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Debate Thread 1st Topic: Illegal Immigration- Question Time (1 Viewer)

timschochet

timschochet

Footballguy
The mods killed the GG debate, which in retrospect was probably bound to happen since he made such a circus out of it and then tried to dictate to them as well. He’s a strange dude, whatever. 
But I wanted to do it because it’s a good idea. I’d still love to have a debate with somebody a little less weird than GG (which means practically anyone in this forum). I don’t want to argue opposite sides and I don’t want to argue 100% Trump: some Trump of course, but mostly the issues of the day: the economy, infrastructure, climate change, race, immigration, abortion, Russia, China, Middle East, etc. I want someone who represents current day conservative views. 
A respectful debate, back and forth with a FEW loose rules: on each topic each side makes an opening statement, then a rebuttal. There could be questions from the cheap seats, who knows? But length, content, use of links, all that stuff is up to the debater. We could have judges or just let readers chime in. 
Any takers? If not that’s fine. I know some folks around here love the last thread turned out to be a joke and would love nothing more than for this one to be a joke as well- they’re in this forum for much different reasons than I am. I’m hoping that somebody takes me up on this. 

 
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squistion said:
Tim, your attempts at a debate inevitably turn out to be a train wreck because the other side always makes it a circus. I am not sure why you expected a different result with GG.
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I didn’t. But he was the first one to challenge me rather than the other way around so I accepted. 

 
timschochet said:
The mods killed the GG debate, which in retrospect was probably bound to happen since he made such a circus out of it and then tried to dictate to them as well. He’s a strange dude, whatever. 
But I wanted to do it because it’s a good idea. I’d still love to have a debate with somebody a little less weird than GG (which means practically anyone in this forum). I don’t want to argue opposite sides and I don’t want to argue 100% Trump: some Trump of course, but mostly the issues of the day: the economy, infrastructure, climate change, race, immigration, abortion, Russia, China, Middle East, etc. I want someone who represents current day conservative views. 
A respectful debate, back and forth with a FEW loose rules: on each topic each side makes an opening statement, then a rebuttal. There could be questions from the cheap seats, who knows? But length, content, use of links, all that stuff is up to the debater. We could have judges or just let readers chime in. 
Any takers? If not that’s fine. I know some folks around here love the last thread turned out to be a joke and would love nothing more than for this one to be a joke as well- they’re in this forum for much different reasons than I am. I’m hoping that somebody takes me up on this. 
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Save the shots against other posters for another forum. 

And for the other posters who'll jump in, sorry but it's not always about "the other" side. 

This could be a fun topic. If you do it, I'd suggest putting someone like bigbottom or fatguyinlittlecoat in charge and let them set the rules and moderate. 

Also to add, what I'd really love to see is instead of debate, that people take the time and energy they would spend debating and put that towards a real life effort in their hometown trying to change for real the things they care about. 

 
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Joe Bryant said:
Also to add, what I'd really love to see is, instead of debate, that people take the time and energy they would spend debating and put that towards a real life effort in their hometown trying to change for real the things they care about. 
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It’s not an either-or. Debate is a form of entertainment just like any other form of entertainment. In your sentence above you could easily replace “instead of debate” with “instead of television” or “instead of sports watching” or “instead of fantasy football” etc. Yet entertainment IS important. So is helping ones community. These are not mutually exclusive. 

 
There are a lot of debate groups in the world and on the Interwebs.  Maybe go seek one out if you're so determined to debate people.

 
Joe Bryant said:
Save the shots against other posters for another forum. 

And for the other posters who'll jump in, sorry but it's not always about "the other" side. 

This could be a fun topic. If you do it, I'd suggest putting someone like bigbottom or fatguyinlittlecoat in charge and let them set the rules and moderate. 

Also to add, what I'd really love to see is instead of debate, that people take the time and energy they would spend debating and put that towards a real life effort in their hometown trying to change for real the things they care about. 
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I'll second the bolded

 
John123 said:
There are a lot of debate groups in the world and on the Interwebs.  Maybe go seek one out if you're so determined to debate people.
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Why the negative response? If you’re not interested in this, why respond at all? 
 

To answer your question I’m not determined. Just thought it would be fun. If nobody takes me up on it, that’s cool. But the resistance to the idea is a little surprising. 

 
timschochet said:
Really? So this is the ONE pastime that should be replaced with good works in the neighborhood? All other forms of entertainment are fine, but a debate idea deserves shaming and “why aren’t you out helping others?” Quite a bit of hypocrisy IMO
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the primary reason i dont debate the issues in these threads much anymore is that the participants dont want to debate. they want to bleat, to squawk, to howl out who they are, what team they are on and how much they need to fear, oppose & register disgust to give motive intent to their mental & emotional lives. other than that, i like em fine....

 
timschochet said:
You know, until you brought it up, I never realized just how much time I spent posting in here. I sure wish somebody had pointed this out to me a long time ago. 
 
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My two cents not that you care.  You’re way too emotional to have a serious debate.  For whatever you want to say about GG you told him to set the rules and you’ve complained about them from the beginning.  You also expect everyone to spend the same time here you do.  You could have your debates in most threads if you policed the riff raft on your side instead of the other side and didn’t over power everyone with volume.  I know when I’ve tried to engage you over the years you just move the goalposts to try to declare your opinions more valid than mine so I just check out.  I’ll never beat you in volume. Fwiw. 

 
timschochet said:
Why the negative response? If you’re not interested in this, why respond at all? 
 

To answer your question I’m not determined. Just thought it would be fun. If nobody takes me up on it, that’s cool. But the resistance to the idea is a little surprising. 
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It's not a negative response.  Your judgment of it as such is part of the reason I recommend you look elsewhere.  This is the PSF.  It's supposed to be for everyone to discuss political topics.  It's not Tim's personal playground to pick and choose who and how he interacts, and on what subjects he does so.  There are formal debate groups that exist to engage in such endeavors.  I have no problem with you engaging in debates.  I just would rather you find the appropriate forum for doing so. 

 
Shocked Tim of Attension had to start another thread when the other one got locked. (What's the point of the locking threads if you just let them fire up anew?)

The only thing I can figure is Tim is trying to make up for some sort of emotional deficiency in real life. 

 
Some of these responses are hilarious. @John123playing board cop and trying to instruct me on what this forum should be about. @tonydeadtrying to psychoanalyze my motives (they’re actually pretty simple Tony- I thought a structured back and forth debate would be fun and educational-that’s it!) @Ramblin Wreck opining that I’m too emotional, wouldn’t follow GG’s convoluted and insane rules and…oh yeah I almost forgot: RW says I POST TOO MUCH (Hey Wreck how many posts is that now you’ve devoted to whining about me, squis or sho? Someone guessed it was 20 out of the last 21 but I can’t find the 1.) 

 
I'm not sure why people are criticizing the debate idea.  I thought this forum was all about debating political ideas or opinions, and a structured format would be interesting.  Agree or disagree with Tim's opinions, he is very well versed on a lot of issues and history.  Maybe people are intimidated by his wide base of knowledge?  Sounds like GordonGekko has his hands full at the moment with that Zoomba instructor so we need some of the other conservatives to step up and challenge Tim as a team.

 
Caveman33 said:
I'm not sure why people are criticizing the debate idea.  I thought this forum was all about debating political ideas or opinions, and a swe need some of the other conservatives to step up and challenge Tim as a team.
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Reminds me of the time Andre The Giant fought a team of midgets.

 
Joe Bryant said:
Also to add, what I'd really love to see is instead of debate, that people take the time and energy they would spend debating and put that towards a real life effort in their hometown trying to change for real the things they care about. 
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timschochet said:
Again, if someone wrote these exact same words about fantasy football, would you agree with it? 
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Cowboysfan8 said:
No one spends 8-10 hrs a day 5-7 days a week arguing about fantasy football
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🤷‍♂️

 
timschochet said:
Really? So this is the ONE pastime that should be replaced with good works in the neighborhood? All other forms of entertainment are fine, but a debate idea deserves shaming and “why aren’t you out helping others?” Quite a bit of hypocrisy IMO
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Frankly I could care less how you spend your precious time on earth, so long as you don't tread on me or mine. I was merely seconding a suggestion that I think would be beneficial for ALL.

I'm not trying to shame you, I don't know you. You may very well do more in your community than I do mine. Then again, maybe not.

 
timschochet said:
Some of these responses are hilarious. @John123playing board cop and trying to instruct me on what this forum should be about. @tonydeadtrying to psychoanalyze my motives (they’re actually pretty simple Tony- I thought a structured back and forth debate would be fun and educational-that’s it!) @Ramblin Wreck opining that I’m too emotional, wouldn’t follow GG’s convoluted and insane rules and…oh yeah I almost forgot: RW says I POST TOO MUCH (Hey Wreck how many posts is that now you’ve devoted to whining about me, squis or sho? Someone guessed it was 20 out of the last 21 but I can’t find the 1.) 
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Enjoy mashing the keyboard to yourself.  And you wonder why no one wants to have discussions with you. You can have the last word as always 

 
Both of you please drop it. The seemingly never ending back and forth slapping at each other is not what we want here. 

 
I don't get why people are piling on tim for wanting to do a debate.  It's not something I would do, but we're talking about a guy who literally wrote a novella that he published on this site, and who is possibly best known for doing interminably long drafts of random stuff.  Obviously his preferences are a little different, and that's fine.  It's not as if folks can't just ignore the Great Debate Thread if they're not interested.

 
tonydead said:
Shocked Tim of Attension had to start another thread when the other one got locked. (What's the point of the locking threads if you just let them fire up anew?)

The only thing I can figure is Tim is trying to make up for some sort of emotional deficiency in real life. 
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So weak.  Please don’t volunteer to debate him 

 
IvanKaramazov said:
I don't get why people are piling on tim for wanting to do a debate.  It's not something I would do, but we're talking about a guy who literally wrote a novella that he published on this site, and who is possibly best known for doing interminably long drafts of random stuff.  Obviously his preferences are a little different, and that's fine.  It's not as if folks can't just ignore the Great Debate Thread if they're not interested.
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This is what people like Tim used to say about political threads in the FFA before Joe created the PSF.

 
IvanKaramazov said:
I don't get why people are piling on tim for wanting to do a debate.  It's not something I would do, but we're talking about a guy who literally wrote a novella that he published on this site, and who is possibly best known for doing interminably long drafts of random stuff.  Obviously his preferences are a little different, and that's fine.  It's not as if folks can't just ignore the Great Debate Thread if they're not interested.
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I actually think it’s a fine idea

I also think comparing his posting in the PSF to people posting in the shark pool is……something

 
Joe Bryant said:
For what?
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I’ll answer because you asked. But you also asked me earlier not to take shots against other posters, so I will try to be as general as possible: 

There are certain people here who follow me around from thread to thread taking shots at me. It doesn’t matter whether it’s a debate idea like this one, or if it’s a particular response I have to any specific subject; they love to rag on me. I’m not gonna name names but you can tell who they are by the fact that their posts are always about ME rather than whatever subject I am raising. As to why they do this, they have several reasons I’m sure: because they find it funny, because they don’t like my politics or my posting style or something about me personally. I’m not their only target; there is also @sho nuff and @squistion; but I seem to be the most targeted. 
So the answer is that this thread, and the debate idea,  is just another excuse for them to pile on. It’s cool; I certainly don’t feel like a victim. I can respond to their jabs (unless you prevent it) and sometimes I find them amusing. Most of them are probably good dudes just looking for some fun at my expense.  

 
timschochet said:
I’ll answer because you asked. But you also asked me earlier not to take shots against other posters, so I will try to be as general as possible: 

There are certain people here who follow me around from thread to thread taking shots at me. It doesn’t matter whether it’s a debate idea like this one, or if it’s a particular response I have to any specific subject; they love to rag on me. I’m not gonna name names but you can tell who they are by the fact that their posts are always about ME rather than whatever subject I am raising. As to why they do this, they have several reasons I’m sure: because they find it funny, because they don’t like my politics or my posting style or something about me personally. I’m not their only target; there is also @sho nuff and @squistion; but I seem to be the most targeted. 
So the answer is that this thread, and the debate idea,  is just another excuse for them to pile on. It’s cool; I certainly don’t feel like a victim. I can respond to their jabs (unless you prevent it) and sometimes I find them amusing. Most of them are probably good dudes just looking for some fun at my expense.  
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Definitely report a post if you feel "targeted". We don't want that. When I read the board, I see lots of the back and forth with posters talking about each other and not the topic and I asked both of you to stop it. It hardly seems one sided. But if it is, report it if it's over the line. We definitely do not want shots at other posters. 

If what you're typing is about another poster and not the topic, don't send it. 

 
Joe Bryant said:
Definitely report a post if you feel "targeted". We don't want that. When I read the board, I see lots of the back and forth with posters talking about each other and not the topic and I asked both of you to stop it. It hardly seems one sided. But if it is, report it if it's over the line. We definitely do not want shots at other posters. 

If what you're typing is about another poster and not the topic, don't send it. 
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He’s referring to me as one of those posters.  My response to him in this thread was directly about the topic:  why I (and likely others) don’t debate him.  Sure it talks about him as part of that reason.  Dropping it like you asked but No one follows him or any other poster he named around from thread to thread.  No one is capable of even keeping up with him to do that if they wanted too! 

 
timschochet said:
The mods killed the GG debate, which in retrospect was probably bound to happen since he made such a circus out of it and then tried to dictate to them as well. He’s a strange dude, whatever. 
But I wanted to do it because it’s a good idea. I’d still love to have a debate with somebody a little less weird than GG (which means practically anyone in this forum). I don’t want to argue opposite sides and I don’t want to argue 100% Trump: some Trump of course, but mostly the issues of the day: the economy, infrastructure, climate change, race, immigration, abortion, Russia, China, Middle East, etc. I want someone who represents current day conservative views. 
A respectful debate, back and forth with a FEW loose rules: on each topic each side makes an opening statement, then a rebuttal. There could be questions from the cheap seats, who knows? But length, content, use of links, all that stuff is up to the debater. We could have judges or just let readers chime in. 
Any takers? If not that’s fine. I know some folks around here love the last thread turned out to be a joke and would love nothing more than for this one to be a joke as well- they’re in this forum for much different reasons than I am. I’m hoping that somebody takes me up on this. 
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Oh tim, buddy just take a deep breath, this board isnt going anywhere

 
Joe Bryant said:
Definitely report a post if you feel "targeted". We don't want that. When I read the board, I see lots of the back and forth with posters talking about each other and not the topic and I asked both of you to stop it. It hardly seems one sided. But if it is, report it if it's over the line. We definitely do not want shots at other posters. 

If what you're typing is about another poster and not the topic, don't send it. 
Click to expand...
c'mon, Joe.  you have a few posters who do nothing but follow the same people from thread to thread posting about them.  they don't ever post facts or arguments...just shots at the same people over and over, topic after topic.  it's really not that difficult to see.

 
timschochet said:
Do you want to debate me? 
come on it would be totally fun. We could choose one topic for now. I know you disagree with me on immigration. We could do it just on that issue. 
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Thanks for the offer 

I don’t have the time or the energy , I’ll pass 

 
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