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Government Response To The Coronavirus


James Daulton

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On 4/25/2021 at 11:19 AM, Doug B said:

Going by the resources on the Colorado Department of Public Health's COVID vaccination page, I strongly suggest skipping the major pharmacy's websites.

There's an easily searchable and zoomable map of vaccine providers on the page. I zoomed in on the Boulder-Broomfield-Lafayette area NW of Denver at random, and saw that there were a number of small pharmacies providing the vaccines. Many of the sites have their phone numbers shown on the map when you click on one of the locations -- prioritize phone calls over website visits, even if they explicitly suggest visiting a website.

Further down the page there is a list of locations by county, and it looks like all have phone numbers. Call first, call second, call third. Phone before Internet. Start with the locations nearest you (not necessarily the big retailers), call them up, and tell them you want to be on their list if they can't schedule you right then and there. Tell them also that you're available for their no-show list -- that you can get down there within 15 - 20 minutes or so if they need someone to come down and use up shots that are getting ready to get thrown away.

It's OK to double- or triple-book appointments and it's OK to put yourself on 10 no-show lists at various places. You can always cancel the appointments you don't end up needing (though do so promptly after your vaccination). If you get a no-show call after your vaccination and thus have to decline, the provider will understand and just move on to the next name.

From reviewing the resources on the Colorado Department of Public Health's COVID vaccination page, it looks like the biggest challenges could be for people who live far away from Colorado's population centers. Are you in kind of an isolated area with only a handful of drugstores and maybe one clinic? If so, you may have to make a drive out of necessity if you feel getting the vaccine is important to you. However, if you are in a populated area and are willing to place maybe 5-10 quick phone calls, I would bet you can schedule your first vaccine by the end of this week.

 

Dug around a little deeper and was finally able to make an appointment tonight, for this coming Sunday.  Thanks for the encouragement.  I still don't think it was handled as well as it could have been, especially re: opening it up to anyone 16 or older when it was still hard for people my age to get it, but I'm glad I got an appointment.  

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48 minutes ago, John123 said:

Dug around a little deeper and was finally able to make an appointment tonight, for this coming Sunday.  Thanks for the encouragement.  I still don't think it was handled as well as it could have been, especially re: opening it up to anyone 16 or older when it was still hard for people my age to get it, but I'm glad I got an appointment.  

Man, no doubt it was handled poorly.  Opening up to anyone 16 or older so quickly was crazy.

Either way, glad that you have an appointment!

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8 hours ago, tonydead said:

What are we betting on for the new guidelines tomorrow?  If you've been vaccinated it's ok to not wear a mask outdoors? That's what the scientists have finally figured out?  

Lmfao yep exactly. Wtf wears a mask outdoors now anyway?

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I didn't realize outdoor mask mandates were so widespread.  I just assumed this was a NYC/DC thing.  

It would interesting to see if there's any sort of correlation between "outdoor mask mandates" and "reluctance to reenter society."  This obviously wasn't the intent of the policy, but if you've been wearing a mask outdoors every time you leave your house, you've essentially spent the last 14 months or so conditioning yourself to think that the air is poisonous.  It won't take long to un-learn that thought process, but it's not nothing and could partly explain why some people are still so skittish about moving on with their lives after vaccination.

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1 hour ago, IvanKaramazov said:

I didn't realize outdoor mask mandates were so widespread.  I just assumed this was a NYC/DC thing.  

It would interesting to see if there's any sort of correlation between "outdoor mask mandates" and "reluctance to reenter society."  This obviously wasn't the intent of the policy, but if you've been wearing a mask outdoors every time you leave your house, you've essentially spent the last 14 months or so conditioning yourself to think that the air is poisonous.  It won't take long to un-learn that thought process, but it's not nothing and could partly explain why some people are still so skittish about moving on with their lives after vaccination.

Most of the outdoor mask “mandates” I’ve seen leave a lot of wiggle room.  Phrases like “if you can’t safely distance a mask is required.”

Mrs APK and I take a lot of walks in the evening (or sometimes over lunch).  I see a lot of people out walking solo, on very empty suburban sidewalks.  Whenever I see someone with a mask, I have the brief thought “why do you hate science?”

Yet that is the opposite reaction most of my virtue signaling friends have here in this liberal suburb of Chicago.  Most people here wear masks everywhere “to show that they are considerate and care about the safety of others.”

I do the same - indoors, like at the grocery store.  What about in crowds outdoors?  Umm, I haven’t been in a crowd in nearly 14 months.

Anyway, I’m rambling, but it’s just weird to me how scientifically ignorant people continue to be.

 

edited because, well, just read below.

Edited by Alex P Keaton
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5 minutes ago, Alex P Keaton said:

Mrs APK and I take a lot of walks in the evening (or sometimes over lunch).  I see a lot of people out walking solo, on very empty suburban sidewalks.  Whenever I see someone without a mask, I have the brief thought “why do you hate science?”

Really?  We had this same argument over a year ago in the FFA version of this thread, and I thought everybody agreed that there was no reason to wear a mask if you're outdoors by yourself.

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3 minutes ago, IvanKaramazov said:

Really?  We had this same argument over a year ago in the FFA version of this thread, and I thought everybody agreed that there was no reason to wear a mask if you're outdoors by yourself.

Hes got to just be just trolling at this point, right?  :lol:. No way sane people think that. 

Edited by tonydead
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4 minutes ago, Alex P Keaton said:

I made it very clear that this isn’t me doing it.

Not even remotely trolling. Ballpark 25-40% of people I see out walking in my area are still wearing masks.  It’s nuts.

Okay, I think I just misread your post.  Sorry about that.

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1 hour ago, IvanKaramazov said:

I didn't realize outdoor mask mandates were so widespread.  I just assumed this was a NYC/DC thing.  

It would interesting to see if there's any sort of correlation between "outdoor mask mandates" and "reluctance to reenter society."  This obviously wasn't the intent of the policy, but if you've been wearing a mask outdoors every time you leave your house, you've essentially spent the last 14 months or so conditioning yourself to think that the air is poisonous.  It won't take long to un-learn that thought process, but it's not nothing and could partly explain why some people are still so skittish about moving on with their lives after vaccination.

This is me...it was never a thing here at all.  I guess it's fine to change the recommendation, but I don't see it being a big impact to a ton of people.

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Biden to make the announcement during a briefing at 12:15 EST.  They finally figured out it might be an incentive to get the vaccine if they can loosen the restrictions.

LMAO if this is some idiotic if you're fully vaccinated and outside and not around other people it might be ok to not wear a mask. We might be able to have small gatherings for the 4th of July!

We know vaccinated people don't carry the virus, and at risk people have had plenty of time to get the vaccine if they want it, ditch the masks altogether already.

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1 hour ago, The Commish said:

This is me...it was never a thing here at all.  I guess it's fine to change the recommendation, but I don't see it being a big impact to a ton of people.

14 states still have a mandate for masks worn outdoors, 2 of which don't include the "when proper distancing cannot be maintained" language.  

So yeah, if they don't at least get rid of the "proper distancing" language or replace it with "unless vaccinated" they won't be talking to a bunch of people at all, just two states.  

I mean if the President is going to make the announcement it has to be a big deal right?  I'm not expecting much.

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12 minutes ago, tonydead said:

14 states still have a mandate for masks worn outdoors, 2 of which don't include the "when proper distancing cannot be maintained" language.  

So yeah, if they don't at least get rid of the "proper distancing" language or replace it with "unless vaccinated" they won't be talking to a bunch of people at all, just two states.  

I mean if the President is going to make the announcement it has to be a big deal right?  I'm not expecting much.

wonder if Joe will take questions?

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Quote

 

Fully vaccinated people can:

Visit with other fully vaccinated people indoors without wearing masks or physical distancing

Visit with unvaccinated people (including children) from a single household who are at low risk for severe COVID-19 disease indoors without wearing masks or physical distancing

Participate in outdoor activities and recreation without a mask, except in certain crowded settings and venues

Resume domestic travel and refrain from testing before or after travel or self-quarantine after travel.

Refrain from testing before leaving the United States for international travel (unless required by the destination) and refrain from self-quarantine after arriving back in the United States.

Refrain from testing following a known exposure, if asymptomatic, with some exceptions for specific settings

Refrain from quarantine following a known exposure if asymptomatic

Refrain from routine screening testing if asymptomatic and feasible

For now, fully vaccinated people should continue to:

Take precautions in indoor public settings like wearing a well-fitted mask

Wear masks that fit snuggly when visiting indoors with unvaccinated people who are at increased risk for severe COVID-19 disease or who have an unvaccinated household member who is at increased risk for severe COVID-19 disease

Wear well-fitted masks when visiting indoors with unvaccinated people from multiple households

Avoid indoor large-sized in-person gatherings

Get tested if experiencing COVID-19 symptoms

Follow guidance issued by individual employers

Follow CDC and health department travel requirements and recommendations

 

 

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1 hour ago, tonydead said:

14 states still have a mandate for masks worn outdoors, 2 of which don't include the "when proper distancing cannot be maintained" language.  

So yeah, if they don't at least get rid of the "proper distancing" language or replace it with "unless vaccinated" they won't be talking to a bunch of people at all, just two states.  

I mean if the President is going to make the announcement it has to be a big deal right?  I'm not expecting much.

The new guidelines should force all 14 states to get rid of social distancing for people who are vaccinated. 

And I don't imagine people running outside to check vaccination cards.  All activity outdoors should return to normal.

Good - next do indoors!

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7 minutes ago, IvanKaramazov said:

My wife and I have been running together outdoors without masks for about fourteen months now.  (Well, actually for 27 years if you want to be technical about it).  I can't believe there are people out there who still thought this was risky.

Runners & bikers with masks are the norm here in Maskachusetts

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Biden using vaccine hesitancy among right-wing whites to tout racial equity in vaccines received is clever politics.

I don't know if he was always good on the "shameless self-promotion" thing or if it's a response to seeing Trump's approach (all politics) vs Obama's (all policy), but it's notable and a throwback to Bush II and, especially, Clinton.  He's better at it than I expected.

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Quote

Zeke Miller

@ZekeJMiller

CDC's Dr. Walensky says guidance for fully vaccinated people to wear masks indoors/mass gatherings is largely to protect unvaccinated from other unvaccinated folks who may be there (given difficulty distinguishing vaccinated people from those that aren't)

https://twitter.com/ZekeJMiller/status/1387087013766209538

Assuming this is accurate, it's nice to have a CDC director who says stuff like this out loud.  At this point -- the tail end of the pandemic -- this seems like a totally reasonable approach.  Lots of people are vaccinated, lots more are partially vaccinated, some haven't had a chance to get vaccinated yet, and some have chosen not to get vaccinated.  For a few more weeks, it's probably just easiest for people to keep wearing masks indoors.

But that's just a logistical keep-it-simple approach not really based in science per se.  Once vaccination is just a little more widespread than it is today, and we're down to just the anti-vaxxers, there's not going to be any good scientific argument for continued masking and we can drop this thing.  This is exactly the kind of expiration date that we should be looking for.  

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2 hours ago, tonydead said:

14 states still have a mandate for masks worn outdoors, 2 of which don't include the "when proper distancing cannot be maintained" language.  

So yeah, if they don't at least get rid of the "proper distancing" language or replace it with "unless vaccinated" they won't be talking to a bunch of people at all, just two states.  

I mean if the President is going to make the announcement it has to be a big deal right?  I'm not expecting much.

I used to think this...I no longer do.  Fool me twice, shame on me and all that stuff....

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6 hours ago, IvanKaramazov said:

I didn't realize outdoor mask mandates were so widespread.

They're not and never were. Not sure why the CDC's guidance is being treated as some kind of sea change -- it's not.

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3 minutes ago, Doug B said:

They're not and never were. Not sure why the CDC's guidance is being treated as some kind of sea change -- it's not.

Gone to a baseball game this season?  Masks mandatory in the stadium in both the Angels and Mariners games I've been to.

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8 minutes ago, -fish- said:

Gone to a baseball game this season?  Masks mandatory in the stadium in both the Angels and Mariners games I've been to.

Point taken -- though note that those fans are allowed to walk back to their cars without wearing masks.

I'm thinking more of the idea that if you, say, go jogging outside maskless in certain states that the local fuzz will swoop down on you in short order. Not really concerned with what a state puts on the books or what a governor announces at a press conference -- I'm more concerned with what a state/city commits enforcement resources to.

Edited by Doug B
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1 hour ago, IvanKaramazov said:

https://twitter.com/ZekeJMiller/status/1387087013766209538

Assuming this is accurate, it's nice to have a CDC director who says stuff like this out loud.  At this point -- the tail end of the pandemic -- this seems like a totally reasonable approach.  Lots of people are vaccinated, lots more are partially vaccinated, some haven't had a chance to get vaccinated yet, and some have chosen not to get vaccinated.  For a few more weeks, it's probably just easiest for people to keep wearing masks indoors.

But that's just a logistical keep-it-simple approach not really based in science per se.  Once vaccination is just a little more widespread than it is today, and we're down to just the anti-vaxxers, there's not going to be any good scientific argument for continued masking and we can drop this thing.  This is exactly the kind of expiration date that we should be looking for.  

Easiest?  It doesn't get any easier than vaccinated people don't have to wear masks.  

Explain to me how that tweet makes any sense without either saying people are too dumb to know if they are vaccinated or unvaccinated people will cheat the guideline?  It's not following the science period, the end. 

 

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43 minutes ago, Doug B said:

Point taken -- though note that those fans are allowed to walk back to their cars without wearing masks.

I'm thinking more of the idea that if you, say, go jogging outside maskless in certain states that the local fuzz will swoop down on you in short order. Not really concerned with what a state puts on the books or what a governor announces at a press conference -- I'm more concerned with what a state/city commits enforcement resources to.

Well that's dumb because most people and organizations follow what the state puts on the books and what the governor announces. 

And they aren't allowed to walk back to their cars, unless you left the game early, you can't maintain 6 feet of distance emptying a stadium.  

Edited by tonydead
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1 hour ago, jobarules said:

The guidance doesnt change that

That rule is based on outdoor mask mandates.  He just said that outdoor mask mandates were not widespread and never were.  Except they are still in place in many states, and still being enforced.   Baseball is an example.

This is Washington's current mandate, for example:

Quote

The Washington State Department of Health has issued a statewide order requiring individuals to wear a face covering in indoor public spaces such as stores, offices and restaurants. The order also requires face coverings outdoors when you can't stay 6 feet apart from others.

The CDC's new guidance changes that for small gatherings, but not large ones.   So you're sort of right.  It doesn't change going to a baseball game.  But it does contradict the current outdoor mask mandate for smaller events.   

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Just now, ekbeats said:

Biden delivered his new mask guidance outside and walked up to the podium, alone, you got it - wearing a mask. What an idiot.

:goodposting:  And you know.....every....single...person....that is around him is already vaccinated.  

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My son is running in his final OUTDOOR track meet this Saturday at Georgia, and I can’t watch it because they aren’t letting in any of the public.  I’m so damn pissed off.  Bunch of dumb-### control freaks making stupid decisions like this.

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1 hour ago, tonydead said:

Easiest?  It doesn't get any easier than vaccinated people don't have to wear masks.  

Explain to me how that tweet makes any sense without either saying people are too dumb to know if they are vaccinated or unvaccinated people will cheat the guideline?  It's not following the science period, the end. 

 

Anyone who is unvaccinated at this point is likely someone who would not follow the guidelines anyway.  Once the entire population has had a reasonable opportunity to get fully vaccinated, the anti-vaxxers will just be infecting each other anyway so no need for masks.

Unfortunately for me up here in Canada, we are a long way out from that scenario.  Our vaccine rollout has been nothing short of embarrassing for a supposed G7 country.

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If there is any big takeaway from this pandemic it's that the education complex doesn't give a flying flag about the kids.  From refusing to go back to school, despite ample evidence of safety, to wanting teachers and kids all fully vaccinated (that we don't have a kids' vaccine isn't relevant, right?), to angling for not having in-class teaching next school year, among many others. This whole system needs to be demolished and rebuilt from the bottom up.  Let's not forget that Europe has conquered this problem almost from the get go.  We, instead, get institutional greed and sloth on a staggering scale.

And, if you're poor and in a minority area, they really, really don't give a rip.  The numbers back this up.

School choice is the civil rights fight of our time.

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1 hour ago, ekbeats said:

My son is running in his final OUTDOOR track meet this Saturday at Georgia, and I can’t watch it because they aren’t letting in any of the public.  I’m so damn pissed off.  Bunch of dumb-### control freaks making stupid decisions like this.

There have been indoor volleyball tournaments in Georgia so it doesn’t make sense to not let in some spectators to an outdoor event. 

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4 hours ago, -fish- said:

Gone to a baseball game this season?  Masks mandatory in the stadium in both the Angels and Mariners games I've been to.

This seems excessive if you and the other two people at the mariners game are vaccinated.

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< 10% of all documented cases were from transmissions that happened outside.  You dont say. CDC Director says they want unvaccinated people to still wear masks outside because the virus could "trick them".  :lol:. Apparently science is tricky. 

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9 hours ago, fatguyinalittlecoat said:

My adult soccer league still requires us to wear masks when playing, even though my suspicion is that most people in the league are fully vaccinated.

Damn.  Honestly I'd be more worried about a respiratory event due to lack of oxygen from running than I would be from the miniscule chance of catching Covid in the outdoors, even if I weren't vaccinated.

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4 hours ago, Sand said:

If there is any big takeaway from this pandemic it's that the education complex doesn't give a flying flag about the kids.  From refusing to go back to school, despite ample evidence of safety, to wanting teachers and kids all fully vaccinated (that we don't have a kids' vaccine isn't relevant, right?), to angling for not having in-class teaching next school year, among many others. This whole system needs to be demolished and rebuilt from the bottom up.  Let's not forget that Europe has conquered this problem almost from the get go.  We, instead, get institutional greed and sloth on a staggering scale.

And, if you're poor and in a minority area, they really, really don't give a rip.  The numbers back this up.

School choice is the civil rights fight of our time.

I think we are in the same county.  Our county schools went to mask optional this week.  They gave the teachers two separate days and set up vaccination clinics and gave it two weeks after that.  That way everyone who wanted to take it that worked at the school could do so.  My wife teaches in one of the other districts, they still have masks.

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6 hours ago, Sand said:

If there is any big takeaway from this pandemic it's that the education complex doesn't give a flying flag about the kids.  From refusing to go back to school, despite ample evidence of safety, to wanting teachers and kids all fully vaccinated (that we don't have a kids' vaccine isn't relevant, right?), to angling for not having in-class teaching next school year, among many others. This whole system needs to be demolished and rebuilt from the bottom up.  Let's not forget that Europe has conquered this problem almost from the get go.  We, instead, get institutional greed and sloth on a staggering scale.

And, if you're poor and in a minority area, they really, really don't give a rip.  The numbers back this up.

School choice is the civil rights fight of our time.

This seems like a made up excuse...

Quote

 

Cardona has meanwhile suggested “issues of distrust” between minority families and their schools lie at the core of the problem.

“It is concerning that students of color in particular are not coming in at the same rates as other students,” the secretary told reporters earlier this month. “But it shouldn't surprise us, if prior to the pandemic we have had issues engaging and achieving the same outcomes for students of color as the general student population."

 

 

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Politically speaking, the worst part about the slowdown in the vaccines is that since they're taking place in a number of red states/areas....when COVID hits those place again hard, while not hitting areas in which the vaccine has been abosorbed into, there's going to be a whole new line of conspiracy theories for the Trump Republican to glom on to.  

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48 minutes ago, Thunderlips said:

Politically speaking, the worst part about the slowdown in the vaccines is that since they're taking place in a number of red states/areas....when COVID hits those place again hard, while not hitting areas in which the vaccine has been abosorbed into, there's going to be a whole new line of conspiracy theories for the Trump Republican to glom on to.  

I was talking with my wife last night about the summer here and the times that are getting ready to shift back indoors.  Hopefully we have enough that have been vaccinated by the time summer hits, but it's a tough slog from this point forward in our area.  Most everyone who wants a shot is in the process of getting them or has completed them.  That seems to be about 40ish% in our area.  That's not going to be enough to prevent more spikes.  I said in either this thread or the Florida Politics thread (sorry, don't remember which) but Florida will be a constant hotspot through the entirety of this experiment.  So far that's been true.  Will be interesting to see what happens as everyone here is driven back inside again by the summer heat.  Hopefully we are significantly better than last summer.  

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Super interesting declaration from Governor Whitmer in MI. She has no chance of getting re-elected, but I like the cut of her gib.

 

NEWS: Gov. Gretchen Whitmer announces a plan to tie the lifting of coronavirus restrictions to Michigan's vaccination rate, setting four specific benchmarks that must be reached to return to normal.

When 55% of people ages 16 & up get a shot, all office work can resume. At 60%, capacity limits rise at banquet halls, conference centers, stadiums, funeral homes. At 65%, no more indoor capacity limits. At 70%, order will be lifted to no longer employ broad mitigation measures.

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7 hours ago, whoknew said:

Super interesting declaration from Governor Whitmer in MI. She has no chance of getting re-elected, but I like the cut of her gib.

 

NEWS: Gov. Gretchen Whitmer announces a plan to tie the lifting of coronavirus restrictions to Michigan's vaccination rate, setting four specific benchmarks that must be reached to return to normal.

When 55% of people ages 16 & up get a shot, all office work can resume. At 60%, capacity limits rise at banquet halls, conference centers, stadiums, funeral homes. At 65%, no more indoor capacity limits. At 70%, order will be lifted to no longer employ broad mitigation measures.

At 80% Aaron Rodgers will be the Lions new QB.

Edited by 2Squirrels1Nut
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