298 replies to this topic

[timschochet]

Obama took to the stump today to lash out at his critics and claimed that they are celebrating the rising gas prices. He pointed out that oil production since he became President has nearly quadrupled under his watch, and it lowered under Bush. He went on to say that we can't lower prices by increased drilling, and anyone who says otherwise is not telling the truth. "There is no silver bullet," he says.

Is he right?

[footballnerd]

not sure, but gas prices will always go up in the summer

[Parrothead]

I dunno, couple years ago I was told it was Bush and Cheney helping their oil buddies..

[Borat]

No

[BigSteelThrill]

Yes.

Because as you increase our output then the middle eastern oil bloc simply lower theirs.

[Tuco]

Anyone who disagrees with him is wrong. Just ask him.

[matuski]

Not a damn thing we can do about it.

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

Is he right?

Probably.

Historically the nations that export oil control the supply to maintain price.

ETA: And if they don't, what happened to the domestic oil producers in the '80's when oil became cheap?

Edited by Bottomfeeder Sports, 23 February 2012 - 05:26 PM.

[hook014]

2 days ago Goldman Sachs released a statement warning about rampant oil speculation and questioning whether supply and demand were even a factor.

When Goldman starts covering their butt in anticipation of a major price spike you know things are dirty. Holder is a disaster as an AG. No one fears him cause he does nothing. He truly is a potted plant.

[loose circuits]

Has Obama ever been well versed in economic theory?

Not sure he knows the definition of supply & demand

[shader]

If oil doesn't come down soon, the recession is directly around the corner. I think it's pretty clear that oil moves pretty independently of who is president in the US.

Think it's bad here? Brent is at an all time high in euros.

[timschochet]

Has Obama ever been well versed in economic theory?

Not sure he knows the definition of supply & demand

I'm not sure I understand it either when it comes to oil. Oil seems to be impervious to basic economic supply and demand rules.

[Dexter]

Has Obama ever been well versed in economic theory?

Not sure he knows the definition of supply & demand

If only it were that simple.

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

Has Obama ever been well versed in economic theory?

Not sure he knows the definition of supply & demand

[hxperson]

Are some of you really that ignorant about what is going on in Iran and Libya right now, and the concept of OPEC?

[timschochet]

Newt Gingrich, like Michelle Bachmann before him, pledged to bring gas prices below 2.50 per gallon if he is elected. But I don't understand how he will accomplish this.

[ceo3west]

Newt Gingrich, like Michelle Bachmann before him, pledged to bring gas prices below 2.50 per gallon if he is elected. But I don't understand how he will accomplish this.

Newt is desperate and will say anything to get attention at this point.

[Parrothead]

Newt Gingrich, like Michelle Bachmann before him, pledged to bring gas prices below 2.50 per gallon if he is elected. But I don't understand how he will accomplish this.

Newt is desperate and Politicians will say anything to get attention elected at this point.

fixed... you want a politician to tell it to you straight, elect Ron Paul.. otherwise, they are all liars

[hook014]

Are some of you really that ignorant about what is going on in Iran and Libya right now, and the concept of OPEC?

Prince Faud has said repeatedly over the last 5 yrs that he would like gas prices in the US to be between 2.50 and 2.75. The price that his advisors have assured him would preclude any forays into alternative energy. Who can forget him walking hand in hand with Bush telling the American public to fix their own house?

At this point I believe him more than any shill on Wall st. Supply and demand arguments have been immaterial for years.

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

Are some of you really that ignorant about what is going on in Iran and Libya right now, and the concept of OPEC?

Prince Faud has said repeatedly over the last 5 yrs that he would like gas prices in the US to be between 2.50 and 2.75. The price that his advisors have assured him would preclude any forays into alternative energy. Who can forget him walking hand in hand with Bush telling the American public to fix their own house?

At this point I believe him more than any shill on Wall st. Supply and demand arguments have been immaterial for years.

More recently the Saudis have indicated to other OPEC members that they think $100/barrel is a good number.

They've made promises to increase production to meet any shortfall from Iran.

[hook014]

Are some of you really that ignorant about what is going on in Iran and Libya right now, and the concept of OPEC?

Prince Faud has said repeatedly over the last 5 yrs that he would like gas prices in the US to be between 2.50 and 2.75. The price that his advisors have assured him would preclude any forays into alternative energy. Who can forget him walking hand in hand with Bush telling the American public to fix their own house?

At this point I believe him more than any shill on Wall st. Supply and demand arguments have been immaterial for years.

More recently the Saudis have indicated to other OPEC members that they think $100/barrel is a good number.

They've made promises to increase production to meet any shortfall from Iran.

The Saudis have consistently dealt with projectable numbers designed to calm business markets. Yet they get no credit because we can't rein our people in.

Hence my utter contempt for Eric Holder.

[timschochet]

Are some of you really that ignorant about what is going on in Iran and Libya right now, and the concept of OPEC?

Prince Faud has said repeatedly over the last 5 yrs that he would like gas prices in the US to be between 2.50 and 2.75. The price that his advisors have assured him would preclude any forays into alternative energy. Who can forget him walking hand in hand with Bush telling the American public to fix their own house?

At this point I believe him more than any shill on Wall st. Supply and demand arguments have been immaterial for years.

More recently the Saudis have indicated to other OPEC members that they think $100/barrel is a good number.

They've made promises to increase production to meet any shortfall from Iran.

The Saudis have consistently dealt with projectable numbers designed to calm business markets. Yet they get no credit because we can't rein our people in.

Hence my utter contempt for Eric Holder.

Not sure I understand you here. What specifically would you like Holder to do?

[Thunderlips]

Don't really think so. It would make sense for OPEC to decline their production as soon as we increased ours.

[E Street Brat]

In 2008 Barack Obama told us he liked gasoline prices at $4 per gallon. Obama thought that along with destroying the coal industry, high oil prices would push us to use less energy and to drive electric cars and travel more by bicycle. In December 2008, when Obama was putting together his White House team, Dr. Steven Chu was selected to become Secretary of Energy. Prior to the General Election, Chu was even more enthusiastic about raising gasoline prices than was Obama, "Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe," Mr. Chu, who directs the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory in California, said in an interview with The Wall Street Journal in September.


http://m.lubbockonli...-obama’s-plan

[loose circuits]

Yes.

Because as you increase our output then the middle eastern oil bloc simply lower theirs.

so they end up with far less revenue/profit...why is that a bad thing?

[timschochet]

Yes.

Because as you increase our output then the middle eastern oil bloc simply lower theirs.

so they end up with far less revenue/profit...why is that a bad thing?

How does it help us?

[pittstownkiller]

Obama did more today to raise the price of oil than to combat it. Even the appearance that the Administration is going to open up drilling will stir the speculators and prices would fall; instead the President speech pandering to all sides causes doubt that will fuel speculation. His message that the other side applauds bad news is comical, when just after he made this statement, he goes on to say that anyone thinking we're going to drill our way out of this mess is clueless, which was followed by applause from the crowd.

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

Yes.

Because as you increase our output then the middle eastern oil bloc simply lower theirs.

so they end up with far less revenue/profit...why is that a bad thing?

It might not be.

In reality though it would be almost entirely Saudi Arabia lowering production because most of the other OPEC countries can't afford to.

[timschochet]

In 2008 Barack Obama told us he liked gasoline prices at $4 per gallon. Obama thought that along with destroying the coal industry, high oil prices would push us to use less energy and to drive electric cars and travel more by bicycle. In December 2008, when Obama was putting together his White House team, Dr. Steven Chu was selected to become Secretary of Energy. Prior to the General Election, Chu was even more enthusiastic about raising gasoline prices than was Obama, "Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe," Mr. Chu, who directs the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory in California, said in an interview with The Wall Street Journal in September.


http://m.lubbockonli...%E2%80%99s-plan

Assuming that this was their goal, why did oil production actually nearly quadruple under their watch? That doesn't make any sense.

[hook014]

Don't really think so. It would make sense for OPEC to decline their production as soon as we increased ours.

OPec yes, Saudis no. They talk about shared goals often but flout production levels all the time. And their business partners understand the political realities they face. It's a long term strategy designed to help all of opec partners.
Honestly, since the early 70's when OPEC was formed and these countries started flexing their economic muscle the Saudis have been more than reasonable in smoothing out the rough edges. There's reason our politicians never have a bad word for them, they dont deserve it.

[MTskibum]

It would be tough to lower gas prices with more drilling. All of the cheap oil has already been drilled and is being produced.


I am working as a petroleum engineer up in north dakota, one of the hottest places for new oil production. These wells have millions of dollars worth of costs associated with them that oil wells in years past did not have. They drill down to the reservoir, then they drill horizontally through the reservoir for 2-3 miles. This horizontal drilling is not cheap as it effectively doubles the drilling time.

Even after a wells exposing 2 miles of reservoir the well will not produce very much oil, it has to be fracked, and fracking greatly increases the cost of the well.


To greatly ramp up oil production means we will be drilling in more remote areas, that require even more expensive technology.




America can produce alot of oil at 100 dollars a barrrel, but we are running out of the cheap stuff.

Edited by MTskibum, 23 February 2012 - 06:26 PM.

[E Street Brat]

In 2008 Barack Obama told us he liked gasoline prices at $4 per gallon. Obama thought that along with destroying the coal industry, high oil prices would push us to use less energy and to drive electric cars and travel more by bicycle. In December 2008, when Obama was putting together his White House team, Dr. Steven Chu was selected to become Secretary of Energy. Prior to the General Election, Chu was even more enthusiastic about raising gasoline prices than was Obama, "Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe," Mr. Chu, who directs the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory in California, said in an interview with The Wall Street Journal in September.


http://m.lubbockonli...%E2%80%99s-plan

Assuming that this was their goal, why did oil production actually nearly quadruple under their watch? That doesn't make any sense.

First there is nothing to assume. He said it.

[timschochet]

In 2008 Barack Obama told us he liked gasoline prices at $4 per gallon. Obama thought that along with destroying the coal industry, high oil prices would push us to use less energy and to drive electric cars and travel more by bicycle. In December 2008, when Obama was putting together his White House team, Dr. Steven Chu was selected to become Secretary of Energy. Prior to the General Election, Chu was even more enthusiastic about raising gasoline prices than was Obama, "Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe," Mr. Chu, who directs the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory in California, said in an interview with The Wall Street Journal in September.


http://m.lubbockonli...%E2%80%99s-plan

Assuming that this was their goal, why did oil production actually nearly quadruple under their watch? That doesn't make any sense.

First there is nothing to assume. He said it.

OK. But how would you answer my question?

[MTskibum]

In 2008 Barack Obama told us he liked gasoline prices at $4 per gallon. Obama thought that along with destroying the coal industry, high oil prices would push us to use less energy and to drive electric cars and travel more by bicycle. In December 2008, when Obama was putting together his White House team, Dr. Steven Chu was selected to become Secretary of Energy. Prior to the General Election, Chu was even more enthusiastic about raising gasoline prices than was Obama, "Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe," Mr. Chu, who directs the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory in California, said in an interview with The Wall Street Journal in September.


http://m.lubbockonli...%E2%80%99s-plan

Assuming that this was their goal, why did oil production actually nearly quadruple under their watch? That doesn't make any sense.

First there is nothing to assume. He said it.

OK. But how would you answer my question?

Oil wells are permitted and planned out years in advance. The oil wells being drilled now were permitted under a republican president.

[humpback]

In 2008 Barack Obama told us he liked gasoline prices at $4 per gallon. Obama thought that along with destroying the coal industry, high oil prices would push us to use less energy and to drive electric cars and travel more by bicycle. In December 2008, when Obama was putting together his White House team, Dr. Steven Chu was selected to become Secretary of Energy. Prior to the General Election, Chu was even more enthusiastic about raising gasoline prices than was Obama, "Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe," Mr. Chu, who directs the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory in California, said in an interview with The Wall Street Journal in September.


http://m.lubbockonli...%E2%80%99s-plan

Assuming that this was their goal, why did oil production actually nearly quadruple under their watch? That doesn't make any sense.

First there is nothing to assume. He said it.

OK. But how would you answer my question?

I'll answer your question- oil production hasn't nearly quadrupled under their watch, not even close.

[glumpy]

...he says that we can't lower prices by increased drilling, and anyone who says otherwise is not telling the truth...

I think he's right--because the program Sucks. The oil companies sell our oil to China and then we buy it for inflated prices from somewhere else.
The oil companies are no longer American--why the hell do we want to give them more of our oil??

[timschochet]

In 2008 Barack Obama told us he liked gasoline prices at $4 per gallon. Obama thought that along with destroying the coal industry, high oil prices would push us to use less energy and to drive electric cars and travel more by bicycle. In December 2008, when Obama was putting together his White House team, Dr. Steven Chu was selected to become Secretary of Energy. Prior to the General Election, Chu was even more enthusiastic about raising gasoline prices than was Obama, "Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe," Mr. Chu, who directs the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory in California, said in an interview with The Wall Street Journal in September.


http://m.lubbockonli...%E2%80%99s-plan

Assuming that this was their goal, why did oil production actually nearly quadruple under their watch? That doesn't make any sense.

First there is nothing to assume. He said it.

OK. But how would you answer my question?

Oil wells are permitted and planned out years in advance. The oil wells being drilled now were permitted under a republican president.

It still doesn't really answer the question. Whatever Obama's motivations were, we have more drilling now than we did when he took office. Yet oil prices keep rising. This at least suggests that there is no correlation between increased oil drilling and prices, no?

[timschochet]

In 2008 Barack Obama told us he liked gasoline prices at $4 per gallon. Obama thought that along with destroying the coal industry, high oil prices would push us to use less energy and to drive electric cars and travel more by bicycle. In December 2008, when Obama was putting together his White House team, Dr. Steven Chu was selected to become Secretary of Energy. Prior to the General Election, Chu was even more enthusiastic about raising gasoline prices than was Obama, "Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe," Mr. Chu, who directs the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory in California, said in an interview with The Wall Street Journal in September.


http://m.lubbockonli...%E2%80%99s-plan

Assuming that this was their goal, why did oil production actually nearly quadruple under their watch? That doesn't make any sense.

First there is nothing to assume. He said it.

OK. But how would you answer my question?

I'll answer your question- oil production hasn't nearly quadrupled under their watch, not even close.

I saw that figure reported on CNN. Do you have information which suggests otherwise?

[E Street Brat]

In 2008 Barack Obama told us he liked gasoline prices at $4 per gallon. Obama thought that along with destroying the coal industry, high oil prices would push us to use less energy and to drive electric cars and travel more by bicycle. In December 2008, when Obama was putting together his White House team, Dr. Steven Chu was selected to become Secretary of Energy. Prior to the General Election, Chu was even more enthusiastic about raising gasoline prices than was Obama, "Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe," Mr. Chu, who directs the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory in California, said in an interview with The Wall Street Journal in September.


http://m.lubbockonli...%E2%80%99s-plan

Assuming that this was their goal, why did oil production actually nearly quadruple under their watch? That doesn't make any sense.

First there is nothing to assume. He said it.

OK. But how would you answer my question?

Because he can't mandated ME oil output from Washington, like he can mandate the gulf of Mexico drilling would be my guess.

[Sarnoff]

anyone who says otherwise is not telling the truth.

Is he right?

You should note in his speech he also said, "In fact, we have always been at war with Eastasia."

[MTskibum]

In 2008 Barack Obama told us he liked gasoline prices at $4 per gallon. Obama thought that along with destroying the coal industry, high oil prices would push us to use less energy and to drive electric cars and travel more by bicycle. In December 2008, when Obama was putting together his White House team, Dr. Steven Chu was selected to become Secretary of Energy. Prior to the General Election, Chu was even more enthusiastic about raising gasoline prices than was Obama, "Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe," Mr. Chu, who directs the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory in California, said in an interview with The Wall Street Journal in September.


http://m.lubbockonli...%E2%80%99s-plan

Assuming that this was their goal, why did oil production actually nearly quadruple under their watch? That doesn't make any sense.

First there is nothing to assume. He said it.

OK. But how would you answer my question?

Oil wells are permitted and planned out years in advance. The oil wells being drilled now were permitted under a republican president.

It still doesn't really answer the question. Whatever Obama's motivations were, we have more drilling now than we did when he took office. Yet oil prices keep rising. This at least suggests that there is no correlation between increased oil drilling and prices, no?

I thought i covered this in a previous post. It costs more to produce oil now. Horizontal drilling, fracking, deeper depths, and drilling into geothermic regions that require expensive drilling fluid systems.

Not to mention new regulations on cleaning up and disposing drill cuttings that didnt exist a decade ago.

All of these add to the cost of oil.

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

... like he can mandate the gulf of Mexico drilling would be my guess.

The president can order international corporations to drill for oil?

[bigbottom]

Does anyone know what percentage of our domestic drilling is exported overseas?

Edited by bigbottom, 23 February 2012 - 06:39 PM.

[E Street Brat]

... like he can mandate the gulf of Mexico drilling would be my guess.

The president can order international corporations to drill for oil?

Actually I was talking about the drilling being shut down after the bp spill.
But he can order insurance company's on what they have to provide, so he probably thinks he can.

[Slapdash]

Are some of you really that ignorant about what is going on in Iran and Libya right now, and the concept of OPEC?

New here?

[hook014]

Are some of you really that ignorant about what is going on in Iran and Libya right now, and the concept of OPEC?

Prince Faud has said repeatedly over the last 5 yrs that he would like gas prices in the US to be between 2.50 and 2.75. The price that his advisors have assured him would preclude any forays into alternative energy. Who can forget him walking hand in hand with Bush telling the American public to fix their own house?

At this point I believe him more than any shill on Wall st. Supply and demand arguments have been immaterial for years.

More recently the Saudis have indicated to other OPEC members that they think $100/barrel is a good number.

They've made promises to increase production to meet any shortfall from Iran.

The Saudis have consistently dealt with projectable numbers designed to calm business markets. Yet they get no credit because we can't rein our people in.

Hence my utter contempt for Eric Holder.

Not sure I understand you here. What specifically would you like Holder to do?

Announce in the WSJ that his office was going to look hard into the oil markets and prosecute any speculators that were guilty of wrong doing or the appearance of market manipulation.

The threat of investigation is more than enough to dampen enthusiasm in market manipulation.

Look at it this way, as a small business man just the threat of an IRS audit is enough to make a crooked man fly straight. A clean operation pays a lot to get thru the process so it's expensive either way. Inviting that cost? Foolhardy.

So he wakes up every morning with this power, given by the citizenry to protect their interests and he does nothing. Potted plant.

[humpback]

I'll answer your question- oil production hasn't nearly quadrupled under their watch, not even close.

I saw that figure reported on CNN. Do you have information which suggests otherwise?

Try googling US Oil production by year. Or, use common sense- does it sound right to you that we've quadrupled the amount of oil produced in just 3 years?

Edited by humpback, 23 February 2012 - 06:47 PM.

[Slapdash]

I'll answer your question- oil production hasn't nearly quadrupled under their watch, not even close.

I saw that figure reported on CNN. Do you have information which suggests otherwise?

Try googling US Oil production by year. Or, use common sense- does it sound right to you that we've quadrupled the amount of oil produced in just 3 years?

Quit arguing with yourself

[urbanhack]

Does anyone know what percentage of our domestic drilling is exported overseas?

If it's too much, it's Holder's fault.

[humpback]

Quit arguing with yourself

That was odd!

Here Tim, I'll do the work for you.