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why do we trust Govt ? (1 Viewer)

Stealthycat

Stealthycat

Footballguy
I've been wanting to ask this for a while now. I suppose it ties in directly to covid but it goes much deeper.

Historically the US Fed Govt and state and local governments too have continually done things that didn't help their citizens. The governments are here to serve the people, not the other way around. We can go all the way back to slavery - the state and federal governments allowed it for decades. The killing of native Americans. The racism at government levels into the 1930's and 50's etc. There are many examples of really flawed Government programs than we now shake our heads at, right? We as a people trusted the Govt to do things right - they didn't. Why trust Govt?

Covid - we can look back at DDT and the many FDA approved drugs that later were recalled because they were harmful. Anyone remember the faux swine flu deal with the Govt and President Ford?

https://www.history.com/news/swine-flu-rush-vaccine-election-year-1976

I read an article yesterday where Fauci - who has all along been saying trust the science - refuses to trust the new science that shows the shot's aren't doing what they though. Why trust Govt?

Or the people that are in the US Fed Govt .... do you trust Biden? Trump? Pelosi or McConnel? On a local level do you trust your city's mayor or state's Governor ? 

Afghanistan which brings people to talking about all the conflicts the US gets into over the last many decades. Did "we" overall as citizens trust the US Govt to get Afghanistan right after Vietnam, Korea and more recent conflicts like Yemen, Syria, Libya, Pakistan etc?

We trust the US Fed Govt on national debt and they've failed over and over. if Govt cannot be fiscally responsible what does that say ?

How many times do we see elected officials faced with corruption ? Either things they did in office or before they were elected ?

https://www.gobankingrates.com/net-worth/politicians/elected-officials-made-millions-from-office/

Making millions from being in office - so much for "public service" ..... and ones like Bernie Sanders? champion of socialist ideas and we all share the wealth ? never had a job other than public office and he's worth a few million. Nice huh ?

With approximately 2.7 million civilian employees, the U.S. government is the largest employer in the country. For reference, Wal-Mart has 2.2 million employees worldwide. That's incredible isn't it ? The Govt - here for the people - now is an entity that the people seem to serve.

I have just been wondering why Govt is trusted when there are so many reasons not to.

 
I trust government as much as I trust anyone - I evaluate what they have to say, against what I perceive are inherent biases, and interests in disclosing the truth, and then make a call.

Its like everything, and everyone, in life. sometimes you believe them, sometimes you don't.

 
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I doubt there are many people that fully trust the government. Likewise, there aren’t many people that fully distrust the government. The vast majority approach government with a degree of skepticism that varies based on the specific issue at hand.

 
The Commish said:
I generally don't :shrug:

Far more trusting of data and verified evidence.  To put it another way, I don't believe in these vaccines because the government is telling me to.  
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DaVinci said:
I doubt there are many people that fully trust the government. Likewise, there aren’t many people that fully distrust the government. The vast majority approach government with a degree of skepticism that varies based on the specific issue at hand.
Click to expand...
Pretty well sums up where I am on this topic. 

 
the moops said:
Perhaps you could link us to this article?
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This will likely produce an article badmouthing vaccines for not fully stopping a variant (delta) that didn't even exist when the vaccines were created all the while ignoring how significantly it DOES reduce symptoms and severity of virus in the vaccinated person.

 
DaVinci said:
I doubt there are many people that fully trust the government. Likewise, there aren’t many people that fully distrust the government. The vast majority approach government with a degree of skepticism that varies based on the specific issue at hand.
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Yes, each issue needs to be looked at individually.  I like to consider where people's interests lie and what would motivate them to be deceitful.  In regards to the vaccine, why would the government be purposefully injecting us and themselves with something they know to be harmful?  That's not to say there won't be any adverse long term effects, but the idea that there is some nefarious intent seems ridiculous to me. 

 
Why do children grow up but stay tethered to their often toxic and emotionally destructive parents, sometimes the link lasts all through their lives?

- It's what you are born into and everyone is born into it.

- It's all you know

- Even if it's toxic, it's normalized

- What are the alternatives?

Toxic crappy parents often still feed their children and put a roof over their heads. The government still functions to keep police patrolling and firefighters doing their jobs and keep grocery stores and hospitals running.

We simply haven't gotten to the point where it's acceptable in our society for those who are politically corrupt to be dragged out into the street and shot. If that happened, things would change pretty fast.

There's very little you can't solve in terms of human behavior with some bullets or a good solid punch to the face.  Think about your every day life, in your workplace, your extended family, your neighbors and on and on and on, and how much more civilized things would be if every so often, people got punched in the face when they deserved it.

We have become a society of laws that morphed into for profit grifting adversarial legalism but not one that gives the visceral satisfaction for justice. 

People want justice. People want retribution. People want violence. It's just not politically correct to say so. It doesn't fit a woke modern liberal virtue signaling context.

Here's an interesting question to ask yourself. Take all the lawyers you know and have met in your entire life. Now imagine a society without civil order and those people acted the exact same way they do as lawyers to everyone else under those conditions. I have no doubt most would get stabbed to death in the streets.

America in terms of ideals is not a problem. America in terms of practical logistics is not a problem. America without justice is a problem.

If you want civil order in a society where natural selection no longer exists, then you need to start culling the herd manually.

 
GordonGekko said:
Why do children grow up but stay tethered to their often toxic and emotionally destructive parents, sometimes the link lasts all through their lives?

- It's what you are born into and everyone is born into it.

- It's all you know

- Even if it's toxic, it's normalized

- What are the alternatives?

Toxic crappy parents often still feed their children and put a roof over their heads. The government still functions to keep police patrolling and firefighters doing their jobs and keep grocery stores and hospitals running.

We simply haven't gotten to the point where it's acceptable in our society for those who are politically corrupt to be dragged out into the street and shot. If that happened, things would change pretty fast.

There's very little you can't solve in terms of human behavior with some bullets or a good solid punch to the face.  Think about your every day life, in your workplace, your extended family, your neighbors and on and on and on, and how much more civilized things would be if every so often, people got punched in the face when they deserved it.

We have become a society of laws that morphed into for profit grifting adversarial legalism but not one that gives the visceral satisfaction for justice. 

People want justice. People want retribution. People want violence. It's just not politically correct to say so. It doesn't fit a woke modern liberal virtue signaling context.

Here's an interesting question to ask yourself. Take all the lawyers you know and have met in your entire life. Now imagine a society without civil order and those people acted the exact same way they do as lawyers to everyone else under those conditions. I have no doubt most would get stabbed to death in the streets.

America in terms of ideals is not a problem. America in terms of practical logistics is not a problem. America without justice is a problem.

If you want civil order in a society where natural selection no longer exists, then you need to start culling the herd manually.
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:oldunsure:

 
DaVinci said:
I doubt there are many people that fully trust the government. Likewise, there aren’t many people that fully distrust the government. The vast majority approach government with a degree of skepticism that varies based on the specific issue at hand.
Click to expand...


what has the Govt done (examples) to give us a reason to trust them ? WWI and WWII I suppose ... getting out of the Great Depression .... it was a long fight for civil rights but eventually the Jim Crow era Democrats were defeated 

in the last 2 decades .... can you give me any shining examples of the US Fed Govt doing things that would instill trust ?

I didn't mention elections - what a fiasco and now, many people distrust the election system

 
the moops said:
Perhaps you could link us to this article?
Click to expand...


https://www.foxnews.com/health/fauci-study-delta-efficacy-moderna-pfizer-booster

Dr. Anthony Fauci has dismissed a study that deemed the Moderna vaccine as more effective than the Pfizer one against the COVID-19 delta variant. 

contrary to what was posted - this isn't just about covid but on the topic of covid look at Fauci. Saying 2 years ago that Trump was 100% going to get hit with a pandemic, then Fauci linked to Wuhan, Fauci having issues with consistency on what he says with masks and shutdowns etc and then the above .......its a constant string of reasons to NOT trust isn't it ?

 
I wouldn’t say I trust the government entirely but I do view government favorably when compared to corporations, for example. 

I’m super busy right now but will try to elaborate more later.

Great thread idea @Stealthycat.

 
Easy - I don't trust the government but I do trust everyone else to screw me at every step.  My employer, people on the streets, doctors, insurance companies, banks, investment houses, anyone I do business with, everyone.  Not a single entity can be trusted.

Government is the only institution that at least tries to keep other people from screwing me.  i don't trust government to be effective but what other choice do we have?  If it's a matter of government vs literally anyone else, the choice is clear.

Lets take COVID for instance.  Delta variant rising, hospitals filling up.  I cannot trust people to behave in a manner that keeps society safe - that much has been proven time and time again.  No one wears a mask until local government institutes a mask mandate.  

 
I get the intent of the thread and know SC's posts enough to guess his posts and replies.    It seems like one of those odd situations where many of the people that are asking this at the same time as propping up the country as the best ever and our government as the best ever conceived.   To me that seems a bit like opposing thoughts being juggled.  Its the best ever, but we can't trust it at all and we shouldn't rely on it? 

Not sure this will explain my position well, but for me it's more that I accept that a government is needed, we have a great system in theory, it's just that I am leery of the people who want to be in government and run things and like anything else there is corruption and waste.  I think there should be less federal oversight for things, but as far as nationally effected problems (like say, a pandemic) some federal oversight and guidance is warranted.  

 
GordonGekko said:
Why do children grow up but stay tethered to their often toxic and emotionally destructive parents, sometimes the link lasts all through their lives?

- It's what you are born into and everyone is born into it.

- It's all you know

- Even if it's toxic, it's normalized

- What are the alternatives?

Toxic crappy parents often still feed their children and put a roof over their heads. The government still functions to keep police patrolling and firefighters doing their jobs and keep grocery stores and hospitals running.

We simply haven't gotten to the point where it's acceptable in our society for those who are politically corrupt to be dragged out into the street and shot. If that happened, things would change pretty fast.

There's very little you can't solve in terms of human behavior with some bullets or a good solid punch to the face.  Think about your every day life, in your workplace, your extended family, your neighbors and on and on and on, and how much more civilized things would be if every so often, people got punched in the face when they deserved it.

We have become a society of laws that morphed into for profit grifting adversarial legalism but not one that gives the visceral satisfaction for justice. 

People want justice. People want retribution. People want violence. It's just not politically correct to say so. It doesn't fit a woke modern liberal virtue signaling context.

Here's an interesting question to ask yourself. Take all the lawyers you know and have met in your entire life. Now imagine a society without civil order and those people acted the exact same way they do as lawyers to everyone else under those conditions. I have no doubt most would get stabbed to death in the streets.

America in terms of ideals is not a problem. America in terms of practical logistics is not a problem. America without justice is a problem.

If you want civil order in a society where natural selection no longer exists, then you need to start culling the herd manually.
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Im gonna sidetrack this thread briefly and say this may be my favorite post ever. Much love GG!

 
KarmaPolice said:
I get the intent of the thread and know SC's posts enough to guess his posts and replies.    It seems like one of those odd situations where many of the people that are asking this at the same time as propping up the country as the best ever and our government as the best ever conceived.   To me that seems a bit like opposing thoughts being juggled.  Its the best ever, but we can't trust it at all and we shouldn't rely on it? 

Not sure this will explain my position well, but for me it's more that I accept that a government is needed, we have a great system in theory, it's just that I am leery of the people who want to be in government and run things and like anything else there is corruption and waste.  I think there should be less federal oversight for things, but as far as nationally effected problems (like say, a pandemic) some federal oversight and guidance is warranted.  
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For me, the government has it's hands in all the things it shouldn't instead of the things it should.

 
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Stealthycat said:
https://www.foxnews.com/health/fauci-study-delta-efficacy-moderna-pfizer-booster

Dr. Anthony Fauci has dismissed a study that deemed the Moderna vaccine as more effective than the Pfizer one against the COVID-19 delta variant. 
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1) he didn't dismiss it

2) you posted that Fauci refused to believe the science that the shots aren't doing what they said they would. The lnked article is talking about the efficacy of Moderna vs Pfizer

3) For someone who refuses to get the vaccine because of unknown long term consequences you sure do seem to jump on any preliminary report that aligns with your views. One would think you would want to wait on all evidence to be thoroughly vetted

Here is what Fauci said, maybe you could point exactly to  what your issue is?

"That study … is a pre-print study, it hasn’t been fully peer-reviewed," Fauci said on CBS's "Face the Nation." "I don’t doubt what they’re seeing, but there are a lot of confounding variables in there, about when one was started, the relative amount of people in that cohort who were delta vs alpha – right now, if we get boosters … it’s clear we want to make sure we get people, if possible, to get the boost from the original vaccine." 

 
Stealthycat said:
what has the Govt done (examples) to give us a reason to trust them ? WWI and WWII I suppose ... getting out of the Great Depression .... it was a long fight for civil rights but eventually the Jim Crow era Democrats were defeated 

in the last 2 decades .... can you give me any shining examples of the US Fed Govt doing things that would instill trust ?

I didn't mention elections - what a fiasco and now, many people distrust the election system
Click to expand...
I can't, hence the skepticism.

 
The Commish said:
For me, the government has it's hands in all the things it shouldn't instead of the things it should.
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Could you unpack this a little more as to what you think it should be involved in that it isn't and vice versa?  

I assume we are talking mostly the federal government in here, and to me that should be big picture things like nation security, pandemics, infrastructure, etc.. 

 
Stealthycat said:
what has the Govt done (examples) to give us a reason to trust them ? WWI and WWII I suppose ... getting out of the Great Depression .... it was a long fight for civil rights but eventually the Jim Crow era Democrats were defeated 

in the last 2 decades .... can you give me any shining examples of the US Fed Govt doing things that would instill trust ?

I didn't mention elections - what a fiasco and now, many people distrust the election system
Click to expand...
  • Tax refund worked at federal and state levels
  • Court system processed my divorce
  • Interstate highway travel is pretty cool
  • City government is installing more electric chargers
  • County processed my license plate renewal fairly efficiently
  • School board/City Council stream meetings to increase transparency
 
the moops said:
1) he didn't dismiss it

2) you posted that Fauci refused to believe the science that the shots aren't doing what they said they would. The lnked article is talking about the efficacy of Moderna vs Pfizer

3) For someone who refuses to get the vaccine because of unknown long term consequences you sure do seem to jump on any preliminary report that aligns with your views. One would think you would want to wait on all evidence to be thoroughly vetted

Here is what Fauci said, maybe you could point exactly to  what your issue is?

"That study … is a pre-print study, it hasn’t been fully peer-reviewed," Fauci said on CBS's "Face the Nation." "I don’t doubt what they’re seeing, but there are a lot of confounding variables in there, about when one was started, the relative amount of people in that cohort who were delta vs alpha – right now, if we get boosters … it’s clear we want to make sure we get people, if possible, to get the boost from the original vaccine." 
Click to expand...
OMG.  You mean he twisted things to get a negative outlook on Fauci?  I'm sure they were just honest mis-quotes.  

 
Zero, ziltch, nope, na-da. And its getting worse every day. 

This pandemic sealed the deal for me that our government (at all major levels) is one big corrupt pile of dog #### looking to take advantage of each other and we are nothing but pawns.

I live in NY so I got to watch how Cuomo, Schumer and Trump would throw jabs at each other, doctor numbers, refuse each others help and then go on TV, smile and tell us "nothing is political" 

Pelosi walks through Chinatown saying "look everything is fine here, nothing to see, Everyone come over" and then rampaged about Trump not closing the airports sooner.

Up until Nov 2nd every democrat was fully against "Trumps Rushed Vaccine" Cuomo said, "no way in hell I'm letting that in my state", and had "Major doubts" that the vax was effective...but now when someone else asks those questions they are labeled a grandma killer and not allowed to go anywhere.  

Masks, Masks, Deleta, Oh my...but 300k squeezed together like cattle at Lallapolozza is no biggie.

Race issues surprisingly pop up every 4 years? hmmmmmm


Covid was the largest threat to our country since 9-11 and it was very clear that our government leaders could not put party politics aside and work together for the good of the country. For that I will never trust any of them again.

 

 
moleculo said:
I cannot trust people to behave in a manner that keeps society safe - that much has been proven time and time again. 
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and you think the Fed Govt has kept people safe - the Fed Govt has a history of doing that ?

I mean lets take it into every day accounts. Would you trust the Fed Govt to manage your checking account knowing how they handle spending/budgets/national debt?

Would you trust the Fed Govt to manage your security knowing how they handle the southern border and crime nationwide?

Would you trust the Fed Govt to advise on ethics/morals knowing how many of them are corrupt?

Would you trust the Fed Govt to manage your retirement/investments seeing as how they've done such an awesome job with Social Security?

Would you trust the Fed Govt for healthcare? I mean we have national health care right now for Veterans ..... I don't think the Fed Govt does a good job there, does anyone else ?

Would you trust the Fed Govt knowing about operation mongoose (with the released JFK documents) that literally was CIA plots to kill Cuban refugee's and blame on Castro?

https://www.miaminewtimes.com/news/jfk-docs-cia-plotted-to-bomb-miami-kill-refugees-and-blame-castro-9782696

I mean we can list on and on examples (and please do!!) examples of why not to trust Govt ............. and yet it seems to be like Gekko said in a way, we all want to believe the Fed Govt is good and just and right and all that ........... but so much points to just the opposite doesn't it ?

how many people listened to Biden last night and shook their heads yes yes yes on everything he said about Afghanistan in July - does nobody remember just weeks ago what he said ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xL7iEWqWIS4

 
After 9/11 the government imposed new rules at airports and large gatherings. Those rules, involving everyone being searched, were cumbersome at times, but they protected us. That’s one example among many. 
 

I should add that I find it distinctly ironic that many of the of the people who make the argument that government should not be trusted are the same people who have previously argued that if only young black men followed the instructions of police, nothing bad would ever happen to them. 

 
Nugget said:
  • Tax refund worked at federal and state levels
  • Court system processed my divorce
  • Interstate highway travel is pretty cool
  • City government is installing more electric chargers
  • County processed my license plate renewal fairly efficiently
  • School board/City Council stream meetings to increase transparency
Click to expand...


But almost everyone hates the way tax codes are - court system is often attacked - roadways are great and in great need of repair (thus the new trillion infrastructure deal, our State/Fed governments failed to maintain them) ... electric system is fixing to collapse, remember the rolling blackouts? When electric cars start sucking more .... where is the alternative energy source? 

DMV's are hateful places I think many would agree!!  and talk about school systems? That might be the BIGGEST example of Govt failure !!

 
timschochet said:
After 9/11 the government imposed new rules at airports and large gatherings. Those rules, involving everyone being searched, were cumbersome at times, but they protected us. That’s one example among many. 
 

I should add that I find it distinctly ironic that many of the of the people who make the argument that government should not be trusted are the same people who have previously argued that if only young black men followed the instructions of police, nothing bad would ever happen to them. 
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is it any more distinctly ironic that you, who IIRC often talks about systemic racism at society / government levels are trying to give example of how we should trust the Govt ?

yes, those imposed new rules have prevented thus far another 9-11 .........  which could also be blamed on lax Fed regulations right? if you give the credit give them the blame too ?

 
Stealthycat said:
and you think the Fed Govt has kept people safe - the Fed Govt has a history of doing that ?

I mean lets take it into every day accounts. Would you trust the Fed Govt to manage your checking account knowing how they handle spending/budgets/national debt?

Would you trust the Fed Govt to manage your security knowing how they handle the southern border and crime nationwide?

Would you trust the Fed Govt to advise on ethics/morals knowing how many of them are corrupt?

Would you trust the Fed Govt to manage your retirement/investments seeing as how they've done such an awesome job with Social Security?

Would you trust the Fed Govt for healthcare? I mean we have national health care right now for Veterans ..... I don't think the Fed Govt does a good job there, does anyone else ?

Would you trust the Fed Govt knowing about operation mongoose (with the released JFK documents) that literally was CIA plots to kill Cuban refugee's and blame on Castro?

https://www.miaminewtimes.com/news/jfk-docs-cia-plotted-to-bomb-miami-kill-refugees-and-blame-castro-9782696

I mean we can list on and on examples (and please do!!) examples of why not to trust Govt ............. and yet it seems to be like Gekko said in a way, we all want to believe the Fed Govt is good and just and right and all that ........... but so much points to just the opposite doesn't it ?

how many people listened to Biden last night and shook their heads yes yes yes on everything he said about Afghanistan in July - does nobody remember just weeks ago what he said ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xL7iEWqWIS4
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I said I don't trust government.  I simply trust everyone else less.

Would you like me to start listing examples of non-governmental entities who have screwed over other people?  Trust me - it's a much longer list.  And, that list would be infinitely longer if there wasn't a governmental watch-dog and their list of regulations keeping things in check.

 
I trust people to be people, which are overwhelming self-serving.  The government is made up of people.  Term limits are desperately needed.  

 
moleculo said:
I said I don't trust government.  I simply trust everyone else less.

Would you like me to start listing examples of non-governmental entities who have screwed over other people?  Trust me - it's a much longer list.  And, that list would be infinitely longer if there wasn't a governmental watch-dog and their list of regulations keeping things in check.
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it seems like you're just settling for a really piss poor performing Govt that has restrictions and rules and regulations in place 

non-govt entities you can walk away from, disown, never deal with again ........... not the Fed Govt, it intrudes into almost every aspect of almost everyone's lives

The US Fed Govt is made up of the very people who screw people over - do you not agree ? 

 
Stealthycat said:
it seems like you're just settling for a really piss poor performing Govt that has restrictions and rules and regulations in place 

non-govt entities you can walk away from, disown, never deal with again ........... not the Fed Govt, it intrudes into almost every aspect of almost everyone's lives

The US Fed Govt is made up of the very people who screw people over - do you not agree ? 
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it's kind of like the old Churchill quote: "democracy is the worst form of government – except for all the others that have been tried".  Our government is the worst entity out there, except for everything else.  I mean, "yeah, government sucks" but what's the alternative?  

 
KarmaPolice said:
Could you unpack this a little more as to what you think it should be involved in that it isn't and vice versa?  

I assume we are talking mostly the federal government in here, and to me that should be big picture things like nation security, pandemics, infrastructure, etc.. 
Click to expand...
We need some sort of minimum coverage for healthcare in the current environment.  If I were pulling all the levers, healthcare wouldn't be "for profit" at all and certainly not tied to your job.  Our national security and infrastructure (including electric, gas, roads and wifi) as you mention and protections from large corporate conglomerates.  I'd likely throw prisons in as part of that list as well.  That's about all I'd want them to be actively part of.  Of course there are probably some other things I could think of that they need to be part of but in a support kind of way to the states.

 
Ultimately, doesn't not trusting the government simply mean that your neighbors aren't trust worthy?  Or, that we are just too apathetic to care?

 
depends what you mean

government delivers thousands of excellent and reliable services every single day.  So mostly i trust government. 

 
moleculo said:
it's kind of like the old Churchill quote: "democracy is the worst form of government – except for all the others that have been tried".  Our government is the worst entity out there, except for everything else.  I mean, "yeah, government sucks" but what's the alternative?  
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I dunno lets count the ways ... umm like almost in EVERY way Government can be better - right ?

So why isn't it ?

We can talk here all year long on national debt, the waste, lack of border security, the flaws in judicial system, systemic racism, crime, the economy, global warming and the list goes on and on and guess what ?

its the SAME problems year after year with the same infectiveness of the Govt to solve the problems right ?

40 years is a long time, can we agree ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_members_of_the_United_States_Congress_by_longevity_of_service

look at the people STILL in Congress - Biden and Pelosi and McConnel and others ................ if they're not got a good fix after a few decades can we agree they will NEVER get anything fixed ?

alternatives - lets try term limits, accountability for national debt balancing, actually cut wasteful  spending, and actually DO SOMETHING about the border as well as other things ............ I mean is that too much to ask to gain voters trust ? 

 
Stealthycat said:
I dunno lets count the ways ... umm like almost in EVERY way Government can be better - right ?

So why isn't it ?
Click to expand...
Government is made up of human beings with human limitations. Individuals can typically always be better people than we currently are. So why don't we?

The answers are not too different for government from what it is for individuals.

 
Stealthycat said:
I dunno lets count the ways ... umm like almost in EVERY way Government can be better - right ?

So why isn't it ?

We can talk here all year long on national debt, the waste, lack of border security, the flaws in judicial system, systemic racism, crime, the economy, global warming and the list goes on and on and guess what ?

its the SAME problems year after year with the same infectiveness of the Govt to solve the problems right ?

40 years is a long time, can we agree ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_members_of_the_United_States_Congress_by_longevity_of_service

look at the people STILL in Congress - Biden and Pelosi and McConnel and others ................ if they're not got a good fix after a few decades can we agree they will NEVER get anything fixed ?

alternatives - lets try term limits, accountability for national debt balancing, actually cut wasteful  spending, and actually DO SOMETHING about the border as well as other things ............ I mean is that too much to ask to gain voters trust ? 
Click to expand...


This is a good post

But there is a reason it is the way it is....it represents the people.  Like it or not, this is us (not the show).  I wish it was different but it isn't and it won't be.  The faster you come to realize that the faster your BP can come down.  I used to be agitated by it beyond belief but i have learned to let go

I would vote for anyone that only had a platform that actually did the things you mention.  

 
Doug B said:
Government is made up of human beings with human limitations. Individuals can typically always be better people than we currently are. So why don't we?

The answers are not too different for government from what it is for individuals.
Click to expand...
We posted the same thing at the same time...you owe me a beer :)

 
Trust is a relative term.

I "trust" the government to equip some sort of police force. I don't trust the government to ensure that every single law enforcement officer is acting ethically. 

I "trust" the government to build roads and highways. I don't trust the government to ensure that all roads won't have potholes or won't be dangerous to travel. 

I "trust" the government to create laws that are generally in favor of the public good. I don't trust the government to create laws that work fairly in every scenario. 

I "trust" the government to instill some minimal form of incentive to get decent people working in government positions. I don't trust the government to employ only the best people. 

I say the above because: 

1. The government cannot take and control all currency in a country for obvious reasons and, therefore, have finite resources to accomplish all thing. 

2. The government cannot employ the "best" people because the best people still needing to make money can make more in the private sector - meaning we're left with those who don't need the money (e.g. wealthy people in it for notoriety) or who aren't the "best" enough to get the private sector job. 

3. Governing thousands to millions of people effectively is really, really ####### hard. 

 
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