The Trump Years- Every day something more shocking than the last! (6 Viewers)

[adonis]

I think Dodds is fed up with our libtard arrogance and is just trolling us. I can understand that a little, I do it with sanctimonious nabobs who support colleges' refusal to let their athletes make any money. 

My theory is that there's a lot of money to be made in online fake news, and he's trying to perfect his persona by sharpening it against a bunch of folks who will react.

Soon he'll launch some fake news site like patriotguys.com and make more money that way than he does with this site.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

The snowflakes threatening to cancel footballguys.com subscriptions again?

Quez, read your own article.

In terms of facts reported, there's nothing improper there. What specifically are you claiming?

 

[The Commish]

This is bigger than Watergate.  What scumbags.  I can't wait for the swamp to be drained.

http://dailycaller.com/2017/04/03/susan-rice-ordered-spy-agencies-to-produce-detailed-spreadsheets-involving-trump/

Welcome aboard.  You're work starts now for the midterms.  This is where we can at least get the plug pulled from the drain.  The heavy lifting will happen in four years where we attempt to actually turn off the faucet.

It's been interesting to watch the reality of Trump set in.  Seeing is believing I suppose.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Mine has three Russian exit nodes if I need them.

Who is this author again?

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Before the election, Trump critics claimed more and more that Trump had connections to foreign spies, oligarchs and criminals.

In November. Trump critics posted articles saying Trump was under investigation for connections to foreign spies, oligarchs and criminals.

In April, Trump supporters post articles saying Trump was under investigation for connections to foreign spies, oligarchs and criminals.

Ok, keep us updated, thanks.

 

[Mene]

That's fair, and it's certainly your right.

Personally, I draw the line with bigots, racists, anti-Semites, etc. I won't go see a Mel Gibson movie, for instance. But guys like Dodds I tend to regard as well-meaning crackpots. So they don't bother me so much.

I used to have a similar line, Tim.  I used to dismiss and chuckle at conspiracy theorists.  They were even entertaining occasionally.  Then they got the White House, and I realized it was time to move my line.

 

[McGarnicle]

Michelle Goldberg makes the same point I made here yesterday: if the stories about Susan Rice are true, then good for Rice: she was doing her job: 

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2017/04/i_hope_susan_rice_was_keeping_tabs_on_trump_s_russia_ties.html

I'm more than okay if the FBI had a standard policy to perform a deep investigation into every candidate for president, and their families, friends and staff. Never felt it necessary before, but we're seeing Trump challenge every assumption we had about the minimum standards Americans would tolerate in a president. Likewise it should now be mandatory to release tax returns, and throw out the first pitch on opening day. 

 

[cobalt_27]

Before the election, Trump critics claimed more and more that Trump had connections to foreign spies, oligarchs and criminals.

In November. Trump critics posted articles saying Trump was under investigation for connections to foreign spies, oligarchs and criminals.

In April, Trump supporters post articles saying Trump was under investigation for connections to foreign spies, oligarchs and criminals.

Ok, keep us updated, thanks.

It's reached that bizarre state where Trump supporters are giddy and excited to know evidence might exist that proves Trump was collaborating with the Russians to hijack the election.  

Not very bright, this group.

 

[Koya]

But you're not paying him for the FFA. What you're paying him for is completely unrelated to this.

Tim, it feels as if your are trying to be a bit too Pollyanna here. 

Dodds has all the right in the world to spout whatever conspiracies and dangerous propoganda he wants here. Maybe he really believes it, maybe it's actually somehow a part of this information dissemination system the Russians have so thoughtfully and successfully developed. Maybe he's an unwitting stooge or an informed actor in his efforts. Either way, it's his right.

But, as noted, we are free to point out the objective ridiculous nature of these claims. 

My biggest issue is not even with what Dodds or others who use the same tactics say, but rather what they don't say. Their unwillingness to answer a direct question and their sheer unfiltered and unsubstantiated bravado making wild claims, without the courage to stand by those statements, provide legitimate sources and objective backing. Hell, often they simply avoid answering simple questions altogether.

if it's just some random poster doing this whatever. We can disregard their comments, understand they command no respect by their own words and actions here and carry on. 

When it's a part owner of the site that hosts this forum, and you use these base, baseless and as I mentioned often cowardly approaches of avoidance/deflection, then at least recognize you will be viewed differently, at least by those deciding where to spend their discretionary income. 

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

I'm more than okay if the FBI had a standard policy to perform a deep investigation into every candidate for president, and their families, friends and staff. Never felt it necessary before, but we're seeing Trump challenge every assumption we had about the minimum standards Americans would tolerate in a president. Likewise it should now be mandatory to release tax returns, and throw out the first pitch on opening day. 

Trump already had a thick FBI file dating at least to the late 80s when he met with the Politburo staff and traveled to the USSR begging to meet Gorbachev.

 

[cobalt_27]

Tim, it feels as if your are trying to be a bit too Pollyanna here. 

Dodds has all the right in the world to spout whatever conspiracies and dangerous propoganda he wants here. Maybe he really believes it, maybe it's actually somehow a part of this information dissemination system the Russians have so thoughtfully and successfully developed. Maybe he's an unwitting stooge or an informed actor in his efforts. Either way, it's his right.

But, as noted, we are free to point out the objective ridiculous nature of these claims. 

My biggest issue is not even with what Dodds or others who use the same tactics say, but rather what they don't say. Their unwillingness to answer a direct question and their sheer unfiltered and unsubstantiated bravado making wild claims, without the courage to stand by those statements, provide legitimate sources and objective backing. Hell, often they simply avoid answering simple questions altogether.

if it's just some random poster doing this whatever. We can disregard their comments, understand they command no respect by their own words and actions here and carry on. 

When it's a part owner of the site that hosts this forum, and you use these base, baseless and as I mentioned often cowardly approaches of avoidance/deflection, then at least recognize you will be viewed differently, at least by those deciding where to spend their discretionary income. 

 

[Koya]

1 hour ago, Ramblin Wreck said:You don't seem to have issues with aliases you agree with.  

I have issues with anyone hiding behind fake fake names. 

That said, until this thread I never gave much concern over aliai. I mean who really cares... but here there seems to be a specific tactic of certain posters many of which suddenly pop up with new names... some who have been banned before, some who may (may) have been responsible for trolling in the past TK a point where literally beloved and really nice people who used to post in this board felt personally threatened to a point of leaving this community altogether. 

If you can point out where I've supported anyone who has these questionable characteristics, please do let me know because it's childish at best, immature #######ry, purposeful baiting, disruption and at times real life harassment at worse. 

FWIW, there is actually quite literally an information and propaganda war going on. It wouldnt surprise me if some of the actors that have sought to influence conversations on other platforms are not also at work to some degree here. The constant parroting and style suggests that may not even be a stretch. My initial reaction is that itself sounds like a conspiracy theory, except it's been proven that foreign agents managed by Russian apparatus have been doing just that.

so, the alias stakes are a bit highrr in this thread, especially if indeed formerly banned folks and others who did try to harm other innocent posters here may be part and parcel to that vocal subset of posters all with similar styles in this thread. 

 

[jonessed]

It's pretty ironic that people who believe our president is a Russian mole are ridiculing conspiracy theories.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

It's pretty ironic that people who believe our president is a Russian mole are ridiculing conspiracy theories.

Read that DiGenova piece.

It claims that Trump's own Director of NSA authorized analysis of call logs involving Trump. Ok, and?

 

[belljr]

Serious question as I really don't follow politics until this circus started?

Does the White House usually have this many press conferences" ?

 

[jonessed]

Read that DiGenova piece.

It claims that Trump's own Director of NSA authorized analysis of call logs involving Trump. Ok, and?

And what?

 

[TobiasFunke]

It's pretty ironic that people who believe our president is a Russian mole are ridiculing conspiracy theories.

It's pretty ironic that people who support or defend Donald Trump, President of the United States are ridiculing anyone for anything.

 

[adonis]

It's pretty ironic that people who believe our president is a Russian mole are ridiculing conspiracy theories.

It's pretty ironic that folks who want to dig into tons of conspiracy theories on little to no evidence want to wave their hands and dismiss all of the circumstantial evidence that causes folks to ask questions about Trump's Russian connections.  

Few folks are saying he's a mole, many folks are concerned that there are so many deep and disturbing connections between Trump, his campaign/associates, and Russia.

It's understandable that you may want to call it a conspiracy theory, but most folks are pretty well grounded in reason on this and aren't making huge leaps unwarranted by what we know.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

And what?

Ha, ok I guess the inquiry is over.

This is a definitive example of, 1. Underpants, 2. ???, 3. Profit.

 

[apalmer]

It's pretty ironic that people who believe our president is a Russian mole are ridiculing conspiracy theories.

Link to anyone saying Trump is a mole?  Being a mole requires a level of intelligence far beyond what any of the anti-Trump posters attribute to him.  A dupe, maybe. A mole, no way.

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

I have issues with anyone hiding behind fake fake names. 

That said, until this thread I never gave much concern over aliai. I mean who really cares... but here there seems to be a specific tactic of certain posters many of which suddenly pop up with new names... some who have been banned before, some who may (may) have been responsible for trolling in the past TK a point where literally beloved and really nice people who used to post in this board felt personally threatened to a point of leaving this community altogether. 

If you can point out where I've supported anyone who has these questionable characteristics, please do let me know because it's childish at best, immature #######ry, purposeful baiting, disruption and at times real life harassment at worse. 

FWIW, there is actually quite literally an information and propaganda war going on. It wouldnt surprise me if some of the actors that have sought to influence conversations on other platforms are not also at work to some degree here. The constant parroting and style suggests that may not even be a stretch. My initial reaction is that itself sounds like a conspiracy theory, except it's been proven that foreign agents managed by Russian apparatus have been doing just that.

so, the alias stakes are a bit highrr in this thread, especially if indeed formerly banned folks and others who did try to harm other innocent posters here may be part and parcel to that vocal subset of posters all with similar styles in this thread. 

Koya is a fake name. 

And  at high stakes.  It's a football forum and you take yourself way too seriously.  99% of this thread is trolling nonsense. 

 

[Koya]

It's pretty ironic that people who believe our president is a Russian mole are ridiculing conspiracy theories.

Who here do you think "believes the President is a Russian Mole"

Not someone who questions his many ties to Russia, Putin and their agents 

not shady businsss dealings which may have exposed Trump to being extorted - or just driven by selfish and narcissistic desires for self over nation 

not that Trumps associates may be colluding with and possibly working on behalf of the Russians

nor even that Trump may have been indirectly or directly involved with and/or had knowledge about colliding with the Russians to improve his electoral showing...

because none of the above is "mole" - but it appears not everyone wants to be bound by legitimate discourse where words and their meanings, matter. 

FYI - while I don't know of a poster who has said Trump "is a mole", there is still more evidence to support even that outlandish contention than almost every conspiracy pushed by the parrots of the alt-right.  Not enough evidence to make most of us think he's an actual mole, but to be fair, there's at least smoke under that particular contention. 

 

[Northern Voice]

But you're not paying him for the FFA. What you're paying him for is completely unrelated to this.

Paying someone who believes in pizzagate, etc.. for critical thinking/analysis just doesn't seem like a wise investment to me

 

[jonessed]

Ha, ok I guess the inquiry is over.

This is a definitive example of, 1. Underpants, 2. ???, 3. Profit.

You aren't making any sense.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Serious question as I really don't follow politics until this circus started?

Does the White House usually have this many press conferences" ?

You mean Spicer's daily press briefings?  Yes, that's normal.  But in the past they've usually been pretty boring.

 

[jonessed]

Who here do you think "believes the President is a Russian Mole"

Not someone who questions his many ties to Russia, Putin and their agents 

not shady businsss dealings which may have exposed Trump to being extorted - or just driven by selfish and narcissistic desires for self over nation 

not that Trumps associates may be colluding with and possibly working on behalf of the Russians

nor even that Trump may have been indirectly or directly involved with and/or had knowledge about colliding with the Russians to improve his electoral showing...

because none of the above is "mole" - but it appears not everyone wants to be bound by legitimate discourse where words and their meanings, matter. 

FYI - while I don't know of a poster who has said Trump "is a mole", there is still more evidence to support even that outlandish contention than almost every conspiracy pushed by the parrots of the alt-right.  Not enough evidence to make most of us think he's an actual mole, but to be fair, there's at least smoke under that particular contention. 

You do.

 

[Henry Ford]

For the left to consider themselves tolerant is a joke.  Anyone dare offer a different opinion, you can't do business with them, you can't have a civil discussion with them, you don't let them speak, you boycott their state.  Are you really that so wrapped up in your ideology that it is so difficult to have an association with someone who thinks differently.  And you think religious people are intolerant.  Good god.  Easily the most intolerant people I know are on the left. 

Yeah, I don't know. "I can't even talk to you anymore" vs. "I'm going to pass a Law that says if you have sex with the person you love you go to prison" seem like disparate levels of intolerance. 

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

You aren't making any sense.

Jones, I'm taking the article seriously. What is wrong with what is reported?

There's nothing political in that article.

Trump's own Dir. NSA - right now in office, a phone call away for Trump - authorized any pulling of logs.

Intelligence personnel are discussed in that report. That's who looks at those things.

Ok don't call it a false report or a conspiracy. So what is the claim here? That Trump was under investigation for connections to foreign spies, oligarchs and criminals, congratulations, seriously.

 

[Koya]

You do.

Then demonstrate where I've said Trump is a mole. I'm not the only poster to call out your comment as another attempt to conflate terms as to obscure underlying objective truth.

I don't believe Trump is a mole. Personally, I don't think him capable of such an intentional effort.  But that's besides the point.

Go ahead and tell people what they think, always a good way to provide substantive discussion. 

 

[apalmer]

You do.

Is that mole or "mole"? Because I understand quotation marks matter in deciding whether you think Koya believes that Trump is an undercover spy planted by Putin or whether you mean something else. 

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Is that mole or "mole"? Because I understand quotation marks matter in deciding whether you think Koya believes that Trump is an undercover spy planted by Putin or whether you mean something else. 

I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Mexican sauce with chocolate in it.

 

[Henry Ford]

Joe DiGenova?

To be fair, if DiGenova was given that kind of classified intel to create a spreadsheet, it would definitely be a breach of classification protocol. 

 

[joffer]

I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Mexican sauce with chocolate in it.

oh there's a new place that just opened up down the street that has the best mole enchiladas.  the best jerry.

 

[Higgs]

Other posters we are not supporting financially. Liken it to the gay wedding cake business. I'm fine with the people not making the wedding cakes but that also doesn't mean I have to buy mine from them. I'll go somewhere else. Dodds can say whatever he wants but I don't have to financially support his views and therefore I won't. I'll go somewhere else. If I was a business owner with a public forum, no way I talk about politics to anyone. If I disagree with you, I swallow my pride because if I piss you off, I lose my livelihood. No way I take that chance. 

You won't give your money to him but I bet you'll continue to use his forum.  Amirite?

 

[Henry Ford]

Serious question as I really don't follow politics until this circus started?

Does the White House usually have this many press conferences" ?

In the first 100 days, absolutely. 

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

So basically the Senate is going to change forever now no matter what.  

Not forever. I'm pretty sure it will go like this:

1. On Wednesday, go nuclear and get rid of the filibuster.

2. On Thursday, vote to confirm Gorsuch.

3. On Friday, bring back the filibuster and restore all conventional norms relating to senatorial protocol and decorum from the pre-Bork era.

4. Profit.

 

[Henry Ford]

Who here do you think "believes the President is a Russian Mole"

Not someone who questions his many ties to Russia, Putin and their agents 

not shady businsss dealings which may have exposed Trump to being extorted - or just driven by selfish and narcissistic desires for self over nation 

not that Trumps associates may be colluding with and possibly working on behalf of the Russians

nor even that Trump may have been indirectly or directly involved with and/or had knowledge about colliding with the Russians to improve his electoral showing...

because none of the above is "mole" - but it appears not everyone wants to be bound by legitimate discourse where words and their meanings, matter. 

FYI - while I don't know of a poster who has said Trump "is a mole", there is still more evidence to support even that outlandish contention than almost every conspiracy pushed by the parrots of the alt-right.  Not enough evidence to make most of us think he's an actual mole, but to be fair, there's at least smoke under that particular contention. 

I'm pretty sure in one or two of my drunk responses to trolls I apologized to someone for their finding out they voted for a Russian mole. I don't know when, but I would assume I did at some point.  

 

[Higgs]

For the left to consider themselves tolerant is a joke.  Anyone dare offer a different opinion, you can't do business with them, you can't have a civil discussion with them, you don't let them speak, you boycott their state.  Are you really that so wrapped up in your ideology that it is so difficult to have an association with someone who thinks differently.  And you think religious people are intolerant.  Good god.  Easily the most intolerant people I know are on the left. 

Been this way for years, only now it is becoming blatantly obvious.  It's not enough for the Left to just disagree with someone today.  They have to either coerce the person into submission (ie - threats of boycotts) or shut down their speech through the heckler's veto.  This is why I abandoned the Left years ago - their intolerance, bigotry and need for censoring speech they don't agree with.  It's terrible.

 

[cobalt_27]

Another gem from Taibbi.

Morning, February 24th, National Harbor, Maryland, the Conservative Political Action Conference. Chin up, eyes asquint, Donald Trump floats to the lectern on a sea of applause and adulation. The building is shaking, and as fans howl his name – Trump! Trump! Trump! – he looks pleased and satisfied, like a Roman emperor who has just moved his bowels.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/features/taibbi-on-trump-the-destroyer-w473144

 

[Higgs]

Yeah, I don't know. "I can't even talk to you anymore" vs. "I'm going to pass a Law that says if you have sex with the person you love you go to prison" seem like disparate levels of intolerance. 

When has that been done recently?  Honest question because that sounds terrible.

 

[jonessed]

Jones, I'm taking the article seriously. What is wrong with what is reported?

There's nothing political in that article.

Trump's own Dir. NSA - right now in office, a phone call away for Trump - authorized any pulling of logs.

Intelligence personnel are discussed in that report. That's who look at those things.

Ok don't call it a false report or a conspiracy. So what is the claim here? That Trump was under investigation for connections to foreign spies, oligarchs and criminals, congratulations, seriously.

Pulling the logs makes perfect sense given what Russia was suspected of.  That doesn't make Trump a conspirator, much less a mole.

Conspiracy theories are built on loosely chained bits of evidence connected by people who have a predilection to believe the outcome.  I guess we will find out in a few months if your conspiracy theory is true.  Every once in a while it does end up working out that way.

I suspect most will continue to cling though.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

When has that been done recently?  Honest question because that sounds terrible.

It only sounds terrible if you assume the sex is consensual.

 

[Higgs]

I think I've got a year left on my subscription. In August I usually check different rankings from people like Bloom, Dodds, MT, Zachariason, the ESPN guys etc., then do my own adjustments right after preseason week 3. 

Um yeah, don't think I'll be looking at Dodds' rankings this year and won't be renewing. And it's pretty stunning that a guy who made a name for himself delving into stats and data and doing analysis that has been considered world-class in the industry also believes the gov't is involved in a pedo ring and Trump is spearheading the effort to save us all. Maybe the FF content is still legit, who knows (and MT has done a good job explaining why he believes the two issues are separate). I just know I won't be in a position of kicking myself because I took the advice of someone who is delusional. 

Then please leave the FFA as well.  TIA.

 

[jonessed]

I'm pretty sure in one or two of my drunk responses to trolls I apologized to someone for their finding out they voted for a Russian mole. I don't know when, but I would assume I did at some point.  

A few times (probably more than a few if I can recall more than one).  I doubt you believe he's a mole though.  You don't seem like the conspiracy theory type.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Pulling the logs makes perfect sense given what Russia was suspected of.  That doesn't make Trump a conspirator, much less a mole.

Then, fine, leave it at that.

Conspiracy theories are built on loosely chained bits of evidence connected by people who have a predilection to believe the outcome.  I guess we will find out in a few months if your conspiracy theory is true.  Every once in a while it does end up working out that way.

I suspect most will continue to cling though.

Jones, above you evaluated a fact, just keep doing that and reach your own conclusions, nothing wrong with that. But also don't blow off people doing the same as engaging in conspiracy fantasies. The weird thing is the refusal to look at facts to begin with, which is what typically goes on here by Trump fans because some do not want to consider the conclusions which naturally fall from it.

 

[Higgs]

It's a terrible posting.  "I don't like what the owner says, so I'm not going to spend my money on his site's services.  But I'm still going to use the free message board he provides".

Talk about cowardly.  And hypocritical.  If you are going to make a principled stand, then do it and boycot everything.

 

[Bruce Dickinson]

Been this way for years, only now it is becoming blatantly obvious.  It's not enough for the Left to just disagree with someone today.  They have to either coerce the person into submission (ie - threats of boycotts) or shut down their speech through the heckler's veto.  This is why I abandoned the Left years ago - their intolerance, bigotry and need for censoring speech they don't agree with.  It's terrible.

Anyone who runs into the loving arms of Donald Trump immediately waives their right to complain about intolerance, bigotry, and need for censoring speech you don't agree with.  That's pretty much what he's about, easily provable through his actions.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

Michelle Goldberg makes the same point I made here yesterday: if the stories about Susan Rice are true, then good for Rice: she was doing her job: 

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2017/04/i_hope_susan_rice_was_keeping_tabs_on_trump_s_russia_ties.html

Yes, I'm having a hard time following the allegation that Susan Rice did anything wrong here. She allegedly reviewed surveillance of Russians discussing their active measures plans or whatever and took an interest in finding out which US Persons were involved in those conversations (as subjects or participants), so she asked the FBI or NSA (whichever agency captured those conversations) to unmask those US Persons. That all seems perfectly normal appropriate. The National Security Adviser should be interested in the identity of US Persons caught up in the Russian active measures plans.

The Wall Street Journal says that the only reason she'd have requested to unmask those persons is out of improper political curiosity. (I forget the exact wording of the editorial.) That would indeed be improper if it were the case, but it seems way wrong. There are important national security-related reasons for wanting to know whom the Russians were talking to or about with regard to their active measures plans.

Is there anything else people are alleging that she did wrong (in this context)?

ETA: I've seen allegations that she surveilled Trump's team. But that's just a misphrasing, isn't it? I believe it's agreed by every credible person who's weighed in on the subject that it was the Russians who were surveilled, not Trump's team; and if communications with or about Trump's team were captured, it was incidental to the surveillance of the Russians.

 

[Koya]

Is that mole or "mole"? Because I understand quotation marks matter in deciding whether you think Koya believes that Trump is an undercover spy planted by Putin or whether you mean something else. 

I tend to read words with intention, with their literal meanings. 

Trump a stooge? No question

An unwilling participant being played by a bunch of people around him? That's what I originally thought, but goodness, how can we believe that when he is surrounded by folks that seem to be very willing and very dedicaed to furthering the interests of Putin and Russia. 

A willing participant / colluder? Per the above, and sadly, there's a lot of evidence to suggest such a ridiculous contention may actually be true. It's maybe harder to believe Trump doesn't know about this... which would tend toward being at least ok with his people colluding if not directly involved himself

An actual mole as in planted afentnof a foreign adversary? No. just nothing to support this contention. As I noted before, I don't think Trump has the ability to deliberately act as an agent / mole. Nor do I think he would as in his narcissistic mind working WITH the Russians to better his position can be rationalised as "ok, end justifies the means, as president Ill be so great it's ok that I got here working with our greatest historical enemy" as opposed to him technically working "for" the Russians. He still sees himself as a true American IMO, but that's due to his cognitive dissonance and narcissistic tendencies. Which makes him the perfect vessel by which to have accomplished what may well be the greatest political infiltration we've seen on our nation's history.

 

[Higgs]

Anyone who runs into the loving arms of Donald Trump immediately waives their right to complain about intolerance, bigotry, and need for censoring speech you don't agree with.  That's pretty much what he's about, easily provable through his actions.

Uh, no.