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*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread. Fresh epidemic fears as child pneumonia cases surge in Europe after China outbreak. NOW in USA (20 Viewers)

jvdesigns2002 said:
And?  You don't have to go to a bar to sell anything regardless of what state you are in.  This is why this country is having such a hard time getting passed this thing. People are literally voluntarily exposing themselves to the disease for no reason and then are shocked by the numbers and are complaining about the ramifications created by those numbers.  Are you trying to claim that you couldn't make your sales and do your job without having to go to a bar?
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I’m a supplier,

I see you are a bartender.  Did you work at all during the pandemic?  If so, why?

 
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FairWarning said:
I’m a supplier,
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I'm not familiar with how bars/clubs work. If its required that you go to bars while they are open and packed to make sales--then I understand.  If going inside a crowded bar could be avoided--I think that would be ideal--but maybe thats not possible.  In any case--I wish you good luck and good health. 

 
jvdesigns2002 said:
I'm not familiar with how bars/clubs work. If its required that you go to bars while they are open and packed to make sales--then I understand.  If going inside a crowded bar could be avoided--I think that would be ideal--but maybe thats not possible.  In any case--I wish you good luck and good health. 
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How do you think the beer, wine, liquor gets to the restaurants?  States don’t let you buy it from the store.  I’ve lost 10 accounts in Michigan due to closures.,  On top of that, im a event bartender for destination weddings.  I haven’t done one since February.  I could have paid off my house with the $10 K I lost.

 
FairWarning said:
How do you think the beer, wine, liquor gets to the restaurants?  States don’t let you buy it from the store.  I’ve lost 10 accounts in Michigan due to closures.,  On top of that, im a event bartender for destination weddings.  I haven’t done one since February.  I could have paid off my house with the $10 K I lost.
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I've honestly never been to a bar or a club where the alcohol was being brought into the bar or sold to the bar while I was there.  I assumed that those types of transactions would be done when the bars are closed or during very off peak hours where there are very few clients there. I understand--I manage a jewelry store in California that just went under strict lockdowns again.  I've taken a big hit in my earnings this year.  I understand the finanical pain. With that said-I also do what I can to work as safely as possible.  I encourage my clients to make appointments so that I can manage the number of clients in our store at any time,  If we ever have more than 4 clients--I don't buzz anybody in the shop until a client leaves the shop, vendors are scheduled to come in before hours, strict sterilization protocols.  Its holiday season for jewelers--and I could very easily put finanical gain ahead of safe business practices--but I won't do that.  We're lucky enough to be doing steady enough to survive and thats good enough for me this year.  I completely understand your frustration--and i do have to tell you--that i do think you should prep yourself for a flood of wedding gigs next year.  Working in jewelry--I know a TON of people that have postponed their weddings until next year.  Good luck. 

 
culdeus said:
Tbh I sort of thought we'd have higher case and hospital loads as of today given how few ####s were given over Thanksgiving.  Winning?
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This would be the week I would expect to start seeing the numbers rise from the holiday. We are only at the ten day point currently.

 
DallasDMac said:
This would be the week I would expect to start seeing the numbers rise from the holiday. We are only at the ten day point currently.
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If the median incubation time is 5 days, positive test increases from Thanksgiving should already be rolling in. They are in Oregon. 

 
DallasDMac said:
This would be the week I would expect to start seeing the numbers rise from the holiday. We are only at the ten day point currently.
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We should have seen significant growth by now. Median onset of symptoms is 5ish days.

Starting to wonder if even though people traveled, did a higher % of them take a lot of precautions leading up to it? 

I remember the Mass. governor pointing out the sunday before was a record number of tests. Perhaps other places were like that too and maybe lots of presymptomatic cases got identified before they normally would have combined with people being smarter leading up to seeing their families.

 
jvdesigns2002 said:
I've honestly never been to a bar or a club where the alcohol was being brought into the bar or sold to the bar while I was there.  I assumed that those types of transactions would be done when the bars are closed or during very off peak hours where there are very few clients there. I understand--I manage a jewelry store in California that just went under strict lockdowns again.  I've taken a big hit in my earnings this year.  I understand the finanical pain. With that said-I also do what I can to work as safely as possible.  I encourage my clients to make appointments so that I can manage the number of clients in our store at any time,  If we ever have more than 4 clients--I don't buzz anybody in the shop until a client leaves the shop, vendors are scheduled to come in before hours, strict sterilization protocols.  Its holiday season for jewelers--and I could very easily put finanical gain ahead of safe business practices--but I won't do that.  We're lucky enough to be doing steady enough to survive and thats good enough for me this year.  I completely understand your frustration--and i do have to tell you--that i do think you should prep yourself for a flood of wedding gigs next year.  Working in jewelry--I know a TON of people that have postponed their weddings until next year.  Good luck. 
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It depends on th restrictions.  Michigan was allowing 50-100 people all summer while Indiana was allowing 250.  We lost a lot of local business.  Now if there are the restrictions (face mask, gloves, etc), I'm sitting it out again.  I can't make money that way, nor will expose myself to everyones germs.  

 
DallasDMac said:
This would be the week I would expect to start seeing the numbers rise from the holiday. We are only at the ten day point currently.
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The smell/taste thing starts at day4 and if it's going to happen is apparent at day7.  We are well beyond that.  

I mean anecdotally I'm starting to hear of "entire families" in facebook and whatever saying the whole family is now +, and already got grandma being fitted for a body bag.  My favorite being more or less, little timmy had it and we thought he was over it so we went on.  

 
Scoresman said:
If the median incubation time is 5 days, positive test increases from Thanksgiving should already be rolling in. They are in Oregon. 
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My co-worker started feeling symptoms on Thanksgiving day. Took him 8 days to get a test (had to have an appt since he was symptomatic). On the phone they told him 2-3 days for results. When he got there, they said more like 5-7. He’s still sick. He still hasn’t been confirmed positive. I’d imagine many of the people who were actually infected on Thanksgiving are not yet being counted. 

 
Capella said:
My sister says she has no fear and isn’t wearing a mask because god decided when we all die so this is all his plan. It’s so creepy hearing stuff like that. It’s like she’s from another planet. 
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You should tell her the story about the guy drowning and all the boats coming by to save him....that should get her thinking GB  :thumbup:  

 
E-Z Glider said:
My co-worker started feeling symptoms on Thanksgiving day. Took him 8 days to get a test (had to have an appt since he was symptomatic). On the phone they told him 2-3 days for results. When he got there, they said more like 5-7. He’s still sick. He still hasn’t been confirmed positive. I’d imagine many of the people who were actually infected on Thanksgiving are not yet being counted. 
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It makes me jumping-up-and-down mad that we still can't get testing right.  I know it's not like this everywhere, but goodness gracious there's no excuse for testing being this slow.

 
E-Z Glider said:
My co-worker started feeling symptoms on Thanksgiving day. Took him 8 days to get a test (had to have an appt since he was symptomatic). On the phone they told him 2-3 days for results. When he got there, they said more like 5-7. He’s still sick. He still hasn’t been confirmed positive. I’d imagine many of the people who were actually infected on Thanksgiving are not yet being counted. 
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What state? 

 
IvanKaramazov said:
It makes me jumping-up-and-down mad that we still can't get testing right.  I know it's not like this everywhere, but goodness gracious there's no excuse for testing being this slow.
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Yeah - his co-workers experience was what happened to me when I got tested months ago (negative) but a close friend just got diagnosed as positive and it took 1 day.  Between lag and people just not caring I have no confidence in our ability to keeps the numbers down via contract tracing.  It was probably always a pipe dream for us - we just need the vaccine pronto.

 
We celebrated Thanksgiving with my wife's side of the family. 11 people total. No elderly except my FIL who already had it. A few days later my brother-in-law's fiancee started feeling unwell and tested positive. So we all got tested. Nobody else had symptoms. My wife got tested last Tuesday and I got tested Wednesday. We made sure to stay home until we got results but didnt change anything else. Thursday morning, my wife got her results, she was POSITIVE. Her only symptom is fatigue. She had 100 degree fever one day briefly. It has now been 7 days since her positive test and still no symptoms. Everything Ive read seems to say she is basically in the clear at this point. DOH said she can leave quarantine on Friday. She was high risk due to high blood pressure so very happy she basically had an asymptomatic case.

Meanwhile for me, I had a sudden allergy attack on Thursday before I got my results. Figured that was the start. My head was stuffy and lasted all day until I went to sleep. Woke up the next morning feeling 100% fine so didnt know what to think. Finally got my results Friday evening and they were NEGATIVE (FYI everyone else at Thanksgiving was also negative). Unfortunately, I was still sleeping in bed with my wife until she got her positive results. Since then weve slept in separate beds and she wears a mask when shes in the living room (we thought completely isolating at that point made little sense since weve been close contacts for days before her results came). Anyway, its been 7 days since her positive result and so far both my son and myself feel 100% fine. When are WE in the clear? Sort of weird everyday waiting for the other shoe to drop but it hasnt happened yet. 

 
IvanKaramazov said:
It makes me jumping-up-and-down mad that we still can't get testing right.  I know it's not like this everywhere, but goodness gracious there's no excuse for testing being this slow.
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Want to know what's worse?  Yes...there's worse.  That would be a state that did a wonderful job early to get testing where it needed to be spending millions to do so, then, basically do nothing for contact tracing....oh and then opening the state completely regardless of what the testing is telling them.  

 
I remember several discussions about proning in here a while back.  My wife was talking to another mom on my daughters cheer team who is an ER nurse.  She highly advised sleeping on your stomach if you get it.  Is that solid advice?  

 
AAABatteries said:
I remember several discussions about proning in here a while back.  My wife was talking to another mom on my daughters cheer team who is an ER nurse.  She highly advised sleeping on your stomach if you get it.  Is that solid advice?  
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I mean that is good advice for most respiratory congestion issues as your coughing will become more productive. The proning for cv seems to be a part of the O2 protocol though.  No idea how it would work without supplemental O2 but can't hurt.  

 
In looking at all the various States and countries around the world, it's interesting that nearly all have similar peaks in cases. Rarely are there plateaus that last for a period of time, almost always defined peaks. Obviously, added precautions can have a big effect but is that just a feature of virus' in general, that they explode and drop only to come back again for another round? You would think there would be some locations that plateau for a period of weeks or so but I don't see it.

 
jobarules said:
We celebrated Thanksgiving with my wife's side of the family. 11 people total. No elderly except my FIL who already had it. A few days later my brother-in-law's fiancee started feeling unwell and tested positive. So we all got tested. Nobody else had symptoms. My wife got tested last Tuesday and I got tested Wednesday. We made sure to stay home until we got results but didnt change anything else. Thursday morning, my wife got her results, she was POSITIVE. Her only symptom is fatigue. She had 100 degree fever one day briefly. It has now been 7 days since her positive test and still no symptoms. Everything Ive read seems to say she is basically in the clear at this point. DOH said she can leave quarantine on Friday. She was high risk due to high blood pressure so very happy she basically had an asymptomatic case.

Meanwhile for me, I had a sudden allergy attack on Thursday before I got my results. Figured that was the start. My head was stuffy and lasted all day until I went to sleep. Woke up the next morning feeling 100% fine so didnt know what to think. Finally got my results Friday evening and they were NEGATIVE (FYI everyone else at Thanksgiving was also negative). Unfortunately, I was still sleeping in bed with my wife until she got her positive results. Since then weve slept in separate beds and she wears a mask when shes in the living room (we thought completely isolating at that point made little sense since weve been close contacts for days before her results came). Anyway, its been 7 days since her positive result and so far both my son and myself feel 100% fine. When are WE in the clear? Sort of weird everyday waiting for the other shoe to drop but it hasnt happened yet. 
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Unfortunately you are not in the clear yet. You have to assume you could get it every day she was in her quarantine period. You should be isolating for 10 days after that date.

 
The Commish said:
You should tell her the story about the guy drowning and all the boats coming by to save him....that should get her thinking GB  :thumbup:  
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Yeahhhhh I think my mom has. The whole thing about you get to heaven and god says what were you doing, I sent you all the tools you needed. I truly think she’s too far gone and I just don’t really have the patience. 

 
jobarules said:
we thought completely isolating at that point made little sense since weve been close contacts for days before her results came
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I understand the mindset and I even understand the people that would rather just get it once the family was infected too. 

I just want to point out that we do not know for sure the exact time frame people are infectious. There have been studies that show the viral load in I believe saliva and the nose at various times, but that does not translate to anything concrete and in fact it might be completely worthless data if this is spread via airborne with deep lung inhalation required. 

There is a solid argument to be made that the period of being infectious is actually incredibly small and unpredictable. 

So just because you had close contact with a positive case for time frame A, doesnt mean that there is no benefit to eliminating time frame b,c, and d. 

Not criticizing you or your actions. We have planned how we would handle it in our house, but I would be lying if I said I dont have the possibility of throwing that plan out the window and start communicating with my wife exclusively via 2 inch face to face conditions if she was positive. 

 
jobarules said:
We celebrated Thanksgiving with my wife's side of the family. 11 people total. 
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Not trying to pick on you directly and sorry to hear about the positive tests, but this is EXACTLY why we can't get this under control.  For everyone that assumes it won't happen to them and it's ok to gather just this one time, that's all it takes and it just perpuates the continued spread. All for something that could have been avoided. 

 
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gianmarco said:
Not trying to pick on you directly and sorry to hear about the positive tests, but this is EXACTLY why we can't get this under control.  For everyone that assumes it won't happen to them and it's ok to gather just this one time, that's all it takes and it just perpuates the continued spread. All for something that could have been avoided. 
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We didnt assume that. Knew there was a risk and was willing to take it.

 
Drunken Cowboy said:
Unfortunately you are not in the clear yet. You have to assume you could get it every day she was in her quarantine period. You should be isolating for 10 days after that date.
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Wife just told me DOH is sending both her and me self swab test kits so I'll test myself at end of quarantine period (Friday) and see if I am clear.

 
Capella said:
Yeahhhhh I think my mom has. The whole thing about you get to heaven and god says what were you doing, I sent you all the tools you needed. I truly think she’s too far gone and I just don’t really have the patience. 
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I'm with you GB.  It's frustrating and sometimes it's just best not to even deal with it unfortunately.

 
In California here and the numbers are really going up.  Also--I personally know several people that did Thanksgiving with their families that have come back home and have gotten sick but are not bothering getting tested--they are just isolating at home.   Three of the people I know almost certainly have Covid because of the loss of taste/smell thing--but they are just riding it out at home (its a couple with their one teenage child).    I know five other people who are sick but not confirmed to be covid (but we are thinking that it is).  Fever, fatigue, chest pressure, cough--but they still have their senses of smell and taste.  These five people are spread across two households and they are also choosing to isolate.  They are assuming they have Covid but are not going to sign up to take a test to confirm unless they need to be hospitalized while sick.  They do plan on taking the anti-body test in a week or two once they recover and most likely get passed the recommended quarantine period.   Basically--my guess is this-- a lot of people are sick but unless they feel like they are in danger of needing to be hospitalized--they are just battling it at home. There are also probably lots of people that are asymptomatic out there--so I'd very much recommend that everybody be more diligent than normal when it comes to masking and distancing. 

 
E-Z Glider said:
My co-worker started feeling symptoms on Thanksgiving day. Took him 8 days to get a test (had to have an appt since he was symptomatic). On the phone they told him 2-3 days for results. When he got there, they said more like 5-7. He’s still sick. He still hasn’t been confirmed positive. I’d imagine many of the people who were actually infected on Thanksgiving are not yet being counted. 
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I was listening to a podcast yesterday and one of the personalities started showing symptoms on Thanksgiving day.  He told his boss who instructed him to get tested Tuesday and he couldn't come back in studio unless it came back negative.  He went to a place to get tested, he didn't say where, and the nurse chewed him out because "you don't have a fever, you're fine.  Why are you wasting your money.  This is ridiculous".   He told her several times why he was getting tested and she reluctantly checked him in.   Said the doctor was much more friendly and professional but that's a crazy story.  FWIW, this guy doesn't make his politics known but he seems to lean right.

 
LA times

A growing number of experts say there’s a better way to advise people— harm reduction. Usually used to describe sex-education programs, harm reduction aims to lessen the risks of dangerous behaviors instead of trying to get people to stop altogether.

You dont say...

 
parasaurolophus said:
This

Is where i got them. 3 transactions with no issues. My sisters have bought a couple times too. Ebay reviews almost all solid too so i dont think my experience is just anecdotal
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how long do they take to arrive?  im moving soon which is why i ask.

 
E-Z Glider said:
My co-worker started feeling symptoms on Thanksgiving day. Took him 8 days to get a test (had to have an appt since he was symptomatic). On the phone they told him 2-3 days for results. When he got there, they said more like 5-7. He’s still sick. He still hasn’t been confirmed positive. I’d imagine many of the people who were actually infected on Thanksgiving are not yet being counted. 
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Crazy.  Both times I've been tested here in Oregon, I just went to the drive through testing site with no appointment and got results 1-2 days after.  

 
E-Z Glider said:
My co-worker started feeling symptoms on Thanksgiving day. Took him 8 days to get a test (had to have an appt since he was symptomatic). On the phone they told him 2-3 days for results. When he got there, they said more like 5-7. He’s still sick. He still hasn’t been confirmed positive. I’d imagine many of the people who were actually infected on Thanksgiving are not yet being counted. 
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definitely not.  Even if they could get a test, its likely to be negative until you have symptoms.  So i think the uptick will start seeing in the next 7-10 days.

 
jvdesigns2002 said:
In California here and the numbers are really going up.  Also--I personally know several people that did Thanksgiving with their families that have come back home and have gotten sick but are not bothering getting tested--they are just isolating at home.   Three of the people I know almost certainly have Covid because of the loss of taste/smell thing--but they are just riding it out at home (its a couple with their one teenage child).    I know five other people who are sick but not confirmed to be covid (but we are thinking that it is).  Fever, fatigue, chest pressure, cough--but they still have their senses of smell and taste.  These five people are spread across two households and they are also choosing to isolate.  They are assuming they have Covid but are not going to sign up to take a test to confirm unless they need to be hospitalized while sick.  They do plan on taking the anti-body test in a week or two once they recover and most likely get passed the recommended quarantine period.   Basically--my guess is this-- a lot of people are sick but unless they feel like they are in danger of needing to be hospitalized--they are just battling it at home. There are also probably lots of people that are asymptomatic out there--so I'd very much recommend that everybody be more diligent than normal when it comes to masking and distancing. 
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We have not done a nearly good enough job to incentivize people to get tested and then isolate.  We are basically forcing people in to difficult decisions - in some cases their livelihoods or mental health - and it's not surprising people choice self-preservation.  On top of that, you have the selfish and the non-believers and it equates to a total mess.

 
I have a contractor coming tomorrow to install indoor shutters on our windows.  I plan to have all windows open and all bathroom fans on sucking the air out for ventilation.  HVAC will be off otherwise.  Everyone will be masked. My wife and I will be on a different level of the home the whole time in a closed room working.   Is there anything else I can do?  This is the highest risk thing we've done since March.  

 
AAABatteries said:
We have not done a nearly good enough job to incentivize people to get tested and then isolate.  We are basically forcing people in to difficult decisions - in some cases their livelihoods or mental health - and it's not surprising people choice self-preservation.  On top of that, you have the selfish and the non-believers and it equates to a total mess.
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What incentives do you have in mind?  I struggle with this as so many people are getting this due to their own actions.  Numerous people, here alone, have admitted to Thanksgiving gatherings with people outside of their households.  People still going to bar, partying with friends, etc...It's their own fault if they get the virus and it no way do I want monetary incentives for them.  You make your bed you sleep in it.  I think we have way too many selfish people/non believers in this country, not sure what incentives would do to offset that. 

 
Scoresman said:
I have a contractor coming tomorrow to install indoor shutters on our windows.  I plan to have all windows open and all bathroom fans on sucking the air out for ventilation.  HVAC will be off otherwise.  Everyone will be masked. My wife and I will be on a different level of the home the whole time in a closed room working.   Is there anything else I can do?  This is the highest risk thing we've done since March.  
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fart fans won't move much air.  do you have the option to turn your hvac fan on without the system being on?  this will pull orders of magnitude more air thru the filter.   I mean if you were really paranoid you could in theory divert the supply registers away from you while leaving your HVAC on thereby keeping you more or less in negative pressure depending on how you manage windows.  

That being said the general guidelines say 2hrs after a worker leaves an indoor area you are ok even if you do nothing but glare sternly at the area where they were.  

 
Pipes said:
What incentives do you have in mind?  I struggle with this as so many people are getting this due to their own actions.  Numerous people, here alone, have admitted to Thanksgiving gatherings with people outside of their households.  People still going to bar, partying with friends, etc...It's their own fault if they get the virus and it no way do I want monetary incentives for them.  You make your bed you sleep in it.  I think we have way too many selfish people/non believers in this country, not sure what incentives would do to offset that. 
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My kid just got black flagged at school, the incentive to get her tested this morning (her 4th time) was do this or we won't see you till January.  That's incentive enough for me.

 
Pipes said:
What incentives do you have in mind?  I struggle with this as so many people are getting this due to their own actions.  Numerous people, here alone, have admitted to Thanksgiving gatherings with people outside of their households.  People still going to bar, partying with friends, etc...It's their own fault if they get the virus and it no way do I want monetary incentives for them.  You make your bed you sleep in it.  I think we have way too many selfish people/non believers in this country, not sure what incentives would do to offset that.
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I had two thoughts in mind with that comment - people who need to be working and have to choose - 1. monetary incentives for small business owners who could remain closed.  2. people put out of work.  I'm not suggesting incentives for people who are stupid and take chances.  Although I'm not sure how we even monitor that unless we start handing out fines for people being in public and not wearing masks or breaking any gathering numbers.  I'm not a fan of doing that though - just have to hope people are smarter.

 
Scoresman said:
Crazy.  Both times I've been tested here in Oregon, I just went to the drive through testing site with no appointment and got results 1-2 days after.  
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Were you symptomatic? Apparently he said none of the drive-up places would take him because he already had symptoms (high fever and cough). Everyone told him he needed an appt and it took several additional days for him to get an appt with his primary.  :shrug:

 
AAABatteries said:
I had two thoughts in mind with that comment - people who need to be working and have to choose - 1. monetary incentives for small business owners who could remain closed.  2. people put out of work.  I'm not suggesting incentives for people who are stupid and take chances.  Although I'm not sure how we even monitor that unless we start handing out fines for people being in public and not wearing masks or breaking any gathering numbers.  I'm not a fan of doing that though - just have to hope people are smarter.
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It's tough that's for sure.  I'd love to see another round of a PPP for businesses but it need to be directed at those business that have suffered losses.  The first round was a free for all mess but let's target businesses in industries that have been hit hard would be a good start. 

 
culdeus said:
fart fans won't move much air.  do you have the option to turn your hvac fan on without the system being on?  this will pull orders of magnitude more air thru the filter.   I mean if you were really paranoid you could in theory divert the supply registers away from you while leaving your HVAC on thereby keeping you more or less in negative pressure depending on how you manage windows.  

That being said the general guidelines say 2hrs after a worker leaves an indoor area you are ok even if you do nothing but glare sternly at the area where they were.  
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Thanks.

I got conflicting info when googling about HVAC and whether having it on spreads the virus or filters it out.  .  I also have 2 Dyson fans I'll have running.  

 
Scoresman said:
I have a contractor coming tomorrow to install indoor shutters on our windows.  I plan to have all windows open and all bathroom fans on sucking the air out for ventilation.  HVAC will be off otherwise.  Everyone will be masked. My wife and I will be on a different level of the home the whole time in a closed room working.   Is there anything else I can do?  This is the highest risk thing we've done since March.  
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Do you have to be there?

 
E-Z Glider said:
Were you symptomatic? Apparently he said none of the drive-up places would take him because he already had symptoms (high fever and cough). Everyone told him he needed an appt and it took several additional days for him to get an appt with his primary.  :shrug:
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No. Both times it was because I was near someone who may have had it.  That was good enough to get a test here.  

 
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