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Moderna vs. Pfizer Vaccines - Which is better?


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10 minutes ago, Scoresman said:

Getting J&J on Friday.  Was first available and the one shot deal sounds great to me.  The fact that they all have at or near 100% prevention of hospital/death is good enough for me.  

 

Yeah if I had my druthers/choice I'd have done the J and J one shot. Super happy I got the Moderna but took time off of work twice for the shots and the one day symptoms wasn't fun. 

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Whichever you can get first is the best one.

Moderna is the varsity. Pfizer the junior varsity.*         *The fact that I got moderna may influence this analysis.

Fun story... By way of background, here in TX counties are by and large organizing distribution of the vaccines.  Any TX resident who is eligible for the vaccine (anyone over 16 at this point, I

Today was 14 days post Moderna #2 injection. Slight sore arm for a couple days after each one. Son in law had Covid over thanksgiving (headache and back ache for about three days) had no side effects after Moderna #1 a couple weeks ago.

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On 4/6/2021 at 9:50 AM, Gally said:

I am going to split the difference and get the Moderna first shot and Pfizer second shot.  It seems the Moderna is worse on your for the second shot but the Pfizer is worse for the first shot.  So bam.....get the best of both worlds...ha

I have no idea whether or not you are joking, but please don't do this.

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Moderna man here.  Only had a sore arm for a day or so after shot #1.  Hopefully shot 2 in a couple of weeks will be as uneventful. 
 

From the stuff I read, I don’t think there is much of a difference between Pfizer and Moderna.

Edited by Andrew74
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18 hours ago, strykerpks said:

Has anyone had/heard of the "Janssen" vaccine? I'm getting mine tomorrow and they provided Pfizer, Moderna and Janssen fact sheets so I assume I'll get whatever they have on hand. 

NM....I see that's the J&J one

why do they call it Janssen and Janssen if you only get one dose?

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Moderna shot #2 in the arm yesterday mid-day.

After shot #1 - semi-sore arm at injection site, mild fatigue & mild nausea approx. 24 hours after shot, joint pain primarily in wrists - it was weird

After shot #2 (so far) - arm is much more sore at injection site than last time (it feels like someone punched me really hard right in my upper shoulder), no signs yet of fatigue or nausea, joint pain in my wrists again - which still seems weird

Hoping the rest of today and tomorrow go swimmingly.

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3 hours ago, Mrs. Rannous said:

I have no idea whether or not you are joking, but please don't do this.

If you read my follow on post it should be quite clear.

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20 hours ago, Biff84 said:

Got the Pfizer and have been giving mainly Moderna with some J&J lately.

For high risk people I suggest Moderna or Pfizer. Everyone else, get whatever you can.

As far as giving the doses I’d rank them J&J > Moderna > Pfizer

My wife saw something like you say indicating the mRNA choice may be better for high risk folks (me). We kept checking around for a few days and (eventually) found all three available.

Teens can only take Pfizer right now, so my wife and I went with Moderna to free up two extra Pfizer doses for that population. I hope they take advantage.

Minor soreness at injection site. Super mild headache later that day, got drowsy earlier than usual that night. Hoping the 2nd dose goes just as smoothly.

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Got dose 2 of Pfizer:gang2: today about 45 minutes ago.  had like 90 oz of gatorade this morning to hydrate.  Supposedly moving the injection arm around bunch helps so trying to do that.  will report back.

-QG

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20 hours ago, QuizGuy66 said:

Got dose 2 of Pfizer:gang2: today about 45 minutes ago.  had like 90 oz of gatorade this morning to hydrate.  Supposedly moving the injection arm around bunch helps so trying to do that.  will report back.

-QG

Edited- NO - this is wrong —->You should rub/massage any injection shot you ever get for at least a minute after your shot. [s/]

I was wrong.

Unlike other shots or vaccines they say not to rub this one. 

Edited by STEADYMOBBIN 22
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25 minutes ago, STEADYMOBBIN 22 said:
2 hours ago, QuizGuy66 said:

Supposedly moving the injection arm around bunch helps so trying to do that.  will report back.

-QG

Yes. You should rub/massage any injection shot you ever get for at least a minute after your shot. 

Wait: Do you need to both rub/massage the spot AND do some shoulder raises or something?

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I got Moderna #2 at 8:00 this morning and my shoulder is seriously sore, like it's injured or something.  Obviously it's not actually injured -- just commenting.  Definitely worse than shot #1.

Edit: Went to bed feeling fine.  Woke up around 1:00 am feeling awful, specifically chills and a strong headache.  At some point I dragged myself out of bed to knock back some powerade and ibuprofen, and now I feel basically okay.  I'm working from home today because I'm still a little chilled and it's just better to sit in front of my computer under a blanket instead of being in the office, but I would have been fine if I had gone in.

Edited by IvanKaramazov
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On 4/7/2021 at 11:00 AM, Biff84 said:

Got the Pfizer and have been giving mainly Moderna with some J&J lately.

For high risk people I suggest Moderna or Pfizer. Everyone else, get whatever you can.

As far as giving the doses I’d rank them J&J > Moderna > Pfizer

It’s interesting how much value people place on one shot convenience + older vaccine technology offered by J&J.

Even though all three vaccines effectively prevent hospitalization and death, one third of J&J recipients got symptomatic covid-19, almost a half of which were considered severe...granted I have no idea what criteria they used for hospitalization, but generally severe disease means oxygen levels below normal. Presumably a sunset of those people are at risk to become long haulers and/or experience organ damage from the infection. Plus they theoretically are more likely to spread it.

In contrast, only ~5% of Pfizer/Moderna recipients developed covid with any symptoms, none of which were considered severe. And it appears their risk of spreading covid is just as unlikely.

To be fair, the three vaccines have not been compared head-to-head in a systematic manner, so the data needs to be interpreted in the context of differences in the initial vaccine trials, including study population demographics and prevailing SARS-CoV-2 strain(s).

While I agree high risk individuals should get the mRNA vaccines, IMO it’s worth the extra hassle for just about everyone to consider the two shot regimens. Death and hospitalization aren’t the only outcomes of SARS-CoV-infection. Symptomatic covid isn’t necessarily a walk in the park, and minimizing spread will expedite a return to normalcy.

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16 minutes ago, Terminalxylem said:

It’s interesting how much value people place on one shot convenience + older vaccine technology offered by J&J.

Even though all three vaccines effectively prevent hospitalization and death, one third of J&J recipients got symptomatic covid-19, almost a half of which were considered severe...granted I have no idea what criteria they used for hospitalization, but generally severe disease means oxygen levels below normal. Presumably a sunset of those people are at risk to become long haulers and/or experience organ damage from the infection. Plus they theoretically are more likely to spread it.

In contrast, only ~5% of Pfizer/Moderna recipients developed covid with any symptoms, none of which were considered severe. And it appears their risk of spreading covid is just as unlikely.

To be fair, the three vaccines have not been compared head-to-head in a systematic manner, so the data needs to be interpreted in the context of differences in the initial vaccine trials, including study population demographics and prevailing SARS-CoV-2 strain(s).

While I agree high risk individuals should get the mRNA vaccines, IMO it’s worth the extra hassle for just about everyone to consider the two shot regimens. Death and hospitalization aren’t the only outcomes of SARS-CoV-infection. Symptomatic covid isn’t necessarily a walk in the park, and minimizing spread will expedite a return to normalcy.

I just looked up the J&J protocol:

Quote

The interim analysis assessed 468 cases of symptomatic COVID-19 among 44,325 adult volunteers in Argentina, Brazil, Chile, Colombia, Mexico, Peru, South Africa, and the United States. The investigational vaccine was reportedly 66% effective at preventing the study’s combined endpoints of moderate and severe COVID-19 at 28 days post-vaccination among all volunteers, including those infected with an emerging viral variant. Moderate COVID-19 was defined as laboratory-confirmed SARS-CoV-2 plus either one of the following: evidence of pneumonia; deep vein thrombosis; difficulty breathing; abnormal oxygen saturation or a respiratory rate equal to or greater than 20; or two or more signs or symptoms suggestive of COVID-19, such as cough, sore throat, fever or chills. Severe COVID-19 was defined as laboratory-confirmed SARS-CoV-2 plus evidence of clinical signs at rest indicative of severe systemic illness, respiratory failure, shock, significant organ dysfunction, hospital intensive care unit admission or death.

It makes no sense to say almost nobody was hospitalized if those were their criteria for severe disease. Heck even their moderate finding could land one in the hospital for a night or two.

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3 hours ago, IvanKaramazov said:

I got Moderna #2 at 8:00 this morning and my shoulder is seriously sore, like it's injured or something.  Obviously it's not actually injured -- just commenting.  Definitely worse than shot #1.

Got Pfizer #2 at 1:00pm.  Tired and arm hurts but ok otherwise- hoping I can say the same tomorrow night.

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After #2 muscles feel a little weird, heavy, but mostly just tired.  Laid down on the couch this afternoon, my kid jumped on me, and I still fell asleep in no time.  Didn't notice when he left.

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On 4/6/2021 at 8:45 AM, Klimtology said:

I just got my first Moderna shot, but I was hoping for a Pfizer.

Questions:

Are they both comparable in terms of efficacy? Side Effects?

TIA

My brother has his degree in Psychology and works for a company that specializes on research for these sort of things. Wor was giving us the option of Pfizer or J&J and I took the one shot J&J. My brother said out of the 3 J&J is the best one to get. I trust him over a lot of people because my baby brother religiously has paid attention to this since the start. His company also did some studies of the Vaccine too.  

Edited by DJackson10
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7 hours ago, Terminalxylem said:

It’s interesting how much value people place on one shot convenience + older vaccine technology offered by J&J.

Even though all three vaccines effectively prevent hospitalization and death, one third of J&J recipients got symptomatic covid-19, almost a half of which were considered severe...granted I have no idea what criteria they used for hospitalization, but generally severe disease means oxygen levels below normal. Presumably a sunset of those people are at risk to become long haulers and/or experience organ damage from the infection. Plus they theoretically are more likely to spread it.

In contrast, only ~5% of Pfizer/Moderna recipients developed covid with any symptoms, none of which were considered severe. And it appears their risk of spreading covid is just as unlikely.

To be fair, the three vaccines have not been compared head-to-head in a systematic manner, so the data needs to be interpreted in the context of differences in the initial vaccine trials, including study population demographics and prevailing SARS-CoV-2 strain(s).

While I agree high risk individuals should get the mRNA vaccines, IMO it’s worth the extra hassle for just about everyone to consider the two shot regimens. Death and hospitalization aren’t the only outcomes of SARS-CoV-infection. Symptomatic covid isn’t necessarily a walk in the park, and minimizing spread will expedite a return to normalcy.

I am amazed by the amount of people waiting for the one dose shot too. From people who don’t like shots to people who fear getting side effects twice, all willing to take that decreased efficiency for convenience. I’ve talked a few people out of J&J because they had significant risk conditions.

With that being said, I’d prefer to get more J&J in. In our area we’ve done a very good job of getting the elderly and high risk patients. Most of our appointments now are 18-45. We’re planning on pushing hard through April and May and start with some well deserved vacation during the summer. With the population we’re vaccinating, I’d rather be doing J&J in April and getting another group in May rather than just doing second doses.

On Monday we did a large J&J clinic for the AZ Craft Brewers Guild. I don’t know if we would have done it if there was a second follow-up clinic. Funny enough they invited media to cover the event I ended up getting interviewed about the differences between the vaccines and ended up in a COVID Fact vs Fiction segment where they referred to me as ‘Dr’ even after I asked them not to. Don’t think I’ll live that down for awhile.

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2 hours ago, Biff84 said:

I am amazed by the amount of people waiting for the one dose shot too. From people who don’t like shots to people who fear getting side effects twice, all willing to take that decreased efficiency for convenience. I’ve talked a few people out of J&J because they had significant risk conditions.

With that being said, I’d prefer to get more J&J in. In our area we’ve done a very good job of getting the elderly and high risk patients. Most of our appointments now are 18-45. We’re planning on pushing hard through April and May and start with some well deserved vacation during the summer. With the population we’re vaccinating, I’d rather be doing J&J in April and getting another group in May rather than just doing second doses.

On Monday we did a large J&J clinic for the AZ Craft Brewers Guild. I don’t know if we would have done it if there was a second follow-up clinic. Funny enough they invited media to cover the event I ended up getting interviewed about the differences between the vaccines and ended up in a COVID Fact vs Fiction segment where they referred to me as ‘Dr’ even after I asked them not to. Don’t think I’ll live that down for awhile.

I agree with getting people vaccinated as quickly as possible, as that is most beneficial on a population level. But as more data comes out, I’d even favor single dose mRNA vaccines over J&J, if that ever becomes an option.

I just can’t think of another situation where people enthusiastically choose something so less effective, at least when cost doesn’t enter the equation. Yes, I know the absolute risk is low for many, but still, the trade-off of two shots is minimal in my mind.

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brohans the swcer got moderna so i guess if you get that one you know its the best and i read that one of the side effects of moderna is that all the papershakers want to go cruisin with you on friday and from my experience that is true take that to the bank 

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16 hours ago, IvanKaramazov said:

I got Moderna #2 at 8:00 this morning and my shoulder is seriously sore, like it's injured or something.  Obviously it's not actually injured -- just commenting.  Definitely worse than shot #1.

My Moderna reactions were exactly the opposite. After shot #1, after about 6 hours I got a shocking level of shoulder soreness ... like "I spent a day moving heavy furniture and I might have pulled something."

Right now, nearly 19 hours after shot #2, the soreness is light, more like "Whoops -- I just bumped into a door frame."

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6 hours ago, Terminalxylem said:

I just can’t think of another situation where people enthusiastically choose something so less effective, at least when cost doesn’t enter the equation. Yes, I know the absolute risk is low for many, but still, the trade-off of two shots is minimal in my mind.

I was under the impression that the reported effectiveness of the J&J vaccine was impacted by when it was in testing -- where variants were a large proportion of the infections in the test.  Meaning that if Pfizer and Moderna had been tested against the variants instead of the initial strain their results might look more like J&J's.  Is that not right?

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getting moderna keeps away covid and also makes you a better person take that to the bank bromigos 

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Wife and I got our first Moderna shot yesterday. Just a little arm soreness. Nothing else. You don’t even feel the needle whatsoever. 

Looking forward to being fully vaccinated in 4 more weeks.

Will be getting Pfizer for my 16 year old son after his high school baseball season ends April 24th. I want him vaccinated for his summer showcase schedule. Things are very open here in Florida (playing in West Palm, Fort Myers, Sanford) and we are also going to Georgia to play at Cobb. I expect almost no one to be wearing masks or following common sense social distancing by then. 

Yeah I know, I have set the bar very low LOL.

I love living in Florida and to be honest I am pleased we are not one of those archaic lock down states......but also people need to use more common sense and once you leave Palm Beach County.....it all goes to ####.

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8 hours ago, Terminalxylem said:

I agree with getting people vaccinated as quickly as possible, as that is most beneficial on a population level. But as more data comes out, I’d even favor single dose mRNA vaccines over J&J, if that ever becomes an option.

I just can’t think of another situation where people enthusiastically choose something so less effective, at least when cost doesn’t enter the equation. Yes, I know the absolute risk is low for many, but still, the trade-off of two shots is minimal in my mind.

I just have no time with work and other stuff to do. I have a wedding for my dad's best friends son who is only a few days young then me in May to go and didn't want to go without being vaccinated. Plus you aren't fully protected in a sense till 2 weeks after the 2nd shot where the single dose is 2 weeks after anyway so the two shot wouldn't have helped me in this case 

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2 hours ago, SWC said:

getting moderna keeps away covid and also makes you a better person take that to the bank bromigos 

Aurora or otherwise? Got mine at South Shore in Crudahy

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2 hours ago, Todem said:

I love living in Florida and to be honest I am pleased we are not one of those archaic lock down states......but also people need to use more common sense and once you leave Palm Beach County.....it all goes to ####.

I bet a place like Brazil wouldn't mind being archaic about now.  Or then.

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4 hours ago, SWC said:

brohans the swcer got moderna so i guess if you get that one you know its the best and i read that one of the side effects of moderna is that all the papershakers want to go cruisin with you on friday and from my experience that is true take that to the bank 

Sad that I'm in a different gang than my Bromigo swc :cry:

-QG

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54 minutes ago, QuizGuy66 said:
5 hours ago, SWC said:

brohans the swcer got moderna so i guess if you get that one you know its the best and i read that one of the side effects of moderna is that all the papershakers want to go cruisin with you on friday and from my experience that is true take that to the bank 

Sad that I'm in a different gang than my Bromigo swc :cry:

-QG

hey man you do you and i bet you still get your fair share of the papershakers the key is just not being a wallflower and taking your shot no matter what it is take that to the bank brohans 

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19 hours ago, joffer said:

got the first Moderna today and i am wiped.  g'night.

feeling great today.  arm just a little sore

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23 hours ago, Terminalxylem said:

It’s interesting how much value people place on one shot convenience + older vaccine technology offered by J&J.

Even though all three vaccines effectively prevent hospitalization and death, one third of J&J recipients got symptomatic covid-19, almost a half of which were considered severe...granted I have no idea what criteria they used for hospitalization, but generally severe disease means oxygen levels below normal. Presumably a sunset of those people are at risk to become long haulers and/or experience organ damage from the infection. Plus they theoretically are more likely to spread it.

In contrast, only ~5% of Pfizer/Moderna recipients developed covid with any symptoms, none of which were considered severe. And it appears their risk of spreading covid is just as unlikely.

To be fair, the three vaccines have not been compared head-to-head in a systematic manner, so the data needs to be interpreted in the context of differences in the initial vaccine trials, including study population demographics and prevailing SARS-CoV-2 strain(s).

While I agree high risk individuals should get the mRNA vaccines, IMO it’s worth the extra hassle for just about everyone to consider the two shot regimens. Death and hospitalization aren’t the only outcomes of SARS-CoV-infection. Symptomatic covid isn’t necessarily a walk in the park, and minimizing spread will expedite a return to normalcy.

I got the J&J shot today and I was seeking it out. I suffer from anaphylactic shock to enough random foods where I do not want to test my luck. For example honey, it is random foods that I have never heard of anyone else suffering allergic reactions to. I did not feel comfortable trying for the mRNA vaccines.

I took an epi pen to the J&J shot today, but did not have an issue. I have not heard of anyone having anaphylaxis from the J&J shot.

 

:edit: my wife got pfizer, all my siblings, parents, and inlaws all sought out the more effective mRNA vaccine. But I just didn't want to risk it.

Edited by MTskibum
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Dear colleagues:

I know that a bunch of us got our second Moderna shots yesterday at the same mass vaccination event.  I saw many of you there, and I'm glad we're on the cusp of getting back to normal.  Also, I understand that the second shot is no joke.  If you tell me that you're not feeling well, trust me, I believe you.  

That said, "I'm having side effects from my vaccine" really isn't a very credible reason for why you're begging out of a Zoom meeting.  And it is not lost on me that the timing of all this results in a three day weekend for you.  You're not fooling anyone.  If you would ever like to play poker, please just name the time, place, and stakes and I will be there.

Yours in Christ,

Ivan

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6 hours ago, Rodrigo Duterte said:

I bet a place like Brazil wouldn't mind being archaic about now.  Or then.

We had our lock down.....and now we don’t. 

Can’t speak for Brazil.....but we are doing ok. 

Overall.....the entire thing has stunk for the country. People can use common sense more than having your entire state shut down and being forced to shelter in place for months on end. 

I am not going to get into politics.....but we are doing ok considering the circumstances. I and my entire family managed to stay covid free using simple common sense and practicing social distancing and wearing masks. 

What a concept. 

Edited by Todem
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21 minutes ago, Todem said:

Overall.....the entire thing has stunk for the country. People can use common sense 

I and my entire family managed to stay covid free using simple common sense and practicing social distancing and wearing masks

What a concept. 

No, a large part of our population cannot use common sense.  And the reason it "has stunk for our entire country" is because of that.

So you can rip on lockdown measures being "archaic" all you want.  Some places that's true.  But the alternative would have probably left us more like Brazil, less like what we got.

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17 hours ago, Terminalxylem said:

I agree with getting people vaccinated as quickly as possible, as that is most beneficial on a population level. But as more data comes out, I’d even favor single dose mRNA vaccines over J&J, if that ever becomes an option.

I just can’t think of another situation where people enthusiastically choose something so less effective, at least when cost doesn’t enter the equation. Yes, I know the absolute risk is low for many, but still, the trade-off of two shots is minimal in my mind.

How so J&J has been tested on some of the newer strains that came out including the South African one. I would like the get the most updated one available when possible where the other 2 have only been tested against the Strains that initially came out 

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11 hours ago, Dinsy Ejotuz said:

I was under the impression that the reported effectiveness of the J&J vaccine was impacted by when it was in testing -- where variants were a large proportion of the infections in the test.  Meaning that if Pfizer and Moderna had been tested against the variants instead of the initial strain their results might look more like J&J's.  Is that not right?

You are correct. The 66% means you will have lesser effects of COVID then others. J7J was tested against newer strains since it came out later including the first new strain from South Africa as well. So yes if the other 2 were tested during the same time as J&J then you'd very likely see similar results. The hope Is the scientist are still testing and hopefully by next year or so we have a much more effective shot overall. The initial Shot is to get people protected to have less reactions as opposed to not being vaccinated and potentially in the hospital or worse death. 

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14 hours ago, Rodrigo Duterte said:

No, a large part of our population cannot use common sense.  And the reason it "has stunk for our entire country" is because of that.

So you can rip on lockdown measures being "archaic" all you want.  Some places that's true.  But the alternative would have probably left us more like Brazil, less like what we got.

I don’t disagree with your sentiment about a large part of our country lacking common sense. We are on the same page. But my personal freedoms and rights are going to suffer because of idiots? No....the idiots will get Covid while I have been able to avoid it using my common sense. I am not saying everyone who contracted Covid is an idiot so please do not take it that way. I am talking about people who are simply ignorant to taking good common sense measures to prevent contraction. 

If I see a situation where I feel that it would drastically increase my chances of contracting the virus....I avoid it. 

It is a slippery slope. So yes Archaic measures were needed for a bit (Feb-Aug 2020) to get this under control, but now? Sorry...we are well past that point, because otherwise our entire economy will wreck 10’s of millions of lives and we have vaccines now.

Time to move on from this lockdown mentality and get back to living. And if you choose not to get vaccinated? That is on you. 

 

Edited by Todem
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