What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.

Ivermectin: What have you heard? (1 Viewer)

Status
Not open for further replies.
Ministry of Pain

Ministry of Pain

Footballguy
My family is pretty split on this topic and I will bet in some of yours it could be a hot topic in the coming weeks and months. 

-I purposely did not put the Covid in the thread topic, i'm not endorsing this as a cure for Covid or any reason that folks especially ones who have pre-existing conditions like diabetes, don't play games with this virus and your life, you should definitely be encouraged to get vaccinated. This is meant to learn more and get some open discussion going for those who want to try and discover more about this Ivermectin other than its a horse drug.

-I do not support forced vaccinations however and don't want to be part of a society in the way it has been tossed around recently with passports or basically wearing a Scarlet Letter indicating vaccinated/NonVax, just preposterous.  

-My brother has a stockpile of these and he is one of the more sane and intelligent people I know, still i have my doubts like a lot of you and want to know more about this because he won't take the vaccine and since he does work the government I am trying to figure out how he is going to pull this off since it seems like it will be required or mandatory in these environments. 

-Some of you have no idea what we are talking about here but people are swearing that this Ivermectin works when people start to show symptoms of the Covid and if you know anyone who got sick and lived but got very sick, we're talking 2.5-3 weeks off their feet and symptoms that went on much longer than that for many, some still suffering lingering effects. 

I don't want our main CV thread to be totally derailed so i wanted to have a safe spot where folks can post what they feel they need to but I caution against main stream media stories, Fox News, that's stuff won't mean a lot to me and others that have stopped watching a lot of news 24/7 and sometimes I have to pause when I read some of your posts because I am not familiar with some fo the things you are bringing up but its not because you are so dang smart but more like you are brainwashed and controlled by (Pick any News Network/Social Media Platform you scroll like my wife does when she watches cat videos in her chaise at night) whatever the news outlet is that is working to build your narrative or you have adopted their flag in many ways. 

I do not expect this thread to blast off, it may die a very quick death because again with 90% of the board vaccinated I cannot imagine that most folks are sweating what others are doing and not doing in terms of getting jabbed but it seems to be playing huge in here like the mainstream media...see the connection there?  ;)

 Cheers!

 
Last edited by a moderator:
I'd like to see the discussion here if there is any so I'll follow along.  But I'll say this.... most of the people posting good info in the CV19 thread are NOT getting it from mainstream media. Honestly, mainstream media are getting their info from a lot of the stuff being posted in the thread. Mainstream media then proceeds to put their own slant/agenda/view on it, from the headlines to the interpretation. 

 
Nathan R. Jessep said:
I'd like to see the discussion here if there is any so I'll follow along.  But I'll say this.... most of the people posting good info in the CV19 thread are NOT getting it from mainstream media. Honestly, mainstream media are getting their info from a lot of the stuff being posted in the thread. Mainstream media then proceeds to put their own slant/agenda/view on it, from the headlines to the interpretation. 
Click to expand...
Good to hear NJR, I find folks seem to be very tunneled in to one of the major news outlets or social media even if its just Facebook which is another place I don't even have an account there which is I guess the equivalent of not having a cell phone? 

 
Dickies said:
Does not compute.
Click to expand...
I edited to say I kinda get it, that's tough to understand but yeah he is highly intelligent and in general on top of things so to have that hard of a stance you recoil if you come from where I do. 

Doesn't compute to me either but for different reasons and we are not using the term in the same way I don't believe

 
Last edited by a moderator:
If the CDC says it's not effective I would tend to think it was actually very effective. Not sure I know of any other medical issue so politicized as Covid. I haven't heard of Ivermectin before your post. I did get Moderna vaccinations but have had periodic mild migraines daily since a week after my second shot end of March. Turns out a couple granules of Himalayan salt stops the headaches within a couple minutes.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Phil Elliott said:
If the CDC says it's not effective I would tend to think i it was actually very effective. Not sure I know of any other medical issue so politicized as Covid. I haven't heard of Ivermectin before your post. I did get Moderna vaccinations but have had periodic mild migraines daily since a week after my second ##### end of March. Turns out a couple granules of Himalayan salt stops the headaches within a couple minutes.
Click to expand...
It's an anti-parasitic, from what I've gathered. And also given to animals (not sure if the dosages are different, etc.). I have no idea who/when it was first thought of to try as a Covid treatment. 

 
Phil Elliott said:
If the CDC says it's not effective I would tend to think it was actually very effective. Not sure I know of any other medical issue so politicized as Covid. I haven't heard of Ivermectin before your post. I did get Moderna vaccinations but have had periodic mild migraines daily since a week after my second shot end of March. Turns out a couple granules of Himalayan salt stops the headaches within a couple minutes.
Click to expand...
And we still have people who seem to like to wear masks in broad daylight outside even though its impossible to catch this virus or any virus i would assume outside in the blazing sun. Nobody caught Covid at the Beach that was an outright lie. People might have caught it in their cheap motels on Spring Break but they weren't catching Covid on the sand. In fact if we could get everyone to go camping and stay outdoors for a week or two with no AC I think we could beat this thing once and for all. Who is with me on going to Yosemite? 

 
Doug B said:
Mosquito-borne viruses such as Zika, West Nile, and yellow fever spread almost exclusively outdoors.
Click to expand...
Excellent point, thank gawd this thing doesn't spread thru mosquito bites here. That would put a real damper on things. 

I was thinking more like those long camera shots on the news in 2020 where they would show people laying around on the beach or biking in a park like they are doing something wrong. 

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Ministry of Pain said:
And we still have people who seem to like to wear masks in broad daylight outside even though its impossible to catch this virus or any virus i would assume outside in the blazing sun. Nobody caught Covid at the Beach that was an outright lie. People might have caught it in their cheap motels on Spring Break but they weren't catching Covid on the sand. In fact if we could get everyone to go camping and stay outdoors for a week or two with no AC I think we could beat this thing once and for all. Who is with me on going to Yosemite? 
Click to expand...
I dunno, six of my neighbors got it at an outdoor bbq in 95 degree weather.

I have gone back to wearing masks everywhere I go other than mountain biking. Whether they are super effective isn’t all that important to me. At this point I’ll do whatever I can to help prevent the spread.  Every little bit helps. 

 
Dickies said:
I dunno, six of my neighbors got it at an outdoor bbq in 95 degree weather.

I have gone back to wearing masks everywhere I go other than mountain biking. Whether they are super effective isn’t all that important to me. At this point I’ll do whatever I can to help prevent the spread.  Every little bit helps. 
Click to expand...
From the BBC which I hate using but it was simply the easiest...and they are pretty pro mask and vaccine and the rest of it but they did print this...

What makes the outdoors safer?

-Researchers say infections can happen outdoors, but the chances are massively reduced.

-Fresh air dilutes the virus.

-It also helps to evaporate the liquid droplets in which it is carried.

-On top of that, ultraviolet light from the Sun should kill any virus that's out in the open.

And while not impossible Dickies, you must know the 6 people who caught it outdoors because...they go on to say 

-Even so, there are a handful of cases where it's believed that infections did happen outside. 

Handful sounds like they could be counted on one hand so maybe you got the magic 6 at the BBQ, we gotta follow the science and the science says you cant really catch it outdoors so again if we would all just head to Smoky National Park and go camping for 2 weeks then as a nation we can begin the healing process. 

The science says go pitch a tent. 

 
Ministry of Pain said:
From the BBC which I hate using but it was simply the easiest...and they are pretty pro mask and vaccine and the rest of it but they did print this...

What makes the outdoors safer?

-Researchers say infections can happen outdoors, but the chances are massively reduced.

-Fresh air dilutes the virus.

-It also helps to evaporate the liquid droplets in which it is carried.

-On top of that, ultraviolet light from the Sun should kill any virus that's out in the open.

And while not impossible Dickies, you must know the 6 people who caught it outdoors because...they go on to say 

-Even so, there are a handful of cases where it's believed that infections did happen outside. 

Handful sounds like they could be counted on one hand so maybe you got the magic 6 at the BBQ, we gotta follow the science and the science says you cant really catch it outdoors so again if we would all just head to Smoky National Park and go camping for 2 weeks then as a nation we can begin the healing process. 

The science says go pitch a tent. 
Click to expand...
Now that I think about it, my four family members that tested positive likely contracted it at a golf tournament. I totally agree that being outdoors greatly diminishes the odds of being infected, but characterizing it as “impossible” seems way over the top. 

 
Start Here

That’s the NIH COVID treatment guidelines, with references.

Key takeaway points:

- Despite some biological plausibility, the are no well designed, large scale randomized controlled studies using ivermectin to prevent or treat COVID-19.

- In vitro studies suggesting antiviral effect occurred at concentrations well above those achieved with approved dosing.

- Existing studies using ivermectin are small, methodologically flawed and have yielded inconsistent results.

 
Ministry of Pain said:
And we still have people who seem to like to wear masks in broad daylight outside even though its impossible to catch this virus or any virus i would assume outside in the blazing sun. Nobody caught Covid at the Beach that was an outright lie. People might have caught it in their cheap motels on Spring Break but they weren't catching Covid on the sand. In fact if we could get everyone to go camping and stay outdoors for a week or two with no AC I think we could beat this thing once and for all. Who is with me on going to Yosemite? 
Click to expand...
Well Florida is clearly doing everything right.

 
I have been reading about this a while, ii thought it might have shown promise, but there are cracks starting to form.

https://www.medpagetoday.com/special-reports/exclusives/93658

A large Egyptian study of ivermectin for COVID-19 patients has been retracted over concerns of plagiarism and serious problems with their raw data, the publisher confirmed to MedPage Today.

Michele Avissar-Whiting, PhD, editor-in-chief of the preprint server Research Square, said in an emailed statement that the study was withdrawn on July 14 "because we were presented with evidence of both plagiarism and anomalies in the dataset associated with the study, neither of which could reasonably be addressed by the author issuing a revised version of the paper."

The study was one of the largest ivermectin trials in the world, and has been included in two recent meta-analyses (Bryant et al. and Hill et al.) that received much attention for their positive results -- particularly the Hill review, which had been anticipated by a U.S. group that has long promoted ivermectin.

Some have questioned whether the positive conclusions of those meta-analyses would still stand when the Egyptian study is removed.

David Boulware, MD, MPH, of the University of Minnesota, told MedPage Today that the 400-patient Egyptian trial -- from Ahmed Elgazzar, MD, of Benha University, and colleagues -- was the largest study included in the Hill review and accounted for 20% of the total data.

 
Ministry of Pain said:
From the BBC which I hate using but it was simply the easiest...and they are pretty pro mask and vaccine and the rest of it but they did print this...

What makes the outdoors safer?

-Researchers say infections can happen outdoors, but the chances are massively reduced.

-Fresh air dilutes the virus.

-It also helps to evaporate the liquid droplets in which it is carried.

-On top of that, ultraviolet light from the Sun should kill any virus that's out in the open.

And while not impossible Dickies, you must know the 6 people who caught it outdoors because...they go on to say 

-Even so, there are a handful of cases where it's believed that infections did happen outside. 

Handful sounds like they could be counted on one hand so maybe you got the magic 6 at the BBQ, we gotta follow the science and the science says you cant really catch it outdoors so again if we would all just head to Smoky National Park and go camping for 2 weeks then as a nation we can begin the healing process. 

The science says go pitch a tent. 
Click to expand...
Rose Garden Super Spreader down?

 
Dickies said:
I dunno, six of my neighbors got it at an outdoor bbq in 95 degree weather.

I have gone back to wearing masks everywhere I go other than mountain biking. Whether they are super effective isn’t all that important to me. At this point I’ll do whatever I can to help prevent the spread.  Every little bit helps. 
Click to expand...
I don’t know.  People at a bbq often go inside somebody’s house on/off during the bbq.  You know, to get condiments, drinks, etc.  And inevitably people end up standing around in the kitchen talking for 30 min before remembering “hey, we are at a bbq, why are we inside?”   Or they go inside to get some cool air because it’s 95 degrees out.

Point being, it wouldn’t be shocking if folks at a bbq also spent time indoors, unmasked.

 
apalmer said:
Rose Garden Super Spreader down?
Click to expand...
It didn't jump up in "mid air" and inflict folks. And just because people say they got it outside doesn't mean they didn't catch it as they brush their hands all over the indoor bathroom with air conditioning. 

I don't want to argue about BBQs and outdoor venues, I linked very clearly from a pretty hard Left news source that Covid or any virus like a cold or flu is pretty much destroyed by ultraviolet light from the Sun, you just blurting out Martha's Vineyard and social media reports do not replace good old fashion science. 

I'm glad you made that point because it is said quite often and the constant repeating of strawman catching it everywhere outside is almost as scary as the folks putting their blind faith in these Ivermectin pills. I never once have said or endorsed these things as a replacement for the vaccine, in fact I encourage folks to get vaccinated but I am not endorsing forced vaccines and my Liberal wife is against mandatory vaccines as well just fyi...

It's exhaustive having to restate what is widely known as facts vs propaganda SOLD-$$$ thru one of these media outlets. It's not peoples fault, it's society but again when you remove yourself from the TV and most nightly news I find it quite eye opening when you do infrequently tune in....you almost want to turn it off or it sounds a little like you are living in a foreign country. Much of what is reported nationally isn't happening anywhere around me when I am out and about.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Alex P Keaton said:
I don’t know.  People at a bbq often go inside somebody’s house on/off during the bbq.  You know, to get condiments, drinks, etc.  And inevitably people end up standing around in the kitchen talking for 30 min before remembering “hey, we are at a bbq, why are we inside?”   Or they go inside to get some cool air because it’s 95 degrees out.

Point being, it wouldn’t be shocking if folks at a bbq also spent time indoors, unmasked.
Click to expand...
This has been one of my biggest sticking points from day 1.  Yes 500 people at a 60th BDay/BBQ can catch the virus but it will be at the inside bar or bathroom or condiment bar or the backroom poker table...but it's like they need an illustration for every point based on widely accepted science. 

-Yes, MoP thinks everyone should go camping for 2-3 weeks or mandatory Beach Living in Florida for a couple weeks, you can camp right on the sand and get everyone outdoors for up to a month.People laugh but the ones who physically can't do it and there will be many but those folks will gather at a government building instead and be vaccinated since they so unhealthy they can't go camping and we jab the entire high risk section of the population simultaneously destroying it in largely sections of the population that won't die even if they catch it but F'it we might as well try and kill this off once and for all.   

We've allowed this major point in how the virus truly spreads to go largely unchecked and its made it far too easy for local governments to do some pretty heinous things that at least half the population in these areas just shrug and say "Sure take some more of our freedoms away" because people have lost their will to want to contribute and work in this society...what is the point of trying to get ahead? I feel terrible for workers that mostly make hourly wages and have been forced to stay home for so long before things got turned around it destroyed their lives. 

It's been announced in Florida we are not shutting down for any reason. I have gone back to having my groceries mostly delivered and I'm putting a restriction on myself, even the indoor/outdoor bars I'm gonna have to take a hard pass on for now and indoor dining is just out of the question. It's not even my own personal fear of catching the virus, it's the visual of looking at some people wearing them and some not, workers masked up and looking scared, it's just not comfortable to enjoy fine dining. My poor wife is going to have to endure more of my cooking. 

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Good summary, copied from @Dinsy Ejotuz's post in the CV19 thread:

Evaluation of Ivermectin for use in COVID-19 falls in three different categories. Each one is showing variable results.  1. In-vitro or test-tube studies which look at “effectiveness” of the drug in reducing virus load  2. Empirical evidence of Ivermectin against SARS-CoV-2. Some countries have mass Ivermectin administration programs for the prevention of parasites, and they report lower numbers of COVID-19 case counts. This indicates the potential of using Ivermectin for prevention of COVID-19. 3. In-vivo studies, which means testing on living organisms. These include clinical trials demonstrating conflicting results. The studies that did show a positive impact of Ivermectin were small, and used only in patients with mild COVID-19. In some cases effectiveness of Ivermectin was in combination with other drugs. Findings also suggested that for Ivermectin to be effective it would be at doses likely to be toxic. However, several clinical trials are being conducted to better understand the effectiveness of the drug against prevention and treatment of COVID-19. As of August 2021, according to ClinicalTrials.gov (the largest clinical trials database in the world) currently 75 studies are ongoing investigating the usefulness of ivermectin in COVID-19. Findings from such studies will be critical to determine if ivermectin can be used in the prevention and/or treatment of COVID-19 

In summary, the current evidence available on the use of ivermectin to treat COVID-19 patients is inconclusive. Health organizations including WHO recommends ivermectin only be used within clinical trials for COVID-19.
Click to expand...

 
Frostillicus said:
So this thread is crazy town.
Click to expand...
If crazy town is not following the CDC lock stock and barrel then yeah it might be a little crazy for people who cannot think outside the box or who prefer to be slaves to the media propaganda machine. 

-Let's not pretend the field of medicine is immune to greed. Cancer doctors make a fortune extending terminally ill cancer patients that would die in 3 months naturally and extend them to a little while longer and it's the most hellish experience these people will go thru and wish they were never born but the doctors make a lot of $$$ on chemotherapy and would never want to be truthful, always want to give them a 1% chance of remission and it's all about greed. 

-Pfizer a non profit company?  

 
Ministry of Pain said:
-Yes, MoP thinks everyone should go camping for 2-3 weeks or mandatory Beach Living in Florida for a couple weeks, you can camp right on the sand and get everyone outdoors for up to a month.People laugh but the ones who physically can't do it and there will be many but those folks will gather at a government building instead and be vaccinated since they so unhealthy they can't go camping and we jab the entire high risk section of the population simultaneously destroying it in largely sections of the population that won't die even if they catch it but F'it we might as well try and kill this off once and for all.   
Click to expand...
Is it OK if I use the ocean in front of your place as my toilet and bathtub?

Seriously, as long as this thread stays on the rails, I'll be checking in.

 
How come people who think there isn't enough research in the COVID vaccination, despite the high level of research and testing that went into them, will immediately latch on to a drug with a barely-there small sample study? A drug that also has side effects, some of them severe.  https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/ivermectin-oral-tablet#side-effects

Here is what the company that makes the drug has released:

The drug’s manufacturer, pharma giant MSD, also warned that its analysis of ivermectin identified “no scientific basis for a potential therapeutic effect against Covid-19 from pre-clinical studies”, “no meaningful evidence for clinical activity or clinical efficacy in patients with Covid-19 disease” and “a concerning lack of safety data” in most studies.

Stay safe out there...

 
Green and Gold said:
How come people who think there isn't enough research in the COVID vaccination, despite the high level of research and testing that went into them, will immediately latch on to a drug with a barely-there small sample study? A drug that also has side effects, some of them severe.  https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/ivermectin-oral-tablet#side-effects

Here is what the company that makes the drug has released:

The drug’s manufacturer, pharma giant MSD, also warned that its analysis of ivermectin identified “no scientific basis for a potential therapeutic effect against Covid-19 from pre-clinical studies”, “no meaningful evidence for clinical activity or clinical efficacy in patients with Covid-19 disease” and “a concerning lack of safety data” in most studies.

Stay safe out there...
Click to expand...
Great post, one question just based on some other posts already. 

I assume the drug company that makes it is saying basically it's rat poison to humans or toxic. If that's true then why are all these clinical trials taking place like @Nathan R. Jessep was linking? We don't need to run trials on whether people should ingest RAID or not, we know its toxic and we keep it away from children etc...I'm just wondering why they would even try to test this stuff. Why are people with professional licenses like doctors endorsing it? I'll accept $ as an answer but that would only lead us back to why people do not trust the medical community as it is. 

Again if you have had long interactions with hospitals or doctors thru loved ones passing away from things like cancer at younger ages like under 50, you know a lot of these doctors are quacks and really don't have a lot of answers which is why people should take control of their health and not rely on a lot of visits to the doctor..."Talk to your doctor" yeah why do they all seem to want us to grab the phone and talk to our doctor? $$$ Maybe Jesus should have overturned the scales at the hospital instead of the temple. 

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Well, I always look at it this way. If you're in a car wreck and they cut you out with the jaws of life, do you want the ambulance to take you to the hospital or to church?

As it turns out, doctors are people too, with all the flaws that come with it. There is an old medical joke that applies here: "What do you call the person who skated by through medical school with barely-passing grades? Doctor."

As for your question about why people are testing or promoting this, there could be many reasons. Maybe they're invested in a generic version of the drug and stand to make money off it. Maybe someone with COVID and taking the drug for another reason had a 'miraculous' recovery and they attributed it to the drug, and it spread from there. It's hard to say.

 
Frostillicus said:
Well Florida is clearly doing everything right.
Click to expand...
Maybe if the entire country didn't use this great place as a Drive-Thru vacation for the last 12 months bringing all their germs with them...

-92% of our Seniors vaccinated, that's like 92% of the population in Naples and Ft Myers. Who cares how many folks test positive under 50, and yeah the hospitals are a little full but its not ventilators like last summer and people are not being toe tagged left and right down here. 

-Why are people buying property here like its going out of style? 

-My brother moved from Wash DC to Florida, staunch Lib I might add...

Proof is in the pudding if you live here. You all know Cappy pretty well, think he hangs out in the Tampa Bay area and I would bet he might not like some of the policies in Florida but I also bet he knows like I do that we have been BLESSED to be living down here thru this pandemic. Our lives changed some but compared to the hell some parts of this country went thru, which is why I felt a moral obligation to be a good host to folks when they were visiting and not yell at them to go back home. I drove many snow birds who were scared to leave their house and helped them get vaccinated, I don't push other age groups as much but we have so many Seniors it would cripple Florida if that section of the population decided only 36% of them were going to get jabbed, we needed a high % of Seniors getting this vaccine and should be very grateful they didn't put up much of a fight or fuss about it. 

Thank you to all Floridians on the Board, you have done a tremendous job and we just broke a record in fundraising at the hospital here, previous high was $40M and in 2020/2021 we have raised over $54M which I never thought in a million years with virtually no fundraising events and yet people came thru. 

 
Ministry of Pain said:
From the BBC which I hate using but it was simply the easiest...and they are pretty pro mask and vaccine and the rest of it ...
Click to expand...
This is a disheartening sentence.

The BBC is about as reliable a popular news source as you'll find on these matters. Pro-mask and pro-vaccine stances are beyond well-supported ... they're not just dogmatic narratives or some 50-50 choices people make.

 
Alex P Keaton said:
I don’t know.  People at a bbq often go inside somebody’s house on/off during the bbq.  You know, to get condiments, drinks, etc.  And inevitably people end up standing around in the kitchen talking for 30 min before remembering “hey, we are at a bbq, why are we inside?”   Or they go inside to get some cool air because it’s 95 degrees out.

Point being, it wouldn’t be shocking if folks at a bbq also spent time indoors, unmasked.
Click to expand...
I’ve made this analogy before - if you’re close enough to smell someone’s breath when they talk to you, they can spread COVID to you. COVID is unlikely to stay in the air while outdoors or live on surfaces but if you’re standing a couple feet away from someone talking directly at them like you would at a BBQ or a crowded ceremony, you’re probably still at risk.

 
Biff84 said:
I’ve made this analogy before - if you’re close enough to smell someone’s breath when they talk to you, they can spread COVID to you. COVID is unlikely to stay in the air while outdoors or live on surfaces but if you’re standing a couple feet away from someone talking directly at them like you would at a BBQ or a crowded ceremony, you’re probably still at risk.
Click to expand...
Very fair points.   I will continue to say that it is also highly likely that people at a BBQ are spending time indoors, unmasked, if only for 5-10 minutes.

 
Doug B said:
This is a disheartening sentence.

The BBC is about as reliable a popular news source as you'll find on these matters. Pro-mask and pro-vaccine stances are beyond well-supported ... they're not just dogmatic narratives or some 50-50 choices people make.
Click to expand...
I understand why you say that and for many of the reasons you gave is why i used them to start with. Some of you seem to get very caught up in word play or think you have found something under the rug, let's relax a bit. It's not disheartening, try dealing or posting with people watching the news 24/7, it's much worse I assure you. 

And all of this just leads to trying to tear down the OP or tear apart the poster's POV by uncovering the "Got'Cha" and to that i would be disheartened in you DB, consider you one of the good guys around here and understanding of folks from all POV. 

All news including your beloved BBC is propaganda and trying to sell something, lets replay the tapes of what I posted...I used them because i know so many of you worship the BBC and put them on Mt Rushmore, I do know my audience here Doug but thank you for zoning in on something to make your own personal feelings feel a little more validated, its cool we all do it to some degree on differing topics. 

The hair splitting when i am using the BBC to simply remind folks of the most tiny fraction of a % of folks that catch it outside and you still have to try and needle it for whatever reason, it's telling. 

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Frostillicus said:
You invalidate any point you're actually trying to make with this kind of garbage. 
Click to expand...
You continue to show that you want nothing to do with the conversation and only stop by to lob tomatoes, its a pattern Frosti, we got a table for you upfront to watch the show but moving forward, these little one liners meant to do nothing but pick a fight are going to be glossed over and just not resoonded. I've tried to engage you some but it's obvious you just want to try and and further a fight or I'll say send NEGATIVE VIBRATIONS which you want to thrust out there so have fun but we're done talking for now. 

Cheers Frost

 
Ministry of Pain said:
You continue to show that you want nothing to do with the conversation and only stop by to lob tomatoes, its a pattern Frosti, we got a table for you upfront to watch the show but moving forward, these little one liners meant to do nothing but pick a fight are going to be glossed over and just not resoonded. I've tried to engage you some but it's obvious you just want to try and and further a fight or I'll say send NEGATIVE VIBRATIONS which you want to thrust out there so have fun but we're done talking for now. 

Cheers Frost
Click to expand...
Fair enough.

 
Ministry of Pain said:
The hair splitting when I am using the BBC to simply remind folks of the most tiny fraction of a % of folks that catch it outside and you still have to try and needle it for whatever reason, it's telling.
Click to expand...
I'm not needling the bolded. I was needling reflexive mistrust of the BBC (among other news sources).

Ministry of Pain said:
All news including your beloved BBC is propaganda and trying to sell something
Click to expand...
For many agencies, I agree that they are "selling something" to an extent, as most news organs are for profit. However, the BBC does not have to satisfy a profit motive, as it is funded by British taxpayers.

Furthermore, I don't necessarily feel like for-profit news means that the informational content is hopelessly compromised. I also don't consider ubiquitous human bias to be prima facie "propaganda" -- it's a matter of degree and intent.
 

 
Doug B said:
I'm not needling the bolded. I was needling reflexive mistrust of the BBC (among other news sources).

For many agencies, I agree that they are "selling something" to an extent, as most news organs are for profit. However, the BBC does not have to satisfy a profit motive, as it is funded by British taxpayers.

Furthermore, I don't necessarily feel like for-profit news means that the informational content is hopelessly compromised. I also don't consider ubiquitous human bias to be prima facie "propaganda" -- it's a matter of degree and intent.
 
Click to expand...
Doug...ALL NEWS SOURCES do you get it? It's Ok if you classify me as part time looney but still have value in the Shark Pool 😄. I love you no less. 

British Taxpayers....sounds a little like PBS. And we all know everyone follows what PBS says. I was a huge PBS watcher at night for a very long time, I'm sure yo can figure out who i used to watch religiously and now I don't even pass by PBS unless there is something specific in the Arts I want to watch or perhaps something like Nature/Nova. 

I feel most printed media is propaganda of one form or another. Colin Cowherd going on and on about Aaron Rodgers when I bet the two of them have never split a sandwich together, PROPAGANDA and he's selling a 3 hour show...catch my drift? I'm trying to stay off the Social Media grid as much as possible and still live a healthy life, it's not easy i have to tell you. 

 
Ministry of Pain said:
Doug...ALL NEWS SOURCES do you get it?
Click to expand...
Well ... where else to get news from than "news sources" :confused:   Even "some dude's YouTube channel" is a "news source" -- so why trust that channel? That channel is being presented by a human with bias -- isn't that still "propaganda"?

...

What does "propaganda" actually mean to you? Is it always malevolent, or can it be a neutral thing in your worldview?

Does "propaganda" mean "wrong" to you? Or even "falsehood"? To you, can something be completely true and still be "propaganda"?

 
Doug B said:
Well ... where else to get news from than "news sources" :confused:   Even "some dude's YouTube channel" is a "news source" -- so why trust that channel? That channel is being presented by a human with bias -- isn't that still "propaganda"?

...

What does "propaganda" actually mean to you? Is it always malevolent, or can it be a neutral thing in your worldview?

Does "propaganda" mean "wrong" to you? Or even "falsehood"? To you, can something be completely true and still be "propaganda"?
Click to expand...
You ask good questions. "Bias" and "Propaganda" are about the same for me and as an example I can love what I am reading about the Miami Dolphins but if its from one of those dedicated sites, it's likely biased. They want to attract readers and fans not repel them. 

It's a tough concept if you are new to it but when you go long periods of time where you don't hear guys speak like Sean Hannity, The Rockefeller on CNN, Maddow, Any of the Major 3-4 nightly on your local affiliates, and then out of the blue you somehow roll on to something like Tucker Carlson you will change that channel pretty fast in horror. It's like brain washing from both sides, this isn't just a left or right hence why I stress all the time don't pick jersey colors or make it all about that one issue.  

It's all or nothing for a lot of people it feels like these days, where have all the Independents disappeared to? 

 
Ministry of Pain said:
All news including your beloved BBC is propaganda and trying to sell something, lets replay the tapes of what I posted...I used them because i know so many of you worship the BBC and put them on Mt Rushmore, I do know my audience here Doug but thank you for zoning in on something to make your own personal feelings feel a little more validated, its cool we all do it to some degree on differing topics. 
Click to expand...
At least reputable news media tries to hold itself accountable if it makes a mistake.  You're pushing BBC as propagandists trying to sell something, yet you're interested in learning more about a drug YouTubers are pushing...... but they're definitely not trying to get views or subscribers.

The YouTuber has zero accountability for pushing knowingly false information, but the MSM and BBC do.

 
Dickies said:
At least reputable news media tries to hold itself accountable if it makes a mistake.  You're pushing BBC as propagandists trying to sell something, yet you're interested in learning more about a drug YouTubers are pushing...... but they're definitely not trying to get views or subscribers.

The YouTuber has zero accountability for pushing knowingly false information, but the MSM and BBC do.
Click to expand...
There we go again where you link a couple words like "reputable news media", it's all a propaganda machine and I'm OK if that is where we stop with that line of thinking.

@fatguyinalittlecoat and I have an understanding where once we have clarity on the other's position we stop questioning the other one and just move forward. Example is the BGI that runs in Bernie Sanders camp, i asked him point blank if he was Pro-BGI and he confirmed it and I didn't beat him up about it, I accepted his POV even though i personally disagree and we move forward. 

You coming over the top and continuing to post "reputable news" is also biased and mostly propaganda. I'm sorry you find comfort in MSNBC, FOX, and all the rest but those are money printing machines and major parts of the problem in this country. You can believe whatever you want and most Americans are in your camp and find a lot of comfort from these news outlets but some of us have disconnected and figured out there are some parallels with the movie "The Matrix" and you might think about disconnecting that tube in the back of your head like I did and understand you can always reconnect it back in but my guess is once you distance yourself from the endless cycle of depressing and rather mind controlling propaganda these companies spit out 24/7, you might find you like being in the dark on some things that aren't really helping you that much to begin with. 

 
Last edited by a moderator:


MOP - You purported to start this separate thread to discuss this drug in a setting separate from the main COVID discussion.  Its now devolved into a garden-variety discussion of media reliability, transmission methods and similar topics that are addressed ad nauseum in the existing threads.  Where is the beef on Ivermectin?  Other than your brother, is there any reliable source indicating this is something of interest?

I learned a ton from the main COVID discussion here over the past year.  I don't trust media, CDC, Fauci or other main street sources on this topic.  I credit the FFA thread with helping me get through the past year safely (knock on wood) while not going overboard.  Its been extremely valuable to me.  I'm willing to consider anything outside the mainstream recommendations.  I do not want to get COVID.  I am still taking daily vitamin D even though most mainstream resources say that's a waste of my time.  Other than the FFA, my main source of information is my personal doctor, who recommended that I get the vaccine (which I've done).

You've not yet stated in this discussion your opinion of Ivermectin, what it is, what it does, why we should be interested in it.

 
I believe all you need to know is that the soulless, for profit company, that makes it, straight up says don’t use this for covid. Nothing vague. No quasi disclaimers. Just straight up, don’t use it, hasn’t been tested, etc. seems pretty clear. 
 

but hey, some dude’s brother says to take it. :lmao:

 
DA RAIDERS said:
I believe all you need to know is that the soulless, for profit company, that makes it, straight up says don’t use this for covid. Nothing vague. No quasi disclaimers. Just straight up, don’t use it, hasn’t been tested, etc. seems pretty clear. 
 

but hey, some dude’s brother says to take it. :lmao:
Click to expand...
Conversely, Pfizer would much rather keep you alive long enough to sell you Viagra than kill you now with a cheap vaccine.

 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Joe Bryant
A Thought On News - Making Every Problem Your Problem
2 3 4
Replies
170
Views
3K
Joe Bryant
Joe Bryant
Ministry of Pain
Christmas Gifts under $250...what are you wanting and what are you buying for others?
2
Replies
60
Views
2K
mr. furley
mr. furley
Joe Bryant
Consuming News: How Much? What Sources?
2 3
Replies
133
Views
3K
FairWarning
FairWarning

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 2 (members: 0, guests: 2)
Top