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Taysom Hill as TE on ESPN


Jail

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1 minute ago, Jail said:

So ESPN is leaving Hill as a TE this weekend even though he is the starting QB this week.  It's causing quite a stir in my league, so I am curious if anyone is doing anything about it? Any commish stepping in or just leaving alone?

Thankfully I do not have a league on ESPN this year. I would have no problem with the commish stepping in. The team shouldn’t get a huge advantage like an extra quarterback because of a technicality.

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2 minutes ago, Jail said:

So ESPN is leaving Hill as a TE this weekend even though he is the starting QB this week.  It's causing quite a stir in my league, so I am curious if anyone is doing anything about it? Any commish stepping in or just leaving alone?

He's been out there with that position eligibility, free for anyone to pick up.

I don't see any reason for it causing a stir - especially since ESPN will almost certainly change it after this week.

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I don’t play on the platform, and I know that it’s typical not to change a player’s position mid-season which has effected players like Joe Webb and Marques Colston in the past... but it’s silly in this case because he has been listed as a QB on the Saints roster all year and probably even longer than that, right? 

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I think it's pretty inherently unfair. I would say the same thing had I had the foresight to pick him up, but I didn't because I just assumed ESPN would make the right decision and switch his eligibility (which the blurb on him in their app actually said). 

If I were commish in any of my leagues, I'd probably tell the guy with Hill that he can either start him as his QB or I'll refund him his FAAB. 

Having a starting QB in your TE slot is just ####### insane. 

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I wish this thread was posted a day earlier.   Some podcast said this was the case on yahoo, which I immediately checked into and was false.   They must have been thinking about espn.   Kudos to the guy in my espn league that scooped him.   My fault for not checking espn sooner.    That said, solidifies espn as a complete clown show of a fantasy platform (if that wasn't already the case) IF no designation is made.   Still sucks for the guy that has to play against TE Hill this week.

Edited by sushinsky4tsar
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I decided to pick him up yesterday as TE insurance in my main League (ESPN) because TJ is a bit injured.

He's been a TE all season in ESPN and nobody picked him up/

I don't have high hopes for him, but I hope NO has some gadget plays lined up for him. I think he's good for 8-10 rush attempts this weekend, so I hope he has a floor of 4-6 points and always the possibility of a TD.

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5 minutes ago, Gally said:

I see this kind of like baseball.  He is gaining eligibility at a position but it shouldn't take away his already earned eligibility. 

 

Everybody had the chance to get him so nobody was at a disadvantage in reading the tea leaves.  

I would argue there was definitely a disadvantage created by ESPN because their little blurb on Taysom Hill actually blatantly said they would remove his TE eligibility if he were to ever become a starting QB. 

Like, I didn't pick him up for that very reason.

There's no reason for ESPN to not be removing his TE eligibility. 

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Unless your TE is Kelce, you should have an easy start at TE this week that you should be thrilled about.   He's juicy even as a flex play, let alone TE.

ESPN should probably do the right thing and help save 1,000s of leagues and friendships from erupting into infighting.    If that doesn't happen, and Hill actually puts up half-way respectable starting QB numbers for weeks going forward, I really don't think it's the commissioner's role to intervene.   The designation was there from the start, good for those that were aware of it and pounced on this potential windfall first.   The commish intervention should probably be finding a better platform for your league in 2021.   The advertisement pop ups that you were forced to watch before making a lineup move should have been the final straw to make this decision anyway. 

Edited by sushinsky4tsar
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5 minutes ago, ATB said:

I would argue there was definitely a disadvantage created by ESPN because their little blurb on Taysom Hill actually blatantly said they would remove his TE eligibility if he were to ever become a starting QB. 

Like, I didn't pick him up for that very reason.

There's no reason for ESPN to not be removing his TE eligibility. 

I was unaware of this statement but if that was stated then the commish should be in the right to not allow Hill to be played at TE.

 

ETA:  where was this stated and is it still there?

Edited by Gally
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technically nothing has changed.....any owner could have picked him up all year and played him at either QB/TE/Flex......and this really shouldn't be a surprise if you have been paying attention, he has always had this designation on the site and I am sure it has been on people's radar.....its just that now it is coming into play because he may get more PT at one of the positions he has always been eligible for....as soon as Brees got hurt, this should have been something every owner should have considered.....so IMO quit crying....it is what it is for this week....

with that said.....just because he has been announced as the "starter at QB" doesn't mean thats how things will play out.......Winston could VERY easily lead the team in QB snaps this week when all is said and done......IMO it is kind of a risky move to play him in some respects....

Edited by Stinkin Ref
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11 minutes ago, Gally said:

I see this kind of like baseball.  He is gaining eligibility at a position but it shouldn't take away his already earned eligibility. 

 

Everybody had the chance to get him so nobody was at a disadvantage in reading the tea leaves.  

No but in Fantasy Baseball I don't believe if a position player comes in a pitches an inning in a blowout that counts towards, or against your pitching stats.  Kind of seems like the same thing to me.

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4 minutes ago, ATB said:

I would argue there was definitely a disadvantage created by ESPN because their little blurb on Taysom Hill actually blatantly said they would remove his TE eligibility if he were to ever become a starting QB. 

Like, I didn't pick him up for that very reason.

There's no reason for ESPN to not be removing his TE eligibility. 

If that blurb is there  (Hill's news timeline?), then they absolutely need to follow through.    Also, that probably changes my stance on non-intervention.   Regardless, espn should move quick on this one.   No one should be playing TE Hill this week.   The guy who thinks he has the TE Hill shouldn't have the rug pulled out from him on Sunday morning. 

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1 minute ago, Pipes said:

No but in Fantasy Baseball I don't believe if a position player comes in a pitches an inning in a blowout that counts towards, or against your pitching stats.  Kind of seems like the same thing to me.

But in football Hill was able to get his passing, rushing, and receiving stats all year long if he was in your lineup regardless if you had him starting at TE already.  Seems like that should continue.

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1 minute ago, Stinkin Ref said:

technically nothing has changed.....any owner could have picked him up all year and played him at either QB/TE/Flex......and this really shouldn't be a surprise if you have been paying attention, he has always had this designation on the site and I am sure it has been on people's radar.....its just that now it is coming into play because he may get more PT at one of the positions he has always been eligible for....as soon as Brees got hurt, this should have been something every owner should have considered.....so IMO quit crying....it is what it is for this week....

with that said.....just because he has been announced as the "starter at QB" doesn't mean thats how things will play out.......Winston could VERY easily lead the team in QB snaps when all is said and done......IMO it is kind of a risky move to play him in some respects....

Link to crying?  Opinions in this thread have been mostly if he's eligible than there is nothing wrong. :shrug:

I think the issue is that he never should have been listed as a TE in the first place. I'm pretty sure the Saints list him as a QB. 

 

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3 minutes ago, Tom Hagen said:

Link to crying?  Opinions in this thread have been mostly if he's eligible than there is nothing wrong. :shrug:

I think the issue is that he never should have been listed as a TE in the first place. I'm pretty sure the Saints list him as a QB. 

 

then this thread (uproar) should have been started at the beginning of the season......

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13 minutes ago, Gally said:

I was unaware of this statement but if that was stated then the commish should be in the right to not allow Hill to be played at TE.

 

ETA:  where was this stated and is it still there?

Not sure where to find it. The ESPN app only shows specific player news going back so far, not to the beginning of the season. Don't remember what date they specifically addressed the topic. 

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3 minutes ago, sushinsky4tsar said:

Okay, apparently we're talking about a Mike Clay tweet from April that said we reserve the right to strip his TE eligibility if he becomes the starter.

ESPN Fantasy should be fixing this quick, unless it's complete and utter trash, which I kind of suspected was already the case.

 

saw this morning they said they may consider changing his designation after this week.....which I think is fair.....don't punish any owners this week who may have been sitting on this "golden ticket" advantage for awhile and acted on it....

Edited by Stinkin Ref
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13 minutes ago, Tom Hagen said:

Link to crying?  Opinions in this thread have been mostly if he's eligible than there is nothing wrong. :shrug:

I think the issue is that he never should have been listed as a TE in the first place. I'm pretty sure the Saints list him as a QB. 

 

Yeah no one is crying here,  it's just fantasy football we're talking about.  I don't think our league will do anything about. My league mates mostly think it sucks for the guy playing Hill,  but that he's been set this way all year and not really much to do about it. 

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Considering we don't know the Hill /  Winston mix, I can respect waiting until after this week to make that decision.   Based on Clay's tweet, I think it's reasonable to expect the TE designation to be removed for anything north of 10-12 pass attempts.   Obviously, the number and metric(s) used to make this determination are extremely subjective.   But when Taysom Hill becomes a top 3 TE in their weekly rankings, it's probably time to do something.

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13 minutes ago, sushinsky4tsar said:

Considering we don't know the Hill /  Winston mix, I can respect waiting until after this week to make that decision.   Based on Clay's tweet, I think it's reasonable to expect the TE designation to be removed for anything north of 10-12 pass attempts.   Obviously, the number and metric(s) used to make this determination are extremely subjective.   But when Taysom Hill becomes a top 3 TE in their weekly rankings, it's probably time to do something.

Idk, I don't think this was presented as a wait-and-see situation from Clay's tweet. Taysom Hill is the announced starter at the position of QB. This is the exact scenario ESPN had apparently planned for, according to Mike Clay, and yet they are going to inexplicably give one week to one owner in every single league to use the guy as a cheat code before they make good on their promise to strip his TE eligibility. 

I'm not even facing him in any of my leagues and I think this is absolutely ridiculous. 

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40 minutes ago, Gally said:

I was unaware of this statement but if that was stated then the commish should be in the right to not allow Hill to be played at TE.

 

ETA:  where was this stated and is it still there?

Matthew Berry tweeted on Tuesday: 

FYI. In light of the Brees news Taysom Hill is given QB eligibility.  If Hill plays primarily at QB, using snap count data & our team sees that continuing, we reserve the right to remove his TE eligibility.  Please note that ESPN will never take a player's eligibility away mid-week. If he starts the week with TE tag then he keeps it all week.  He will have TE eligibility for Week 11 even if he is announced as the starting QB for NO in Week 11

 

So since he started this week with TE eligibility, looks like it stays.  

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9 minutes ago, ATB said:

Idk, I don't think this was presented as a wait-and-see situation from Clay's tweet. Taysom Hill is the announced starter at the position of QB. This is the exact scenario ESPN had apparently planned for, according to Mike Clay, and yet they are going to inexplicably give one week to one owner in every single league to use the guy as a cheat code before they make good on their promise to strip his TE eligibility. 

I'm not even facing him in any of my leagues and I think this is absolutely ridiculous. 

?.....you could have been using him as a TE all year.....

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4 minutes ago, wlwiles said:

Matthew Berry tweeted on Tuesday: 

FYI. In light of the Brees news Taysom Hill is given QB eligibility.  If Hill plays primarily at QB, using snap count data & our team sees that continuing, we reserve the right to remove his TE eligibility.  Please note that ESPN will never take a player's eligibility away mid-week. If he starts the week with TE tag then he keeps it all week.  He will have TE eligibility for Week 11 even if he is announced as the starting QB for NO in Week 11

 

So since he started this week with TE eligibility, looks like it stays.  

Props to ESPN, this is the correct action for this week.

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I get that and 

3 minutes ago, ATB said:

Idk, I don't think this was presented as a wait-and-see situation from Clay's tweet. Taysom Hill is the announced starter at the position of QB. This is the exact scenario ESPN had apparently planned for, according to Mike Clay, and yet they are going to inexplicably give one week to one owner in every single league to use the guy as a cheat code before they make good on their promise to strip his TE eligibility. 

I'm not even facing him in any of my leagues and I think this is absolutely ridiculous. 

I get that and do have sympathy for anyone playing TE Hill this week.   When Brees went down last year, there was some question about the Bridgewater/ Hill mix at QB.   Pass attempts went to Bridgewater in the game Brees got injured and again the following week in Seattle.   I can't remember exactly how Peyton played it.    Seems like no starter was declared, or he said they would both take snaps at QB.   

Have no doubt that Hill will be getting some rushes attempts this week, which probably won't make anyone playing TE Hill feel any better.   But the fact that he was named the starter might not be a guarantee that he has more pass attempts than Winston.    Just speculating, but I think it could be close to 50/50, but I'm leaning Winston.

    

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6 minutes ago, wlwiles said:

Matthew Berry tweeted on Tuesday: 

FYI. In light of the Brees news Taysom Hill is given QB eligibility.  If Hill plays primarily at QB, using snap count data & our team sees that continuing, we reserve the right to remove his TE eligibility.  Please note that ESPN will never take a player's eligibility away mid-week. If he starts the week with TE tag then he keeps it all week.  He will have TE eligibility for Week 11 even if he is announced as the starting QB for NO in Week 11

 

So since he started this week with TE eligibility, looks like it stays.  

Someone who was able to grab him and put him at TE, let us know next week - if they do take his TE tag away, does he automatically go to your bench, or can you loophole the system and leave him there so long as you never move him?  Lol

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3 minutes ago, Stinkin Ref said:

?.....you could have been using him as a TE all year.....

He wasn't named the starting QB until this week. And as I and others have pointed out, Mike Clay -- a representative of ESPN's fantasy football arm -- made it very clear that Hill's TE eligibility would be removed were he to ever become the starting QB.

Well, guess what, ESPN? Hill was named the starting QB. 

They didn't they would wait to observe his usage as a starter. They didn't say it was dependent on in-game usage. They said he would not be TE eligible if he were named as a starting QB. 

So exactly how is the change in their position at all defensible?

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1 minute ago, wlwiles said:

Someone who was able to grab him and put him at TE, let us know next week - if they do take his TE tag away, does he automatically go to your bench, or can you loophole the system and leave him there so long as you never move him?  Lol

I'm pretty sure as soon as ESPN pulls the TE eligibility he'll be flagged as invalid and you'll have to move him to another slot or drop him.

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The rule in our league is a player can’t have two positions.  So Hill is either a QB or TE.  Not both.  
We are now debating what his position is this week.  Based on the post above from Matthew Berry it looks like he will be considered a TE in our league this week until ESPN removes that position designation.  The guy who owns him picked him up last week and is saying he picked him up as a TE and he should stay that way this week.  The guy playing Hill at TE has Kelce too so talk about an embarrassment of riches at the TE spot this week. 
 

What a mess. 

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4 minutes ago, Stinkin Ref said:

how sure is anybody that he will actually make a cheat code advantage this week at TE......?......there's a good chance this could be a lot of smoke and mirrors by Peyton....

I don't think anyone can be sure, but if you don't have one of the elite TEs and 7 to 8 points is what you're expecting in a .5ppr streamer, you absolutely plug him in and have very reasonable hopes for a 15 point game passing and running from the QB position.  

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I only play in one espn league....(free league through a radio station contest thing)....I also have Kelce (also had Henry/Goedert).....due to position limits I had to drop a TE in order to pick up Hill....I couldn't drop any other position player or PK or DST.....so I dumped Goedert....I currently have Hill plugged in as my flex, as Kelce has been :moneybag:.....is Hill a slam dunk flex...?...I don't know....but at least no matter what I do with Hill, he won't be playing and scoring TE points for somebody else.....good chance he rides my bench this week, but playing keep away was definatley the move here if nothing else.....

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7 minutes ago, ATB said:

He wasn't named the starting QB until this week. And as I and others have pointed out, Mike Clay -- a representative of ESPN's fantasy football arm -- made it very clear that Hill's TE eligibility would be removed were he to ever become the starting QB.

Well, guess what, ESPN? Hill was named the starting QB. 

They didn't they would wait to observe his usage as a starter. They didn't say it was dependent on in-game usage. They said he would not be TE eligible if he were named as a starting QB. 

So exactly how is the change in their position at all defensible?

therein lies the rub.....what exactly does that mean.....nobody knows yet.....you can't assume yet that "being named the starter" means he gets what we normally think of as a starting QB's workload.....based on his usage this year he hasn't really been used as what we think of as a "starting QB".....and in fact last week, he wasn't even really being used as a "backup QB" as Winston took over after Brees went out......

waiting a week is a very reasonable decision here....

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For this week, I would call Hill an elite TE option.   Risky, but the ceiling is higher than the floor is low imo.

A good to very good flex option.   There's a scenario where an owner has Kelce, an excellent WR/RB alternative at flex and might not want to risk a Hill flex.    I would say that the play there might be to trade Hill to a team desperate for a win that has a mediocre TE.

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18 minutes ago, wlwiles said:

Matthew Berry tweeted on Tuesday: 

FYI. In light of the Brees news Taysom Hill is given QB eligibility.  If Hill plays primarily at QB, using snap count data & our team sees that continuing, we reserve the right to remove his TE eligibility.  Please note that ESPN will never take a player's eligibility away mid-week. If he starts the week with TE tag then he keeps it all week.  He will have TE eligibility for Week 11 even if he is announced as the starting QB for NO in Week 11

 

So since he started this week with TE eligibility, looks like it stays.  

Interesting.  Every time this has come up in the past, ESPN's position has been:

ESPN will never take a player's eligibility away mid-season. If he starts the season with TE tag then he keeps it all season

 

Also this (bolded mine):

  • The NFL sends ESPN an updated list of every player's position eligibility, including rookies, prior to the start of each season.
  • ESPN reserves the right to designate a different position for a player.
  • Once the season has begun, ESPN cannot change the primary position. However, a player can gain additional eligibility for other positions during the season if circumstances warrant it.
  • League Managers DO NOT have the ability to change a player's position.
  • ESPN has added the edge rusher spot to Individual Defensive Player (IDP) Leagues starting with the 2017/2018 NFL season.

https://support.espn.com/hc/en-us/articles/115003849751-Position-Eligibility

 

So by their own stated policy, a player can only gain additional eligibility, but can never lose eligibility.

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From Rotoword:

Saints head coach Sean Payton won't name a starting quarterback for Week 11 against the Falcons. 

“I haven’t announced that either one of them are starting," Payton said when asked whether Taysom Hill or Jameis Winston would start in placed of Drew Brees (ribs, lung) this week. ESPN's Adam Schefter reported Friday that Hill would start Week 11 against Atlanta. That doesn't mean Winston won't be involved in some way against the Falcons. If he gets the nod at QB, Hill would be a top-end tight end option on fantasy sites that give him tight end eligibility, while said eligibility sparks a civil war on fantasy football Twitter. 

RELATED: 

Jameis Winston

SOURCE: James Palmer on Twitter

Nov 20, 2020, 2:53 PM ET

 

So has he not officially been named starter?  If so, what can ESPN reasonably do...


ETA: Shefter is not coach or Saints GM...his speculation not official...

Edited by MikeApf
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18 minutes ago, Stinkin Ref said:

therein lies the rub.....what exactly does that mean.....nobody knows yet.....you can't assume yet that "being named the starter" means he gets what we normally think of as a starting QB's workload.....based on his usage this year he hasn't really been used as what we think of as a "starting QB".....and in fact last week, he wasn't even really being used as a "backup QB" as Winston took over after Brees went out......

waiting a week is a very reasonable decision here....

There's no rub. It doesn't matter what it means. If he's taking first-team reps all week long, he's the starting QB. 

Look at it this way: Are more people getting ####ed unfairly by facing a QB in their opponent's TE slot or by being forced to decide on whether to play Hill in their QB slot over other QB options?

It's a very obvious, simple decision to make here. 

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30 minutes ago, Stinkin Ref said:

how sure is anybody that he will actually make a cheat code advantage this week at TE......?......there's a good chance this could be a lot of smoke and mirrors by Peyton....

Lol. What classified as a “cheat code advantage” at TE this year, 14 points (non ppr)? Unless you’re a Kelce owner he’s an auto start at TE. This type of amateur hour stuff is exactly why I avoid playing on a trash platform like ESPN.

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1 minute ago, Johnny Utah #9 said:

Lol. What classified as a “cheat code advantage” at TE this year, 14 points (non ppr)? Unless you’re a Kelce owner he’s an auto start at TE. This type of amateur hour stuff is exactly why I avoid playing on a trash platform like ESPN.

I'm really just playing devils advocate here......but what should his designation have been.....he hasn't been a starting QB, he hasn't even been the backup QB.....he has mostly played RB/TE/WR......

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1 hour ago, Stinkin Ref said:

any owner could have picked him up all year and played him at either QB/TE/Flex

In hindsight he should have been on my radar at TE long before this weekend because my TEs have sucked balls so far this year.  Sadly, he was picked up by the guy right before me during the WW process this week.  Good for him - at least I don't play him this week.  I'll be starting G. Everett on MNF instead :lol:  :bag: 

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25 minutes ago, sushinsky4tsar said:

For this week, I would call Hill an elite TE option.   Risky, but the ceiling is higher than the floor is low imo.

A good to very good flex option.   There's a scenario where an owner has Kelce, an excellent WR/RB alternative at flex and might not want to risk a Hill flex.    I would say that the play there might be to trade Hill to a team desperate for a win that has a mediocre TE.

As bad as the TE position has been this year, he'll be no lower than the 2nd highest scorer this week.  What a free roll at that position.  Knowing his skill set, he probably should have been stashed a lobg time ago.  If you started him on a bye week and he got you a 0, no different than starting Gelsicki, Fant, Doyal, etc.

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