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TRADE THREAD- President Trump signs Phase One of China agreement, China promises to double its purchases in 2020 (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter timschochet
- Start date
Chaz McNulty
Footballguy
That's why he's against immigration. He doesn't want cheap labor, he wants free labor.
FairWarning
Footballguy
The Z Machine
Footballguy
#totallypredictable
#chinalonggame
#chinalonggame
Sabertooth
Footballguy
GoBirds
Footballguy
Biden defense team trying to blame Trump as inflation skyrockets under Biden’s watch….some things are so predictable here. It’s all Trump’s fault as usual, But Trump!
FairWarning
Footballguy
To be fair, we sold out to China 35 years ago.
James Daulton
Footballguy
WE didn't sell out to China, our corporate overlords and their unending pursuit of shareholder value and profits did.
Just part of our wonderful system of capitalism that has produced the country of haves and have nots we enjoy today.
And yet many folks, mainly conservative, will argue that it's perfectly fine that CEOs make 400x the average worker today vs 50x pre-1990. Just one more result of unfettered capitalism.
Ruffrodys05
IBL Representative
Some serious questions.Biden defense team trying to blame Trump as inflation skyrockets under Biden’s watch….some things are so predictable here. It’s all Trump’s fault as usual, But Trump!
Does the trade agreement that DJT signed with China, that China hasn't honored, have anything to do with the current level of inflation? Do the tariffs DJT enacted, that Biden hasn't removed, have anything to do with the current level of inflation?
The first question belongs in this thread. The second really belongs in the tariffs thread. Either way I'm not sure they truly are affecting inflation currently.
Final question. How does acknowledging & discussing the fact that China hasn't honored their side of the trade agreement (which was in fact predictable,) in the trade thread, lay the blame for the current inflation level at the feet of DJT?
If anyone could explain that to me I'd appreciate it.
James Daulton
Footballguy
MAGA guys are very sensitive to criticism of their guy.
Try having a discussion with them about Trump suggesting we inject bleach and light to fight covid and they'll swear up and down that we're just being big liars and meanies.
GoBirds
Footballguy
It was a long shot from the start ( but does bring back good memories of a potus w backbone) and who blames China for waiting it out once it looked like there were enough people in our country that really thought Joe Biden was somehow a good choice and was going to solve Coronavirus. We all see how that worked out, even worse than Trump.
Just funny to watch all those in here suddenly care about this after electing the guy every one knew would lay down day 1.
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FairWarning
Footballguy
timschochet
Footballguy
This is a thread about trade. How has Biden “laid down” with regard to trade?
It was a long shot from the start ( but does bring back good memories of a potus w backbone) and who blames China for waiting it out once it looked like there were enough people in our country that really thought Joe Biden was somehow a good choice and was going to solve Coronavirus. We all see how that worked out, even worse than Trump.
Just funny to watch all those in here suddenly care about this after electing the guy every one knew would lay down day 1.
FairWarning
Footballguy
sho nuff
Footballguy
People cared about it before. People said the trade war was a mistake early in and seems were proven right.
It was a long shot from the start ( but does bring back good memories of a potus w backbone) and who blames China for waiting it out once it looked like there were enough people in our country that really thought Joe Biden was somehow a good choice and was going to solve Coronavirus. We all see how that worked out, even worse than Trump.
Just funny to watch all those in here suddenly care about this after electing the guy every one knew would lay down day 1.
We are not in a better position now…worse actually. Probably would have been better off staying in the TPP to lessen China’s influence.
And Biden absolutely should look to ending these tariffs that, while not responsible for all the inflation, the tariffs do likely contribute to it. As people warned way back then. That China doesn’t just cut us a check (like Trump inferred often) but that the cost just gets passed down to the consumer.
GoBirds
Footballguy
In what aspect of his presidency has he not completely laid down? Could the rest of the world have asked for a bigger pushover? Who?
In 2020 under the Trump administration farmers like myself received “market facilitation program payments “because farmers commodities and farmers were used as pawns in an attempt to deal with China and yes we were but those payments the Trump administration gave to us became the largest government program payments I received in over 40 years of farming. Consider what that added to our national debt.
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timschochet
Footballguy
My question was pretty specific. Which trade policy of Biden’s, toward China or any other nation, do you disapprove of? What would you do differently?
GoBirds
Footballguy
Forgot we had to stand trial to your schtick?
Its pretty clear, if you cared about the trade deal succeeding you would have re-elected Trump. China saw that there were enough of you that really bought that Biden had any plan whatsoever for Corona and the did the smart move and stalled. Then you elected Biden, who has allowed Corona to get worse and more Americans to die than before even. That’s all he was elected for, everyone knew he didn’t have the backbone to attempt to stand up to China that’s why this schtick is so weak. China played it exactly how they should have once they saw our media sold so many of you on Corona.
Also another great example of why this country should want a red wave asap.
timschochet
Footballguy
Sorry none of this makes any sense to me. Again we’re talking about trade here, not about Coronavirus. I don’t what it means that, according to you, Trump stood up to China and Biden has not. As a general rule, Biden has attempted to overturn most of the tariffs that Trump enacted: as a free market guy I think that’s a very good thing, He has kept them in place with regard to China, which I think is a mistake, but it’s hardly one that we can look towards Trump as a better alternative.
That’s my perspective; I would appreciate it you could unpack yours a little more because right now I don’t understand you. No shtick intended.
James Daulton
Footballguy
I guess, I don't really know. What I do know is that corporations have bled the american worker dry and enriched their executives and shareholders as a result.
While capitalism is a great system its pursuit of profits no matter the impact to society or the environment has caused the situation we're facing today. We're a nation of a tiny class of elites, and small subclasses of very wealthy, a shrinking middle class, and a growing lower class
Half of individuals in the country makes less than $40k. It's shameful.
shadrap
Footballguy
not sensitive just amazed at the lies people spew. he did not suggest injecting bleach & light.
James Daulton
Footballguy
And right on cue. He also didn't sharpie up the weather map and lie about his inauguration crowd did he?
Unbelievable the hold he has on MAGA guys. But that's what we're dealing with these days.
lol, at still saying he didn't suggest injecting bleach and light.
GoBirds
Footballguy
Sorry man just comes across as shtick when the guys that only cared about Russia for 5 years now are doing gymnastics to blame you know who for China. Smells like bad bait Tim but have a great weekend and sorry you don’t understand but I’ll have to disagree as far as sleepy Joe being a better option on any front except social media.
timschochet
Footballguy
I don’t “blame Trump for China”. I blame him for some bad policies that I think made things worse, not better. But China was already a problem and Trump wasn’t going to solve it.
With regard to Biden, you’ve been among his biggest critics in this forum and that’s fine. But I think that if you’re going to make blanket statements about his performance it’s reasonable for people to ask you to explain exactly what you think he did wrong and how you, or any politician you prefer, would have handled things differently. Yet whenever this request is made of you, you inevitably call it shtick, decline to answer, and wish the other poster a great weekend. Which again is your privilege, but it greatly weakens your original argument.
James Daulton
Footballguy
Tim you're a good dude. Some folks just aren't worth wasting your energy on. Trump handed a steaming pile of everything to Biden. Yet somehow Biden's at fault for worldwide inflation and MAGA anti-vaxx, anti-science folks for perpetuating the scourge of covid in this country. Biden will have four years to make an impact. At which time we will be able to fairly judge him.
timschochet
Footballguy
I don’t want to get into the habit of blaming everything on Trump. Trump made a lot of things worse, a small amount of things better, and a lot of the problems that Biden faces today have nothing whatsoever to do with Trump.
James Daulton
Footballguy
True. But Trump's continued lying about losing the election and forcing the republican party to bend to his will is in fact perpetuating a lot of the problems in this country. His massive increase in the deficit, his bullying the federal reserve to not raise interest rates, the tax cuts for the rich, all have contributed to the issues we're dealing with today. Not caused but certainly contributed.
sho nuff
Footballguy
The trade deal was a mistake…so why reelect the person who made that huge error? The oh shucks, at least he tried mentality is odd to me. Backbone? Is backbone good when was bad failed policy? Its not some macho contest. And the trade deal was bad before Covid. He got played by China…same as he got played by North Korea.
timschochet
Footballguy
Can’t disagree with any of this. Very good summary.
Except- his tax cut for the rich was only for certain states. In Blue states like mine the rich actually are paying more, thanks to Trump, because the state and local exemptions were lowered.
How is it "shtick" when he's asking you to explain yourself?
"shtick" is like your 4 canned replies you cycle through in all threads
GoBirds
Footballguy
That ship has sailed my friend.
I think I do agree with your previous post of China already being a problem that Trump wasn’t going to solve but I do appreciate the effort. Let’s end on the only thing we can agree on, I’m hanging w the kids enjoy this beautiful day buddy.
Chaz McNulty
Footballguy
No one understands. You didn't address the trade question at all and just went on about Covid and other nonsense.
Desert_Power
Footballguy
Whole lotta "but Biden" in a topic about Trump's failed trade deal.
The Commish
Footballguy
There hasn't been a single, meaningful change in what Trump did as it pertains to China. Biden's basically continued exactly what Trump did. It was dumb then. It's dumb now. But some are convinced it was good then, but bad now even though it's exactly the same.
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GoBirds
Footballguy
Don’t expect you to understand, anyone outside your normal liberal echo group does but look at the roll call here. Like groundhogs day.
The Z Machine
Footballguy
Biden could end it, but hasn't.
Why not? It could really help with taming inflation.
2Squirrels1Nut
Footballguy
Right wing talk radio conveniently forgets this though. Along with the fact that tariffs raise prices to the consumer. Then there's the trillion dollar tax cut that went almost entirely to the super rich after 10+ years of record market gains when taxes and interest rates should have started being raised. Literally Econ 101. Have the government assist programs push inflation higher? Absolutely but it's but a piece of the puzzle. A very necessary piece as there are still millions of Americans who were and still are suffering.
As someone that consumed a lot of right wing talk radio, I admit they are incredible at spreading singular messages in a uniform way. With inflation it's gas prices which the average Joe can relate to although in most cases it's relatively inconsequential unless you drive for a living. I've read here too many times how Biden is horrible because he won't do anything about it. The radio hosts know that there's nothing he can do about it with the exception of nationalizing, socializing, energy and that's not going to happen. The other of course is the bill at the grocery store which absolutely is a hindrance to millions. Keep in mind what this post started in response to, how you in not so many words reminded us how Trump royally screwed up agriculture in this country with HORRIBLE trade policies.
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sho nuff
Footballguy
Yeah. He needs to end these tariffs. Its not going to fix all…but theoretically should ease some prices on goods relying on China.There hasn't been a single, meaningful change in what Trump did as it pertains to China. Biden's basically continued exactly what Trump did. It was dumb then. It's dumb now. But some are convinced it was good then, but bad now even though it's exactly the same.
2Squirrels1Nut
Footballguy
There hasn't been a single, meaningful change in what Trump did as it pertains to China. Biden's basically continued exactly what Trump did. It was dumb then. It's dumb now. But some are convinced it was good then, but bad now even though it's exactly the same.
Agreed, haven't heard anything about where we stand on tariffs lately but they all need to end.
Listen, I don't trust the Chinese anymore than the other brutal commie/dictator countries and want nothing more than to do less business with them. How about we have a well thought out long term plan instead of tariffs, which I learned in the 6th grade doesn't work.
Desert_Power
Footballguy
Not sure. I could venture they think it is a bad idea to unilaterally remove tariffs without the other party, but I am supportive of doing that generally.
I’d say it is more likely that they don’t feel they have the political capital to take on another unpopular policy. Particularly given the conspiracies on the right about Chinese influence in his administration.
The Z Machine
Footballguy
The question I have is about how popular these tariffs are with the American people.
The Commish
Footballguy
This cant happen unless we have generations of politicians on the same page. Not happening in this country. Not with this political climate. I mean, look at this thread. Forget about the solution and whether its good or not. Just look at the reaction to the solution and how different it is for some based solely on who's in office. Its looney tunes.
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Biden Biden Biden. What the you think happens? China pays the tariffs? Lol.Biden defense team trying to blame Trump as inflation skyrockets under Biden’s watch….some things are so predictable here. It’s all Trump’s fault as usual, But Trump!
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Right. It’s the same reason Trump didn’t take very many secret meetings with Putin when everyone had all these crazy conspiracies about him being Putin’s stooge. Which he is.
timschochet
Footballguy
Agreed. As I mentioned, Biden has removed some of Trump’s stupid tariffs, and good for him, but not with regard to China. And I don’t get it.There hasn't been a single, meaningful change in what Trump did as it pertains to China. Biden's basically continued exactly what Trump did. It was dumb then. It's dumb now. But some are convinced it was good then, but bad now even though it's exactly the same.
timschochet
Footballguy
This is a problem.
Trump was the first major Republican politician to attack free trade. Being anti-tariff was NOT a liberal position- in fact many leftists (think Bernie and AOC) actually agree with Trump on this issue. If anything, Trump’s position was a leftist one. Yet for @GoBirds and far too many other conservatives, any criticism of a Trump policy must make you a liberal. It’s very frustrating and rather nonsensical.
FairWarning
Footballguy
Agree but someone has to change it.There hasn't been a single, meaningful change in what Trump did as it pertains to China. Biden's basically continued exactly what Trump did. It was dumb then. It's dumb now. But some are convinced it was good then, but bad now even though it's exactly the same.
The Commish
Footballguy
The approach to China has to be a group of countries. Think of a TPP kind of deal without forfeiting one's sovereignty. That was a good start, but what the US would have to give up was a nonstarter IMO. The US is never going to be able to address China all by itself. We don't produce nearly enough for that to happen.
The Commish
Footballguy
It's true that he could end the tariffs. What's not true is that it would automatically help with inflation. It ONLY helps if the companies charging $50 for what they charged $30 for prior to the tariffs went back to the $30 tag. Are we to believe that would happen? I don't.
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