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*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread


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2 hours ago, Doug B said:

This is true. Birth control pills are essentially hormone treatments ... hormones that already naturally occur in a woman's body. Men have these hormones, too, but much less of one specific one (estrogen).

I wonder if, in the interim, men can still proceed with the J&J vaccine? I'm trying to get more detailed demographic information about the blood clot sufferers in Europe who had the AZ vaccine.

A high-level view of the AstraZeneca blood clot issue in Europe yields equivocal information about whether women are clearly at higher risk than men. The first few paragraphs here give a good summation (Financial Times, 4/9/2021):

Quote

Health authorities across Europe have stressed that the rare blood clots linked to the Oxford/AstraZeneca coronavirus vaccine are as common in men as women, as experts continue to puzzle over the mechanism causing the strange constellation of sometimes fatal symptoms. 

Early reports on the clots from Europe stressed that the vast majority of cases were observed in women — a phenomenon that seemed to make sense given that the specific kind of blood clot gaining attention is known to afflict women roughly twice as much as men. In late March, Germany announced that there had been 31 cases in total, 29 of which affected women.

But at a press conference held by the UK medicines regulator on Wednesday, Sir Munir Pirmohamed, chair of the UK’s Commission on Human Medicines, a government advisory body, said the incidence rate of rare blood clots showed “no difference” between men and women.

The European Medicines Agency also said there had been no indication that there was a gender more at risk.

The pronouncement from two of the most established international health agencies has turned early understanding of the condition on its head, and eliminated some of the most compelling hypotheses about the scientific mechanism causing the response.

Gender-specific risk factors that experts had put forward as possible explanations included oral contraceptives, pregnancy and hormonal replacement therapy, all of which tend to be risk factors for these blood clots in normal times.


Further reading from a few days prior to the article above, when the increased risk for women seemed more conclusive: Women under 60 face higher risk of rare clotting after AstraZeneca shot - German official (Reuters, 4/7/2021)

 

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My dad has been sick for a few weeks.  My mom called me today to say he was about to die.  I said some final words to him and he could hear me but was unable to respond.  He passed a short time later.

Not to derail anything, but we had our baby last night! She's doing amazingly well. Due to the hospital's pandemic policies, I had to leave her right after my wife was released from recovery. I can't

On a positive note, my wife gave birth to our first child this morning!! We were expecting our daughter to be born in the first week of April, which does not align very well if this hospital sees a ma

https://twitter.com/squawkcnbc/status/1381945683276664839?s=21
 

A good interview with Scott Gottlieb. His theory is that they made this move to determine if it is truly an extremely rare event or if they’ve only caught the major occurrences and minor clots are happening under the radar.

It’s reasonable but no matter what the damage has been done. J&J was the vaccine most who were skeptical were willing to get. That’s done now.

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My 16 year old is excited to get her 1st shot this Saturday. She wants us to go to Vegas in July. :D

Weird pandemic supply problems---I can't get large pasta shells anywhere and i don't want to order on-line because they will not arrive in one piece for sure. This has been going on for weeks..

And the worst problem of all---Coors Light is sold out everywhere. I mean gone--gone!! It started slowly-three weeks ago, no bottles.anywhere. I have had to resort to (gasp) cans!!  My friend, who is a distributor, said there is a shortage of bottles, but he also said something about a cyber attack at Coors plant causing this. Yes, I only drink Coors Light--flame away. 

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My wife is on blood thinners for having had clots in the past and we both got our J&J vaccines last week.  Is there concern for her case?  I'm thinking that since she's already on blood thinners, it would be less likely for something to happen, but who knows.  

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So depressed today over this. On the surface it seems like a good idea. Let's check it out to make sure it is not something to be concerned about. But the reality is that today may be where our progress as a country grinds to a halt. Those that were ready to get the shot have been trying to get the vaccine since it became available. At least in my state, I believe the majority have been Moderna or Phizer. Those (like my wife) who have been leery of the new mRNA ones who were willing to jump on the JnJ vaccine because it was "safer" are now likely to pass on ANY vaccination. We are going to get to a point VERY QUICKLY where those willing to get vaccinated have done so and the rest.... Well, they are going to take their chances. And that won't be enough to kick this virus to the curb. 

I was optimistic we were going to get back to normal by the end of the year. Now I'm not so sure. :(

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10 hours ago, The Z Machine said:

Their vaccine rollout has been very poor.  I think they went in big time on AZ, then declined to distribute it.  So they don't have nearly the doses they thought they would 6 months ago.

apparently they bought the Chinese version & it didn't work.     So they were behind by 2 months and counting.

from what I have heard from my Canadian friends.

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4 hours ago, top dog said:

So depressed today over this. On the surface it seems like a good idea. Let's check it out to make sure it is not something to be concerned about. But the reality is that today may be where our progress as a country grinds to a halt. Those that were ready to get the shot have been trying to get the vaccine since it became available. At least in my state, I believe the majority have been Moderna or Phizer. Those (like my wife) who have been leery of the new mRNA ones who were willing to jump on the JnJ vaccine because it was "safer" are now likely to pass on ANY vaccination. We are going to get to a point VERY QUICKLY where those willing to get vaccinated have done so and the rest.... Well, they are going to take their chances. And that won't be enough to kick this virus to the curb. 

I was optimistic we were going to get back to normal by the end of the year. Now I'm not so sure. :(

Every time we post new appointments I wonder if this will be the time where it doesn’t fill up. Hasn’t happened yet but every day we struggle to find replacements for no shows. I spent a couple hours planning out our schedule for the next two months but wonder if there will be demand in a few weeks. After the J&J news, I’m not so sure.

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14 hours ago, Courtjester said:

My 16 year old is excited to get her 1st shot this Saturday. She wants us to go to Vegas in July. :D

Weird pandemic supply problems---I can't get large pasta shells anywhere and i don't want to order on-line because they will not arrive in one piece for sure. This has been going on for weeks..

And the worst problem of all---Coors Light is sold out everywhere. I mean gone--gone!! It started slowly-three weeks ago, no bottles.anywhere. I have had to resort to (gasp) cans!!  My friend, who is a distributor, said there is a shortage of bottles, but he also said something about a cyber attack at Coors plant causing this. Yes, I only drink Coors Light--flame away. 

Coors Lite is the thinking man's beer. No shame sir. I only wish they sold it in the stubbies like they sell Coors Banquet.

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49 minutes ago, the moops said:

I did read that the J & J shots have only acounted for 5% of total shots given. So while it is dumb, hopefully it doesn't slow things down too much

I think the bigger issue isnt the % of the shots that have been given, but the number of people who were hesitant but considering the JnJ because it was "traditional" technology rather than what has never been done before (mRNA). For whatever the reason, people are afraid of unknown risks (new vaccine technology, long term effects that can't be determined yet) more than known risks such as death and complications from COVID. 

I know it is anecdotal,  but I know a handful of people who were scared of the mRNA but willing to get the JnJ for this very reason. 

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40 minutes ago, the moops said:

I did read that the J & J shots have only acounted for 5% of total shots given. So while it is dumb, hopefully it doesn't slow things down too much

It’s a small percentage of the total doses but considering it’s a 1-shot dose and started well after the other two, the daily share is much higher. It is the shot of choice for the vaccine skeptics and for on-site vaccination clinics (no need for second clinic).

Pfizer and Moderna both are sending out more doses earlier, so if there’s no decrease in demand, supply can keep up. I’d expect a significant decrease in demand. We had 80 appointments on Friday and 80 for an off-site clinic on Monday. We’re gonna try to convert everyone to Pfizer but I’m expecting 30-40 on Friday and maybe 50 on Monday.

The issue bigger than supply is confidence and I think a lot of people will equate problems with J&J as problems with all COVID. It is going to pose significant problems and I predict many states will see dramatic drops in doses given.

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5 minutes ago, top dog said:

I think the bigger issue isnt the % of the shots that have been given, but the number of people who were hesitant but considering the JnJ because it was "traditional" technology rather than what has never been done before (mRNA). For whatever the reason, people are afraid of unknown risks (new vaccine technology, long term effects that can't be determined yet) more than known risks such as death and complications from COVID. 

I know it is anecdotal,  but I know a handful of people who were scared of the mRNA but willing to get the JnJ for this very reason. 

What I’ve seen is more the convenience of 1-dose rather than concerns with the mRNA vaccine. But it was going to play a huge role in getting those hesitant fully immunized no matter the reason.

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It still is a setback for the vaccination process.no matter how you slice it. I have multiple family members who are anti-vax and they have send me "I told yo so" type texts after the the J&J news.  My 16 year old daughter has seen the same from several of her friends and their families. It just gives the uneducated a small moment of validation and that allows this pandemic to go on longer and longer. 

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I think it's wild that the FDA tells grown adults that they can't have access to a vaccine against a once-in-a-lifetime pandemic because of a complication that maybe occurs 0.0001% of the time (and may not even have anything to do with the vaccine), and we all just accept that of course that's how it should be.  Why do we give this kind of power to anybody, let alone people who have proven themselves unable to be trusted with it?

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17 hours ago, Courtjester said:

My 16 year old is excited to get her 1st shot this Saturday. She wants us to go to Vegas in July. :D

Weird pandemic supply problems---I can't get large pasta shells anywhere and i don't want to order on-line because they will not arrive in one piece for sure. This has been going on for weeks..

And the worst problem of all---Coors Light is sold out everywhere. I mean gone--gone!! It started slowly-three weeks ago, no bottles.anywhere. I have had to resort to (gasp) cans!!  My friend, who is a distributor, said there is a shortage of bottles, but he also said something about a cyber attack at Coors plant causing this. Yes, I only drink Coors Light--flame away. 

 I don't know which one is worse, Coors Light or Vegas in July? Big fan of being in an oven? :lol:

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1 hour ago, IvanKaramazov said:

I think it's wild that the FDA tells grown adults that they can't have access to a vaccine against a once-in-a-lifetime pandemic because of a complication that maybe occurs 0.0001% of the time (and may not even have anything to do with the vaccine), and we all just accept that of course that's how it should be.  Why do we give this kind of power to anybody, let alone people who have proven themselves unable to be trusted with it?

If not the FDA and CDC, then who/what would assure quality control and safety?  I agree that this stoppage seems a bit pre-mature -- hoping there isn't other data showing more danger that has not been disclosed yet.  

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4 minutes ago, Leeroy Jenkins said:

If not the FDA and CDC, then who/what would assure quality control and safety?  I agree that this stoppage seems a bit pre-mature -- hoping there isn't other data showing more danger that has not been disclosed yet.  

One take I posted earlier in one of the threads was that they are trying to determine if it’s just the isolated cases or something much bigger that’s being underreported because the symptoms could just be viewed as side effects (headaches, stomach pain, leg pain).

If that’s the case, more transparency would be better along with a time frame. Maybe a pause for 30 days to perform an extensive outreach with recently vaccinated J&J patients to evaluate the risk of clots. Or pause it just for certain demographics at higher risk - females under 60.

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On 4/12/2021 at 11:18 AM, AAABatteries said:

Georgia still dead last at 15% - we may never hit 50%

Georgia still doing horrible but overall it's promising we are at 37% with at least one shot nationally.  Does anybody have any good details on herd immunity and how regional numbers impact that?  Meaning, are we assuming an even distribution of those with immunity and if so, how does one state, like Georgia, impact things overall?

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I am on a call with a bunch of national real estate developers and one guy just said how Georgia was doing a great job on the vaccine roll-out and that has helped keep jobs moving.  GEORGIA DOING GREAT!?!?  What world am I living in?

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4 minutes ago, Leeroy Jenkins said:

I am on a call with a bunch of national real estate developers and one guy just said how Georgia was doing a great job on the vaccine roll-out and that has helped keep jobs moving.  GEORGIA DOING GREAT!?!?  What world am I living in?

I guess it depends on what he means - it does seem like we are doing a ok (not great) job getting it to the people who want it - we just don't have a lot of people who want it apparently.

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14 minutes ago, Leeroy Jenkins said:

I am on a call with a bunch of national real estate developers and one guy just said how Georgia was doing a great job on the vaccine roll-out and that has helped keep jobs moving.  GEORGIA DOING GREAT!?!?  What world am I living in?

Guesses:

1.  A world without facts

2.  A world where "great" = very few people want a dose so everybody already has one

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On 4/13/2021 at 6:45 AM, madshot31 said:

The fact the cases only happened in women inside the birth control age ranges is big. Birth control causes a much higher risk of blood clots in women. My money would be on this is a birth control issue side affect and just happens they got the vaccine. My wife can never have birth control due to clotting. She received a now banned birth control years back and had stroke like vision symptoms. It dissolved on the drive to to the ER and was normal by the time she was admitted. Two years later that drug had a class action suit against it for a very high clotting risk. 

Doubt it. These clots are associated with low platelet counts; birth control clots are not.

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A little more information about the six J&J vaccine recipients with the rare blood clots. While the sample size of six is tiny, it seems that these six women had some commonalities in terms of general overall health, including conditions with which people are prone to generating blood clots.

Quote

 

Johnson & Johnson vaccine remains on pause as CDC panel requests more information (NBC News, 4/14/2021)

The six cases involved rare blood clots in vessels leading out of the brain, called cerebral venous sinus thrombosis, or CVST, as well as low levels of platelets. All of the cases were in white women between ages 18 and 48 and occurred six to 13 days after they received the shot.

Three patients also developed clots in other parts of the body. No one was pregnant or had recently given birth. Three were obese. One person reported hormone therapy.

No other pre-existing conditions linking the cases were identified.

 

A seventh woman, age 59, developed deep-vein thrombosis (or DVT, a different clotting disorder) after receiving the J&J vaccine. My note: I don't believe that a cause-and-effect relationship between the one DVT case and the J&J vaccine has been at all established ... or even really suspected based on one case in ~7 million.

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Excellent news on the vaccine front.  5800 breakthrough cases among 66 million people vaccinated.  About 1 in 11,000 give or take.  

https://twitter.com/elizacollins1/status/1382685621861416970 (linking to Twitter because I don't have a WSJ subscription)

As we all expected, if you're fully vaccinated this pandemic is basically over for you.  You're about four times more likely to die from choking on food than you are to contract covid.  Your chances of dying from covid are essentially zero.

 

 

 

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7 minutes ago, IvanKaramazov said:

Excellent news on the vaccine front.  5800 breakthrough cases among 66 million people vaccinated.  About 1 in 11,000 give or take. 

Would love severity numbers (even if self-reported) and hospitalizations on this 5800. Collins writes that "most of the cases have been mild" and one Tweet down writes that "74 out of 66 million" have died (of COVID? and for sure 14 days after completing their vaccination course? - db).

I am assuming all those more specific figures also came from the WSJ article? Can't read the full article myself without a subscription -- but I should be able to find another article elsewhere reporting on the CDC's just-released numbers.

Completely agreed about all this being excellent news.

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27 minutes ago, IvanKaramazov said:

Excellent news on the vaccine front.  5800 breakthrough cases among 66 million people vaccinated.  About 1 in 11,000 give or take.  

https://twitter.com/elizacollins1/status/1382685621861416970 (linking to Twitter because I don't have a WSJ subscription)

As we all expected, if you're fully vaccinated this pandemic is basically over for you.  You're about four times more likely to die from choking on food than you are to contract covid.  Your chances of dying from covid are essentially zero.

While this may be true, changing your lifestyle so that you're doing all sorts of indoor dining, bar hopping, etc. puts the staff and others that aren't vaccinated at risk of exposure.  There are still lots of people that haven't gotten any shots yet and want them. 

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38 minutes ago, Doug B said:
55 minutes ago, IvanKaramazov said:

Excellent news on the vaccine front.  5800 breakthrough cases among 66 million people vaccinated.  About 1 in 11,000 give or take. 

Would love severity numbers (even if self-reported) and hospitalizations on this 5800. Collins writes that "most of the cases have been mild" and one Tweet down writes that "74 out of 66 million" have died (of COVID? and for sure 14 days after completing their vaccination course? - db).

I am assuming all those more specific figures also came from the WSJ article? Can't read the full article myself without a subscription -- but I should be able to find another article elsewhere reporting on the CDC's just-released numbers.

Completely agreed about all this being excellent news.

OK, found some further info elsewhere:

- Number of hospitalizations: 396 out of 5800 (so ~93% of the breakthrough COVID cases don't need hospitalization) according to CNN.

- Were the 5800 breakthroughs fourteen days past completing their vaccination course? Yes, according to the WSJ link in the Tweet Ivan posted.

...

EDIT: More specifics in the CNN link:

- Per the CDC: "a little over 40% of the [breakthrough] infections were in people 60 or more years of age"

- 65% of the breakthrough cases are female.

- 29% of the breakthrough cases are asymptomatic.
 

Quote

"CDC is monitoring reported cases for clustering by patient demographics, geographic location, time since vaccination, vaccine type or lot number, and SARS-CoV-2 lineage," the CDC said.

Plus, samples from cases will be tested to see how many are caused by variants and if so, which ones.

 

Edited by Doug B
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9 minutes ago, The Z Machine said:

While this may be true, changing your lifestyle so that you're doing all sorts of indoor dining, bar hopping, etc. puts the staff and others that aren't vaccinated at risk of exposure.  There are still lots of people that haven't gotten any shots yet and want them. 

To me, "the pandemic being over" has a lot more to do with what wider society can do safely than with what I, personally, can do safely.

That said, there will be a tipping point. I think American society-at-large will eventually accept somewhat heightened risk of "dying through 'regular' illness", and that 'regular illness' will come to include COVID as it now includes influenza, strep, Legionnaires, meningitis, mononucleosis, etc.

Going by cold, hard numbers ... it's going to be a long while (IMHO) before going out and about is exactly as safe as it was in 2019. However, that only means that an astronomically-slight risk of 'severe illness/death from community illness' is only marginally less slight. Fiddling with small numbers, as it were -- one American's personal background risk of "death by communicable illness in a given year" in 2019 might have been 1 in 1.5 million (fake number), and in 2023 it might still be 1 in 1.35 million thanks to the lingering relics of COVID.

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4 hours ago, Doug B said:

Would love severity numbers (even if self-reported) and hospitalizations on this 5800. Collins writes that "most of the cases have been mild" and one Tweet down writes that "74 out of 66 million" have died (of COVID? and for sure 14 days after completing their vaccination course? - db).

I am assuming all those more specific figures also came from the WSJ article? Can't read the full article myself without a subscription -- but I should be able to find another article elsewhere reporting on the CDC's just-released numbers.

Completely agreed about all this being excellent news.

Somewhere in that same twitter thread, there was a link stating that evidence in Spain shows the vaccines 90%+ effective against transmission as well.  Get the shot and go do shots (2 weeks later).

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4 hours ago, Doug B said:

To me, "the pandemic being over" has a lot more to do with what wider society can do safely than with what I, personally, can do safely.

That said, there will be a tipping point. I think American society-at-large will eventually accept somewhat heightened risk of "dying through 'regular' illness", and that 'regular illness' will come to include COVID as it now includes influenza, strep, Legionnaires, meningitis, mononucleosis, etc.

Going by cold, hard numbers ... it's going to be a long while (IMHO) before going out and about is exactly as safe as it was in 2019. However, that only means that an astronomically-slight risk of 'severe illness/death from community illness' is only marginally less slight. Fiddling with small numbers, as it were -- one American's personal background risk of "death by communicable illness in a given year" in 2019 might have been 1 in 1.5 million (fake number), and in 2023 it might still be 1 in 1.35 million thanks to the lingering relics of COVID.

Yea, I am not ready to dine indoors or attend any type of in-person conference just yet.  Next year?  Maybe?

I think I will be comfortable with air and train and mass transit this summer, with masks. Not sure when the mask should come off.

I am thinking of attending an MLB game this June, but I guess my unvaccinated kids would need masks?

I did get a haircut and a massage last week and went to the dermatologist on Monday.  Dentist next week and have outdoor dining reservations coming up. So slowly integrating things.  Debating on the gym.

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17 minutes ago, Leeroy Jenkins said:

I am thinking of attending an MLB game this June, but I guess my unvaccinated kids would need masks?

Assuming you mean an outdoor stadium, no roof:

Wider American society doesn't seem quite ready for this ... but within a year or two or three, it's going to be publicized that outdoor COVID spread, even without masks, really doesn't happen. Maybe in a VERY dense crowd -- not a stadium, but in a literal shoulder-to-shoulder "Ow! I'm getting squeezed!" kind of crowd.

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6 minutes ago, Doug B said:

Assuming you mean an outdoor stadium, no roof:

Wider American society doesn't seem quite ready for this ... but within a year or two or three, it's going to be publicized that outdoor COVID spread, even without masks, really doesn't happen. Maybe in a VERY dense crowd -- not a stadium, but in a literal shoulder-to-shoulder "Ow! I'm getting squeezed!" kind of crowd.

Yes, Phillies.  After Fauci caught all that heat saying not to eat indoors, he was on CNN saying he would attend a Washington Nationals game without hesitation, though he would wear a mask due to his interactions with the public. 

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After 4 calls, finally got appointments for my 16 and 18yo for next week. Apparently you can only get Pfizer in the hospitals or health units around here right now. Pharmacies have Moderna only. 

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6 hours ago, IvanKaramazov said:

Excellent news on the vaccine front.  5800 breakthrough cases among 66 million people vaccinated.  About 1 in 11,000 give or take.  

https://twitter.com/elizacollins1/status/1382685621861416970 (linking to Twitter because I don't have a WSJ subscription)

As we all expected, if you're fully vaccinated this pandemic is basically over for you.  You're about four times more likely to die from choking on food than you are to contract covid.  Your chances of dying from covid are essentially zero.

 

 

 

That's it, I'm done eating food

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59 minutes ago, Leeroy Jenkins said:

Yea, I am not ready to dine indoors or attend any type of in-person conference just yet.  Next year?  Maybe?

I think I will be comfortable with air and train and mass transit this summer, with masks. Not sure when the mask should come off.

I am thinking of attending an MLB game this June, but I guess my unvaccinated kids would need masks?

I did get a haircut and a massage last week and went to the dermatologist on Monday.  Dentist next week and have outdoor dining reservations coming up. So slowly integrating things.  Debating on the gym.

I'm not trying to pick on you, but your list of things you will and won't do seems kind of random.

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Also, Pfizer CEO announced that a third booster (and one annually) will likely be needed after a year. Not shocked at that, I think it's what they were thinking all along. 

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33 minutes ago, Nathan R. Jessep said:

After 4 calls, finally got appointments for my 16 and 18yo for next week. Apparently you can only get Pfizer in the hospitals or health units around here right now. Pharmacies have Moderna only. 

Might just be coincidence ... but since we're in the same state: the same thing seems true in the New Orleans area, too.

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20 minutes ago, Nathan R. Jessep said:

Also, Pfizer CEO announced that a third booster (and one annually) will likely be needed after a year. Not shocked at that, I think it's what they were thinking all along. 

Fine with me since I get annual check-ups anyway, but this is going to be a problem.  I don't see most people getting boosters once we get past the first round of vaccination.  Hopefully folks keep plugging away on vaccine research and can come up with something longer-lasting.

(Then again, this is Pfizer which we all know is kind of a low class vaccine anyway.  #teammoderna)

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1 hour ago, IvanKaramazov said:

Fine with me since I get annual check-ups anyway, but this is going to be a problem.  I don't see most people getting boosters once we get past the first round of vaccination.  Hopefully folks keep plugging away on vaccine research and can come up with something longer-lasting.

(Then again, this is Pfizer which we all know is kind of a low class vaccine anyway.  #teammoderna)

get that Moderna trash outta here! :lol: 

But, yeah, I'm guessing they must've seen some kind of data to make that statement, but not going to get to excited over it either way until we see some corroborating data. And besides that, since they are so similar, I'll bet Moderna will be following suit on the booster. 

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1 hour ago, Doug B said:

Might just be coincidence ... but since we're in the same state: the same thing seems true in the New Orleans area, too.

I got mine (Pfizer) via Walgreens a couple months ago. Suspiciously enough, they aren't even listed on the LDH website any more, so there must have been a falling out. Political I'm sure. :rolleyes:   And I guess the hospitals/clinics that do other vaccines (aside from Walgreens) must be the only places that have the cold storage facilities for Pfizer. Just my guess. 

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4 minutes ago, Nathan R. Jessep said:

I got mine (Pfizer) via Walgreens a couple months ago. Suspiciously enough, they aren't even listed on the LDH website any more, so there must have been a falling out. Political I'm sure. :rolleyes:   And I guess the hospitals/clinics that do other vaccines (aside from Walgreens) must be the only places that have the cold storage facilities for Pfizer. Just my guess. 

Our local Winn Dixie grocery (one with a pharmacy) has never been on the LDH website, yet they've been giving out no-appointment walk-up COVID vaccinations for a few weeks now.

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1 minute ago, Doug B said:

Our local Winn Dixie grocery (one with a pharmacy) has never been on the LDH website, yet they've been giving out no-appointment walk-up COVID vaccinations for a few weeks now.

Interesting. Then maybe I should've called Walgreens. Ah well, appointments made. 

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4 hours ago, Nathan R. Jessep said:

After 4 calls, finally got appointments for my 16 and 18yo for next week. Apparently you can only get Pfizer in the hospitals or health units around here right now. Pharmacies have Moderna only. 

I didn't think anyone 18 or under was getting a shot yet 

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