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Matt Gaetz Under Investigation for Sex Trafficking


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31 minutes ago, the moops said:

No, it sounds like an ongoing investigation that takes time to get right - especially when it concerns underage girls and a sitting congressman

Yeah, I remember the Mueller Report too.  :doh:

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Honestly, I think there are few things less productive than arguing about hypocrisy on a message board. First, it’s often a generalized comment about groups of posters, which seems facially ridiculous

Today’s GOP:  Mitt Romney, Liz Cheney - “BOOOOOOO!!!!” Matt Gaetz, Roy Moore - “CIRCLE THE WAGONS!!!”

Not nearly as bad as a can of tuna in a crowded movie theatre.

1 hour ago, -fish- said:

Shouldn't Gaetz have been charged with something by now?  Now the investigation has shifted to his ties with medical marijuana.  Sounds like another ill-advised attempt to leak information from a half-assed investigation hoping someone will resign.    

Knowing who's involved and who he is associating with, I am confident there are piles of "leads" that have to be gone through.  Just in his relationship with Greenberg there's months worth of work I'd imagine. 

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58 minutes ago, BladeRunner said:

Yeah, I remember the Mueller Report too.  :doh:

What does the Mueller report have to do with a sitting congressman being investigated for underage sex tradfficking?

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9 minutes ago, the moops said:

What does the Mueller report have to do with a sitting congressman being investigated for underage sex tradfficking?

We know how the anonymous sources worked out there too.  

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3 hours ago, BladeRunner said:

We know how the anonymous sources worked out there too.  

Pretty well if you read the actual Mueller report.

 

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5 hours ago, -fish- said:

Shouldn't Gaetz have been charged with something by now?  Now the investigation has shifted to his ties with medical marijuana.  Sounds like another ill-advised attempt to leak information from a half-assed investigation hoping someone will resign.    

That may not be far from the truth - though, if it is, I suggest the source is more likely Liz Cheney (or someone in her orbit), than anyone else.

 

Dems don't want to force someone like Gaetz out of office, and out of the public spotlight.

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28 minutes ago, Sinn Fein said:

Dems don't want to force someone like Gaetz out of office, and out of the public spotlight.

"Dems" shouldn't have anything to do with charging decisions. The DOJ attorneys, whatever their party affiliations, should be acting without regard to political gamesmanship.

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2 minutes ago, Maurile Tremblay said:

"Dems" shouldn't have anything to do with charging decisions. The DOJ attorneys, whatever their party affiliations, should be acting without regard to political gamesmanship.

I am not sure anyone suggested they did...

 

The post I responded to was this:

Sounds like another ill-advised attempt to leak information from a half-assed investigation hoping someone will resign.    

 

 

But certainly a valid point :shrug:

 

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35 minutes ago, McBokonon said:

Today’s GOP: 

Mitt Romney, Liz Cheney - “BOOOOOOO!!!!”

Matt Gaetz, Roy Moore - “CIRCLE THE WAGONS!!!”

Today's DNC:

Mitt Romney, Liz Cheney - YAAAYYY!

Yesterday's DNC:

Mitt Romney, Liz Cheney - BOOOOOO!!! LIARS!

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4 minutes ago, BladeRunner said:

Today's DNC:

Mitt Romney, Liz Cheney - YAAAYYY!

Yesterday's DNC:

Mitt Romney, Liz Cheney - BOOOOOO!!! LIARS!

This is, in fact true.

 

Not relevant to teh post you responded to, but, it is true.  (Having said that, I am not sure I am a fan of the Dems position here - Dems should let the GOP go wherever the GOP thinks it can get votes, and the Dems should focus on delivering their message).

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deadline for Greenberg to become a fully cooperating witness is reportedly May 15.  If there's something to all this, it should heat up next week. 

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2 hours ago, -fish- said:

reports that he has reached a plea deal and will cooperate with the investigation.

When the Feds come for you, they come correct.

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4 hours ago, -fish- said:

reports that he has reached a plea deal and will cooperate with the investigation.

Court schedules *PLEA HEARING* for Monday at 10am in fraud and sex trafficking case of Joel Greenberg, an associate of Rep Matt Gaetz (R-FL)

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, zoonation said:

The bell is tolling for Matt Gaetz. 

He is well on his way to becoming the R's candidate for president with his resume

He just has to make fun of handicapped people

Edited by killface
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I've not been following this story at all. I assumed he's already resigned just like Al Franken and Katie Hill???

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3 hours ago, zoonation said:

The bell is tolling for Matt Gaetz. 

Mr. Greenberg admitted that he and unidentified others had paid a 17-year-old girl for sex and that he had provided her with drugs. He admitted that he “introduced the minor to other adult men, who engaged in commercial sex acts” with her, according to the documents, and that he was sometimes present. The others were not named.

Prosecutors revealed in the documents that they have evidence they say corroborates Mr. Greenberg’s admissions — including a series of communications and transactions Mr. Greenberg had with the girl, and a list of dates of their sexual encounters. The inclusion of that material appeared designed to bolster the credibility of Mr. Greenberg as a witness whose truthfulness would likely be challenged by anyone who is charged based on anything he tells prosecutors.

 

I wonder who those "other" men might be.  🤔

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A spokesman for Gaetz denounced the recent development, noting that Greenberg has a history of fabricating allegations of underage sex. 

"The first indictment of Joel Greenberg alleges that he falsely accused another man of sex with a minor for his own gain. That man was apparently innocent. So is Congressman Gaetz," the congressman's spokesperson, Harlan Hill, said in a statement.

 

 

I suspect, if the Feds move on Gaetz - they will have the receipts beyond Greenberg's testimony. 

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7 minutes ago, Sinn Fein said:

Mr. Greenberg admitted that he and unidentified others had paid a 17-year-old girl for sex and that he had provided her with drugs. He admitted that he “introduced the minor to other adult men, who engaged in commercial sex acts” with her, according to the documents, and that he was sometimes present. The others were not named.

Prosecutors revealed in the documents that they have evidence they say corroborates Mr. Greenberg’s admissions — including a series of communications and transactions Mr. Greenberg had with the girl, and a list of dates of their sexual encounters. The inclusion of that material appeared designed to bolster the credibility of Mr. Greenberg as a witness whose truthfulness would likely be challenged by anyone who is charged based on anything he tells prosecutors.

 

I wonder who those "other" men might be.  🤔

Also:

Investigators are reportedly interested in the assistance of the former girlfriend, who was reportedly on a 2018 Bahamas trip with Gaetz that has come under scrutiny for potentially violating the Mann Act, which makes it a felony to transport people across state lines to engage in prostitution. The ex-girlfriend is believed to “have knowledge of drug use and arrangements with women,” sources told CNN.

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Interesting - in the plea agreement - Greenberg pleads guilty to count one - sex trafficking of a child - which carries a mandatory minimum of 10 years in prison.

 

I don't know how much leeway a judge has, even for a cooperating witness, to deviate from a mandatory minimum - @Zow might know that though.

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22 minutes ago, Sinn Fein said:

Interesting - in the plea agreement - Greenberg pleads guilty to count one - sex trafficking of a child - which carries a mandatory minimum of 10 years in prison.

 

I don't know how much leeway a judge has, even for a cooperating witness, to deviate from a mandatory minimum - @Zow might know that though.

Imagine what all you must be guilty of in order to accept a plea agreement where you plead guilty to sex trafficking a child.

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So the plea deal looks like just one count associated with the sex trafficking - and which should worry Gaetz.  The other charges seem to relate to frauds he committed as Tax Collector.

 

A couple of things stood out to me - Greenberg eventually found out she was underage - by looking her up in the Florida Drivers License database (illegally).  She had represented herself as over 18 on the "Sugar Daddies" site, but Greenberg had enough interactions with her that he should have known, or acted in reckless disregard.

The plea does state that Greenberg introduced the girl to other adult men, who engaged in commercial sex activities - presumably Gaetz is among this group - but its not clear how many interactions, and whether that would be sufficient interaction to alert Gaetz she was underaged (goes to intent, I think).

 

It does detail the plan to disguise payments to girls/women as school/tuition - which was Gaetz' initial defense - he was just a generous lover - but that defense seems to have flown out the window.

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4 minutes ago, dgreen said:

Imagine what all you must be guilty of in order to accept a plea agreement where you plead guilty to sex trafficking a child.

That's an excellent point.  The evidence must be horrendous against him

 

 

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4 minutes ago, dgreen said:

Imagine what all you must be guilty of in order to accept a plea agreement where you plead guilty to sex trafficking a child.

I think they had him dead to rights - at some point he knew her age, and knew he was in trouble, and asked her to align her story with his, and lie in some cases.

He pled guilty, because he was guilty, and he was unlikely to be able to persuade a jury (or judge) otherwise.

 

This, of course, will weigh on his credibility - he knew he was going to a federal pen - and might just be looking for a cooperation agreement as a way to soften the blow - no pun intended.  Thats why I think if the Feds go after Gaetz - they will have more than Greenberg's testimony - and might not pursue Gates, if all they have is Greenberg's testimony.

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17 hours ago, Sinn Fein said:

Interesting - in the plea agreement - Greenberg pleads guilty to count one - sex trafficking of a child - which carries a mandatory minimum of 10 years in prison.

 

I don't know how much leeway a judge has, even for a cooperating witness, to deviate from a mandatory minimum - @Zow might know that though.

In federal court a judge can deviate (either direction) provided it’s reasonable per a 2005 case called US v. Booker and the court considers and weighs the statutory sentencing factors. 
 

Notably, this different than some state jurisdictions (including mine) where a judge is bound to sentence with the statutory ranges (and pleas must be structured to account for the ranges). 

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18 hours ago, dgreen said:

Imagine what all you must be guilty of in order to accept a plea agreement where you plead guilty to sex trafficking a child.

More to the point, if he didn’t actually do this, and is only out to sully Gaetz’s reputation(as I’d bet the supporters of Gaetz are surely already starting to scream), why willingly admit to these types of crimes, that not only destroy a reputation in civilian life, but will earn plenty of enemies in prisons anywhere?

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26 minutes ago, Amused to Death said:

Why is Matt Gaetz still on the House Judiciary Committee? His friend is now pleading guilty and cooperating with an investigation into him. Shouldn't he be removed immediately?

He hasn’t been charged with anything. I can see removing him if he’s charged with a crime. 

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20 minutes ago, bigbottom said:

He hasn’t been charged with anything. I can see removing him if he’s charged with a crime. 

Yeah I understand that, but his friend and someone who may have incriminating evidence against him has been. Seems like a conflict.

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Amused to Death said:

Yeah I understand that, but his friend and someone who may have incriminating evidence against him has been. Seems like a conflict.

So if I a friend of yours pleaded guilty to an awful crime YOU shouldn't be able to hold down a job?

That's not how justice works.  Nor should it be.

Edited by BladeRunner
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4 minutes ago, BladeRunner said:

So if I a friend of yours pleaded guilty to an awful crime YOU shouldn't be able to hold down a job?

That's not how justice works.  Nor should it be.

When the job in question has a lot to do with the justice system, it should at least generate some pause while an investigation clears the person of wrongdoing.

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1 minute ago, Kal El said:

When the job in question has a lot to do with the justice system, it should at least generate some pause while an investigation clears the person of wrongdoing.

Negative.

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1 minute ago, BladeRunner said:

Negative.

So by that logic, cops shouldn’t be placed on leave after shooting someone, just send them back out, huh? 

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Change Matt Gaetz's name to Hillary Clinton and the Conservative media would would explode in an unified orgasmic display of anger and huaghty derision.  Since he's a Trump guy....this scandal, regardless of the outcome, has just skyrocketed him to the top of a VP short list.

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37 minutes ago, BladeRunner said:

So if I a friend of yours pleaded guilty to an awful crime YOU shouldn't be able to hold down a job?

That's not how justice works.  Nor should it be.

He sits on a committee that has oversight over the department that is prosecuting his friend - a friend who is cooperating with prosecutors and is likely providing evidence against him.

It's not just a friend who is pleading guilty to a crime. But you know that.

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On 5/14/2021 at 11:25 AM, killface said:

He is well on his way to becoming the R's candidate for president with his resume

He just has to make fun of handicapped people

Memorial day is just around the corner...maybe he could mention he likes people who weren't captured. That could garner some GOP votes.

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6 minutes ago, Amused to Death said:

He sits on a committee that has oversight over the department that is prosecuting his friend - a friend who is cooperating with prosecutors and is likely providing evidence against him.

It's not just a friend who is pleading guilty to a crime. But you know that.

Republicans aren’t in control of the committee, and I suspect that with respect to any business the committee has that would in any way be related to the investigation (if there even is any such business), I’m sure the committee leadership would require that he recuse himself.

That said, it’s worth noting that there is also a House ethics panel investigation regarding his conduct.

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53 minutes ago, BladeRunner said:

So if I a friend of yours pleaded guilty to an awful crime YOU shouldn't be able to hold down a job?

That's not how justice works.  Nor should it be.

Well, if HR is investigating a complaint about my misconduct on the job, they might suspend me during the pendency of the investigation. 

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53 minutes ago, Kal El said:

So by that logic, cops shouldn’t be placed on leave after shooting someone, just send them back out, huh? 

That is not even close to a good analogy.  At all.

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10 minutes ago, bigbottom said:

Well, if HR is investigating a complaint about my misconduct on the job, they might suspend me during the pendency of the investigation. 

I was responding to the post where @Amused to Death said that Gaetz should be suspended because his friend took a plea deal.

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1 minute ago, BladeRunner said:

I was responding to the post where @Amused to Death said that Gaetz should be suspended because his friend took a plea deal.

Well there’s more at play than just that. There’s a House ethics investigation, and he’s being investigated by the department that his committee oversees. 

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Posted (edited)
15 hours ago, Amused to Death said:

Why is Matt Gaetz still on the House Judiciary Committee? His friend is now pleading guilty and cooperating with an investigation into him. Shouldn't he be removed immediately?

Not unless he says something negative about Trump.  Then he’s persona non grata in 2 seconds.   That’s about the only thing the GOP will hold accountable these days

Edited by dkp993
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