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Are we already living in a dictatorship?


Skoo

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15 hours ago, PennStater77 said:

More like 5/5, look at them pushing this vaccine off on people, and going into people's homes.

They are deplorable humans. 3 of them aren't even American.

Since we have people on this board suggesting that liberals hate conservatives, but not the other way around, I offer up this post as a counter-example for you.

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7 minutes ago, Alex P Keaton said:

Since we have people on this board suggesting that liberals hate conservatives, but not the other way around, I offer up this post as a counter-example for you.

Touche'.  I can't find anything to argue against in your post.  Dangit!

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2 hours ago, rockaction said:

That contingent's preferred preference of government is dictatorship. Any democratic socialist knows exactly what will happen if their policies and re-organization is enacted. It'll be a dictatorship.

Funny we should be having this conversation right now as the Democratic leadership is bragging that they're going through your SMS messages and your private Facebook posts at the executive branch. I thought we were in danger from the fascists with Trump; I underestimated the socialist/centrist part of the Democratic Party, which now is willing to go through your personal communications to tell you to get medical procedures.

This is odious, odious stuff, and only Team Blue supports it. It's garbage, and a real chink in the armor of freedom.

I'm sorry, but this is insane, Tucker Carlson-esque hyperbole.  None of them are arguing for dictatorship and you know it.  Bernie, Warren, AOC, et.al. are arguing for government modeled much closer to the Scandinavian countries.

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5 minutes ago, Rich Conway said:

I'm sorry, but this is insane, Tucker Carlson-esque hyperbole.  None of them are arguing for dictatorship and you know it.  Bernie, Warren, AOC, et.al. are arguing for government modeled much closer to the Scandinavian countries.

No. They call themselves democratic socialists, not social democrats. I think we all know the difference. I've spent untold hours on this site telling people the difference. The people themselves will tell you the difference.

I'm having no argument that requires another exposition about the difference. I've done it many times on this board, and have proven my point every. darn. time. I see no need to rehash it. You won't get from Point A to B with me with that as your passage.

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1 minute ago, rockaction said:

No. They call themselves democratic socialists, not social democrats. I think we all know the difference. I've spent untold hours on this site telling people the difference. The people themselves will tell you the difference.

I'm having no argument that requires another exposition about the difference. I've done it many times on this board, and have proven my point every. darn. time. I see no need to rehash it. You won't get from Point A to B with me with that as your passage.

We'll have to agree to disagree.  None of the folks I named are in favor of dictatorship or are arguing for any policies that support it.  You're free to come up with any link that provides a direct statement to the contrary, but I'm entirely certain you can't.

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2 minutes ago, Rich Conway said:

We'll have to agree to disagree.  None of the folks I named are in favor of dictatorship or are arguing for any policies that support it.  You're free to come up with any link that provides a direct statement to the contrary, but I'm entirely certain you can't.

I'm entirely certain that glowing admiration for Fidel Castro's policies, along with a fervent love of the Sandinistas in the eighties, puts me a lot -- and I mean -- a lot closer than you think I would be. But we can agree to disagree. He's not a social democrat by any stretch. He's a democratic socialist, and the two are radically different.

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6 hours ago, rockaction said:

I'm entirely certain that glowing admiration for Fidel Castro's policies, along with a fervent love of the Sandinistas in the eighties, puts me a lot -- and I mean -- a lot closer than you think I would be. But we can agree to disagree. He's not a social democrat by any stretch. He's a democratic socialist, and the two are radically different.

Way to drop the knowledge!  :thumbup:

These guys are going to vote enough of these "social democrats" :lol:  into office until one day they're really going to find out that "social democrats" was intended to fool them this entire time and then the real masks will come off.  Might even happen in their lifetime, but it will happen.

Unfortunately, we've had the entirety of the 20th century as an example of what these "social democrats" really mean.  Also, unfortunately, they never seem to learn from history.

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6 minutes ago, BladeRunner said:

Way to drop the knowledge!  :thumbup:

These guys are going to vote enough of these "social democrats" :lol:  into office until one day they're really going to find out that "social democrats" was intended to fool them this entire time and then the real masks will come off.  Might even happen in their lifetime, but it will happen.

Unfortunately, we've had the entirety of the 20th century as an example of what these "social democrats" really mean.  Also, unfortunately, they never seem to learn from history.

Oh, Blade, Social Democrats are fine. They're in Europe and they believe in private enterprise, only they believe in more of a transfer or wealth than we're used to in the states. AOC and Bernie call themselves democratic socialists, which is a huge difference from a party like the Social Democrats in Europen, even. Democratic socialists call for the public ownership of companies, and believe in publicly set wages and prices. There's no markets in democratic socialism, unlike in Europe under the social democrats. Huge difference.

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1 minute ago, rockaction said:

Oh, Blade, Social Democrats are fine. They're in Europe and they believe in private enterprise, only they believe in more of a transfer or wealth than we're used to in the states. AOC and Bernie call themselves democratic socialists, which is a huge difference from a party like the Social Democrats in Europen, even. Democratic socialists call for the public ownership of companies, and believe in publicly set wages and prices. There's no markets in democratic socialism, unlike in Europe under the social democrats. Huge difference.

Yeah, I know.  I was being sarcastic in using "social democrats" because that's what they think Bernie, Warren, AOC (and many more are).  My point being is that they've convinced guys like Rich that they're "Social Democrats" which is, of course, absurd.

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Just now, BladeRunner said:

Yeah, I know.  I was being sarcastic in using "social democrats" because that's what they think Bernie, Warren, AOC (and many more are).  My point being is that they've convinced guys like Rich that they're "Social Democrats" which is, of course, absurd.

Their program generally is a social democratic platform, but that's because of the reality of the situation. They quite consciously declare themselves democratic socialists, so we know what they would do if they had their druthers. People like AOC and Bernie think you can keep freedom along with socialism and the abolition of private property; I've yet to see it work on a large scale almost everywhere that has taken nationalizing industries heretofore not nationalized  and doing so (excluding health care).

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1 minute ago, rockaction said:

Their program generally is a social democratic platform, but that's because of the reality of the situation. They quite consciously declare themselves democratic socialists, so we know what they would do if they had their druthers. People like AOC and Bernie think you can keep freedom along with socialism and the abolition of private property; I've yet to see it work on a large scale almost everywhere that has taken nationalizing industries heretofore not nationalized  and doing so (excluding health care).

Yep!  :thumbup:

But, we're going to ignore history because all those others did it wrong and they will do much better!  TRUST US!

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12 minutes ago, rockaction said:

Their program generally is a social democratic platform, but that's because of the reality of the situation. They quite consciously declare themselves democratic socialists, so we know what they would do if they had their druthers. People like AOC and Bernie think you can keep freedom along with socialism and the abolition of private property; I've yet to see it work on a large scale almost everywhere that has taken nationalizing industries heretofore not nationalized  and doing so (excluding health care).

Stop.  Show me one quote; just one, where Bernie has advocated for the abolition of private property. Do you seriously think he's advocating for government ownership of everything?

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42 minutes ago, Rich Conway said:

Stop.  Show me one quote; just one, where Bernie has advocated for the abolition of private property. Do you seriously think he's advocating for government ownership of everything?

Yes.  The problem with Socialists/Marxists/Communists is they can't be trusted.  EVER.  They're all kissing cousins.  They'll tell you what you want to hear to gain power, but once that power is achieved then the masks come off.  Again, just look at the entirety of the 20th century for proof to see how all of that stuff works out.  Probably 100+ million bodies and counting.

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  • 1 month later...
On 7/18/2021 at 8:09 PM, rockaction said:

Their program generally is a social democratic platform, but that's because of the reality of the situation. They quite consciously declare themselves democratic socialists, so we know what they would do if they had their druthers. People like AOC and Bernie think you can keep freedom along with socialism and the abolition of private property; I've yet to see it work on a large scale almost everywhere that has taken nationalizing industries heretofore not nationalized  and doing so (excluding health care).

Yet you think the Republicans  are the problem.    A 3 seat majority in house and a tie breaker in senate and they are gonna fundamentally change the rules of America.   kOOky

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On 2/12/2020 at 8:44 AM, Skoo said:

The checks and balances of our 3 branches no longer exist

The President is instructing the Private Businesses to do his bidding,

What happens next? What do we have in place to stop him?

Wow you were right but just about the wrong guy.

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44 minutes ago, NorvilleBarnes said:

When you've been hunting for Nazis for four years and you finally find one in the mirror.

 

Biden is bypassing Congress and legislating from the Executive Branch using Executive Branch Organizations.  

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On 9/9/2021 at 6:33 PM, HellToupee said:

:goodposting:

I feel the same way

The high water mark for closeness to a dictatorship was when the acting president of the United States tried to overturn the election.  Nothing else is in the same galaxy.  

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3 hours ago, zoonation said:

The high water mark for closeness to a dictatorship was when the acting president of the United States tried to overturn the election.  Nothing else is in the same galaxy.  

 

Goalposts unsuccessfully moved.

You seem to forget that this thread was started in January of 2020 - well before the election.  You don't get to move the goalposts to fit your current excuse.

Turns out you guys weren't scared of Trump becoming a dictator - you were scared he was going to do it first.  :shrug:

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4 hours ago, zoonation said:

The high water mark for closeness to a dictatorship was when the acting president of the United States tried to overturn the election.  Nothing else is in the same galaxy.  

You mean use the rules laid out in the Constitution to appeal the election? Following what is written in the Constitution is your high water mark? Guess that makes sense why you're fine with everything that's happened since. 

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On 9/10/2021 at 1:02 PM, Insein said:

Imagine Trump saying this. 

https://youtu.be/IItaNVU8kMU

Um, while I don't support Biden saying it, I could absolutely see Trump saying something like this. I believe he literally said he would override governors if they didn't re-open places of worship last summer. 

Here's where he says it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dMgxJQXBcCY

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17 minutes ago, Zow said:

Um, while I don't support Biden saying it, I could absolutely see Trump saying something like this. I believe he literally said he would override governors if they didn't re-open places of worship last summer. 

Here's where he says it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dMgxJQXBcCY

So defending Americans' first amendment rights is the same to you as inflicting forced medical procedures on unconsenting adults to keep their jobs?

Edited by Insein
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14 minutes ago, Insein said:

So defending Americans' first amendment rights is the same to you as inflicting forced medical procedures on unconsenting adults to keep their jobs?

No (and I'll refrain from commenting on the hyperbolic gloss on your question). 

Trump saying something as dumb as Biden regarding "overriding governors" is something I can absolutely imagine him doing. Because, you know, he did it. :shrug: 

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7 minutes ago, Zow said:

No (and I'll refrain from commenting on the hyperbolic gloss on your question). 

Trump saying something as dumb as Biden regarding "overriding governors" is something I can absolutely imagine him doing. Because, you know, he did it. :shrug: 

Seriously? 

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; 

you can try to argue state rights but that's been shot down before when it comes to overriding the Constitution. Where in the Constitution does it say the government has the power to force your employer to make you get a medical procedure or receive punishment for not doing so?

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2 minutes ago, Insein said:

Seriously? 

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; 

you can try to argue state rights but that's been shot down before when it comes to overriding the Constitution. Where in the Constitution does it say the government has the power to force your employer to make you get a medical procedure or receive punishment for not doing so?

First, I'm well aware of the Constitution and the Amendments made thereto as well as the lengthy and complicated progenies of constitutional issues as dealt with by SCOTUS. Second, I think you're missing my point - which is that, in the context of your post saying "imagine Trump saying this," I can imagine Trump saying pretty much anything stupid or myopic such as the suggestion that he has the power to override governors. Put differently, about the only things I can't imagine him saying are "I lost the 2020 election fair and square" and "please don't supersize my value meal." 

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1 minute ago, Zow said:

First, I'm well aware of the Constitution and the Amendments made thereto as well as the lengthy and complicated progenies of constitutional issues as dealt with by SCOTUS. Second, I think you're missing my point - which is that, in the context of your post saying "imagine Trump saying this," I can imagine Trump saying pretty much anything stupid or myopic such as the suggestion that he has the power to override governors. Put differently, about the only things I can't imagine him saying are "I lost the 2020 election fair and square" and "please don't supersize my value meal." 

 

You can imagine Trump saying these things but you're ok with Biden actually saying them. Yea that about sums it up. 

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4 minutes ago, Insein said:

 

You can imagine Trump saying these things but you're ok with Biden actually saying them. Yea that about sums it up. 

Your post was verbatim "imagine Trump saying this." So, yes, yes I could. And in the first sentence of my response where I wanted to note that one could easily imagine Trump saying something that dumb I literally said, "while i don't support Biden saying this." Combine that with me later calling the statement "stupid" and referencing it as "myopic" and i'm at a complete loss how and where you could conclude that I am "ok" with Biden saying it.  

Seems like you view the presidents through binary lenses as one being really good and the other being bad without the possibility that they both can say dumb stuff that may be suggesting an unconstitutional act such as overriding governors. . 

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1 minute ago, Zow said:

Your post was verbatim "imagine Trump saying this." So, yes, yes I could. And in the first sentence of my response I literally said, "while i don't support Biden saying this." Combine that with me later calling the statement "stupid" and referencing it as "myopic" and i'm at a complete loss how and where you could conclude that I am "ok" with Biden saying it.  

He meant imagine ya'lls reaction if Trump said that.  So you actually imagining it makes it appear as if you are defending Biden.  HTH

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2 minutes ago, Zow said:

Your post was verbatim "imagine Trump saying this." So, yes, yes I could. And in the first sentence of my response where I wanted to note that one could easily imagine Trump saying something that dumb I literally said, "while i don't support Biden saying this." Combine that with me later calling the statement "stupid" and referencing it as "myopic" and i'm at a complete loss how and where you could conclude that I am "ok" with Biden saying it.  

Seems like you view the presidents through binary lenses as one being really good and the other being bad without the possibility that they both can say dumb stuff that may be suggesting an unconstitutional act such as overriding governors. . 

Trump was there for 4 years. Did he actually Do the thing you think he could say? There's a difference between saying stupid stuff and allowing people to use you to do incredibly stupid and dangerous stuff. 

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3 hours ago, Insein said:

Trump was there for 4 years. Did he actually Do the thing you think he could say? There's a difference between saying stupid stuff and allowing people to use you to do incredibly stupid and dangerous stuff. 

I genuinely have no idea what you’re saying here. I posted a link to trump saying he’d override governors. As for your second sentence, I don’t know where this “allowing people” sentence is coming from or how it applies. 

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3 hours ago, tonydead said:

He meant imagine ya'lls reaction if Trump said that.  So you actually imagining it makes it appear as if you are defending Biden.  HTH

Ya’alls? Who is ya’alls? 

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2 minutes ago, tonydead said:

Man, you really have a tough time reading a room. 

I don’t think I do. I think you’re grouping people regardless of any other factors as to whether they blindly support trump. 

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16 minutes ago, Zow said:

I don’t think I do. I think you’re grouping people regardless of any other factors as to whether they blindly support trump. 

Careful using gate word "blindly supporting". 

On one side, you have people who supported Trump and he was elected.

OTOH, you have people on these boards every single day clearly saying "Biden sucks and I knew he sucks but I voted for him anyway and still prefer him over Trump."

That, my friend, is true blind support. When you will sacrifice so many things in our country to spite one personality. When you will do it, stand by, openly say it, and then die on that hill, regardless of what trouble it brings...THAT is blind support. 

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