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Dynasty Watch Javonte Williams - RB UNC

Zyphros

By Zyphros,
in The Shark Pool (NFL Talk)

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Ilov80s

Next time I have a thought I will make a cave drawing and post the picture here. 

Andy Dufresne

Dalvin Cook ran a 4.49 at the combine and ran twice at his pro day — once in the mid-4.4s and once in the low 4.5 range. 4.5's are just fine for a guy his size.  

Biabreakable

2020 highlights I am seeing a good variety of skills exhibited in the above clip. He has good footwork and shows patience to set up some of these runs. One of them a defender is very close before

JohnnyU

JohnnyU 4,370

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2 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

Are we sure he’s better than Michael Carter? Is it just the extra size we like?

I like both, but I like Williams’ abilities after contact and his overall contact balance.  He’s a machine.

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Mister CIA

Mister CIA 8,618

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1 minute ago, Ilov80s said:

Are we sure he’s better than Michael Carter? Is it just the extra size we like?

Well, I was pretty sure until you asked.  My intial thought is Javonte Williams looks a lot more lively than Michael Carter.  I'm all for drafting phyical specimens who don't fit the prototype at their position, but 5'10, 220 vs 5'8, 200 checks an extra box for me.

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Ilov80s

Ilov80s 31,081

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Just now, Mister CIA said:

Well, I was pretty sure until you asked.  My intial thought is Javonte Williams looks a lot more lively than Michael Carter.  I'm all for drafting phyical specimens who don't fit the prototype at their position, but 5'10, 220 vs 5'8, 200 checks an extra box for me.

Yeah I’ll be curious to see what he weighs in at and tests at. That’s huge for Carter.

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Ilov80s

Ilov80s 31,081

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3 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

I like both, but I like Williams’ abilities after contact and his overall contact balance.  He’s a machine.

Yeah he looks legit and has the ideal nfl build. Just odd that they seemed so close at UNC and Williams is getting hyped as the potential RB1 now.

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JohnnyU

JohnnyU 4,370

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Just now, Ilov80s said:

Yeah he looks legit and has the ideal nfl build. Just odd that they seemed so close at UNC and Williams is getting hyped as the potential RB1 now.

One is UNC and the other is NFL.  There’s a lot more variables than college stats.

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Boston

Boston 3,207

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Just now, Ilov80s said:

Yeah he looks legit and has the ideal nfl build. Just odd that they seemed so close at UNC and Williams is getting hyped as the potential RB1 now.

Not trying to be a wise-*** but why is this odd?  Carter (who I love) is an excellent player himself and as far as college goes he is in the ballpark of Williams...it's just that Williams is built much better for the NFL game than Carter...he is bigger, stronger and faster and due to that projects to possibly be a bellcow three down RB while Carter will have much more to prove once he gets to the NFL.

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SoBeDad

SoBeDad 2,337

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2 minutes ago, Boston said:

Not trying to be a wise-*** but why is this odd?  Carter (who I love) is an excellent player himself and as far as college goes he is in the ballpark of Williams...it's just that Williams is built much better for the NFL game than Carter...he is bigger, stronger and faster and due to that projects to possibly be a bellcow three down RB while Carter will have much more to prove once he gets to the NFL.

On tape, Williams breaks tackles, has good vision and soft hands. But he doesn't have breakaway speed. Maybe an Arian Foster comp.

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JohnnyU

JohnnyU 4,370

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1 minute ago, SoBeDad said:

On tape, Williams breaks tackles, has good vision and soft hands. But he doesn't have breakaway speed. Maybe an Arian Foster comp.

I’d rather have have him than Etienne.

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JohnnyU

JohnnyU 4,370

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2 minutes ago, SoBeDad said:

He'll also go a little later than Etienne, I think. Early 2nd for Etienne, late 2nd for Williams. 

In dynasty drafts (non-super flex) both will go top 5 most likely.

Edited by JohnnyU
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Ilov80s

Ilov80s 31,081

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2 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

I’d rather have have him than Etienne.

I can see that pre draft capital and landing spot. It seems like overthinking it but I understand the reasons behind it and I think ETN is more volatile in his outcomes. 

14 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

One is UNC and the other is NFL.  There’s a lot more variables than college stats.

Obviously, I didn’t refer to any numbers. 

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Ilov80s

Ilov80s 31,081

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14 minutes ago, Boston said:

Not trying to be a wise-*** but why is this odd?  Carter (who I love) is an excellent player himself and as far as college goes he is in the ballpark of Williams...it's just that Williams is built much better for the NFL game than Carter...he is bigger, stronger and faster and due to that projects to possibly be a bellcow three down RB while Carter will have much more to prove once he gets to the NFL.

Bigger isn’t necessarily better. If Carter comes in size wise as projected, his BMI is still perfectly fine for an NFL back. He’s short but well built.

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JohnnyU

JohnnyU 4,370

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1 minute ago, Ilov80s said:

I can see that pre draft capital and landing spot. It seems like overthinking it but I understand the reasons behind it and I think ETN is more volatile in his outcomes. 

Obviously, I didn’t refer to any numbers. 

Yes, landing spots not withstanding.

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JohnnyU

JohnnyU 4,370

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2 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

Bigger isn’t necessarily better. If Carter comes in size wise as projected, his BMI is still perfectly fine for an NFL back. He’s short but well built.

Yes, I like both, I obviously like Williams more.  You can get Carter in the 2nd rd of standard dynasty leagues, maybe later.

Edited by JohnnyU
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Ilov80s

Ilov80s 31,081

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2 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

Yes, I like both, I obviously like Williams more.  You can get Carter in the 2nd rd of standard dynasty leagues, maybe later.

Not sure I have an opinion on what Carter is worth yet, just wondering if there’s anything besides size separating them? I’m curious to heat what else people see between them.

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Blackbear

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30 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

Not sure I have an opinion on what Carter is worth yet, just wondering if there’s anything besides size separating them? I’m curious to heat what else people see between them.

To me it looks like Williams is a well rounded back. Has poise and vision but has more power, can truck, run inside tackles well.

If you watch his tapes you will notice a lot of yac and tackles broken. Good around goal line.

But the play at 4:30 in shows some good patience to let his blockers get out in front and then some burst once they established their blocks... many broken tackles and hard to get down.

The play at 7:19 is nice because he shows he can adjust when holes close and he can pause then break outside and still has burst to get around the tackler to go the distance. 

Highlights of Williams... https://youtu.be/JE65d6M9OY0

 

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JohnnyU

JohnnyU 4,370

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1 hour ago, Ilov80s said:

Not sure I have an opinion on what Carter is worth yet, just wondering if there’s anything besides size separating them? I’m curious to heat what else people see between them.

There’s a good chance Carter will always be in a RBBC (see ETN).

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Blick

Blick 1,250

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Isn't the much more likely answer that both are good backs but the system made them great?  I'm staying off of Williams in the top 5.  It may bite me, but I think Carter is the better value. 

Edited by Blick
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Ilov80s

Ilov80s 31,081

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1 hour ago, JohnnyU said:

There’s a good chance Carter will always be in a RBBC (see ETN).

I think that’s true of any RB. 

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Zyphros

Zyphros 2,029

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3 hours ago, Ilov80s said:

Not sure I have an opinion on what Carter is worth yet, just wondering if there’s anything besides size separating them? I’m curious to heat what else people see between them.

It's not just size for me. I like Javonte's vision and patience more than Carter's. Perhaps it's just different styles, but Javonte's appeals more to me as a guy that would do better at the next level. The only thing I'd say Carter does better is he's more explosive, but Javonte makes up for that with his vision and tackle breaking ability. 

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Boston

Boston 3,207

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3 hours ago, Ilov80s said:

I agree and Carter might be limited to an Aaron Jones role. 

I mentioned it in another thread (it was in an article) but the healthy Dion Lewis with the Pats is a very good comp.

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Ilov80s

Ilov80s 31,081

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27 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

...or Darrell Henderson.

That was a puzzling one this year as he played really well when given the ball. I’m not sure what the Rams have against him. Let’s not act like bigger backs don’t also get put into RBBC though. Plenty of 2 down grinders out there who aren’t they helpful for fantasy.

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JohnnyU

JohnnyU 4,370

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7 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

That was a puzzling one this year as he played really well when given the ball. I’m not sure what the Rams have against him. Let’s not act like bigger backs don’t also get put into RBBC though. Plenty of 2 down grinders out there who aren’t they helpful for fantasy.

True, but you have to factor size into ability to be a bell cow.  it's not a myth.  Not saying smaller backs can't gain the upper share of a committee, I'm just saying history shows they are more likely to be stuck in a RBBC on the unfavorable side.

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Ilov80s

Ilov80s 31,081

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15 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

True, but you have to factor size into ability to be a bell cow.  it's not a myth.  Not saying smaller backs can't gain the upper share of a committee, I'm just saying history shows they are more likely to be stuck in a RBBC on the unfavorable side.

Oh I totally agree and this is mostly all pointless until we know what teams they are on to see what roles are available and how good the offense is.

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Edgar

Edgar 276

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Javonte has a ton to offer. While I see the Bell comps with the smooth running, Javonte also has some thumping to his game where he dishes out hits. I'm not sure who he comps to in that regard, but I love the skill set. Bowling over a defender sure seems easier when the defender is concerned about being evaded altogether. Maybe a combo of Bell and David Montgomery? 

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JohnnyU

JohnnyU 4,370

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On 2/25/2021 at 12:37 PM, Edgar said:

Javonte has a ton to offer. While I see the Bell comps with the smooth running, Javonte also has some thumping to his game where he dishes out hits. I'm not sure who he comps to in that regard, but I love the skill set. Bowling over a defender sure seems easier when the defender is concerned about being evaded altogether. Maybe a combo of Bell and David Montgomery? 

Jim Brown

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Zyphros

Zyphros 2,029

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On 2/25/2021 at 11:37 AM, Edgar said:

Javonte has a ton to offer. While I see the Bell comps with the smooth running, Javonte also has some thumping to his game where he dishes out hits. I'm not sure who he comps to in that regard, but I love the skill set. Bowling over a defender sure seems easier when the defender is concerned about being evaded altogether. Maybe a combo of Bell and David Montgomery? 

I saw some Marion Barber comps which I thought fit perfectly. There really isn’t a recent comp that I can come up with. 

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Blackbear

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1 hour ago, Zyphros said:

I saw some Marion Barber comps which I thought fit perfectly. There really isn’t a recent comp that I can come up with. 

If you look at Josh Jacobs profile you will see similar size and running style... violent, great contact balance, poise and burst, etc... He might be faster than Jacobs in open field.

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