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How Much Voter Fraud Happened In 2020? (6 Viewers)

How much voter fraud do you think happened in 2020?

  • I voted for Biden and I think Voter Fraud was rampant - enough to impact the outcome.

    Votes: 8 1.7%

  • I voted for Biden and I think Voter Fraud was real - enough to maybe impact the outcome.

    Votes: 4 0.8%

  • I voted for Biden and I think Voter Fraud was minimal - not enough to make a real impact

    Votes: 65 13.7%

  • I voted for Biden and I think Voter Fraud was virtually non existent - no impact at all

    Votes: 269 56.9%

  • I voted for Trump and I think Voter Fraud was rampant - enough to impact the outcome.

    Votes: 26 5.5%

  • I voted for Trump and I think Voter Fraud was real - enough to maybe impact the outcome.

    Votes: 23 4.9%

  • I voted for Trump and I think Voter Fraud was minimal - not enough to make a real impact

    Votes: 14 3.0%

  • I voted for Trump and I think Voter Fraud was virtually non existent - no impact at all

    Votes: 8 1.7%

  • I voted for a 3rd party or didn't vote and I think Voter Fraud was rampant - enough to impact the ou

    Votes: 7 1.5%

  • I voted for a 3rd party or didn't vote and I think Voter Fraud was real - enough to maybe impact the

    Votes: 11 2.3%

  • I voted for a 3rd party or didn't vote and I think Voter Fraud was minimal - not enough to make a re

    Votes: 20 4.2%

  • I voted for a 3rd party or didn't vote and I think Voter Fraud was virtually non existent - no impac

    Votes: 18 3.8%
  • Total voters
    473
Blinky the Three Eyed Fish said:
The argument will most likely be that since there is no way to tell what ballots were altered, came in past the deadline, or were covertly added in in the middle of the night that all the mail in ballots counted post Election Day should be tossed. That would be a radical decision which I don’t think they will make, but that seems to be the legal arguments they are preparing to make. 
Click to expand...
Impossible.  There is no way a court would rule to invalidate a significant portion of PA's population's right to cast a ballot without specific evidence of which to throw out.  If they are talking about the ones postmarked after 11/3, those have already been separated and represent less than 10K votes anyway so it won't matter for the end result.

 
gianmarco said:
Even if they throw out PA (which will never happen), Biden still wins.

I have no idea how they'd figure out WHICH tens of thousands of "illegal" votes to discredit.  I still don't even understand what they are trying to allege. 

A link to any of these stories would help to clarify this.  Not blaming you for the misunderstanding as I think it's just the nonsense of it all that is making it difficult to follow.
Click to expand...
Here is one of the articles. LINK

 
gianmarco said:
Impossible.  There is no way a court would rule to invalidate a significant portion of PA's population's right to cast a ballot without specific evidence of which to throw out.  If they are talking about the ones postmarked after 11/3, those have already been separated and represent less than 10K votes anyway so it won't matter for the end result.
Click to expand...
Just to clarify, I am not supporting Trump and in no way, shape, or form do I think he stands a chance at this point. I was only discussing what some of the conservative reporting sites are saying, who they are talking to, and what some of the GOP people or attorneys have said about their legal strategy. 

 
Blinky the Three Eyed Fish said:
Just to clarify, I am not supporting Trump and in no way, shape, or form do I think he stands a chance at this point. I was only discussing what some of the conservative reporting sites are saying, who they are talking to, and what some of the GOP people or attorneys have said about their legal strategy. 
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Oh, I know.  That's why I said I don't blame you at all for the confusion.  I just wanted to read what these claims were (if it's a legitimate site reporting them).  If you're seeing this over at OAN or Brietbart, don't bother with the links. 

I appreciate you posting this stuff.

 
Blinky the Three Eyed Fish said:
The argument will most likely be that since there is no way to tell what ballots were altered, came in past the deadline, or were covertly added in in the middle of the night that all the mail in ballots counted post Election Day should be tossed.
Click to expand...
I would bet money, even though I can't quote the specific protocols, that at no point were ballots left unwatched so that ballots were added in the middle of the night.

Otherwise, this falls under "proving a negative" -- "Prove the ballots were not altered!" "Prove that ballots weren't added in the middle of the night!"

 
gianmarco said:
If they are talking about the ones postmarked after 11/3, those have already been separated and represent less than 10K votes anyway so it won't matter for the end result.
Click to expand...
Quick point: The ballots that were postmarked on or before 11/3, but arrived after 5 p.m. 11/3 and before 5 p.m. 11/6, have been separated.

 
Blinky the Three Eyed Fish said:
After making the rounds again (TV/websites/Twitter), oddly enough the GOP seems most confident they will win PA. One of their legal arguments is that in-person voters were treated differently than mail in voters. They allege people that had ballot issues were contacted to come in and correct them but in person voters were not. So they are insisting that process of inequality is unconstitutional. 

They have other assertions that some of the ballots were opened before Election Day and people were called to correct them BEFORE 11/3. They also allege ballots received 11/4 and after were commingled, so there will be tens of thousands of ballots disallowed. 

They also have other smaller issues with dead people voting and processors being told to add or change dates. But those are mostly to frame that there were multiple illegal things going on. 

I have no idea if any of those have legs, but the people communicating all that seem pretty confident they will win PA in court. 

ETA that they also say security measures in person were way stricter than by mail, and that is also not constitutional (or so they allege).
Click to expand...
Well that's something.... Considering the GOP sued my county in PA (Montgomery) last Tuesday for allowing people to cure their ballots in real time during in-person voting. They lost of course. Just an interesting development for sure.

 
it seems Biden's camp has largely taken the high road on the fraud stuff so far, but this implication that all of the 'rigging' came from the Democrats is preposterous. I'm hoping that Joe at least has some people investigating voter fraud from the other side so he can fight fire with fire if it comes to it.

not that I'm wishing for this. it would obviously be better for everyone if we can just drop it and move forward.

 
The Commish said:
Forgive me as I haven't followed any of this all that closely, but the 10,000 foot view is:

1.  Guy makes claims off the record of x,y,z fraud etc.
2.  He's interviewed by law enforcement and says he takes it back.
3.  Once law enforcement is gone he then goes back to the claims and says he didn't say he took it back.

That about right?
Click to expand...
Yes and then they said they would release the audio to prove he was coerced into recanting. As far as I’ve seen they released about 10 seconds of audio where the investigator tells him he’s going to be questioned throughly to make sure he’s being honest and that sometimes these interrogations can be scary. Imo if they had anything, they would release the whole interview.

 
Football Jones said:
This isn't looking good. I ask you guys to take off the rose colored glasses & reflect on the possibility there was election fraud.

So much smoke there's now a fire.

We need to find out the truth.
Click to expand...
We are finding out the truth, all these allegations are being taken to court.

 
Maik Jeaunz said:
it seems Biden's camp has largely taken the high road on the fraud stuff so far, but this implication that all of the 'rigging' came from the Democrats is preposterous. I'm hoping that Joe at least has some people investigating voter fraud from the other side so he can fight fire with fire if it comes to it.

not that I'm wishing for this. it would obviously be better for everyone if we can just drop it and move forward.
Click to expand...
I find the VERY RECENT switch to the high road from the non stop slander and hyperbolic emotional outrage to be incredibly disingenuous and insulting. 

This fictional moral high ground is solely based on the emotions of quite possibly the softest generation in human existence.  

All the republicans are asking for is to make sure all the votes are legal and there’s no shenanigans. Once again, the dems want to skirt the law and procedure and just claim the bad orange man that hurts your feelings should just bow down cause that’s what everyone you know says. 
 

70+ million people voted for Trump

70+ million people voted for Biden. 
 

Lets just so a little math first. That’s all. No outrage. Nobody is getting hurt. The businesses are safe. No car dealerships have been harmed. 
 

GL!

 
fissure man said:
I find the VERY RECENT switch to the high road from the non stop slander and hyperbolic emotional outrage to be incredibly disingenuous and insulting. 

This fictional moral high ground is solely based on the emotions of quite possibly the softest generation in human existence.  

All the republicans are asking for is to make sure all the votes are legal and there’s no shenanigans. Once again, the dems want to skirt the law and procedure and just claim the bad orange man that hurts your feelings should just bow down cause that’s what everyone you know says. 
 

70+ million people voted for Trump

70+ million people voted for Biden. 
 

Lets just so a little math first. That’s all. No outrage. Nobody is getting hurt. The businesses are safe. No car dealerships have been harmed. 
 

GL!
Click to expand...
The problem is, the claims of fraud were the jumping off point. That's not an impartial request to validate the results. Few are saying we shouldn't validate results. Most are saying it is wrong to begin with an assumption of fraud - and only then in the cases where the Republican candidate lost. That's not an objective search for truth, that's a partisan attempt to influence the result of the election.

 
Sea Duck said:
I agree that it isn't looking good. For Republicans.

They've been laughed out of court in every case they've brought so far. 0-for-10 the last I checked.
Click to expand...
If the evidence of fraud is strong, there's a million dynamics that could play out. Some of which are ugly.

Long, LONG way from over looks like.

If the evidence isn't there, then I will support a Biden presidency. You won't hear any "not my President" nonsense from me (or most conservatives).

 
Gr00vus said:
The problem is, the claims of fraud were the jumping off point. That's not an impartial request to validate the results. Few are saying we shouldn't validate results. Most are saying it is wrong to begin with an assumption of fraud - and only then in the cases where the Republican candidate lost. That's not an objective search for truth, that's a partisan attempt to influence the result of the election.
Click to expand...
All I’ve seen is the media declare Biden and say that Trump is just talking baseless claims and he’s a troll for questioning the hearts and minds of random people. He should just concede and he’s an awful person for messing with the sanctity of the transition of power. Lol more hyperbole based on visceral emotions. 
 

All I’m seeing from the Republicans is them saying the mail in ballets are of concern, upwards of 500k ballet weren’t reviewed properly. 

I don’t know if any of it is true, untrue, frivolous or not- but I’m willing to wait to find out. I don’t think it will change the election but I can’t say for sure. 
 

I don’t think it’s right for people to raise their nose at the system just because it serves the outcome they want. Im interested in what’s right, that’s it. 

 
Doug B said:
And further: none of these 16 have even gotten to trial, right? It's basically Roger Federer swatting away a bunch of serves from a beginner, over and over and over.
Click to expand...
Then what’s with all the outrage? Sounds like the left has nothing to worry about. 

 
Football Jones said:
Sea Duck said:
I agree that it isn't looking good. For Republicans.

They've been laughed out of court in every case they've brought so far. 0-for-10 the last I checked.
Click to expand...
If the evidence of fraud is strong, there's a million dynamics that could play out. Some of which are ugly.

Long, LONG way from over looks like.
Click to expand...
The Trump campaign hasn't presented any viable evidence in court. They are 0-for-16 and counting.

I agree that it's a long way from being over, but that's purely due to chronological happenstance.

 
fissure man said:
Doug B said:
And further: none of these 16 have even gotten to trial, right? It's basically Roger Federer swatting away a bunch of serves from a beginner, over and over and over.
Click to expand...
Then what’s with all the outrage?
Click to expand...
It seems to be less outrage and more sadness that America has turned into a country where sore losers can complain their way to victory. We used to be better than that.

 
fissure man said:
I find the VERY RECENT switch to the high road from the non stop slander and hyperbolic emotional outrage to be incredibly disingenuous and insulting. 

This fictional moral high ground is solely based on the emotions of quite possibly the softest generation in human existence.  

All the republicans are asking for is to make sure all the votes are legal and there’s no shenanigans. Once again, the dems want to skirt the law and procedure and just claim the bad orange man that hurts your feelings should just bow down cause that’s what everyone you know says. 
 

70+ million people voted for Trump

70+ million people voted for Biden. 
 

Lets just so a little math first. That’s all. No outrage. Nobody is getting hurt. The businesses are safe. No car dealerships have been harmed. 
 

GL!
Click to expand...
Somebody had to say it. Disingenuous doesn't even do it justice. I had to snicker when I saw the first thread on it in here (even though I know JB was genuine about it).

Now the Dems are wanting to shake hands? Riiiiiight, LOL. You guys created the rules during the last cycle. Now you have to play by them. It's akin to getting punched in the mouth, not punching back, then the guy asking to shake your hand. :)

MAYBE we can shake hands in 24, but from the looks of what's going on right now with legit fraud allegations, we could be in some real ****. 

I'm a "hope cooler heads prevail guy" (I have two grandkids), but turning your cheek doesn't apply in some situations. That's what we're faced with now. If you're so inclined, you might want to hit your knees & pray. We're at a significant crossroads right now.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
cashman88 said:
Trump’s press secretary says they have 11K fraud incident reports and 500 affidavits thus far. I think Trump will be able to provide enough evidence of fraud to get past summary judgment. But the alleged fraud will be de minimus and Trump will ultimately lose because he can’t prove enough fraud happened to change the outcome.

The problem for Biden is that this whole process is loosely structured and the rules are vague. Trump will exploit that.

This won’t be finished until mid-December. 
Click to expand...
I'd be tempted to tell Biden and the Dems to go on the offensive and do the same in NC and FL but I think what the Republicans are doing is asinine so I'll just hope this gets resolved quickly.

 
fissure man said:
All I’ve seen is the media declare Biden and say that Trump is just talking baseless claims and he’s a troll for questioning the hearts and minds of random people. He should just concede and he’s an awful person for messing with the sanctity of the transition of power. Lol more hyperbole based on visceral emotions. 
 

All I’m seeing from the Republicans is them saying the mail in ballets are of concern, upwards of 500k ballet weren’t reviewed properly. 

I don’t know if any of it is true, untrue, frivolous or not- but I’m willing to wait to find out. I don’t think it will change the election but I can’t say for sure. 
 

I don’t think it’s right for people to raise their nose at the system just because it serves the outcome they want. Im interested in what’s right, that’s it. 
Click to expand...
Trump's been declaring fraud since 2015. He's been selling that "emotional and visceral" response to the prospect that he may lose since the inception of his candidacy. A lot of his voting base has bought in, based on his insistence with little to no evidence to support that. That is not a good faith approach to participating in the election process. Candidates are within their rights to request verification. Once they and their supporters insist fraud has occurred before finding evidence and trying the evidence, as Trump and his supporters are doing, they've left the "reasonable challenge" realm and entered the world of illicit attempts to force the outcome they desire on everyone else. That is not acceptable and is not reasonable.

Your attempt to spin this as reasonable, objective inquiry into the veracity of election results rings very hollow against that backdrop.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Football Jones said:
Somebody had to say it. Disingenuous doesn't even do it justice. I had to snicker when I saw the first thread on it in here.

Now the Dems are wanting to shake hands? Riiiiiight, LOL. You guys created the rules during the last cycle. Now you have to play by them. It's akin to getting punched in the mouth, not punching back, then the guy asking to shake your hand. :)

MAYBE we can shake hands in 24, but from the looks of what's going on right now with legit fraud allegations, we could be in some real ****. 

I'm a "hope cooler heads prevail guy" (I have two grandkids), but turning your cheek doesn't apply in some situations. That's what we're faced with now. If you're so inclined, you might want to hit your knees & pray. We're at a significant crossroads right now.
Click to expand...
ooooops

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/11/11/trump-lawyers-suffer-embarrassing-rebukes-judges-over-voter-fraud-claims/

 
Maik Jeaunz said:
it seems Biden's camp has largely taken the high road on the fraud stuff so far, but this implication that all of the 'rigging' came from the Democrats is preposterous. I'm hoping that Joe at least has some people investigating voter fraud from the other side so he can fight fire with fire if it comes to it.

not that I'm wishing for this. it would obviously be better for everyone if we can just drop it and move forward.
Click to expand...
What's so rich about this is the comments about 4 years of not accepting the results of the last election and all they've done for a week is not accept this one.  Nice job fellas!

 
Football Jones said:
I just want to the truth to come out regarding any potential fraud.

I'm assuming all the evidence will be presented in time.

Unfortunately, we may have to play the long game.
Click to expand...
If given the option of Biden won honestly or Trump wins by making things up and wins dishonestly, which would you choose?

 
Football Jones said:
Disingenuous doesn't even do it justice.
Click to expand...
Judge: Are your observers in the counting room?

Trump Lawyer: [pause] There's.....a non-zero number of people in the room.

Judge: [frustrated] I'm asking you, as a member of the bar of this court: are people representing Donald J. Trump For President, representing the plaintiffs, in that room?

Trump Lawyer: [pause] Yes.

Judge: I'm sorry, then what's your problem?

Case dismissed!

 
I can only hope that "red herrings" we keep hearing about never surface such as...

-If there are really mail in votes where only Joe's name alone are on them, produce them. In an era of social media where if a person leaves a big tip dining out, they put the receipt up on social media or vice versa to shame someone if they didn't tip...you're telling me nobody could produce or reveal on the internet a sample ballot from one of these Biden-Only ballots if the thing even exists? i mention it because Fox News host, think her initials are MB had a Trump Lawyer on and she said the things I am posting. Biden only ballots...where are they? if they don't exist then she should be brought up on slander/libel charges immediately, Trump can then commute her sentence before he leaves office. Should he just let ALL the Criminals out of jail? Imagine the list of folks he wants to pardon before he exits. 

-How about any mail in votes from people who are no longer with us or DEAD, did they find any of those? That would be the next smoking gun if you will and I haven't seen hard evidence of any of this. 

I bring these two up BECAUSE if they have these things and somehow beyond a miracle keep it a secret until they walk into Court...it's not going to happen is my point. But if they had real evidence of it, then and only then could you start to build a case around where I could see them asking somehow someway to throw out all Mail In Votes...the only way they can change the election is to somehow count only the in person votes and I just cannot see that happening. It won't. 

I'd also like to make a point for this group and that is when you look at the voting in here and the number of folks vote Biden over Trump it's about 5:1, it's not a very good representation of what it's truly like across the States an d I don't believe you will see many GOP want to discuss much with you and that means you will simply be carrying on a one sided debate and I think you're going to get a biased POV of the country. Good luck and I won't be surprised when you find yourself in shock in another 4 years all over again. There's far worse than Trump out there, imagine someone who thinks like he does but can blend him/her self in with the rest of society. A true Sociopath the likes you haven't quite seen yet because if you believe the GOP will roll back to Rubio/Bush sort of speak, I have news for you. 

Quite a Utopia you all have managed to create for yourselves, full steam ahead!

 
fissure man said:
All I’ve seen is the media declare Biden and say that Trump is just talking baseless claims and he’s a troll for questioning the hearts and minds of random people. He should just concede and he’s an awful person for messing with the sanctity of the transition of power. Lol more hyperbole based on visceral emotions. 
 

All I’m seeing from the Republicans is them saying the mail in ballets are of concern, upwards of 500k ballet weren’t reviewed properly. 

I don’t know if any of it is true, untrue, frivolous or not- but I’m willing to wait to find out. I don’t think it will change the election but I can’t say for sure. 
 

I don’t think it’s right for people to raise their nose at the system just because it serves the outcome they want. Im interested in what’s right, that’s it. 
Click to expand...
Your version of what is happening just isn't true.

 
Sea Duck said:
Judge: Are your observers in the counting room?

Trump Lawyer: [pause] There's.....a non-zero number of people in the room.

Judge: [frustrated] I'm asking you, as a member of the bar of this court: are people representing Donald J. Trump For President, representing the plaintiffs, in that room?

Trump Lawyer: [pause] Yes.

Judge: I'm sorry, then what's your problem?

Case dismissed!
Click to expand...
LOL. I'm not talking about fraud allegations when I mentioned being disingenuous.

Now, as far as the fraud allegations, you have a lot of catching up to do.

Like I said, looks like we're going to have to play the long game to uncover any potential fraud (unfortunately).

 
Football Jones said:
This isn't looking good. I ask you guys to take off the rose colored glasses & reflect on the possibility there was election fraud.

So much smoke there's now a fire.

We need to find out the truth.
Click to expand...
Then provide actual examples rather than this vague thing...I mean actual examples.  

Id ask you to look beyond your feelings towards Trump and understand what voter fraud really is to make such a claim.

Thus far...not really any smoke or fire that I have seen from any legitimate source.

 
Ministry of Pain said:
I can only hope that "red herrings" we keep hearing about never surface such as...

-If there are really mail in votes where only Joe's name alone are on them, produce them. In an era of social media where if a person leaves a big tip dining out, they put the receipt up on social media or vice versa to shame someone if they didn't tip...you're telling me nobody could produce or reveal on the internet a sample ballot from one of these Biden-Only ballots if the thing even exists? i mention it because Fox News host, think her initials are MB had a Trump Lawyer on and she said the things I am posting. Biden only ballots...where are they? if they don't exist then she should be brought up on slander/libel charges immediately, Trump can then commute her sentence before he leaves office. Should he just let ALL the Criminals out of jail? Imagine the list of folks he wants to pardon before he exits. 
Click to expand...
The Trump lawyer was promoting a false narrative that had already been debunked: https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2020/11/04/fact-check-typo-led-false-post-michigan-votes-biden/6164385002/

The sad thing is that Trump supporters are still promoting the fake news a week later.

But this isn't really a case of slander or libel because the lawyer can just point to Twitter and say "I saw it there" and he's off the hook.

 
fissure man said:
Then what’s with all the outrage? Sounds like the left has nothing to worry about. 
Click to expand...
Because the throwing out random claims and assertions without any evidence is a dangerous precedent.  Because its not good for the Republic or normal at all.  Because its delaying things getting done the way they should to ensure a proper and peaceful transition of power.

 
AAABatteries said:
Your version of what is happening just isn't true.
Click to expand...
You are aware that you guys don’t actually have the force, right? Some of us aren’t dumb enough to to just parrot what’s told to ya and we’ll abide. 
 

We like to use things called facts, not emotion. 
 

If all the votes are checked and Biden wins I will support the POTUS. 
 

If all the votes are checked and Trump is completely wrong and it was all nonsense then I will denounce it. 
 

This isn’t hard for half of us. Again, we aren’t the one burning #### down when things don’t go our way. 

 
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