I wasn't sure either. But he pretty clearly said, "The official party platform for the conservative party in this country" and "written into the Republican Party platform"
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Jordan Peterson Explains Why (Radical) Leftists Don't Like Facts (5/23/22 14:24 PST) (1 Viewer)
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I wasn't sure either. But he pretty clearly said, "The official party platform for the conservative party in this country" and "written into the Republican Party platform"
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
(HULK)
(Smash)
Well, much like I was saying right wing media oversells the trans stuff, left wing media does too, just in the other direction. Maybe not to the same extent, but it happens.
It has always been my nature to be skeptical, and in this day and age it's unfortunately a big asset because so few outlets present actual facts anymore.
(HULK)
(Smash)
That's 2016. Pretty sure they dropped it formally, either in 2020 or 2021, can't remember exactly.
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
The Republican National Platform is adopted every 4 years. In 2020, the RNC voted to re-adopt the 2016 platform, making no changes.
Sadly, it’s still the official Republican Party platform position to oppose gay marriage.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
As clueless and as much of a mess as the current GOP is, I'd be surprised if their latest platform clung to that, as that is a losing cause at this point in time. I think something like 70% of the population is now in favor of gay marriage, and my guess would be that the vast majority of the 30% still against it are because of some outdated religious beliefs based on a book (the Bible) that is loaded with contradictions.
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
Here’s the actual resolution in 2020, re-adopting the 2016 platform in full, with no edits, and specifically stating that the platform won’t change until the RNC Convention in 2024. https://prod-static.gop.com/media/RESOLUTION-REGARDING-THE-REPUBLICAN-PARTY-PLATFORM.pdf?_ga=2.118707402.295933178.1657465100-426196665.1657465100
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
That is disappointing and a little surprising, but par for the course for a party that is out of touch on too many issues already.
Looks like it was informal.
https://www.politico.com/news/2021/08/16/republicans-gay-marriage-wars-505041
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roadkill1292
Footballguy
The problem for the current GOP in updating its platform is that its leader is not willing to support a coherent ideological platform but instead insists on the platform being "whatever he wants that particular day."
The medical professions are adopting the principal that gender is what one thinks is the overriding principle and sexual organs are not that critical. And it is to the point where medical professions are even prohibited from second guessing their client and must accept their self-diagnosis even if they are children.
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
@Joe Bryant, clearly you, @(HULK), and @Ghost Rider were surprised to learn that the official Republican Platform is anti-gay marriage.
Why do you think folks like you 3, who are all smart and well informed, were unaware of such a blatant and express form of bigotry being the official position of the Republican Party on an issue so widely accepted by a majority of Americans?
What does it say about our society that liberal positions on transgender issues are becoming predominant wedge issues in elections and being heavily scrutinized, while something so egregious as continuing to officially oppose gay marriage is so underreported that we’ll informed folks don’t even know about it?
Why do you think folks like you 3, who are all smart and well informed, were unaware of such a blatant and express form of bigotry being the official position of the Republican Party on an issue so widely accepted by a majority of Americans?
What does it say about our society that liberal positions on transgender issues are becoming predominant wedge issues in elections and being heavily scrutinized, while something so egregious as continuing to officially oppose gay marriage is so underreported that we’ll informed folks don’t even know about it?
(HULK)
(Smash)
TBH, I don't really look at their platform because I'm not a Republican. I had read that they'd dropped it, and that some state party groups were doubling down on it as a result. Looks like the drop was informal though.
Trans issues will also have zero bearing on how I vote. Honestly, everything but preserving democracy is off my docket at the moment because none of the other stuff will matter if democracy dies.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
Same here. I am not Team Red or Team Blue, so I never read the official platforms, by either party.
It seems like more and more GOP politicians have come out as either in favor of gay marriage or not totally opposed to it (baby steps!), which is why I incorrectly assumed that the platform had reflected this.
Same. I don't normally dig through 40 page pdfs like that.
Especially since I understood this article to be the current reality. https://www.politico.com/news/2021/08/16/republicans-gay-marriage-wars-505041
Especially with the 2020 platform thrown together so haphazardly where they almost didn't even have an official platform. And then the practical reality being "There were openly gay officials working at the highest levels of the Trump administration. And in Congress, the gay rights movement has found allies in up and coming Republican stars like Rep. Dan Crenshaw (R-Texas), Rep. Elise Stefanik (R-N.Y.), and Rep. Young Kim (R-Calif.)."
Added that I know a good number of strong Conservatives and they feel exactly the same way.
I don't see any Conservatives I know claiming the Supreme Court is illegitimate after Obergefell v. Hodges. And I don't see anyone saying they'll defy the Supreme Court ruling. The one lady in Kentucky that refused to give a marriage license was widely hailed as crazy.
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Juxtatarot
Footballguy
It is certainly possible Obergefell will be overturned. Here’s an article: https://www.usnews.com/news/national-news/articles/2022-06-24/could-same-sex-marriage-go-the-way-of-abortion-at-the-supreme-court
The question then becomes would all 50 states still allow gay marriage? I’m skeptical.
Sure. Anything is possible. But I see zero energy among my conservative friends in overturning Obergefell v. Hodges or claiming the court was illegitimate after ruling. Or defying the ruling.
Where many of them had lots of interest in Roe v Wade.
dkp993
Footballguy
All this talk of platforms for the GOP I don’t really get. They functionally don’t matter. Right now the platform of the GOP is pro Trump MAGA type. And for them DEM’s it’s, we’re not Trump. Sure the details can be squabbled over but at the end of the day these are the core principles right now
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Sad but not far off.
It seems like:
Republicans - the other side is crazy & evil.
Democratics - the other side is evil & crazy.
As long as people hang on those, we get what we have.
I'm thankful we seem to sometimes have good discussion here.
dkp993
Footballguy
For sure. And to be clear I don’t want it to be this is way, it just is what it is at this point.
Agreed.
And I think the only way it gets better is if people make an effort themselves. I know you do that. We all can.
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
Joe, here’s mainstream conservative Republican Ted Cruz, denouncing Obergefell. If there’s anything I’m sure of in politics, it’s that Ted Cruz chooses his positions on issues based on where he thinks the Republican party is.
https://twitter.com/mikesington/status/1548417274163240963?s=21&t=veb1uwykzB0Dcr4cHZIAkg
The major differences between the crazies on each side is that the rightwing nuts are toothless, while the leftwing nuts run university departments and provide degrees and education to teachers and medical professions and human resource departments. And the radicals have taken over the censoring departments at Twitter, Amazon, Google, Facebook. The leftwing loons are far more impactful to everyday life.
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
Today, the vast majority of the Republicans in the House of Representatives voted against codifying same sex and interracial marriage into law. 157 no votes, only 47 votes in favor of the following bill (all Dems votes Yay):
“Introduced in House (07/18/2022)
Respect for Marriage Act
This bill provides statutory authority for same-sex and interracial marriages.
Specifically, the bill repeals and replaces provisions that define, for purposes of federal law, marriage as between a man and a woman and spouse as a person of the opposite sex with provisions that recognize any marriage that is valid under state law. (The Supreme Court held that the current provisions were unconstitutional in United States v. Windsor in 2013.)
The bill also repeals and replaces provisions that do not require states to recognize same-sex marriages from other states with provisions that prohibit the denial of full faith and credit or any right or claim relating to out-of-state marriages on the basis of sex, race, ethnicity, or national origin. (The Supreme Court held that state laws barring same-sex marriages were unconstitutional in Obergefell v. Hodges in 2015; the Court held that state laws barring interracial marriages were unconstitutional in Loving v. Virginia in 1967.) The bill allows the Department of Justice to bring a civil action and establishes a private right of action for violations.”
BladeRunner
Footballguy
Nice spin.
Even your own linked article doesn't justify your spin:
"The GOP waves white flag in the same-sex marriage wars
The Republican Party has moved on from one of the most seminal culture war debates, even as evangelicals fume."
Even Axios is telling you to go fly a kite with your fake spin:
"House passes bill to codify marriage equality with large bipartisan support"
There's a reason why this country is so divisive, and it's because of people like you who just want to fan the flames.
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squistion
Footballguy
157 no votes, only 47 votes in favor does not indicate wide bipartisan support among Republicans (over 3 to 1 against).
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BladeRunner
Footballguy
Go bake a cake.
You guys are THE SAME GUYS who call a bill "bipartisan" if you get only ONE republican to vote for it.
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
If same sex marriage is so accepted in the GOP, why did 77% of Republican House members vote against it today?Nice spin.
Even your own linked article doesn't justify your spin:
"The GOP waves white flag in the same-sex marriage wars
The Republican Party has moved on from one of the most seminal culture war debates, even as evangelicals fume."
Even Axios is telling you to go fly a kite with your fake spin:
"House passes bill to codify marriage equality with large bipartisan support"
There's a reason why this country is so divisive, and it's because of people like you who just want to fan the flames.
squistion
Footballguy
Grace Under Pressure
Footballguy
It’s a victory if it passes the Senate. Seems doubtful that it will. We’ll see. I’ll hold off declaring it either way until then.
BladeRunner
Footballguy
What do you think the votes would have been 5 years ago? 10 years ago? 20 years ago?
The problem with Progressives is they can never recognize progress. Stop being a Debbie Downer. Become part of the solution, don't be part of the problem.
dkp993
Footballguy
Let’s hope the Senate takes this advice, I will not be holding my breath. Otherwise this “progress” you’re touting will be completely meaningless.
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
I recognize progress, but it sure gets old dragging people to the position of (checks notes) equality. In 2022.What do you think the votes would have been 5 years ago? 10 years ago? 20 years ago?
The problem with Progressives is they can never recognize progress. Stop being a Debbie Downer. Become part of the solution, don't be part of the problem.
And by “progress”, we’re talking about having convinced 23% of House Republicans to favor gay marriage. 77% still oppose equality.
GordonGekko
Footballguy
https://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_votes/vote1042/vote_104_2_00280.htm#position
HR 3396 is DOMA. That's the 1996 Defense Of Marriage Act that 32 Democratic Senators ( yes including that flip flopper and pathological liar in Joe Biden) voted for and that President Bill Clinton (yes more Team Blue here) signed into law. DOMA said that marriage could only legally happen between a man and a woman. Remember that in the eyes of the law, marriage is a fiduciary relationship. In effect, DOMA removed all legal pathway for same sex marriage. Also 118 Democrats in the House voted for HR 3396.
HR 8408 is what you are talking about today. That repeals DOMA. That repeals what Bill Clinton (bizarrely a guy accused so many times of rape is never held to the fire over DOMA), 32 Blue Senators and 118 Blue Democrats in the HOR voted to support.
Where's your purity test now?
Those in Congress voted as they did for the same reasons why they always vote as they do
1) To please their corporate big donor overlords
2) To defend the best pathway for reelection in their respective districts.
Adam Kinzinger voted for HR 8404. He also widely denounced Trump and is on the J6 Select Committee. How was he rewarded? JB Pritzker, a Democratic Governor, gerrymandered Kinzinger's district into oblivion. The redistricting in Illinois looks like a baby seal was asked to carve a birthday cake with a chainsaw. But since it's Team Blue, no one talks about in the activist complicit MSM. Adam Kinzinger will soon no longer be in Congress because of Democrats, not Trump.
Elise Stefanik voted for HR 8404. She's the third ranking House Republican right now and will be the tip of the spear to impeach Joe Biden after the coming Mid Terms. She's also in New York. She also has to hold onto her own seat first and foremost.
Joe Manchin was the ONLY Democrat in the Senate who voted to approve Brett Kavanaugh to SCOTUS. Because he's in West Virginia which is heavy hard Red. That one move was likely what saved him the last time he was up for reelection.
Speaking of DOMA, Fritz Hollings, a Democrat, voted for it. Well he was in South Carolina. Most people didn't go after Hollings too hard most of the time because he served in WW2. But how would that play out in the culture and tone of South Carolina in the mid 90s if old Fritzy voted against DOMA?
Your cheap purity tests burns more Democrats across time than Republicans. Hilarious. I'm literally laughing right now in front of my laptop. If you were sitting in front of me now, I'd still be laughing. Go on, dig into the rules here at FBG where it says I can't laugh at you for running a purity test that RUNS BACKWARDS.
Cheap is one thing. Cheap without context and without skill is another.
If you've got such a hard on to fulfill your tribalism against Conservatives, how about doing something completely crazy like actually raising the level of discussion?
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
Your defense for 77% of House Republicans voting against marriage equality today is to bring up DOMA from 26 years ago?
Understandable, bigotry is ugly. Are you so Team GOP that you can’t just admit they’re wrong on this issue?
Grace Under Pressure
Footballguy
This is how it works. Lee Zeldin also had to vote yes. Hochul’s team already had the ad written if he voted no. If one goes rep by rep it makes more sense. Top leadership knew it would pass, they released members to vote how they needed.
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