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2020 NBA Playoffs Thread - Haters arguing that it took Lebron 10 Finals to win 4 titles

Capella

By Capella,
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trader jake

So is Magic Johnson.  link  He broke it down like this: "I'm so excited for Denver vs. Utah Game 7 & to see Jamal Murray vs. Donovan Mitchell! For Denver to win, Nikola Jokić, Gary Harris, Pa

Gr00vus

Two posts in and no 76er talk? That boycott was really powerful.

jvdesigns2002

Full disclosure--I think both Kawhi and Lebron  are great players and I'm not trying to hate on either of them.  With that said--I do think that even though its only been one day since the Clippers lo

DJackson10

DJackson10 2,924

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Not sure if anyone reported this but CHI gave Donovan the largest Contract in team history 4yrs 24M. 

Also according to local reporter John Clark in Philly the 76ers are intrigued by Mike DAntonio because of maybe being able to get a 34 yrs old James Harden in FA. 

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trader jake

trader jake 1,379

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5 minutes ago, DJackson10 said:

Also according to local reporter John Clark in Philly the 76ers are intrigued by Mike DAntonio because of maybe being able to get a 34 yrs old James Harden in FA. 

😆 James Harden barely moves off ball now and his defense has always been an issue.  Now imagine him at 34.  Good luck.

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jvdesigns2002

jvdesigns2002 3,138

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The last thing that Sixers need is a coach that encourages Embiid to shoot more threes--or even better yet--a coach that  will encourage the GM to give him away for a guy like Covington like he did Capela. 

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Long Ball Larry

Long Ball Larry 14,288

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On 9/23/2020 at 11:41 PM, PIK95 said:

I'm starting to think Brad is under orders from Ainge not to play Time Lord too much.  Gotta be a salary cap thing.  They know he's a stud, but can't pay him max money.  That the only thing that explains his handling of Time Lord this series.

max money, lol

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jvdesigns2002

jvdesigns2002 3,138

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25 minutes ago, The Z Machine said:

Yes. 

No. I think the Lakers would be the favorite--but the Heat are really good.   I'm not sure if anybody in here is a fan of some weird stats--and I'll probalby get made fun of for these--but I found them interesting.  Lebron and Jimmy Butler have played each other 34 times including the playoffs--they are 17-17 against each other.  Spoelstra and Vogel have coached each other 50 time in their careers in the NBA including the playoffs--spoelstra has won 26 of those games, Vogel 24.   If there ever was a big that could match up decent against AD--it's Bam.  The Heat can throw Butler, Crowder, Derick Jones and Iggy against Lebron.   Olynk and Meyers Leonard can pull guys like Howard and McGee away from the hoop.   Dragic, Herro, Nunn, and Robinson are all guys that can give Miami a spark.   If that ends up being the finals--and both teams play well--I'd expect it to be a really good series. 

 

Just realized that i somehow replied to the wrong post--was meaning to reply to the post that you replied to. My apologies for the confusion. 

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Jayrod

Jayrod 4,326

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Now they are playing some good basketball.

Probably too late, but at least they aren't going down without a fight.

Then again I may have just jinxed them and they'll collapse in the 4th quarter.

Edited by Jayrod
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SoBeDad

SoBeDad 2,244

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44 minutes ago, Jayrod said:

Woot.  Finished strong.  One more win just to make it interesting.

The Celtics have to feel good about the way they played in the 2nd half. They were more aggressive and the Heat missed too many open shots. Not sure if Bam was 100%. 

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PIK95

PIK95 3,073

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14 hours ago, Zigg said:

No idea who time lord is, but is that a real nickname? Seems like a terrible name by locals that everyone else realizes is awful. 

I'll bite.  You get drafted way lower than you should have, because of chronic lateness and other questions.  On your first day, you miss the Flight from Texas to Boston, which in turn makes you miss your introductory press conference.  Then when you finally arrive, you over sleep and miss your introductory team meeting the day after.  At this time, the whispers of a "Time Lord" nickname surface, and Celtics nation laughs in unison. Danny Ainge talks about the nickname on a radio show, and asks everyone to cut it out and stop calling him Time Lord.  Naturally, that just makes it stick.  In his first season he has a monster swat on Anthony Davis, and the Time Lord Memes are everywhere.

  The best part is Robert Williams has seemed to turn around his issues, he never complained about the hazing, and actually shows huge baller potential.  Now we call him Time Lord with love.  I think that's everything.

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PIK95

PIK95 3,073

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9 hours ago, SoBeDad said:

The Celtics have to feel good about the way they played in the 2nd half. They were more aggressive and the Heat missed too many open shots. Not sure if Bam was 100%. 

Kanter changed the game.  I love Theis, but this matchup has been rough foe him, especially on the boards and defending the Bam role. I was calling for Robert Williams, but Kanter ended up doing the same thing and that really helped.  THE Celtics need that high pick and roll to work, and the Heat were switching and shutting it down.  Kanter helped that and more importantly, cleaned the glass.  That took pressure off the shooters and that part showed in the third quarter.  Good game.  Hope Brad does it again.

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DJackson10

DJackson10 2,924

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On 9/25/2020 at 12:27 PM, trader jake said:

😆 James Harden barely moves off ball now and his defense has always been an issue.  Now imagine him at 34.  Good luck.

I just don't see what people see that is so special about Mike DAntonio. It's not just that stuff but the constant flopping he does as well. Just imagine how bad that's gonna get at age 34

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Chris B.

Chris B. 137

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12 minutes ago, Judge Smails said:

I used to be the biggest Dwight Howard hater. Much respect in this second go round with the Lakers. I could see them losing this series without him 

True. He's been good all year in the absence of Demarcus Cousins.

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The Kansas Comet

The Kansas Comet 743

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1 hour ago, Judge Smails said:

I used to be the biggest Dwight Howard hater. Much respect in this second go round with the Lakers. I could see them losing this series without him 

Me too.  One of the storylines I've loved this year is how he has worked to just fit in and be a role player.  He was a key part of the Lakers' success against Denver once he stopped trying to punk Jokic and just focused on doing his job.


Props to the Nuggets in these playoffs.  That was as much of a grind as a 4-1 series win could be.  Such a fun, mentally tough squad to watch.  They have some really nice pieces in place to be a significant contender for the foreseeable future.  

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modogg

modogg 4,700

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1 hour ago, Craig_MiamiFL said:

JIMMY AND THE SCRUBS!!!!!!!!!!!*

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

*excludes present and future all stars in bam and superherro

man is he ever making the T-Wolves and Sixers look dumb right now. 

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Craig_MiamiFL

Craig_MiamiFL 2,478

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Just now, modogg said:

lol, so quiet in here when the Celtics lose. have to think this year was their best chance at a championship, my guess is they got close enough they will keep with the basic same team and rest in mediocrity. 

 

 

Interesting. JMO I think the Celtics are arguably the best set franchise long term in the NBA.

I think they've got a bunch of young pieces outside Tatum/Brown with potential to be solid contributors. I'm particularly interested to see how Time Lord continues to progress. Bam absolutely destroyed the Celts this series. Unfortunately Stevens didn't feel Time Lord has ready for that challenge.

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modogg

modogg 4,700

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1 minute ago, Craig_MiamiFL said:

Interesting. JMO I think the Celtics are arguably the best set franchise long term in the NBA.

I think they've got a bunch of young pieces outside Tatum/Brown with potential to be solid contributors. I'm particularly interested to see how Time Lord continues to progress. Bam absolutely destroyed the Celts this series. Unfortunately Stevens didn't feel Time Lord has ready for that challenge.

maybe. lot of young pieces will be expensive soon. and Time Lord is good, but get a motivated, well-coached Embiid, or Bam, and they will lose that series. they are low on extra resources so getting young talent will be tougher. and i don't know how financially they will be able to keep things up for a few years

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Ghost Rider

Ghost Rider 6,204

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14 minutes ago, Craig_MiamiFL said:

Interesting. JMO I think the Celtics are arguably the best set franchise long term in the NBA.

I think they've got a bunch of young pieces outside Tatum/Brown with potential to be solid contributors. I'm particularly interested to see how Time Lord continues to progress. Bam absolutely destroyed the Celts this series. Unfortunately Stevens didn't feel Time Lord has ready for that challenge.

Hasn't that been said about the Celtics for like 3-4 years now? 

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Sudoku_in_the_Bathtub

Sudoku_in_the_Bathtub 69

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49 minutes ago, Craig_MiamiFL said:

Interesting. JMO I think the Celtics are arguably the best set franchise long term in the NBA.

I think they've got a bunch of young pieces outside Tatum/Brown with potential to be solid contributors. I'm particularly interested to see how Time Lord continues to progress. Bam absolutely destroyed the Celts this series. Unfortunately Stevens didn't feel Time Lord has ready for that challenge.

:goodposting:

Lot to build on.

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jvdesigns2002

jvdesigns2002 3,138

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1 hour ago, Craig_MiamiFL said:

Interesting. JMO I think the Celtics are arguably the best set franchise long term in the NBA.

I think they've got a bunch of young pieces outside Tatum/Brown with potential to be solid contributors. I'm particularly interested to see how Time Lord continues to progress. Bam absolutely destroyed the Celts this series. Unfortunately Stevens didn't feel Time Lord has ready for that challenge.

I agree and disagree with you at the same time. I agree that they have the pieces required to be solid for years to come.  However--if by 'best set franchises" you mean true title contenders--I feel like I'd have to give you some resistance there.  The recent Celtics have always had a very decent amount of talent. From Kyrie, horford and crew--to now Tatum, Brown, Kemba, Hayward and others--an abundance of talent has never been their problem.  Their biggest problem has been that they basically have no real identity and are unable to put their stamp on a game.  Small ball and analytical basketball can win you lots of games in the regular season and it can win you lots of games in the first and second rounds--but it's very hard to win a championship with that kind of ball. 

D'antoni made the small ball three point shot or layup thing very popular.  He had a team with Nash, Amare, Joe Johnson, Shawn Marion, Jason Richardson and others all in their primes--and he couldn't win a title with them.   Small ball can win you titles if you happen to have at least a couple of the best long distance and quick release shooters in the history of the league on the same team like Golden State did.   You add a 7 footer in KD that is also a historically great shooter to that mix--you get even better.  Aside from that--small ball hasn't really been successful in winning championships.  Boston has a plethora of solid shooters--but none of them are close to being historically good. 

If you look at Boston play--they do not utilize their talent collectively. They take turns individually on the offensive end.  Sometimes it's watching Tatum dribble the ball for 20 seconds and end up taking a step back three, or Brown creating something for himself off of penetration.  They don't do a great job moving off the ball even though they are more than capable of doing it.  Stevens is great at coming up with inbouding schemes/plays at the end of quarters off of timeouts and such--but he doesn't seem to create a system where the individual talents of each player are magnified in a collective form.  Unless they work on creating a system and creating an identity--they will end up being a good team that never really makes it to the promiseland. The downside to that is that it generally results in being in basketball purgatory after a few years.  You never get great draft picks and eventually your star players get tired of never breaking through and end up leaving.  

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trader jake

trader jake 1,379

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9 hours ago, modogg said:

lol, so quiet in here when the Celtics lose. have to think this year was their best chance at a championship, my guess is they got close enough they will keep with the basic same team and rest in mediocrity. 

With talented teams like Golden State and Brooklyn out of the running, this may have been the best shot for a lot of teams to win a title.  That certainly includes the Heat and probably the Lakers as well.

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Anarchy99

Anarchy99 6,137

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The Celtics of the past few years really didn't get enough from their big acquisitions. Horford was overpaid for what he delivered. Hayward and Kyrie were hurt and struggled to stay on the court. Kemba was solid this year, but seemed like he came up small at the worst times. Who knows which stats matter and which ones don't, but net scoring per 100 possessions in the regular season :

RWilliams +36
Theis +25
Kanter +19
Hayward +9
Wanamaker +6
Tatum +5
Ojeleye +5
Walker +4
Green +4
Smart +3
Brown +2
GWililams -4

Based on that, it certainly appears their three headed hydra of bigs was not the liability that many people have suggested.

The C's suffered from completely getting out of their offense in crunch time, chucking up too many threes, not getting back on defense, and committing too many fouls. To me, it seemed like they got one offensive foul called on opponents for every 12 times they tried to draw a charge. Just play defense instead of trying to get a call. 

While Tatum certainly flashed superstar caliber skills at times, he also did not appear to be a guy that could play iso ball in the last few minutes. Too many times he held the ball until there were two seconds left on the shot clock and tried bombing a three or bailed and passed and forced someone else to shoot with 0.5 on the shot clock. He also had some spotty first halves and some games with a bunch of late turnovers. Maybe he can play like he does in most of the second half throughout the game and in crunch time.

Who knows if the core of Tatum / Brown / Smart / Walker can play better and work on closing out games. Brown is signed for 4 more years, Kemba for 3, and Smart for 2. Tatum will get a max deal, but he is under team control for 2 more years. They can pay for most of that by giving him what they are paying Hayward now. They won't be able to make major changes without a trade, so they will either have to develop someone for within or get other small pieces that might fit.

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dawgtrails

dawgtrails 732

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9 hours ago, Ghost Rider said:

Hasn't that been said about the Celtics for like 3-4 years now? 

Tough crowd. They have been to 3 eastern conference finals in the past 4 years. And made a semi-finals appearance the other year. And their two best players are 22, and 23 years old. 

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Ghost Rider

Ghost Rider 6,204

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3 minutes ago, dawgtrails said:

Tough crowd. They have been to 3 eastern conference finals in the past 4 years. And made a semi-finals appearance the other year. And their two best players are 22, and 23 years old. 

I hear ya, but are they going to get over the hump at some point or are they going to be the mid 2000's Phoenix Suns? 

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