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Jeffrey Epstein: there is definitely nothing to see here folks, I am feeling very sleepy, I think I'll take a nice nap.

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3 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Did she testify to that, publicly or in court? I thought that it was just a rumor at this point.

there are sworn affidavits.  you can read them online.  she pulled the lawsuit because she was apparently getting death threats.

 

Edit:  here you go - http://thememoryhole2.org/blog/doe-v-trump

Edited by zoonation
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4 minutes ago, zoonation said:

We know that one of the alleged  underage victims says Trump raped her.

It's really weird how Trump keeps getting accused of rape and sexual assault by all these different women, right?  How unlucky for Trump that every single one of these women is getting her facts mistaken or making up these charges out of whole cloth.    

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1 minute ago, zoonation said:

there are sworn affidavits.  you can read them online.  she pulled the lawsuit because she was apparently getting death threats.

The level of power involved in this case is staggering.  Our judicial system, on multiple levels at multiple points in time, was manipulated in order to let Epstein off as lightly as possible.

The power that comes to bear in this case is rarely seen.

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1 minute ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

The question on Michael Cohen ended up being pretty telling - Trump lied about it brazenly.

Exactly my point. He lied and not one Trump supporter batted an eyelid. Not one Republican in Congress even hesitated.

Lying to the public used to be kind of a big deal. Bill Clinton was caught lying about Monica Lewinsky and Republicans spent months talking about it, Democrats spent months talking about how disappointed they were, and Bill himself spent months trying to parse out different meanings of sex and the word "is". Nowadays, Trump lies on a regular basis and nobody cares. "Greatest President of my lifetime!"

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Just now, IvanKaramazov said:

It's really weird how Trump keeps getting accused of rape and sexual assault by all these different women, right?  How unlucky for Trump that every single one of these women is getting her facts mistaken or making up these charges out of whole cloth.    

oh, it is weird alright.  weird that no one seems to care.

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7 minutes ago, zoonation said:

there are sworn affidavits.  you can read them online.  she pulled the lawsuit because she was apparently getting death threats.

 

Edit:  here you go - http://thememoryhole2.org/blog/doe-v-trump

And just in case anyone wondered about other ties between the president and Epstein:

Plaintiff: Jane Doe (pseudonym)

Defendants:
Donald J. Trump and
Jeffrey E. Epstein

"Complaint for rape, sexual misconduct, criminal sexual acts, sexual abuse, forcible touching, assault, battery, intentional and reckless infliction of emotional distress, duress, false imprisonment, and defamation."

 

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9 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Exactly my point. He lied and not one Trump supporter batted an eyelid. Not one Republican in Congress even hesitated.

Lying to the public used to be kind of a big deal. Bill Clinton was caught lying about Monica Lewinsky and Republicans spent months talking about it, Democrats spent months talking about how disappointed they were, and Bill himself spent months trying to parse out different meanings of sex and the word "is". Nowadays, Trump lies on a regular basis and nobody cares. "Greatest President of my lifetime!"

Sorry to differ with you here but it was a criminal investigation. The difference is that Congress has to impeach, but as it turned out it was evidence of Trump's knowledge and his desire to obstruct.

Same thing here. Though of course putting the horse pre-cart means that Trump would have to be implicated in a crime just like what happened with Cohen, and that has not happened yet. But if it did happen getting Trump on record like this will be essential.

But even so I think the press has a duty to ask these questions and the public has a right to hear what the President says about it. I realize you and I often differ on this stuff so I guess this is consistent on that.

Edited by SaintsInDome2006

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1 minute ago, Bucky86 said:

Did you hear the Bill Clinton flew on Epstein's plane?

Ask questions of him too.  But to your point, we won't pretend that the two levels of suspicion are equal here.  All I hope for is a fair inquiry into this.

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1 hour ago, Max Power said:

Agreed. I dont know what the DOJ wants out of this (besides justice) Maximum punishment for him or for him to name names and punish the whole group. If it is to roll on others, they have to dangle the carrot.

Dangling the carrot is what got this whole thing started.

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55 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Bail hearing in a few days. His attorneys are arguing that this is old news, old charges and of course he deserves bail. Prosecution says that if he is allowed bail we will never see him again.

I gotta go with prosecution here. If there is bail hes gone.

 

They call that a Roman Polanski.

Edited by Ditkaless Wonders
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Just now, Ditkaless Wonders said:

They call that a Roman Polanski.

Yeah.

Well, I didn't want to bring that up because in the past I made some very unfortunate, uninformed comments here on that subject, which no doubt a few people here still remember. Wasn't a good look for me. 

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26 minutes ago, timschochet said:
29 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Trump should be asked by a reporter, it is a fair question and even a necessary one.

Why bother? He'll just say, "I don't really know the guy." That will be a total lie, and nobody will care.

His lawyers just did - it was reported in this thread some pages back

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4 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Yeah.

Well, I didn't want to bring that up because in the past I made some very unfortunate, uninformed comments here on that subject, which no doubt a few people here still remember. Wasn't a good look for me. 

The only shameful opinion is one that is immune to new information.

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29 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Did she testify to that, publicly or in court? I thought that it was just a rumor at this point.

There's a pretty big chasm of possibilities between "testify to that publicly or in court" and "just a rumor."

She filed a lawsuit claiming that.

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4 minutes ago, Ditkaless Wonders said:

The only shameful opinion is one that is immune to new information.

I thought that, then I read that Roman Polanski thread.

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1 hour ago, Godsbrother said:

You do?   I must have missed the evidence that Clinton and Trump were involved with underage girls.

Don't get me wrong, I want all molesters locked up and none are above the law.  However I would not take joy in finding out that either the current or a former president of our country were child molesters.

I don’t take joy that it happened, but evidence is staring us in the face. There is a videotaped deposition of a woman who was 13 at the time, and is highly credible, online for you to see, as well as the court filings from April 2016 that describe Trump forcibly raping her and threatening that she will disappear like another girl who had been involved in a previous sexual encounter and was hadn’t been seen since.

As for Clinton, we know he’s a horndog and there’s no good explanation for his ditching secret service to fly on that plane. One has to assume it was what it looks like. 

It’s hard to fathom that black swans like two Presidents caught up in something so base could occur, but it’s hard to believe that’s not what happened in this case. 

Edited by Mr. Ham

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9 minutes ago, Henry Ford said:

I thought that, then I read that Roman Polanski thread.

As I recall Tim was resistant, maybe even highly so, to changing his opinion.  Still, he eventually came around to the opinion that plying 14 year olds with drugs and then isolating them and trying to coerce them into sex is wrong, at least for those 3 times the 14 year olds age and in positions of power.  (leaving open the possibility that teen sexual politics between persons of similar age may have different standards, and maybe not)

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2 minutes ago, Mr. Ham said:

I don’t take joy that it happened, but evidence is staring us in the face. There is a videotaped deposition of a woman who was 13 at the time, and is highly credible, online for you to see, as well as the court filings from April 2025, that describe Trump forcibly raping her and threatening that she will disappear like another girl who had been involved in a previous sexual encounter and was hadn’t been seen since.

As for Clinton, we know he’s a horndog and there’s no good explanation for his ditching secret service to fly on that plane. One has to assume it was what it looks like. 

It’s hard to fathom that black swans like two Presidents caught up in something so base could occur, but it’s hard to believe that’s not what happened in this case. 

Thanks Ham.  It makes me sick to think of these sick rich dudes preying on underage girls.

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8 minutes ago, Ditkaless Wonders said:

As I recall Tim was resistant, maybe even highly so, to changing his opinion.  Still, he eventually came around to the opinion that plying 14 year olds with drugs and then isolating them and trying to coerce them into sex is wrong, at least for those 3 times the 14 year olds age and in positions of power.  (leaving open the possibility that teen sexual politics between persons of similar age may have different standards, and maybe not)

This is the reason I decided long ago that all people are deserving of respect and capable of redemption, while all opinions are not.

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The problem with the Trump accuser is it didn't come out until 2016 when he got into politics.  He wasn't listed as one of the names that flew in the Lolita express to the island.  Although he could have taken a boat.

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Just now, Punxsutawney Phil said:

The problem with the Trump accuser is it didn't come out until 2016 when he got into politics.  He wasn't listed as one of the names that flew in the Lolita express to the island.  Although he could have taken a boat.

To me, there's no need to speculate on the details, just that there's enough question surrounding the issue to warrant investigation.  Much like Russia.

And I'm sure the investigation will be much like the Russia investigation, and that supporters will treat the question similarly.

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23 minutes ago, adonis said:

To me, there's no need to speculate on the details, just that there's enough question surrounding the issue to warrant investigation.  Much like Russia.

And I'm sure the investigation will be much like the Russia investigation, and that supporters will treat the question similarly. 

the investigation would be more like the Kavanaugh investigation than the Russian one, IMO.

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1 minute ago, moleculo said:

the investigation would be more like the Kavanaugh investigation than the Russian one, IMO.

And both "ended" unjustly. So... pick your poison? 

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56 minutes ago, Henry Ford said:

I thought that, then I read that Roman Polanski thread.

Actually it wasn't a thread about Polanski, it was about Woody Allen (somehow the same guys keep reappearing in these conversations- apparently Woody knows Epstein as well.)

I was going on wrong information. I had watched an interview with  the star of The Pianist, Adrien Brody, about whether or not he had any moral qualms about making a film with Polanski. He said he did not, and offered a defense of Polanski's actions in the 70s. Either he misstated the facts, or I misunderstood him (probably the latter). So I made some dumb arguments and then attempted to defend them. My worst moment in the FFA.

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48 minutes ago, Henry Ford said:

This is the reason I decided long ago that all people are deserving of respect and capable of redemption, while all opinions are not.

There are some to whom my emotional reaction is so powerful that my intellectual precepts fall to the wayside. I would like to believe this, I hope it is true, and yet imperfect creature that I am I just can't quite get there.  Maybe someday. 

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>>AG Barr also said that he's not getting involved in the Epstein matter. "I'm recused from that matter because one of the law firms that represented Epstein long ago was a firm that I joined for a period of time," he said.<<

It’s Kirkland.

- I’ll just point out Barr has similar Kirkland conflicts in the Russia investigation but it’s been non-recusal all the way on that one of course.

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2 hours ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

My feeling on this is that we can't say what Trump was or was not doing so let's not say it, because it is ugly beyond the pale, even for Trump and his horrid record.

But I do think it's fair to point out how completely lacking in morals Trump is to pal around with such a person. Same goes for Clinton I suppose. Is there a claim people in that strata really didn't know the scuttlebutt on Epstein? And they'd take a free meal, cab ride, or even a plane ride from him? Just disgusting. Bring heat on Clinton and Trump both on that basis as far as I'm concerned.

It’s certainly possible, depending on the timing.  The level of this guy’s depravity is something that probably had to be seen to be believed.

I can’t imagine he just woke up one day and decided to instantly create a giant underage sex island complete with a distribution network.  I suspect he was always a scumbag.  Lots of those around though.  Very different than a scumbag, pedo, sex trafficker.

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32 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Actually it wasn't a thread about Polanski, it was about Woody Allen (somehow the same guys keep reappearing in these conversations- apparently Woody knows Epstein as well.)

I was going on wrong information. I had watched an interview with  the star of The Pianist, Adrien Brody, about whether or not he had any moral qualms about making a film with Polanski. He said he did not, and offered a defense of Polanski's actions in the 70s. Either he misstated the facts, or I misunderstood him (probably the latter). So I made some dumb arguments and then attempted to defend them. My worst moment in the FFA.

As I hope is clear in this thread, I don't think you're a bad person, I just think that was a bad opinion.

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6 minutes ago, Henry Ford said:

As I hope is clear in this thread, I don't think you're a bad person, I just think that was a bad opinion.

Thanks.

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1 hour ago, Punxsutawney Phil said:

The problem with the Trump accuser is it didn't come out until 2016 when he got into politics.  He wasn't listed as one of the names that flew in the Lolita express to the island.  Although he could have taken a boat.

Or his own plane

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I just heard on the news a search if his NYC apartment had nude pictures of underage girls.  I had read before they were young nude women.  If they turn out to be underage they should charge him with a count of child pornography for each one.

Edited by Punxsutawney Phil

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1 hour ago, Max Power said:

https://youtu.be/kEAj2qbB3DA

Interesting video 

Trump is such a parasite. In summer of 16, 2-3 months before the election, flight logs were released and right wing had a field day implicating Clinton (rightly in my opinion). It’s ever so consistent with his poor character that he would trumpet this despite the fact a criminal complaint had been filed just months earlier with great detail describing how he raped a 13 year old girl at Epstein’s home. He’s just the kind of dirtbag that hits hardest at the things he’s guilty of. He’s truly a garbage human. 

Edited by Mr. Ham

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10 minutes ago, Mr. Ham said:

Trump is such a parasite. In summer of 16, 2-3 months before the election, flight logs were released and right wing had a field day implicating Clinton (rightly in my opinion). It’s ever so consistent with his poor character that he would trumpet this despite the fact a criminal complaint had been filed just months earlier with great detail describing how he raped a 13 year old girl at Epstein’s apartment. He’s just the kind of dirtbag that hits hardest at the things he’s guilty of. He’s truly a garbage human. 

Seriously this is what goes here , calling the President a parasite and a garbage human being??????

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It really is impolite to say disparaging things about a man who proclaims that a pedophile is a terrific guy.

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12 minutes ago, HellToupee said:

Seriously this is what goes here , calling the President a parasite and a garbage human being??????

He’s been too credibly accused of too many sex crimes to ignore. I believe his accusers, and that makes him pure garbage. Particularly because I believe the detailed account of the accuser who was 13 when she says he forcibly raped her at Epstein’s home.

It fits. Trump has victimized people his whole life. The less power someone has, the more he seeks to take.

Edited by Mr. Ham

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I think Kevin Spacey was on Epstein island a few times.  Looks like he's getting ready to skate.  Pretty soon Harvey Weinstein will be making movies again.  These rich people with connections can evidently get away with pedophilia.  It's sick.

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5 minutes ago, Joe Summer said:

It really is impolite to say disparaging things about a man who proclaims that a pedophile is a terrific guy.

Trump's nearly sole requirement for declaring support for someone else is that it benefits him personally, and the person in question says nice things about him.  

Beyond those standards - anything goes.

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1 minute ago, adonis said:

Trump's nearly sole requirement for declaring support for someone else is that it benefits him personally, and the person in question says nice things about him.  

Beyond those standards - anything goes.

Heaven forbid one tries to enforce what should be self-evident standards against a powerful Republican. I’m utterly sick over this all. Especially that evidence can be so blatant of so many heinous crimes, and ignored because a political base thinks he represents their insecurities. I don’t recognize this country for harboring so many willing to turn a blind eye to child sex trafficking. But watch, as more details emerge, that’s what we’ll see.

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4 hours ago, adonis said:

Setting aside the specifics, I think it's reasonable to at least acknowledge that there's a connection between the two that bears investigating.  

For example, if Tom Brady had multiple properties in Florida that he obtained unlawfully and was being actively investigated for tax evasion and other criminal conduct, and we knew that Bill Belichick also was really interested in Florida properties and had quite a few on the other side of the state, it'd be fair to ask the question whether Bill and Tom were tied up together in it, since they knew each other well, spoke favorably of the other person, visited each others Florida properties repeatedly and were involved in similar niche business opportunities.

We shouldn't jump to conclusions, but we shouldn't be blind to some obvious questions that come to mind.

Well when you put it that way, I’d say....umm...why were so many of the FBI agents that raided Epstein female? Sounds like they had an axe to grind.

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1 minute ago, Mr. Ham said:

Heaven forbid one tries to enforce what should be self-evident standards against a powerful Republican. I’m utterly sick over this all. Especially that evidence can be so blatant of so many heinous crimes, and ignored because a political base thinks he represents their insecurities. I don’t recognize this country for harboring so many willing to turn a blind eye to child sex trafficking. But watch, as more details emerge, that’s what we’ll see.

Who has turned a blind eye to child sex trafficking here?

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1 minute ago, John Blutarsky said:

Who has turned a blind eye to child sex trafficking here?

Anyone who reads the details of the criminal complaint against Trump, and watches the video deposition, and thinks in light of his relationship and positive comments about Epstein and dubious appointment of Acosta, that he should remain in office one more second. 

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3 minutes ago, Mr. Ham said:

Anyone who reads the details of the criminal complaint against Trump, and watches the video deposition, and thinks in light of his relationship and positive comments about Epstein and dubious appointment of Acosta, that he should remain in office one more second. 

That’s quite an terrible blanket generalization. There is no one here that would support child sex trafficking.

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3 minutes ago, John Blutarsky said:

That’s quite an terrible blanket generalization. There is no one here that would support child sex trafficking.

Trump is implicated. I know he gaslights people, but the evidence exists for him to reasonably be assumed part of the sex racket, at minimum as a customer. The detailed criminal complaint should be enough, but the scandal around elevating Acosta after he criminally protected Epstein’s co-conspirators, of which he surely is among, is enough that the public must demand immediate answers and total transparency.

To be clear: At this point, it is highly unlikely Trump wasn’t a co-conspirator in a child sex ring. You can say the same about Bill Clinton. 

These were children! Where is your pitchfork?

Edited by Mr. Ham
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I don’t think I have a clear understanding of the “credible accusation” term.   It seems to just mean an accusation from someone who, at first glance, appears to not be a nut job.

Maybe that’s all it is.  The various contexts it’s used in appear to give it more weight than that though.

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