2020 NBA Playoffs Thread - Haters arguing that it took Lebron 10 Finals to win 4 titles

[Chemical X 5,761]

I kind of thought Horford would be untradeable with that deal and his age.  I understand not needing Gordon  and his deal with Russ and Harden, Rockets shave a year off the committment, but man........

[dawgtrails 1,096]

3 hours ago, jvdesigns2002 said:

That deal is so weird. They dump a great young big in Capela and now are turning around and trading decently viable assets for an older and less effective big? Maybe they have some sort of macro plan and this might be the first move of more to come. 

 

 

They didn't really dump Capela though. They got Covington in the deal, who is a better fit for what their team wants to do

[Leeroy Jenkins 2,894]

4 hours ago, Long Ball Larry said:

I think that anything is possible right now with the Rockets, though I agree that it is unclear how Horford gets them much closer to anything good.

This deal would need some salary filler from Houston that would be tough, unless they would give up Tucker or Covington, which seems even crazier.  I guess they could get another team involved, but going to be tricky with the lack of cap space around the league.

I wish it was Covington.  But the rumor I saw had Gordon, Chris Clemons, Ben McLemore (non-guaranteed) and David Nwaba

[Craig_MiamiFL 2,551]

 

2 hours ago, dawgtrails said:

They didn't really dump Capela though. They got Covington in the deal, who is a better fit for what their team wants to do

I loved that deal for them. Shocked they even got someone as useful as Covington for Capela. 

Covington is a high end defender that can defend almost every position and stick the 3. They weren't going anywhere with Capela either. They can get similar #s out of a 5 if they decided to go back to a traditional one.

[caustic 3,931]

Adrian Wojnarowski @wojespn

Billy Donovan has agreed to a deal to become the next coach of the Chicago Bulls, sources tell ESPN.

4:58 PM · Sep 22, 2020

[Juxtatarot 11,320]

Holy ####!

[jvdesigns2002 3,151]

4 hours ago, dawgtrails said:

They didn't really dump Capela though. They got Covington in the deal, who is a better fit for what their team wants to do

Honestly--Covington could have been gotten for far less than Capela.  They could have easily tried to get a third team involved and gotten more for him.  Secondly--what is it that their team wants to do?  D'antoni is gone and now they are looking to add a big again.  They are now looking to trade Gordon who is one of the better players they have for a small ball lineup.  Not having a decent big to make life hard for Anthony Davis was a big part of what costed them any real chance against the Lakers.    The Rockets seem to make deals for the sake of making deals--trading cp3 away for westbrook, trading capella away for Covington--and now talking about trading Gordon for Horford.   Regardless of what their scheme is--give me cp3, harden, capella, gordon over harden, westbrook, Covington, horford any day of the week.   I'd even take the first four guys in a small ball scheme.   

[Desert_Power 850]

1 hour ago, jvdesigns2002 said:

Honestly--Covington could have been gotten for far less than Capela.  They could have easily tried to get a third team involved and gotten more for him.  Secondly--what is it that their team wants to do?  D'antoni is gone and now they are looking to add a big again.  They are now looking to trade Gordon who is one of the better players they have for a small ball lineup.  Not having a decent big to make life hard for Anthony Davis was a big part of what costed them any real chance against the Lakers.    The Rockets seem to make deals for the sake of making deals--trading cp3 away for westbrook, trading capella away for Covington--and now talking about trading Gordon for Horford.   Regardless of what their scheme is--give me cp3, harden, capella, gordon over harden, westbrook, Covington, horford any day of the week.   I'd even take the first four guys in a small ball scheme.   

I'm puzzled on both of the bold thoughts too. Of course, I'm not sure how I would build a winner around Harden either.

[DJackson10 3,061]

2 hours ago, caustic said:

Adrian Wojnarowski @wojespn

Billy Donovan has agreed to a deal to become the next coach of the Chicago Bulls, sources tell ESPN.

4:58 PM · Sep 22, 2020

Still can't believe any of this. GarPax FO is gone, New and improved GM who built a Den team who's now in the WCF this year and a legit coach for the first time since Thibs. Markanen will finally be utilized correctly. 

[dawgtrails 1,096]

1 hour ago, jvdesigns2002 said:

Honestly--Covington could have been gotten for far less than Capela.  They could have easily tried to get a third team involved and gotten more for him.     

Third team involved? The deal involved 4 teams and 12 players, 2 first round picks, and 1 second round pick. It was a massive massive deal 

[Craig_MiamiFL 2,551]

ATL literally gave nothing for Capela.

Just a product of the market for C with zero range. Can be had for a bag of chips. Covington has/had more trade value as a 3 with high end D that can defend about any position and it's not close. Really no reason at all to even debate that because that very trade will show as much.

 

Edited September 23, 2020 by Craig_MiamiFL

[DJackson10 3,061]

Legit question and this isn't political but more of opinions on why some fans are obsessed with him.

Why do fans continually bring up Mark Jackson into conversations of coaching candidates? I mean fans as the media and NBA have laid off on him for awhile. He was brought up by Bulls fans and I'd have seen several fans mention him for the 76ers too. Some legit didn't know about his comments he made though. Yes he helped build the Warrirors but my understanding is he was blackballed by the league and let go as he didn't get along with others as well as some homophobic views which many believe were directed an openly Gay Warrior member Rick Wartz at the time as well. Andre Iguodala even says he believes the former coach "who is one of my favorites ever" said Jackson was blackballed do to his views. There's some beliefs that Jackson's views on homosexuality (He's a pastor) and how the Org felt didn't vibe well. There's also some stuff about Jackson being a hypocrite in preaching one thing and doing another. After all he cheated on his wife with a stripper who tried to extort him (no a good view for a pastor) among other things. 

So now that people who may no of known the background of this why do you think fans continue to bring his name up? Is this just one of those dream scenarios people have, race maybe play part here, because he helped build the Warriors team that was successful, etc? I really don't get it as it seems like a snowballs chance in hell this guy ever coaches an NBA team again. Don't get me wrong he was a good coach but given todays climate of Politics and all I do not think anyone wants to go near this dude with a 20 inch pole and put themselves in PR nightmare. 

[mr. furley 12,297]

4 hours ago, Craig_MiamiFL said:

 

I loved that deal for them. Shocked they even got someone as useful as Covington for Capela. 

Covington is a high end defender that can defend almost every position and stick the 3. They weren't going anywhere with Capela either. They can get similar #s out of a 5 if they decided to go back to a traditional one.

feels more like they dumped Capela to go all-in on small ball thinking it would overwhelm the league and get them a title this year. a one-year shot deal.

problem, it's still the NBA and you need big guys whether teams want to or not.  Capela maybe doesn't push them over the top vs. the Lakers, but maybe if he's not the only guy over 6'7" they're in much better shape.  he got them cheap/easy buckets instead of relying on canning 40% of 50 threes per game.

[jvdesigns2002 3,151]

5 minutes ago, mr. furley said:

feels more like they dumped Capela to go all-in on small ball thinking it would overwhelm the league and get them a title this year. a one-year shot deal.

problem, it's still the NBA and you need big guys whether teams want to or not.  Capela maybe doesn't push them over the top vs. the Lakers, but maybe if he's not the only guy over 6'7" they're in much better shape.  he got them cheap/easy buckets instead of relying on canning 40% of 50 threes per game.

Exactly this.   People can try to discount bigs all they want--but they still have a massive role in todays NBA. You think Boston would be having such a hard time with Miami if they had a more intimidating big than Theis?   Much of the reason the Nuggets got past the heavy favorite clippers is because Harrell could not match up at all with Jokic.  Three out of the final four teams left in the championship chase have legit big men.   I understand that the small ball thing is sexy--but it has vast limitations--and it's not like small ball teams have to play small ball for 48 minutes per game.  They can integrate big men into their schemes as well. 

[Chris B. 137]

Do these refs get paid per foul call? This is trash.

[The Kansas Comet 746]

Lakers are just getting punked in every way tonight.

[Desert_Power 850]

Incredible 4th Q so far.

[3 hour lunch 179]

Anthony Davis 38 minutes played and has 1 rebound? Seems impossible 

[Desert_Power 850]

Lakers really suffer at the end without another shooter. Teams will let Kuzma, Caruso, and Rondo beat them from the 3pt line.

[The Kansas Comet 746]

Kuzma finally attacks the basket hard once Murray puts the game away 

[The Kansas Comet 746]

1 minute ago, Desert_Power said:

Lakers really suffer at the end without another shooter. Teams will let Kuzma, Caruso, and Rondo beat them from the 3pt line.

That emphasizes why they need to play with more urgency on the defensive end so they can get out in transition and score that way.  

[trader jake 1,408]

We've seen Denver come back to win so many games, it was odd to see the Nuggets hold off an opponent trying to come back against them.  Great finish for Murray to put that game away.  A few of his teammates got tight and he made the winning plays to put away LA.

Edited September 23, 2020 by trader jake

[jvdesigns2002 3,151]

12 minutes ago, The Kansas Comet said:

Kuzma finally attacks the basket hard once Murray puts the game away 

I'm not sure why Vogel played Kuzma so much in the 4th. He seems like he's lost on the court. Thinking too much, hesitating--just no fluidity to his game right now. 

[trader jake 1,408]

21 minutes ago, 3 hour lunch said:

Anthony Davis 38 minutes played and has 1 rebound? Seems impossible 

AD ended the game with 2 rebounds.  He shot well tonight but that rebounding total is unacceptable from him.

[trader jake 1,408]

1 hour ago, DJackson10 said:

Legit question and this isn't political but more of opinions on why some fans are obsessed with him.

Why do fans continually bring up Mark Jackson into conversations of coaching candidates? I mean fans as the media and NBA have laid off on him for awhile. He was brought up by Bulls fans and I'd have seen several fans mention him for the 76ers too. Some legit didn't know about his comments he made though. Yes he helped build the Warrirors but my understanding is he was blackballed by the league and let go as he didn't get along with others as well as some homophobic views which many believe were directed an openly Gay Warrior member Rick Wartz at the time as well. Andre Iguodala even says he believes the former coach "who is one of my favorites ever" said Jackson was blackballed do to his views. There's some beliefs that Jackson's views on homosexuality (He's a pastor) and how the Org felt didn't vibe well. There's also some stuff about Jackson being a hypocrite in preaching one thing and doing another. After all he cheated on his wife with a stripper who tried to extort him (no a good view for a pastor) among other things. 

So now that people who may no of known the background of this why do you think fans continue to bring his name up? Is this just one of those dream scenarios people have, race maybe play part here, because he helped build the Warriors team that was successful, etc? I really don't get it as it seems like a snowballs chance in hell this guy ever coaches an NBA team again. Don't get me wrong he was a good coach but given todays climate of Politics and all I do not think anyone wants to go near this dude with a 20 inch pole and put themselves in PR nightmare. 

1 This may be the longest DJax post I've ever read.

2 A lot of good points in there, and those points cover many of the reasons why he probably shouldn't be a head coach in the NBA again.  His name getting brought up a lot doesn't mean much though, so does his announcing partner Jeff Van Gundy...and he's probably not getting a gig soon.

3 I'd like Jackson to get a head coaching job for some desperate college team  willing to pay and give him the keys to the program.  Mainly because he's a horrible announcer and would prefer he's off national television as soon as possible.

[DJackson10 3,061]

24 minutes ago, trader jake said:

1 This may be the longest DJax post I've ever read.

2 A lot of good points in there, and those points cover many of the reasons why he probably shouldn't be a head coach in the NBA again.  His name getting brought up a lot doesn't mean much though, so does his announcing partner Jeff Van Gundy...and he's probably not getting a gig soon.

3 I'd like Jackson to get a head coaching job for some desperate college team  willing to pay and give him the keys to the program.  Mainly because he's a horrible announcer and would prefer he's off national television as soon as possible.

I was more so wondering why people are obsessed with the guy. There's multiple of good reasons and probably some I forgot or didn't add to reasons why. Just wondering why Fans want him so badly because some of these same fans will be the ones who maybe don't know the reasons he's coaching blow up on a team who did hire him. 

[Rodrigo Duterte 763]

50 minutes ago, trader jake said:

1 This may be the longest DJax post I've ever read.

Say what?????

[Craig_MiamiFL 2,551]

Odds of another 3-1?

 

[Jayrod 4,512]

6 hours ago, Rodrigo Duterte said:

Say what?????

Yeah, that's actually a below average length post for him.

[mr. furley 12,297]

are the Bucks on tonight.... tomorrow???

Edited September 23, 2020 by mr. furley

[Jayrod 4,512]

Celtics will win tonight.

I'm 53.7% certain.

[trader jake 1,408]

9 hours ago, Rodrigo Duterte said:

Say what?????

That I've read.  Typically TL:DR.

3 hours ago, Jayrod said:

Yeah, that's actually a below average length post for him.

Very correct.  😆

[The Kansas Comet 746]

12 hours ago, trader jake said:

AD ended the game with 2 rebounds.  He shot well tonight but that rebounding total is unacceptable from him.

As a team the Lakers were outrebounded 44-25.  Lebron had 10 of those, which left 15 for everyone else.  Denver just flat outworked them.

[Desert_Power 850]

13 hours ago, The Kansas Comet said:

That emphasizes why they need to play with more urgency on the defensive end so they can get out in transition and score that way.  

They're just too old to play that style that got them back into the game for so long. Can't let these games get away from them.

Jokic is just so fun to watch. Doesn't seem like the Lakers have a good counter for him.

[trader jake 1,408]

21 minutes ago, Desert_Power said:

Jokic is just so fun to watch. Doesn't seem like the Lakers have a good counter for him.

??

The Lakers have Anthony Davis and LeBron James.  AD is on the all-defensive team and LBJ just finished 2nd in MVP.  LA also has two centers in Dwight Howard and JaVale McGee that can be physical with him for as many minutes as Coach Vogel deems appropriate.  That's about as much ammo as any team can reasonably have to slow down a player like Jokic.

All that said, when push comes to shove, this is the exact type of situation that Anthony Davis has to take on.  This is why he forced his way out of New Orleans, this is why LeBron did what he had to do to get him to LA, and beating Jokic head-to-head is exactly what AD will need to do if the Lakers are going to be champions this season.

[Leeroy Jenkins 2,894]

Damn that AD 3 in Game 2.

[jvdesigns2002 3,151]

I said it before in this thread and i’ll say it again. If murray/Jokic can effectively produce enough to neutralize or compete with what AD/Lebron do each game- they will have a chance to win. In game 1 Anthony Davis single handedly  scored like 5 fewer points than Jokic and Murray combined.

Game 2- a game that Denver frankly had snatched away from them due to a defensive error by Plumlee and a great shot by AD

jokic/Murray combined for 55-12-13.          Lebron/AD  57-20-6

 

Game 3- a game that Denver won but the Lakers did fight back

jokic/Murray 50-18-17                    Lebron/ad  57-12-12

The closer that Jokic and Murray match what Lebron and Ad do- the more the role players play a part in determining the outcome. I think it’s fair to say that there are more weapons on the Denver side outside of each teams big two.  Last night- AD’s stats were hollow. He did not play with the same energy and passion as jokic, Murray or Lebron. On top of that- Denver’s supporting cast played with a lot of energy- led by Grant-  who was great

 

[Desert_Power 850]

45 minutes ago, trader jake said:

??

The Lakers have Anthony Davis and LeBron James.  AD is on the all-defensive team and LBJ just finished 2nd in MVP.  LA also has two centers in Dwight Howard and JaVale McGee that can be physical with him for as many minutes as Coach Vogel deems appropriate.  That's about as much ammo as any team can reasonably have to slow down a player like Jokic.

All that said, when push comes to shove, this is the exact type of situation that Anthony Davis has to take on.  This is why he forced his way out of New Orleans, this is why LeBron did what he had to do to get him to LA, and beating Jokic head-to-head is exactly what AD will need to do if the Lakers are going to be champions this season.

That is kind of what I was getting at. If they are going to play their smaller lineups, AD has to do a lot more on the defensive end/boards.

[facook 5,419]

I'd like to congratulate the Lakers on their win in Game 7, and either the Heat or Celtics on their win in Game 7.  No way either series go less than 7, and no way the Lakers don't make the Finals.  $$$

[Kev4029 1,219]

Until the Lakers decide to start AD at center and play him there exclusively (which I don't think will happen) while completely benchingMcGee (which might happen), I think the Nuggets are the better team. 

The Lakers answer to Jokic has to be to extend him defensively and Howard/McGee just can't do that. 

 

I'm absolutely amazed at the evolution of this Nuggets team and they can basically roll it back in '21 if they want. They only decision they'll really have is how much they are willing to pay Grant (a lot) and if they should keep Millsap or Plumlee (please God let it be Millsap). With Jokic playing 40mpg in the playoffs and staying pretty fresh, I would all but punt on a center for '21 and grab an athletic rim runner from the scrap heap.

[Moe. 1,990]

How much will Grant get? 20 million a year? He’s so good. 

[DJackson10 3,061]

1 hour ago, facook said:

I'd like to congratulate the Lakers on their win in Game 7, and either the Heat or Celtics on their win in Game 7.  No way either series go less than 7, and no way the Lakers don't make the Finals.  $$$

And people call me crazy when I say this league is rigged. They will want both these series go 7 and will do whatever they can to get maybe 5-6 games out of the finals if they have too

[jvdesigns2002 3,151]

10 minutes ago, DJackson10 said:

And people call me crazy when I say this league is rigged. They will want both these series go 7 and will do whatever they can to get maybe 5-6 games out of the finals if they have too

While I do think there is a certain level of rigging done by the NBA I actually think it's far less this year than ever.  If anything the league would have salivated over a Lakers vs Clippers western confernce finals.   On the Eastern side--being that the league is driven by superstars--they would have absolutely loved to have Milwaukee in the ECF to promote Giannis.  No matter who is in the finals--the ratings are going to be bad.  Casual fans aren't going to watch.  

[wilked 2,141]

Uneven start by the Celts but at least it’s tied

 

need Jalen to stay at 2 fouls. He gets #3 too soon and it will challenge the team 

[DJackson10 3,061]

8 minutes ago, jvdesigns2002 said:

While I do think there is a certain level of rigging done by the NBA I actually think it's far less this year than ever.  If anything the league would have salivated over a Lakers vs Clippers western confernce finals.   On the Eastern side--being that the league is driven by superstars--they would have absolutely loved to have Milwaukee in the ECF to promote Giannis.  No matter who is in the finals--the ratings are going to be bad.  Casual fans aren't going to watch.  

Oh I'm not saying its close to what it was like the Kings/Lakers 01 Western Conference Finals series. 

[Jayrod 4,512]

Good grief, that was an ugly quarter for both teams.  Probably the worst basketball we've seen in this series.  Just a lot of mistakes, fumbles and missteps.  Hope it cleans up the rest of the way.  

[wilked 2,141]

Tatum looks like dog ####

[wilked 2,141]

1 minute ago, Jayrod said:

Good grief, that was an ugly quarter for both teams.  Probably the worst basketball we've seen in this series.  Just a lot of mistakes, fumbles and missteps.  Hope it cleans up the rest of the way.  

Odd half. Jimmy came out strong than disappeared. Tatum maybe as bad as I’ve ever seen him. 
 

bam and Time Lord only guys doing anything 

[Jayrod 4,512]

Celtics still look like crap.  They are playing like it is a pickup game at the Y, just jogging around and going through the motions.  Nobody tried to get that loose ball and then Herro just picks it up and hits another uncontested jumper.  Stevens needs to break out of his even keel routine and light some dudes up.  This is garbage effort for a conference finals.

ETA:  Robert Williams only reason it is somewhat close.

Edited September 24, 2020 by Jayrod

[jvdesigns2002 3,151]

13 minutes ago, Jayrod said:

Celtics still look like crap.  They are playing like it is a pickup game at the Y, just jogging around and going through the motions.  Nobody tried to get that loose ball and then Herro just picks it up and hits another uncontested jumper.  Stevens needs to break out of his even keel routine and light some dudes up.  This is garbage effort for a conference finals.

ETA:  Robert Williams only reason it is somewhat close.

Yup.  Celts look especially bad. They are lucky that Miami isn't looking super great either.  Looks like that extended layoff between games maybe took both teams out of rhythm and especially so Boston.  They win a must win game--and instead of getting to play a couple days later and capitalize on that momentum--they get forced to let the adrenaline settle back down and wait like 4 days.