten Covid. The number is pretty sobering.

Off the top of my head, 45 people I know have contracted it. Of the 45 people, the largest amount were co-workers and their immediate family. 7 coworkers were hospitalized. 2 may have permanent lung damage.

7 of the 45 people have died. In my immediate family both of my sons have had it, my daughter in law, and my grandson. Luckily we have avoided any serious complications or death in the family.

:(

 

 

Wow. 

I'm sorry GB :( 

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15 hours ago, nirad3 said:

Dumb question - how are some of you able to get the vaccine?  Are you in healthcare?  High-risk? 

There are lots of self-centered people out there with no moral compass who will gladly push their way ahead of deserving people who actually qualify for the vaccine. Shocking, I know.

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15 minutes ago, E-Z Glider said:

There are lots of self-centered people out there with no moral compass who will gladly push their way ahead of deserving people who actually qualify for the vaccine. Shocking, I know.

Some states are doing a better job of vaccination. My city has administered the first shot to almost 15% of the total population.

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19 minutes ago, E-Z Glider said:

There are lots of self-centered people out there with no moral compass who will gladly push their way ahead of deserving people who actually qualify for the vaccine. Shocking, I know.

I have absolutely no problem with anyone getting the vaccine right now.  The more people the better.  It is much better to put it to use quickly than to have it go unused waiting for people who qualify to schedule an appointment.  Sounds like a lot of folks who qualify are refusing to get it which is causing a delay.  

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4 minutes ago, Dezbelief said:

Some states are doing a better job of vaccination. My city has administered the first shot to almost 15% of the total population.

That's because some states have less complicated distribution channels. West Virginia has like one major healthcare system to work through. PA has like 20. Not hard to see why PA is taking longer than WV.

 

3 minutes ago, Gilroy34 said:

I have absolutely no problem with anyone getting the vaccine right now.  The more people the better.  It is much better to put it to use quickly than to have it go unused waiting for people who qualify to schedule an appointment.  Sounds like a lot of folks who qualify are refusing to get it which is causing a delay.  

I agree with the general sentiment, but Im not talking about being on a standby list for leftovers. Im talking about underserving people taking appointments when there are still tons of older (qualified) people who cant get an appointment. How would people refusing to get it cause any delays? :confused: They'll just get skipped over. 

 

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15 hours ago, fred_1_15301 said:

Yup bizarre.  I have no idea why we got invited.

My state has teachers -- which includes college professors -- in the same general category as people over 65 and people with two or more comorbidities.  That makes sense if you want teachers working inside a classroom with students present.  We actually break down this group into little sub-groups, with the result being that teachers will get vaccinated after old people but before the general population, which strikes me as about right.  It's certainly a reasonable way to prioritize various populations.  

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43 minutes ago, E-Z Glider said:

There are lots of self-centered people out there with no moral compass who will gladly push their way ahead of deserving people who actually qualify for the vaccine. Shocking, I know.

Speaking as somebody who's perfectly happy to wait his turn, I can't disagree with this strongly enough.  There are no "undeserving" vaccine recipients, and every shot that goes into every arm benefits me indirectly.  I mean, I guess I would entertain an argument that Khalid Sheik Muhammed was undeserving of vaccination, but I doubt he's the person who you had in mind, and if vaccinating KSM helps keep prison guards and their families safe, I'm all for it. 

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19 hours ago, Doug B said:

I don't want to put words in nirad's mouth, so I'll note specifically here that I am not talking about nirad3.

...

There is an idea out there -- and I see it peep out a bit on this board from time to time -- that there are:

a) people who are "supposed to get COVID" aka "the vulnerable" -- the elderly, cancer survivors, the immunocompromised, etc.

b) people who "deserve to get COVID" -- the deniers, the reckless, the smokers, the overweight and obese, etc.

c) people who "won't get COVID" -- the 'healthy', people who eat right and exercise, people who take COVID seriously and take precautions, and children.

When a person identified with a given group doesn't get the expected result, it can cause the all-too human response of wondering why things don't always go to plan? Why people get outcomes they either deserve or don't deserve? There's chaos inherent in the spread of a pandemic, and it's not always easy for a person to grapple with the proximate manifestations (e.g. among the "people I know").

Corollary: It's often thought that contracting COVID is a volitional act. There is an instinct to assign blame or wonder "What went wrong?" or "Who/what did this? I was being careful. I was following the rules."

Yes, I've noticed this same dynamic for a long time.  It gets on my nerves and I've started to police my own language to avoid assigning blame to people who get covid.  I'm sure everyone understands intellectually that masks, social distancing, etc. aren't infallible and that you can still catch a communicable disease just from being unlucky, but you wouldn't know that from the moralistic way that folks sometimes discuss the issue. 

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7 minutes ago, IvanKaramazov said:

Speaking as somebody who's perfectly happy to wait his turn, I can't disagree with this strongly enough.  There are no "undeserving" vaccine recipients, and every shot that goes into every arm benefits me indirectly.  I mean, I guess I would entertain an argument that Khalid Sheik Muhammed was undeserving of vaccination, but I doubt he's the person who you had in mind, and if vaccinating KSM helps keep prison guards and their families safe, I'm all for it. 

Undeserving may have been the wrong word. How about unqualified? Im referring to the people not currently eligible who are gaming the on-line systems to get ahead of those that are qualified just so they can go on some tropical vacation next month. Its just all so predictable. People suck, whatever.

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34 minutes ago, E-Z Glider said:

 

I agree with the general sentiment, but Im not talking about being on a standby list for leftovers. Im talking about underserving people taking appointments when there are still tons of older (qualified) people who cant get an appointment. How would people refusing to get it cause any delays? :confused: They'll just get skipped over. 

 

I want as many people vaccinated as quickly as possible.  I have no issue at all if anyone "skips the line" as I would do the same if I could.

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