Jump to content
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

MLB moves All-Star game in response to GA voter laws


Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, IvanKaramazov said:

The TLDR version of this is that it would be a mistake to assume that stunts like this don't affect viewership.  They probably do among sufficiently casual fans.

I don't disagree with any of this, but it implies an undertone in my original post that isn't my intent.  If the actions of the league, players etc, are deemed so unpalatable (defined however someone wants to define that), then the individual shouldn't bother watching it.  The league will suffer financially as a result, whether by declining TV viewership, selling fewer tickets.  Absolute free market.

What I don't understand is people (politicians, regular Joes, whoever) falling all over themselves whining about the political behavior of the leagues/players.  There is no hidden meaning behind my statement....it's quite literally what it says....if you don't like it....don't watch it.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Desert_Power said:

We also lost the NBA All Star Game (came back a couple of years later) and other events. It really was unfortunate because the NC bill was a response to an actual progressive policy in the city of Charlotte. Charlotte was the place that lost the events.

Oh well, it helped get McCrory out and Cooper has performed pretty well.

NCAA boycotted hosting a lot of events in SC until the Confederate flag finally came down.

This is what is happening here, it becomes a kind of "friendly fire" situation on who is affected.  The SC flag situation was one that should never have taken so long, but I'd say the Mother Emanuel AME shooting was way more of the driver of that change than the NCAA. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

27 minutes ago, massraider said:

I don't think casual baseball fans care where the All-Star game is (outside of some fans in GA).  For real, San Diego/St. Louis/Pittsburgh fans, they don't care.  

This move is was pretty swift by MLB, I think it clearly shows how out of bounds these laws are. 

I don't understand how cancel culture/woke and other liberal buzzwords are being used when it comes to access to free and fair elections.

Since when are conservatives against that??

Since they lost. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

24 minutes ago, John123 said:

This is a great post, and about where I'm at with my own set of tiers.  In the case of MLB, I've always enjoyed them live more than on TV.  So I'll typically hit up a few Rockies games during the season.  This type of decision will drive me away from doing that, not because of the specific decision, but because of the political nature of it.  I just don't like politics with my sports, regardless of the specifics.

So you won't go hang out in Coors Field and enjoy a baseball game because they moved the AllStar game?

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, Steve Tasker said:

I don't disagree with any of this, but it implies an undertone in my original post that isn't my intent.  If the actions of the league, players etc, are deemed so unpalatable (defined however someone wants to define that), then the individual shouldn't bother watching it.  The league will suffer financially as a result, whether by declining TV viewership, selling fewer tickets.  Absolute free market.

What I don't understand is people (politicians, regular Joes, whoever) falling all over themselves whining about the political behavior of the leagues/players.  There is no hidden meaning behind my statement....it's quite literally what it says....if you don't like it....don't watch it.

But this had nothing to do with the team or players.  We pretty much have to "settle".  Looking how active political topics are across the forums I go to, people have done just that.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Shula-holic said:

This is what is happening here, it becomes a kind of "friendly fire" situation on who is affected.  The SC flag situation was one that should never have taken so long, but I'd say the Mother Emanuel AME shooting was way more of the driver of that change than the NCAA. 

Yes, wasn't trying to say it was what got it removed. Just another example of the NCAA/sports orgs attempting to put political pressure on.

Edited by Desert_Power
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, Mile High said:

So you won't go hang out in Coors Field and enjoy a baseball game because they moved the AllStar game?

Once they start convening the military at every sporting event, you don't get to say 'no politics in my sports'.  

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, Mile High said:

So you won't go hang out in Coors Field and enjoy a baseball game because MLB hyper politicized baseball moved the AllStar game?

FYP.  Count me in, won't miss it and they won't miss me I'm sure.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, massraider said:

Once they start convening the military at every sporting event, you don't get to say 'no politics in my sports'.  

 

For me the military is not political.  Neither is the flag or the anthem or first responders. 

But others feel differently and I understand that, particularly the military vs flag/anthem.  Flying jets over stadiums is not necessary.  Honoring soldiers at a game, not necessary either but neither is honoring first responders or teachers or whoever.  Unfortunately there is no grey and we can't use these events as a common platform to celebrate anything. 

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, massraider said:

That's the way I feel about free and fair elections.  

I didn't see where fees were added or that the law is applied differently to different people and it seems that most on this forum agree some form of ID is good...so yes I think you are confirming it is political.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Sea Duck said:

John Roberts, Antonin Scalia, Anthony Kennedy, Clarence Thomas, and Samuel Alito say "Hi."

I recall MLK day becoming a holiday national/federal holiday in the ‘80’s but Arizona didn’t recognize it until sometime after the NFL pulled the Super Bowl in the ‘90’s.

Tell those guys I said hello too and thanks for their service

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, djmich said:

I didn't see where fees were added or that the law is applied differently to different people and it seems that most on this forum agree some form of ID is good...so yes I think you are confirming it is political.

Right, and I'm not engaging with people being dishonest about what this is, and pretending a 98 page bill is about presenting an ID in order to vote.

These laws aren't a reaction to voter fraud, they are a reaction to high voter turnout.  

Hiding behind, 'well the rules are the same for everyone' is a joke.  They have all the stats that show who uses absentee ballots, and who votes early, and which churches get out the vote on Sunday mornings.  They know this, the rules they are changing have shown ZERO vulnerability to large scale fraud, it is clear what's going on.  

It's disheartening to see people being so willing to repeat an obvious lie.  

  • Like 4
  • Thanks 2
  • Love 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, djmich said:
2 hours ago, massraider said:

Once they start convening the military at every sporting event, you don't get to say 'no politics in my sports'. 

For me the military is not political.  Neither is the flag or the anthem or first responders. 

Well, I guess we can agree to disagree on whether taxpayer-funded displays of war machines are designed to justify foreign wars. But I don't think it's a coincidence that these pregame shows increased in number after the Iraq and Afghanistan wars started.

But the bigger issue, to me, is that military funding is being re-routed to private sports owners. I don't like the idea of the government subsidizing the NFL.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Sea Duck said:

Well, I guess we can agree to disagree on whether taxpayer-funded displays of war machines are designed to justify foreign wars. But I don't think it's a coincidence that these pregame shows increased in number after the Iraq and Afghanistan wars started.

But the bigger issue, to me, is that military funding is being re-routed to private sports owners. I don't like the idea of the government subsidizing the NFL.

Not sure how Jets flying overhead justifies foreign wars.  Get people amped up for war sure...maybe thats what you meant?

 And yes, I agree that the military and wars in general are political and hence why I said that, I wish that wasn't the case given fellow citizens are fighting them and dying in them on our behalf...but I do get it.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Sea Duck said:

But the bigger issue, to me, is that military funding is being re-routed to private sports owners. I don't like the idea of the government subsidizing the NFL.

On that we are agreed, the leagues are about enriching themselves.  That we are sending public money to them is ridiculous.

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, massraider said:

Right, and I'm not engaging with people being dishonest about what this is, and pretending a 98 page bill is about presenting an ID in order to vote.

These laws aren't a reaction to voter fraud, they are a reaction to high voter turnout.  

Hiding behind, 'well the rules are the same for everyone' is a joke.  They have all the stats that show who uses absentee ballots, and who votes early, and which churches get out the vote on Sunday mornings.  They know this, the rules they are changing have shown ZERO vulnerability to large scale fraud, it is clear what's going on.  

It's disheartening to see people being so willing to repeat an obvious lie.  

You've made up your mind and only want to hear what you want to hear.  Got it.  :thumbup:

If you want the bubble talk you've certainly come to the right forum.  However, I appreciate your honesty.

Edited by BladeRunner
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, IvanKaramazov said:

This wasn't directed at me and even if it was I wouldn't take it personally -- it's a totally reasonable question.  I do think I can chime in here because I think I'm probably pretty typical of a lot of fans.

For me, sports fall into three basic tiers.  In no particular order, the first tier is sports that I don't like and aren't going to watch no matter what.  I've always disliked baseball.  MLB can get as woke as it wants and it won't change my baseball viewing habits at all.  Similarly, I stopped paying attention to the NBA sometime during grad school.  I don't remember why.  It just became boring to me, I quit watching their games, lost track of most of the players, and drifted into complete non-viewership. The NBA can get woke and I'll barely even be aware of it.  My MLB and NBA viewership is completely inelastic with respect to the leagues' ideological lean.

The second tier is the NFL (with the EPL as a distant second that I'm going to just ignore for this discussion).  I'm going to watch all 17 Bills games next year no matter what.  Each broadcast could feature a halftime lecture on social justice by Angela Davis, and I would tune in every Sunday.  If the Bills are good, I'm also going to watch quite a bit of other NFL games because I feel the overall narrative of the league season involves my team and I way stay plugged in.  If the Bills suck, I'll skip most other NFL games regardless.  I might complain about politics seeping into the games, but it doesn't affect whether I watch or not.  Again, my NFL viewership is completely inelastic with regard to the league's ideological lean.

Then you get to the third tier, which is the sports that are entertaining but highly marginal for me personally.  These are sports that I kind of like as a casual fan, and I'll follow them if there's nothing else going on, but I would just as soon drop them if they're going to start preaching at me.  This isn't just a hypothetical and it's easy for me to list a concrete example here: women's soccer.  I like women's soccer and I've watched several women's world cups.  I don't follow the WNT religiously or anything -- I don't see their roster moves, have no idea how WC qualification is going, etc.-- but I'll tune in for the WC and pull for them.  Except I didn't last time because that particular team had a couple of really insufferable players, well one in particular, and I while I care about the WNT a little bit, I definitely don't care enough to sit through a hectoring lecture on gender equality (delivered by people who don't know what they're talking about, of course) every time I want to watch a game.  Netflix is great.  Amazon Prime is great.  Hulu is great.  Video games are great.  My library is great.  There's a ton of other stuff I can do that WNT games have to compete against for my attention.  When they got preachy last time around, I just stuck with those other things.  Here, my viewership is actually pretty elastic with respect to league preachiness.   

The TLDR version of this is that it would be a mistake to assume that stunts like this don't affect viewership.  They probably do among sufficiently casual fans.

Just out of curiosity would you possibly move something from Category 1 to 3 based on a cause that is important to you?  I’m guessing you are like me and the answer is no but just wondering.  I definitely think there’s more people that won’t watch or say they won’t watch than those who wouldn’t watch previously but this convinces them to watch.  
 

But, I will say that in this instance it could be a calculated thing with MLB - they don’t do well as well in the black community than they used to and seem to be well behind basketball and football.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, massraider said:

Right, and I'm not engaging with people being dishonest about what this is, and pretending a 98 page bill is about presenting an ID in order to vote.

These laws aren't a reaction to voter fraud, they are a reaction to high voter turnout.  

Hiding behind, 'well the rules are the same for everyone' is a joke.  They have all the stats that show who uses absentee ballots, and who votes early, and which churches get out the vote on Sunday mornings.  They know this, the rules they are changing have shown ZERO vulnerability to large scale fraud, it is clear what's going on.  

It's disheartening to see people being so willing to repeat an obvious lie.  

Yes. It is disheartening to see people repeat the same lies over and over every day in the hopes that people will believe them. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

This truth is that self-evident to me.  

This is like we are disagreeing on the best route to take our sailboat around the world, except you think the world is flat.  

Tough to, um, see the other side of the issue, no?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

33 minutes ago, massraider said:

This truth is that self-evident to me.  

This is like we are disagreeing on the best route to take our sailboat around the world, except you think the world is flat.  

Tough to, um, see the other side of the issue, no?

More like trying to sail around the world but you keep insisting the crew you took with you is too stupid to know how to sail and therefore need everything done for them to make sure they survive the journey they didn't really want to go on.

  • Like 3
  • Love 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, massraider said:

This truth is that self-evident to me.  

This is like we are disagreeing on the best route to take our sailboat around the world, except you think the world is flat.  

Tough to, um, see the other side of the issue, no?

Just because it's "self-evident" to you doesn't mean it's the truth. 

  • Love 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, massraider said:

Right, and I'm not engaging with people being dishonest about what this is, and pretending a 98 page bill is about presenting an ID in order to vote.

These laws aren't a reaction to voter fraud, they are a reaction to high voter turnout.  

Hiding behind, 'well the rules are the same for everyone' is a joke.  They have all the stats that show who uses absentee ballots, and who votes early, and which churches get out the vote on Sunday mornings.  They know this, the rules they are changing have shown ZERO vulnerability to large scale fraud, it is clear what's going on.  

It's disheartening to see people being so willing to repeat an obvious lie.  

Yep. This is all an outgrowth of Trump's Big Lie; that the election was stolen from him. There is no evidence of this.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Summer Wheat said:

The rich don`t care..but as usual it hurts the lower income people from getting another payday.

Or, it provides a different community, and their “lower income people” with an unexpected payday. 
 

Why do you hate the people in whatever community gets the all-star game?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, Sinn Fein said:

Or, it provides a different community, and their “lower income people” with an unexpected payday. 
 

Why do you hate the people in whatever community gets the all-star game?

Are you ok?  This is, well, bizarre.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, Sinn Fein said:

Or, it provides a different community, and their “lower income people” with an unexpected payday. 
 

Why do you hate the people in whatever community gets the all-star game?

Well when lower income people were just getting over a hard year and had a big event scheduled to come to town, spent money to prepare for it and banked on the income to help get them back to business, this is going to pretty much crush them. Where as that new community of lower income people will not have prepared for this unexpected windfall and see this as a bonus on what they already had in mind. 

But you already knew that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, Insein said:

Well when lower income people were just getting over a hard year and had a big event scheduled to come to town, spent money to prepare for it and banked on the income to help get them back to business, this is going to pretty much crush them. Where as that new community of lower income people will not have prepared for this unexpected windfall and see this as a bonus on what they already had in mind. 

But you already knew that.

I’m confused. What money did these low income earners spend to prepare for the All-star game?

Seems to me the financial losers here are the Atlanta-area business owners who were looking to profit off the backs of these lower income workers.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, Insein said:

Well when lower income people were just getting over a hard year and had a big event scheduled to come to town, spent money to prepare for it and banked on the income to help get them back to business, this is going to pretty much crush them. Where as that new community of lower income people will not have prepared for this unexpected windfall and see this as a bonus on what they already had in mind. 

But you already knew that.

Worth pointing out the midseason classic doesn't happen til the midseason, and the season just started.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, Shula-holic said:

Are you ok?  This is, well, bizarre.

How so?  Some city is going to stage the All-star game. The same amount of money will be spent in the new city.  The same number of employees will be hired.   The amount of money going to lower income employees is not changing. The same number of people will benefit. 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Sinn Fein said:

How so?  Some city is going to stage the All-star game. The same amount of money will be spent in the new city.  The same number of employees will be hired.   The amount of money going to lower income employees is not changing. The same number of people will benefit. 

To ask why he hated the people, especially when that poster wasn't the one bringing up changing the community.  I get what you're saying that someone on the low end gets the benefit, granted that it's a net zero, one city's lower income gains, one city's loses.  This is just odd to me since you said you used to live there and now you seem anxious to ensure it's the low end folks there who are the ones that are the losers.  But that really wasn't the part I considered bizarre as much as that you accused someone of hating those people who actually just stated lower income people are getting hurt, which in that area they are.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, thriftyrocker said:

Worth pointing out the midseason classic doesn't happen til the midseason, and the season just started.

And you think a thing like the All Star game is just "hey show up on Monday and we'll figure it out as we go" for these businesses? Most businesses try to plan ahead for the year or at least the next few quarters to set expectations on what will be needed to maximize their profits. 

Edited by Insein
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, Sinn Fein said:

I’m confused. What money did these low income earners spend to prepare for the All-star game?

Seems to me the financial losers here are the Atlanta-area business owners who were looking to profit off the backs of these lower income workers.  

If that's what you call small business owners, sure. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Insein said:

And you think a thing like the All Star game is just "hey show up on Monday and we'll figure it out as we go" for these businesses? Most businesses try to plan ahead for the year or at least the next few quarters to set expectations on what will be needed to maximize their profits. 

You said they "spent money to prepare for it."  I don't think any food orders went to rot. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

30 minutes ago, thriftyrocker said:

You said they "spent money to prepare for it."  I don't think any food orders went to rot. 

I don't think he was referring to food.  For example, businesses tend to spend in advance for all the knick knacks, shirts, hats, baseballs, cups, etc with the Atlanta 2021 All Star Game logo. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, Shula-holic said:

I don't think he was referring to food.  For example, businesses tend to spend in advance for all the knick knacks, shirts, hats, baseballs, cups, etc with the Atlanta 2021 All Star Game logo. 

Just think about how many UCLA and Houston tshirts just got shipped off to Africa. Those poor businesses. 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, timschochet said:

I’m not sure I do, but even if you’re right, doesn’t that make what the MLB is doing here more principled? 

If the MLB loosely interpreted the Biden border Crisis as a moral issue and decided to remove a major event from Arizona or Texas in a knee jerk reaction to make headlines, would that make them principled? Or if the recent attack in DC from a black nationalist prompted MLB to threaten removing the Nationals games until Biden resolves the problem, would that be principled?

Edited by Insein
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, Insein said:

If the MLB loosely interpreted the Biden border Crisis as a moral issue and decided to remove a major event from Arizona or Texas in a knee jerk reaction to make headlines, would that make them principled? Or if the recent attack in DC from a black nationalist prompted MLB to threaten removing the Nationals games until Biden resolves the problem, would that be principled?

Your two examples don’t make any sense because there’s no specific solution in either case. In this case we have an unjust, racist law which should never have been passed. 

  • Like 1
  • Laughing 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Your two examples don’t make any sense because there’s no specific solution in either case. In this case we have an unjust, racist law which should never have been passed. 

There's nothing unjust or racist about the law but it isn't stopping people from virtue signaling about it. MLB thought this was a way to help their brand. Guess we'll see by the end of the season if it worked out for them 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 hours ago, Sinn Fein said:

Or, it provides a different community, and their “lower income people” with an unexpected payday. 
 

Why do you hate the people in whatever community gets the all-star game?

"MLB giveth and MLB taketh away"   Happy Easter....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 hours ago, thriftyrocker said:

Just think about how many UCLA and Houston tshirts just got shipped off to Africa. Those poor businesses. 

😆 You mean the ones where you budget loss when you are doing your pricing and inventory cost?  Yeah, that’s the same. 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, timschochet said:

I’m not sure I do, but even if you’re right, doesn’t that make what the MLB is doing here more principled? 

I’m really not looking to my sports leagues for principles.  There are better places for that.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Shula-holic said:

😆 You mean the ones where you budget loss when you are doing your pricing and inventory cost?  Yeah, that’s the same. 

It's like he just gets his talking points from the DNC website and has ZERO idea how a business is planned or run.  Weird.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...