BobbyLayne
Footballguy
It would have been fine to use income (the rake) for operating expenses. To use restricted cash for Capital Expenditure OTOH...wait, nobody actually believes the cover story amirite?
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.
Phenoms going under (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter JohnW1970
- Start date
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
Okay, the whitepages lists a Michael D. Zangrilli that lives in UT, and used to live in PA.
http://www.whitepages.com/name/Michael-Zangrilli
I also found an obituary from PA that was an elder Zangrilli and listed a Michael as a grandson of the deceased.
http://www.legacy.com/obituaries/postgazette/obituary.aspx?pid=172641309
So the name might be real or at least have some real roots.
That whitepages link also for whatever reason says that he "knows" a Neil C. Argyle, who is a medical student in Seattle?
http://www.vitals.com/doctors/Dr_Neil_Argyle.html
Probably unrelated....unless that's "Mike" and he's paying off some medical school debt with the prize money.
http://www.whitepages.com/name/Michael-Zangrilli
I also found an obituary from PA that was an elder Zangrilli and listed a Michael as a grandson of the deceased.
http://www.legacy.com/obituaries/postgazette/obituary.aspx?pid=172641309
So the name might be real or at least have some real roots.
That whitepages link also for whatever reason says that he "knows" a Neil C. Argyle, who is a medical student in Seattle?
http://www.vitals.com/doctors/Dr_Neil_Argyle.html
Probably unrelated....unless that's "Mike" and he's paying off some medical school debt with the prize money.
Last edited by a moderator:
If you add up the total leagues for this year + the approx deposits for dynasty/keeper leagues, he just stole somewhere in the neighborhood of 1.1 MILLION dollars
And if he had the paypal accounts linked with a fraudulent account that he liquidated, he could do a lot..
Dizzy
Footballguy
Very strange. Unless they changed the grid system overnight, Google Maps shows an LDS church in the area of that address.
ILUVBEER99
Footballguy
have any of these larger league operations not ended up scams?
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Review from TrustPilot.com:
Last edited by a moderator:
steelerfan1
Footballguy
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
So, has anyone actually replied to the email? I have to assume no one has heard back from him, if they had?
ILUVBEER99
Footballguy
no idea. after the WCOFF went under which was the most respected fantasy event in the industry all bets were off.
Just crazy to see the WCOFF, AntSports, Phenoms, Misfits, etc all ending up badly.
LeagueSafe also seems a bit shady, they removed money out of my account and when i complained just acted like no big deal and put it back. I heard others had same issue so assume a lot of people didn't realize their money disappeared and league safe just kept it.
Army Eye
Footballguy
Can't argue with anything in that review. It's all true. He built trust, that's for sure.
I just so hope he doesn't get away with this. I don't even care if I don't get my payouts. This guy just needs to go down.
TheWick
Footballguy
Does anyone remember turfwar?
It was the first daily site and it ended a lot like this.
FYI - guys whose face was all over Turfwar website is none other than the leaguesafe founder Paul Charchian.
I'm not sayin... I'm just sayin
ILUVBEER99
Footballguy
it was only like $68 i had left in there over the offseason but still BS. Was extremely pissed how they just brushed if off like nothing and tried to make it look like i did something. i hadn't even logged into the account from when i was paid in December and when i checked the account before this season in mid-Fed to see no money in it.. Another guy in my league said it happened to him as well.
They did give me the money back right away but what if i wouldn't have noticed?
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
I'm in agreement with those saying that while the losing money aspect of it does suck, it really sucks to lose these leagues. I did love the way the guy ran his leagues and I hate to see my keeper team I built fall by the wayside.
Back to the money, I play for fun and for chump change ($100 leagues), so I cannot imagine how enraged those who in the more expensive leagues he had are.
Back to the money, I play for fun and for chump change ($100 leagues), so I cannot imagine how enraged those who in the more expensive leagues he had are.
Chili Cheese Burrito
Footballguy
I just hope no one is thinking they will get paid anything. PayPal probably already has his account locked down from the chargebacks. His account will be bigtime negative, with the account locked down he cannot send money out. Its restricted. He wont be able to send money until the negative balance is resolved. Basically the only way you will see money is to file a dispute with your card issuer.
cstu
Footballguy
Paul Charchian joined our league after our commish was able to quit the league in the middle of the season and get a refund. He's a respected member of fantasy community and I doubt he needs the
What I don't understand about these scams is why they are necessary - sites should be making enough off interest to run them. The only reason they should fail is if the funds are being put into high risk investment such as stocks.
msudaisy26
Footballguy
My guess is person wanted to supplement their retirement when they came up with this scheme, they have probably been looking to cash out for the last few years, but were waiting for the big year and finally decided this was it.
I have a hard time thinking it was a bad business decision from someone that has run the company this long.
Lastly the thing that throws up a red flag for me now is that someone said he ran this business by himself, but that is easy to say after the fact.
I have a hard time thinking it was a bad business decision from someone that has run the company this long.
Lastly the thing that throws up a red flag for me now is that someone said he ran this business by himself, but that is easy to say after the fact.
Alberta Clipper
Footballguy
I thought I knew Mike for 10+ yrs in the fantasy football circle.
I've played in 2-4 of his Phenoms every year going back to his Greek days.
He's played in 2 of my keeper leagues for 8-10+ yrs.
I've even shared a high stakes team with him in prior years.
I was really hoping someone hacked his identity/site, etc and this was a cruel joke but I know that's not likely.
The 2 leagues I played on Phenoms are auction salary keeper so building for a couple years to this point sucks.
In prior years I would chat online with Mike often but I scaled back my FF this year and didn't share a team with him in any higher stakes leagues so less reason to chat Sept-Dec.
All I know is Mike is real and up to this point has always been very honest and upfront commish.
He used to be a bartender in SLC. Other than that I don't know too much about him.
I know he discussed his plan to develop his own site to replace the MFL side of things and the delays so I believe that to be real. I just don't think anyone would get into a situation where they would give 600+ K of current deposits for a project not completed/tested that was 2-3x over budget.
I'm at a loss and this might just end fantasy football for many including me.
More sad than pissed just numb right now...
I've played in 2-4 of his Phenoms every year going back to his Greek days.
He's played in 2 of my keeper leagues for 8-10+ yrs.
I've even shared a high stakes team with him in prior years.
I was really hoping someone hacked his identity/site, etc and this was a cruel joke but I know that's not likely.
The 2 leagues I played on Phenoms are auction salary keeper so building for a couple years to this point sucks.
In prior years I would chat online with Mike often but I scaled back my FF this year and didn't share a team with him in any higher stakes leagues so less reason to chat Sept-Dec.
All I know is Mike is real and up to this point has always been very honest and upfront commish.
He used to be a bartender in SLC. Other than that I don't know too much about him.
I know he discussed his plan to develop his own site to replace the MFL side of things and the delays so I believe that to be real. I just don't think anyone would get into a situation where they would give 600+ K of current deposits for a project not completed/tested that was 2-3x over budget.
I'm at a loss and this might just end fantasy football for many including me.
More sad than pissed just numb right now...
Milkman
Footballguy
That's what i don't understand. 10-20% off the top and then add interest. Seems like good money once you get established.
Craig_MiamiFL
Footballguy
Looks like he did same with Twitter. (Deactivated the account & deleted all tweets)
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:wIbWc3oLPdoJ:https://twitter.com/unluckyz+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us
When you're deleting off Twitter/Facebook accounts, you can't really expect people to believe their will be an open line of communication via email.
Huge blow to the FBG community. Guy had gained as much trust as any commissioner here.
Last edited by a moderator:
Hooper31
Footballguy
I don't mind saying Mike was good people. He did a great job getting his dream job started and took a risk. It failed. Sucks for everyone involved. As confidently as I would support Mike, it would bewith equal enthusiasm I would let the world know I think you're a piece of####.
So you actually hung out with him in person?
I know "Mike" is an actual guy, I just don't believe he is who he says he is..
Never joined any of these because of the 10~20% cut but any site is not making any money off the interest these days. Its not 2006 level interest rates. Even if he has a million in deposits he'd only be making a few thousand in interest over a three to four month period. Now taking 10% off the top for every league, that's a nice gig.
Also put me in the camp that doesn't trust any of these daily sites, fantasy championship sweepstakes or leaguesafe for that matter anymore.
Also put me in the camp that doesn't trust any of these daily sites, fantasy championship sweepstakes or leaguesafe for that matter anymore.
Alberta Clipper
Footballguy
Just to clarify - I've never met Mike in person. As my post said he was someone I knew from fantasy football like 100's others in FBG family.
FBG staffers even played in Phenoms leagues so this is shocking. Mike 'had' a clean rep which was his biggest selling feature.
FBG staffers even played in Phenoms leagues so this is shocking. Mike 'had' a clean rep which was his biggest selling feature.
I know no one believes the developer story...
But, he said had the developers finished on-time he would have had no problem paying out...
How is that exactly? I get having software would eliminate the need for myfantasyleague, but that is a one-time fee upfront at the beginning of the season..
Soooo…. what happened to the other $967,000?
But, he said had the developers finished on-time he would have had no problem paying out...
How is that exactly? I get having software would eliminate the need for myfantasyleague, but that is a one-time fee upfront at the beginning of the season..
Soooo…. what happened to the other $967,000?
I played in a No Mercy league with Mike Zangrilli in 2002, which was before he even contemplated starting Phenoms, I believe. He had no reason to use a fake name at that point. I'm pretty sure that's his real name.
Raiderfan32904
Footballguy
Last edited by a moderator:
Yamato
Footballguy
After taking 3 years off from fantasy football I decided to come back. Put in $1k into Mikes leagues since I've known him from the Greek league days. Got a 3 year subscription to this site and was ready to roll. Now this. Mike did say during a draft in early September that next year we wouldn't have to worry about some of the quirks in MFL drafting. I don't think at that point he was scamming. Can't really say what he was thinking afterwards. Bottom line it's bad business. Spending $200k to improve drafting isn't worth it. Drafting on MFL wasn't great but after 2 hours or so it was done. Guess Mike wanted something he didn't have to micromanage.
Regarding where Mike lives (and I hope no one is looking for a face to face) I thought he lived in Arizona. Maybe the Utah address was just for tax reasons.
Regarding where Mike lives (and I hope no one is looking for a face to face) I thought he lived in Arizona. Maybe the Utah address was just for tax reasons.
AZhardballz
Footballguy
Well I just got an email from him since I responded to his doomsday announcement:
I will have more information for you in the coming days and weeks about claiming any money you have with Phenoms, whether as deposits for dynasty/keeper leagues, prize winnings, or other funds. Unfortunately, I can’t provide specifics at this time as we continue to work diligently through potential resolution strategies.
Mike
I will have more information for you in the coming days and weeks about claiming any money you have with Phenoms, whether as deposits for dynasty/keeper leagues, prize winnings, or other funds. Unfortunately, I can’t provide specifics at this time as we continue to work diligently through potential resolution strategies.
Mike
howatzer
Footballguy
Ignoratio Elenchi
Footballguy
Apples and oranges really. I never played in any of these phenoms leagues, or anything like it, but if you give your money to "some guy" like the one who ran these leagues, no matter how trustworthy he makes himself seem through message board posts or whatever, this end result isn't all that surprising.
FanDuel is an actual company with tens of millions of dollars in investor funding and over a hundred employees in multiple offices. I'm less familiar with DK but I'm sure they're similar. I've played on FD for a couple years and have no concerns. It's an actual business, not some guy in a
Last edited by a moderator:
The Scorpion
Footballguy
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Some facts: FD has 80 employees in Edinborogh (HQ) and NYC. They've taken down $80M in four rounds of VC financing over five years, and "are nearing profitability."
Fariq
Footballguy
Dinsy Ejotuz
Footballguy
What would be ideal is for one of the player associations to work with law enforcement on one of these cases and put someone's head on a stake high enough for the rest of the community to see.
Don't really care how/why it happens.
Don't really care how/why it happens.
buck naked
Footballguy
It's all public information based on what he filed with the Utah Secretary of State. Nothing unwise about it at all. Considering that Mike is trying to and succeeding in deleting his social network and other information, adb255 is doing people a service.
fatness
Footballguy
You do not go from spending $200,000 to spending $630,000 in one "screwup". It takes a series of decisions to spend more money, including decisions to dip into the prize pool and spend that money. It takes conscious decisions to spend money from other people which you've told them is held securely by Wells Fargo and Paypal.
If the explanation given is even true.
And that is if the story given is true.
Sorry if this has already been posted. Looks like this link lists Zangrilli as a staff member at FBG at some point - http://apps.footballguys.com/staff.htm. Does that increase the chance he is a real person and not an alias?
As with WCOFF,Fantasy Jungle, Antsports, and the like, i regret to inform you that you will not see any money whatsoever. I lost thousands when these entities went under. I was the first to post about Fantasy Jungle, and the mods moved my post from the Shark pool to "looking for leagues", not believing this could actually happen.
Fantasy Jungle was the absolute worst case, taking entries for a college bowl contest when they already knew they couldnt pay regular season winners. When i "WON" the bowl contest for $2k, and started to get the runaround when i questioned when i would be paid, the writing was on the wall. The owners had even entered their own WCOFF and FFPC that season, surely with our money.
I looked at all avenues of redress, i was mostly interested in criminal prosecution because it was obviously fraud on a grand scale. There would never be any money, because even if they got convicted of crimes, they would never have the money for restitution. A civil judgment is useless, can and would be wiped out in bankruptcy. I emailed Mike yesterday when i got the email....he responded with...."call or write to my lawyer..." for any further inquiry.
My advice is to bombard appropriate law enforcement agencies until something is done...which it never was as far as i know with the aforementioned culprits. WCOFF sought bankruptcy protection, the FJ guys just dissappeared.
As for FanDuel, DraftKings, etc, I am predicting that as congress sees this multi billion dollar gambling industry exploding even more, they will be taking a close look at it if they havent already. Like the poker sights, if the govt shuts them down you also arent going to see any of your money. As a result, i keep a few hundred bucks in those accts, but will never allow more than that to be at risk.
As we say ,govern yourselves accordingly.
Fantasy Jungle was the absolute worst case, taking entries for a college bowl contest when they already knew they couldnt pay regular season winners. When i "WON" the bowl contest for $2k, and started to get the runaround when i questioned when i would be paid, the writing was on the wall. The owners had even entered their own WCOFF and FFPC that season, surely with our money.
I looked at all avenues of redress, i was mostly interested in criminal prosecution because it was obviously fraud on a grand scale. There would never be any money, because even if they got convicted of crimes, they would never have the money for restitution. A civil judgment is useless, can and would be wiped out in bankruptcy. I emailed Mike yesterday when i got the email....he responded with...."call or write to my lawyer..." for any further inquiry.
My advice is to bombard appropriate law enforcement agencies until something is done...which it never was as far as i know with the aforementioned culprits. WCOFF sought bankruptcy protection, the FJ guys just dissappeared.
As for FanDuel, DraftKings, etc, I am predicting that as congress sees this multi billion dollar gambling industry exploding even more, they will be taking a close look at it if they havent already. Like the poker sights, if the govt shuts them down you also arent going to see any of your money. As a result, i keep a few hundred bucks in those accts, but will never allow more than that to be at risk.
As we say ,govern yourselves accordingly.
fatness
Footballguy
Written for him by a lawyer, probably the same response everyone will get, giving you no information at all.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
everyone is a scammer
sheesh
just wait, fanduel, all that crap will rip everyone off if they are not already
sheesh
just wait, fanduel, all that crap will rip everyone off if they are not already
