supermike80
Footballguy
Again, just weird you asked for a civil discussion but had zero intention of actually, you know, being civil.I tend to meet people where they're at, especially in the PSF
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.
Can We Civilly Discuss Thoughts On Vaccination? A Poll. (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Joe Bryant
- Start date
It's incredible to me (still) how many people believe the misinformation about this that they come across. I understand that at this point, they'll just never change their minds no matter how much proof or science comes out about it's efficacy. It's sad. Our world will never be the same again. It just blows me away.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
We've talked about this before - people frequently seek out information that confirms their preexisting opinions. I think all of us can be guilty of it but Covid has really help shine a light on it. If I think Covid is the worst thing ever or I think it's not big deal I'm going to gravitate to information that supports my take. I think this is why it's so important to get good information out there and educate the public as best we can. But, it's apparent that hasn't been/won't be sufficient - that's why we have to do things like vaccine passports, employers requiring vaccines, etc. It's a really unfortunate situation we find ourselves in and what really stinks is due to the unvaccinated it doesn't appear we will be back to normal for quite a while.
The Commish
Footballguy
I like that you pretend to know anything about my intentions...keep up the good work. I've laid out exactly what I expect. My only error was meeting you guys where you were instead of ignoring you until you got there. Spitting out the hook...have a good day.
Last edited by a moderator:
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
88% of the Board is vaccinated...did I not hear that 70% of America has been vaccinated or am I having Covid Nightmares and can't tell the difference?
With so many people vaccinated I don't see how there could be any Covid outbreak any more? At least some of the folks who didn't get vaccinated have caught it and would have antibodies in their system...just such a weird time we are in right now.
With so many people vaccinated I don't see how there could be any Covid outbreak any more? At least some of the folks who didn't get vaccinated have caught it and would have antibodies in their system...just such a weird time we are in right now.
LawFitz
Footballguy
It's incredible to me (still) how many people don't question anything our institutions tell them after so many examples over CENTURIES of insitutional narratives ultimately proven false. The woman I referenced a few posts ago lost her legs, hands and nearly her heart in the immediate wake of her Covid vax. And doctors and the CDC have the nerve to tell her they can't prove it was due to the vax. Just look up the countless similar stories all over the world using something other than FB/Google/YouTube - the tech companies have latched on to your view and are suppressing the 'misinformation'.
We've decended into a country where anyone who questions accepted narratives is labeled conspiratorial. Multiple posters did exactly that to me upthread. What is truly sad is when people think something that is ALWAYS evolving such as science could be settled by a few months of testing. The very foundations of science are to question and test and question and test and question and test and to never stop questioning, postulating and testing. You guys are trying to stop at the first round with something that IS doing serious immediate harm to some people and MIGHT be doing serious longterm harm to many others. Many on your side are slowly devolving into a mob of jab violators, eager to stomp on others' basic human right to determine their own medical directives. Shame on anyone who would support such a position.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
I'm not sure where you saw that number but it's way off. We are at 50% totally vaccinated across the country. My state is only about 38% totally vaccinated. We are a long ways off from herd immunity - and it is starting to seem like a pipe dream that we'll get there.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Are people who are vaccinated and still testing positive for Covid misinformation?
Simple question but I doubt I'm gonna get a simple answer.
I already know the answer, Mrs works in a hospital so people are catching this already vaccinated. My wife's hospital is "overflowing" but the people dying is minimal to none right now at the hospital.
92% of our Seniors are vaccinated here in Florida, I thought that was the biggest part of the population that could die. I understand people are testing positive but people get colds and flus every winter or season, that's not going to change.
I don't understand if we vaccinated or made them widely available for FREE to almost anyone that wants it and especially those at high risk...what exactly is the issue facing us all right now? Why is everyone so angry?
I can remember people months ago in here high five'n each other getting jabbed and no fear of going out anymore and these are the folks who should NOT be allowing themselves to be masked up under ANY CIRCUMSTANCES, you've paid your dues, you did take precautions, you got vaccinated, you/we deserve better.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Florida Seniors 92%, Publix went full mask for their employees yesterday AGAIN and almost all of them got vaccinated, they paid them to get the shots, that's so unfair to their employees, they should get federal money for first line workers, like extra for having to put up with this. I don't know why they don't just strike and not show up, they are virtually the only grocery store in most area of Florida, it would cripple people overnight.
LawFitz
Footballguy
MOP, it's because the vax isn't stopping transmission - one of the many assertions that were made that is slowly proving false.
Also, there is plenty of reason to postulate that we would be at risk of vaccine leak when trying to vaccinate an entire population during a pandemic, rather than after it subsided. When you do it during, the risk of the virus mutating to something more dangerous rises, especially if we are talking a virus that vax'd individuals can carry and pass on to others without displaying symptoms.
LawFitz
Footballguy
AAABatteries
Footballguy
No offense man but as usual your posts are all over the place. I do agree it stinks that the rest of us will need to wear masks because of how selfish a large segment of our population is being. I personally won't really wear them unless it is mandated - if it is, then I'll wear one. If circumstances change then maybe I'll wear one more often. Either way - getting worked up about masks one way or the other is not in my top 10 of things to be concerned with around Covid. #1 for everyone should be getting as many people as possible to get the vaccine.
Dickies
Footballguy
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
People right now at my wife's hospital that received the vaccine months ago are in ICU, want to come visit with me? I'm not trying to be rude at all Fitz, I'm not mad but I think you didn't read what i said correctly. Also Sen Graham, there's a picture of him getting the vaccine in Dec, he tested positive this week, it's not misinformation my friend.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Totally one's opinion and certainly not shared by a majority of people in the State where I live. You're so nonchalant about it too, so disconnected from the real world I guess.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
How is sticking up for people making $15 an hour all but forced to get vaccinated and promised this would end for them, now being forced to wear them again, how is that all over the place? The CDC or the rules and how they are laid out are ALL OVER the PLACE.
LawFitz
Footballguy
You misunderstood my response. It's absolutely fact at this point that the vax doesn't stop transmission to others. My point was that like so much else, this now undisputable fact was being labeled as misinformation as little as a few weeks ago. And it speaks to my broader point that we need to stop with that label entirely. We need to have dialogue. We need to listen to the real world affectees, especially those who are being harmed the most. And most of all, we need to slow our roll on all of this and stop being so God-damned expedient and divisive.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
Ultimately wearing a mask isn't that big a deal. I don't like wearing them but in the grand scheme of things it really isn't a big deal. It's a minor inconvenience save very rare instances.Totally one's opinion and certainly not shared by a majority of people in the State where I live. You're so nonchalant about it too, so disconnected from the real world I guess.
Doug B
Footballguy
1) 70% is not enough. And there is no firm hard number known in advance. You vaccinate society until new cases become fairly infrequent. You don't aim at an arbitrary percentage and call it good once it is achieved.
2) That 70% is not uniform. There are still large swaths of the country below 50% (like my home state).
EDIT: Added the bolded word above. Post makes more sense now.
Last edited by a moderator:
AAABatteries
Footballguy
My son works for Publix - he's not happy about it. It's an inconvenience for sure. But it's not the end of world.
The all over the place was your 3 posts in a row. One with wildly inaccurate vaccine numbers. One asking why we are seeing outbreaks and one asking if breakthrough cases are misinformation. I'd say all of that qualifies as all over the place.
Dickies
Footballguy
I can either wear the mask when I’m asked to and be a responsible member of society, or I can throw a hissy fit about it and play the victim. Masks have been used constantly since the start of the pandemic and I’m used to them. Unless you have bad breath I really don’t understand why people get so worked up about themTotally one's opinion and certainly not shared by a majority of people in the State where I live. You're so nonchalant about it too, so disconnected from the real world I guess.
Doug B
Footballguy
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
There we go, that would seem like the information I heard, TY Doug.
I'm not saying the other 30% shouldn't get jabbed, I'm just trying to show that this is not like 3/4 of the population walking around in the high risk categories are unvaccinated. We don't have bodies with toe tags piling up at the morgues as best i can tell so what are people truly getting so angry about right now?
It's hysteria and propaganda, many of you know it in your hearts but you don't want to be honest with yourself. At some point, enough is enough. You're smart to get the vaccine(if you want to live) but to join in this parade of righteousness and want to shame others or start ruining others lives because you have all the right answers and there is no other answer but the one you are currently typing...how naive and obtuse to any other thoughts.
Our government has proven again and again throughout time to make a lot of mistakes but suddenly on this issue, people are falling in line and who can blame them when their livelihood($$$) is potentially being threatened or taken away, how easy it is to control populations.
Doug B
Footballguy
I would say the people you see around you every day are kind of, in aggregate, outliers with masking attitudes.Totally one's opinion and certainly not shared by a majority of people in the State where I live. You're so nonchalant about it too, so disconnected from the real world I guess.
Even around here, which is a deep red suburb of deep-blue New Orleans ... masking percentages around me aren't super-high in recent months (50-75% depending on where and when), but complaints and agitated refusals don't really happen.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Wasn't that the President's goal to get 70% vaccinated? I thought that I had heard early on once we passed that number it was going to be smooth sailing, these were they things they said to get folks to comply rather quickly. A lot of people have been vaccinated that could die from this Virus, do people not agree on that? Is there a diabetic in Iowa or something that can't obtain a vaccination? I don't hear those stories much.
I personally drove I don't know how many Seniors from my Condo buildings to Publix and my wife's hospital to get vaccinated, I'm not trying to be ANti-Vax but I know some will rush to try and paint it that way.
I thought i heard 36% of the African American population was vaccinated, is that true? Seems terribly low.
Dickies
Footballguy
Not wanting people to die or have serious long term health complications from Covid is a weird way to want to ruin someone
Doug B
Footballguy
The ground shifts under out feet. Guidance and rules will continue to be all over the place for the duration.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
I'm trying but that little bell at the top just went off like 20x, i can't keep up and all i did was just ask a few questions and make a couple comments that might not be what 88% want to read but who @Joe Bryant did ask to come in here and have civil dialogue. Now I am not saying people are not being civil but I can't breathe at the moment so give me a minute fellows please.
-Let's be clear, I am not telling folks to not be vaccinated so please do not label me in such manner, thank you.
LawFitz
Footballguy
100% true. And yet based on the *current* guidance, so many on your side (not saying you are one of them) are ready to support mandating by law injection of a substance that a huge % of our population isn't ready to voluntarily take for whatever personal reasons.
Last edited by a moderator:
Doug B
Footballguy
Before we go to much further:
a) 70% is correct for those having received at least one dose. Note: One dose against Delta is pretty much being unvaxed.
b) 50% is correct for those being FULLY VAXED (two doses of mRNA vaccines, one dose of J&J). Link is behind WSJ paywall, but relevant info can be read here.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
The folks at my wife's hospital are irate so please if you don't wear them 8-12 hours a day i think it's awful arrogant to assume it is no big deal. Wife and son both vaccinated and both unhappy to have to put these back on so lets not say "its no big deal"...its no big deal sitting in your living room right now and not wearing a mask, it's a big deal if you have them on a lot. I don't know a lot fo folks who gleefully wear them and in fact isn't California now having a RECALL effort? Sounds like a few folks out there in Maskland don't seem all that happy either.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
70% isn't correct unless you are only talking about adults. I didn't see any qualifier in his post. The number that I see for that is 58%.
Doug B
Footballguy
An arbitrary goal but yes -- Biden said that out loud.
"Smooth sailing" at 70% single-dosed? You didn't hear that from anyone responsible in an official capacity. It was a nice goal, but definitely not a determinative one.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
My son as well, 21 yrs old and I never thought this was a good place for him but thru the pandemic and so many people leaving in droves he has carved out a living I woulda thought no way when he started.
But same thing here in Florida and I think it's highly unfair to these people who have been on the front lines since the start of all this. Good for you son, great company and my son has taken advantage of everything they offer.
fatguyinalittlecoat
Footballguy
The 70% number does not include 12-18 year olds. Only 67% of the eligible U.S. population has received at least one shot.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
It's not a big deal and the reason I know it's not is there's jobs out there that require something similar or worse and people do it. Does it suck - sure. Would I want to do it, no. I feel like we are getting hung up on semantics. I've already said I won't be wearing a mask unless it's mandated. And we haven't even shifted the discussion back to the efficacy.
Doug B
Footballguy
I was being quick and self-referential -- I had posted "70% of those 12 and up" a few minutes ago. You are correct if we're talking ALL Americans of any age.
supermike80
Footballguy
Doug B
Footballguy
I took it as, essentially, 70% of those eligible and they're saying "adults" as shorthand. I haven't seen specific figures to support that, though, so I won't quibble over three percent. 67% will work just fine for discussion.
The Commish
Footballguy
This is a rather simple question to answer. The country as a whole may be at 70%, but there are areas of this country where well over 80% of the population is vaccinated and areas like ours where less than 50% are vaccinated. Adding those together, you come to the "overall" number. In areas like ours, there is obviously going to be outbreaks. When less than half the people in an area are vaccinated, it's pretty much a guarantee that the outbreaks are going to happen.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
I'm not sure if this is your usual schtick but if you've read the thread you would know what people are angry about. Case counts rising, hospitalizations rising, deaths continuing and school is about to start. Companies re-instituting masks (you yourself seem pretty enraged about that) and the vast majority of the blame can be laid at the feet of the people unwilling to be vaccinated.
Think of it like this - you go to the movies and everybody is polite and courtesy and they watch the move in peace. Then there's one jerk who opens a can of tuna and ruins it for everybody. Anti-vaxxers are like the tuna guy ruining things for the rest of us.
Last edited by a moderator:
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
What if Publix gave a $25 gift card to get vaccinated? $50? $100?
-The more you threaten people with their livelihood the more ridiculous and desperate your POV and position sounds. Wouldn't it be easier to just lay out some Reese's Pieces sorta speaks and just keep shuffling them along to a good decision rather tan chastising and trying to hold Social Media Crucifixions to rally and galvanize the other side whatever that side is right now.
-Why stop people that want to die from this thing, obviously none of you are fans of Dr Kevorkian? If you got jabbed, you won't die so just relax and let others parrish, why does it bother you that people you don't know didn't care enough to protect themselves? If you have a loved one i'm sure you got them vaccinated and if you didn't or cannot then you shouldn't love them quite as much if losing them int he future is going to be too painful for you.
@AAABatteries now that post might count as all over the place but I wanted to make a sure you saw a good one.
4 kids, you and your wife are Saints.
-The more you threaten people with their livelihood the more ridiculous and desperate your POV and position sounds. Wouldn't it be easier to just lay out some Reese's Pieces sorta speaks and just keep shuffling them along to a good decision rather tan chastising and trying to hold Social Media Crucifixions to rally and galvanize the other side whatever that side is right now.
-Why stop people that want to die from this thing, obviously none of you are fans of Dr Kevorkian? If you got jabbed, you won't die so just relax and let others parrish, why does it bother you that people you don't know didn't care enough to protect themselves? If you have a loved one i'm sure you got them vaccinated and if you didn't or cannot then you shouldn't love them quite as much if losing them int he future is going to be too painful for you.
@AAABatteries now that post might count as all over the place but I wanted to make a sure you saw a good one.
4 kids, you and your wife are Saints.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
I'm all for incentives to get people to get vaccinated - scholarships, lotteries, government handing out 1k checks - whatever. I'm also in favor of companies, events, etc. requiring vaccines.
No clue what you mean by threatening somebody's livelihood.
If you are asking why we are pushing the vaccine on somebody who is fine with dying from it then the answer is because their decision isn't just impacting them. It's pretty clear and been said a bunch.
I'm a Falcons fan - never call me a Saint.
(Not to mention it's inaccurate - my wife maybe, definitely not me)
fatguyinalittlecoat
Footballguy
AAABatteries
Footballguy
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
First of all, thank you and I follow your logic so please understand why I seem a bit arrogant about these vaccine numbers. I'm having a hard time understanding why people are not getting the vaccine that want it.
Here in Florida it's ready-set-jab almost everywhere and the number in our State prove we focused on the Seniors and those who were high at risk. I have seen folks try and slander my statements by shouting Florida is middle of the pack at best, but at what? 92% of our Seniors are vaccinated, only the truly looney in that age group opted no vaccine, and at least some of those remaining 8% had to catch it and somehow beat the odds and survived.
I'm not that concerned with people testing positive who are not high risk to die. My wife's hospital had a lot of folks in it but almost nobody was hooked up to one of these venhilators thankfully and deaths are minimal, that doesn't mean it's not happening but I don't believe we are witnessing death tolls like we saw last summer.
Who are people really angry with? Search your feelings folks, are you really that mad at folks not currently vaccinated? How are they ruining your current life?
fatguyinalittlecoat
Footballguy
Numbers from NY Times
At least one dose
All ages 57.7%
12 and up 67.6%
18 and up 70.0%
65 and up 80.1%
Fully vaccinated
All ages 49.6%
12 and up 58.1%
18 and up 60.6%
65 and up 89.9%
Similar threads
