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Will Trump pardon everyone involved in the Capitol riots?


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With a flurry of pardons coming in this final week and half of the Trump presidency I'm curious if the forum believes Trump will issue a blanket pardon for everyone involved in the Capitol riots.

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the president can exercise the pardon power at any time, even before legal proceedings start or the prosecutor knows of the crime. The crime just needs to have been committed.

 

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See, that's the thing. I don't need media to tell me that an assault on the US Capitol during an congressional session counting electoral votes is worthy of investigation. You should maybe question yo

Struggling to understand why Presidents are able to pardon anyone. Why does the executive branch get to override the judicial branch. 

Whoops, forgot a big one.  Carter wasn't complicit in the draft dodging! 

I went No, Not Sure, Yes.

I don't think he cares about those people and it would just make him look worse than he already does with regard to this incident.  Snowden - I doubt Trump even understands what that is about so no clue what he does.  For himself, I think it's too easy an out not to take it.  He can always claim they are out to get me so I have to be sure they don't try to take your great leader from you!

Edited by AAABatteries
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22 minutes ago, AAABatteries said:

I don't think he cares about those people and it would just make him look worse than he already does with regard to this incident.

I agree but with Congress moving to impeach and with more moving to distance themselves from him he may feel these people who stormed the Capitol are all he has left. On top of that it would be a final FU to all who didn't bow down to him. It's already been reported he almost instantly regretted releasing the taped message denouncing the violence. If there was a way to pardon all of them with the exception of whoever was responsible for the death of the police officer my guess is he would be at least considering a blanket pardon.

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Just now, Willie Neslon said:

I agree but with Congress moving to impeach and with more moving to distance themselves from him he may feel these people who stormed the Capitol are all he has left. On top of that it would be a final FU to all who didn't bow down to him. It's already been reported he almost instantly regretted releasing the taped message denouncing the violence. If there was a way to pardon all of them with the exception of whoever was responsible for the death of the police officer my guess is he would be at least considering a blanket pardon.

Maybe and with him nothing would truly shock me but I think he's still holding out some level of hope that he can make a run in 2024 or one of his kids doing so.  Maybe I'm not reading the tea leaves clearly but that seems like just a final line that if he crosses it there's no coming back from it. 

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If he does pardon himself, I bet it takes the form of “I didn’t do anything wrong. Many people are saying I was the most law-abiding President since George Washington. But since Nasty Nancy and Cryin’ Chuck and the other election-stealing Democrats are out to get me, I hereby pardon myself for any crimes committed during my first-but-definitely-not-last term, although I definitely didn’t do anything wrong.”

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No on all.

A week left, I don't think he really gives a #### about the pleebs, or about Snowden.

The third....I put no. No particular reason. Not a super strong feeling, but I'm leaning that way. Just a gut feel, so don't quiz me on it.

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100% he will pardon himself, 90% for his SIL and the children who weren't raised by Marla Maples. Presuming minors are exempt from being charged with crimes here.

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3 minutes ago, DaVinci said:

Carter pardoned draft dodgers as a class.

forgot about that, thanks

those were people who violated a specific statue

we're talking about pardoning perps who may have violated several federal statutes

but the pardon power is sweeping so your example is probably a good analogy

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8 minutes ago, Bottomfeeder Sports said:

That is the executive order from the very beginning of his term.  Was there mechanics involved that put names to the pardons over then next four years?  Or was that all there was?  (Asking - don't know.)

There was no list of names before or after as far as I can tell.

ETA: I’m sure someone at the Pentagon could have compiled a list if Carter had asked.

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1 hour ago, Willie Neslon said:

I agree but with Congress moving to impeach and with more moving to distance themselves from him he may feel these people who stormed the Capitol are all he has left. On top of that it would be a final FU to all who didn't bow down to him. It's already been reported he almost instantly regretted releasing the taped message denouncing the violence. If there was a way to pardon all of them with the exception of whoever was responsible for the death of the police officer my guess is he would be at least considering a blanket pardon.

Agree.  And this would be the last chapter in his book.  He would be a political pariah to all except Parler

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3 minutes ago, fruity pebbles said:

Struggling to understand why Presidents are able to pardon anyone. Why does the executive branch get to override the judicial branch. 

I think presidential pardons are one of the few things the framers liked from Britain so they decided to adopt it. Governors can pardon as well. 

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A few differences between Carter's pardon of draft dodgers and any potential Trump pardon of Capitol rioters : 

- Carter campaigned on pardoning draft dodgers, so arguably had a mandate to do it. Trump does not have a mandate. 

- Carter did it during his first days in office. So he could have accomplished the same thing, for practical purposes, by simply instructing his DOJ to refrain from draft dodger prosecutions. Trump, on the other hand, would be binding future DOJ's. 

- Carter's pardon order in January of 1977 covered draft dodging crimes from the 60's up to March of 1973. So there had been almost 4 years for the investigation and prosecution of draft dodgers. Indeed, many had been prosecuted and already served their punishments. A Trump pardon would come before the extent of the crimes is known, and while the crimes are possibly ongoing. 

-Carter's pardon order specifically excluded anyone who used violence in dodging the draft. We'll have to wait and see if Trump's pardon does the same, though this raises the issue again of allowing for a complete investigation prior to issuing pardons. 

 

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https://news.yahoo.com/trump-reportedly-angry-aides-warning-070935116.html

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"The president has been warned, David, by some of his lawyers that if he goes ahead and pardons himself, he could be more vulnerable to civil lawsuits, including from some of those injured in the Capitol riot, because a self-pardon would be seen as an admission that he did something wrong that he would need to be pardoned for," Karl said. "The president is angry, he has not taken that well, and I am told that he is now saying that he doesn't want to see pardons for anybody. So the attitude seems to be: 'If I can't get a pardon, then nobody else should get one, either.'"

 

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if were just throwin stuff out there i hope he pardons pete rose and shoeless joe give those brohans a break take that to the bank brochachos 

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The idea that a President could pardon himself, essentially be the judge & jury and the defendant, is absurd. 

I am sure he will do it being the absurd person that he is and I am sure the GOP and his supporters will have no problem with it.

Edited by Godsbrother
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20 minutes ago, Yenrub said:

https://news.yahoo.com/trump-reportedly-angry-aides-warning-070935116.html

  Quote

"The president has been warned, David, by some of his lawyers that if he goes ahead and pardons himself, he could be more vulnerable to civil lawsuits, including from some of those injured in the Capitol riot, because a self-pardon would be seen as an admission that he did something wrong that he would need to be pardoned for," Karl said. "The president is angry, he has not taken that well, and I am told that he is now saying that he doesn't want to see pardons for anybody. So the attitude seems to be: 'If I can't get a pardon, then nobody else should get one, either.'"

I would also be very worried about Dominion suing him for $$$$$$.  He better have chosen his words wisely in all the tweets and speeches when referring to the Dominion machines being compromised.

 

 

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I'm not sure if the Republican Party would survive if Trump pardoned all the rioters, especially if Trump pardoned the people who attacked and killed police officers.

(Which is exactly why I think Trump might do it anyway. He no longer needs the party, so he may as well burn that bridge while he's still got the power to do it.)

 

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Trump despises his followers.  He won’t pardon any of them.  He will pardon himself, because he is the only thing he cares about.  I doubt he knows enough about Snowden to care.  His pardons are for people that carry his water.  

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10 hours ago, Sea Duck said:

I'm not sure if the Republican Party would survive if Trump pardoned all the rioters, especially if Trump pardoned the people who attacked and killed police officers.

The Democratic Party (at least how current comprised) doesn't survive if the Republican Party breaks up.  I'm not sure that is a bad thing.

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8 hours ago, Bottomfeeder Sports said:

The Democratic Party (at least how current comprised) doesn't survive if the Republican Party breaks up.  I'm not sure that is a bad thing.

If you're saying both the parties break up then where do I sign up?

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On 1/16/2021 at 1:25 AM, conlilnew said:

I hope he does pardon himself. He’s allowed to do it so why not. Give the middle finger one more time to these blood sucking good for nothing career politicians on the way out the door. 

Has this been throughly vetted? I thought there were opinions but we weren't sure where SCOTUS would go. You could say the 9 are heavily conservative, but I'm not sure that wins the day for him. 

I don't think he pardons the rioters, but if he wanted to many are already named and charged with something. He'd need a good attorney to write it for him. No to Snowden. 

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1 minute ago, -OZ- said:

Has this been throughly vetted? I thought there were opinions but we weren't sure where SCOTUS would go. You could say the 9 are heavily conservative, but I'm not sure that wins the day for him. 

 

This is true but my understanding is the only way it would get to SCOTUS is if the DOJ charges him with something and he tries to claim that he can't be charged because he's been pardoned.  That's when the legal battle would ensue.

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On 1/16/2021 at 2:25 AM, conlilnew said:

I hope he does pardon himself. He’s allowed to do it so why not. Give the middle finger one more time to these blood sucking good for nothing career politicians on the way out the door. 

For some reason this is important to people.  It doesn't seem to matter that he gave the entire country the middle finger too.

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28 minutes ago, GoBirds said:

He needs to pardon himself and family so the witch hunt can end and we can all move forward from it. 

What happened to the party of "if you didn't do anything wrong, you have nothing to be afraid of"?

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7 minutes ago, dawgtrails said:

What happened to the party of "if you didn't do anything wrong, you have nothing to be afraid of"?

They have been silent since Trump has refused to release his tax returns (and no one believes the IRS has been auditing him since 2015.

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17 minutes ago, dawgtrails said:

What happened to the party of "if you didn't do anything wrong, you have nothing to be afraid of"?

The hysterical tantrum like behavior of the other party for the last 4 plus years happened. Trying desperately to get anything possible to stick on a daily basis, coming up empty. 
 

It’s an old tired act those that aren’t part of it are ready to move on from. 

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48 minutes ago, GoBirds said:

He needs to pardon himself and family so the witch hunt can end and we can all move forward from it. 

The pardon won’t stop all the state’s cases. A lot of prosecutors and civil lawyers are going to want justice. IMO, we are just coming up to the starting line.

It should be interesting, though, and I hope we can get some actual legal guardrails in place to keep any president from acting like this again, rather than only relying on traditions and norms.

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4 minutes ago, The Football Freak said:

The pardon won’t stop all the state’s cases. A lot of prosecutors and civil lawyers are going to want justice. IMO, we are just coming up to the starting line.

It should be interesting, though, and I hope we can get some actual legal guardrails in place to keep any president from acting like this again, rather than only relying on traditions and norms.

Sandy I think your are right we are just coming to the starting line, too many bruised egos that they have been wrong on previous claims and any attorney desperate for attention can file a lawsuit. Any clown can file a lawsuit, so get ready for the circus. 
 

Doesn’t look like he will pardon himself but I think he should. 

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2 minutes ago, GoBirds said:

Sandy I think your are right we are just coming to the starting line, too many bruised egos that they have been wrong on previous claims and any attorney desperate for attention can file a lawsuit. Any clown can file a lawsuit, so get ready for the circus. 
 

Doesn’t look like he will pardon himself but I think he should. 

Those types won’t go forward, I’d guess. They’ll probably get thrown out for lack of merit, or some such thing. I’m more thinking of civil cases like the charity case or his fraud cases, and state prosecutors bringing criminal cases. It should be pretty interesting, and likely lead to a few new laws to deter future presidents from the gray areas of presidential illegality. I think that will be going on straight through 2022. 

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5 minutes ago, The Football Freak said:

Those types won’t go forward, I’d guess. They’ll probably get thrown out for lack of merit, or some such thing. I’m more thinking of civil cases like the charity case or his fraud cases, and state prosecutors bringing criminal cases. It should be pretty interesting, and likely lead to a few new laws to deter future presidents from the gray areas of presidential illegality. I think that will be going on straight through 2022. 

I think your timeline might be short, just look at how many are obsessed with attacking him....I bet you have those he triggered going after him anyway they can for years and years. Claims that usually would never be made, but it’s Trump so throw it and see what sticks. 

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2 minutes ago, Godsbrother said:

It is surprising to me that anyone would be okay if a president that committed crimes while in office escaped prosecution by pardoning himself. 
 

Never under normal circumstances, only the current where the opposition party has spent years attempting to manufacture any “crime” they could to get him out of office. There’s a whole new President, time to accept the election results from 4 years ago and move on. 

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16 minutes ago, Godsbrother said:

It is surprising to me that anyone would be okay if a president person that committed crimes while in office escaped prosecution by pardoning himself. 
 

Slightly edited, but this. The fact anyone would support this frankly sickens me. So disappointed to see people on board with this in any way, shape or fashion. I'm amazed at how far this country has fallen morally. 

Edited by DallasDMac
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1 hour ago, GoBirds said:

I think your timeline might be short, just look at how many are obsessed with attacking him....I bet you have those he triggered going after him anyway they can for years and years. Claims that usually would never be made, but it’s Trump so throw it and see what sticks. 

Trump and his businesses have been involved in over 3,500 lawsuits. So this won’t be much of a change. 

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49 minutes ago, GoBirds said:

It’s been really sad to watch so many try to prosecute for 4 years not caring what/if there was a real crime. Disappointed how far we have fallen morally. 

Technically, he hasn’t been prosecuted for any crime during the last four years.

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9 minutes ago, bigbottom said:

Technically, he hasn’t been prosecuted for any crime during the last four years.

I did not follow the Russian stuff that proved to be false.  What crime has Trump done the last 4 years to be prosecuted for?

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