Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
Rite Aid told my wife she needs something from her doctor to show immunocompromised in order to receive her third Moderna dose pre-8months.
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Will you get a Covid vaccine when available? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter gianmarco
- Start date
Rite Aid told my wife she needs something from her doctor to show immunocompromised in order to receive her third Moderna dose pre-8months.
BigJim®
Footballguy
Hmm, so the immuno 3rd Moderna is being given, but the booster 3rd to others is on hold?
Jayrod
Footballguy
So I've had a difficult and interesting vaccine journey over the past week.
My uncle, who was 69, overweight and an anti-vaccine right wing nut, died of COVID last Thursday.
I made a long post (for me anyway) on Facebook about vaccines being safer than COVID and put forth some arguments refuting the "long-term side effects" argument. I basically implored people to actually talk to their doctor and simply take their advice. It fueled some blowback from the anti-vax crowd, which included my sister.
My sister and I are close, so I eventually had a conversation with her via text about it. Come to find out she has some antibodies and doesn't feel like she needs the vaccine. Yet her post said "I asked a doctor and he said not to take it".
Now come to find out, it wasn't "her" doctor but a friend's dad who was a doctor. And what he told her friend was that if you have anti-bodies already, those are better than what the vaccine could do and you didn't need the vaccine then. I basically told her she had to clarify her statement, which she did.
Yet for some reason, she felt like I was being rude for making people who didn't get the vaccine feel like they are stupid. I didn't point out that her half/truth could potentially cost someone their life.
I'm contemplating a "clarifying post" that basically says that if you think the vaccine is more dangerous than the disease than you ARE stupid at this point. Arguing which form of immunity is more effective may have merit and the need to double up with natural antibodies plus the vaccine may be overkill and a more balanced risk/reward scenario. But for someone who has never had COVID to continue to refuse the vaccine is completely asinine. Especially if you or someone in your household has any sort of high-risk factor like heart/lung issues or obesity. Just plain stupid. I now personally know 2 people who have DIED and would have most likely lived had they gotten the vaccine.
My uncle, who was 69, overweight and an anti-vaccine right wing nut, died of COVID last Thursday.
I made a long post (for me anyway) on Facebook about vaccines being safer than COVID and put forth some arguments refuting the "long-term side effects" argument. I basically implored people to actually talk to their doctor and simply take their advice. It fueled some blowback from the anti-vax crowd, which included my sister.
My sister and I are close, so I eventually had a conversation with her via text about it. Come to find out she has some antibodies and doesn't feel like she needs the vaccine. Yet her post said "I asked a doctor and he said not to take it".
Now come to find out, it wasn't "her" doctor but a friend's dad who was a doctor. And what he told her friend was that if you have anti-bodies already, those are better than what the vaccine could do and you didn't need the vaccine then. I basically told her she had to clarify her statement, which she did.
Yet for some reason, she felt like I was being rude for making people who didn't get the vaccine feel like they are stupid. I didn't point out that her half/truth could potentially cost someone their life.
I'm contemplating a "clarifying post" that basically says that if you think the vaccine is more dangerous than the disease than you ARE stupid at this point. Arguing which form of immunity is more effective may have merit and the need to double up with natural antibodies plus the vaccine may be overkill and a more balanced risk/reward scenario. But for someone who has never had COVID to continue to refuse the vaccine is completely asinine. Especially if you or someone in your household has any sort of high-risk factor like heart/lung issues or obesity. Just plain stupid. I now personally know 2 people who have DIED and would have most likely lived had they gotten the vaccine.
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
Yes, I understand. It is critically important that everybody else take all possible actions to slow down the spread of covid-19, except for people who work in this one particular industry who get a pass because of reasons.
Sorry, not buying it. Nurses should be required to get vaccinated, along with teachers, nursing home workers, and other folks who work in close proximity to vulnerable populations. (I don't think kids are actually a "vulnerable population" so if you want to take teachers off the list, that's fine, but then lets stop freaking out about in-person schooling.) If people switch careers because of that, fine. We can deal with some short-term disruption and we'll be better off for having done so on the other end.
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
top dog
Footballguy
My sister-in-law is a RN in a nursing home. She is a vaccine holdout. Smokes cigarettes, but does not want to put the vaccine in her body. Ready to quit her job if they try to mandate it. "They need us more than we need them right now" was her exact quote.
Both her and her husband I considered to be pretty sharp people before politics took them over.
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A 3rd dose is indicated for severely immunocompromised people due to health conditions or medications. It’s not really a booster but a change in dosing requirements for an estimated 3% of the population.
For everyone else the booster recommendation is still pending. I’ve seen more and more analysis of the Israel study and case rise here questioning the need for boosters at this time.
The original timeline was to start those boosters on Sept 20th and 8 months after your second dose. There has been discussion of making that 6 months and reports from the CDC and FDA that there isn’t consensus about the recommendation. The latest I’ve heard is that Moderna and J&J have not submitted data and it’s likely to only be Pfizer boosters starting in 2 weeks with the others late.
TL/DR It’s a mess, no one knows what’s going to happen.
fatness
Footballguy
Hospitals also don't have the luxury of staff to cover additional COVID cases (among patients and staff members) caused by contact with unvaccinated hospital staff. At this point with vaccinations so easily available some hospitals are requiring staff to be vaxxed because they see unvaxxed staff as more of a problem-causer than problem-solver.Terminalxylem said:
I realize nurses wear or are supposed to wear PPE, and I've not been inside a hospital during the COVID age. But I've visited my mom weekly at her nursing home since late spring or early summer and I see how those masks are worn there. She's in the skilled nursing unit, in a nursing home that had almost 200 cases of COVID which about 30 died. Her roommate died. Yet today nurses and staff there remove their masks some of the time, often wear them below the nose, sometimes substitute face shields for masks. So the idea that masked, unvaccinated nurses can't infect hospital patients seems like a theoretical argument only, one that doesn't match reality.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
A nurse wearing proper PPE isnt spreading anything.IvanKaramazov said:
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Insoxicated
Serious Question: What happened to Hydroxychloroquine?culdeus said:
A venn diagram for Ivermectin advocates would likely be near 100% overlap with people who, 12 months ago, were CONVINCED Hydroxychloroquine worked and was being suppressed by Big Pharma.
Now suddenly the former Hydroxychloroquine simps are no longer convinced it works, but NOW their "Research" tells them Ivermectin is the hotness.
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Doug B
Footballguy
Right. This kind of thing is going to vary wildly state to state -- and perhaps even provider to provider.Leeroy Jenkins said:
The state of Louisiana definitely has in their COVID vaccination database that I affirmed 'no immunodeficiencies' when I got my first shot. I could pretend like I have immunodeficiency and attempt to go to a national drugstore chain to get a booster ... but I'd have no confidence at all that my information wouldn't be checked against what I submitted in March.
I'm not sure Louisiana ever did have a 'no questions asked' vaccination scheme set up. I don't know what our illegal immigrants, people without ID, etc. did when/if they got vaccinated locally back in the winter & spring. Photograph + thumbprint? I really couldn't tell you.
Doug B
Footballguy
It's all in flux, but from what I can gather:BigJim® said:
a) Truly immunocompromised people (cancer patients, congenital immune diseases, etc.) can get a third shot of whatever vaccine right now. Moderna & Pfizer are both available to them (unsure about a second J&J). Note that these shots are not considered boosters -- they are instead the third shot in a three-shot routine. This is important.
b) Regular folks with healthy immune systems will soon be eligible to receive a booster COVID vaccine. Starting in a few weeks, this will be for people 8 months from their second shot ('8 months' is not set in stone at present, could be 6 months). It's likely, but also not set in stone, that regular people will have to get Pfizer booster only regardless of what their original shots were -- but this is also in flux.
Stay tuned.
Calls one of the safest human medicines on the planet, 'horse medicine'Capella said:
That's what it looks like when you are clueless.
All of you no doubt fell for the rolling stone article (lie).
https://reason.com/2021/09/06/ivermectin-overdoses-oklahoma-hospitals-rolling-stone-hoax/
Keep putting that jab crap inside ya.
https://torontosun.com/news/provincial/over-100-ontario-youth-have-been-sent-to-hospital-for-vaccine-related-heart-problems
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Insoxicated
Vaccine Risk: "the reporting rate for this generally mild / temporary side effect is 7.4 per million for Pfizer and 20 per million for Moderna"..... you're more likely to be struck by lightning ... And has extensive evidence showing dramatic reduction in infection and near elimination of serious disease.
Ivermectin Risk: One large study showed 60 per million Serious Adverse Effects (Coma, Death, etc), and a whopping 67% of patients observed less serious side effects (severe headache, Myalgia, etc).... and has zero legitimate studies showing any effect on COVID whatsoever.
It takes a special kind of stupid....
... And has extensive evidence showing dramatic reduction in infection and near elimination of serious disease. Ivermectin Risk: One large study showed 60 per million Serious Adverse Effects (Coma, Death, etc), and a whopping 67% of patients observed less serious side effects (severe headache, Myalgia, etc).... and has zero legitimate studies showing any effect on COVID whatsoever.
It takes a special kind of stupid....
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Capella
Footballguy
WILLLLLLLLBURRRRRRR!Calls one of the safest human medicines on the planet, 'horse medicine'
That's what it looks like when you are clueless.
All of you no doubt fell for the rolling stone article (lie).
https://reason.com/2021/09/06/ivermectin-overdoses-oklahoma-hospitals-rolling-stone-hoax/
Keep putting that jab crap inside ya.
https://torontosun.com/news/provincial/over-100-ontario-youth-have-been-sent-to-hospital-for-vaccine-related-heart-problems
When this is all over , look in the mirror.Vaccine Risk: "the reporting rate for this generally mild / temporary side effect is 7.4 per million for Pfizer and 20 per million for Moderna"..... you're more likely to be struck by lightning
Ivermectin Risk: One large study showed 60 per million Serious Adverse Effects (Coma, Death, etc), and a whopping 67% of patients observed less serious side effects (severe headache, Myalgia, etc).... and has zero legitimate studies showing any effect on COVID whatsoever.
It takes a special kind of stupid....
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culdeus
Footballguy
Serious Question: What happened to Hydroxychloroquine?
A venn diagram for Ivermectin advocates would likely be near 100% overlap with people who, 12 months ago, were CONVINCED Hydroxychloroquine worked and was being suppressed by Big Pharma.
Now suddenly the former Hydroxychloroquine simps are no longer convinced it works, but NOW their "Research" tells them Ivermectin is the hotness.
It faded when it came out that Trump never took it. The horse worm stuff started on the meme sites not long after that.
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Insoxicated
OK
In the meantime, it would be helpful if you'd stop posting silly stuff that's so easy to rip apart with data. It happened in the main thread and it's happening here. You either have NO idea how to read and interpret scientific literature, or you're trolling.
Either way... enjoy your trip on the crazy train. Here's your tinfoil hat and your bale of hay.
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I can only laugh at how clueless you are as you follow fauci and the rest of the idiot train pushing a worthless jab that is now on #4 in Israel while my posts shows Ivermectin works and you can only deny it even though you have no rebuttal. Explain the 12 cases where IVM was given to patients on ventilators and recovered. You won't cause you cannot. I'm sorry you follow the idiots pushing failed 'vaxxes' and I follow doctors that are saving patients with treatments but it seems you cannot be helped.
Current effectiveness of Pfizer's garbage is lower than the others and that is what they are pimping. Figure it out if you can.
OK
In the meantime, it would be helpful if you'd stop posting silly stuff that's so easy to rip apart with data. It happened in the main thread and it's happening here. You either have NO idea how to read and interpret scientific literature, or you're trolling.
Either way... enjoy your trip on the crazy train. Here's your tinfoil hat and your bale of hay.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8248252/
Conclusions:
Moderate-certainty evidence finds that large reductions in COVID-19 deaths are possible using ivermectin. Using ivermectin early in the clinical course may reduce numbers progressing to severe disease. The apparent safety and low cost suggest that ivermectin is likely to have a significant impact on the SARS-CoV-2 pandemic globally.
Alex P Keaton
Footballguy
It’s weird. I can see why immunocompromised people might need a 3rd dose. But more and more the data seems to show that vaccine efficacy isn’t waning for the average person. We might need a vaccine that is more tailored / targeted toward Delta or other variants…..but a 3rd dose doesn’t seem rational.
Nathan R. Jessep
Footballguy
Sample Size 12 is a good cover band name
fatness
Footballguy
"Look at this discredited study showing Ivermectin helped 12 unvaccinated patients who wouldn't have been there had they been vaccinated" is not the solid argument you think it is.
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Insoxicated
Hey guys, I went skydiving but I saw an article where this one time someone's Parachute didn't open properly, so there was NO WAY I was wearing one.
Good news is, I did find a doctor who was able to replace my ruptured organs with pig organs so I'm good as new.
Therefore: Pig Organs are superior Parachutes in preventing Skydiving deaths.
Good news is, I did find a doctor who was able to replace my ruptured organs with pig organs so I'm good as new.
Therefore: Pig Organs are superior Parachutes in preventing Skydiving deaths.
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Doug B
Footballguy
Just a side note:
The proportion of the dosages in micrograms of the two major mRNA vaccines, Moderna (100 μg) and Pfizer (35 μg), is similar to the proportion of the side effect incidents per million:
20 per million/7.4 per million ~ 2.70
100 μg/35 μg ~ 2.85
This makes me wonder if more tailored dosages will be available in the future.
fatness
Footballguy
The best part is that after you're done using those parachutes you can eat them.Hey guys, I went skydiving but I saw and article once where someone's Parachute didn't open properly, so there was NO WAY I was wearing one.
Good news is, I did find a doctor who was able to replace my ruptured organs with pig organs so I'm good as new.
Therefore: Pig Organs are superior Parachutes in preventing Skydiving deaths.
The Commish
Footballguy
If this is your bar, then ivermectin won't "work" either. It would be required every time you got the virus moving forward. This isn't a slam on ivermectin, I think more research should be done on it as a treatment, it's a comment on the absurd bar you set. It's unrealistic and laughable.lod001 said:
The Commish
Footballguy
WIth Hydroxychloroquine, it was always a joke because the "study" was in cell culture in kidney cells. There is only one way into those cells and that's why hydroxychloroquine worked. So it could be extremely effective in keeping virus out of your kidney. That's about it. Your lungs and other organs have at least two ways in and that drug did nothing to prevent the virus from infecting them.Serious Question: What happened to Hydroxychloroquine?
A venn diagram for Ivermectin advocates would likely be near 100% overlap with people who, 12 months ago, were CONVINCED Hydroxychloroquine worked and was being suppressed by Big Pharma.
Now suddenly the former Hydroxychloroquine simps are no longer convinced it works, but NOW their "Research" tells them Ivermectin is the hotness.
I think ivermectin should be looked at. It's already part of most cocktails they provide in treatment along with remdeziveer etc. The problem with these drugs is they are antiviral drugs. By the time you're in the hospital, the viral problem is gone and you are having large problems with inflammation. In short, these drugs are given way too late in the process. These kinds of drugs need to be provided as soon as you start getting symptoms to have any sort of shot at working (if at all....yet to be determined).
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Insoxicated
I thought ivermectin was anti-parasitic not anti-viral, which is part of why it's so puzzling that it's perceived as a solution
DallasDMac
Footballguy
Nathan R. Jessep
Footballguy
https://dearpandemic.org/ivermectin-and-covid-19/
"People got really excited about ivermectin early in the pandemic because studies showed that ivermectin could inhibit the replication of the virus in lab samples."
I'm sure a pre-print study hit the sites and some doc or maybe a media outlet ran with it, and boom, a misinformation campaign is born.
The Commish
Footballguy
It is, but it remains to be seen if the same impacts it has on parasites translates to virus. Sometimes they do, other times they don't. If I'm being completely honest, I was shocked to find out some hospital protocols call for it as part of the cocktail they give. Though, as pointed out before, it's likely too little too late even in current applications because at the point people are in the hospital, they are likely passed the viral stage and well into the inflammation stage and we KNOW it does NOTHING for inflammation.
It gained popularity because, like hydroxychloroquine, there was a favorable outcome in cell culture. Of course we know that's not NEARLY enough to start injecting it into bodies, but that doesn't mean it's been verified to be useless like hydroxychloroquine....yet.
Terminalxylem
Footballguy
I’m not in favor of keeping stupid healthcare workers employed, believe me. But while our ICUs are over 100% capacity and standard of care is already being compromised, any warm body will do.
Terminalxylem
Footballguy
RelevantHey guys, I went skydiving but I saw an article where this one time someone's Parachute didn't open properly, so there was NO WAY I was wearing one.
Good news is, I did find a doctor who was able to replace my ruptured organs with pig organs so I'm good as new.
Therefore: Pig Organs are superior Parachutes in preventing Skydiving deaths.
Follow the science, bro.
Terminalxylem
Footballguy
Its approved for anti-parasitic effect, but like hydroxychloroquine, it shows antiviral properties in vitro as well. The are many drugs like this, with unexpected actions that aren’t directly related to their primary indication.
The problem is, in vitro and animal studies don’t equate to in vivo efficacy in humans. Even human studies don’t mean much, if they aren’t conducted properly. This is why prospective, double blind randomized controlled studies are the standard for clinical evidence. These must also be peer-review to confirm the methodology and findings.
Neither hydroxychloroquine nor ivermectin have met these standards, so no one reputable uses them for covid-19.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
Let's say Ivermectin works well. Why would this keep someone from getting a vaccine? Seems like the vaccine sure is useful, and if you still get sick you can use a useful therapeutic. Ya know, like, double protection.
Terminalxylem
Footballguy
Capella
Footballguy
it’s not that the vaccines work or don’t work, it’s that there has to be a stupid culture war on everything and the horse paste eaters have decided this is their ground to dig their hoofs in about.
You can’t get through to them, there’s no changing them, so just ignore them or laugh at them.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
You know how many vaccine deniers have been claiming that it could affect fertility? Well, just wait until they find out in a few years that they all destroyed their sperm with ivermectin.
fatness
Footballguy
2Squirrels1Nut
Footballguy
I received my third Moderna shot three weeks ago, 6 months since my second shot, at CVS. Only side effect was a sore arm the next day. I didn't have to show anything from my doctor. FWIW, GLGBLeeroy Jenkins said:
The thing with the Ivermectin craze, it’s all counter culture driving the craziest behaviors. The more the experts warns against it, the more they want to take it. I think it’s time to stop reporting about it and get it out of the news. People taking the animal formulation know it’s not safe, they just don’t care.
The Commish
Footballguy
A really good question you won't get a meaningful answer to from the "it only works if I have to take it once" group. Each would be serving their purpose but it should be obvious that each would have a very different purpose/role.
Nathan R. Jessep
Footballguy
gianmarco
Footballguy
This.
And the basic thing that doesn't make sense is, if it works, then why wouldn't we want to use it? Do people really think tens of thousands of doctors are withholding a lifesaving medication?
