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☠ ☠ ☠ Official 2021 Las Vegas Raiders thread ☠ ☠ ☠ - only 3.5 more months of talking about draft reaches until real football arrives


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1 hour ago, Chadstroma said:

Owusu-Kamorah makes a lot of sense because he is that tweener you need in that D's LEO position. 

Agreed, but he might be gone by pick #17. Toney gives Gruden that quadtruple threat at WR/RB/PR/QB he covets. Like I said before, expect the unexpected..

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This is why it pays to wait before passing judgement on all deals. Based on the breakdown you have here, I love the deal too. Drake is a fantastic compliment to Jacobs.

By position: QB - we're fine with Carr.  He's at least very good and possibly great.  He's closer to 2016 form than 2019 and that's a good thing.  I'd be ok if we took a shot at a true franchise

I'll throw in my two cents here as a Buffalo football diehard fan who's seen (most likely?) all of Koonce's games.  He's a tremendously productive player....kinda slowly came on the scene over the yea

15 minutes ago, Blackbear said:

Every GM knows... rebuild the D

This draft is so simple.  Go with the BPA for D.   Over and over.  Gruden and Mayock need to throw away their draft grades and go with the media consensus picks since they can’t draft.  

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5 minutes ago, DocHolliday said:

This draft is so simple.  Go with the BPA for D.   Over and over.  Gruden and Mayock need to throw away their draft grades and go with the media consensus picks since they can’t draft.  

Yes... but you know they won't. Toney is the pick.. 

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12 minutes ago, DocHolliday said:

That will be the final straw for me.  

I don't believe it... Russell was it for me and I'm still here

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41 minutes ago, DocHolliday said:

This draft is so simple.  Go with the BPA for D.   Over and over.  Gruden and Mayock need to throw away their draft grades and go with the media consensus picks since they can’t draft.  

Media consensus picks 🤣🤣🤣

Come on... group think misses more than anything. I will take Mayock and his talent evaluation anyday.

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2 hours ago, DocHolliday said:

This draft is so simple.  Go with the BPA for D.   Over and over.  Gruden and Mayock need to throw away their draft grades and go with the media consensus picks since they can’t draft.  

So who do you like at #17? The elite CBs will be gone, Micah Parsons won't be there. It'll be close whether or not Kwity Paye will be there. Do you reach on Gregory Rousseau or Jaelen Phillips? I'm praying DT Christian Barmore is there but I just don't think Gruden values that position in the 1st round. 

Oddly enough this year there's plenty of 2nd round value for edge rushers in this year's draft.

If they go game changer on offense like Toney, there's a handful of pass rushers available in the 2nd round. 

Azeez Ojulari, Jayson Oweh, Carlos Basham ( who I like a lot, tons of college production), Rashad Weaver, Joseph Ossai, Payton Turner and Ronnie Perkins. Keep your eyes on Perkins, reading he's climbing draft boards. If they go Toney in the 1st, Perkins might be tight there for them in round 2. Although,  I'm hoping for Basham out of Wake Forest. 

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On 2/24/2021 at 12:39 PM, Ed Wood said:

Yikes, I've lost track over the years of how plugged in Peter King is but if he's even in the ballpark with these Watson trades, my "offer" of Carr, Waller and 2 1s is cheap by comparison. I love Watson but nobody nobody is worth this much (not even Mahomes).

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2021/02/22/deshaun-watson-trade-texans-nfl-fmia-peter-king/

Agree and honestly this looks like click bait. Watson has told the team he will never play for them again. The Texans are losing leverage with each passing day with their current stance. 

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I will add this... if nothing else, Bruno2 is strong in his beliefs!  😄

I don't follow College football nearly closely enough to have a valid opinion on who the pick will be.  Bruno2 isn't wrong in his logic, but I really do hope the consensus of nearly everyone is right, and D is the the pick over and over. 

On a related note, what a crappy part of the off-season with no combine this year.  Covid Sucks.

 

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1 hour ago, kaso said:

I will add this... if nothing else, Bruno2 is strong in his beliefs!  😄

I don't follow College football nearly closely enough to have a valid opinion on who the pick will be.  Bruno2 isn't wrong in his logic, but I really do hope the consensus of nearly everyone is right, and D is the the pick over and over. 

On a related note, what a crappy part of the off-season with no combine this year.  Covid Sucks.

 

Thanks Kaso, I'm a draft geek and not having the combine this year does suck. Watching YouTube videos of these guys only tells half the story. I can easily tell what they do well, trying to figure out their weaknesses, that's the hard part.

Just to be clear, I'm in the camp of picking a D player in the 1st round, but at #17 they're in a tricky spot. They're gonna need some players to slide. And there's a lot of ??s with the edge players this year. 

My ideal scenario: if either Parsons, Barmore, JOK or Paye make it to #17, run to the virtual podium and take one. Makes the most sense.

2nd option: No D player is there that they like, trade back a little and draft LB/edge Zaven Collins. He's the kind of playmaker the defense needs.

I've targeted Kadarius Toney because he's the better version of a shifty, multiple-position player Gruden was looking for in Bowden last year. And if you don't know who he is, watch some highlights. I will say this; if the elite D players are gone I won't be mad if Toney is the pick. It's a lot better than some of the mocks I'm seeing with the Raiders taking an Olinemen like Darrishaw or Vera-Tucker, assuming Trent Brown will walk, plus Gruden has a history of drafting Oline in the 1st round.

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1 hour ago, Bruno2 said:

Thanks Kaso, I'm a draft geek and not having the combine this year does suck. Watching YouTube videos of these guys only tells half the story. I can easily tell what they do well, trying to figure out their weaknesses, that's the hard part.

Just to be clear, I'm in the camp of picking a D player in the 1st round, but at #17 they're in a tricky spot. They're gonna need some players to slide. And there's a lot of ??s with the edge players this year. 

My ideal scenario: if either Parsons, Barmore, JOK or Paye make it to #17, run to the virtual podium and take one. Makes the most sense.

2nd option: No D player is there that they like, trade back a little and draft LB/edge Zaven Collins. He's the kind of playmaker the defense needs.

I've targeted Kadarius Toney because he's the better version of a shifty, multiple-position player Gruden was looking for in Bowden last year. And if you don't know who he is, watch some highlights. I will say this; if the elite D players are gone I won't be mad if Toney is the pick. It's a lot better than some of the mocks I'm seeing with the Raiders taking an Olinemen like Darrishaw or Vera-Tucker, assuming Trent Brown will walk, plus Gruden has a history of drafting Oline in the 1st round.

I'm not a huge fan of Paye.  I'm not sure if he is an upgrade over Crosby/Ferrell.  I'm onboard with taking Parsons, JOK, Barmore or even Collins.  I think two of them will be there when the Raiders pick.  

I have also seen mocks with Raiders taking O line.  Usually not a bad idea, but not for this team that has so many holes on defense, already has a good offensive line and has shown the ability to plug guys in and still operate at a high level. 

The only way I would be OK not taking D is if by some miracle Chase, Devonta Smith or Pitts was there.  

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26 minutes ago, ICON211 said:

I'm not a huge fan of Paye.  I'm not sure if he is an upgrade over Crosby/Ferrell.  I'm onboard with taking Parsons, JOK, Barmore or even Collins.  I think two of them will be there when the Raiders pick.  

I have also seen mocks with Raiders taking O line.  Usually not a bad idea, but not for this team that has so many holes on defense, already has a good offensive line and has shown the ability to plug guys in and still operate at a high level. 

The only way I would be OK not taking D is if by some miracle Chase, Devonta Smith or Pitts was there.  

I feel the same about Paye, all these edge players have warts this year. Another guy on the radar is Gregory Rousseau. Totally different build than Paye, I think he's listed at 6'7". But he's raw and doesn't have a lot of playing time under his belt. Not sure this is the guy they want if they're looking for an immediate contributor. 

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16 hours ago, Bruno2 said:

I don't believe it... Russell was it for me and I'm still here

If Gruden drafts any player other than Chase or D at 17, I am leaving the thread  until Gruden is gone or the Raiders play in the AFC championships.   

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48 minutes ago, ICON211 said:

I'm not a huge fan of Paye.  I'm not sure if he is an upgrade over Crosby/Ferrell.  I'm onboard with taking Parsons, JOK, Barmore or even Collins.  I think two of them will be there when the Raiders pick.  

I have also seen mocks with Raiders taking O line.  Usually not a bad idea, but not for this team that has so many holes on defense, already has a good offensive line and has shown the ability to plug guys in and still operate at a high level. 

The only way I would be OK not taking D is if by some miracle Chase, Devonta Smith or Pitts was there.  

A good D player will slip into the 17 spot.  I don’t care what position it is since he Raiders need an upgrade at every position on D.   This isn’t rocket science. You let the draft come to you and don’t reach for a position like Gruden has made a habit of doing.  

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11 minutes ago, DocHolliday said:

If Gruden drafts any player other than Chase or D at 17, I am leaving the thread  until Gruden is gone or the Raiders play in the AFC championships.   

You’ll be missed.  🤣🤣🤣

I am prepared for the wtf moments.  It’s Gruden he’s an idiot  

Like last year, when Goodell said ruggs, instead of lamb or juedy. Smdh

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36 minutes ago, DA RAIDERS said:

You’ll be missed.  🤣🤣🤣

I am prepared for the wtf moments.  It’s Gruden he’s an idiot  

Like last year, when Goodell said ruggs, instead of lamb or juedy. Smdh

I don’t think I will be missed.   All I do is whine and complain about the Raiders.   Anyone can pick up the slack.   

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17 hours ago, Bruno2 said:

Yes... but you know they won't. Toney is the pick.. 

A CBS Mock published recently (today? Didn't confirm the date, and too lazy to go back) had Toney to WFT at 20.  So he's in that range of the Raiders pick by an 'expert'... 

 

 

*Just throwing some offseason fuel on the fire.

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17 minutes ago, DocHolliday said:

I don’t think I will be missed.   All I do is whine and complain about the Raiders.   Anyone can pick up the slack.   

i don't think i can pick up your slack.  i'm about at my bithc and moan maximum.  :mellow: :pickle:

we'll get through this together.

@Stompin' Tom Connors  come back brother.

 

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2 hours ago, DocHolliday said:

If Gruden drafts any player other than Chase or D at 17, I am leaving the thread  until Gruden is gone or the Raiders play in the AFC championships.   

I agree to a point.... It has to be a game changer on the front 7. I swear if they draft another #$!@&*$ Safety in the 1st round, I'm leaving the thread too!

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6 hours ago, DA RAIDERS said:

i don't think i can pick up your slack.  i'm about at my bithc and moan maximum.  :mellow: :pickle:

we'll get through this together.

@Stompin' Tom Connors  come back brother.

 

@Stompin' Tom Connorswas the smart one to get away from annoying posters like me.   If he comes back, I won’t be going any where though.   That will teach him to try to get away.  

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14 hours ago, Chadstroma said:

So.... I might be talking to myself around here after Day 1 of the draft? 

Nope. No one is going anywhere. But we have been beaten down so much that the fantasy of walking away is still cathartic.

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On 3/1/2021 at 2:18 PM, kaso said:

A CBS Mock published recently (today? Didn't confirm the date, and too lazy to go back) had Toney to WFT at 20.  So he's in that range of the Raiders pick by an 'expert'... 

 

 

*Just throwing some offseason fuel on the fire.

The Raiders had three strikes on a WR1 last draft in the first 3 rounds.  Why not waste another pick seems to be Gruden’s motto.   

I do like to see teams drafting QB and WR before pick 17 in the mocks.  A starting player for the D will fall to the Raiders. 

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12 hours ago, DA RAIDERS said:

How much they wasting on him?  Haven’t wanted to look it up. 

Kendal Vickers signed a 1 year, $780,000 contract with the Las Vegas Raiders, including an average annual salary of $780,000. In 2021, Vickers will earn a base salary of $780,000, while carrying a cap hit of $780,000.

Source: Spotrac

Edited to add:  This puts him on average as the 98th largest cap hit for a DE.  

Edited by kaso
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2 hours ago, kaso said:

Kendal Vickers signed a 1 year, $780,000 contract with the Las Vegas Raiders, including an average annual salary of $780,000. In 2021, Vickers will earn a base salary of $780,000, while carrying a cap hit of $780,000.

Source: Spotrac

Edited to add:  This puts him on average as the 98th largest cap hit for a DE.  

Sounds about right. 

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they need to be cutting people,.  not signing scrubs and wasting money and roster spots.  at least vickers is a defensive player.

so far, they have signed 17 players to reserve/future contracts.    r/f contracts will count against the cap, after 3/17.  so far the r/f contracts, total around 11M dollars.  including another qb.  some dude named kyle sloter,  for 920,000. :rant: if this fool makes the team.  :hot:  8 are offensive players.  2 are ST.  7 are defensive players.

we'll see what happens in a couple weeks.

 

 

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11 minutes ago, DA RAIDERS said:

they need to be cutting people,.  not signing scrubs and wasting money and roster spots.  at least vickers is a defensive player.

so far, they have signed 17 players to reserve/future contracts.    r/f contracts will count against the cap, after 3/17.  so far the r/f contracts, total around 11M dollars.  including another qb.  some dude named kyle sloter,  for 920,000. :rant: if this fool makes the team.  :hot:  8 are offensive players.  2 are ST.  7 are defensive players.

we'll see what happens in a couple weeks.

 

 

We should know as soon as Monday... read a tweet where the feeling is that a lot of teams will be cutting a lot of players... the other side of the coin from Covid related cap adjustments.

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1 hour ago, DA RAIDERS said:

they need to be cutting people,.  not signing scrubs and wasting money and roster spots.  at least vickers is a defensive player.

so far, they have signed 17 players to reserve/future contracts.    r/f contracts will count against the cap, after 3/17.  so far the r/f contracts, total around 11M dollars.  including another qb.  some dude named kyle sloter,  for 920,000. :rant: if this fool makes the team.  :hot:  8 are offensive players.  2 are ST.  7 are defensive players.

we'll see what happens in a couple weeks.

 

 

Chill.

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1 hour ago, kaso said:

We should know as soon as Monday... read a tweet where the feeling is that a lot of teams will be cutting a lot of players... the other side of the coin from Covid related cap adjustments.

Oh yea... a lot of talent will be FA's that if not for COVID, would still be with their teams. A lot of hard decisions will need to be made by a lot of teams. 

Van Noy would not have been cut, IMO, if not for the lower cap as an example.

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2 hours ago, DA RAIDERS said:

they need to be cutting people,.  not signing scrubs and wasting money and roster spots.  at least vickers is a defensive player.

 

You ask and you shall receive.  The Raiders have cut G Gabe Jackson saving $9.6M in cap space.   He had a $9.35M base salary and a $250k workout bonus set for 2021.

His contract was through the 2022 season, and would have carried a $9.6M cap in 2022 as well. 

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1 minute ago, kaso said:

You ask and you shall receive.  The Raiders have cut G Gabe Jackson saving $9.6M in cap space.   He had a $9.35M base salary and a $250k workout bonus set for 2021.

His contract was through the 2022 season, and would have carried a $9.6M cap in 2022 as well. 

Damn... I wanted to see if we could keep him. I was hoping for a restructure/extension. 

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8 minutes ago, Chadstroma said:

Damn... I wanted to see if we could keep him. I was hoping for a restructure/extension. 

Me too, he was solid last year. Would have rather seen Richie go. 

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good start.  they are going to make some cuts, we don't like.  sorry to see him go.  but, richie is way cheaper.  and gruden loves him.  signing good, now becomes a priority, imho.

unless!  gruden has his eye on an OL for the first round.  a strong possibility.  gruden gonna gruden.

they are now under the cap.  but more cuts are needed, in order to sign any FA.  the rookie class will take up around 10M  

mariota is 10M.  richard is another 3.5M.  heath is another 3.1M

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2 minutes ago, DA RAIDERS said:

good start.  they are going to make some cuts, we don't like.  sorry to see him go.  but, richie is way cheaper.  and gruden loves him.  signing good, now becomes a priority, imho.

unless!  gruden has his eye on an OL for the first round.  a strong possibility.  gruden gonna gruden.

they are now under the cap.  but more cuts are needed, in order to sign any FA.  the rookie class will take up around 10M  

mariota is 10M.  richard is another 3.5M.  heath is another 3.1M

Good is a high priority now and this should signal that we are bringing Incognito back too. Still hoping we can deal Mariota. 

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T. Williams signing with the Lions for $6.2. Would have liked him back at that price but it is a bigger risk for a team to keep him after basically 1 3/4 years of unavailability than another team to take the chance on him new. 

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20 hours ago, Chadstroma said:

Damn... I wanted to see if we could keep him. I was hoping for a restructure/extension. 

Gabe is one of the top guards in the league when healthy, he'll be missed for sure. But the Oline needs to get cheaper so some of that cash can go towards rebuilding the defense.  

The depth of the Oline is one the strengths of the team. Plug Simpson in there, and hopefully he continues to develop like Miller and Goode have. So far, I see the Oline looking like this:

LT:Miller, LG Incognito, C Hudson, RG Simpson, RT: Goode/Brown??

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40 minutes ago, Bruno2 said:

Gabe is one of the top guards in the league when healthy, he'll be missed for sure. But the Oline needs to get cheaper so some of that cash can go towards rebuilding the defense.  

The depth of the Oline is one the strengths of the team. Plug Simpson in there, and hopefully he continues to develop like Miller and Goode have. So far, I see the Oline looking like this:

LT:Miller, LG Incognito, C Hudson, RG Simpson, RT: Goode/Brown??

Good really isn't a RT. He filled in and held up but I would be shocked if that was their plan. Brown is on the trading block right now. I think that means that they will cut him if we do not find a trade partner. We will be in the market for a new RT. 

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26 minutes ago, Chadstroma said:

Good really isn't a RT. He filled in and held up but I would be shocked if that was their plan. Brown is on the trading block right now. I think that means that they will cut him if we do not find a trade partner. We will be in the market for a new RT. 

i doubt they'll cut him.  costs too much.  we'll see  

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40 minutes ago, Chadstroma said:

Good really isn't a RT. He filled in and held up but I would be shocked if that was their plan. Brown is on the trading block right now. I think that means that they will cut him if we do not find a trade partner. We will be in the market for a new RT. 

I forgot about Brandon Parker. Played great in spots last year. I gotta think this is the year he finally develops into the starting RT he was drafted to be.

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51 minutes ago, Bruno2 said:

I forgot about Brandon Parker. Played great in spots last year. I gotta think this is the year he finally develops into the starting RT he was drafted to be.

I don't know about great. He held up decently. Was superior to Young for sure. No way we bring Young back. 

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