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As a small business owner and CPA, zero. Small businesses don't start with the costs that corporations have for health care. There is no barrier to starting a small business in the form of having to pay employee health care costs.
You missed my entire first paragraph. Your link says this:
None of which is true because Apple affords all active staff with an opportunity to purchase company stock at a discount, to then be held or sold at the participant's discretion. Their employees are shareholders. That's true of many companies, it's a horrible false talking point.
I was responding to a comment that said corporate taxes are passed on to consumers.
Looking at it strictly from a financial/business owner standpoint and not a political one, why wouldn't I prefer to pay for that myself? I understand pools, etc. But while I may pay more as an individual for my insurance, it's also true our government isn't ever close to a dollar for dollar, 1:1 type benefit for what we pay in. Once I turn that over to the government, then I no longer have the ability to try and control those costs on my own and we have created another entitlement that will cause my company's taxes to need to be increased. In the net over time, I feel pretty sure I'd end up paying less by expensing my own health care costs and not facing increasing tax burdens to subsidize a new entitlement.
He didn't say "consumers", but if you interpreted it that way I'm not sure why you provided the link that you did. That link didn't have anything to do with consumers.
I’ll pay more taxes so more people can have access to school, clean water, housing, and food. I’m good with that.
Right. Because decreasing corporate taxes didn’t have any effect on consumer pricing. Which was my point.
Your link didn't even attempt address consumer pricing. Your link was no proof of that.
Do you think corporate taxes are tied to consumer pricing?Your link didn't even attempt address consumer pricing. Your link was no proof of that.
And what your link did report on was completely false anyway.
If I write a check to the government, will they just use it to lower corporate taxes?
Sure. I mean, you're already under the impression that if you pay higher taxes in your regular tax returns that they will go to the right causes. And yet every year they want more.
This is where I am. That's why when you ask a politician who talks about people paying their "fair share", that term is never defined numerically. They never want a number out there so that there is no cap for going back to that well. We've also slipped into adding things to the list that we want the government providing minimum standards for. I suspect we are going to see a further call for government to provide certain standards of housing beyond what it does today. Our entitlement state is growing and therefore there will never be an answer to "fair share" because the number will always need to grow and it will never be enough to fund the next project.
How about we just get some more taxpayers? There are a lot of people begging to come here and pay taxes. Around 11M already live here.
Right, but when we have the government programs we are discussing, there isn't just an income side to the equation. I'm assuming most of these workers would be at the bottom of the wage scale, so our incremental cost of adding someone to the government services would be greater than the revenue we would take in.
I think this is a great place for a discussion - probably a different thread. We spend most of our tax dollars on people under age 18 and over 65. Letting in more H1B and young families should be net positive. And should solve the employment issues, plus stimulate demand. I liked Bryan Caplan’s work on the issue.
So the $6K that I am spending for a dislocated shoulder has already been spoke for.
Apple is the last company to hold out as the typical company affected here and pointing them out as the epitome of company response is disingenuous. Raising taxes on a grocery store at 3% margin is massively different than the most atypical company out there (AAPL), which is at 70-80% margins.
For every additional dollar I make above $400K, you can tax me at 60%. Currently all of my income is spoken for paying for things that should be covered by our taxes but are not.This doesn't answer my questions.
Can you answer them, please?
Why 400K? Why not lower? Lemme guess - you make under 400K?
I thought I was addressing your questions - let me know which ones I am missing.
This is such a mind-numbingly stupid argument. If we are going to fix the budget we all need to be in it together, not just a handful of middle class individuals who want us to be fiscally responsible.
In my case, not speaking for @BladeRunner, count me in for being fiscally responsible. If you're expecting me to be in to foot the bill to help fix our current shortfall, which is huge, it's at least a fair discussion. The folks in government advocating for it should show us the budget shortfall and show us the percentages we need to fix it. I'm not naive enough to think we can get there on spending cuts alone. But that is not what is being asked of us and promoted by those on the left today.
I’d like to see us cut government spending overall, but there is zero chance that alone will cure the budget deficit. The reality is that we need spending cuts and increased revenue. The whole “our tax cut will be budget neutral due to increased GDP as a result of our tax cuts” never works.
These are probably the most accurate and genuine posts I've seen on this topic in a while and I find myself nodding along to both. However, this is NOT unique to "left" principles. There is no question that what is being asked of the left today isn't going to help our deficits/debt. It's equally true that what the "right" asks (cut taxes and continue spending as it is, and in many instances raise spending) is EQUALLY problematic. There HAS to be a budget. Without looking it up, does anyone here know the last time we had an actual budget set and passed by Congress? That fact alone should tell us every single thing we need to know about our government politicians' attitude towards our money and it's a shared attitude NOT unique to one side or the other.
I know you and I go back and forth a lot and, IMO, I wish I would see more of these types of posts than the antagonistic ones that you, I and others engage in far too much.
meh...we see what we want to see on these boards. What I've outlined here is probably the 50th time I've done it. I get it, you don't like Democrats and their spending. It's merely the other side of the coin from the GOP and their "cut taxes and keep spending" approach. Until we can agree on that, there isn't much we will agree on. This entire post is focused on the Democrats. That's not going to get us anywhere. Come talk to me when you are this passionate about spending and the GOP is proposing tax cuts for the rich and businesses while continuing to spend at established levels. Both approaches are incredibly dangerous and I've called them out every single time they happen. I don't remember many on the "conservative" side of things bagging on the tax grift that happened in 2018. It was justified as "needed to stimulate the economy". That was as much nonsense as "hey, I have this new entitlement I want to do and am going to raise your taxes while I do it WHILE the debt spirals out of control".BladeRunner said:
Thank you very much for your great post. Seriously.
While I definitely feel we already do pay higher taxes than we already should, I also understand the incredible failure of our elected officials in controlling our budget and spending. I would accept a slight increase if I knew 100% that the revenue driven from those increases would go towards paying off our debt and getting this under control, but I know it won't. Our elected officials will see this "new revenue" as more spending money (ESPECIALLY the democrats, IMO) and send us further down the hole. So that is why I'm opposed to raising taxes again. If someone feels they aren't paying enough then they should stop talking and start paying more out of their own volition. Those who can do - those who can't talk
It's about time we stop asking citizens to pay MORE and we start demanding our elected officials to spend LESS.
I will not support more entitlement programs and welfare as we already have enough (and too many, IMO). Absolutely not. So when the left proposes ridiculous and unsustainable Green New Deals and Universal Healthcare and more absurd entitlement programs it rankles my skin. How about we pay off our other #### first before we start looking at "new stuff"?
1996KiddLattimer said:
and a massive cut of this all goes to the consultant class who just fundraises off the boogie monsters in the other party
Income taxes aren't the only taxes. Total tax burden matters a lot more than just "income" taxes.
. Even better. 