You gave them a free pass for being young. Some of these people believe that god has chosen who will get corona, who will live, who will die, and the most important thing is they pay him respect so they make it to heaven and avoid hell. You can believe they're wrong, they don't. And it isn't your right to tell them what to believe. And it's ridiculous to think their beliefs deserve far more criticism than beach goers, regardless of their age.
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*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread. Fresh epidemic fears as child pneumonia cases surge in Europe after China outbreak. NOW in USA (16 Viewers)
- Thread starter Big League Chew
- Start date
Koya
Footballguy
Yeah, this could get ugly. As I've said all along, while I can sympathize with these kids, and while I acknowledge they are young and stupid to a degree by nature (as we were as a generation, mind you), it's a ticking time bomb as they go back to their home communities. Many that have not yet been ravaged by COVID, and it only takes a few to light that fuse.
Really really dangerous. And also a lesson for any idiots - of any age, for whatever reason - who wish to gather in large groups, risking not just their health (hell, that's their right if they don't expect others to pay for their care), but the health of others (NOT their right. Ever).
parasaurolophus
Footballguy
I agree they are far more irresponsible. Kids on the beach are lower risk than old obese people.
Doug B
Footballguy
It's not hard to grocery-shop safely if not overly crowded ... you mainly need something handy to sanitize your hands with as you go.
However, if you go to a grocery store and it's wall-to-wall people ... go another time or to another store.
...
Just a side point for the house:
Sometimes in meatspace and a few times online ... I've run into the argument "If it's fine to grocery shop, it should be fine to do X!" Where that seemingly reasonable argument falls apart is that having food is a true necessity, so taking a risk to get food is worth it especially if precautions are taken. On the other hand, most of the other things people want to keep doing and want to keep justifying are not "true necessities" so any comparison to food/medicine shopping falls flat.
⚡DEADHEAD⚡
Footballguy
fatguyinalittlecoat
Footballguy
Agreed. If the government wants us all to stay at home and sit on the couch watching TV, it should be sending free weed to every resident.
Koya
Footballguy
Dude, stop putting words in my mouth. I never gave anyone a free pass. Full stop. Kindly stop propogating that lie.
Second, some people believe that god has chosen who is worthy of sacrifice. You can believe they're wrong. They don't. And it isn't your right to tell them what to believe.
Some people believe that god has deemed it ok and even in gods name and spirit to groom children to become child wives, or worse. You can believe they're wrong. They don't. And it isn't your right to tell them what to believe.
And if you think these extreme examples don't make a point, it's simply a sliding scale. The reality is, everyone's rights - including that of freedom to believe and freedom of religion - do not trump the rights of others. You can not overtake someone's house and say that the Lord deemed this to be his church, so their right to congregate overtakes your right to private property you own.
And you can not look to purposefully increase the risk of everyone around you to be exposed to a potentially deadly, and 100% known to be harmful, disease.
FINALLY, I'm not telling them what to believe. I'm stating their right to CONGREGATE does not overtake the right of others to, well NOT BE EXPOSED TO THE RISK OF DYING.
Let them believe. In a manner that doesnt infringe upon others' rights to life, liberty, pursuit of happiness. And not being exposed to a deadly disease certainly seems to fall under right to life. No?
Again, these are selfish, dangerous people if they feel their right to be in a church is more important than the rights of others to not be exposed to potential deadly disease.
Koya
Footballguy
That's not my rationale. I'm not worried about the idiot kids. 1. as you mention, they are not an at-risk group 2. if they themselves get sick, it was due to choices they made.
What IS the irresponsible part for the kids is how many illnesses and deaths OF OTHERS will be a result of those choices. So while I understand why they did it and recognize they are young kids, it's still terribly irresponsible.
Koya
Footballguy
Question, understanding that this is sensitive and hits home... isn't PT essential for many? Those recovering from injury, or dealing with potentially life altering outcomes and lack of movement, strength, quality of life?My son is a Physical Therapist and he's still being asked to work. Boss says PT has been deemed an essential service. Pisses me off. He sees dozens of potentially infected patients a day and then brings it home
Not trying to be harsh or cold, but is that not part of the risk one takes when they decide to become a medical professional of some sort? Hope you don't mind me asking, I recognize it is a very difficult situation for him, and for you.
Going to the beach is far more unnecessary. There is literally nothing essential about going to the beach.
strykerpks
Footballguy
Osaurus
Footballguy
Koya
Footballguy
strykerpks
Footballguy
Haven't been there in years but will try to get one for you when they re-open.
Joking aside, all bars have been closed for over a week. THEY CLOSED THE BARS IN WISCONSIN FOR ####S SAKE!! God help us all
Keerock
Footballguy
Yes... I suppose for some it is. I have asked if much of what he provides his patients is "medically necessary" and his response is always "some of it". I try to get a feeling for how much of it could be done at home, with or without some sort of virtual coaching and he thinks much of it could.Question, understanding that this is sensitive and hits home... isn't PT essential for many? Those recovering from injury, or dealing with potentially life altering outcomes and lack of movement, strength, quality of life?My son is a Physical Therapist and he's still being asked to work. Boss says PT has been deemed an essential service. Pisses me off. He sees dozens of potentially infected patients a day and then brings it home
Not trying to be harsh or cold, but is that not part of the risk one takes when they decide to become a medical professional of some sort? Hope you don't mind me asking, I recognize it is a very difficult situation for him, and for you.
Doug B
Footballguy
Why would it? People who are taking precautions can leave home and generally work safely (if not completely without risk).
EDIT: And the essential employees' workplaces shouldn't be exactly the same as before. Still have to be serious and stick to social distancing. Still have to bend over backwards to avoid any sardine-can scenarios (don't get onto elevators with more than one other person, no standing-room-only conferences, everything via chat, text, or e-mail instead of office visits, etc.). Even if you are an essential employee and have to go to work ... your world should still be impacted in a way that minimizes your risk.
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urbanhack
Fight The Power!
THANKS FACEBOOK.
Facebook has 45,000 employees and they amassed an emergency reserve of 720,000 masks?
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-facebook-masks-idUSKBN21911E?
Facebook has 45,000 employees and they amassed an emergency reserve of 720,000 masks?
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-facebook-masks-idUSKBN21911E?
Koya
Footballguy
Appreciate the thought out answer. To that end, I'd agree that there should be all efforts made to provide care only to those who need it most. If someone has something that is "optional" or "elective" then they can choose to find a PT that is willing to come to their home, where there is less risk of group gatherings that lead to more mass exposure.
From that perspective, it sounds like they will simply use the overarching definition of "essential" for bottom line's sake, not the health and wellness of all involved (including patients).
People suck. Best of thoughts for your son, you, and the fam.
The Tahitian Facemask
Footballguy
Is there a thread dedicated to documenting the experiences of those who have tested positive? Actual symptoms, where/when/how infected (if known), timeline, medications - helpful vs not as helpful, etc. Less for news, more for how to deal with it if it actually happens to you.
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
There’s a meme going around with our governors picture on an “I closed Wolskis” number sticker.
Dan Lambskin
Footballguy
Flying Elvis
Footballguy
Maryland Gov. Larry Hogan announced Monday he was ordering closed all non-essential businesses in the state, including retail stores that had been allowed to remain open.
https://www.baltimoresun.com/coronavirus/bs-md-pol-hogan-nonessential-businesses-20200323-mb5ltcvsjvbu3ihp236por2xvq-story.html
https://www.baltimoresun.com/coronavirus/bs-md-pol-hogan-nonessential-businesses-20200323-mb5ltcvsjvbu3ihp236por2xvq-story.html
Tom Skerritt
Footballguy
Picked up some adult undergarments, fish oil supplements and other essential items for a senior, heart-transplant recipient, neighbor friend of mine. Dropped the items off outside, honked the horn and left. Social distancing.
Doug B
Footballguy
For better or worse ... the "take-out order!" loophole is going to have to be closed. Not enough places are going to do it right. It can be done pretty safely, but frankly requires some uncommon sense and counterintuitive behaviors to pull off.Restaurants still open for takeout orders, leading to a bunch of people hanging out together waiting for their orders.
Keerock
Footballguy
Galileo
Footballguy
Not sure so sure about this...health care workers especially. I haven't been in a grocery store for over a week, but are those employees wearing PPE? They are routinely being exposed to people and the things they touch.
Koya
Footballguy
I know we are trying to avoid "hearsay" comments, but a friend of mine is a Doctor in NY, within the hospital systems (forget which). He posted on facebook some info on how one might know they are infected, early signs... should I share?
It's not "sourced" other than Koya's Doctor friend.
It's not "sourced" other than Koya's Doctor friend.
nirad3
Footballguy
At what point do people stop listening to him, and instead rely on the Surgeon General, CDC, WHO, etc.....?
I personally haven't taken one thing he's said to be true. Completely ignoring him.
Politician Spock
Footballguy
The unintended consequence of shutting down restaurant takeout is the grocery stores will he burdened to supply more food to the public than they are designed to, making the crowds at grocery stores even bigger.
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Koya
Footballguy
I'm seeing this work pretty well here in Dallas. Many if not most places are doing curbside pickup, with little to know interaction and contact at all. Another I know if placing paper bags on the counter so people can come in, pick it up, no interaction at all.
nirad3
Footballguy
nirad3
Footballguy
parasaurolophus
Footballguy
It is irresponsible. Sure. But they are less likely to catch and less likely to spread. So if comparing the two choices to me it is easy. And none of that even brings into play what you were saying about being young and that young people do dumb things.
Galileo
Footballguy
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
It's been interesting on social media to observe who is able to drop partisan politics for a moment and who isn't. I'm with you -- I've basically been tuning out the president and trying to listen to others. But there are lots of folks out there still in full-blown partisan combat mode. I point that out not to inject politics into the thread because I'm not going to blame or name anybody in particular, just to point out that it does not bode well.
skol asylum
Footballguy
It's going to take the bodies piling up. Even then you'll have the give me liberty group.
shader
Footballguy
Galileo
Footballguy
I ordered take out this past Friday. Ordered at 5 pm. Was told to pick up at 5:45 pm. I show up at 5:45 and there are 14, mostly older gentlemen, hanging around the counter BS'ing with each other in close proximity. I stood across the room by myself wearing gloves and a mask. A few curious looks were thrown my way. At one point another guy walked in and one of those hanging around the counter went up to him and gave him big hug and they continued to chat. Slowly orders were coming out and some people would leave, but others were coming in to replace them. Money was changing hands...credit carts...pens to sign... (I brought my own pen). I ended up having to wait a half hour for my food. This was not a model of how to do take out. I would love to support the local businesses, but that will be the last take out I order for quite some time.
Doug B
Footballguy
Seems to be no one-size-fits-all answer here. I can tell you that a close relative is a mostly-bedridden stroke patient, and they had their on-site physical therapy sessions cancelled for the duration early last week. This relative is supposed to continue doing "homework" PT with their live-in caregiver (spouse in this case) for however long is necessary. Patient and spouse are on the cusp of the COVID "danger zone" due to age and some comorbidities.
JbizzleMan
Footballguy
Elon Musk: LOOK! LOOK AT ME! I AM TRYING TO SAVE THE WORLD! LAX IS PREVENTING IT!
LAX: Dude, you're lying again.
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1241896915416973312?s=20
nirad3
Footballguy
Good question. I would assume other restaurant workers are wearing them. What about workers at Costco and grocery stores.
Heck, maybe everyone should be wearing them right now.
Koya
Footballguy
ooof.
Yeah, the one where I picked up it was my two friends front of the house (both are managers/GMs), and their one cook. All wore gloves. Place was dripping in sanitizer, they wore gloves. We did an across the bar elbow air greeting.
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Flying Elvis
Footballguy
If you can post the FB link it at least gives people a chance to view the source and decide what to do with it. Most of the negative response has been the solo, no-link posts that say "so-and-so says travel papers will be needed" that are 100% hearsay. I personally don't have much issue with any of them, but understand why some dislike those.
Doug B
Footballguy
In the case I'm familiar with ... a patient will do twice as much, or more, for a PT than for a family member, esp a spouse. It's really hard for a lot of people to apply "tough love" to a spouse that's undergone a major health emergency. Home PT tends to get "rounded off" for many patients, as many patients will seek to avoid the hard stuff and spouses won't feel comfortable playing drill sergeant. Not all patients are gung-ho motivated to get back to normal ... oftentimes PTs fill in that motivation gap.
Koya
Footballguy
Here is the link (hope that works), and the content is below. He is an Infectious Disease Specialist at NYU Langone.
Since this is my field of expertise, and there is a lot of misinformation out there, I feel I should say a few things. No need for comments, and feel free to share:
1. At this point, if you have viral respiratory symptoms (fever, cough, etc) it is almost certainly coronavirus. Many places aren’t bothering testing anymore, including nyc, as it won’t really change things that much. If you have these symptoms you should self quarantine immediately.
2. Shortness of breath seems to be the big tip off that things may get worse, if you have it. So if you get significant shortness of breath in the setting of upper respiratory symptoms or fever, you should be evaluated urgently. (This doesn’t mean seeing a useless citymd college kid. Likely need to go to ER)
3. Interestingly loss of smell and taste seems to be a somewhat unique characteristic of this, that some are reporting.
4. While I have heard some reports of young people getting severely ill, based on what I am seeing the vast, vast majority are older people. Please protect the older people in your life by keeping away from them. I would rather have them be bored for a few weeks than to get severely ill. They can FaceTime with the grandkids instead of visits. Make sure they have food and supplies but minimize direct contact if possible.
5. You can transmit even if you don’t feel sick yet so please try to maintain the social distancing, at least for now, until we get over the big hurtle of cases that are happening in the coming days.
6. Be aware that most hospitals are barring visitors at this point, to minimize transmission.
7. We will get through this.
