I think Gibson is in the top 3% of athletically gifted players in the entire NFL. He could probably rush the passer if he really wanted to. His acceleration reminds me of Tyreek Hill. He makes CeeDee Lamb look like a little kid.
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RB Antonio Gibson, NE (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Faust
- Start date
TVT 0 N S T A
Footballguy
Not necessarily what I am looking for, but I appreciate your candor. I am just saying a rookie with improved off-season, supporting players around him after a position change but we are thinking he will have a down year and can't handle the workload... but, we can stake our claim into an UDFA having more impact seens a little naive. Carry on though. I think we have exhausted all the juice from this lemon of a conversation.Shaq90 said:
barackdhouse
Footballguy
This is not even close to true.nittanylion said:
I like him a lot, and you don't hear me gushing about many other players that I also like a lot (although I'm sure I've written about a few others) and so it might be easy to say I'm too big on this one guy that I write about a lot. But the truth is I have him in 4/14 redrafts I've done so far and I have him in 5/29 dynasty teams. I even sold one share of him this offseason. I didn't respond to your posts because yes I vehemently disagree with your take and feel like I've already stated my case. There is no reason to think he will get less than his baseline from last year. Period. Full stop. You disagree? Fine. But to say I'm "all in" is misguided, misinformed, and fails to understand what "all-in" even means. I'm not trying to be inflammatory or anything and I respect your opinion and perspective but I did disagree with almost every word, and I don't have a ton of energy to get into these things. You don't like him or the WFT, fine, I disagree.
I can tell you some other names that I'm probably way more in on than I should be, but Gibson is hardly one of them.
kutta
Footballguy
massraider
Footballguy
I have 4 dynasty teams total, and I cannot keep track of free agents.
Do you have a Bangladeshi sweat shop that works on your fantasy teams instead of Nikes?
And if so, may I borrow them for 15 minutes on Tuesdays?
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
barackdhouse
Footballguy
As I've mentioned in the FFPC thread I am thinking seriously of hiring an assistant GM and/or intern. But I did basically the same level of management last year and it was just doable. 20 of those dynasties are from the DD site and I plan to flip probably half of them next year after competing this year.
Deamon
Footballguy
How many redrafts will you have in total? If you've already done 13 drafts in May, I'm assuming you'll be at 75 redraft leagues?
barackdhouse
Footballguy
No I want to keep it around 20. I really like trying to leverage early offseason draft ADP opportunities. I don't like the August drafts as much in terms of the way the boards look at that point. I love them in May, however. I'm going to try and hold off until the last week before the season, in early September to another half dozen or so. I have one ME team coming up that week as well, and I like the boards right after the NFL teams make their cuts, so I'll be aiming for that window of time. I am parlaying a lot of entry tokens and winning credit from 2020 and 2019 here. I am hoping to do a bunch of travelling and working this summer and put this #### to bed for awhile!
Deamon
Footballguy
Tha Guru
Footballguy
What’s great is when someone ask how his FF team did this year he can say he won the league...........he better win 1
barackdhouse
Footballguy
I'm trying to win *all* of the prizes. https://youtu.be/r3uMeF4Wfy4?t=266What’s great is when someone ask how his FF team did this year he can say he won the league...........he better win 1
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massraider
Footballguy
Not as big news as @barackdhouse stable of leagues, but:
I was today years old when I found out the guy with 66 total touches in college averaged 4.68 ypc with Dwayne Haskins as his QB in his rookie season.
choo choo
https://www.espn.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/316330/washingtons-revamped-offense-primed-for-speed-depth-and-big-plays
I was today years old when I found out the guy with 66 total touches in college averaged 4.68 ypc with Dwayne Haskins as his QB in his rookie season.
choo choo
Makes sense to me. If you think you have a gamechanging talent, lets not run him straight into 300 lb lineman 15 times a game. Put him in space and work him into the slot.
McKissic had 110 targets and ran the most routes of any RB last year. I think that's unlikely to repeat. Gibson had 44 targets and 36 receptions last year. If those numbers can increase to 60/48 this year (remember he missed two weeks last year and we get an extra game this year), his value rises quite a bit.
LawFitz
Footballguy
Reminds me of a smaller version of Derrick Henry with better hands. Elite burst and top speed for his size, but lacks wiggle and balance during cuts IMO, at least compared to true elite backs. This perhaps means greater injury risk, given his size/speed, but I also see some huge fantasy days coming if he stays healthy. Love the burst and he look smooth catching the ball. A creative OC could do wonders with his talent in a Kamara-like role, but if they use him like the Titans do Henry, I'd be very leery of depending on him for a full season.
sushinsky4tsar
Footballguy
Meteoric rise. As an owner, I'm willing to listen on trades that are assessing his value as a top 20 dynasty asset, which is where the fantasypros consensus is on him.
What I'm getting is half my league putting out offers thinking I haven't noticed how much his value has skyrocketed. Most offers barely concede a small profit on the 2nd rounder I spent on him. Honestly, kind of glad that my league mates are living in a dream world. I really don't want to entertain any tempting offers that would actually result in me sending him out. Truly a godsend to my rb depth chart, which has languished behind my wr core. Saw no reason to swap him out for Akers pre-injury. See no reason to swap him for Swift or Dobbins now. If you're not trying to plug other holes on the roster, I think Gibson owners really only have a tough decision if CMC, Barkley, Cook, Taylor, maybe Kamara are coming the other way, depending on what other pieces are involved in the trade. I really don't see much point in moving for Chubb or Henry due to the age difference, unless you're at the absolute end of a window to win a championship this year.
TVT 0 N S T A
Footballguy
An unattainable asset at this point if you're buying.
As an owner, I can't think of moving him because what I would ask for would be so assinine you would hate me as a leaguemate.
sushinsky4tsar
Footballguy
This is probably the correct answer, unless it's a modest downgrade to someone like Dobbins and you're really solving a big hole at QB/WR/TE in the process. If someone comes real strong, the reason that I will at least listen as a Gibson owner is the knowledge of what happens to his stock if he has back-to-back seasons of missing significant games due to injury, and also the unanswered question of long-term QB for WFT.
TVT 0 N S T A
Footballguy
I think those question marks can still exist even for some of the marquee players you mentioned (CMC, Dalvin Cook, Saquon Barkley). I'm not going to shy away from an unknown future QB and wouldn't consider Gibson an injury risk yet. Those other 3 players have the same risks.
Depends on need and my strengths of course. Personal example... I have Russ Wilson, Kyler Murray, Tua, Cam Newton - would potentially be willing to ship Russ + Gibson for a Cook/Saquon/JT player + 3rd but would shoot for a 2nd round pick first? I guess you could look at Gibson + 1st or 2nd straight up for one of the players you mentioned but no guarantees I'm not kicking my own d**k in a couple years.
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Pwingles
Footballguy
Thats a really good question IMO. Not sure Id be able to get myself to add an appropriate amount for the other owner to bite. I would be most likely to find an overpay for JT tho.
In a year when WFT has a new QB and the hype is out of control, youll be able to re sell gibson if you pass this year. Unless his toe falls off.
I think there is an equal chance that gibson is a top 5 rb next year or the perpetual joe mixon tease every year. Either way his value shouldnt wane a ton
sushinsky4tsar
Footballguy
I think TVT has it pegged pretty good with his Gibson + Wilson -for- *consensus top 5 stud RB* + pick example.
This assumes 1QB league and I have something brewing behind Wilson that I like. I think I'm probably insisting on a 2nd rounder for the pick (probably mid-2nd or better if it's this year). Basically, I have to tell myself a story where I can win the part 2 component of that trade, even if the current consensus value says that you're coming out a little ahead. At least this is true with Barkley due to larger injury questions marks, and Cook 25, not without his own durability questions. With Kamara at 26 and his own QB questions, I need a specific reason answered as to why I'm adding 3 years at RB. I think I can rule out paying anything resembling a sweetener for that swap.
Given what CMC has done at his peak, I think I'm talking myself into paying a true premium for that, possibly at my own peril. J Taylor seems like a safe property that's actually younger. I'm not a paying a boatload to get it done, but I value him over Gibson in all formats and in all situations my dynasty team might be in.
This assumes 1QB league and I have something brewing behind Wilson that I like. I think I'm probably insisting on a 2nd rounder for the pick (probably mid-2nd or better if it's this year). Basically, I have to tell myself a story where I can win the part 2 component of that trade, even if the current consensus value says that you're coming out a little ahead. At least this is true with Barkley due to larger injury questions marks, and Cook 25, not without his own durability questions. With Kamara at 26 and his own QB questions, I need a specific reason answered as to why I'm adding 3 years at RB. I think I can rule out paying anything resembling a sweetener for that swap.
Given what CMC has done at his peak, I think I'm talking myself into paying a true premium for that, possibly at my own peril. J Taylor seems like a safe property that's actually younger. I'm not a paying a boatload to get it done, but I value him over Gibson in all formats and in all situations my dynasty team might be in.
I'm considering an offer of AJ Brown for Gibson plus a mid round rookie pick next year. This league is PPR, requires 1 RB and 3 WR plus 2 flex, and I am fairly deep at RB (Gibson is my RB3) and could use the WR help.
I'm torn on it (and still negotiating the pick to be included).
sushinsky4tsar
Footballguy
1 RB + 3 WR + 2 FLEX? I can easily part with Gibson for AJB in that scenario, given the lineup requirements.
2 RB + 2 WR + 1 FLEX. AJB still offers plenty of temptation, enough that you probably should strive to pull the trigger. But this becomes a difficult call if you don't have other legit RB1-RB2-RB3 options behind Gibson.
King of the Jungle
Footballguy
I am not sure there is a format out there where I would prefer Gibson over AJ Brown (dynasty).
sushinsky4tsar
Footballguy
In general, I agree. AJB definitely has more value. I have both, and I actually think that a Gibson injury might be more devastating to my team (2-2-1). However, this is probably just an indicator that I need to try to deal a WR for more RB help.
D Henry - D Henderson - Z Moss - Dillon
-vs-
Godwin - Lamb - Higgins - Sutton - AB
In a 1 RB-3 WR scenario, I think it's a no-brainer to AJB.
Tanner9919
Footballguy
I have Gibson, I'd be thrilled if someone over-spent in an offer for him. here's the problem - as an owner, what would I accept as a good offer? will it be enough to make up for a player who could be a top 5 RB by the end of the season, and for years to come? or, am I giving up a decent player at the right time when the hype is out of control, maximize profit and get out? RBs are a premium, but more importantly, coaching staffs are too, and this coaching staff is laser focused on creating an offense like CMCs situation. That in itself is reason enough to NOT trade Gibson for anything.
hard to walk away from a situation like this.
MAC_32
Footballguy
What's your risk assessment of his toe injury? Mine has me leaning pass at his current price point.
Tanner9919
Footballguy
uptick in stats in 2021, now with more receptions and more 3rd down work. I guess there goes whatever wind was in McKissic's sail.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I’d go crazy on Sunday mornings.
I know someone who has 15. They told me they can't pay any attention to their teams on Sunday/Monday - the conflicts are too plentiful & too maddening.
They decided they could either let FF ruin football for them & drive them insane, or simply check for W's, L's and injuries on Monday/Tuesday.
I was in 3 redraft & 1 dynasty and have since pared down to 1 RD, 1 Dynasty. The RD is IDP, so they're sufficiently different animals, and even then I still get conflicts from time to time where I'm cheering and booing the same play at the same time.
I vowed to not expand beyond these 2 leagues (both with people I know locally) and have stuck to it, despite numerous invites every year. It's just better for my mental health, which is already borderline without FF.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I am at the point where I'm a strong buy on Gibson this year at his ADP.
I am still not as much of a believer as others. I do agree with a recent analysis (forget by whom) that described him as an instinctive runner who anticipates well.
But in the late 2nd/early 3rd his value is significantly better than it should be. If I can start with a top 3 RB and follow up with AG in the late 2nd, or if I start WR-WR and can get him as my RB1, I'm feeling pretty good to begin my draft.
And if he does see a production bump in the receiving game, his ceiling is pretty fierce in PPR.
I am still not as much of a believer as others. I do agree with a recent analysis (forget by whom) that described him as an instinctive runner who anticipates well.
But in the late 2nd/early 3rd his value is significantly better than it should be. If I can start with a top 3 RB and follow up with AG in the late 2nd, or if I start WR-WR and can get him as my RB1, I'm feeling pretty good to begin my draft.
And if he does see a production bump in the receiving game, his ceiling is pretty fierce in PPR.
barackdhouse
Footballguy
So I have written about this before, and I have read others say much the same thing, but the FF experience for me owning so many teams is next-level zen because I don't worry whatsoever about this matchup and that matchup. I own a little bit of everything and almost every TD helps me and hurts me at the same time. The management burden is a real thing but once I set the lineups and Sunday kickoff happens, I enjoy every second of it. I'll have notes handy where I know I may need to make a couple decisions before the afternoon games, but I don't check box scores frantically and all that BS. I kick back believe it or not. It actually allows me to be a little bit more pure of a football fan because I'm appreciating each game for what it is, instead of being focused purely on the FF aspect. The longest running home league of mine is the only one that I really scoreboard watch for. Now obviously there are guys (like Gibson) that I am going to root for specifically because I have a lot of shares. But again each time I celebrate something like that I know that it hurt me in several other matchups.I know someone who has 15. They told me they can't pay any attention to their teams on Sunday/Monday - the conflicts are too plentiful & too maddening.
They decided they could either let FF ruin football for them & drive them insane, or simply check for W's, L's and injuries on Monday/Tuesday.
I was in 3 redraft & 1 dynasty and have since pared down to 1 RD, 1 Dynasty. The RD is IDP, so they're sufficiently different animals, and even then I still get conflicts from time to time where I'm cheering and booing the same play at the same time.
I vowed to not expand beyond these 2 leagues (both with people I know locally) and have stuck to it, despite numerous invites every year. It's just better for my mental health, which is already borderline without FF.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Yep - this is exactly how my friend put it. Once his lineups are set, he can ignore it all and just enjoy football.
I'm wired a little differently - part of FF entertainment for me is living & dying with each play, scoreboard watching & the thrill of victory, agony of defeat kinda thing. I love the highs and lows and jumping up yelling at the TD when one of my guys hits a home run play.
And at the same time, I can opt to turn on my Niners and just enjoy that game even if I have no FF players in it.
Any more than 2 teams and I get way too conflicted and care too much. I lack the detachment/zen to ignore the scoreboard. And honestly I wouldn't want to because like I said, it can be thrilling. It's the reason that to me having 15 or 40 or 50 leagues would literally be impossible.
In my dynasty league my leaguemates can't fathom only having one. They're all in 6-10 other dynasty leagues, so they've always got a pony in the race. This year, as you know, my team needed an overhaul & I managed to pull off 5-6 deals to get it into a position where between this year + 2022/2023 drafts & trades, I might just continue to be competitive. I get the impression that when my leaguemates teams are in that position they're ok with languishing for a while because they have other competitive teams.
My zen there comes from redraft, where hope springs annual/eternal.
