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*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread


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15 minutes ago, BassNBrew said:

Did I read this right?  Your FIL is cucking some married dude and giving his wife the yule-log?

Well he never said how big FIL's log was

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My dad has been sick for a few weeks.  My mom called me today to say he was about to die.  I said some final words to him and he could hear me but was unable to respond.  He passed a short time later.

Not to derail anything, but we had our baby last night! She's doing amazingly well. Due to the hospital's pandemic policies, I had to leave her right after my wife was released from recovery. I can't

On a positive note, my wife gave birth to our first child this morning!! We were expecting our daughter to be born in the first week of April, which does not align very well if this hospital sees a ma

16 minutes ago, Cold Dead Hands said:

We’re on longer allowed to tell people that rabies is 100% fatal once symptoms begin. Apparently, some people have been cured of the rabies virus through an extreme treatment, but they were left in a vagetative State.

Pretty sure a girl in my state recovered and did quite well. It was a discovery channel show. She picked up a bat in church iirc. 

Eta: yep, she has 3 kids now, races sled dogs. Milwaukee protocol is treatment. Google wisconsin girl bit by bat

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19 hours ago, Doug B said:

I think Dez is almost certainly right -- keep in mind that this mutation is not brand-brand-new. It was first identified in September.

The information about this mutation is still indefinite, so it's still reasonable to take one of either an optimistic or a pessimistic perspective. Here's the state-of-play at present from the 12/20 New York Times:

 

Yeah, I mistakenly linked an article up thread talking about the mutation that made the Italian SARS-CoV-2 worse than the original Wuhan flavor. This UK variety appears to be even more contagious, though should still be covered by the vaccine, unless the mutation dramatically altered the spike protein antibody binding site. Usually these sites are highly conserved, and there’s a little flexibility that allows binding if the fit isn’t perfect.

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14 hours ago, themeanmachine said:

A detailed post on the efficacy of various COVID treatments.  Full disclosure, I do not know if this guy is credible or not other than his claim he is "the Executive Director for the COVID-19 Early Treatment Fund (CETF)".

Interesting quote: "If everyone in the world took just the fluvoxamine for 14 days after they learned they were COVID positive, our hospitals and ICUs would be nearly empty today."

 

Interesting, and definitely recommending stuff way off standard of care based on limited, less than ideal data. And that quote is pretty over the top for a single study of ~150 patients. Plus it’s weird he doesn’t mention dexamethasone.

Some of those meds warrant additional investigation, but he’s jumping the gun IMO.

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7 hours ago, Cold Dead Hands said:

We’re on longer allowed to tell people that rabies is 100% fatal once symptoms begin. Apparently, some people have been cured of the rabies virus through an extreme treatment, but they were left in a vagetative State.

I’m pretty cocksure rabies has been survived non-vagetatively.

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The FDA resumed EIND approval of CytoDyn’s leronlimab for severe - critical COVID-19 patients. With the unblinding of their phase 3 trial set to occur in late Jan, this could be a precursor to a broader approval. 

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13 hours ago, jvdesigns2002 said:

Nobody really knows if "covid" is curable.  

Yes we do.  Millions have people have had covid and made full recoveries.  It's as curable as . . . wait for it . . . the flu.

Covid-19 really sucks, and we should take it extremely seriously.  That said, it isn't Captain Tripps and it doesn't do anybody any good to make it out to be worse than it already is.

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12 hours ago, parasaurolophus said:

Pretty sure a girl in my state recovered and did quite well. It was a discovery channel show. She picked up a bat in church iirc. 

Eta: yep, she has 3 kids now, races sled dogs. Milwaukee protocol is treatment. Google wisconsin girl bit by bat

####### bats, man.  Maybe we should start leaving bats alone?

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My wife got the vaccine yesterday.  Minor arm soreness happened for a short time yesterday.  No other impacts so far.  Her coworker said it helps to relax as much as you can.  A lot of her coworkers are taking the wait and see how it goes approach, so I'm not sure how long they need to see everything is fine before they get it.  That's a little disappointing. 

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My arm was pretty sore this morning and the last few hours of sleep weren't good as I felt pretty crummy.

But, a little ibuprofen and getting up, moving around and I'm back to normal. Just a bit of arm soreness still but better after moving it.

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12 minutes ago, gianmarco said:

My arm was pretty sore this morning and the last few hours of sleep weren't good as I felt pretty crummy.

But, a little ibuprofen and getting up, moving around and I'm back to normal. Just a bit of arm soreness still but better after moving it.

Are you ambidextrous?  Congrats on being vaccinated!

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Gulp

Scientists from the UK’s New and Emerging Respiratory Virus Threats Advisory Group (NERVTAG) say they are now “highly confident” the new variant of coronavirus is more infectious than others, with a “hint” that it could be more transmissible in children. 

According to NERVTAG, the new variant -- which is believed to have originated in southeast England -- could be around 71% more transmissible than other variants. 

https://www.cnn.com/webview/world/live-news/coronavirus-pandemic-vaccine-updates-12-22-20/h_97eef54d80c7defb94b5885d256e9076?utm_medium=social&utm_content=2020-12-22T20%3A44%3A20&utm_source=twcnnbrk&utm_term=image

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Got the Pfizer vaccine a couple hours ago. Pretty impressed with the process and gives me a little optimism that the rollout won’t be a total disaster. So far arm is a little sore but nothing unusual. Working a 12 hour shift tomorrow, so hopefully I won’t have any lingering symptoms.

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3 hours ago, the moops said:

Gulp

Scientists from the UK’s New and Emerging Respiratory Virus Threats Advisory Group (NERVTAG) say they are now “highly confident” the new variant of coronavirus is more infectious than others, with a “hint” that it could be more transmissible in children. 

According to NERVTAG, the new variant -- which is believed to have originated in southeast England -- could be around 71% more transmissible than other variants. 

https://www.cnn.com/webview/world/live-news/coronavirus-pandemic-vaccine-updates-12-22-20/h_97eef54d80c7defb94b5885d256e9076?utm_medium=social&utm_content=2020-12-22T20%3A44%3A20&utm_source=twcnnbrk&utm_term=image

 

If it is more transmissible among children, that very well could explain a lot of the additional spread. 

Luckily, there is no evidence that this strain is: 
a. Any worse for symptoms and general disease progression.  So far all that's thought is that it spreads easier. 
b. It is too early to tell, but nobody has raised any alarms that the vaccine will not work, or that this is different enough to cause reinfection for those who have beaten covid once already.  In fact I'm reading that a lot of experts think the vaccine will work fine on this variant.

The bummer is obvious.  What a shame to have quicker transmission just before the vaccine is available for elderly and high risk groups and ultimately the general population.  Also, faster spread introduces more opportunity to mutate further. Ugh.  Nobody wants that unless it's to a much more tame variant.  

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So my wife's MIL, who has leukemia, is the typical Hispanic. Very family oriented, always hugs. Never tells the kids (adult or otherwise) no. We constantly feared the chances she took, even after some family members tested positive. After getting the news late last week that her cancer is spreading, she got the news yesterday she is COVID positive. She is absolutely miserable, and we really fear for her. She is suffering through all the symptoms and her immune system is shot.

On top of all that, my wife's son, his wife and their two small kids took MIL for a car ride to see the lights Saturday since she was depressed from the cancer news, before she showed symptoms. Now the son's wife is feeling poor and went to CVS to be tested. Since then, my wife's son and their daughter both showing symptoms. We are hoping it is just allergies but, in the meantime, due to everyone getting tested for the holidays, they can't get an appointment anywhere before Saturday. It's just a mess.

So sometimes it isn't even a family event. It's spending time with ONE single family member outside your own homestead. That's all it takes.

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3 hours ago, Scoresman said:

I also read that when these things mutate, they tend to be less severe/deadly versions.  Nice if true, but I don't believe everything I read nowadays though.  

This is typical of all viruses. There's no reason to think it won't be true here. 

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15 hours ago, IvanKaramazov said:

Yes we do.  Millions have people have had covid and made full recoveries.  It's as curable as . . . wait for it . . . the flu.

Covid-19 really sucks, and we should take it extremely seriously.  That said, it isn't Captain Tripps and it doesn't do anybody any good to make it out to be worse than it already is.

It’s treatable- not curable. It’s not like a bacterial infection where a particular anti-biotic is known to kill specific types of bacteria and cure them. There is no established “cure” for covid.  They treat the symptoms that the particular patient has, they beef up the body’s response with steroids in some cases..etc. Upwards of 15-20% of people that have “recovered” from covid are long haulers that still experience symptoms. How do they fit in your “cure” argument?

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5 hours ago, jvdesigns2002 said:

It’s treatable- not curable. It’s not like a bacterial infection where a particular anti-biotic is known to kill specific types of bacteria and cure them. There is no established “cure” for covid.  They treat the symptoms that the particular patient has, they beef up the body’s response with steroids in some cases..etc. Upwards of 15-20% of people that have “recovered” from covid are long haulers that still experience symptoms. How do they fit in your “cure” argument?

You're getting hung up on a semantic argument over "curable" vs. "treatable."  Regardless, it's like THE FLU in the sense that the overwhelming majority of people recover from it.

There's really no need to exaggerate or otherwise catastrophize a virus that has already killed millions.  It's bad enough without the additional hyperbole.  (Edit: Nobody in this forum thinks that antibiotics will cure a viral infection.)

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7 minutes ago, IvanKaramazov said:

You're getting hung up on a semantic argument over "curable" vs. "treatable."  Regardless, it's like THE FLU in the sense that the overwhelming majority of people recover from it.

There's really no need to exaggerate or otherwise catastrophize a virus that has already killed millions.  It's bad enough without the additional hyperbole.

I'm not exaggerating anything. You are spreading misleading information.  There is no cure for covid.  When somebody points out smething that you say is wrong--that doesn't mean they are exaggerating. I've lost several family members to Covid--maybe read through the first 20 pages of this thread and you'll see that I was one of a handful of people here that were completely  right about covid.  I don't need to be told by you or anybody else about my thoughts of a disease. It's called having an opinion.  So far in regards to Covid--my opinion has been more accurate than yours will ever be.  

Edited by jvdesigns2002
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1 minute ago, jvdesigns2002 said:

I'm not exaggerating anything. You are spreading misleading information.  There is no cure for covid.  When somebody points out smething that you say is wrong--that doesn't mean they are exaggerating. I've lost several family members to Covid--maybe read through the first 20 pages of this thread and you'll see that I was one of a handful of people here that were completely  right about covid.  I don't need to be told by you or anybody else about my thoughts of a disease. It's called having an opinion.  So far in regards to Covid--my opinion has been more accurate than yours will ever be.  

I'm sorry for your loss.

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8 hours ago, culdeus said:
12 hours ago, Scoresman said:

also read that when these things mutate, they tend to be less severe/deadly versions.  Nice if true, but I don't believe everything I read nowadays though.  

This is typical of all viruses. There's no reason to think it won't be true here.

Did SARS 1 become less deadly? Is ebola less deadly? Did smallpox become less deadly? Did MERS become less deadly? 

Viruses can evolve to have staying power in many ways. They can evolve to survive longer outside the body, they can evolve to have a longer transmission window.

I think the this is "typical" of viruses thought process should be thrown out the window. 

Mostly because much of what we thought was typical might actually have been wrong all along. But also because it is silly to compare viruses that are completely unrelated to each other.

 

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9 hours ago, DallasDMac said:

So my wife's MIL, who has leukemia, is the typical Hispanic. Very family oriented, always hugs. Never tells the kids (adult or otherwise) no. We constantly feared the chances she took, even after some family members tested positive. After getting the news late last week that her cancer is spreading, she got the news yesterday she is COVID positive. She is absolutely miserable, and we really fear for her. She is suffering through all the symptoms and her immune system is shot.

On top of all that, my wife's son, his wife and their two small kids took MIL for a car ride to see the lights Saturday since she was depressed from the cancer news, before she showed symptoms. Now the son's wife is feeling poor and went to CVS to be tested. Since then, my wife's son and their daughter both showing symptoms. We are hoping it is just allergies but, in the meantime, due to everyone getting tested for the holidays, they can't get an appointment anywhere before Saturday. It's just a mess.

So sometimes it isn't even a family event. It's spending time with ONE single family member outside your own homestead. That's all it takes.

That sucks but I also have a random question that I just cant get passed.  Your wife's MIL is not your Mom?   Sorry I'm just hung up on this :bag:

 

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3 minutes ago, parasaurolophus said:

Did SARS 1 become less deadly? Is ebola less deadly? Did smallpox become less deadly? Did MERS become less deadly? 

Viruses can evolve to have staying power in many ways. They can evolve to survive longer outside the body, they can evolve to have a longer transmission window.

I think the this is "typical" of viruses thought process should be thrown out the window. 

Mostly because much of what we thought was typical might actually have been wrong all along. But also because it is silly to compare viruses that are completely unrelated to each other.

 

For those of us who are not medical researchers or otherwise working on the very front lines of covid-related knowledge discovery, it's almost certainly best to tentatively operate under the assumption that covid behaves like other viruses are known to behave.  Obviously we can always update our priors as new information comes in, but taking as our starting point "this virus is different and probably worse than all other viruses that have come before" is most likely going to (1) lead you to believe things that turn out to be wrong (most things are normal, few things are abnormal, and betting on "abnormal" out of the gate in the absence of any special information will lead to error most of the time), and (2) unnecessarily freak people out (covid is bad and scary enough to without making things up). 

At one point, we had people cooking their mail.  We still have people wiping down their groceries and getting anxious about taking walks outdoors.  At one point, there was a mini-freak out over people possibly getting re-infected with covid, which we now know is extraordinarily rare, like winning the world's worst lottery.  We want people taking sensible precautions.  We don't want to mentally traumatize people, and we don't want to put them in a situation where they throw their hands up and say "#### it" either.  

Covid is a "novel" coronavirus in the sense that it is a new virus that humans haven't been exposed to before.  It's not an alien virus.  It took a grand total of one weekend to create a 95% effective vaccine, because it's a virus and we have a pretty good idea of how to deal with viruses.

Avoid other people, wear a mask, wash your hands, and get vaccinated at the first opportunity.  Don't get yourself or others worked up over a hypothetical Captain Tripps mutation that probably isn't going to happen.

 

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Possible source of the adverse reactions to vaccine identified

tl;dr: both vaccines contain a compound, polyethylene glycol (PEG), has never been used before in an approved vaccine, but it is found in many drugs that have occasionally triggered adverse reactions. Studies being set up to vet these theories

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37 minutes ago, Nathan R. Jessep said:

Possible source of the adverse reactions to vaccine identified

tl;dr: both vaccines contain a compound, polyethylene glycol (PEG), has never been used before in an approved vaccine, but it is found in many drugs that have occasionally triggered adverse reactions. Studies being set up to vet these theories

Sounds like they can skin test you to see if you react to this stuff.

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1 hour ago, Nathan R. Jessep said:

Possible source of the adverse reactions to vaccine identified

tl;dr: both vaccines contain a compound, polyethylene glycol (PEG), has never been used before in an approved vaccine, but it is found in many drugs that have occasionally triggered adverse reactions. Studies being set up to vet these theories

In before we start hearing reports that "There's antifreeze in the vaccine!!!1!1!" There's not -- it's ethylene glycol that's the active ingredient in automotive antifreeze. Sometimes diethylene glycol is also present in antifreeze. But neither are in the vaccines, and though the names of the chemicals are similar, the properties are very different.

Use of polyethylene glycol in pharmaceuticals is called PEGylation. Below is a quick laymen's read on it:

Quote

PEGylation is routinely achieved by the incubation of a reactive derivative of PEG with the target molecule. The covalent attachment of PEG to a drug or therapeutic protein can "mask" the agent from the host's immune system (reducing immunogenicity and antigenicity), and increase its hydrodynamic size (size in solution), which prolongs its circulatory time by reducing renal clearance.

...

A PEGylated lipid is used as an excipient in both the Moderna vaccine and the Pfizer–BioNTech vaccine for SARS-CoV-2. Both RNA vaccines consist of Messenger RNA, or mRNA, encased in a bubble of oily molecules called lipids. Proprietary lipid technology is used for each. In both vaccines, the bubbles are coated with a stabilizing molecule of polyethylene glycol. As of December 2020, there is some concern that PEG could trigger an allergic reaction, as appears to have occurred by 19 December in at least three "Alaska health care worker" people who were administered the Tozinameran product.

 

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44 minutes ago, Doug B said:

In before we start hearing reports that "There's antifreeze in the vaccine!!!1!1!" There's not -- it's ethylene glycol that's the active ingredient in automotive antifreeze. Sometimes diethylene glycol is also present in antifreeze. But neither are in the vaccines, and though the names of the chemicals are similar, the properties are very different.

Use of polyethylene glycol in pharmaceuticals is called PEGylation. Below is a quick laymen's read on it:

 

Polyethylene glycol is also what's in Miralax (used frequently for constipation) and many bowel preps for colonoscopies.

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They really need to come up with a different name for it. We use thousands of gallons of glycol every year for everything from winterizing equipment to ground heaters. I hear this all the time. Come up with something the average Joe can't pronounce so we can move off of this hill please. Looking at you medical community.

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1 hour ago, IvanKaramazov said:

For those of us who are not medical researchers or otherwise working on the very front lines of covid-related knowledge discovery, it's almost certainly best to tentatively operate under the assumption that covid behaves like other viruses are known to behave.  Obviously we can always update our priors as new information comes in, but taking as our starting point "this virus is different and probably worse than all other viruses that have come before" is most likely going to (1) lead you to believe things that turn out to be wrong (most things are normal, few things are abnormal, and betting on "abnormal" out of the gate in the absence of any special information will lead to error most of the time), and (2) unnecessarily freak people out (covid is bad and scary enough to without making things up). 

At one point, we had people cooking their mail.  We still have people wiping down their groceries and getting anxious about taking walks outdoors.  At one point, there was a mini-freak out over people possibly getting re-infected with covid, which we now know is extraordinarily rare, like winning the world's worst lottery.  We want people taking sensible precautions.  We don't want to mentally traumatize people, and we don't want to put them in a situation where they throw their hands up and say "#### it" either.  

Covid is a "novel" coronavirus in the sense that it is a new virus that humans haven't been exposed to before.  It's not an alien virus.  It took a grand total of one weekend to create a 95% effective vaccine, because it's a virus and we have a pretty good idea of how to deal with viruses.

Avoid other people, wear a mask, wash your hands, and get vaccinated at the first opportunity.  Don't get yourself or others worked up over a hypothetical Captain Tripps mutation that probably isn't going to happen.

 

It is funny that for you the only choice other than this will mutate to become less deadly is that it is the worst virus ever. 

The vaccine wasnt developed so quickly because of similarities to all viruses. It was developed so quickly because of its similartities to MERS in the way it attaches.  

So for history of mutations it would be foolish to use mutations in flu or hiv for comparing to this one.

What we know from some other coronaviruses is that sometimes mutations can be a big deal. They can also be inconsequential. When they are the result of mass deletions, they can become much more severe. 

Doesnt mean they will and there isnt much we can do about it anyway. 

But saying things like this is how other viruses behave, so we can assume xyz, when plenty of them dont behave that way makes little sense. Thats how we got in some of the mess we are in now. Because people make assumptions and they make even more assumptions about how people will react. 

Dont forget, the wash your hands and clean stuff nonstop wasnt based on new assumptions. It came from assumptions about other viruses. 

There is a whole spectrum of actions and reactions available, but the next logical choice isnt "OMG panic! It is going to kill us all!" And that is not at all what I am saying. Some people will go there for sure. But putting on a happy face will never keep the doomers from going there. Just like putting up doom and gloom wont convince just a flu bros that it is something to take serious. 

Honest communication should always be the choice because that is how you keep reasonable people listening.

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I'll post this video again.  Saying something that goes against the mainstream narrative is not a crime and in fact is OUR RIGHT.  At the 5:30 mark you will hear Dr. Stella Immanuel talk about the 350 patients she treated and all of them are well.  Some in their 90s, some with asthma, some with high blood pressure. All lived.  There are other doctors taking too.  Her message: Nobody needs to die.  If you care about the truth, you will watch without bias.  Some of the greatest scientific discoveries were initially scoffed at and the scientists who made the discoveries were ridiculed and outcast.  Be wary of censorship.  Be wary of anyone telling you that your thoughts and ideas are not allowed.  Stop complying. Stop the obedience.  None of the actions being asked of us by our government makes sense. 

Does anyone remember when Fauci originally told the American public that masks would make Covid worse?  He then changed his position weeks later.  Everyone is wearing masks yet the numbers are 'spiking'.  Nothing makes complete sense.  There are doctors and scientists on both sides of this thing but we only hear one side from the media.  This isn't right.  Censoring people like me isn't right. I'm not a troll, I'm an American who isn't willing to give away my freedom.  

https://www.#####ute.com/video/PqqvcxdCGJo9/

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1 minute ago, Rhythmdoctor said:

I'll post this video again.  Saying something that goes against the mainstream narrative is not a crime and in fact is OUR RIGHT.  At the 5:30 mark you will hear Dr. Stella Immanuel talk about the 350 patients she treated and all of them are well.  Some in their 90s, some with asthma, some with high blood pressure. All lived.  There are other doctors taking too.  Her message: Nobody needs to die.  If you care about the truth, you will watch without bias.  Some of the greatest scientific discoveries were initially scoffed at and the scientists who made the discoveries were ridiculed and outcast.  Be wary of censorship.  Be wary of anyone telling you that your thoughts and ideas are not allowed.  Stop complying. Stop the obedience.  None of the actions being asked of us by our government makes sense. 

Does anyone remember when Fauci originally told the American public that masks would make Covid worse?  He then changed his position weeks later.  Everyone is wearing masks yet the numbers are 'spiking'.  Nothing makes complete sense.  There are doctors and scientists on both sides of this thing but we only hear one side from the media.  This isn't right.  Censoring people like me isn't right. I'm not a troll, I'm an American who isn't willing to give away my freedom.  

https://www.#####ute.com/video/PqqvcxdCGJo9/

This again? Is there like a reminder in people's calendars that prompts them to post this video every two weeks or something? 

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57 minutes ago, Rhythmdoctor said:

I'll post this video again.  Saying something that goes against the mainstream narrative is not a crime and in fact is OUR RIGHT.  At the 5:30 mark you will hear Dr. Stella Immanuel talk about the 350 patients she treated and all of them are well.  Some in their 90s, some with asthma, some with high blood pressure. All lived.  There are other doctors taking too.  Her message: Nobody needs to die.  If you care about the truth, you will watch without bias.  Some of the greatest scientific discoveries were initially scoffed at and the scientists who made the discoveries were ridiculed and outcast.  Be wary of censorship.  Be wary of anyone telling you that your thoughts and ideas are not allowed.  Stop complying. Stop the obedience.  None of the actions being asked of us by our government makes sense. 

Does anyone remember when Fauci originally told the American public that masks would make Covid worse?  He then changed his position weeks later.  Everyone is wearing masks yet the numbers are 'spiking'.  Nothing makes complete sense.  There are doctors and scientists on both sides of this thing but we only hear one side from the media.  This isn't right.  Censoring people like me isn't right. I'm not a troll, I'm an American who isn't willing to give away my freedom.  

https://www.#####ute.com/video/PqqvcxdCGJo9/

Stella Immanuel

To put it nicely, she's a quack.  I'm sorry you listen to that and believe it.  I already responded earlier and explained that the physicians in these videos are either not true physicians or have lost their licenses.  They are conspiracy theorists.  They don't believe viruses exist.  They don't believe AIDS exists.  They believe in witches and demons.

None of it is true science.  Yes, there are doctors and scientists on both sides, as you stated.  However, for every 1 doctor/scientist on one side (i.e. this video), there are 99 on the other side.  There's a reason for that.  If you truly want to be educated on what's going on, stop believing the fringe minority conspiracy folks.

ETA -- More on that video

America's Frontline Doctors

But none of the most vocal members have practices that would place them on the actual front lines of the COVID-19 pandemic. Some don't currently practice at all.

Two of those appearing at the Monday event are ophthalmologists, one of whom is no longer licensed.

Edited by gianmarco
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5 hours ago, IvanKaramazov said:

For those of us who are not medical researchers or otherwise working on the very front lines of covid-related knowledge discovery, it's almost certainly best to tentatively operate under the assumption that covid behaves like other viruses are known to behave.  Obviously we can always update our priors as new information comes in, but taking as our starting point "this virus is different and probably worse than all other viruses that have come before" is most likely going to (1) lead you to believe things that turn out to be wrong (most things are normal, few things are abnormal, and betting on "abnormal" out of the gate in the absence of any special information will lead to error most of the time), and (2) unnecessarily freak people out (covid is bad and scary enough to without making things up). 

At one point, we had people cooking their mail.  We still have people wiping down their groceries and getting anxious about taking walks outdoors.  At one point, there was a mini-freak out over people possibly getting re-infected with covid, which we now know is extraordinarily rare, like winning the world's worst lottery.  We want people taking sensible precautions.  We don't want to mentally traumatize people, and we don't want to put them in a situation where they throw their hands up and say "#### it" either.  

Covid is a "novel" coronavirus in the sense that it is a new virus that humans haven't been exposed to before.  It's not an alien virus.  It took a grand total of one weekend to create a 95% effective vaccine, because it's a virus and we have a pretty good idea of how to deal with viruses.

Avoid other people, wear a mask, wash your hands, and get vaccinated at the first opportunity.  Don't get yourself or others worked up over a hypothetical Captain Tripps mutation that probably isn't going to happen.

 

So good.

Another common sense thing they should do is give everyone antibody tests before they get the vaccine. If they have antibodies, they don’t need the vaccine.  

 

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21 minutes ago, shader said:

So good.

Another common sense thing they should do is give everyone antibody tests before they get the vaccine. If they have antibodies, they don’t need the vaccine.  

 

This is not true.  You said this once before and I tried correcting you about it already.

Edited by gianmarco
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25 minutes ago, gianmarco said:

There are different levels of need, though, particularly if you're talking about a resource that is currently very scarce.  I read your link, and I'm curious as to your thoughts on prioritizing people at the same level who have not been infected.  The first two doctors mention something to that effect, and it makes sense to me as a layman.  Maybe there's something I'm not considering though.

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27 minutes ago, gianmarco said:

 The reason is that natural infection immunity seems to wear out after two to three months

I dont have issues with the reco to still get the vaccine. There doesnt seem to be any evidence it is harmful. 

But that doctor shouldnt be saying that. That just isnt true. 

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3 minutes ago, Dr_Zaius said:

There are different levels of need, though, particularly if you're talking about a resource that is currently very scarce.  I read your link, and I'm curious as to your thoughts on prioritizing people at the same level who have not been infected.  The first two doctors mention something to that effect, and it makes sense to me as a layman.  Maybe there's something I'm not considering though.

There's a difference in bumping priority and saying "you don't need the vaccine".  I agree with waiting longer if you are positive for antibodies or had known Covid if it's a scarce resource where you are.

Edited by gianmarco
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1 hour ago, gianmarco said:

Thanks for the opinions from a couple doctors.  I disagree. Does that doctor have proof that natural immunity wears out after 2-3 months?  If he doesn’t, he shouldn’t spread rumors.

The goal here is to be as effective as possible with the vaccine and end the pandemic. Thus far 1 million people in the USA have received it.  If we deprioritized the 18 million people that have already had it, those that really need it could get it sooner.

Then when all those that actually need it are done, those that should have immunity wearing off can get theirs if they want to.

At least that’s how I’d design it.

And I certainly wouldn’t take a vaccine away from someone else that actually needed it, if I’d already had covid. 

Edited by shader
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I can’t believe there are doctors spreading the 2-3 month immunity crap.  How dumb do they think we are? When I express frustration with the medical industry it’s because of silliness like this. A quick google search shows how absurd that idea is.  As does common sense. 

Edited by shader
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To me, a non-medical-professional, my plan would be to mirror the tiers of those who are prioritized to get the vaccine. The second set would be those who have already had Covid. Then you place the mirrored set, in the same respective order, under the first set in the pecking order. 

 

ETA: def wouldn't argue against bumping the frontline workers (COVID unit workers in particular) from set 2 up the heirarchy into the set 1 list

Edited by Nathan R. Jessep
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