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Government Response To The Coronavirus (4 Viewers)

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whoknew said:
The experts are all over the place on military spending. That doesn't seem to be the case on the coronavirus. 
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I actually think they are kind of all over the place. Not to the extremes of some posters here, but definitely quite a variance from a lot of people. And certainly a lot of variance over time. 

 
BobbyLayne said:
Old story (4 days) but this is one of the most baffling aspects of the pandemic. Whether it’s a public health crisis, how SRO we are to wash our hands, and how likely we are to continue shaking hands are partisan issues.

https://www.washingtonian.com/2020/03/09/hand-washing-is-now-a-partisan-issue/
 

https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/486417-democrats-twice-as-likely-as-republicans-to-call-coronavirus-imminent?amp
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Bows and curtsies may have come about like this. :speculation: But could be useful again.

 
BobbyLayne said:
Sinn Fein said:
Kyle Griffin @kylegriffin1

While the California state government has 8,000 test kits available, the kits have not all included every necessary component to actually perform the test for COVID-19, Gov. Gavin Newsom said.

Think about this for a moment - South Korea are doing 10,000 tests per day, the state of California only has 8,000 in total - and some of those are not functional.  Dysfunction.
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People keep getting this wrong...

Each kit contains enough supplies for 750-800 specimen tests. So the baseline is 6-6.4M.

The original (botched) test kit had three components - my terminology might be off here but it was three specimen tests. Each different and confirms the others. When they realized one of these wasn’t working properly, they evaluated whether two would be sufficient. It was determined it would be.

So they probably have enough for 6M specimen tests, or 3M people.

Hope that makes sense.

Edited 7 minutes ago by BobbyLayne
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Thank you for the explanation.  Do you have any citation for this, as I would hate for me to repeat incorrect information that I heard on a football forum.

Thanks in advance

 
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The Mayo Clinic in Rochester has developed its own test and says it now has the capability to test between 200-300 coronavirus samples per day.

 
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Congress needs to pass a stimulus package that helps vulnerable populations. People that need guaranteed sick pay, that need to be able to have their kids taken care of, low wage workers that don't get paid when they can't work. For people, not for corporations. And not some payroll tax end-around to short change SS and Medicare. Stimulus for people who need it. Now. People need to not be afraid of getting sick and that they will be be fired and evicted kind of stimulus. Now.

 
Dr Steven Brule said:
roadkill1292 said:
Don played this down and delayed serious action for two weeks because he was angry that virus fears were making him look bad. The war with science is going to go badly for those on the wrong side of it (and maybe all the rest of us, too).
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It feels like our boat has capsized and when we try to swim to shore, some are grabbing our legs to keep us in the water.    
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The orange people?

 
Kal El said:
Idiots? No. Wasting time, energy and resources? Yes.
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would a pandemic ever be enough to change your mind to close borders / travel ?

or anything? or is it open borders from now on regardless? 

just curious how far people who want open borders believe in it .... I mean if a 50% fatality virus comes from Wuhan next year ... would that be enough to lock borders down hard ? 

 
Grace Under Pressure said:
Congress needs to pass a stimulus package that helps vulnerable populations. People that need guaranteed sick pay, that need to be able to have their kids taken care of, low wage workers that don't get paid when they can't work. For people, not for corporations. And not some payroll tax end-around to short change SS and Medicare. Stimulus for people who need it. Now. People need to not be afraid of getting sick and that they will be be fired and evicted kind of stimulus. Now.
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I’m hearing on the radio that this indeed will be happening. But we’ll see. 

 
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Grace Under Pressure said:
Congress needs to pass a stimulus package that helps vulnerable populations. People that need guaranteed sick pay, that need to be able to have their kids taken care of, low wage workers that don't get paid when they can't work. For people, not for corporations. And not some payroll tax end-around to short change SS and Medicare. Stimulus for people who need it. Now. People need to not be afraid of getting sick and that they will be be fired and evicted kind of stimulus. Now.
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How much would this cost? I am asking seriously. Has a number been thrown out yet? 

 
Stealthycat said:
would a pandemic ever be enough to change your mind to close borders / travel ?

or anything? or is it open borders from now on regardless? 

just curious how far people who want open borders believe in it .... I mean if a 50% fatality virus comes from Wuhan next year ... would that be enough to lock borders down hard ? 
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Our borders aren't “open”.

Lock down for what?  A question you still have not answered.  We have more cases here than Mexico...you think people are coming here right now given our leadership and lack of testing?

 
CletiusMaximus said:
When he realized his first tactic - saying it’s all a media hoax - wouldn’t work, he pivoted to blaming Obama. When he realizes that won’t work, he’s going to start claiming this virus is a weapon created by China to attack him. He’s already laying the groundwork for that.
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Even today I'm optimistic no one is dumb enough to buy that.

 
Trump is (and has been) the political equivalent to Rudy Gobert mockingly touching all of the microphones, reporters and fellow teammates... only later to learn that not only does he have the virus, but he has also spread the virus to those he mockingly touched. AND HE IS SUPPOSED TO BE THE ONE IN CHARGE!!! Another difference being that Gobert has publicly acknowledged his idiocy and has apologized. Pretty darn sure you will not see that response from the president.

 
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South Korea has 66 deaths out of 7,869 confirmed cases.  They've been testing like crazy so their denominator is likely more accurate than most other countries.  That's only a 0.8% death ratio. Very encouraging.

 
Juxtatarot said:
South Korea has 66 deaths out of 7,869 confirmed cases.  They've been testing like crazy so their denominator is likely more accurate than most other countries.  That's only a 0.8% death ratio. Very encouraging.
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Its only encouraging IMO if we test more and are able to treat people.  Left untested and untreated...that % likely climbs, no?

 
Tom Skerritt said:
The Mayo Clinic in Rochester has developed its own test and says it now has the capability to test between 200-300 coronavirus samples per day.
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There should be a BUNCH of these tests coming online in the next few days.  We're going to start knowing what's really happening out there.  Which is probably why you're seeing Trump switch gears this morning.  He's not going to be able to hide behind "so few cases" anymore.

 
There’s two ways to manage this:

1. Mass testing and strict quarantine of those that test positive.

2. Mass quarantine on the assumption that the population is already highly infected.

Our failure to do #1 has made #2 a necessity. I don’t think it can be overstated how badly we have bungled the testing. Not only are we not doing mass testing, there’s people showing symptoms that aren’t able to get tested.

As someone posted above, Mayo Clinic developed their own testing. That’s where this is going. Billionaires funding the development of testing methods at the leading hospitals to get the masses tested.

 
parasaurolophus said:
How much would this cost? I am asking seriously. Has a number been thrown out yet? 
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Not sure, but this is realistically a temporary measure, and IMO should be directed at those people who would take that stimulus and inject it right back into the economy. It may cost less to do it than not to do it on a net/net basis.

 
Grace Under Pressure said:
Not sure, but this is realistically a temporary measure, and IMO should be directed at those people who would take that stimulus and inject it right back into the economy. It may cost less to do it than not to do it on a net/net basis.
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Wouldnt you pretty much have to do it as a whole with a cap? You would need this to be quick i would think and selectively applying would just put up roadblocks. 

 
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Juxtatarot said:
South Korea has 66 deaths out of 7,869 confirmed cases.  They've been testing like crazy so their denominator is likely more accurate than most other countries.  That's only a 0.8% death ratio. Very encouraging.
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What is so encouraging? We've known this for a while. It's still 6-8x deadlier than the flu. And I think I heard that there were something like 80,000 deaths from t he flu in 2018.

 
HellToupee said:
I’m actually thinking it may be smart to shut everything down and give every working adult cash . Be bold 
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Yes, basically this. Perhaps not the extreme end on both of those, but a very aggressive push on both.

WFH for all those that can. Small businesses stay open, and get stimulus to account for lost revenue. Workers who can't work from home, get stimulus.  

We can get through this. Flatten the curve. Increase social distancing. Be smart. Band together.

 
Juxtatarot said:
South Korea has 66 deaths out of 7,869 confirmed cases.  They've been testing like crazy so their denominator is likely more accurate than most other countries.  That's only a 0.8% death ratio. Very encouraging.
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If we were using the resources and infrastructure that we have as a wealthy nation, we could match that. We haven’t.

 
Juxtatarot said:
Yes.  Our testing problems have been terrible so far but it seems like we're making progress.  
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Some...but still severely lacking.  I believe it was Sinn who posted that Cali still has only 8000 tests and some of those aren't fully functional..

I think better steps are being taken now to try and slow it...but overall the government response has sucked.

 
Juxtatarot said:
South Korea has 66 deaths out of 7,869 confirmed cases.  They've been testing like crazy so their denominator is likely more accurate than most other countries.  That's only a 0.8% death ratio. Very encouraging.
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if 10% of the US population catches it, a 0.8% death ratio results in 261k dead Americans.

That's a hell of a lot better than the 1.3M we are looking at if you assume the 2.35% we are currently at, or 2.2M if you assume the 6.74%  that Italy is currently finding.

 
Tom Skerritt said:
What is so encouraging? We've known this for a while. It's still 6-8x deadlier than the flu. And I think I heard that there were something like 80,000 deaths from t he flu in 2018.
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It's encouraging because a death rate below 1% is better than a death rate above 1%.  I've read there is a lot of uncertainty about the ratio.  

The number of flu deaths from 2018 is irrelevant to the point I'm making.

 
jon_mx said:
I thought the older people kind of told you that.  It is people are are in a group which are highly likely to die if they get this virus.  
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It's not just older people as we understand it today.  If you have asthma, you're at risk.  If you have diabetes, you're at risk.  If you have heart conditions, you're at risk.  All these are regardless of age.  How do you propose segregating specific groups in this manner?  At this point, the best we can do is limit the exposure from outside sources and treat those within our borders.  It's assinine to continue and allow the influx of contamination into an area you are trying to decontaminate.

Now, if one wants to make the argument that travel should still be allowed as long as the traveler has tested negative for the virus prior to travel, then we can talk.  However, if your concern is "cost" as you talk about above, that approach won't address that problem.  So I'm not exactly sure there is a realistic and effective method that's acceptable with that as a primary driver.  That ship appears to have sailed.

 
https://www.latimes.com/politics/story/2020-03-13/trump-administration-blocks-states-use-medicaid-respond-coronavirus-crisis

Despite mounting pleas from California and other states, the Trump administration isn’t allowing states to use Medicaid more freely to respond to the coronavirus crisis by expanding medical services.

In previous emergencies, including the 9/11 terrorist attacks, Hurricane Katrina and the H1N1 flu outbreak, both Republican and Democratic administrations loosened Medicaid rules to empower states to meet surging needs.

That’s making it harder for states to quickly sign up poor patients for coverage so they can get necessary testing or treatment if they are exposed to coronavirus.
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"haha let the poors die"

 
Biff84 said:
There’s two ways to manage this:

1. Mass testing and strict quarantine of those that test positive.

2. Mass quarantine on the assumption that the population is already highly infected.

Our failure to do #1 has made #2 a necessity. I don’t think it can be overstated how badly we have bungled the testing. Not only are we not doing mass testing, there’s people showing symptoms that aren’t able to get tested.

As someone posted above, Mayo Clinic developed their own testing. That’s where this is going. Billionaires funding the development of testing methods at the leading hospitals to get the masses tested.
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I like this post.  Good example of why socialism or democratic socialism or whatever we are calling it would suck.  We are seeing first hand how private capitalism, and yes billionaires, are going to crush anything our bloated government can handle.

One note about the testing/quarantining: We only have ~40 deaths.  That means either it hasn't spread as fast as your are assuming OR it's not as big of a deal (deadly) as you are assuming.  Both cannot be true.

 
tonydead said:
I like this post.  Good example of why socialism or democratic socialism or whatever we are calling it would suck.  We are seeing first hand how private capitalism, and yes billionaires, are going to crush anything our bloated government can handle.

One note about the testing/quarantining: We only have ~40 deaths.  That means either it hasn't spread as fast as your are assuming OR it's not as big of a deal (deadly) as you are assuming.  Both cannot be true.
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Seems like you are assuming that all governments are as incompetent as the current government. 

I disagree.

 
tonydead said:
One note about the testing/quarantining: We only have ~40 deaths.  That means either it hasn't spread as fast as your are assuming OR it's not as big of a deal (deadly) as you are assuming.  Both cannot be true.
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People don't die the second they get it.  It is likely that it has spread widely and that there are many people that have already contracted it and will die from it in the future.

 
tonydead said:
I like this post.  Good example of why socialism or democratic socialism or whatever we are calling it would suck.  We are seeing first hand how private capitalism, and yes billionaires, are going to crush anything our bloated government can handle.

One note about the testing/quarantining: We only have ~40 deaths.  That means either it hasn't spread as fast as your are assuming OR it's not as big of a deal (deadly) as you are assuming.  Both cannot be true.
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Or we dont really know how many actually have it and reported numbers are unreliable.

Also...using this as an excuse against universal/socialized healthcare is a pretty bad take.

The government response has sucked not because government sucks...but because this administrations actions have sucked.  Its ok to admit that

 
moleculo said:
if 10% of the US population catches it, a 0.8% death ratio results in 261k dead Americans.

That's a hell of a lot better than the 1.3M we are looking at if you assume the 2.35% we are currently at, or 2.2M if you assume the 6.74%  that Italy is currently finding.
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Those high numbers were so wrong to begin with and misleading. Without accurate data, those mortality rates are useless.

And while I can admit that those early numbers caused some unnecessary panic. It doesn’t remove the cause for concern, as a 0.6-0.8% mortality rate should be. 

 
Stealthycat said:
would a pandemic ever be enough to change your mind to close borders / travel ?

or anything? or is it open borders from now on regardless? 

just curious how far people who want open borders believe in it .... I mean if a 50% fatality virus comes from Wuhan next year ... would that be enough to lock borders down hard ? 
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First of all, I don't like traveling, and the less I do the better. Second, I never said to fling open the borders, which you apparently believe we did. The time to close the borders was months ago, but keep pushing an incorrect narrative.

 
Dinsy Ejotuz said:
There should be a BUNCH of these tests coming online in the next few days.  We're going to start knowing what's really happening out there.  Which is probably why you're seeing Trump switch gears this morning.  He's not going to be able to hide behind "so few cases" anymore.
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Death Rate should be the new slogan.  All those people putting out the obviously false numbers like 3.4% blew it.

 
Joyce Karam

@Joyce_Karam

BREAKING: #Brazil President Jair Bolsonaro Tests Positive for #CoronaVirus. He was in US and dined with Trump on Saturday, March 7. He is highest ranking political leader to get COVID-19.

 
whoknew said:
Seems like you are assuming that all governments are as incompetent as the current government. 

I disagree.
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No.  This is what I know, no assumption:   The best privately ran companies > The best ever government run organizations.  Literally hundred of examples.

 
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