3rd Round Reversal (1 Viewer)

[Carver Lee]

The basic idea is to penalize those lucky enough to draw high draft picks and reward the less fortunate lower half.

But is there any data that proves this is necessary? In a 12 team league, has it been proven that 1-5 have a decisive advantage over 7-12?

 

[Novice2]

If you hate the snake join an auction.

 

[Carver Lee]

Its not to penalize... its to set thing as close-to-even as possible before a pick is ever made.

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...7&hl=Banzai

Points for based on draft position...Taken from one of the guys at wcoff... 4 years of Data...

the numbers of 2004-2007:

DP-----PF-----% >1500

1-----1453-----0.38

2-----1427-----0.27

3-----1409-----0.26

4-----1374-----0.14

5-----1383-----0.18

6-----1385-----0.17

7-----1371-----0.17

8-----1354-----0.10

9-----1353-----0.13

10-----1354-----0.11

11-----1343-----0.10

12-----1347-----0.10

So as to understand the above data... 1500 was determined as the "make the playoffs" break mark.

Thus a % of teams from each spot that make the playoffs is correlated. Top 3 picks ea made the playoffs 30%; which is double the rate of any of the other positions.

Also note the league WINNERS racked up a 75% winning percentage from the top 4 selections, despite being just 33% of the field.

I have seen this data on multiple websites but it is the only data I've ever seen on the subject. Does anyone have their own data from their personal leagues?The consensus 1-5 picks last year were LT, AP, SJax and Westbrook.. there was 1 hit out of the 4 and even that is subjective.

 

[two_dollars]

Banzai style actually is the most even, with pick #5 statistically being the worst position, but the % is very small.

Banzai is not the same as 3rd round reversal before anyone decides to comment on that.

rd 1 is 1-12

rd 2 is 12-1

rd 3 is 12-1 just like a 3rr

rd 4 is 12-1 again

rd 5 is 1-12 and the snake continues normally

 

[VonRomig]

Be careful. If you don't like 3RR don't mention your opinion here, otherwise you will be threatened with banishment.

 

[KellysHeroes]

I like 3RR the best. But the Most Fair way to draft is auction.... it just takes forever to do.

 

[Adebisi]

Banzai style actually is the most even, with pick #5 statistically being the worst position, but the % is very small.Banzai is not the same as 3rd round reversal before anyone decides to comment on that.rd 1 is 1-12rd 2 is 12-1rd 3 is 12-1 just like a 3rrrd 4 is 12-1 againrd 5 is 1-12 and the snake continues normally

Since there are no Marshall Faulk/Priest Holmes-type monsters at the top of the draft these days, this seems like the guy picking 12th would have a huge advantage over the guy picking 1st.

 

[twistd]

Banzai style actually is the most even, with pick #5 statistically being the worst position, but the % is very small.Banzai is not the same as 3rd round reversal before anyone decides to comment on that.rd 1 is 1-12rd 2 is 12-1rd 3 is 12-1 just like a 3rrrd 4 is 12-1 againrd 5 is 1-12 and the snake continues normally

Since there are no Marshall Faulk/Priest Holmes-type monsters at the top of the draft these days, this seems like the guy picking 12th would have a huge advantage over the guy picking 1st.

It isn't just the advantage of the higher first round pick. It's the advantage of the two picks in the second and third round that really make the difference. Often times there are solid players at the end of the second, and in to the top of the third. But the talent from the beginning of the third versus the end of the third can be a pretty big drop off. The 3RR tries to make it a little more even. I agree that an auction is the best solution, but when that isn't an option the 3RR makes it a little fairer. I won't participate in a draft that isn't a 3RR.

 

[Captain Hook]

The basic idea is to penalize those lucky enough to draw high draft picks and reward the less fortunate lower half.

DEAD WRONG with this statement......the whole purpose is to even out the advantage that the first few drafters have - not just in the 1st round but more importantly at the 2/3 and 4/5 turns

But is there any data that proves this is necessary? In a 12 team league, has it been proven that 1-5 have a decisive advantage over 7-12?

YES - see Jeff Pasquino's articles that look at the point values per pick that have lots of data behind them.

In addition it is not just about the likelihood of making the right pick as you suggest in another of your posts, but the substantial value over many years of drafts that having three of the top 25 (or 29 or 21 depending on your league size) picks gives Team #1.Sure I agree that Auction Drafts are the best and fairest ways to populate the rosters in a league.....but many don't have the extra time (or if casual, office, or friend groups don't want to take the time) and it would be unfair in the large national FF contests because you might have one league with a lot of experienced auction drafters and one experienced guy/gal in a league with people who haven't auctioned before so you can't score them across the field like you can with a draft.....plus the logistics would be horrendous.

3RR (and Banzai) are well researched, thought out variations to make the drafts fairer for ALL the teams in the league.

 

[Adebisi]

Banzai style actually is the most even, with pick #5 statistically being the worst position, but the % is very small.Banzai is not the same as 3rd round reversal before anyone decides to comment on that.rd 1 is 1-12rd 2 is 12-1rd 3 is 12-1 just like a 3rrrd 4 is 12-1 againrd 5 is 1-12 and the snake continues normally

Since there are no Marshall Faulk/Priest Holmes-type monsters at the top of the draft these days, this seems like the guy picking 12th would have a huge advantage over the guy picking 1st.

It isn't just the advantage of the higher first round pick. It's the advantage of the two picks in the second and third round that really make the difference. Often times there are solid players at the end of the second, and in to the top of the third. But the talent from the beginning of the third versus the end of the third can be a pretty big drop off. The 3RR tries to make it a little more even. I agree that an auction is the best solution, but when that isn't an option the 3RR makes it a little fairer. I won't participate in a draft that isn't a 3RR.

I'm on board with that line of thinking. Where I start to raise an eyebrow is when the #12 team gets the 1st pick again in the 4th round.

 

[zed2283]

I have no experience in 3RR or other variations, but we've tried to track my snake redraft leagues over the years and have seen ZERO correllation between draft position and championships. Maybe it has to do with drafting (or not drafting) according to Hoyle.

 

[The High Priest]

Well Last 2 years I was #10,#12 and won both years, just the jimbob snake draft. I think its the middle rounds that win it for you......and the luck too

 

[Short Corner]

Its not to penalize... its to set thing as close-to-even as possible before a pick is ever made.

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...7&hl=Banzai

Points for based on draft position...Taken from one of the guys at wcoff... 4 years of Data...

the numbers of 2004-2007:

DP-----PF-----% >1500

1-----1453-----0.38

2-----1427-----0.27

3-----1409-----0.26

4-----1374-----0.14

5-----1383-----0.18

6-----1385-----0.17

7-----1371-----0.17

8-----1354-----0.10

9-----1353-----0.13

10-----1354-----0.11

11-----1343-----0.10

12-----1347-----0.10

So as to understand the above data... 1500 was determined as the "make the playoffs" break mark.

Thus a % of teams from each spot that make the playoffs is correlated. Top 3 picks ea made the playoffs 30%; which is double the rate of any of the other positions.

Also note the league WINNERS racked up a 75% winning percentage from the top 4 selections, despite being just 33% of the field.

I have seen this data on multiple websites but it is the only data I've ever seen on the subject. Does anyone have their own data from their personal leagues?The consensus 1-5 picks last year were LT, AP, SJax and Westbrook.. there was 1 hit out of the 4 and even that is subjective.

All I have is our last 6 years worth of drafts, but in our 10 team league with no playoffs, the last 6 winners have picked from 4-1-3-2-1-1. Of the 18 money spots, 12 were taken by the top half of the draft.

 

[two_dollars]

read more here:

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...howtopic=408850