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RB Sony Michel, LAR


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44 minutes ago, brewer said:

I think the Patriot's have proven that they are hard to predict year to year.  There will be no Tom Brady obviously, so I feel safe saying that the offense will change.  They are a team that is only a few years removed from LeGarrette Blount rushing for 1200 yards and scoring 18 TDs.

If Harris is the #1 guy(which as you say is a huge if), I'm buying.

Harris is probably worth a late round flyer or an add and hold just to see how things play out as he should not be that expensive to pick up. As for Blount's big season, he essentially took on an expanded role as the early down pounder not involved in the passing game (the role that Michel currently has). Blount just happened to score a ton of TDs. Bear in mind that that was the year that Dion Lewis reinjured himself and White emerged as a pass catching specialist. So Blount inherited most of the carries as they didn't have much depth.

The way the roster is constituted this year, I think they have more options and the workload would be more distributed than it was in 2016 (if Michel missed extended time). NE seems to always have their backs getting dinged, so there is a path for Harris to getting a bigger workload . . . assuming he is the one that stays healthy and the other guys are the ones with nagging injuries.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Plodder. Not running with the same power and lacks ability to make people miss. Can't really catch passes. Stidham will kill what value he has as Pats will play behind a lot more.

 

Unless we see a scheme change and Hoyer is the QB, he's probably where he should be in Non-PPR 14 teamers, early 7th round.

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4 hours ago, The Frankman said:

Plodder. Not running with the same power and lacks ability to make people miss. Can't really catch passes. Stidham will kill what value he has as Pats will play behind a lot more.

 

Unless we see a scheme change and Hoyer is the QB, he's probably where he should be in Non-PPR 14 teamers, early 7th round.

You think turning to Hoyer would be a good thing?

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31 minutes ago, Dr. Octopus said:

You think turning to Hoyer would be a good thing?

Is there any reason to think Stidham is better than Hoyer? Stidham was a day 3 QB, who seemingly got worse every year at Auburn. 

I know Hoyer is obviously nobody's idea of a starting QB, but he's been decent in spots, the unknown isn't always better.

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12 minutes ago, travdogg said:

Is there any reason to think Stidham is better than Hoyer? Stidham was a day 3 QB, who seemingly got worse every year at Auburn. 

I know Hoyer is obviously nobody's idea of a starting QB, but he's been decent in spots, the unknown isn't always better.

I don't know that Stidham is better - but he surely has more upside. However, the point is if the Pats go into the season with Stidham as the starter and he has to be replaced by Hoyer, that is not a good thing. 

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32 minutes ago, travdogg said:

Is there any reason to think Stidham is better than Hoyer? Stidham was a day 3 QB, who seemingly got worse every year at Auburn. 

I know Hoyer is obviously nobody's idea of a starting QB, but he's been decent in spots, the unknown isn't always better.

People need to think less like a fan and more like a coach. BB chose Stidham over Brady, Newton, Winston, Dalton, Love, and all the remaining drafted QBs after Love. If Belichick wanted anyone on that list, that guy would be the Patriots QB. (At one point they had the cap room to have any of those options but instead used the money elsewhere.) IMO, that to me means BB sees Stidham in a similar tier as those players AS THEY ARE CURRENTLY CONSTITUTED . . . so 43-year-old Brady, turnover-prone Winston, injury-prone Newton, average Andy Dalton, and a host of would-be rookies that need a lot of development. BB also knows that for similar production, Stidham knows the system and would cost 1/20th the price of the other guys. I can't see Hoyer winning the job with his 10-year track record  of mediocrity (35--years-old, 16-22 as a starter, and an 82.5 QB rating). At this point, where Stidham was drafted and how he did at Auburn are irrelevant.

We have seen NE with a similar roster and strategy in 2001 (albeit transformed by an injury to Bledsoe): strong defense, inexperienced QB, few offensive weapons, heavy ball control / rushing attack. The 2001 offensive numbers for NE weren't pretty but they won:

Tom Brady 2843-18-12
Antowain Smith 1349 YFS - 13 total TD
Troy Brown 1290 YFS - 5 total TD
David Patten 816 YFS - 5 total TD
Kevin Faulk 358 YFS - 3 total TD
Marc Edwards 307 YFS - 3 total TD
JR Redmond 251 YFS - 0 TD
Terry Glenn 204 YFS - 1 TD
Jermaine Wiggins 133 YFS - 4 TD
Charles Johnson 111 YFS - 1 TD
Leftovers 162 YFS - 0 TD

I get that offenses now get a lot more production than almost 20 years ago, so those numbers would be even weaker now than then. The 2001 Patriots defense allowed 271 points. The 2019 Patriots defense allowed 225. Yes, I understand, the defense played a D-II college schedule the first half of the season, but they still allowed the 7th or 8th fewest points over the second half of the season. They lost some key pieces, but knock on wood they should still be solid. And certainly they have a much tougher schedule this year compared to last year. Also notable is that there may not be any sort of homefield advantage this season if fans are not able to attend games.

But Stidham should be able to produce better numbers than what Brady did in 2001. Michel (if healthy) might be able to hit Edwards' 1157 rushing yards. A healthy Edelman might approach Troy Brown's numbers. Harry could reach Patten's numbers. And a ham sandwich might be able to outproduce the 2001 total of 168 receiving yards from the TE position. (Last year, their TE production was horrible . . . and even that group hit 424 receiving yards).

IMO, that's the model that BB is looking to emulate for the 2020 Patriots. On paper, you would never look at the stats from the 2001 team and think they were more than a 6-10 team. Yet they went 11-5 and won the SB.

 

 

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47 minutes ago, Anarchy99 said:

People need to think less like a fan and more like a coach. BB chose Stidham over Brady, Newton, Winston, Dalton, Love, and all the remaining drafted QBs after Love. If Belichick wanted anyone on that list, that guy would be the Patriots QB. (At one point they had the cap room to have any of those options but instead used the money elsewhere.) IMO, that to me means BB sees Stidham in a similar tier as those players AS THEY ARE CURRENTLY CONSTITUTED . . . so 43-year-old Brady, turnover-prone Winston, injury-prone Newton, average Andy Dalton, and a host of would-be rookies that need a lot of development. BB also knows that for similar production, Stidham knows the system and would cost 1/20th the price of the other guys. I can't see Hoyer winning the job with his 10-year track record  of mediocrity (35--years-old, 16-22 as a starter, and an 82.5 QB rating). At this point, where Stidham was drafted and how he did at Auburn are irrelevant.

We have seen NE with a similar roster and strategy in 2001 (albeit transformed by an injury to Bledsoe): strong defense, inexperienced QB, few offensive weapons, heavy ball control / rushing attack. The 2001 offensive numbers for NE weren't pretty but they won:

Tom Brady 2843-18-12
Antowain Smith 1349 YFS - 13 total TD
Troy Brown 1290 YFS - 5 total TD
David Patten 816 YFS - 5 total TD
Kevin Faulk 358 YFS - 3 total TD
Marc Edwards 307 YFS - 3 total TD
JR Redmond 251 YFS - 0 TD
Terry Glenn 204 YFS - 1 TD
Jermaine Wiggins 133 YFS - 4 TD
Charles Johnson 111 YFS - 1 TD
Leftovers 162 YFS - 0 TD

I get that offenses now get a lot more production than almost 20 years ago, so those numbers would be even weaker now than then. The 2001 Patriots defense allowed 271 points. The 2019 Patriots defense allowed 225. Yes, I understand, the defense played a D-II college schedule the first half of the season, but they still allowed the 7th or 8th fewest points over the second half of the season. They lost some key pieces, but knock on wood they should still be solid. And certainly they have a much tougher schedule this year compared to last year. Also notable is that there may not be any sort of homefield advantage this season if fans are not able to attend games.

But Stidham should be able to produce better numbers than what Brady did in 2001. Michel (if healthy) might be able to hit Edwards' 1157 rushing yards. A healthy Edelman might approach Troy Brown's numbers. Harry could reach Patten's numbers. And a ham sandwich might be able to outproduce the 2001 total of 168 receiving yards from the TE position. (Last year, their TE production was horrible . . . and even that group hit 424 receiving yards).

IMO, that's the model that BB is looking to emulate for the 2020 Patriots. On paper, you would never look at the stats from the 2001 team and think they were more than a 6-10 team. Yet they went 11-5 and won the SB.

 

 

This is a great post. I do think Stidham's impact to Michel is less concerning than the O-line and Michel's health. The pats O-line struggled last year and Michel has been much more effective with Develin, who retired this offseason. Also Michel looked bad last year, if that was a result of an injury and he can't get back to 100%, nothing else matters because I don't see him staying on the field. He won't get the volume he needs to be useful for fantasy.

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1 hour ago, Anarchy99 said:

People need to think less like a fan and more like a coach. BB chose Stidham over Brady, Newton, Winston, Dalton, Love, and all the remaining drafted QBs after Love. If Belichick wanted anyone on that list, that guy would be the Patriots QB. (At one point they had the cap room to have any of those options but instead used the money elsewhere.) IMO, that to me means BB sees Stidham in a similar tier as those players AS THEY ARE CURRENTLY CONSTITUTED . . . so 43-year-old Brady, turnover-prone Winston, injury-prone Newton, average Andy Dalton, and a host of would-be rookies that need a lot of development. BB also knows that for similar production, Stidham knows the system and would cost 1/20th the price of the other guys. I can't see Hoyer winning the job with his 10-year track record  of mediocrity (35--years-old, 16-22 as a starter, and an 82.5 QB rating). At this point, where Stidham was drafted and how he did at Auburn are irrelevant.

We have seen NE with a similar roster and strategy in 2001 (albeit transformed by an injury to Bledsoe): strong defense, inexperienced QB, few offensive weapons, heavy ball control / rushing attack. The 2001 offensive numbers for NE weren't pretty but they won:

Tom Brady 2843-18-12
Antowain Smith 1349 YFS - 13 total TD
Troy Brown 1290 YFS - 5 total TD
David Patten 816 YFS - 5 total TD
Kevin Faulk 358 YFS - 3 total TD
Marc Edwards 307 YFS - 3 total TD
JR Redmond 251 YFS - 0 TD
Terry Glenn 204 YFS - 1 TD
Jermaine Wiggins 133 YFS - 4 TD
Charles Johnson 111 YFS - 1 TD
Leftovers 162 YFS - 0 TD

I get that offenses now get a lot more production than almost 20 years ago, so those numbers would be even weaker now than then. The 2001 Patriots defense allowed 271 points. The 2019 Patriots defense allowed 225. Yes, I understand, the defense played a D-II college schedule the first half of the season, but they still allowed the 7th or 8th fewest points over the second half of the season. They lost some key pieces, but knock on wood they should still be solid. And certainly they have a much tougher schedule this year compared to last year. Also notable is that there may not be any sort of homefield advantage this season if fans are not able to attend games.

But Stidham should be able to produce better numbers than what Brady did in 2001. Michel (if healthy) might be able to hit Edwards' 1157 rushing yards. A healthy Edelman might approach Troy Brown's numbers. Harry could reach Patten's numbers. And a ham sandwich might be able to outproduce the 2001 total of 168 receiving yards from the TE position. (Last year, their TE production was horrible . . . and even that group hit 424 receiving yards).

IMO, that's the model that BB is looking to emulate for the 2020 Patriots. On paper, you would never look at the stats from the 2001 team and think they were more than a 6-10 team. Yet they went 11-5 and won the SB.

 

 

Very solid post & great points. 
 

I’ll add one more: BB stuck with a 6th round draft pick (199) over Drew Bledsoe After Bledsoe recovered, and that worked out pretty well for the patriots. 

Bledsoe wasn’t the most mobile QB (lol) but he certainly wasn’t a scrub either.

so when it comes to going with Stidham over Hoyer, I’m gonna trust BB’s instincts on this one.

As for Michele, I’ll preface by saying he was a toss-in to balance a trade I made for Mike Evans. I am only invested as much as I allow myself to be, so I try to stay neutral on the dude since he was basically free.

That disclaimer aside, I’ll say that if Michele’s foot is ok, and assuming there’s a 2020 season, I would expect he’d be used more consistently than when Brady was there. Anywhere around 17 touches a game & he should provide modest RB2-3 production. 

if Stidham is competent & can sustain drives, then Michele may have .35 TD/gm as well. 

Michele’s YPC average the last couple years shows a bit more than “plodder” as some have called him. His average is respectable enough, but it’s been opportunity he’s lacked. In games he’s been fed the ball, he’s put up some decent numbers. 

hard to imagine a RB that will cost less who has a chance to be decent. And if he sucks, it didn’t cost anyone much. 

I’m a hold until there’s a bump in value. Not holding my breath, but I’m not gonna discount the possibility of that either. 

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2 minutes ago, Wise Old Owl said:

This is a great post. I do think Stidham's impact to Michel is less concerning than the O-line and Michel's health. The pats O-line struggled last year and Michel has been much more effective with Develin, who retired this offseason. Also Michel looked bad last year, if that was a result of an injury and he can't get back to 100%, nothing else matters because I don't see him staying on the field. He won't get the volume he needs to be useful for fantasy.

The OL was a mess the first part of the year with all the injuries they sustained. Combined with no FB and no Gronk, that spelled disaster for the running game. In theory, the OL should start the year healthier. While they don't have experienced depth players for the O-line, they have younger and healthier depth pieces this year. Dante leaving as the line coach could be an issue. There has been consistent chatter about trading Thuney, but at this point that doesn't make a lot of sense. They don't really have anyone reliable to insert instead of him. The time to trade him was prior to the draft when they could have gotten a decent draft pick back and they could have either signed or drafted another guard. Bottom line, whoever is carrying the football will need a healthy OL and help from a FB and TE to get anywhere. Michel wasn't very effective, but I am not sure anyone else would have done markedly better.

For some reason, BB seems committed to Michel. He's had 219 touches and 259 touches his first two seasons . . . and he was nicked up both seasons. For better or for worse, Michel did have some runs that worked out pretty well when the play was schemed and blocked properly. It would be hard to tell what would have happened with a more explosive back. Maybe a 12 yard run may have turned into a 40 yard run with someone else . . . we'll never know.

I personally would not be too concerned about his recent foot surgery, which was said to be a minor clean up procedure to relieve pain and discomfort in his foot (obviously subject to change if it comes out that his surgery was far worse than being reported). I think we have seen what Michel has to offer. He's basically 3 yards and a cloud of dust without much explosion. If he can fall forward, then maybe he can get 4 yards. And we all know receiving is not his game. Fantasy wise, he has averaged 17 touches a game in his time with NE (72.8 YFS and 0.58 TD per game) but that includes his playoff starts. We've seen the same type of player and numbers in NE in other seasons . . . Maroney, Morris, BJGE, Ridley, Blount, where someone is an early round back and someone else is the 3rd down / receiving back. So it's unlikely that pattern is going to change.
People can decide for themselves if the changes to the offense will make Michel's numbers higher, lower, or the same. IMO, if the offensive personnel can stay healthy this year, I can see the NE offense with Stidham putting together numbers a little bit better than last year. The Pats offense produced 5664 yards on offense, which ranked 15th. They also scored 42 times last season, which ranked 16th in passing TD and 7th in rushing TD. In terms of getting into the end zone, I think a lot of that will depend on how well the defense plays and if they can force turnovers or create short fields and scoring opportunities for the offense. I would not but a lot of faith in the offense if Stidham has to lead the team on 75+ yard drives over and over again.

The wildcard for Michel is Harris, as the media has jumped on the Michel injury as an opportunity for Harris. That remains to be seen, but BB liked 4 other guys more than Harris last year (and made Harris inactive most weeks), All those players are returning (at least as of now), so I think it would take Michel being out for an extended stretch for Harris to get a much bigger role. We'll see how things shake out eventually, but it's hard to imaging anyone climbing the depth chart when no one is practicing yet.

Michel is basically a Top 25-30 RB in 0 PPR leagues based on his workload and goal line carries (when they can advanced the ball that far). In PPR leagues, he's probably in the RB 31-40 range. The problem is, I don't see him being able to do dramatically better than that.

 

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Injury issues, one-dimensional, underperforming running back with a crowded backfield that now has to compete with Cam Newton taking goal-line rushes.

Am I missing anything else?

The corresponding ADP drop from last year will at least make this guy pretty cheap to acquire if you want him.

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1 hour ago, Faust said:

Injury issues, one-dimensional, underperforming running back with a crowded backfield that now has to compete with Cam Newton taking goal-line rushes.

Am I missing anything else?

The corresponding ADP drop from last year will at least make this guy pretty cheap to acquire if you want him.

Nope, summed it all up. 

also a buy-low gamble. I got him free. But if I were in another dynasty league I’d definitely throw out a chump change offer to see if I could get him on the cheap.

Because if Cam can play, that’s gonna open up holes in that OL. The 8 in the box I’d feared with Stidham won’t happen, and Michele can be an effective 1-2 down back. 

also given the likelihood that Newton will be able to get them to the RZ more often, Michele’s TD numbers aren’t as much a concern as they were a few days ago. 

so yeah - he’s a 1-dimensional plodder who’s prone to injury, but he’s MY 1-dimensional plodder prone to injury. and he can be as good as a RB2 for FF purposes if things break right in NE. Acquiring Cam Newton elevates the value of all Pats if he’s healthy. 

the one attribute you didn’t name was an important one: BB lIkes him. So if Michele’s foot is right (reading it was a minor clean-up) then he’s likely to be the early down back.

pretty solid value for the price. Or complete garbage. One of the two. :pickle:

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26 minutes ago, woodstock said:

Belichick kept sticking up for him last year, but he looked like he had no burst even if he was getting tackled behind the line. I didn't think the line was that atrocious, either.  

Don’t sell them short, they were a tremendous slouch.

/caddyshack 

here’s the thing about Michele & his usage last year - the Pats didn’t have receiving weapons. No Gronk, poor blocking by the other TEs, Edelman played through various injuries most of the year - the OL wasn’t that bad, you’re right. But the Pats offense as a whole wasn’t very creative, and they weren’t a great poor run blocking unit. Plus the play calling was a little vanilla. How many times can you run it up the gut when Michele comes on? they also would have success on a good inside run, then try to pass twice for a 3 & out. They weren’t great at extending drives, and they rotated running backs a little too often for their own good.

IMO if BB ran more 2-back sets last year with white & Michele they would have been less predictable. 

So both things are true: the OL wasn’t that bad; and the Pats offense wasn’t that good. I think it was mostly due to not having Gronk & being banged up on offense. That & Harry wasn’t near as good as expected out of the gate. 

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On 6/22/2020 at 7:14 AM, Anarchy99 said:

People need to think less like a fan and more like a coach. BB chose Stidham over Brady, Newton, Winston, Dalton, Love, and all the remaining drafted QBs after Love. If Belichick wanted anyone on that list, that guy would be the Patriots QB. (At one point they had the cap room to have any of those options but instead used the money elsewhere.) IMO, that to me means BB sees Stidham in a similar tier as those players AS THEY ARE CURRENTLY CONSTITUTED .

 

 

 

 

Edited by GordonGekko
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31 minutes ago, GordonGekko said:

 

The reason lots of people give Belichick The Drafter a pass is because Belichick The Drafter has always been protected by Belichick The Coach

He mines UDFA well. He does pretty well with very late round picks ( relative to the average pan out rate) , many of his trades have helped the team. The cap situation is never totally a mess.  He's not a bad GM ( Do not push Caserio or anyone else's name here, Belichick picks who he wants) but he's a pretty poor drafter. One of the few things about this kind of long standing tenure and essentially job security is all the normal excuses/rationalizations have to go out the window.

Spending draft picks on kickers? Spending picks on those kickers? Spending those specific picks ( i.e. questions on value for slot) on kickers?

Trading up to take a tight end that they could have gotten a couple of rounds later?

Spending a first round pick on a running back in todays game?

The Patriots fortunes will rest not just on Stidham, and not just on Michel, but on the quality of successive drafts in the past 2-3 seasons. While some of Belichick's trades do work out, they do, by their nature, start to create cap issues ( You need cheap cost controlled labor to build depth on a team, which you can only get by drafting) because they typically deal with players outside their rookie deals.

Michel is not a game changer. If you are not a game changer, then you have to look to volume. He's never healthy enough to give you that. He's a wasted pick, which is fine in isolation, you will miss on picks. But was he value for slot? (A long term resource management question) Was he value for slot given positional value concerns and typical opportunity cost questions?

You could get an UDFA to run into a wall of defenders and break something every other snap.

That Belichick THE COACH chose Stidham ... and by extension, Michel, doesn't really matter. That Belichick The Drafter did actually does. He's historically been a poor drafter protected by being an elite coach.

Michel is an easy pass in fantasy. The Patriots RB is a wasteland for fantasy. If you need points, make Patriots RBs much farther down on your list on places you'll use your research ( i.e. your valuable and limited time) to try to garner value.

I agree with this for one exception. He drafts the chip on your shoulder player despite talent differentials. He wants a pack of chips on the shoulder guys vs. a pack of pure talent. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

 

Quote

ESPN's Mike Reiss reports Patriots RB Sony Michel (foot) has been rehabbing at the team's facilities for several weeks.

It's the first we've heard of Michel's recovery since he underwent foot surgery in June. He recently posted a photo on Instagram without a walking boot on, suggesting he's been rehabbing in Foxborough without it. His ADP has dipped to the mid-ninth round as the overall RB42 the past month, which is a slight value if healthy for the New England's season opener. Michel remains in line for 200 carries if upright for a full 16 games.

SOURCE: Mike Reiss on Twitter

Jul 12, 2020, 9:22 AM ET

 

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  • 3 weeks later...

 

Quote

Patriots RB Sony Michel's status (foot) is uncertain for the start of football activities, according to The Athletic's Jeff Howe.

Michel had foot surgery in May and might not be cleared in time for practice. Michel has been fairly productive when on the field with 13 touchdowns and over 1,800 rushing yards in 29 total games, but injuries continue to derail any momentum he creates. This could open the door for 2019 third-round pick Damien Harris to find a role in this offense after failing to secure one as a rookie. Michel is currently being drafted as the RB42.

SOURCE: Jeff Howe on Twitter

Jul 27, 2020, 7:21 PM ET

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Hoh said:

I confess that I actively root against Nick Chubb because I chose Michel over him, and if Chubb doesn’t do well either I don’t look like such a dummy.  

I think that ship has sailed man

Even if Chubb retired tomorrow I'd rather have had his career than Michel's

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I think Howe needs better sources. Of all the players on NE, Michel should be the one guy they should know how he’s doing. He’s been rehabbing at their facilities for the last few weeks. Almost everyone else was not allowed back yet. I still think Michel will heal up in time to start the season (but he won’t do anything spectacular when he plays). He’s good for a decent amount of carries and perhaps some red zone looks, but at best he is a fantasy flex or bye week (or COVID) filler. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

 

Quote

The Athletic's Jeff Howe said it's "too early to know" if Sony Michel (foot) will be available for Week 1.

Michel's foot surgery paired with Brandon Bolden's opt out are the primary reasons why the Patriots signed veteran RB Lamar Miller on Monday. Bill Belichick continues to hedge against Michel's injury history with Miller's signing and last year's third-round investment in Damien Harris. It's a very crowded running back group, one that is destined to be frustrating for fantasy purposes. Michel already was a fade in all formats, and Miller's presence only confirms that. James White is the highest-ranked Patriots back, but he's only a flex play in PPR formats.

RELATED: 

Lamar Miller

SOURCE: Jeff Howe on Twitter

Aug 10, 2020, 7:16 PM ET

 

 

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On 7/27/2020 at 8:37 PM, Blackbear said:

Pats fan here. Own zero shares. Never will. Coach rotates every week. 

This didn’t age well. Drafted in a thirty round dynasty draft and currently stashed on IR. This is cheaper than lottery ticket. This is like the pull tabs on side of McDonald’s soda. I should be able to get a free happy meal. 

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I hate to state the obvious, but Silva is not a beat guy or a reporter. He’s a fantasy guy. So his tweet is an opinion or a prediction not a report. 

Talk in Boston today was Michel may or may not be ready by Week 1. But suggesting he will miss half the season is a bit of a hot take at this juncture. 

There are whispers the Eagles may be interested in Michel. LINK

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15 hours ago, Anarchy99 said:

I hate to state the obvious, but Silva is not a beat guy or a reporter. He’s a fantasy guy. So his tweet is an opinion or a prediction not a report. 

Talk in Boston today was Michel may or may not be ready by Week 1. But suggesting he will miss half the season is a bit of a hot take at this juncture. 

There are whispers the Eagles may be interested in Michel. LINK

If he does get placed on IR wouldn't he have to miss half the season? or is it 6 games?

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19 minutes ago, Dr. Octopus said:

If he does get placed on IR wouldn't he have to miss half the season? or is it 6 games?

 

He could be placed on the PUP list if he doesn’t practice during training camp:

How Does The NFL's PUP List Work? Rules Explained

Excerpt:

Quote

What is the PUP List?

Players who start the preseason on the PUP list may not practice until cleared by team medical personnel. They can attend team meetings and work out. Once cleared, they can return to the field.

If a player practices during training camp, they are not eligible for the PUP list. Instead, the team has to cut the player or put them on injured reserve. 

If a player finishes preseason on the PUP list, they can be placed on the regular season PUP list.

Players on the PUP list may not practice or play the first six weeks of the season. After the sixth week, the player must be allowed to return to practice, placed on injured reserved or released within five weeks.

If the player returns to practice, the team has three weeks to decide to place him on the active roster or on the injured reserve list.

Players on the PUP list do not count aginst the 53-man roster, but do count against the 90-man roster limit.

If he practices during training camp, the Patriots could then elect to place him on IR with a designation that he is eligible to return from IR later in the season.

PUP, IR and NFI - exploring the different designations

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I believe there are more options available than in prior years for activating or deactivating players. I believe this year there will be an inactive list where guys can go for three weeks. There is also the COVID list, and who knows if teams can try to abuse that. There is also an additional IR designation that can return and an IR minor injury designation as well. The point being, Michel may not have to go on the PUP list, which would require him 6 weeks. I can never remember if the PUP list requires missing 6 weeks or 6 games (I believe NE has a bye in Week 6).

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2 minutes ago, Anarchy99 said:

I believe there are more options available than in prior years for activating or deactivating players. I believe this year there will be an inactive list where guys can go for three weeks. There is also the COVID list, and who knows if teams can try to abuse that. There is also an additional IR designation that can return and an IR minor injury designation as well. The point being, Michel may not have to go on the PUP list, which would require him 6 weeks. I can never remember if the PUP list requires missing 6 weeks or 6 games (I believe NE has a bye in Week 6).

Bill would never! 

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All right, the Evan Silva blurb makes more sense now. Mike Lombardi was the one that floated out that Michel probably isn't going to be rushed back and could miss half the season. I still am not convinced that is the case, but Lombardi has ties to the Patriots. Of course, it's also possible that NE leaked that to Lombardi as a shot across the bow for Michel in an effort to get him off his couch and onto the field.

I am still waiting to see the specifics of Lamar Miller's contract. That should tell us more in terms of how much they value Miller (and everyone else).

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Details came out just after I posted. 

Details on Miller's contract. Since he was on IR last year, just like with Cam Newton, the Pats opted for the incentive route. His contract contains a lot of not likely to be earned incentives and weekly roster bonuses. (That basically give NE more cap flexibility.) He signed for the veteran minimum ($1.05). With incentives, he could make $2.5 million this season. Only $200,000 guaranteed.

This makes it really easy for the Pats to release him with very little damage to their cap. NE still has $32.3 million in cap space this year, and the most likely outcome is they don't spend much of it and roll it over to 2021.

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Quote

Patriots RB coach Ivan Fears thinks Sony Michel (foot, active/PUP) “will be ready” to play Week 1.

Michel hasn’t practiced since opening training camp on PUP.  New England’s roster moves — they signed Lamar Miller and restructured Rex Burkhead's contract— suggest they expect him to miss time. Still, it’s worth noting Michel looked likely to sit the early part of 2018 before he ended up returning in Week 2.  Nothing can be taken for granted with the Patriots. Michel has reportedly been spotted on the sidelines at Patriots camp in recent weeks.

SOURCE: Boston Sports Journal

Aug 21, 2020, 6:41 PM ET

 

 

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  • Faust changed the title to RB Sony Michel, LAR

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