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“Cancel Culture” and “Woke”


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4 hours ago, Summer Wheat said:

Is being "Woke" getting old?  Oscar ratings down 56%, NBA ratings down.

 

Sunday's 93rd annual Academy Awards, held at Los Angeles' Union Station, plunged to 10.4 million viewers, according to final Nielsen estimates.  That's down 56% from last year's  23.6 million viewers, that was a record-low that was down by 6 million from 2019. 

The Oscars claimed just 2.1% of adults ages 18 to 49 age group advertisers covet.

Is the Oscars something that was adored by Boomers up to maybe Gen X and then has fallen off a cliff with older people?

 

I know the narrative from the Right is going to be if anything...and I mean ANYTHING suffers even miniscule lower numbers/revenue after it has taken a sembelance of a stance on "social issues" is going to be "SEE!!!! NOONE WANTS THAT EQUALITY CRAP IN OUR ENTERTAINMENT!!...JUST PLAY BALL!!!".  But I'd imagine that people just aren't as interested because there is much more entertainment out there.  

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The 56th annual Academy of Country Music Awards — aka the ACM Awards — suffered a brutal ratings plunge on Sunday night.

The ACM Awards became the latest music awards show to plunge in the ratings, though this drop appears especially severe. The annual country music awards gala pulled a modest 0.8 rating in the critical 18-49 demographic, while drawing an unexpectedly-low 6.08 million total viewers according to preliminary Nielsen numbers. That is the lowest-rated and least-watched ACM Awards in the 56-year history of the event.

The double-whammy represents a blow to both the Academy of Country Music and CBS, especially given the greater reliability of country music audiences. The latest ratings represent an 8% drop in total viewers in 2020, and a 20% ratings tank year-over-year.

 

For those pushing the ridiculous narrative that ratings for the Oscars and NBA are down because of 'woke' fatigue, I present to you some evidence that the ratings for the 'unwoke' awards were also decimated.

:coffee:

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1 hour ago, General Malaise said:

For those pushing the ridiculous narrative that ratings for the Oscars and NBA are down because of 'woke' fatigue, I present to you some evidence that the ratings for the 'unwoke' awards were also decimated.

:coffee:

Yep, as I noted earlier, all awards shows are taking a beating. The thing is, anything worthwhile at them is on YT the next day, so why suffer through the slop when you watch what little you want to see, if any, the next day without all of the nonsense?

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7 hours ago, Thunderlips said:

Is the Oscars something that was adored by Boomers up to maybe Gen X and then has fallen off a cliff with older people?

 

I know the narrative from the Right is going to be if anything...and I mean ANYTHING suffers even miniscule lower numbers/revenue after it has taken a sembelance of a stance on "social issues" is going to be "SEE!!!! NOONE WANTS THAT EQUALITY CRAP IN OUR ENTERTAINMENT!!...JUST PLAY BALL!!!".  But I'd imagine that people just aren't as interested because there is much more entertainment out there.  

I agree.  I am only in my 30s and really don`t care about what actors say. Pretty sure that is one thing both parties agree with. Ricky Gervais nailed when he says "Nobody cares what you think"

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22 hours ago, Maurile Tremblay said:

Seriously, you guys? Nobody's posted the James Carville article yet?

“Wokeness is a problem and we all know it”

Interesting follow on conversation to this. Also includes Greenwald. 
 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=D13_MrrSLh8

 

ETA this is great:

“Take someone like Democratic Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez. She’s obviously very bright. She knows how to draw a headline. In my opinion, some of her political aspirations are impractical and probably not going to happen. But that’s probably the worst thing that you can say about her.

Now take someone like Marjorie Taylor Greene, the new Republican congresswoman from Georgia. She’s absolutely loonier than a tune. We all know it. And yet, for some reason, the Democrats pay a bigger political price for AOC than Republicans pay for Greene. That’s the problem in a nutshell. And it’s ridiculous because AOC and Greene are not comparable in any way.”

Edited by -jb-
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Woke is a boogeyman claimed by the right against the left similar to how the racism boogeyman is claimed by left against the right. Both are lazy and overused conventions used by people who like emojis more than critical thought. These things exist (and suck) but not to the level some think/want them to.

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26 minutes ago, kwille said:

Woke is a boogeyman claimed by the right against the left similar to how the racism boogeyman is claimed by left against the right. Both are lazy and overused conventions used by people who like emojis more than critical thought. These things exist (and suck) but not to the level some think/want them to.

I think this is correct (in a high level and lazy way) but important to distinguish that without the initial lazy/overused conventions (your example of racism) then the reaction (woke) wouldn't be necessary.

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32 minutes ago, kwille said:

Woke is a boogeyman claimed by the right against the left similar to how the racism boogeyman is claimed by left against the right. Both are lazy and overused conventions used by people who like emojis more than critical thought. These things exist (and suck) but not to the level some think/want them to.

Most people I see complaining about wokeness are on the left, not the right. (I'm sure there are people on the right complaining about it too, but I don't watch Fox News.) And they don't use emojis.

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3 minutes ago, Maurile Tremblay said:

Most people I see complaining about wokeness are on the left, not the right. (I'm sure there are people on the right complaining about it too, but I don't watch Fox News.)

Point taken. Maybe my left/right analysis was equally lazy. I'll maintain that complaints of woke and racism are exaggerated for easy to use convention by many which actually lessens the effectiveness of some to foster honest dialog 

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4 hours ago, -jb- said:

Interesting follow on conversation to this. Also includes Greenwald. 
 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=D13_MrrSLh8

 

ETA this is great:

“Take someone like Democratic Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez. She’s obviously very bright. She knows how to draw a headline. In my opinion, some of her political aspirations are impractical and probably not going to happen. But that’s probably the worst thing that you can say about her.

Now take someone like Marjorie Taylor Greene, the new Republican congresswoman from Georgia. She’s absolutely loonier than a tune. We all know it. And yet, for some reason, the Democrats pay a bigger political price for AOC than Republicans pay for Greene. That’s the problem in a nutshell. And it’s ridiculous because AOC and Greene are not comparable in any way.”

The blue team doesn't pay a price for AOC.  All of her policy positions are in line to be implemented.  The talk should be of the profit she's brought.

Greene is a nobody, essentially a political non entity to the mainstream.

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6 hours ago, djmich said:

Those people are engaging in cyber bullying. I'd like to see an organized campaign to get them all fired from their jobs. Followed, naturally, by a retaliatory campaign to get the second group fired for bullying the first group. And so on, and so on, creating a never ending cycle of woke-vs-woke. Then the rest of us can go back to talking about the real issues affecting the country, such as: why can't they find a decent replacement for Alex Trebek??

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On 4/29/2021 at 11:48 AM, kwille said:

Woke is a boogeyman claimed by the right against the left similar to how the racism boogeyman is claimed by left against the right. Both are lazy and overused conventions used by people who like emojis more than critical thought. These things exist (and suck) but not to the level some think/want them to.

:thumbup:

 

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Without taking sides here, it sure has been a slow month for the woke-up cancel culture, huh? I'd think we all can agree that's a good thing. 

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35 minutes ago, woodstock said:

Without taking sides here, it sure has been a slow month for the woke-up cancel culture, huh? I'd think we all can agree that's a good thing. 

Hopefully people are slowly getting out more and more and not obsessing over dumb #### at home on their devices.  

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7 minutes ago, KarmaPolice said:

Hopefully people are slowly getting out more and more and not obsessing over dumb #### at home on their devices.  

Yes! Hadn't thought too much about that. I hope people please go about their business and spend less time worrying about others' failings. I'd be willing to bet that pandemic seriousness and woke culture share a positive correlation. Let's hope that's the case.

But that's a sad comment about humanity if you really think about it, though. To insist others' thoughts pass one's own purity test. That's why revolutions often wind up with heads in guillotines and civil wars lead to permanent armed strife. The purity test of the reformer is quite the thing. 

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11 hours ago, KarmaPolice said:

Hopefully people are slowly getting out more and more and not obsessing over dumb #### at home on their devices.  

Yet...here we all are.

:bag:

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11 hours ago, woodstock said:

I'd be willing to bet that pandemic seriousness and woke culture share a positive correlation.

It would be interesting to know how often pandemics lead to moral panics.  I know that's a common trope in fiction -- people get sick from a new disease and six months later we're burning witches -- but I don't honestly know if these two things are really linked IRL.  It would explain a lot of how 2020 went though.

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12 hours ago, jobarules said:

NYC DOE canceled Columbus Day

I have no problem with this.  It makes a lot of social sense to keep holidays non-controversial.  Given that Columbus is a bit of a lightning rod for a significant chunk of the population, it seems to me that Columbus Day just adds a little bit of division that we don't need.  

I say that with the usual disclaimer that if my employer wants to give me a paid day off to celebrate bin Laden's birthday, I'll take it and be happy.

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19 minutes ago, IvanKaramazov said:

I have no problem with this.  It makes a lot of social sense to keep holidays non-controversial.  Given that Columbus is a bit of a lightning rod for a significant chunk of the population, it seems to me that Columbus Day just adds a little bit of division that we don't need.  

I say that with the usual disclaimer that if my employer wants to give me a paid day off to celebrate bin Laden's birthday, I'll take it and be happy.

While I agree in spirit, where does it end? I have no dog in the Columbus Day fight, but what's next, Christmas and Easter are lightning rods for non-believers, so do we do away with those as well?  Thanksgiving, too, for obvious reasons?  

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25 minutes ago, Ghost Rider said:

While I agree in spirit, where does it end? I have no dog in the Columbus Day fight, but what's next, Christmas and Easter are lightning rods for non-believers, so do we do away with those as well?  Thanksgiving, too, for obvious reasons?  

Not everyone celebrates Christmas and Easter / Good Friday, but enough people do so that you might as well just make them days off.  If we lived in a country that was predominately Jewish, I imagine we would do something similar with major Jewish holidays and that would be fine.  Us Christians could enjoy Chinese Food on Yom Kippur or whatever.  But also, nobody is actively offended at Christmas the way they are about Columbus Day.  

I'm comfortable writing off the "I'm offended over Thanksgiving" people as cranks.  

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58 minutes ago, Ghost Rider said:

While I agree in spirit, where does it end? I have no dog in the Columbus Day fight, but what's next, Christmas and Easter are lightning rods for non-believers, so do we do away with those as well?  Thanksgiving, too, for obvious reasons?  

Man do I get sick of slippery slope arguments. The answer is, it ends with Christmas and Thanksgiving and Easter. 

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1 hour ago, Ghost Rider said:

While I agree in spirit, where does it end? I have no dog in the Columbus Day fight, but what's next, Christmas and Easter are lightning rods for non-believers, so do we do away with those as well?  Thanksgiving, too, for obvious reasons?  

 

They are?

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33 minutes ago, IvanKaramazov said:

Not everyone celebrates Christmas and Easter / Good Friday, but enough people do so that you might as well just make them days off.  If we lived in a country that was predominately Jewish, I imagine we would do something similar with major Jewish holidays and that would be fine.  Us Christians could enjoy Chinese Food on Yom Kippur or whatever.  But also, nobody is actively offended at Christmas the way they are about Columbus Day.  

I'm comfortable writing off the "I'm offended over Thanksgiving" people as cranks.  

We used to get Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur off back in college, since the university has a very large Jewish population.  It was always a welcome and unexpected day off since I never knew when the holidays were going to be.  Always messed you up a little bit that it was a 6 PM - 6 PM day off of classes though.

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8 hours ago, IvanKaramazov said:

But also, nobody is actively offended at Christmas the way they are about Columbus Day.  

You must not know any hardcore Christians then.  

 

The kind that quote scripture to show that Jesus was born around August and say Xmas is pagan sunworship  and actually the Saturnalia festival of devil worship.  

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8 hours ago, IvanKaramazov said:

I'm comfortable writing off the "I'm offended over Thanksgiving" people as cranks.  

I don't see how you can be cool with Columbus day being cut but say this.  

For most, the two events are intrinsically linked.  Makes sense considering they were probably taught the same day/week in school.  

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7 minutes ago, cockroach said:

You must not know any hardcore Christians then.  

 

The kind that quote scripture to show that Jesus was born around August and say Xmas is pagan sunworship  and actually the Saturnalia festival of devil worship.  

I know a ton of hardcore Christians and I've never met a single person who thinks that Christmas is a pagan holiday.  I've met lots of atheists in this forum who adore that argument though.  I don't really care if they're offended by the holiday.  

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14 minutes ago, IvanKaramazov said:

I know a ton of hardcore Christians and I've never met a single person who thinks that Christmas is a pagan holiday.  I've met lots of atheists in this forum who adore that argument though.  I don't really care if they're offended by the holiday.  

 

Well, if you'd like to meet some I know where they hang on Wed night for bible study.   Some also gather to observe the sabbath from sundown Friday to sundown Saturday.  

 

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43 minutes ago, IvanKaramazov said:

I know a ton of hardcore Christians and I've never met a single person who thinks that Christmas is a pagan holiday.  I've met lots of atheists in this forum who adore that argument though.  I don't really care if they're offended by the holiday.  

Christmas is a coopted pagan holiday.  As a Christian I have no issues with that (why not steal the wind from a false religion?).  I also don't care who may be offended (I'm also not offended that it's become a big commercial holiday).  Easter is the important Christian holy day.

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37 minutes ago, cockroach said:

 

Well, if you'd like to meet some I know where they hang on Wed night for bible study.   Some also gather to observe the sabbath from sundown Friday to sundown Saturday.  

 

Arent they called "jews"

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1 hour ago, jobarules said:

Yep

Happy holidays 

People say Happy Holidays because they don't know if the person is a Christian or not. Not because there is some anti-Christmas jihad.

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3 hours ago, whoknew said:

People say Happy Holidays because they don't know if the person is a Christian or not. Not because there is some anti-Christmas jihad.

I always thought people said Happy Holidays because Christmas and New Year were so close together 

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23 hours ago, Ghost Rider said:

While I agree in spirit, where does it end? I have no dog in the Columbus Day fight, but what's next, Christmas and Easter are lightning rods for non-believers, so do we do away with those as well?  Thanksgiving, too, for obvious reasons?  

Thanksgiving as it exists today will absolutely die.  It might morph into a day of thanks, but the references and links to the country's history will end.  Facts,

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Saw this trending the other day: controversy with the UT fight song.  I think it's a good example of what people view as the excesses of cancel culture.  Someone declares that the long-standing fight song of a southern university is racist, which on its face doesn't seem like a stretch.  Except, in this case, the song appears to be from the early 20th century and the lyrics themselves, while IMO kind of stupid, are unobjectionable.  The pro cancel people then pivot to the “I’ve been working on the railroad” melody, which may or may not have unsavory roots (the exact origin of the melody seems disputed).  Next pivot seems to be that at some point maybe people in blackface performed the song, which while they don’t seem to have any proof, is certainly possible. 

There are the usual sort of overwrought declarations about how people seeing the plaque in the visitor’s center will not feel welcome.  Which, to be fair, may be true now that half of the guides have declared the song racist, but if those same people had stumbled across the plaque 5 years ago, I doubt they would have given it a second glance.  I don’t see how the phrase “the eyes of Texas” itself would put anyone in some sort of distress.

People who are closer on the ground can feel free to chime in, but to me it seems like a group of people for whatever reason decided they didn’t like the song, declared it racist on flimsy grounds, and now are demanding that anything short of complete acquiescence to their demands is an affront to the entire minority community.

And I think the natural tendency of most people is to say, “well, it’s only a stupid song, just get rid of it if it’s causing so much dissension.”  The problem with this line of thinking is seen by looking at the actual facts around this – by the standard of “proof” that has been put forward, basically anything a small group of people declare problematic must be cancelled.  And that sort of power is going to be abused by the worst sorts of people.

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