Godsbrother
Footballguy
Starting a new Steelers thread for the offseason. I will be periodically updating the thread title when there is major news.
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*** 2024 Pittsburgh Steelers: Watt in, Pickens out week 16 vs Ravens (16 Viewers)
- Thread starter Godsbrother
- Start date
Godsbrother
Footballguy
Here is a link to Steelers1080's excellent analysis of what the Steelers should do:
forums.footballguys.com
2023 Pittsburgh Steelers. Banged up team loses to Buffalo. Looking ahead to 2024 now
WE CAN DO IT Even without Watt? To be fair, the other games he missed our backup OLBs were not good; Melvin Ingram (who didn't want to be here), Jamir Jones, Ryan Anderson, Taco Charlton. We now have Marcus Golden and Nick Herbig who have both played very well at times this year. They are not...
forums.footballguys.com
steelers1080
Footballguy
We could also trade Diontae for lots of cap savings but I can't see us cutting A-Rob and Diontae and leaving ourselves with 2 WRs. And if they're approximately the same against the cap, it makes sense to keep Diontae.Here is a link to Steelers1080's excellent analysis of what the Steelers should do:
2023 Pittsburgh Steelers. Banged up team loses to Buffalo. Looking ahead to 2024 now
WE CAN DO IT Even without Watt? To be fair, the other games he missed our backup OLBs were not good; Melvin Ingram (who didn't want to be here), Jamir Jones, Ryan Anderson, Taco Charlton. We now have Marcus Golden and Nick Herbig who have both played very well at times this year. They are not...
Godsbrother
Footballguy
I think Diontae is a good receiver but he needs to learn how to keep his mouth shut during the game. He's always a risk to get a taunting or unsportsmanlike penalty.
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
I think we were closer to trading DJ last off-season than we think. So that could be on the table again.
Steelers4Life
Footballguy
I think that a good, imaginative OC who understands how to structure routes to get guys open and utilize speed would be able to get more out of him than the vanilla offense the Steelers ran all year.
steelers1080
Footballguy
As far as I know he has 2 years left on his contract. He was a great signing. He's surrounded by bad players (Moore and Cole), I think it took him roughly half the season to adjust to that and down the stretch he was playing awesome.
steelers1080
Footballguy
Every Steelers fan hopes not. He costs too much.
steelers1080
Footballguy
I'm hoping it was because he was still recovering from last year and he had a terrible OC. If we can hire a decent OC he could still keep improving and become a solid WR3 behind Diontae and George.
Godsbrother
Footballguy
We don't even know if Tomlin will make any coaching changes.
5-ish Finkle
Footballguy
My expectation is he wont,unless forced.
"I fired Canada already. We made the playoffs. See? This is "working." We dont need to throw it or, y'know, score more."
Better make that minus one because I think he'd be an upgrade and also think he's be extremely cheap in every way. Free to acquire, cheap to pay.
Steeler's need to turn over every stone for an OC and DC. Going with the existing in-house coach should not be an option. Tomlin should desperately want to right the ship. But with the most ridiculous job security in the NFL "Not for long league" I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't open up the search. If Mike Tomlin isn't extended and the local radio station is adamant that Tomlin will be. But if he's not extended then he may not be able to get the best possible candidate and may have to stick to in house or a lesser commodity.
Steelers' Dionate Johnson Makes It Absolutely Clear Who He Wants As His QB And It's Not Kenny Pickett
Here's my thoughts on Dionate Johnson
1. Ridiculously overpaid paid as a WR1. He was surpassed this season by George.
2. Hands slightly better than Dwight Stone.
3. Needs to tone down on the antics.
4. Needs to play harder every game. Against the Bills he showed a lot of effort.
5. In the article above he endorses Mason for next season. Article does mention that Kenny hasn't really had a chance in a competent offense. But in my mind, he also hasn't shown that he can be a competent passer. I love the boldness of endorsing Mason for Kenny really hasn't earned the free pass to start next season that Tomlin more than likely will give him. Last 2 seasons there really wasn't a competition in camp. Once Mike has his mind set its set-in stone. I kind of liken this situation to the rookie's this year who he slow walked into playing / starting a number of them.
6. Next season with a competent passer like Mason or other. I see George further separating himself from Diontae.
Calvin Austin needs to make a leap forward next year. He was injured in rookie year. Much like Cory Trice was this year. In theory one might want to give a player whose missed an entire season the benefit of the doubt for at least 1 full season played.
Kenny Pickett skips final media availability of season. The article mentions He has 13 touchdown passes and 13 interceptions, in 25 career games. If he's upset, mad or afraid to say something that he can't take back. Then boo hoo to Kenny whose been given every opportunity. His play has been atrocious.
I know it's really easy to bag on Mitch Trubisky who should be a be a cap casualty for 2024. Mitch is definitely behind Mason and Kenny. But Mitch at least has averaged over a passing TD a game for his career. Not this anemic .5 passing touchdowns that Kenny has per game.
Here's my thoughts on Dionate Johnson
1. Ridiculously overpaid paid as a WR1. He was surpassed this season by George.
2. Hands slightly better than Dwight Stone.
3. Needs to tone down on the antics.
4. Needs to play harder every game. Against the Bills he showed a lot of effort.
5. In the article above he endorses Mason for next season. Article does mention that Kenny hasn't really had a chance in a competent offense. But in my mind, he also hasn't shown that he can be a competent passer. I love the boldness of endorsing Mason for Kenny really hasn't earned the free pass to start next season that Tomlin more than likely will give him. Last 2 seasons there really wasn't a competition in camp. Once Mike has his mind set its set-in stone. I kind of liken this situation to the rookie's this year who he slow walked into playing / starting a number of them.
6. Next season with a competent passer like Mason or other. I see George further separating himself from Diontae.
Calvin Austin needs to make a leap forward next year. He was injured in rookie year. Much like Cory Trice was this year. In theory one might want to give a player whose missed an entire season the benefit of the doubt for at least 1 full season played.
Kenny Pickett skips final media availability of season. The article mentions He has 13 touchdown passes and 13 interceptions, in 25 career games. If he's upset, mad or afraid to say something that he can't take back. Then boo hoo to Kenny whose been given every opportunity. His play has been atrocious.
I know it's really easy to bag on Mitch Trubisky who should be a be a cap casualty for 2024. Mitch is definitely behind Mason and Kenny. But Mitch at least has averaged over a passing TD a game for his career. Not this anemic .5 passing touchdowns that Kenny has per game.
Grid71
Footballguy
I love the smell of a fresh new Steelers thread. Thanks for kicking us off @Godsbrother
Surprised at the Cal Austin negativity. I thought he performed well with his limited opportunities. Only 1 drop all season. Kick returns alone brought some juice. He got separation on deep routes. QBs struggled to make accurate throws. Best is yet to come once Mason Rudolph builds up a connection. He isn’t the best blocker so buried behind ARob as WR 4.
Surprised at the Cal Austin negativity. I thought he performed well with his limited opportunities. Only 1 drop all season. Kick returns alone brought some juice. He got separation on deep routes. QBs struggled to make accurate throws. Best is yet to come once Mason Rudolph builds up a connection. He isn’t the best blocker so buried behind ARob as WR 4.
3C's
Footballguy
Hard pass. Aging and over paid, diva traits, and locker room cancer rumors. I'll take Mason every day over that.
I guess I missed the part where Wilson was playing on a big contract next year and we already had Mason signed.
He's aging, like everyone else. That part is right, everything else is a bunch of conjecture.
3C's
Footballguy
Besides all the "noise"p, Russ isn't playing on a cheap contact. I believe his current contact is around $50M/yr. He's not signing elsewhere at less than half that. All things remaining the same, Russ for $30M or Mason at $15M, I'm going Mason. And yes, Mason is a free agent but if you give him low level starter money versus vet minimum (his current deal) he's probably not only back but given an actual real chance to win the job.
Mason probably won't cost a lot but Wilson might actually be cheaper, maybe to a point of league minimum type of stuff though I'd guess his main reason for not signing something that cheap is he'll want some commitment.
The thing to know on Wilson is he's likely going to get cut. When that happens the Broncos will owe him $17M in 2024 on a contract that likely has offsets to the degree that if he can't get $17m he's going to be essentially playing for free next year and his options for exceeding that pay scale are not abundant. Maybe he''ll want his contract structured in such a way it he gives you the first year cheap with major guarantees in the following years, in such a case as that I'd pass.
I'm definitely not saying I want to anoint Wilson as the starter. I am saying if he's as cheap as I think he might be I'd absolutely like to add him to the mix. A mix with Rudolph if possible.
N Zone
Footballguy
Nov. 21 2023 - Steelers fire Offensive Coordinator Matt Canada
Nov 26 2023 - Kenny Pickett:
Dec 3 2023 - Kenny Pickett
Kenny Pickett injured
Mason Rudolph enters and plays well the rest of the regular season.
Seems to me the O. C. change was what made the Steelers QBs much better, and the RBs and most everyone really.
I think Kenny Pickett should start and will and will have a very good 2024 with a good O.C.
Nov 26 2023 - Kenny Pickett:
Dec 3 2023 - Kenny Pickett
Kenny Pickett injured
Mason Rudolph enters and plays well the rest of the regular season.
Seems to me the O. C. change was what made the Steelers QBs much better, and the RBs and most everyone really.
I think Kenny Pickett should start and will and will have a very good 2024 with a good O.C.
Steelers4Life
Footballguy
That 278 yard performance against the Bengals resulted in 16 points. Rudolph put up 34 against them a couple weeks later. He didn't just complete passes, he took shots downfield and stood in the pocket to allow things to develop more.
If someone believes Pickett has a lot of room for improvement, that's fine. I don't and I hated the pick when they made it. He locked onto his primary read in college, and in his only good year at Pitt that target happened to be Jordan Addison (38% of his passing yards, 42% of his TDs in 2021). He does it in the pros too, forces balls, and misses open receivers. He has a LONG way to go before becoming even an adequate starter and I hope he has legit competition next year whether it's Rudolph or someone else.
Steelers4Life
Footballguy
That's to be expected. He's loose and a player's coach and he gives the players a lot of freedom. They love that. Also probably why his teams have had lots of drama, often lack discipline, and haven't had playoff success since the veteran core of talent that kep everyone in line started moving on in the early 2010's.
The standard in Pittsburgh has been lowered to the point that a solid regular season with no realistic shot in the playoffs has become a successful season.
fred_1_15301
Footballguy
Yeah Pickett is not the long term answer. There is nothing that he did at Pitt that makes me think that he will suddenly figure it out. As you said, he locked into a single receiver (usually Addison) and never even looked in another direction. The big difference at Pitt compared to here was that he appeared to be more accurate and athletic. It could be that Addison was typically 5 yards open and that the competition was just weak.
3C's
Footballguy
Ain't no damn way.
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
If KP was 22 next season instead of 26, I would say to cut him some slack. But he is what he is and was what he was when they drafted him. Terrible pick. They have to sign Mason and draft a QB. I don't think they spend big $$ on a free agent.
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
Mason has better pocket presence, a better arm, is better going through progressions, and doesn't play scared. KP could improve here in theory, but he is already old.
Godsbrother
Footballguy
A solid regular season is required in order to make the playoffs and have a realistic shot at winning. I don't know too many Steelers fans that are happy they haven't won a playoff game since 2016 so I don't think the standard has been lowered. However I do think that given the circumstances as they unfolded this year they did about as good as they were going to do and if TJ Watt plays in that Buffalo game they may have actually pulled off the upset. They certainly weren't going to contend for the Super Bowl with their QBs but a playoff win would have been nice.
That said, things have got to change. They need a new offensive coordinator, they need a legit center & left tackle and they need much better play from the quarterback. Personally I think they should re-sign Mason and go with him and KP for 2023. Address the offensive line and shore up middle linebacker and secondary through free agency and 2024 draft and then look to draft a better QB in 2025.
This is what they should have done in 2022 instead of wasting a pick on KP.
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
My First Mock of 2024:
20. Jeremiah Trotter Jr. - LB Clemson
51. Jackson Powers-Johnson - OC Oregon
84. Kris Jenkins - DT Michigan
115. Tykee Smith - S Georgia
116. Blake Fisher - OT Notre Dame
179. Joe Milton - QB Tennessee
212. Dwight McGlothern - CB Arkansas
Wanted another WR or Edge, but didn't fall that way.
20. Jeremiah Trotter Jr. - LB Clemson
51. Jackson Powers-Johnson - OC Oregon
84. Kris Jenkins - DT Michigan
115. Tykee Smith - S Georgia
116. Blake Fisher - OT Notre Dame
179. Joe Milton - QB Tennessee
212. Dwight McGlothern - CB Arkansas
Wanted another WR or Edge, but didn't fall that way.
fred_1_15301
Footballguy
Agree with all of this. I have little confidence that this will all happen though.
No mention of a Superbowl in the article below no mention of wanting to be in an AFC Championship game.
T.J. Watt: Extremely Frustrating' To Still Not Have Playoff Win
Steelers4Life
Footballguy
Agree with most of this for sure.
I just disagree with the idea that the standard hasn't been lowered. Maybe some fans still have those expectations, but a majority of the national media worships the ground Tomlin walks on and if the organization as a whole still had higher expectations, Tomlin would have been on the hot seat YEARS ago. As long as they keep winning their 9 or 10 games, ownership seems like they'll be satisfied and not force any changes. I don't see any reason to think Tomlin is going to all of a sudden swallow his ego and become better at identifying assistants outside the organization instead of just taking the easy route of promoting from within for the sake of continuity. I'll be pleasantly surprised if I'm wrong about that though.
I don't expect them to contend for the Super Bowl every year. I just don't expect them to be so content with mediocrity that they're afraid to make a change. I'd rather them at least try to win and fail than just stick with the status quo that's gotten them nowhere meaningful in 13 years.
Steelers4Life
Footballguy
If you're a highly thought of offensive coordinator, do you choose to come to Pittsburgh if your initial success is tied to Kenny Pickett's arm?
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
I think they need to avoid the college guys. I would love Kubiak -- think we have pieces that fit his style (and his dad's).
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
Tomlin presser:
- intends to coach Steelers in 2024. Expects contract will be taken care of at appropriate time
- KP listed as QB1 (I think I heard that), but there will be a competition -- nobody is anointed and competition bring out best in people
- Plan to have Rudolph back, but is a free agent
- Looking outside the building for new OC
Godsbrother
Footballguy
Yep. Good summary.
I am relieved that we will be looking outside of the organization for an OC but Tomlin's record in hiring them has been problematic.
Grid71
Footballguy
That’s an interview question for sure. How much control does the OC have over personnel decisions including QB?
Highly unlikely Pickett is QB1 next season unless Art puts his foot down. Need a new OC for input on Rudy signing vs a vet or hit the draft. Some coordinators on the list have ties to players like Fields and Cousins.
Personally, I hope Mason Rudolph gets the job
There was no competition in 2022 when the Steeler's went with Mitch. 2023 no competition when they went with Kenny. Mason was identified as being the best QB in camp by various media members. So, I expect the Steeler's to start Kenny. Give him every benefit of the doubt. Use the super lame excuse of football justice for Kenny. Kenny's situation reminds me so much of the players son growing up playing baseball. Whose given every chance in the world. Heard Bill Billick on the fan mention that Bill Walsh use to state after 25 games you know what type of QB you have. Granted there's the Canada affect. But I have no confidence in Kenny.
Grid71
Footballguy
We’ve seen enough of Pickett to know he isn’t a franchise QB. It’s not like he was a young development project as a rookie. Came in with more college experience than most. Will he get a shot to complete? Sure. But he should quickly find himself firmly in the #3 chair or #2 with a quick hook after his first spinning bail from the pocket signature move. It’s time to hand him the bust label and move forward.
Sad thing is, he shouldn’t have been a first round pick. Heaped expectations of franchise or bust. Take him in the 3rd or later then the hope is for a solid starter who might breakthrough. That would be more realistic.
steelers1080
Footballguy
That he reiterated that they're looking outside for OC was huge. Also, he did say that they were looking for someone with OC experience, so it sounds like they won't be going after a QB coach or something like that.
Someone asked about defensive coaches and Tomlin basically said that the evaluation of coaching staff is just starting. Same with evaluating players.
When talking about the OC search Tomlin said it'll be him, Omar, and Art, did not mention Weidl. I wonder if he's limited to scouting/players.
There was talk about some Vets and will they be back, but nothing concrete.
Cam in his separate press meeting did say that he's interested in playing for several more years past 2024, but also that he's aching. Not sure where that'll go. I'm hopeful that we extend him 1-2 more years and bring his cap hit down some, maybe with 1-2 void years at the end. I think that if he can get healthy and stay healthy, he can still be excellent for 2-3 more years.
I did see rumors start to swirl around Aaron Donald. That he wants to move back closer to Pittsburgh. Idk that there's any way we could afford it, but that would be absolutely wild. Watt, Donald, Benton, Heyward, Highsmith. QB be damned, we might still win the AFCN.
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
Hearing Eric B and Kubiak are top 2 preferred candidates.
Definitely looking into Cousins. Also a potential trade for Fields is on the table as well as another QB that I don’t want to mention for fear of identifying the source. But not one I had heard linked to us before who has a prolific career.
DJ def on the block — but I have heard this every year.
Definitely looking into Cousins. Also a potential trade for Fields is on the table as well as another QB that I don’t want to mention for fear of identifying the source. But not one I had heard linked to us before who has a prolific career.
DJ def on the block — but I have heard this every year.
Agree, both strong choices.
As far as I know on Eric B the potential HC ship has sailed away from his life for right now, have not even heard his name on the interview circuit this off-season.
Interesting and made me run through the possible candidates and found myself wondering does Ryan Tannehill qualify? Not that you need to answer, just talking out loud.
