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Rookie QB Expectations? Early Struggles - Expectations For Year? (1 Viewer)

Joe Bryant

Joe Bryant

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It's natural rookies will have bumps as they develop.

Story from Jets Saturday.

Source: ESPN.com - Rich Cimini https://twitter.com/RichCimini/status/1424176868048228354?s=2

New York Jets QB Zach Wilson went 11-for-24 for 112 yards and two interceptions during team drills Saturday, Aug. 7.

[ [ [ [ [ [ [ [ [ FOOTBALLGUYS VIEW ] ] ] ] ] ] ] ] ]

Wilson is going to have to endure a lot of bumps in the road this year, but he should also be passing a lot and playing from behind. He's only of interest in superflex/2QB leagues, but he could have more value than his low ADP indicates.

*****

How concerned are you with early season struggles for Wilson? And his receivers?

How about the other rookie QBs?

How do you have them ranked among QBs now?

 
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I'd say it's definitely a bit concerning, although also not unexpected. It seems like other rookie QBs are also having some growing pains: Lance after he put on a show one day last week, Lawrence had (I think) 3 INTs in one practice session. Even second-year Burrow has also supposedly been struggling as well. The only rookie who doesn't seem to be struggling is Fields, although the focus doesn't have been as much on him as the others.

In redraft terms, I see Zach as middle of the pack - probably around 15-20. Slightly higher for dynasty terms, with room for upside if he seems to "get it" out of the gate. The terrible tragic loss of Greg Knapp, while obviously much more important off the field than on, could set Zach back a bit.

 
Context.

------------

49er Notes

Tough Day To Judge The QBs

Trey Lance

...  I had Lance 8-14 with an interception. In Lance’s defense, his throw to Elijah Mitchell ricocheted off his hands to his helmet and into Marcell Harris’s lap.

Lance’s best throw was probably his first, where he purposely threw behind Brandon Aiyuk instead of leading him into the safety for a big hit.

His worst throw was his next attempt when Lance was locked onto Aiyuk running a deep corner route but failed to recognize the safety coming from over the top. Jared Mayden should have picked the pass off.

Lance didn’t exactly do his blockers any favors, as he held onto the ball at times and was double-clutching. Were there receivers open? Debatable. He can’t afford to take sacks, which it felt like he would have been responsible for a few.

When Lance is on, it’s pretty. He throws with good anticipation and timing and has the arm strength to throw effortlessly to the far-hash. The hope is with more reps comes more consistency for the rookie.

Lance didn’t score during the second move-the-ball period, where he ran for a first down but couldn’t muster another first after they ran the ball on 3rd & 6. The overreactions to a triple-option call on third down would have been hilarious if it were a game.

 
Dr. Octopus said:
I’m searching for the “Tua throws 5 INTs in one practice, are you concerned?” thread. Can’t find it. Must be a bad search function.
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Tua had a bad early practice, but then has looked very good with pads in 11 on 11.  I agree one bad practice isn't cause for concern, perhaps multiple bad practices would be.  But this is not a real game, so I'm still not sold on Tua under pressure. Preseason games will be a better indicator for all young unproven QBs.

 
SoBeDad said:
 Preseason games will be a better indicator for all young unproven QBs.
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That's really what it all boils down to, and even then pre-season games may not be fully telling. A lot of it is just a leap of faith that the talent, supporting cast, and coaching regime will be the determining factor as to a young QB's success.

 
I'm actually bullish on Wilson long term based on what I saw in college.   He'll have up and down passing days just like every other rookie in the history of the NFL, but he seems to have the smarts and the motivation to learn from his mistakes.

Wilson is currently being undervalued in rookie dynasty drafts IMHO.   

I have him ranked as the #2 dynasty QB in this class.  I have him ranked 4th of the rookies for redraft and have him as the  26th overall QB  for redraft.

 
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SoBeDad said:
Tua had a bad early practice, but then has looked very good with pads in 11 on 11.  I agree one bad practice isn't cause for concern, perhaps multiple bad practices would be.  But this is not a real game, so I'm still not sold on Tua under pressure. Preseason games will be a better indicator for all young unproven QBs.
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i think his point was less about there being a problem with Tua than about why do we need "concern" threads for anyone's bad practice.

 
Dr. Octopus said:
I’m searching for the “Tua throws 5 INTs in one practice, are you concerned?” thread. Can’t find it. Must be a bad search function.
Click to expand...


What are you talking about? 

Expectations for Zach Wilson is a pretty important topic. If you've got something to contribute to that topic, we'd love to hear it. If not, please don't derail the thread. Thanks. 

 
Dr. Octopus said:
I don’t get why this is it’s own topic. There’s already a Wilson topic. Will we start a new topic every time a WR drops two passes in practice.
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The topic is about Zach Wilson's expectations for the year. And if anyone is worried or not about growing pains, which are sure to happen. 

 
Bracie Smathers said:
Context.

------------

49er Notes

Tough Day To Judge The QBs

Trey Lance

...  I had Lance 8-14 with an interception. In Lance’s defense, his throw to Elijah Mitchell ricocheted off his hands to his helmet and into Marcell Harris’s lap.

Lance’s best throw was probably his first, where he purposely threw behind Brandon Aiyuk instead of leading him into the safety for a big hit.

His worst throw was his next attempt when Lance was locked onto Aiyuk running a deep corner route but failed to recognize the safety coming from over the top. Jared Mayden should have picked the pass off.

Lance didn’t exactly do his blockers any favors, as he held onto the ball at times and was double-clutching. Were there receivers open? Debatable. He can’t afford to take sacks, which it felt like he would have been responsible for a few.

When Lance is on, it’s pretty. He throws with good anticipation and timing and has the arm strength to throw effortlessly to the far-hash. The hope is with more reps comes more consistency for the rookie.

Lance didn’t score during the second move-the-ball period, where he ran for a first down but couldn’t muster another first after they ran the ball on 3rd & 6. The overreactions to a triple-option call on third down would have been hilarious if it were a game.
Click to expand...


That's good info. Lance and Trevor Lawrence could both be in the same conversation of young QBs and what we expect. I'll tweak the original post. 

 
Joe Bryant said:
What are you talking about? 

Expectations for Zach Wilson is a pretty important topic. If you've got something to contribute to that topic, we'd love to hear it. If not, please don't derail the thread. Thanks. 
Click to expand...
There is a Zach Wilson thread and Jets team thread that address Zach Wilson’s expectations already.

 This topic was focused on one bad showing in a practice/scrimmage. I don’t remember similar threads when some player had a bad practice or even one bad preseason game. I just don’t understand the point of piling on.

ETA: I see you renamed the thread and edited the first post to make it more generic.

The fact that others have “liked” my posts says that they agreed with my original stance so forgive me for “derailing”.

 
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Dr. Octopus said:
There is a Zach Wilson thread and Jets team thread that address Zach Wilson’s expectations already.

 This topic was focused on one bad showing in a practice/scrimmage. I don’t remember similar threads when some player had a bad practice or even one bad preseason game. I just don’t understand the point of piling on.

ETA: I see you renamed the thread and edited the first post to make it more generic.

The fact that others have “liked” my posts says that they agreed with my original stance so forgive me for “derailing”.
Click to expand...


Thanks. With the excellent comment on Trey Lance, it made me think it might be good to include the other rookie QBs.

Definitely don't derail with shots about Tagovailoa or whatever that was. I don't care who liked it. 

We'd love to have you contribute to the topic. Thanks. 

 
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Joe Bryant said:
Thanks. With the excellent comment on Trey Lance, it made me think it might be good to include the other rookie QBs.

Definitely don't derail with shots about Tagovailoa or whatever that was. I don't care who liked it. 

We'd love to have you contribute to the topic. Thanks. 
Click to expand...
It wasn’t a shot at Tua. 

 
Just saw a tweet that Wilson threw a dart for a TD in practice this AM.  Why isn't everyone jumping up & down calling for Zach to win the MVP now? ;)  

Reportedly Cole dropped a nice pass this AM as well (also according to tweet) - after practice when they report that Wilson was X for X passing, that drop won't be mentioned. 

The point is that this microscope we put rookies on this early is a little overboard every season. The kid's had what, 5 practices & that scrimmage where he threw 2 picks?  And exactly none of that gets recorded against his career numbers. They never happened. As Iverson says, we're talking about practice here, man. Practice. 

They practice to get up to speed. Early "struggles" often have peripheral aspects to them. Ints can happen due to poor protection, bad route running, miscommunications between QB / receiver and a hundred other reasons. The guys on the field with him? Yeah, some of them are rookies, too. It's not all going to be pretty.   

What matters to me is how he looks in practice next week, and the week after that. And then if he absorbs the lessons & applies it all to the regular season.  I try not to get to into the day to day minutia - I traded for Wilson because of his body of work. Fortunately I have 2 QBs ahead of him on my depth chart, but of course I'm hoping he steps up & makes me question whether to start him at some point this season. If not, I'll hope for that next year. 

 
I think rookie QB performance/acclimation all comes down to what's going on "between the ears" and intangibles. I was watching the LAC game last year when Herbert was forced into action (he wasn't supposed to play that day). I remember the TV team just talking about how he always had this ability to learn and absorb things extremely fast. Sounded like his academic achievements were more impressive than his athletic ones. You could see it on his first series... cool, relaxed, decisive.

It's what makes the position so much tougher to predict than others.How soon will it "click" for a guy before he's ruined by poor... coaching, supporting cast, scheme, other.

 
Dizzy said:
I think rookie QB performance/acclimation all comes down to what's going on "between the ears" and intangibles. I was watching the LAC game last year when Herbert was forced into action (he wasn't supposed to play that day). I remember the TV team just talking about how he always had this ability to learn and absorb things extremely fast. Sounded like his academic achievements were more impressive than his athletic ones. You could see it on his first series... cool, relaxed, decisive.

It's what makes the position so much tougher to predict than others.How soon will it "click" for a guy before he's ruined by poor... coaching, supporting cast, scheme, other.
Click to expand...


I don't disagree with this, but it's also worth noting the context that he had a preseason of work/practices (while an odd 2020 preseason, he was still far more practiced/prepared than the subjects of this topic who've had only a few days). 

 
Hot Sauce Guy said:
I don't disagree with this, but it's also worth noting the context that he had a preseason of work/practices (while an odd 2020 preseason, he was still far more practiced/prepared than the subjects of this topic who've had only a few days). 
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Fully with you. I pointed out the Herbert example more/less as a "best that can be expected" scenario... he had zero practice reps with 1st team offense, then found out during the National Anthem that he was going to start... and he came out and looked like Dan Marino.

The thing that bothers me about Wilson is the lack of competition he faced during his college days. I live in Utah and don't recall much hype about him until the NFL draft talk started creeping in. We'll find out very soon if he's got those intangibles and mental muscles to deal with defenses the likes of which he's never dreamed of, or he'll just wash out - longing for those cream puffs he faced in 2020.

 
Dizzy said:
The thing that bothers me about Wilson is the lack of competition he faced during his college days.
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That’s fair and the same can probably be said about Lance - even more so considering he sat out last year. But you could also say that about Josh Allen, Big Ben and even Wentz (before he cratered). Sometimes guys have it and sometimes they don’t, irrespective of their college resume.

 
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Dizzy said:
Fully with you. I pointed out the Herbert example more/less as a "best that can be expected" scenario... he had zero practice reps with 1st team offense, then found out during the National Anthem that he was going to start... and he came out and looked like Dan Marino.

The thing that bothers me about Wilson is the lack of competition he faced during his college days. I live in Utah and don't recall much hype about him until the NFL draft talk started creeping in. We'll find out very soon if he's got those intangibles and mental muscles to deal with defenses the likes of which he's never dreamed of, or he'll just wash out - longing for those cream puffs he faced in 2020.
Click to expand...


Oh, for sure. He also played with talent sub-par to an NFL roster as well, so it will be equally interesting to see if his game elevates by having NFL-caliber receivers & an NFL caliber OL to protect him. 

I believe the Jets are a work in progress - I would hope they win 6-7 games this year. The division isn't the strongest it's ever been (MIA is on the rise, BUF is now the elite team & NEP seems like a dumpster fire, but I'd never write off BB) and I don't think the Jets expect playoffs in year 1 from Wilson. My hope as a FF shareholder is that he demonstrates that ability to evolve, and that what he did in Utah wasn't a mirage only effective against weak competition.  I like to think the Jets did diligence, and as a Niner fan I trust Saleh as a talent evaluator & as someone who hires good people to make those judgements. They clearly invested a ton of time on selecting Wilson, so I am hopeful they know more than we all do, collectively. 

And, again, it's still very, very early.  Herbert's performance last year was nothing short of amazing, I agree. And he's the exception, and hardly the rule. I'm old enough to remember Steve Young stinking up Tampa Bay before becoming one of the greatest to ever play the game.  Some QBs take more time to develop than others. Herbert is a special player to have done what he did - and I don't think anyone saw that coming. 

 
One bad practice or scrimmage or preseason game or regular season game for rookie QB is meaningless IMO. Virtually every rookie QB is going to have growing pains. What’s important is whether we see evidence of what he can be and whether he shows improvement or not.

 
Hot Sauce Guy said:
Herbert's performance last year was nothing short of amazing...
Click to expand...


Yes, kind of unfair of me to pull the Herbert example as he was truly an exception. I made the Marino comment purposely in previous comments as that was the last time I watched a rookie that looked so comfortable out there. And that's a l - o - n - g     t - i - m - e between those two examples.

Must be exciting times right now for Chargers fans.

 
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GroveDiesel said:
One bad practice or scrimmage or preseason game or regular season game for rookie QB is meaningless IMO. Virtually every rookie QB is going to have growing pains. What’s important is whether we see evidence of what he can be and whether he shows improvement or not.
Click to expand...
Or even a whole season. I distinctly recall folks opining that Josh Allen would never be the long-term answer for the Bills due to his inaccuracy. 

Now he has a shiny new contract & I don’t seem to hear that much any more. 

 
zamboni said:
That’s fair and the same can probably be said about Lance - even more so considering he sat out last year. But you could also say that about Josh Allen, Big Ben and even Wentz (before he cratered). Sometimes guys have it and sometimes they don’t, irrespective of their college resume.
Click to expand...


And the flip side of that argument is someone like Mac Jones got to play surrounded by an entire offense of future NFL players that were also far superior to their competition, most weeks.

 
I expect all of them to struggle, there’s not a generational talent in this class, no matter what people say about Trevor. 

And even if one of them is a future HOF inductee, we won’t really see it as a raw rookie.

Lawrence and Wilson will start all season, no matter how good or bad they are. And they will both have plenty of bad games to go with the good ones.

Lance and Fields shouldn’t start right away due to both the team situation and their need to learn a ton in the next month. SF and Chicago will roll out the veteran and make the switch around the 1/4 pole when it’s obvious the vets won’t take those teams any further. 

Mac Jones should sit all year if Cam is healthy.

The long shot prospects will only play in a Break Glass In Case Of Emergency situation. 

 
tangfoot said:
I expect all of them to struggle, there’s not a generational talent in this class, no matter what people say about Trevor. 

And even if one of them is a future HOF inductee, we won’t really see it as a raw rookie.

Lawrence and Wilson will start all season, no matter how good or bad they are. And they will both have plenty of bad games to go with the good ones.

Lance and Fields shouldn’t start right away due to both the team situation and their need to learn a ton in the next month. SF and Chicago will roll out the veteran and make the switch around the 1/4 pole when it’s obvious the vets won’t take those teams any further. 

Mac Jones should sit all year if Cam is healthy.

The long shot prospects will only play in a Break Glass In Case Of Emergency situation. 
Click to expand...
Wrong about mac Jones

Cam has been done for years

 
tangfoot said:
The long shot prospects will only play in a Break Glass In Case Of Emergency situation. 
Click to expand...
I wouldn't include Kellen Mond in that group right now. He is way behind and Jake Browning seems to have locked up the back up QB position at least for this year.

Not that Cousins ever gets hurt, but who knows?

 
Joe Bryant said:
How concerned are you with early season struggles for Wilson? And his receivers?
Click to expand...
I'm most concerned that Wilson is surrounded by completely unproven players on offense. Who is the most accomplished NFL player on that offense? Jamison Crowder maybe? Tevin Coleman? Yeah, they have some young guys that are supposed to contribute right away and there is something to be said for creating a young offensive corp that you hope can develop together but I worry that the lack of veterans could stunt the development of Wilson. Which sounds awfully familiar as I still have no idea if Darnold was/is any good because the team surrounding him stunk so bad the entire time.

I was a little surprised that the Jets didn't seem all that interested in Ertz for a conditional draft pick. He would served as a veteran outlet for a rookie QB to get his bearings against NFL defenses, Of course I also thought they should have overpaid James White to serve a similar outlet role for Wilson. White is a fundamentally sound player that would contribute in passing situations which has generally started on 2nd down for the Jets the past several seasons. At this point if the Jets are a disaster on offense(a long shot, I know) I'll still have no idea if Wilson was the problem, or the OL, or the rookie receiver ran the right route(s), or the rookie RB wasn't reading the protection like he was assigned, etc, etc. If you were starting from scratch AGAIN with a rookie QB why not give him some dump down options even if you have to overpay them a little? If they help the development of Wilson it's well worth that money and probably a lot more.

 
BoltBacker said:
I'm most concerned that Wilson is surrounded by completely unproven players on offense. Who is the most accomplished NFL player on that offense? Jamison Crowder maybe? Tevin Coleman? Yeah, they have some young guys that are supposed to contribute right away and there is something to be said for creating a young offensive corp that you hope can develop together but I worry that the lack of veterans could stunt the development of Wilson. Which sounds awfully familiar as I still have no idea if Darnold was/is any good because the team surrounding him stunk so bad the entire time.

I was a little surprised that the Jets didn't seem all that interested in Ertz for a conditional draft pick. He would served as a veteran outlet for a rookie QB to get his bearings against NFL defenses, Of course I also thought they should have overpaid James White to serve a similar outlet role for Wilson. White is a fundamentally sound player that would contribute in passing situations which has generally started on 2nd down for the Jets the past several seasons. At this point if the Jets are a disaster on offense(a long shot, I know) I'll still have no idea if Wilson was the problem, or the OL, or the rookie receiver ran the right route(s), or the rookie RB wasn't reading the protection like he was assigned, etc, etc. If you were starting from scratch AGAIN with a rookie QB why not give him some dump down options even if you have to overpay them a little? If they help the development of Wilson it's well worth that money and probably a lot more.
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Agreed. I thought the same about Ertz. And maybe there was more interest than we know. But I was hoping for more weapons for him. I do love Elijah Moore but we're talking about a lot of youth here. 

 
Joe Bryant said:
Agreed. I thought the same about Ertz. And maybe there was more interest than we know. But I was hoping for more weapons for him. I do love Elijah Moore but we're talking about a lot of youth here. 
Click to expand...


Joe Douglas has built up the o-line tenfold since taking over as GM - drafting Becton and AVT in back to back first rounds of the draft and signing RT Morgan Moses. He signed productive veteran WRs Corey Davis and Keenan Cole and restructured Crowder to bring him back. He drafted Denzel Mims and Elijah Moore in back to back Round 2s of the NFL draft. They also did bring in Tyler Kroft who is a solid veteran at TE - and at this point is probably fairly close to the same player as a 31 year old Ertz and they do have Chris Herndon who looked great as a rookie but regressed under the Gase regime.

The RBs are not great but they brought in Tevin Coleman, who knows the system, and drafted Michael Carter (who has a lot of upside) and LeMichael Perine in back to back drafts.

If Zach Wilson fails it will not be because the GM did nothing to help him - like what happened with Darnold and GM McCann - and the team is still a work in progress. 

 
BoltBacker said:
I'm most concerned that Wilson is surrounded by completely unproven players on offense. Who is the most accomplished NFL player on that offense? Jamison Crowder maybe? Tevin Coleman? 
 
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They brought in Cole & Corey Davis, so they have some experience at WR. 

I would have liked to have seen them being in an experienced TE, but Ertz looks washed to me. From what I’ve seen the last 2 years, he’s slow, and often lacks concentration. He’s no longer bullying anyone for the ball. 

One thing to note that hasn’t been mentioned here: Gregg Knapp was brought in specifically to be the Zach Wilson whisperer & reportedly the two had a close relationship. Knapp’s tragic & unexpected death surely effected everyone on that team to varying degrees, so within a week or so of that happening I might expect some mental lapses / struggles. And now without a QB coach, his development could be stunted a bit. 

I mean, I’m not a psychologist, but it stands to reason that might have an effect on a young player. 

 
Dr. Octopus said:
Corey Davis?
Click to expand...
That's fair. He's a big target and has shown flashes even if he's been a fairly big disappointment as a pro.

Not sure if I'm seeing Keelan Cole as much more than a guy that replaces what Mims could have developed into.

You make a great point about Morgan Moses, though. He was a big addition and I had forgotten he was added.

FWIW, when I suggested Ertz I wasn't expecting the 2018 pro-bowl 110/1100/8 version. But I don't think the 2019 version with 80/900/6 is within reach if he had all the TE production to himself. Ertz was never productive because of some sort of special athleticism so his only hurdle was health last season imo(along with the overall PHI offensive implosion in 2020). Davis has never been as productive and I feel very safe in saying that Kroft/Herndon combined will never have a season like the Ertz mediocre year in 2019. But we'll see.

 
tangfoot said:
I expect all of them to struggle, there’s not a generational talent in this class, no matter what people say about Trevor. 

And even if one of them is a future HOF inductee, we won’t really see it as a raw rookie.

Lawrence and Wilson will start all season, no matter how good or bad they are. And they will both have plenty of bad games to go with the good ones.

Lance and Fields shouldn’t start right away due to both the team situation and their need to learn a ton in the next month. SF and Chicago will roll out the veteran and make the switch around the 1/4 pole when it’s obvious the vets won’t take those teams any further. 

Mac Jones should sit all year if Cam is healthy.

The long shot prospects will only play in a Break Glass In Case Of Emergency situation. 
Click to expand...
Why do you think none of them are top quality qbs?  Lawrence has been THE NEXT BEST THING since hs, Lance is going to the best possible situation for his skill set, and Fields has sneaky rich mans Big Ben upside.  Even Mac Jones, who I'm down on the most of all the 1st round qbs (although Wilson's close) got drafted into the perfect situation to have a Brady-like career arc.

Honestly of all qbs after the draft ended I like Wilson the worst, the Jets aren't in a spot where they can take a guy who was playing with and against nobody and then throw them into the NFL gauntlet.  At least sf is two years off of a superbowl run (with that vet you say won't take them further) and can blame last year on injuries.

Should we expect a Herbert?  No, but we should never expect a Herbert.  One of them might even have a first year like Peyton Manning.  But aside from Jones they all offer a ground element to their game that shouldn't be ignored when looking at how they'll do compared to other rookies. 

 
wgoldsph said:
Why do you think none of them are top quality qbs?  Lawrence has been THE NEXT BEST THING since hs, Lance is going to the best possible situation for his skill set, and Fields has sneaky rich mans Big Ben upside. 
Click to expand...
As we are a fantasy board, curious to see the consensus view on the rookie QBs in terms of fantasy value (both redraft and dynasty)? My take:

Redraft: Lawrence, Lance, Fields, Wilson, Jones

Dynasty: Lance, Fields, Lawrence, Wilson, Jones

I give Lance and Fields the longer term edge due to rushing upside.

 
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zamboni said:
As we are a fantasy board, curious to see the consensus view on the rookie QBs in terms of fantasy value (both redraft and dynasty)? My take:

Redraft: Lawrence, Lance, Fields, Wilson, Jones

Dynasty: Lance, Fields, Lawrence, Wilson, Jones

I give Lance and Fields the longer term edge due to rushing upside.
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Something that surprised me about Lawrence was that he was a really good at running (500 yrs in his sophomore year and 100 in the Fiesta bowl) the ball.  There's upside if he can get the opportunity.

My take in value is the same as yours in redraft and in dynasty - Lance, Lawrence, Fields, Jones, Wilson.   Wilson goes into year 3 as a "make or break" season and he breaks.

 
wgoldsph said:
Why do you think none of them are top quality qbs?  Lawrence has been THE NEXT BEST THING since hs, Lance is going to the best possible situation for his skill set, and Fields has sneaky rich mans Big Ben upside.  Even Mac Jones, who I'm down on the most of all the 1st round qbs (although Wilson's close) got drafted into the perfect situation to have a Brady-like career arc.

Should we expect a Herbert?  No, but we should never expect a Herbert.  One of them might even have a first year like Peyton Manning.  But aside from Jones they all offer a ground element to their game that shouldn't be ignored when looking at how they'll do compared to other rookies. 
Click to expand...


wgoldsph said:
My take in value is the same as yours in redraft and in dynasty - Lance, Lawrence, Fields, Jones, Wilson.   Wilson goes into year 3 as a "make or break" season and he breaks.
Click to expand...


I didn't say that they aren't top quality QBs, I said that none of them are a generational talent.  Your further comments seem to agree with my take.  If you think Lawrence is THE NEXT BIG THING, why do you have Lance ranked ahead of him? 

Do you truly think Herbert is generational?  You say that none of them are even at his level.

 
wgoldsph said:
Something that surprised me about Lawrence was that he was a really good at running (500 yrs in his sophomore year and 100 in the Fiesta bowl) the ball.  There's upside if he can get the opportunity.
Click to expand...
Agreed - Trevor is mobile enough, I just don’t think he’ll have as many designed runs as Lance/Fields will. Probably more of a pocket guy with the ability to run, such as Herbert or Burrow (at least pre-injury).

 
tangfoot said:
I didn't say that they aren't top quality QBs, I said that none of them are a generational talent.  Your further comments seem to agree with my take.  If you think Lawrence is THE NEXT BIG THING, why do you have Lance ranked ahead of him? 

Do you truly think Herbert is generational?  You say that none of them are even at his level.
Click to expand...
I meant for their rookie years.  I don't see Herbert as being better than the top three of the draft career wise, but I can see a path for Lance, Lawrence, and Fields to become generational talents when it's all said and done.

 
zamboni said:
As we are a fantasy board, curious to see the consensus view on the rookie QBs in terms of fantasy value (both redraft and dynasty)? My take:

Redraft: Lawrence, Lance, Fields, Wilson, Jones

Dynasty: Lance, Fields, Lawrence, Wilson, Jones

I give Lance and Fields the longer term edge due to rushing upside.
Click to expand...
Lawrence is every bit the runner as Fields.

 
Dr. Octopus said:
Lawrence is every bit the runner as Fields.
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Not so sure. In his three full years at Clemson, Lawrence averaged 6 rushes per game, while Fields averaged about 10 in his two years at OSU.

Different college systems of course, as they will be in the NFL, and both are capable runners. I just think designed runs will be more of Fields’ game than Lawrence’s. Could be wrong, of course, until we see how these guys are used.

 
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Atlanta Falcons Offense '24- WR/RB/TE/QB and the OL
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zamboni
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