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Public College Tuition: should it be free? (1 Viewer)

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If current living conditions remain so stagnant (wages, price of goods, cost of living), something will have to give. I think college is in its dying days. The value just isn't as overpowering as it once was, and nobody wants a citizenship that is uneducated and/or turned off by the idea of education due to cost.

 
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rustycolts said:
Johnnymac said:
I would like to see something like this happen in this country. If we are the greatest country in the world, there should be an opportunity for it's citizens to gain a college education at no cost to them. Thoughts?

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/05/watch-bernie-sanders-blows-wolf-blitzers-mind-with-plan-to-make-college-free-by-taxing-wall-street/
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Will everyone get a free phone too?How about crab legs?
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We can't all be Jameis Winston.
 
I'm banking on this so I don't have to save as much for my kid's college.

...not that it will be free, but that competition and the decreasing importance of a degree from a particular school will cause the tuition bubble to burst... it has to happen.

 
Biggest $cam in the country today is the extreme high cost of a college education. Burying people in debt at a young age

 
Johnnymac said:
I would like to see something like this happen in this country. If we are the greatest country in the world, there should be an opportunity for it's citizens to gain a college education at no cost to them. Thoughts?

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/05/watch-bernie-sanders-blows-wolf-blitzers-mind-with-plan-to-make-college-free-by-taxing-wall-street/
Click to expand...
I'd love to see it as well but many in this country don't even want to fund K-12 public schools. How is college going to happen?

 
Mario Kart said:
Johnnymac said:
I would like to see something like this happen in this country. If we are the greatest country in the world, there should be an opportunity for it's citizens to gain a college education at no cost to them. Thoughts?

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/05/watch-bernie-sanders-blows-wolf-blitzers-mind-with-plan-to-make-college-free-by-taxing-wall-street/
Click to expand...
I'd love to see it as well but many in this country don't even want to fund K-12 public schools. How is college going to happen?
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So if we just throw more money at it...

 
Seriously, isn't this why we created community colleges? So that people with low incomes could afford a college education?

 
fourd said:
Mario Kart said:
Johnnymac said:
I would like to see something like this happen in this country. If we are the greatest country in the world, there should be an opportunity for it's citizens to gain a college education at no cost to them. Thoughts?

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/05/watch-bernie-sanders-blows-wolf-blitzers-mind-with-plan-to-make-college-free-by-taxing-wall-street/
Click to expand...
I'd love to see it as well but many in this country don't even want to fund K-12 public schools. How is college going to happen?
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So if we just throw more money at it...
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Not at all however there is a better way to do things than are currently being done. We know, as educators, what does and does not work. Having 30+ kids in a class with one teacher does not work. Having 20-24 kids in one class works much better and offers other rewards. This is not rocket science but in order to do this, yes, you need to fund education. The result of the previously stated is to have more teachers and thus more money. But, you can't make an omelette without breaking a few eggs. You can't have high results without also spending money to educate the citizens of this country.

And, before you say anything, like you were trying to with your few words above, I voted for Scott Walker three times so don't pawn off what I say as some liberal mess. Privatizing schools is not the answer. All that does is shift our tax dollars from public responsibilities we have as citizens to private enterprises. Terrible way to allow tax payers to continue to make a few other people rich.

 
Yes.

Or at the very least, made affordable again.

Regardless, I'm so tired of hearing geezers brag about how they paid their way through school. No one is impressed that you picked up a 4-hour minimum wage shift at Burger King once a week. Working 10x those hours barely even puts a dent into college tuition in modern times.

 
FreeBaGeL said:
Yes.

Or at the very least, made affordable again.

Regardless, I'm so tired of hearing geezers brag about how they paid their way through school. No one is impressed that you picked up a 4-hour minimum wage shift at Burger King once a week. Working 10x those hours barely even puts a dent into college tuition in modern times.
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Entitlement generation.

 
You get what you pay for though. Your education would suck. And who wants to employ some dude who got a sucky education for free. No thanks.

 
I could see it being free for the actual full-on state institutions, IF, and only if, we make it WAY harder to get into college.

I think one of the biggest problems we have is that our colleges are A) not rigorous and B) too easy to get into. Obviously, those two things are very much tied together.

My thoughts on this are still in the formative stage, but my gut reaction is that the biggest problem with higher education is that there's too much of it, for people who can't handle it and don't need it. Instead of people being unable to hack it, schools adjust curriculum downward because they need tuition to payments to keep flowing.

ETA: Would be really difficult to implement too. Have to regulate the schools, because the system likely ends up looking similar to Medicare, where you go to the doctor and then they bill the government. You'd go to school, school would bill the FedGov.

 
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If you made every state school tuition free upon acceptance and they held to current acceptance numbers, I feel like that would result in those schools to become much more elite. Reason being, everyone will want to get in. Not getting in would mean paying a fortune to go to private school, almost like a penalty. It would shift the market back from the brink of private schools commanding whatever rate of inflation they desire on annual tuition hikes. I love this idea actually, the student pays room/board/living expenses. This would have to force private schools to scale it back, I'd have to think.

Thinking this through logically, next question is does this result in tax hikes to foot the bill?

 
ChiefD said:
Planning on sending my kids to trade school. Tons of jobs out there.
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Yep. Good idea. The trades are making a comeback. Used to be the other way where college was for the privileged and everyone learned trades. Now media, people in power have been pushing college so much over the past few decades, there's hardly anyone left in the trades. Tons of money to be made there with so little competition.

 
Instinctive said:
I could see it being free for the actual full-on state institutions, IF, and only if, we make it WAY harder to get into college.

I think one of the biggest problems we have is that our colleges are A) not rigorous and B) too easy to get into. Obviously, those two things are very much tied together.

My thoughts on this are still in the formative stage, but my gut reaction is that the biggest problem with higher education is that there's too much of it, for people who can't handle it and don't need it. Instead of people being unable to hack it, schools adjust curriculum downward because they need tuition to payments to keep flowing.

ETA: Would be really difficult to implement too. Have to regulate the schools, because the system likely ends up looking similar to Medicare, where you go to the doctor and then they bill the government. You'd go to school, school would bill the FedGov.
Click to expand...
In a lot of ways, that's what we have now. There are a lot of people who argue that one of the reasons tuition costs are so high (at least for law school) is the fact that the federal government gives student loans to anyone who's in school, which basically allows schools to charge absurdly high, and rapidly increasing, rates.

 
Binky The Doormat said:
ChiefD said:
Planning on sending my kids to trade school. Tons of jobs out there.
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What trade school? Have you done much research? Asking for a friend.
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My oldest is only nine, so I have some time. But right now, the average age of machinists in this country is something like the upper 50's. The HVAC trade is woefully short of good technicians right now. I have clients calling me every week asking me if I know any techs looking for jobs. Those guys can easily make 40-60k and up. Same with licensed plumbers. And electricians.

 
I think we need to move away from the traditional college model, not enable it further. This isn't the early 1900s where there were few institutions of higher learning where the greatest minds can meet. Every piece of information ever created for consumption is at your fingertips.

 
fourd said:
Mario Kart said:
Johnnymac said:
I would like to see something like this happen in this country. If we are the greatest country in the world, there should be an opportunity for it's citizens to gain a college education at no cost to them. Thoughts?

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/05/watch-bernie-sanders-blows-wolf-blitzers-mind-with-plan-to-make-college-free-by-taxing-wall-street/
Click to expand...
I'd love to see it as well but many in this country don't even want to fund K-12 public schools. How is college going to happen?
Click to expand...
So if we just throw more money at it...
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http://dpi.wi.gov/sites/default/files/news-release/dpinr2015_55.pdf

How is this good? This is a news release with a new law passed in Wisconsin. Makes no sense.
 
MaxThreshold said:
Johnnymac said:
I would like to see something like this happen in this country. If we are the greatest country in the world, there should be an opportunity for it's citizens to gain a college education at no cost to them. Thoughts?

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/05/watch-bernie-sanders-blows-wolf-blitzers-mind-with-plan-to-make-college-free-by-taxing-wall-street/
Click to expand...
Maybe we can give them a free car and a free house too? After all, we are the greatest country in the world.
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Last figures I saw showed we spend about 54 billion a year financing education now. It would cost about 52 billion to just pay for it. So how about dropping the stupid strawmen?

 
Germany is pretty conservative fiscally and they now offer this. We are falling ever further behind the rest of the industrialized world.

 
njherdfan said:
Instinctive said:
I could see it being free for the actual full-on state institutions, IF, and only if, we make it WAY harder to get into college.

I think one of the biggest problems we have is that our colleges are A) not rigorous and B) too easy to get into. Obviously, those two things are very much tied together.

My thoughts on this are still in the formative stage, but my gut reaction is that the biggest problem with higher education is that there's too much of it, for people who can't handle it and don't need it. Instead of people being unable to hack it, schools adjust curriculum downward because they need tuition to payments to keep flowing.

ETA: Would be really difficult to implement too. Have to regulate the schools, because the system likely ends up looking similar to Medicare, where you go to the doctor and then they bill the government. You'd go to school, school would bill the FedGov.
Click to expand...
In a lot of ways, that's what we have now. There are a lot of people who argue that one of the reasons tuition costs are so high (at least for law school) is the fact that the federal government gives student loans to anyone who's in school, which basically allows schools to charge absurdly high, and rapidly increasing, rates.
Click to expand...
Certainly at the grad school level, I agree...but wasn't aware it was as big a deal at undergrad institutions.

Also key: theoretically people have to pay back the loans.

 
My grand daughter is 14 and very intelligent she has a 3.8 gpa .I told her if she could maintain at least a 3.5 until she graduated I would give her my Challenger.It wouldn't be a gift it would be because she worked hard for it and earned it. I also told her if she wanted to go to college I would go back to work and if I had to I would work 3 jobs so she could go where she wanted to go.The one thing that never entered my mind was maybe the government would pay for it and to be honest I wouldn't want it to. I guess it just depends on the mind set of different individuals.

 
Free is a bit much, but it is fast becoming a bad decision to go to a 4 year college when you think about debt to income potential afterwards. That should not be the case and it discourages further education.

 
rustycolts said:
My grand daughter is 14 and very intelligent she has a 3.8 gpa .I told her if she could maintain at least a 3.5 until she graduated I would give her my Challenger.It wouldn't be a gift it would be because she worked hard for it and earned it. I also told her if she wanted to go to college I would go back to work and if I had to I would work 3 jobs so she could go where she wanted to go.The one thing that never entered my mind was maybe the government would pay for it and to be honest I wouldn't want it to. I guess it just depends on the mind set of different individuals.
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And some people's grandfather is a crack addicted misogynist that beat the kid's mother into a depressed life of alcoholism. What about their grand-kid?

Btw, sounds like quite the handout you're planning for your grand daughter. What an entitled, spoiled little leach she is to get that.

 
FreeBaGeL said:
rustycolts said:
My grand daughter is 14 and very intelligent she has a 3.8 gpa .I told her if she could maintain at least a 3.5 until she graduated I would give her my Challenger.It wouldn't be a gift it would be because she worked hard for it and earned it. I also told her if she wanted to go to college I would go back to work and if I had to I would work 3 jobs so she could go where she wanted to go.The one thing that never entered my mind was maybe the government would pay for it and to be honest I wouldn't want it to. I guess it just depends on the mind set of different individuals.
Click to expand...
And some people's grandfather is a crack addicted misogynist that beat the kid's mother into a depressed life of alcoholism. What about their grand-kid?

Btw, sounds like quite the handout you're planning for your grand daughter. What an entitled, spoiled little leach she is to get that.
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Again to maintain a 3.5 gpa through middle school and high school is quite an achievement and you have to work hard to get there so she earned it. Hey but thanks for your input you sound like a very enlightened individual.

 
Definitely a trade school fan. And if I was going to campaign on this I would certainly include them. I've looked into this a bit and it appears very few here understand how much the current system is broken and how expensive it is for taxpayers. Outright paying for it makes a lot of sense financially and as a type of infrastructure investment. Also it could be used as leverage to bend the cost curve.

 
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