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“Cancel Culture” and “Woke”


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10 minutes ago, General Malaise said:

Do you think she will find another job in acting?

In Hollywood? Only if she submits to their "reeducation." Otherwise it will be indie projects for her.

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That was way too long a post.  Gordon Gekko is looking at that and wondering why I couldn't tighten it up a little.

Cancelling an awards show might be the best thing ever to emerge from the woke movement.  If they cancel the Oscars, I might become pro-woke.

Right-wingers do something dumb: "Look at those right-wingers.  What a bunch of dummies." Progressives do something dumb: "Look at those right-wingers complaining about that thing we did.  What a

2 minutes ago, Maurile Tremblay said:

I think it's pretty obvious that "she refused to put BLM stuff in her profile" and "she refused to put pronouns in her profile" are no part of why she was let go. As a wild guess, I'd estimate that fewer than 10% of Disney actors have anything in their Twitter profiles about BLM or pronouns. Disney obviously doesn't have a policy of firing all people who don't.

The Wikipedia summary doesn't mention that she refused to put BLM stuff or pronoun stuff in her profile. It instead mentions a bunch of other things. Those other things are very likely the story here, IMO.

If it was just about not putting it in her bio, that would be that. It was about the constant harassment she received from that that caused Disney to step in to "discipline" her and ask her to apologize for her actions. Without the mob, you're right, Disney wouldn't care.

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6 minutes ago, Insein said:

In Hollywood? Only if she submits to their "reeducation." Otherwise it will be indie projects for her.

One of my best friends works for Kimmel.  Conservatives have to keep it to themselves if they want to stay in the industry.

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2 minutes ago, Maurile Tremblay said:

I think it's pretty obvious that "she refused to put BLM stuff in her profile" and "she refused to put pronouns in her profile" are no part of why she was let go. As a wild guess, I'd estimate that fewer than 10% of Disney actors have anything in their Twitter profiles about BLM or pronouns. Disney obviously doesn't have a policy of firing all people who don't.

The Wikipedia summary doesn't mention that she refused to put BLM stuff or pronoun stuff in her profile. It instead mentions a bunch of other things. Those other things are very likely the story here, IMO.

I'm in the same boat as you and timschochet in that I didn't know this person existed as recently as a week or so ago.  I watched the first season of The Mandalorian a while back and was like "Oh, it's that person" when I looked her up, but I didn't know anything about her background or political views or whatever until super-recently.  

I keep waiting for some highly-offensive post to drop that makes all of this make sense, but none of what's been reported so far rises above Dumb Stuff That People Say On Social Media Literally Everyday.  People keep coming back to the Nazi analogy, but members of congress have made plenty of dumb Nazi analogies.  Now, personally, I agree that we should probably hold people in high-status occupations like actresses in science fiction series to a higher standard than low-status occupations like members of congress, but I still can't get too excited over this. 

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49 minutes ago, Insein said:

Offensive on what grounds? Pointing out that persecution starts when a government turns it's people against each other for having different beliefs? Or is it that you cannot make any posts in modern society about the holocaust or Nazi germany in any capacity?

I don’t think you should be drawing on the example of the Holocaust to warn about what could happen to conservatives in the USA. Offensive and idiotic. Not sure why this remains a question. 

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1 minute ago, IvanKaramazov said:

I'm in the same boat as you and timschochet in that I didn't know this person existed as recently as a week or so ago.  I watched the first season of The Mandalorian a while back and was like "Oh, it's that person" when I looked her up, but I didn't know anything about her background or political views or whatever until super-recently.  

I keep waiting for some highly-offensive post to drop that makes all of this make sense, but none of what's been reported so far rises above Dumb Stuff That People Say On Social Media Literally Everyday.  People keep coming back to the Nazi analogy, but members of congress have made plenty of dumb Nazi analogies.  Now, personally, I agree that we should probably hold people in high-status occupations like actresses in science fiction series to a higher standard than low-status occupations like members of congress, but I still can't get too excited over this. 

I don’t find it exciting but I’d still fire her. 

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1 minute ago, timschochet said:

I don’t think you should be drawing on the example of the Holocaust to warn about what could happen to conservatives in the USA. Offensive and idiotic. Not sure why this remains a question. 

Again, she never even brought up conservatives. She said political beliefs. The fact that people filled in that blank proved her point.

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5 hours ago, massraider said:

Nope. 

Agree that it's bad when people face consequences for their actions? I sure don't. 

Now, does every person who gets cancelled deserve it? Not in my opinion. 

I don't really see what Gina Carano said that should have her lose her job. Funny part is, I don't think most Star Wars superfans would have been that bothered by it.  I'm sure a good amount agreed with her. 

I think Disney has been less than thrilled by her politics, I think this was a unilateral move by them, her contract was up, they didn't like her statements, and they didn't want her around. Have you noticed that when anyone brings up Nazis, it never goes well? The most harmless comparison, and it always blows up. 

I didn't think it was fair when Kaepernick was cancelled. He didn't deserve it. 

I can acknowledge these mistakes, agree when someone says the punishment doesn't fit the crime. Anyone wants to right these wrongs, I'm in favor. Let's get Carano working. 

I can also take immense amounts of pleasure when a Joss Whedon, Brett Ratner, Marilyn Manson, Paula Deen, Bill Cosby go down. 

Unless, of course, you're Pedro Pascal (THE Mandalorian).   Then it's okay.

You see how this goes?  Only one side is getting cancelled because they aren't applying the rules evenly.

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4 minutes ago, BladeRunner said:

Unless, of course, you're Pedro Pascal (THE Mandalorian).   Then it's okay.

You see how this goes?  Only one side is getting cancelled because they aren't applying the rules evenly.

So are you suggesting that the left has all the power?

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1 minute ago, General Malaise said:

So are you suggesting that the left has all the power?

No, the right doesn’t fire people if they don’t share their views as much.

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1 hour ago, Insein said:

Offensive on what grounds? Pointing out that persecution starts when a government turns it's people against each other for having different beliefs? Or is it that you cannot make any posts in modern society about the holocaust or Nazi germany in any capacity?

Wait, is this how you see Nazi Germany?

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32 minutes ago, quick-hands said:

Don't you have a bunch of employees?    You would fire them if you found out they shared her views?

Not a bunch. I have some. If one of my real estate salespersons posted this live I would fire them yes. Not to do so would hurt my business. Plus I really don’t want to be associated with such a person. 

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Just now, timschochet said:

Not a bunch. I have some. If one of my real estate salespersons posted this live I would fire them yes. Not to do so would hurt my business. Plus I really don’t want to be associated with such a person. 

Serious question.  What if one of your employees posted something about how we should look past Roman Polanski's child rape allegations?  Should that person lose their job over one very bad take?  Or is a bad take about child rape meaningfully not as bad as a bad take about Nazis?

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5 minutes ago, IvanKaramazov said:

Serious question.  What if one of your employees posted something about how we should look past Roman Polanski's child rape allegations?  Should that person lose their job over one very bad take?  Or is a bad take about child rape meaningfully not as bad as a bad take about Nazis?

Good question. It depends where and how and under what circumstances and if they had bad information and if they apologized for it, etc etc. 

But if I think someone is saying something publicly that could have a negative effect on my business, then sure, termination would have to be a strong consideration. In light of your specific example, good thing for me that I’m the boss! 

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1 minute ago, timschochet said:

Good question. It depends where and how and under what circumstances and if they had bad information and if they apologized for it, etc etc. 

But if I think someone is saying something publicly that could have a negative effect on my business, then sure, termination would have to be a strong consideration. In light of your specific example, good thing for me that I’m the boss! 

Let’s make it simple - I went to a Trump rally.  Do I have a job at Tim S Inc on Monday?

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1 minute ago, timschochet said:

Good question. It depends where and how and under what circumstances and if they had bad information and if they apologized for it, etc etc. 

But if I think someone is saying something publicly that could have a negative effect on my business, then sure, termination would have to be a strong consideration. In light of your specific example, good thing for me that I’m the boss! 

That's fair and I don't mean anything personal by it.  Just something to think about before we start throwing strangers under the bus.

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Just now, FairWarning said:

Let’s make it simple - I went to a Trump rally.  Do I have a job at Tim S Inc on Monday?

Sure. I actually have some ardent Trump supporters who work for me. I don’t know if they attended rallied but it wouldn’t surprise me. 

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1 minute ago, IvanKaramazov said:

That's fair and I don't mean anything personal by it.  Just something to think about before we start throwing strangers under the bus.

I made the point in my comment that if this woman was one of my real estate salespersons I would fire her because that sort of thing, publicly stated would hurt my business. But if the woman was a contractor or doing something else that didn’t involve public relations I probably wouldn’t fire her. I still wouldn’t want to be associated with her, but I would find it unfair to fire her under such circumstances. I don’t think I could do it, to be honest, 

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54 minutes ago, timschochet said:

I don’t think you should be drawing on the example of the Holocaust to warn about what could happen to conservatives in the USA.

To be fair, I don't think this is what Carano was doing.

She was posting about a period before the Holocaust took place. Unwittingly, she was probably talking about Germany sometime during the Weimar Republic years.

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36 minutes ago, BladeRunner said:

Unless, of course, you're Pedro Pascal (THE Mandalorian).   Then it's okay.

You see how this goes?  Only one side is getting cancelled because they aren't applying the rules evenly.

Only one side is GOOD at it. That's not the same thing. 

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7 minutes ago, massraider said:

Only one side is GOOD at it. That's not the same thing. 

negative. That's disingenuous. When one side holds 99% of the power in entertainment, news and media it's not because they're good at it. It's because they control almost everything.

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8 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Sure. I actually have some ardent Trump supporters who work for me. I don’t know if they attended rallied but it wouldn’t surprise me. 

That would be the correct answer IMO (I never have been to one).I do see there it’s can be a major problem when it off the clock actions interfere with a business though.

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28 minutes ago, FairWarning said:

I assume it’s a trump thing.  He’s clearly an outlier.  

Nice to be able to pick and choose your battles like this.   

 

THE RIGHT DOESN'T FIRE PEOPLE WHO DON'T AGREE WITH THEM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111*

 

Uh, Trump fired like everybody who didn't agree with him.

HE DOESN'T COUNT!!!!111 

 

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3 minutes ago, General Malaise said:

Nice to be able to pick and choose your battles like this.   

 

THE RIGHT DOESN'T FIRE PEOPLE WHO DON'T AGREE WITH THEM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111*

 

Uh, Trump fired like everybody who didn't agree with him.

HE DOESN'T COUNT!!!!111 

 

Not to mention that conservatives are currently trying to remove  every Republican politician who opposes Trump. 

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For me its not so much that disney fired her.  I'm sure they were within their rights and they are simply bowing to the mob.  Its the mob thats the problem.  Whether its Gina Carrano, some random guy or some random kid.

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1 minute ago, timschochet said:

Not to mention that conservatives are currently trying to remove  every Republican politician who opposes Trump. 

Unfortunately that is just whole different level of unhinged by a party.  What time is his speech Sunday?  I’ll watch 90 day fiancée or something else.

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"When we look at Auschwitz we see the end of the process. It's important to remember that the Holocaust actually did not start from gas chambers. This hatred gradually developed from words, stereotypes & prejudice through legal exclusion, dehumanisation & escalating violence." - Auschwitz Memorial

LINK  WARNING this was posted on Twitter.

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2 minutes ago, djmich said:

For me its not so much that disney fired her.  I'm sure they were within their rights and they are simply bowing to the mob.  Its the mob thats the problem.  Whether its Gina Carrano, some random guy or some random kid.

You say “mob”, I say “consumers”. And I don’t see a problem. What she said was awful and I’m glad she was fired. 

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1 minute ago, NorvilleBarnes said:

"When we look at Auschwitz we see the end of the process. It's important to remember that the Holocaust actually did not start from gas chambers. This hatred gradually developed from words, stereotypes & prejudice through legal exclusion, dehumanisation & escalating violence." - Auschwitz Memorial

LINK  WARNING this was posted on Twitter.

Can we cancel the Auschwitz Memorial?

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Just now, NorvilleBarnes said:

"When we look at Auschwitz we see the end of the process. It's important to remember that the Holocaust actually did not start from gas chambers. This hatred gradually developed from words, stereotypes & prejudice through legal exclusion, dehumanisation & escalating violence." - Auschwitz Memorial

LINK  WARNING this was posted on Twitter.

You do get that Jews weren’t persecuted because of their political ideology, right? 

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Just now, timschochet said:

You do get that Jews weren’t persecuted because of their political ideology, right? 

They weren't persecuted because the color of their skin either...guess thats ok?

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10 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Not to mention that conservatives are currently trying to remove  every Republican politician who opposes Trump. 

By voting them out. Yes some states are making censures to them. We all know how much weight those hold. People are preparing to vote them out in 2022 if they can. 

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Just now, NorvilleBarnes said:

Yes - but that's a very bizarre question in response to what I posted.

No it’s at the core of the offense. Nobody is treating conservatives (or liberals, or any other ideology) the way the Nazis treated Jews. Nobody is threatening to do so. There are no pogroms of conservatives. Conservatives aren’t being sent to camps. We’re not on a slippery slope towards that either. It’s dumb and it’s totally offensive. Stop it. 

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What's amazing to me is of all the references to Nazi's, stormtroopers, concentration camps, etc we have seen over the past two years....Gina Carrano was the one who had to go...lol.  Pelosi, AOC, Biden.  Those were only the first three I googled.

You don't have fire them though because their constituents support those comparisons.

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4 minutes ago, djmich said:

They weren't persecuted because the color of their skin either...guess thats ok?

Anti-semitism is a different form of bigotry than racism but it’s still bigotry and like racism it has a terrible history. But not here though. We’ve only had minor incidents of anti-semitism in American history: some discrimination at times, a few bad incidents, one terrible lynching. Nothing like Europe. On the other hand our treatment of blacks and natives has been worse than any country on the globe save some of Central America. 

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9 minutes ago, timschochet said:
10 minutes ago, NorvilleBarnes said:

"When we look at Auschwitz we see the end of the process. It's important to remember that the Holocaust actually did not start from gas chambers. This hatred gradually developed from words, stereotypes & prejudice through legal exclusion, dehumanisation & escalating violence." - Auschwitz Memorial

LINK  WARNING this was posted on Twitter.

You do get that Jews weren’t persecuted because of their political ideology, right? 

Also: you (Norville) do get that the persecution didn't start with the Holocaust, right?

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25 minutes ago, BladeRunner said:

negative. That's disingenuous. When one side holds 99% of the power in entertainment, news and media it's not because they're good at it. It's because they control almost everything.

Both sides attempt boycotts.  One has been more successful.  I don't feel like that's disingenuous.  

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4 minutes ago, timschochet said:

No it’s at the core of the offense. Nobody is treating conservatives (or liberals, or any other ideology) the way the Nazis treated Jews. Nobody is threatening to do so. There are no pogroms of conservatives. Conservatives aren’t being sent to camps. We’re not on a slippery slope towards that either. It’s dumb and it’s totally offensive. Stop it. 

I disagree. We are on a slippery slope. If things aren't opposed, they tend to escalate and get worse. You yourself have gone from not knowing what cancel culture is, to supporting it in an astonishingly short time. There's nothing offensive about the Auschwitz Memorial pointing this out. There's nothing wrong with Carano saying essentially the same thing.

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4 hours ago, timschochet said:

No it’s at the core of the offense. Nobody is treating conservatives (or liberals, or any other ideology) the way the Nazis treated Jews. Nobody is threatening to do so. There are no pogroms of conservatives. Conservatives aren’t being sent to camps. We’re not on a slippery slope towards that either. It’s dumb and it’s totally offensive. Stop it. 

Tim, your attempts to distort the actual reality we've been living in for at least the last 4 years and more is absurd.  It's almost as if you don't want face the real truth behind it all because you're afraid of the consequences that might entail.  You want this sugar-coated fantasy that's just not real.

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1 minute ago, djmich said:

What's amazing to me is of all the references to Nazi's, stormtroopers, concentration camps, etc we have seen over the past two years....Gina Carrano was the one who had to go...lol.  Pelosi, AOC, Biden.  Those were only the first three I googled.

You don't have fire them though because their constituents support those comparisons.

Of the ones you mentioned the only one I found personally offensive was AOC. If she was working for Disney I would have been glad if she was fired over it. 
I’ve never liked AOC and I could never ever vote for her. But in recent days she has redeemed herself in my eyes through what she has done for the people of Texas. I now think she’s a pretty good person though still wrong about so many things. 

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1 minute ago, BladeRunner said:

Tim, you attempts to distort the actual reality we've been living in for at least the last 4 years and more is absurd.  It's almost as if you don't want face the real truth behind it all because you're afraid of the consequences that might entail.  You want this sugar-coated fantasy that's just not real.

You’re not the victim you think you are. Sorry but you’re not. 

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