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#8 pick strategy (1 Viewer)

Evilgrin 72

Distributor of Pain
.....and because I pick 8th in my $$ league. :D

Strategy for the first 6 rounds or so - what have you got? I'll give you my train of thought, feel free to tell me where I am making mistakes. Let's assume 12-team league, standard non-PPR scoring, all TDs 6 points.

Note : As a point of reference, when I discuss my OWN PERSONAL draft strategy, my league is a 12-team, non-PPR, all TD2 6 league, but differences are that the league is NO TE REQUIRED and also awards yardage at 1 pt/20 yards rushing, 1 pt/15 yards receiving (for WR and TE only, RBs get 1 pt/20 yards) and 1 pt/50 yards passing.

First round, I am really looking solely at the RB position. I think pick #8 in a 12-team is too early to start looking at Manning or the receivers, so I am pretty much dead set on an RB here. Now, it's pretty obvious that Alexander, Tomlinson, and LJ in some order are the top 3. Portis is a cinch to be gone as well, as there are 7 U of Miami grads in the league. For that matter, Edge is probably gone as well, so that's 6. I would normally think Barber would be a top choice as well, but last year, I had him ranked 9th in our scoring system going into the draft and he fell to 2.11, where I happily snapped him up. So, if he drops again, is he the sure fire pick here? Assuming he's gone as he will be in most drafts, then all but one of the following backs are available : Lamont Jordan, Steven Jackson, Rudi Johnson, Ronnie Brown, and Cadillac Williams. In a non-PPR that is somewhat TD heavy as mine is, I tend towards Rudi, whose proven TD output is a real plus. People will argue over who the best pick here is : what do you think?

Second round becomes very interesting. Manning's current ADP has him going off the board at the vbottom of round 1 or very top of round 2, but the standard variance shows that there's at least a slim chance that he's there at 2.5. If so, is he worth the investment, or do you sit on a QB and wait until the later rounds? If we don't go Manning, then an interesting choice arises. Take a second back, a la Kevin Jones, Westbrook, McGahee, Dom Davis, Julius Jones, Willie Parker, etc? Or go to a top-tier WR? ADP looks like in most leagues, Steve Smith and T.O. are gone at this pick, leaving a group of Holt, Chad Johnson, Fitzgerald, and Harrison as the available talent at this juncture. My plan is to rank the likely available RBs and WRs by VBD and simply choose the highest rated, regardless of position. Using the draft dominator and most recent projections by FBG, in my scoring system, it seems extremely likely that it's the WR spot that is going to provide the most value here, numerically. I am leaning towards a WR here.

Now, your third round from the 8 hole will depend largely on your second round choice, and your own personal strategy. Most will likely look to add a legit WR1 here if you went RB/RB in the first two rounds. However, there are those who like to take RBs until the cows come home. If a WR or QB was the second round choice, then RB becomes very attractive here as well. Available talent at this point seems like Darrell Jackson, Plaxico Burress and Santana Moss at WR (Ward and Chambers are going off a few picks before 3.8 in most drafts) and Reggie Bush, Reuben Droughns, Warrick Dunn, and DeShaun Foster at RB. Also, Carson Palmer becomes a possibility if, as in most cases, you haven't drafted Manning. To me, unless a more proven commodity like Ward drops to this spot, I might go RB here regardless. Frankly, DJax scares me with his recent injury woes and Burress is inconsistent. Moss would likely be my first choice of those three, but his targets are likely to plummet, making a reasonable facsimile of last year's numbers seem like a pipe dream. If I went WR in round 2, I'd almost definitely take a second back here, as the 4 guys I listed above are likely to be gone by round 4, according to ADP. Now, of those four, Bush is the x factor, Droughns is a powerful back on a lousy team, which limits his TD #s, Dunn is a steady yardage performer whose stock slips a bit in my TD-heavy scoring, and Foster has terrific upside potential in the Carolina offense, but a history of injuries. I might lean towards swinging for the fences with Bush here. However, I have to admit, Palmer is intriguing here, as his upside most likely provides the highest VBD ceiling of any player around at this spot. If you play in a TE-required league, do you consider Gates here?

Fourth round - if Palmer is still there, do you grab him now? If not, do you grab another QB here, or wait? QBs typically seem to start flying off the board in rounds 4 & 5 in my drafts, so without another pick until 5.8, one must at least consider it. Brady, Hasselbeck, McNabb, Palmer, Eli, Culpepper, and Delhomme could all conceivably be gone before we choose again - more likely 4-5 of those QBs are, and maybe Delhomme and Culpepper last until the late 5th. RBs going in this range include Tatum Bell, Corey Dillon, Joe Addai, Cedric Benson, and Deuce McAllister. Risk/reward picks, every one of them. Would a McAllister pick here make sense if you drafted Bush in the previous round? Deuce is going on average at 5.4, but as early as 2.11 and as late as 8.2. Would you wait a round and take your chances? I think so, because the WR value here is solid, IMO. Andre Johnson, Donald Driver, Javon Walker, and Antonio Gates (in non-TE leagues) are all typically on the board at this point, and IMO, represent more solid choices than the RBs I listed above. Assuming we have 2 RBs and 1 WR at this point, where would you go with this pick?

Fifth round - Looking briefly at some players typically available here.... Dominic Rhodes is an enticing possibility as an RB3. McNabb is there about 50% of the time, but I think I'd wait until round 6 for a QB if I hadn't drafted one yet. Houshmandzadeh, Branch, and Mason are possibilities, as their ADPs are 5.5, 5.6, and 5.7 respectively. If they're all gone, Galloway is likely still on the board. This seems to be a spot in the draft where people ease off receivers and start grabbing the remaining few solid backs and mid-first tier QBs, so I think I'd wait on a receiver too, unless maybe Houshmandzadeh or Mason fell to me. Aside from Rhodes, Thomas Jones, Frank Gore, and Ron Dayne are on the board at this point. If you go RB here, who's the best choice?

Sixth round - Bulger is sitting there, if you have the stones to draft him. He killed it for me as a 4th round selection last year, until his injury and Brunell's simultaneous collapse destroyed my season. Other QBs who may be there, but aren't likely to be there in round 7 include Delhomme, Bledsoe, and Kurt Warner. Would this be the spot to jump on a QB if you haven't drafted one already, or would you wait on a Plummer or Aaron Brooks in rounds 7-8? RBs by now are sketchy - Dayne MAY still be there, other than him, you're looking at DeAngelo Williams, Chris Brown, Curtis Martin, and LenDale White. One more reason why I think round 5 is best spent on an RB. At the WR spot, we see Michael Clayton, Reggie Brown, Rod Smith, and Nate Burleson. I'm personally not enamored with any of those guys, and think equal production can be found in rounds 7-10, so I think I'd go QB here.

Thus, to sum up, my thinking right now would likely land me a first 6 picks of :

QB : Bulger

RB1 : Steven Jackson

RB2 : Reggie Bush

RB3 : Dominic Rhodes

WR1 : Torry Holt

WR2: Donald Driver

Another possible outcome :

QB : Bledsoe

RB1 : Rudi Johnson

RB2 : Warrick Dunn

RB3 : Ron Dayne

WR1 : Chad Johnson

WR2 : Javon Walker

What do you guys think of these two starts? What might you do differently?

Let's get some good dialogue going.

 
From the #8 spot, in a non TE league...

I like RB/WR/RB/WR/WR/QB if you can get these guys...

1-Ronnie Brown (going from 8-11)

2-T.Holt

3-R.Bush at RB (If he is still there)

4-Driver/Gates/Walker

5-TJ Housh

6-Bulger

So your team would be off to a great start with...

QB-Bulger

RB1-R.Brown

RB2-R.Bush

WR1-T.Holt

WR2-Driver

WR3-TJ Housh

I think a team with those core guys will easily make the playoffs. (barring multiple injuries.) The rest of your team will round out depth at QB, RB, WR, etc.

 
In a TE required league Gates will probably not make it to 3.08. He is going at the turn in most drafts 2.12 - 3.3

 
well seeing how I have #8 in one of my leagues and the entire league posts here - I guess I have to wait to share! but I will post results - draft is 8/17/06 - 14 teamer

 
From the #8 spot, in a non TE league...I like RB/WR/RB/WR/WR/QB if you can get these guys...1-Ronnie Brown (going from 8-11)2-T.Holt3-R.Bush at RB (If he is still there)4-Driver/Gates/Walker5-TJ Housh6-BulgerSo your team would be off to a great start with...QB-BulgerRB1-R.BrownRB2-R.BushWR1-T.HoltWR2-DriverWR3-TJ HoushI think a team with those core guys will easily make the playoffs. (barring multiple injuries.) The rest of your team will round out depth at QB, RB, WR, etc.
Do you think that given the available players, if things follow ADP (obviously we're all smart enough to draft for value should it present itself) - that RB/WR/RB/WR is the way to go in the first 4 rounds? Also, you'd take another WR in round 5 rather than a 3rd back? And finally - if Manning is there at 2.5, do you take him, or go for Holt (for example) instead?
 
From the #8 spot, in a non TE league...I like RB/WR/RB/WR/WR/QB if you can get these guys...1-Ronnie Brown (going from 8-11)2-T.Holt3-R.Bush at RB (If he is still there)4-Driver/Gates/Walker5-TJ Housh6-BulgerSo your team would be off to a great start with...QB-BulgerRB1-R.BrownRB2-R.BushWR1-T.HoltWR2-DriverWR3-TJ HoushI think a team with those core guys will easily make the playoffs. (barring multiple injuries.) The rest of your team will round out depth at QB, RB, WR, etc.
Do you think that given the available players, if things follow ADP (obviously we're all smart enough to draft for value should it present itself) - that RB/WR/RB/WR is the way to go in the first 4 rounds? Also, you'd take another WR in round 5 rather than a 3rd back? And finally - if Manning is there at 2.5, do you take him, or go for Holt (for example) instead?
For me personally, I will pass on Manning even if he lasted until 2.5, and I play in a 6pt/td league, and go WR here. I would target a QB later on in the draft.From the mock drafts I have been on I am seeing about 6 wr's going in the first and 2nd rounds leaving depth at RB for your 3rd round pick. Probably because they all seem in the same tier.The 3rd and 4th round picks depend on who is available at the 3rd pick. If Bush is there, I take a flier on him. He won't last until your 4th round pick for sure. If he isn't there, I could go best WR here instead then RB in the 4th. My plan for RB to cover for bye weeks, injury and bust would be to load up on the remaining RB's in the later rounds 7-12. I would carry more players at RB than at any other position, hoping to hit on a late round gem, or player that becomes a starter due to injury. With the 3 WR's I would have at this point, I am confident they would be my every week starters and I would only need maybe 1 or 2 more to cover for bye weeks that can be plucked fromt he late rounds/waiver wire.
 
From the #8 spot, in a non TE league...I like RB/WR/RB/WR/WR/QB if you can get these guys...1-Ronnie Brown (going from 8-11)2-T.Holt3-R.Bush at RB (If he is still there)4-Driver/Gates/Walker5-TJ Housh6-BulgerSo your team would be off to a great start with...QB-BulgerRB1-R.BrownRB2-R.BushWR1-T.HoltWR2-DriverWR3-TJ HoushI think a team with those core guys will easily make the playoffs. (barring multiple injuries.) The rest of your team will round out depth at QB, RB, WR, etc.
Do you think that given the available players, if things follow ADP (obviously we're all smart enough to draft for value should it present itself) - that RB/WR/RB/WR is the way to go in the first 4 rounds? Also, you'd take another WR in round 5 rather than a 3rd back? And finally - if Manning is there at 2.5, do you take him, or go for Holt (for example) instead?
For me personally, I will pass on Manning even if he lasted until 2.5, and I play in a 6pt/td league, and go WR here. I would target a QB later on in the draft.From the mock drafts I have been on I am seeing about 6 wr's going in the first and 2nd rounds leaving depth at RB for your 3rd round pick. Probably because they all seem in the same tier.The 3rd and 4th round picks depend on who is available at the 3rd pick. If Bush is there, I take a flier on him. He won't last until your 4th round pick for sure. If he isn't there, I could go best WR here instead then RB in the 4th. My plan for RB to cover for bye weeks, injury and bust would be to load up on the remaining RB's in the later rounds 7-12. I would carry more players at RB than at any other position, hoping to hit on a late round gem, or player that becomes a starter due to injury. With the 3 WR's I would have at this point, I am confident they would be my every week starters and I would only need maybe 1 or 2 more to cover for bye weeks that can be plucked fromt he late rounds/waiver wire.
Hmmmm... very interesting take. For some reason, I always panic if I am only two deep with likely starters at RB, and that might lead me to Rhodes in round 5, but honestly, I'll probably just evaluate it the same way as the third round pick, and just draft by VBD. I also want to earmark a # of RBs I see as viable options in the lineup and use ADP and past drafts in my league to see at which pick those RBs are likely to be exhausted - then make sure I draft in such a way as to get at least 4 of them, similar to what you are saying above.
 
I have #8 in a 10-team league. I plan to take Ronnie Brown there. On the comeback I am not so sure. I'm leaning towards Holt as I have him as my #1 WR and doubt he will be there for me in the 3rd, even in a 10 team league. Although I will be tempted to take Westbrook or Rudi in the 2nd if they're there. ####, maybe Holt will fall in the 3rd to me? hmmmmmm

 
:blackdot:

I am in the same hole in my league and a lot of what you are saying is what I have been debating. I will get back later though and post some of my own thoughts. Good writeup though EG.

 
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As much as it pains me to *help* a Pittsburgh fan, here goes. ;)

I'm sitting on #7 in a 14 team league, so basically the same options you're considering (at least till the extra picks push me out in the later rounds).

I agree w/ your top 3 options @ RB in the 1st. And personally I'm leaning towards RB now. I've been bumping all 3 (Rudi, SJax, RB) around for what seems like months now, and mainly due to schedule and OLine, I'm thinking RB will come out on top of that group (even w/ less experience). Rudi's schedule and Palmer's injury are pushing me here. Sure, RB hasn't yet proven it over a full season (carrying the load himself), but he's got the opportunity & surrounding talent - combined w/ a weaker (D wise) division - to excel this year. 1200 (combined) & 9tds = floor w/ 1500 (combined) & 14 tds = ceiling IMHO

I would also not (personally) draft both SJax AND Holt in the first 2 rds. Too many eggs in STLs basket - considering the new coaching staff and avg. schedule.

I'd pass on Manning in R2 w/ the value QBs (even a late round QBBC tandem) in the mid-late rounds. And I'm not drinking the RBush koolaid this year. At least not in the 3rd.

Even w/ the extra 4 picks I'm looking @ (in a 14 teamer), I'm still likely going WR in the mid 2nd and should see one of Fitz, Moss, Holt (crosses fingers), or Harrison. In R3, back to the RBs, but this one will depend on the pre-season and injury report. I'm hoping for C Taylor or Dunn in R3 @ this point.

 
:blackdot:I am in the same hole in my league and a lot of what you are saying is what I have been debating. I will get back later though and post some of my own thoughts. Good writeup though EG.
Thanks, man. I'm looking forward to hearing where you stand on some of these calls, as you are a shark pooler whose opinion I highly value and respect.
 
This Article on the new Miami O-line coach has me high on Ronnie Brown and is a big reason why I am hoping to get him at #8.

Houck holding the line for Dolphins

Respected coach trying to mold Miami unit into a force

COMMENTARY

By Dennis Dillon

The Sporting News

Updated: 7:36 p.m. ET July 25, 2006

In 1970, the freshman football coach at Southern California looked at the varsity's offensive line coach and saw what he wanted to be: a great teacher and disciplinarian, a leader who was demanding but also had fun with his players. "If he would have stayed and been an offensive line coach, he would have been the best there was," the freshman coach says, 36 years later.

You know what became of the line coach? He led the Redskins to three Super Bowl championships and was elected to the Pro Football Hall of Fame in 1996. Now, Joe Gibbs is in his second term in Washington.

The freshman coach also advanced to the NFL, where he has found a way to star in a supporting role for five teams in the past 23 years. You might not recognize his name, but he became what he envisioned Gibbs could have been.

"If there was a Hall of Fame for offensive line coaches," says Chargers tackle Roman Oben, "Hudson Houck would be first in line."

Houck has left his fingerprints from Seattle to Miami. When he was with the Rams (1983-1991), Eric Dickerson won three NFL rushing titles and five offensive linemen were selected to a combined 21 Pro Bowls. When he was with the Seahawks ('92), Chris Warren had the first 1,000-yard rushing performance of his career. When Houck was with the Cowboys (1993-2001), Emmitt Smith was a two-time rushing champion and six linemen racked up 22 Pro Bowl selections combined.

Among the prominent linemen Houck has tutored are Anthony Munoz and Bruce Matthews (during Houck's tenure as USC's line coach from 1976-82); Jackie Slater, Doug Smith and Dennis Harrah in Los Angeles; and Larry Allen, Erik Williams and Nate Newton in Dallas. Munoz and Slater are in the Hall of Fame; Matthews and Allen eventually will join them.

"It's not a coincidence that wherever he's been, it seems there's somebody who emerges as one of the game's best," former Cowboys quarterback Troy Aikman says.

But one of Houck's best coaching jobs came sans star power. Two years ago in San Diego, he took five new starters — a combination of pedestrian veterans and inexperienced youngsters — and molded them into a cohesive unit that helped the Chargers finish third in the league in scoring, fourth in fewest sacks allowed and sixth in rushing. They won 12 games and went to the playoffs for the first time in nine years.

Going into his second season as Miami's line coach, Houck faces a similar challenge. The Dolphins are expected to have new starters at left tackle (free-agent addition L.J. Shelton), center (former guard Rex Hadnot) and right guard (Bennie Anderson or Seth McKinney). After Miami closed the 2005 season with six straight wins, some preseason publications, including Sporting News, project the Dolphins as a wild-card team. The line will be a big factor in determining the season's outcome.

"Getting the new guys, the new pieces of the puzzle, and putting them together is our major goal at this point," says Houck.

A three-year center at USC who helped the Trojans win the 1962 national championship, Houck has flirted with other positions during his career. He wouldn't have minded coaching running backs, defensive backs or linebackers. But he has stayed betrothed to the offensive line, a unit that can be as sturdy as brick or as breakable as straw depending on its coordinated effort.

"You've got to have five guys working on the same page," Houck says. "They've got to have the same communication. They all have to be doing the correct footwork."

It all requires choreography, and no one devises line schemes better than Houck, who breaks down his philosophy into three areas.

He teaches physical football by emphasizing leverage, the best technique for moving a defender. Houck compares it to sumo wrestling.

He puts his players in the best position to succeed by devising drills that simulate what they'll do in a game — and repeating them over and over.

He sets the standard. "I've got to let them know when they're not putting in enough effort," he says. "And that's something they don't want to hear sometimes."

Houck has coached through personal tragedy — his first wife died on Christmas Day 1988 after a long bout with cancer. He is 63 and has two years left on his contract. How much longer will he continue?

"I'm just going to keep going until that motor wears out — or until my wife says, 'That's enough,' " he says.

That day will have to wait. The master choreographer still has a lot of line dancing to direct.

© 2006 The Sporting News
 
As much as it pains me to *help* a Pittsburgh fan, here goes. ;) I'm sitting on #7 in a 14 team league, so basically the same options you're considering (at least till the extra picks push me out in the later rounds).I agree w/ your top 3 options @ RB in the 1st. And personally I'm leaning towards RB now. I've been bumping all 3 (Rudi, SJax, RB) around for what seems like months now, and mainly due to schedule and OLine, I'm thinking RB will come out on top of that group (even w/ less experience). Rudi's schedule and Palmer's injury are pushing me here. Sure, RB hasn't yet proven it over a full season (carrying the load himself), but he's got the opportunity & surrounding talent - combined w/ a weaker (D wise) division - to excel this year. 1200 (combined) & 9tds = floor w/ 1500 (combined) & 14 tds = ceiling IMHOI would also not (personally) draft both SJax AND Holt in the first 2 rds. Too many eggs in STLs basket - considering the new coaching staff and avg. schedule.I'd pass on Manning in R2 w/ the value QBs (even a late round QBBC tandem) in the mid-late rounds. And I'm not drinking the RBush koolaid this year. At least not in the 3rd.Even w/ the extra 4 picks I'm looking @ (in a 14 teamer), I'm still likely going WR in the mid 2nd and should see one of Fitz, Moss, Holt (crosses fingers), or Harrison. In R3, back to the RBs, but this one will depend on the pre-season and injury report. I'm hoping for C Taylor or Dunn in R3 @ this point.
Great stuff here. I'm seeing more and more Ronnie Brown supporters at this spot - I may need to move him up. I've really had Jackson and Rudi neck and neck with Jordan a step behind him and Brown a step behind Jordan, but I may need to reconsider that.You bring up an interesting point with the Holt/Jackson thing. I had a draft a few weeks back I posted about here where I took Rudi and Chad Johnson in the first two rounds, but just didn't feel good about it. Would you let your first round choice dictate your second rounder (i.e. avoiding two players on the same team)?I'd be thrilled with Willie Parker or Taylor in round 3, but their ADPs continue to rise where now Parker seems to be a late 2nd rounder, and Taylor is gone in the first 3-4 picks of round 3. Dunn might really be my pick in round 3, but there's something about Bush's upside that tantalizes me. I was thinking about it yesterday, and you have to figure the least the Saints are going to get the guy is 8-10 carries and 3-4 receptions a game. They almost have to in order to justify his salary. If he averages near 5 ypc (which I am highly confident he can) and 10-12 ypr, you're looking at anywhere from 70-100 combined yards a game, minimum, just on those touches. Add in kick returning, and he's a pretty good bet to put up at least 6-8 TDs as well. Those numbers really don't vary all that much from what Dunn put up last year (as long as Duckett is around, he's not going to score a lot of TDs.) Now, imagine if he proves to be considerably better than McAllister, or Deuce gets hurt again. Now we could be looking at a huge season. I'm not sold on Bush, nor am I trying to sell him, this is just my thought process here.
 
This Article on the new Miami O-line coach has me high on Ronnie Brown and is a big reason why I am hoping to get him at #8.

Houck holding the line for Dolphins

Respected coach trying to mold Miami unit into a force

COMMENTARY

By Dennis Dillon

The Sporting News

Updated: 7:36 p.m. ET July 25, 2006

In 1970, the freshman football coach at Southern California looked at the varsity's offensive line coach and saw what he wanted to be: a great teacher and disciplinarian, a leader who was demanding but also had fun with his players. "If he would have stayed and been an offensive line coach, he would have been the best there was," the freshman coach says, 36 years later.

You know what became of the line coach? He led the Redskins to three Super Bowl championships and was elected to the Pro Football Hall of Fame in 1996. Now, Joe Gibbs is in his second term in Washington.

The freshman coach also advanced to the NFL, where he has found a way to star in a supporting role for five teams in the past 23 years. You might not recognize his name, but he became what he envisioned Gibbs could have been.

"If there was a Hall of Fame for offensive line coaches," says Chargers tackle Roman Oben, "Hudson Houck would be first in line."

Houck has left his fingerprints from Seattle to Miami. When he was with the Rams (1983-1991), Eric Dickerson won three NFL rushing titles and five offensive linemen were selected to a combined 21 Pro Bowls. When he was with the Seahawks ('92), Chris Warren had the first 1,000-yard rushing performance of his career. When Houck was with the Cowboys (1993-2001), Emmitt Smith was a two-time rushing champion and six linemen racked up 22 Pro Bowl selections combined.

Among the prominent linemen Houck has tutored are Anthony Munoz and Bruce Matthews (during Houck's tenure as USC's line coach from 1976-82); Jackie Slater, Doug Smith and Dennis Harrah in Los Angeles; and Larry Allen, Erik Williams and Nate Newton in Dallas. Munoz and Slater are in the Hall of Fame; Matthews and Allen eventually will join them.

"It's not a coincidence that wherever he's been, it seems there's somebody who emerges as one of the game's best," former Cowboys quarterback Troy Aikman says.

But one of Houck's best coaching jobs came sans star power. Two years ago in San Diego, he took five new starters — a combination of pedestrian veterans and inexperienced youngsters — and molded them into a cohesive unit that helped the Chargers finish third in the league in scoring, fourth in fewest sacks allowed and sixth in rushing. They won 12 games and went to the playoffs for the first time in nine years.

Going into his second season as Miami's line coach, Houck faces a similar challenge. The Dolphins are expected to have new starters at left tackle (free-agent addition L.J. Shelton), center (former guard Rex Hadnot) and right guard (Bennie Anderson or Seth McKinney). After Miami closed the 2005 season with six straight wins, some preseason publications, including Sporting News, project the Dolphins as a wild-card team. The line will be a big factor in determining the season's outcome.

"Getting the new guys, the new pieces of the puzzle, and putting them together is our major goal at this point," says Houck.

A three-year center at USC who helped the Trojans win the 1962 national championship, Houck has flirted with other positions during his career. He wouldn't have minded coaching running backs, defensive backs or linebackers. But he has stayed betrothed to the offensive line, a unit that can be as sturdy as brick or as breakable as straw depending on its coordinated effort.

"You've got to have five guys working on the same page," Houck says. "They've got to have the same communication. They all have to be doing the correct footwork."

It all requires choreography, and no one devises line schemes better than Houck, who breaks down his philosophy into three areas.

He teaches physical football by emphasizing leverage, the best technique for moving a defender. Houck compares it to sumo wrestling.

He puts his players in the best position to succeed by devising drills that simulate what they'll do in a game — and repeating them over and over.

He sets the standard. "I've got to let them know when they're not putting in enough effort," he says. "And that's something they don't want to hear sometimes."

Houck has coached through personal tragedy — his first wife died on Christmas Day 1988 after a long bout with cancer. He is 63 and has two years left on his contract. How much longer will he continue?

"I'm just going to keep going until that motor wears out — or until my wife says, 'That's enough,' " he says.

That day will have to wait. The master choreographer still has a lot of line dancing to direct.

© 2006 The Sporting News
Good stuff here. I personally am high on the Dolphins this year and think Brown could be excellent.. I just don't know if I'd take him over Rudi in a low-performance scoring system.
 
I have now done three mock drafts. In two of the three I have taken Jordan, although Brown and Rudi have been available. In the other, Jackson fell to me at 8. Interesting that I don't consider Rudi having as much upside as others do. Can someone give me a compelling arguement as to Rudi over Jordan or Brown?

In the second one player who wasn't mentioned but has been there in every mock I have done is Westbrook. While I know there are questions with Westy, I think his upside would be too much to pass on here if he were available.

I also plan on sluffing QB until at least the 6th. In one mock I took Hasselbeck in the 5th and then looking at the WR that were still available (TJ Houz. and Driver) I was kicking myself for taking a QB at this point.

Just my 2 cents.

 
This Article on the new Miami O-line coach has me high on Ronnie Brown and is a big reason why I am hoping to get him at #8.

Houck holding the line for Dolphins

Respected coach trying to mold Miami unit into a force

COMMENTARY

By Dennis Dillon

The Sporting News

Updated: 7:36 p.m. ET July 25, 2006

In 1970, the freshman football coach at Southern California looked at the varsity's offensive line coach and saw what he wanted to be: a great teacher and disciplinarian, a leader who was demanding but also had fun with his players. "If he would have stayed and been an offensive line coach, he would have been the best there was," the freshman coach says, 36 years later.

You know what became of the line coach? He led the Redskins to three Super Bowl championships and was elected to the Pro Football Hall of Fame in 1996. Now, Joe Gibbs is in his second term in Washington.

The freshman coach also advanced to the NFL, where he has found a way to star in a supporting role for five teams in the past 23 years. You might not recognize his name, but he became what he envisioned Gibbs could have been.

"If there was a Hall of Fame for offensive line coaches," says Chargers tackle Roman Oben, "Hudson Houck would be first in line."

Houck has left his fingerprints from Seattle to Miami. When he was with the Rams (1983-1991), Eric Dickerson won three NFL rushing titles and five offensive linemen were selected to a combined 21 Pro Bowls. When he was with the Seahawks ('92), Chris Warren had the first 1,000-yard rushing performance of his career. When Houck was with the Cowboys (1993-2001), Emmitt Smith was a two-time rushing champion and six linemen racked up 22 Pro Bowl selections combined.

Among the prominent linemen Houck has tutored are Anthony Munoz and Bruce Matthews (during Houck's tenure as USC's line coach from 1976-82); Jackie Slater, Doug Smith and Dennis Harrah in Los Angeles; and Larry Allen, Erik Williams and Nate Newton in Dallas. Munoz and Slater are in the Hall of Fame; Matthews and Allen eventually will join them.

"It's not a coincidence that wherever he's been, it seems there's somebody who emerges as one of the game's best," former Cowboys quarterback Troy Aikman says.

But one of Houck's best coaching jobs came sans star power. Two years ago in San Diego, he took five new starters — a combination of pedestrian veterans and inexperienced youngsters — and molded them into a cohesive unit that helped the Chargers finish third in the league in scoring, fourth in fewest sacks allowed and sixth in rushing. They won 12 games and went to the playoffs for the first time in nine years.

Going into his second season as Miami's line coach, Houck faces a similar challenge. The Dolphins are expected to have new starters at left tackle (free-agent addition L.J. Shelton), center (former guard Rex Hadnot) and right guard (Bennie Anderson or Seth McKinney). After Miami closed the 2005 season with six straight wins, some preseason publications, including Sporting News, project the Dolphins as a wild-card team. The line will be a big factor in determining the season's outcome.

"Getting the new guys, the new pieces of the puzzle, and putting them together is our major goal at this point," says Houck.

A three-year center at USC who helped the Trojans win the 1962 national championship, Houck has flirted with other positions during his career. He wouldn't have minded coaching running backs, defensive backs or linebackers. But he has stayed betrothed to the offensive line, a unit that can be as sturdy as brick or as breakable as straw depending on its coordinated effort.

"You've got to have five guys working on the same page," Houck says. "They've got to have the same communication. They all have to be doing the correct footwork."

It all requires choreography, and no one devises line schemes better than Houck, who breaks down his philosophy into three areas.

He teaches physical football by emphasizing leverage, the best technique for moving a defender. Houck compares it to sumo wrestling.

He puts his players in the best position to succeed by devising drills that simulate what they'll do in a game — and repeating them over and over.

He sets the standard. "I've got to let them know when they're not putting in enough effort," he says. "And that's something they don't want to hear sometimes."

Houck has coached through personal tragedy — his first wife died on Christmas Day 1988 after a long bout with cancer. He is 63 and has two years left on his contract. How much longer will he continue?

"I'm just going to keep going until that motor wears out — or until my wife says, 'That's enough,' " he says.

That day will have to wait. The master choreographer still has a lot of line dancing to direct.

© 2006 The Sporting News
Good stuff here. I personally am high on the Dolphins this year and think Brown could be excellent.. I just don't know if I'd take him over Rudi in a low-performance scoring system.
Rudi has to play the Steelers twice. I dont need that kind of inner conflict.My dilemma is going to be in the second round. Being only a 10 team league both Westbrook and Holt can very well be there for me. I always draft for value and if no WRs are off the board yet, I'd probably go with Westy, but having Holt as my #1 rated WR will make it tough (no way Holt falls back to me at 28 I would say)

 
I have now done three mock drafts. In two of the three I have taken Jordan, although Brown and Rudi have been available. In the other, Jackson fell to me at 8. Interesting that I don't consider Rudi having as much upside as others do. Can someone give me a compelling arguement as to Rudi over Jordan or Brown?In the second one player who wasn't mentioned but has been there in every mock I have done is Westbrook. While I know there are questions with Westy, I think his upside would be too much to pass on here if he were available.I also plan on sluffing QB until at least the 6th. In one mock I took Hasselbeck in the 5th and then looking at the WR that were still available (TJ Houz. and Driver) I was kicking myself for taking a QB at this point.Just my 2 cents.
In a non-PPR, TD heavy format like my league is, I like Rudi's consistency. Barring something unforeseen, you're going to get about 1,300+ yards and 12-13 TDs from Rudi, whereas Jackson, Brown, and Westbrook have never posted such stats. In a PPR league, I like Jordan and Westbrook a lot better, but in a TD-heavy league, I tend to favor consistent, workhorse-back types.
 
This Article on the new Miami O-line coach has me high on Ronnie Brown and is a big reason why I am hoping to get him at #8.

Houck holding the line for Dolphins

Respected coach trying to mold Miami unit into a force

COMMENTARY

By Dennis Dillon

The Sporting News

Updated: 7:36 p.m. ET July 25, 2006

In 1970, the freshman football coach at Southern California looked at the varsity's offensive line coach and saw what he wanted to be: a great teacher and disciplinarian, a leader who was demanding but also had fun with his players. "If he would have stayed and been an offensive line coach, he would have been the best there was," the freshman coach says, 36 years later.

You know what became of the line coach? He led the Redskins to three Super Bowl championships and was elected to the Pro Football Hall of Fame in 1996. Now, Joe Gibbs is in his second term in Washington.

The freshman coach also advanced to the NFL, where he has found a way to star in a supporting role for five teams in the past 23 years. You might not recognize his name, but he became what he envisioned Gibbs could have been.

"If there was a Hall of Fame for offensive line coaches," says Chargers tackle Roman Oben, "Hudson Houck would be first in line."

Houck has left his fingerprints from Seattle to Miami. When he was with the Rams (1983-1991), Eric Dickerson won three NFL rushing titles and five offensive linemen were selected to a combined 21 Pro Bowls. When he was with the Seahawks ('92), Chris Warren had the first 1,000-yard rushing performance of his career. When Houck was with the Cowboys (1993-2001), Emmitt Smith was a two-time rushing champion and six linemen racked up 22 Pro Bowl selections combined.

Among the prominent linemen Houck has tutored are Anthony Munoz and Bruce Matthews (during Houck's tenure as USC's line coach from 1976-82); Jackie Slater, Doug Smith and Dennis Harrah in Los Angeles; and Larry Allen, Erik Williams and Nate Newton in Dallas. Munoz and Slater are in the Hall of Fame; Matthews and Allen eventually will join them.

"It's not a coincidence that wherever he's been, it seems there's somebody who emerges as one of the game's best," former Cowboys quarterback Troy Aikman says.

But one of Houck's best coaching jobs came sans star power. Two years ago in San Diego, he took five new starters — a combination of pedestrian veterans and inexperienced youngsters — and molded them into a cohesive unit that helped the Chargers finish third in the league in scoring, fourth in fewest sacks allowed and sixth in rushing. They won 12 games and went to the playoffs for the first time in nine years.

Going into his second season as Miami's line coach, Houck faces a similar challenge. The Dolphins are expected to have new starters at left tackle (free-agent addition L.J. Shelton), center (former guard Rex Hadnot) and right guard (Bennie Anderson or Seth McKinney). After Miami closed the 2005 season with six straight wins, some preseason publications, including Sporting News, project the Dolphins as a wild-card team. The line will be a big factor in determining the season's outcome.

"Getting the new guys, the new pieces of the puzzle, and putting them together is our major goal at this point," says Houck.

A three-year center at USC who helped the Trojans win the 1962 national championship, Houck has flirted with other positions during his career. He wouldn't have minded coaching running backs, defensive backs or linebackers. But he has stayed betrothed to the offensive line, a unit that can be as sturdy as brick or as breakable as straw depending on its coordinated effort.

"You've got to have five guys working on the same page," Houck says. "They've got to have the same communication. They all have to be doing the correct footwork."

It all requires choreography, and no one devises line schemes better than Houck, who breaks down his philosophy into three areas.

He teaches physical football by emphasizing leverage, the best technique for moving a defender. Houck compares it to sumo wrestling.

He puts his players in the best position to succeed by devising drills that simulate what they'll do in a game — and repeating them over and over.

He sets the standard. "I've got to let them know when they're not putting in enough effort," he says. "And that's something they don't want to hear sometimes."

Houck has coached through personal tragedy — his first wife died on Christmas Day 1988 after a long bout with cancer. He is 63 and has two years left on his contract. How much longer will he continue?

"I'm just going to keep going until that motor wears out — or until my wife says, 'That's enough,' " he says.

That day will have to wait. The master choreographer still has a lot of line dancing to direct.

© 2006 The Sporting News
Good stuff here. I personally am high on the Dolphins this year and think Brown could be excellent.. I just don't know if I'd take him over Rudi in a low-performance scoring system.
Rudi has to play the Steelers twice. I dont need that kind of inner conflict.My dilemma is going to be in the second round. Being only a 10 team league both Westbrook and Holt can very well be there for me. I always draft for value and if no WRs are off the board yet, I'd probably go with Westy, but having Holt as my #1 rated WR will make it tough (no way Holt falls back to me at 28 I would say)
Believe me, don't think I haven't considered the Steelers angle, particularly when it's entrely possible that VBD will tell me to draft Rudi in round 1, Chad Johnson in round 2, and Palmer in round 3. :) No way on Earth Holt drops to #28. I see a run on receivers starting around the top of round 2, with CJ, Owens, Smith, Holt, Harrison, and Fitzgerald all likely going in the 2nd, and Moss, BOldin, Chambers, and Ward in the top half of round 3. It's for this exact reason that I am leaning towards going WR in round 2, as I think more receivers than backs come off between 2.5 and 3.8.

 
Reggie Bush will not make it to the 3rd round in many drafts once he gets on the field.

While he is a risk, his upside and "flash" is just too high to expect him to go later than that.

Give him a couple of good pre-season games I would not be surprised to see him go late 1st round early 2nd round and be considered a reasonable pick.

I can see him going before both the Jones, FWP, Droughns, McGahee, DD.

I can see him going RB 13 easy. Just because of his potential.

If he rips off 1 long run during the pre-season, top 10 RB is not that much of a stretch.

I got him, paid too much for him and cannot wait to see him on the field, just because he is Reggie and I expect him to be exciting. Heck I would watch a game I have absolutely no interest in, just because he is playing.

He has the "IT" that will pack the stands and make people want to watch him.

Could he be a total bust, sure.

Am I more excited to see what he can do on the football field more than any other RB in recent history, you bet I am.

 
This Article on the new Miami O-line coach has me high on Ronnie Brown and is a big reason why I am hoping to get him at #8.

Houck holding the line for Dolphins

Respected coach trying to mold Miami unit into a force

COMMENTARY

By Dennis Dillon

The Sporting News

Updated: 7:36 p.m. ET July 25, 2006

In 1970, the freshman football coach at Southern California looked at the varsity's offensive line coach and saw what he wanted to be: a great teacher and disciplinarian, a leader who was demanding but also had fun with his players. "If he would have stayed and been an offensive line coach, he would have been the best there was," the freshman coach says, 36 years later.

You know what became of the line coach? He led the Redskins to three Super Bowl championships and was elected to the Pro Football Hall of Fame in 1996. Now, Joe Gibbs is in his second term in Washington.

The freshman coach also advanced to the NFL, where he has found a way to star in a supporting role for five teams in the past 23 years. You might not recognize his name, but he became what he envisioned Gibbs could have been.

"If there was a Hall of Fame for offensive line coaches," says Chargers tackle Roman Oben, "Hudson Houck would be first in line."

Houck has left his fingerprints from Seattle to Miami. When he was with the Rams (1983-1991), Eric Dickerson won three NFL rushing titles and five offensive linemen were selected to a combined 21 Pro Bowls. When he was with the Seahawks ('92), Chris Warren had the first 1,000-yard rushing performance of his career. When Houck was with the Cowboys (1993-2001), Emmitt Smith was a two-time rushing champion and six linemen racked up 22 Pro Bowl selections combined.

Among the prominent linemen Houck has tutored are Anthony Munoz and Bruce Matthews (during Houck's tenure as USC's line coach from 1976-82); Jackie Slater, Doug Smith and Dennis Harrah in Los Angeles; and Larry Allen, Erik Williams and Nate Newton in Dallas. Munoz and Slater are in the Hall of Fame; Matthews and Allen eventually will join them.

"It's not a coincidence that wherever he's been, it seems there's somebody who emerges as one of the game's best," former Cowboys quarterback Troy Aikman says.

But one of Houck's best coaching jobs came sans star power. Two years ago in San Diego, he took five new starters — a combination of pedestrian veterans and inexperienced youngsters — and molded them into a cohesive unit that helped the Chargers finish third in the league in scoring, fourth in fewest sacks allowed and sixth in rushing. They won 12 games and went to the playoffs for the first time in nine years.

Going into his second season as Miami's line coach, Houck faces a similar challenge. The Dolphins are expected to have new starters at left tackle (free-agent addition L.J. Shelton), center (former guard Rex Hadnot) and right guard (Bennie Anderson or Seth McKinney). After Miami closed the 2005 season with six straight wins, some preseason publications, including Sporting News, project the Dolphins as a wild-card team. The line will be a big factor in determining the season's outcome.

"Getting the new guys, the new pieces of the puzzle, and putting them together is our major goal at this point," says Houck.

A three-year center at USC who helped the Trojans win the 1962 national championship, Houck has flirted with other positions during his career. He wouldn't have minded coaching running backs, defensive backs or linebackers. But he has stayed betrothed to the offensive line, a unit that can be as sturdy as brick or as breakable as straw depending on its coordinated effort.

"You've got to have five guys working on the same page," Houck says. "They've got to have the same communication. They all have to be doing the correct footwork."

It all requires choreography, and no one devises line schemes better than Houck, who breaks down his philosophy into three areas.

He teaches physical football by emphasizing leverage, the best technique for moving a defender. Houck compares it to sumo wrestling.

He puts his players in the best position to succeed by devising drills that simulate what they'll do in a game — and repeating them over and over.

He sets the standard. "I've got to let them know when they're not putting in enough effort," he says. "And that's something they don't want to hear sometimes."

Houck has coached through personal tragedy — his first wife died on Christmas Day 1988 after a long bout with cancer. He is 63 and has two years left on his contract. How much longer will he continue?

"I'm just going to keep going until that motor wears out — or until my wife says, 'That's enough,' " he says.

That day will have to wait. The master choreographer still has a lot of line dancing to direct.

© 2006 The Sporting News
Good stuff here. I personally am high on the Dolphins this year and think Brown could be excellent.. I just don't know if I'd take him over Rudi in a low-performance scoring system.
Rudi has to play the Steelers twice. I dont need that kind of inner conflict.My dilemma is going to be in the second round. Being only a 10 team league both Westbrook and Holt can very well be there for me. I always draft for value and if no WRs are off the board yet, I'd probably go with Westy, but having Holt as my #1 rated WR will make it tough (no way Holt falls back to me at 28 I would say)
Believe me, don't think I haven't considered the Steelers angle, particularly when it's entrely possible that VBD will tell me to draft Rudi in round 1, Chad Johnson in round 2, and Palmer in round 3. :) No way on Earth Holt drops to #28. I see a run on receivers starting around the top of round 2, with CJ, Owens, Smith, Holt, Harrison, and Fitzgerald all likely going in the 2nd, and Moss, BOldin, Chambers, and Ward in the top half of round 3. It's for this exact reason that I am leaning towards going WR in round 2, as I think more receivers than backs come off between 2.5 and 3.8.
Yea, I am thinking Holt in the second while hoping a run on WRs indeed happens, maybe a QB or 2 is off the board and even Gates by the time it gets back to 3.08 and one of the Jones or another RB whom I have in the top 20 or so slips to me and then I grab maybe a Roy Williams in the 4th.We start 2QB, 3RB, 4WR, 2TE, 2K, 2D/st, so that has an impact of what position I may draft. Last year I drafted 3 straight RBs though.

 
I had the 8 spot in No Mercy (12 team leagues) and we drafted in mid July... I posted this in (one of) the 7th spot threads for reference, but will add it here now since it applies. I'll post our actual draft results and some commentary. Feel free to ask questions about why I did what I did, where certain guys went or simply talk about what I did that you think was good/lousy so we can all learn from my mistakes. [basic info: 1QB/2RB/3WR/1TE w/6pts for all TDs]

My Roster:

1.08 Rudi Johnson (was between him and Edge, and chose Rudi for his consistency)

2.05 Steve Smith (#1 WR on my board, #2 WR taken C-johnson went two picks earlier)

3.08 Warrick Dunn (I waivered a long time between Warrick and Chester Taylor... I have a feeling I will regret not taking Taylor, but we shall see...) My top 2 Rbs are on BYE week 5. Not ideal.

4.05 De'Shaun Foster (see Rhodes pick for commentary)

5.08 Matt Hasselbeck (the QB run hadn't started Manning/Brady and McNabb were only ones gone...and since we get 6/TD, I wanted to have a stud so I grabbed my #3 ranked QB. It turns out that 4 more QBs went in the next 1.5 rounds)

6.05 Dominic Rhodes (Between Foster/Rhodes I expect one of them to pan out into a strong RB 3. As one of the FBG articles calls out, less than 1 in 5 rookie RBs pans out to be a top 20RB, yet the CAR and IND RB will historically produce a top 10 or top 5 RB. I anticipate one of these two will be able to win the job. If they both do, then i will have a sick slate of RBs.)

7.08 Rod Smith - The old standbye is steady, and he gets his catches/yards.

8.05 Koren Robinson - He was the best avialable WR1 left on the board. And I'm a Viking fan, so that was the tiebreaker. My starting WR corps at this point is a bit suspect, but I have been able to be successful using the waiver wire to get viable WRs. As a result I tend to go RB Heavy.

9.08 Chris Perry - This was a round earlier than I would have liked, but I wanted to ensure I backed up my #1 pick, especially since I took a bit of a gamble with my RB 3/4.

10.05 Keenan McCardell - I was between him and guys like Moulds/KCurtis, and I went with the last #1 WR. As a sidenote, I don't get the big love for K Curtis. A guy in our league drafted him as his #3 WR. He is the #3 WR on his own NFL team!

11.08 Randy McMichael I was one of the last to grab a TE, and I like what he can potentially do with Daunte.

12.05 Colts Def. This is the first time I have ever taken a Def before the last round or two. Not sure that I love this pick, but I wasn't too excited about the other options. I probably could/should have grabbed a b/u QB like McNair...but I didn't have him rated much higher than 3 others, including the guy I ended up getting.

13.08 Jeremy Stevens Grabbed another TE so I can play matchups each week. Not that it really matters but I have Hass/Stevens combo for weeks when they play weak teams.

14.05 Brad Johnson If Hass gets hurt, then I am in big trouble. Brad threw better than a TD/week last year when he was starting...but he would have 2TDs one week, and then none for two weeks, and then two the next. Not the type of consistency you want. But with the WCO, who knows. The other QBs taken in the previous two rounds were all in the same tier: (PRivers, Carr, Simms, Brunell) So since none of them really excited me, I went with Brad a round later.

15.08 Brandon Stokley Could be good...he's healthy and had 10TDs two years ago

16.05 Maurice Morris I'm fishing for a lucky pick here at the end of drafts. High Risk High Reward types (and possible 'throw-in' trade bait guys.

17.05 Michael Pittman If Caddy's hammy is a problem, this could be gold

18.08 Josh Brown

There are your 2006 Tusken Raiders...Hope this helps. If you have questions about strategy, or where certain guys went, let me know...

 
Last edited by a moderator:
I had the 8 spot in No Mercy (12 team leagues) and we drafted in mid July... I posted this in (one of) the 7th spot threads for reference, but will add it here now since it applies. I'll post our actual draft results and some commentary. Feel free to ask questions about why I did what I did, where certain guys went or simply talk about what I did that you think was good/lousy so we can all learn from my mistakes. [basic info: 1QB/2RB/3WR/1TE w/6pts for all TDs]

My Roster:

1.08 Rudi Johnson (was between him and Edge, and chose Rudi for his consistency)

2.05 Steve Smith (#1 WR on my board, #2 WR taken C-johnson went two picks earlier)

3.08 Warrick Dunn (I waivered a long time between Warrick and Chester Taylor... I have a feeling I will regret not taking Taylor, but we shall see...) My top 2 Rbs are on BYE week 5. Not ideal.

4.05 De'Shaun Foster (see Rhodes pick for commentary)

5.08 Matt Hasselbeck (the QB run hadn't started Manning/Brady and McNabb were only ones gone...and since we get 6/TD, I wanted to have a stud so I grabbed my #3 ranked QB. It turns out that 4 more QBs went in the next 1.5 rounds)

6.05 Dominic Rhodes (Between Foster/Rhodes I expect one of them to pan out into a strong RB 3. As one of the FBG articles calls out, less than 1 in 5 rookie RBs pans out to be a top 20RB, yet the CAR and IND RB will historically produce a top 10 or top 5 RB. I anticipate one of these two will be able to win the job. If they both do, then i will have a sick slate of RBs.)

7.08 Rod Smith - The old standbye is steady, and he gets his catches/yards.

8.05 Koren Robinson - He was the best avialable WR1 left on the board. And I'm a Viking fan, so that was the tiebreaker. My starting WR corps at this point is a bit suspect, but I have been able to be successful using the waiver wire to get viable WRs. As a result I tend to go RB Heavy.

9.08 Chris Perry - This was a round earlier than I would have liked, but I wanted to ensure I backed up my #1 pick, especially since I took a bit of a gamble with my RB 3/4.

10.05 Keenan McCardell - I was between him and guys like Moulds/KCurtis, and I went with the last #1 WR. As a sidenote, I don't get the big love for K Curtis. A guy in our league drafted him as his #3 WR. He is the #3 WR on his own NFL team!

11.08 Randy McMichael I was one of the last to grab a TE, and I like what he can potentially do with Daunte.

12.05 Colts Def. This is the first time I have ever taken a Def before the last round or two. Not sure that I love this pick, but I wasn't too excited about the other options. I probably could/should have grabbed a b/u QB like McNair...but I didn't have him rated much higher than 3 others, including the guy I ended up getting.

13.08 Jeremy Stevens Grabbed another TE so I can play matchups each week. Not that it really matters but I have Hass/Stevens combo for weeks when they play weak teams.

14.05 Brad Johnson If Hass gets hurt, then I am in big trouble. Brad threw better than a TD/week last year when he was starting...but he would have 2TDs one week, and then none for two weeks, and then two the next. Not the type of consistency you want. But with the WCO, who knows. The other QBs taken in the previous two rounds were all in the same tier: (PRivers, Carr, Simms, Brunell) So since none of them really excited me, I went with Brad a round later.

15.08 Brandon Stokley Could be good...he's healthy and had 10TDs two years ago

16.05 Maurice Morris I'm fishing for a lucky pick here at the end of drafts. High Risk High Reward types (and possible 'throw-in' trade bait guys.

17.05 Michael Pittman If Caddy's hammy is a problem, this could be gold

18.08 Josh Brown

There are your 2006 Tusken Raiders...Hope this helps. If you have questions about strategy, or where certain guys went, let me know...
I'm particularly interested in the QB in the 5th round, which is one spot I had tabbed as a possible QB pick. You also went very RB-heavy, which is interesting - 4 of the top 6. You still ended up with a respectable WR corps though, which is good to see....
 
I have the 8 spot in my money league as well, very similar format to yours.

1st round- I am also dead-set on a RB in the 1st. I am targeting S-Jax or Rudi, but would be OK with Tiki or R Brown. Guys I don't want in the 1st are Edge, Cadillac, & Jordan, but would take on the way back in Round 2. I just don't think Jordan or Caddy are good enough to carry a fantasy team & I am scared of Edge's situation.

2nd- I will most likely go best RB available. Jordan, Rudi, Cadillac, McGahee, DD- somebody in that range. I would love Steve Smith here, but WRs start to go in the late 1st in my league due to .5 PPR. I probably can't get a 10+ TD WR here, so I'll wait for the 2nd tier guys.

3rd & 4th- I'll go with 2 WRs along the lines of Wayne, Ward, D-Jax, Driver, ROY, S Moss, Burress, etc. I think there is enough RB depth this year to get a decent RB3 in the 5th.

I have laid out the draft a dozen times. If I take a WR like Holt in the 2nd, I am stuck with a Droughns or Chester Taylor as my RB2. If I take a RB in the 2nd, I get 2 WRs almost as good as Holt in the 3rd/4th. I like S-Jax/Cadillac/Wayne/D-Jax a lot better than S-Jax/Holt/Chester/D-Jax

 
I have the 8 spot in my money league as well, very similar format to yours.1st round- I am also dead-set on a RB in the 1st. I am targeting S-Jax or Rudi, but would be OK with Tiki or R Brown. Guys I don't want in the 1st are Edge, Cadillac, & Jordan, but would take on the way back in Round 2. I just don't think Jordan or Caddy are good enough to carry a fantasy team & I am scared of Edge's situation.2nd- I will most likely go best RB available. Jordan, Rudi, Cadillac, McGahee, DD- somebody in that range. I would love Steve Smith here, but WRs start to go in the late 1st in my league due to .5 PPR. I probably can't get a 10+ TD WR here, so I'll wait for the 2nd tier guys.3rd & 4th- I'll go with 2 WRs along the lines of Wayne, Ward, D-Jax, Driver, ROY, S Moss, Burress, etc. I think there is enough RB depth this year to get a decent RB3 in the 5th.I have laid out the draft a dozen times. If I take a WR like Holt in the 2nd, I am stuck with a Droughns or Chester Taylor as my RB2. If I take a RB in the 2nd, I get 2 WRs almost as good as Holt in the 3rd/4th. I like S-Jax/Cadillac/Wayne/D-Jax a lot better than S-Jax/Holt/Chester/D-Jax
This prompts one of the big debates on the 8 spot this year - RB/WR or WR/RB in rounds 2 and 3? I don't think you get Cadillac in round 2 from this spot, however.
 
I have the 8 spot in my money league as well, very similar format to yours.1st round- I am also dead-set on a RB in the 1st. I am targeting S-Jax or Rudi, but would be OK with Tiki or R Brown. Guys I don't want in the 1st are Edge, Cadillac, & Jordan, but would take on the way back in Round 2. I just don't think Jordan or Caddy are good enough to carry a fantasy team & I am scared of Edge's situation.2nd- I will most likely go best RB available. Jordan, Rudi, Cadillac, McGahee, DD- somebody in that range. I would love Steve Smith here, but WRs start to go in the late 1st in my league due to .5 PPR. I probably can't get a 10+ TD WR here, so I'll wait for the 2nd tier guys.3rd & 4th- I'll go with 2 WRs along the lines of Wayne, Ward, D-Jax, Driver, ROY, S Moss, Burress, etc. I think there is enough RB depth this year to get a decent RB3 in the 5th.I have laid out the draft a dozen times. If I take a WR like Holt in the 2nd, I am stuck with a Droughns or Chester Taylor as my RB2. If I take a RB in the 2nd, I get 2 WRs almost as good as Holt in the 3rd/4th. I like S-Jax/Cadillac/Wayne/D-Jax a lot better than S-Jax/Holt/Chester/D-Jax
10 or 12 team league?
 
As much as it pains me to *help* a Pittsburgh fan, here goes. ;) I'm sitting on #7 in a 14 team league, so basically the same options you're considering (at least till the extra picks push me out in the later rounds).I agree w/ your top 3 options @ RB in the 1st. And personally I'm leaning towards RB now. I've been bumping all 3 (Rudi, SJax, RB) around for what seems like months now, and mainly due to schedule and OLine, I'm thinking RB will come out on top of that group (even w/ less experience). Rudi's schedule and Palmer's injury are pushing me here. Sure, RB hasn't yet proven it over a full season (carrying the load himself), but he's got the opportunity & surrounding talent - combined w/ a weaker (D wise) division - to excel this year. 1200 (combined) & 9tds = floor w/ 1500 (combined) & 14 tds = ceiling IMHOI would also not (personally) draft both SJax AND Holt in the first 2 rds. Too many eggs in STLs basket - considering the new coaching staff and avg. schedule.I'd pass on Manning in R2 w/ the value QBs (even a late round QBBC tandem) in the mid-late rounds. And I'm not drinking the RBush koolaid this year. At least not in the 3rd.Even w/ the extra 4 picks I'm looking @ (in a 14 teamer), I'm still likely going WR in the mid 2nd and should see one of Fitz, Moss, Holt (crosses fingers), or Harrison. In R3, back to the RBs, but this one will depend on the pre-season and injury report. I'm hoping for C Taylor or Dunn in R3 @ this point.
Great stuff here. I'm seeing more and more Ronnie Brown supporters at this spot - I may need to move him up. I've really had Jackson and Rudi neck and neck with Jordan a step behind him and Brown a step behind Jordan, but I may need to reconsider that.You bring up an interesting point with the Holt/Jackson thing. I had a draft a few weeks back I posted about here where I took Rudi and Chad Johnson in the first two rounds, but just didn't feel good about it. Would you let your first round choice dictate your second rounder (i.e. avoiding two players on the same team)?I'd be thrilled with Willie Parker or Taylor in round 3, but their ADPs continue to rise where now Parker seems to be a late 2nd rounder, and Taylor is gone in the first 3-4 picks of round 3. Dunn might really be my pick in round 3, but there's something about Bush's upside that tantalizes me. I was thinking about it yesterday, and you have to figure the least the Saints are going to get the guy is 8-10 carries and 3-4 receptions a game. They almost have to in order to justify his salary. If he averages near 5 ypc (which I am highly confident he can) and 10-12 ypr, you're looking at anywhere from 70-100 combined yards a game, minimum, just on those touches. Add in kick returning, and he's a pretty good bet to put up at least 6-8 TDs as well. Those numbers really don't vary all that much from what Dunn put up last year (as long as Duckett is around, he's not going to score a lot of TDs.) Now, imagine if he proves to be considerably better than McAllister, or Deuce gets hurt again. Now we could be looking at a huge season. I'm not sold on Bush, nor am I trying to sell him, this is just my thought process here.
W/ Rudi & CJ, you're one hit away to Palmer's reconstructed knee from Anthony Wright (IIRC) which could be 8 in the box ugly. Plus you've got C Perry lurking. I just shy away from having my top 2 picks on the same team (unless they're Edge/Harrison or Faulk/Holt a few years ago). At least in STL this year, you've got Frerotte as a solid backup to Bulger if something happens.As for the RB2s available in R3, keep in mind that going off mocks from the pre-season can be skewed when you add in the 1/3 to 1/2 of leaguemates that aren't as freakish about FF as most of us (here) are... So, there's going to be some "interesting" picks through the first 3 rounds that will let a few value plays drop to you. (Unless all the guys in your league are trolling this board ;) ) i.e. the guys that will go RB, WR, QB (in some order) regardless to fill out their roster. You might have one of the Jones', Dillon, or Jamal Lewis fall in your lap as well @ the 3rd pick. WRT R Bush, sure you could be right, but it could also be Deuce coming back strong and Bush catching punts and filling in on 3rd downs - while he gets adjusted to the NFL game. Just too much uncertainty for me in R3, especially early in the season w/ a rook. He'd be a great option to target for a trade if he starts off slowly and his owner gets nervous - since he should get better mid-late this year. But I wouldn't want to be counting on him for solid production in weeks 1-6, b/c you might get yourself out of contention before he gets going. (and I don't get combined yards for kick returns - only scores)
 
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First year dynasty league I am drafting from the 8 spot (12 team). It is a PPR league.

So far my draft looks like:

1.08 - Jordan

2.05 - Fitz

3.08 - JJones

4.05 - Plaxico

5.08 - D Mason

6.05 - Bulger

As I mentioned it is a PPR league but RBs were going off the board right and left. In fact after the 6th round there were two owners who had 4RB and only 1WR. Because of the number of RBs taken, RB options were slim and WR's presented a bigger scoring option.

This is now how I played out my draft at all since I figured WRs would go off the board much quicker (S. Smith went off the board late in the 2nd). I thought there would be better options RB options available to me in the earlier rounds but I was wrong. Then again I wasn't happy with the 8 spot to begin with.

 
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Evilgrin 72 said:
This prompts one of the big debates on the 8 spot this year - RB/WR or WR/RB in rounds 2 and 3? I don't think you get Cadillac in round 2 from this spot, however.
The 8 spot is very close to the breaking point for what you do in Round 2. RB in round 1 for sure. Round 2 completely depends on how things fall and whether or not you're in a PPR league. It's a tough slot to be in, but the good news is that you get to lead the pack in either the RB2 or WR1 slot. I lean towards going RB/RB to start things off. The tiers are so much more shallow at RB that it is probably going to make the most sense more often than not. I think it will be much easier to find late value at WR than it will be at RB. But getting that RB2 won't mean much if everyone else makes a run on WRs. So I guess the bottom line is: It totally depends on what you think everyone else is about to do, but since there is better depth at WR, it's probably safest to grab an RB2.What hasn't been discussed much for this approach is going RB/RB/RB. I doubt it'd be too wise, but in a 10 team league, the DD is telling me to go that route. I have to admit, it is pretty sick if the draft wound up like this in a PPR 10 team league:1 - RB1 - Brown 2 - RB2 - Westbrook 3 - RB3 - Droughns 4 - WR1 - Driver5 - WR2 - Deion Branch (depending on his contract)That is just shy of Driver's current ADP, and FBG projections have him as a potential top 10 WR. That is some powerful depth at RB, though, and you still come out with quality WRs.With the glut of talent at the QB spot this year, I doubt I'll be taking one prior to round 8. I think there is better value to be found at the other positions (including the bench).
 
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Evilgrin 72 said:
This prompts one of the big debates on the 8 spot this year - RB/WR or WR/RB in rounds 2 and 3? I don't think you get Cadillac in round 2 from this spot, however.
The 8 spot is very close to the breaking point for what you do in Round 2. RB in round 1 for sure. Round 2 completely depends on how things fall and whether or not you're in a PPR league. It's a tough slot to be in, but the good news is that you get to lead the pack in either the RB2 or WR1 slot. I lean towards going RB/RB to start things off. The tiers are so much more shallow at RB that it is probably going to make the most sense more often than not. I think it will be much easier to find late value at WR than it will be at RB. But getting that RB2 won't mean much if everyone else makes a run on WRs. So I guess the bottom line is: It totally depends on what you think everyone else is about to do, but since there is better depth at WR, it's probably safest to grab an RB2.What hasn't been discussed much for this approach is going RB/RB/RB. I doubt it'd be too wise, but in a 10 team league, the DD is telling me to go that route. I have to admit, it is pretty sick if the draft wound up like this in a PPR 10 team league:1 - RB1 - Brown 2 - RB2 - Westbrook 3 - RB3 - Droughns 4 - WR1 - Driver5 - WR2 - Deion Branch (depending on his contract)That is just shy of Driver's current ADP, and FBG projections have him as a potential top 10 WR. That is some powerful depth at RB, though, and you still come out with quality WRs.With the glut of talent at the QB spot this year, I doubt I'll be taking one prior to round 8. I think there is better value to be found at the other positions (including the bench).
I don't think going RB/RB/RB is such a bad option. Even in a 12 team league, I think Westy could fall to the 2.05 spot. Westy with Brown, Rudi, or Jordan wouldn't be bad at all. Adding a decent backup like Droughns would be a nice consolation prize and give nice depth. I would go to battle with those three. Then if you could still somehow snag Driver...wow. Now in a 12 teamer, Driver might be gone, but I would be fine if Branch (contract??) were my no. 1 and I had a couple of guys like Galloway, Rod Smith, T.J. Houz on my roster. Just talking. Maybe I am off base, but I don't mind waiting until the 4th for a WR.
 
Evilgrin 72 said:
This prompts one of the big debates on the 8 spot this year - RB/WR or WR/RB in rounds 2 and 3? I don't think you get Cadillac in round 2 from this spot, however.
The 8 spot is very close to the breaking point for what you do in Round 2. RB in round 1 for sure. Round 2 completely depends on how things fall and whether or not you're in a PPR league. It's a tough slot to be in, but the good news is that you get to lead the pack in either the RB2 or WR1 slot. I lean towards going RB/RB to start things off. The tiers are so much more shallow at RB that it is probably going to make the most sense more often than not. I think it will be much easier to find late value at WR than it will be at RB. But getting that RB2 won't mean much if everyone else makes a run on WRs. So I guess the bottom line is: It totally depends on what you think everyone else is about to do, but since there is better depth at WR, it's probably safest to grab an RB2.What hasn't been discussed much for this approach is going RB/RB/RB. I doubt it'd be too wise, but in a 10 team league, the DD is telling me to go that route. I have to admit, it is pretty sick if the draft wound up like this in a PPR 10 team league:1 - RB1 - Brown 2 - RB2 - Westbrook 3 - RB3 - Droughns 4 - WR1 - Driver5 - WR2 - Deion Branch (depending on his contract)That is just shy of Driver's current ADP, and FBG projections have him as a potential top 10 WR. That is some powerful depth at RB, though, and you still come out with quality WRs.With the glut of talent at the QB spot this year, I doubt I'll be taking one prior to round 8. I think there is better value to be found at the other positions (including the bench).
I don't think going RB/RB/RB is such a bad option. Even in a 12 team league, I think Westy could fall to the 2.05 spot. Westy with Brown, Rudi, or Jordan wouldn't be bad at all. Adding a decent backup like Droughns would be a nice consolation prize and give nice depth. I would go to battle with those three. Then if you could still somehow snag Driver...wow. Now in a 12 teamer, Driver might be gone, but I would be fine if Branch (contract??) were my no. 1 and I had a couple of guys like Galloway, Rod Smith, T.J. Houz on my roster. Just talking. Maybe I am off base, but I don't mind waiting until the 4th for a WR.
RB/RB/RB is a definite possibility. In fact, if one of my top 12 or so backs falls to round 2, I will likely do just that. The key is finding the cutoff among the RBs where, in round 2, they no longer represent better value than the top 3-4 WRs. If a Cadillac Williams, Ronnie Brown, Rudi Johnson, or maybe even Westbrook falls to round 2, I will likely take him. If all that's left is Domanick Davis or McGahee, and TO, Holt, Harrison, etc.. are still around, I'll be tempted to go with the stud WR rather than the RB with question marks at pick 17.
 
Evilgrin 72 said:
This prompts one of the big debates on the 8 spot this year - RB/WR or WR/RB in rounds 2 and 3? I don't think you get Cadillac in round 2 from this spot, however.
The 8 spot is very close to the breaking point for what you do in Round 2. RB in round 1 for sure. Round 2 completely depends on how things fall and whether or not you're in a PPR league. It's a tough slot to be in, but the good news is that you get to lead the pack in either the RB2 or WR1 slot. I lean towards going RB/RB to start things off. The tiers are so much more shallow at RB that it is probably going to make the most sense more often than not. I think it will be much easier to find late value at WR than it will be at RB. But getting that RB2 won't mean much if everyone else makes a run on WRs. So I guess the bottom line is: It totally depends on what you think everyone else is about to do, but since there is better depth at WR, it's probably safest to grab an RB2.What hasn't been discussed much for this approach is going RB/RB/RB. I doubt it'd be too wise, but in a 10 team league, the DD is telling me to go that route. I have to admit, it is pretty sick if the draft wound up like this in a PPR 10 team league:1 - RB1 - Brown 2 - RB2 - Westbrook 3 - RB3 - Droughns 4 - WR1 - Driver5 - WR2 - Deion Branch (depending on his contract)That is just shy of Driver's current ADP, and FBG projections have him as a potential top 10 WR. That is some powerful depth at RB, though, and you still come out with quality WRs.With the glut of talent at the QB spot this year, I doubt I'll be taking one prior to round 8. I think there is better value to be found at the other positions (including the bench).
I don't think going RB/RB/RB is such a bad option. Even in a 12 team league, I think Westy could fall to the 2.05 spot. Westy with Brown, Rudi, or Jordan wouldn't be bad at all. Adding a decent backup like Droughns would be a nice consolation prize and give nice depth. I would go to battle with those three. Then if you could still somehow snag Driver...wow. Now in a 12 teamer, Driver might be gone, but I would be fine if Branch (contract??) were my no. 1 and I had a couple of guys like Galloway, Rod Smith, T.J. Houz on my roster. Just talking. Maybe I am off base, but I don't mind waiting until the 4th for a WR.
RB/RB/RB is a definite possibility. In fact, if one of my top 12 or so backs falls to round 2, I will likely do just that. The key is finding the cutoff among the RBs where, in round 2, they no longer represent better value than the top 3-4 WRs. If a Cadillac Williams, Ronnie Brown, Rudi Johnson, or maybe even Westbrook falls to round 2, I will likely take him. If all that's left is Domanick Davis or McGahee, and TO, Holt, Harrison, etc.. are still around, I'll be tempted to go with the stud WR rather than the RB with question marks at pick 17.
We are on the same page here. I plan to take Brown at the 8 and if West, Caddy, or Rudi are there on the comeback, I have to take one of them . . . if not, I am taking Holt (if all 4 are gone I'm not sure what I will do).I'm on the fence on whether I would take Steven Jackson over Holt or not if they both slid back to me.
 
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Evilgrin 72 said:
This prompts one of the big debates on the 8 spot this year - RB/WR or WR/RB in rounds 2 and 3? I don't think you get Cadillac in round 2 from this spot, however.
The 8 spot is very close to the breaking point for what you do in Round 2. RB in round 1 for sure. Round 2 completely depends on how things fall and whether or not you're in a PPR league. It's a tough slot to be in, but the good news is that you get to lead the pack in either the RB2 or WR1 slot. I lean towards going RB/RB to start things off. The tiers are so much more shallow at RB that it is probably going to make the most sense more often than not. I think it will be much easier to find late value at WR than it will be at RB. But getting that RB2 won't mean much if everyone else makes a run on WRs. So I guess the bottom line is: It totally depends on what you think everyone else is about to do, but since there is better depth at WR, it's probably safest to grab an RB2.What hasn't been discussed much for this approach is going RB/RB/RB. I doubt it'd be too wise, but in a 10 team league, the DD is telling me to go that route. I have to admit, it is pretty sick if the draft wound up like this in a PPR 10 team league:1 - RB1 - Brown 2 - RB2 - Westbrook 3 - RB3 - Droughns 4 - WR1 - Driver5 - WR2 - Deion Branch (depending on his contract)That is just shy of Driver's current ADP, and FBG projections have him as a potential top 10 WR. That is some powerful depth at RB, though, and you still come out with quality WRs.With the glut of talent at the QB spot this year, I doubt I'll be taking one prior to round 8. I think there is better value to be found at the other positions (including the bench).
I don't think going RB/RB/RB is such a bad option. Even in a 12 team league, I think Westy could fall to the 2.05 spot. Westy with Brown, Rudi, or Jordan wouldn't be bad at all. Adding a decent backup like Droughns would be a nice consolation prize and give nice depth. I would go to battle with those three. Then if you could still somehow snag Driver...wow. Now in a 12 teamer, Driver might be gone, but I would be fine if Branch (contract??) were my no. 1 and I had a couple of guys like Galloway, Rod Smith, T.J. Houz on my roster. Just talking. Maybe I am off base, but I don't mind waiting until the 4th for a WR.
RB/RB/RB is a definite possibility. In fact, if one of my top 12 or so backs falls to round 2, I will likely do just that. The key is finding the cutoff among the RBs where, in round 2, they no longer represent better value than the top 3-4 WRs. If a Cadillac Williams, Ronnie Brown, Rudi Johnson, or maybe even Westbrook falls to round 2, I will likely take him. If all that's left is Domanick Davis or McGahee, and TO, Holt, Harrison, etc.. are still around, I'll be tempted to go with the stud WR rather than the RB with question marks at pick 17.
We are on the same page here. I plan to take Brown at the 8 and if West, Caddy, or Rudi are there on the comeback, I have to take one of them . . . if not, I am taking Holt (if all 4 are gone I'm not sure what I will do).I'm on the fence on whether I would take Steven Jackson over Holt or not if they both slid back to me.
FWIW, Steven Jackson is typically going in the firs 6-7 picks, so a second round selection of him is likely not a possibility. Holt, on the other hand, is almost always there at 2.5.
 
Some interesting numbers using Drinen's historical value calculator.

For those that missed the article, it's posted on the FBG Main Page. Read it for details, but he basically gives historical output from different combinations of draft choices (i.e. RB2, RB7, RB12, RB25) based on who would be starting in certain weeks, etc. It's a good read.

How it applies to our discussion : I used ADP and the results of my last 3 drafts to determine what players we will be looking at at each of the first 9 rounds (example : in round 1, typically we have available to us RB8, QB1, and WR1 - in round 2, QB2, RB14, WR4, etc..) I then, since his application values only RBs and WRs, decided to use the round 5 pick on a QB for the sake of this example, to maintain continuity throughout the different draft strategies. Also for this sake, I determined that after 9 rounds, we would have 4 backs, 4 receivers, and a QB (always drafted in round 5.) I also, in the interest of keeping this close to actual drafting, made sure we had our 4 backs by round 7 and waited until rounds 8 and 9 to draft our WR3 and WR4. This may not be your style, and you can use the application to test other combos, but I wanted to segregate the 2nd and 3rd round choices in a vacuum, to determine if RB/RB/WR, RB/RB/RB, or RB/WR/RB would be historically the most productive. Here's the data it spit out :

RB/RB/WR strategy, drafting RBs in rounds 1,2,6, and 7 and WRs in 3,4,8, and 9.

RB8, RB14, RB24, RB31 = 488.4 pts.

WR10, WR14, WR39, WR42 = 269.9 pts.

TOTAL - 758.3 pts.

RB/WR/RB strategy, drafting RBs in rounds 1,3,6, and 7 and WRs in 2,4,8, and 9.

RB8, RB20, RB24, RB31 = 481.3 pts.

WR4, WR14, WR39, WR42 = 314.3 pts.

TOTAL - 795.6 pts.

RB/RB/RB strategy, drafting RBs in rounds 1,2,3, and 7 and WRs in 4,6,8, and 9.

RB8, RB14, RB20, RB31 = 472.9 pts.

WR14, WR30, WR39, WR42 = 307.6 pts.

TOTAL - 780.5 pts.

So, what does this tell us about this year? Not much. But, it DOES state that historically, given the players available at the 8 spot (at least in my league - it's the only historical "ADP" data I have to work with) - the RB/WR/RB strategy I have been leaning towards is historically the most productive.

 
Some interesting numbers using Drinen's historical value calculator.

For those that missed the article, it's posted on the FBG Main Page. Read it for details, but he basically gives historical output from different combinations of draft choices (i.e. RB2, RB7, RB12, RB25) based on who would be starting in certain weeks, etc. It's a good read.

How it applies to our discussion : I used ADP and the results of my last 3 drafts to determine what players we will be looking at at each of the first 9 rounds (example : in round 1, typically we have available to us RB8, QB1, and WR1 - in round 2, QB2, RB14, WR4, etc..) I then, since his application values only RBs and WRs, decided to use the round 5 pick on a QB for the sake of this example, to maintain continuity throughout the different draft strategies. Also for this sake, I determined that after 9 rounds, we would have 4 backs, 4 receivers, and a QB (always drafted in round 5.) I also, in the interest of keeping this close to actual drafting, made sure we had our 4 backs by round 7 and waited until rounds 8 and 9 to draft our WR3 and WR4. This may not be your style, and you can use the application to test other combos, but I wanted to segregate the 2nd and 3rd round choices in a vacuum, to determine if RB/RB/WR, RB/RB/RB, or RB/WR/RB would be historically the most productive. Here's the data it spit out :

RB/RB/WR strategy, drafting RBs in rounds 1,2,6, and 7 and WRs in 3,4,8, and 9.

RB8, RB14, RB24, RB31 = 488.4 pts.

WR10, WR14, WR39, WR42 = 269.9 pts.

TOTAL - 758.3 pts.

RB/WR/RB strategy, drafting RBs in rounds 1,3,6, and 7 and WRs in 2,4,8, and 9.

RB8, RB20, RB24, RB31 = 481.3 pts.

WR4, WR14, WR39, WR42 = 314.3 pts.

TOTAL - 795.6 pts.

RB/RB/RB strategy, drafting RBs in rounds 1,2,3, and 7 and WRs in 4,6,8, and 9.

RB8, RB14, RB20, RB31 = 472.9 pts.

WR14, WR30, WR39, WR42 = 307.6 pts.

TOTAL - 780.5 pts.

So, what does this tell us about this year? Not much. But, it DOES state that historically, given the players available at the 8 spot (at least in my league - it's the only historical "ADP" data I have to work with) - the RB/WR/RB strategy I have been leaning towards is historically the most productive.
Evilgrin:Thanks for crunching those numbers. I planned on doing that but have been way too busy. :thumbup:

 
Evilgrin 72 said:
This prompts one of the big debates on the 8 spot this year - RB/WR or WR/RB in rounds 2 and 3? I don't think you get Cadillac in round 2 from this spot, however.
The 8 spot is very close to the breaking point for what you do in Round 2. RB in round 1 for sure. Round 2 completely depends on how things fall and whether or not you're in a PPR league. It's a tough slot to be in, but the good news is that you get to lead the pack in either the RB2 or WR1 slot. I lean towards going RB/RB to start things off. The tiers are so much more shallow at RB that it is probably going to make the most sense more often than not. I think it will be much easier to find late value at WR than it will be at RB. But getting that RB2 won't mean much if everyone else makes a run on WRs. So I guess the bottom line is: It totally depends on what you think everyone else is about to do, but since there is better depth at WR, it's probably safest to grab an RB2.What hasn't been discussed much for this approach is going RB/RB/RB. I doubt it'd be too wise, but in a 10 team league, the DD is telling me to go that route. I have to admit, it is pretty sick if the draft wound up like this in a PPR 10 team league:1 - RB1 - Brown 2 - RB2 - Westbrook 3 - RB3 - Droughns 4 - WR1 - Driver5 - WR2 - Deion Branch (depending on his contract)That is just shy of Driver's current ADP, and FBG projections have him as a potential top 10 WR. That is some powerful depth at RB, though, and you still come out with quality WRs.With the glut of talent at the QB spot this year, I doubt I'll be taking one prior to round 8. I think there is better value to be found at the other positions (including the bench).
I don't think going RB/RB/RB is such a bad option. Even in a 12 team league, I think Westy could fall to the 2.05 spot. Westy with Brown, Rudi, or Jordan wouldn't be bad at all. Adding a decent backup like Droughns would be a nice consolation prize and give nice depth. I would go to battle with those three. Then if you could still somehow snag Driver...wow. Now in a 12 teamer, Driver might be gone, but I would be fine if Branch (contract??) were my no. 1 and I had a couple of guys like Galloway, Rod Smith, T.J. Houz on my roster. Just talking. Maybe I am off base, but I don't mind waiting until the 4th for a WR.
RB/RB/RB is a definite possibility. In fact, if one of my top 12 or so backs falls to round 2, I will likely do just that. The key is finding the cutoff among the RBs where, in round 2, they no longer represent better value than the top 3-4 WRs. If a Cadillac Williams, Ronnie Brown, Rudi Johnson, or maybe even Westbrook falls to round 2, I will likely take him. If all that's left is Domanick Davis or McGahee, and TO, Holt, Harrison, etc.. are still around, I'll be tempted to go with the stud WR rather than the RB with question marks at pick 17.
Big mistake EG. Every draft I've been in I've seen huge value drop in rounds 3 and 4. You have to start off RB/WR to allow yourself some flexibility in round 3 and 4. What if Parker drops to three and you already have two RBs? Then in 4 Foster and Lewis are still there? Grab the stud wideout early and be prepared to scoop up the value later, don't tie your hands.
 
No problem.

I found it kind of interesting to see that if one takes RB/RB in the first two rounds, it's historically been more productive to take a 3rd back in round 3 and wait until round 4 for a WR.

However, it appears that it pays to get that stud receiver in round 2 and wait on your second back. I would say if that has historically been the case, it may be even more applicable this year, as the depth at RB is greater than it has been in recent years.

 
FWIW, Steven Jackson is typically going in the firs 6-7 picks, so a second round selection of him is likely not a possibility. Holt, on the other hand, is almost always there at 2.5.
I agree. SJ probably won't be there. But the good thing about drafting towards the back, like someone else already mentioned, is that there's an excellent chance that just one of the players higher on your projections sheets might slip through the crack. That's the dillemma to be ready for.And back on the RB/RB/RB option for the 8 spot, if it's a 10 team league, I'm becoming more convinced that is the way to go as it's only 4 more picks to get that first WR. If it's 12 team league, I think the typical RB/RB/WR might be safer, in general. Of course, who knows what players might slip through the crack in rounds 3 and 4.I think the only way you're going to go with RB/WR to lead things off is if you're in a 12 team league, or if you play with 9 other sharks that snag every one of your top 10-12 RBs before your round 2 pick.
 
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Evilgrin 72 said:
This prompts one of the big debates on the 8 spot this year - RB/WR or WR/RB in rounds 2 and 3? I don't think you get Cadillac in round 2 from this spot, however.
The 8 spot is very close to the breaking point for what you do in Round 2. RB in round 1 for sure. Round 2 completely depends on how things fall and whether or not you're in a PPR league. It's a tough slot to be in, but the good news is that you get to lead the pack in either the RB2 or WR1 slot. I lean towards going RB/RB to start things off. The tiers are so much more shallow at RB that it is probably going to make the most sense more often than not. I think it will be much easier to find late value at WR than it will be at RB. But getting that RB2 won't mean much if everyone else makes a run on WRs. So I guess the bottom line is: It totally depends on what you think everyone else is about to do, but since there is better depth at WR, it's probably safest to grab an RB2.

What hasn't been discussed much for this approach is going RB/RB/RB. I doubt it'd be too wise, but in a 10 team league, the DD is telling me to go that route. I have to admit, it is pretty sick if the draft wound up like this in a PPR 10 team league:

1 - RB1 - Brown

2 - RB2 - Westbrook

3 - RB3 - Droughns

4 - WR1 - Driver

5 - WR2 - Deion Branch (depending on his contract)

That is just shy of Driver's current ADP, and FBG projections have him as a potential top 10 WR. That is some powerful depth at RB, though, and you still come out with quality WRs.

With the glut of talent at the QB spot this year, I doubt I'll be taking one prior to round 8. I think there is better value to be found at the other positions (including the bench).
I don't think going RB/RB/RB is such a bad option. Even in a 12 team league, I think Westy could fall to the 2.05 spot. Westy with Brown, Rudi, or Jordan wouldn't be bad at all. Adding a decent backup like Droughns would be a nice consolation prize and give nice depth. I would go to battle with those three. Then if you could still somehow snag Driver...wow. Now in a 12 teamer, Driver might be gone, but I would be fine if Branch (contract??) were my no. 1 and I had a couple of guys like Galloway, Rod Smith, T.J. Houz on my roster. Just talking. Maybe I am off base, but I don't mind waiting until the 4th for a WR.
RB/RB/RB is a definite possibility. In fact, if one of my top 12 or so backs falls to round 2, I will likely do just that. The key is finding the cutoff among the RBs where, in round 2, they no longer represent better value than the top 3-4 WRs. If a Cadillac Williams, Ronnie Brown, Rudi Johnson, or maybe even Westbrook falls to round 2, I will likely take him. If all that's left is Domanick Davis or McGahee, and TO, Holt, Harrison, etc.. are still around, I'll be tempted to go with the stud WR rather than the RB with question marks at pick 17.
Big mistake EG. Every draft I've been in I've seen huge value drop in rounds 3 and 4. You have to start off RB/WR to allow yourself some flexibility in round 3 and 4. What if Parker drops to three and you already have two RBs? Then in 4 Foster and Lewis are still there? Grab the stud wideout early and be prepared to scoop up the value later, don't tie your hands.
Really? I haven't been in any 12-team drafts this year yet (save for :e:, which is just starting) so I haven't seen this. I am firmly leaning towards the RB/WR combo, but if a Cadillac Williams dropped to you in round 2, you would still pass him up for a TO/Smith/Holt ?
 
FWIW, Steven Jackson is typically going in the firs 6-7 picks, so a second round selection of him is likely not a possibility. Holt, on the other hand, is almost always there at 2.5.
I agree. SJ probably won't be there. But the good thing about drafting towards the back, like someone else already mentioned, is that there's an excellent chance that just one of the players higher on your projections sheets might slip through the crack. That's the dillemma to be ready for.And back on the RB/RB/RB option for the 8 spot, if it's a 10 team league, I'm becoming more convinced that is the way to go as it's only 4 more picks to get that first WR. If it's 12 team league, I think the typical RB/RB/WR might be safer, in general. Of course, who knows what players might slip through the crack in rounds 3 and 4.I think the only way you're going to go with RB/WR to lead things off is if you play with 9 other sharks that snag every one of your top 12 RBs before your round 2 pick.
In my league, historically, 13 backs have gone in the first 16 picks, with Manning and 2 WRs thrown in. If one of my top-12 backs (particularly Cadillac) falls to #17, I'd have to consider him, but at this point, I am firmly in the RB/WR camp.
 
Evilgrin 72 said:
This prompts one of the big debates on the 8 spot this year - RB/WR or WR/RB in rounds 2 and 3? I don't think you get Cadillac in round 2 from this spot, however.
The 8 spot is very close to the breaking point for what you do in Round 2. RB in round 1 for sure. Round 2 completely depends on how things fall and whether or not you're in a PPR league. It's a tough slot to be in, but the good news is that you get to lead the pack in either the RB2 or WR1 slot. I lean towards going RB/RB to start things off. The tiers are so much more shallow at RB that it is probably going to make the most sense more often than not. I think it will be much easier to find late value at WR than it will be at RB. But getting that RB2 won't mean much if everyone else makes a run on WRs. So I guess the bottom line is: It totally depends on what you think everyone else is about to do, but since there is better depth at WR, it's probably safest to grab an RB2.

What hasn't been discussed much for this approach is going RB/RB/RB. I doubt it'd be too wise, but in a 10 team league, the DD is telling me to go that route. I have to admit, it is pretty sick if the draft wound up like this in a PPR 10 team league:

1 - RB1 - Brown

2 - RB2 - Westbrook

3 - RB3 - Droughns

4 - WR1 - Driver

5 - WR2 - Deion Branch (depending on his contract)

That is just shy of Driver's current ADP, and FBG projections have him as a potential top 10 WR. That is some powerful depth at RB, though, and you still come out with quality WRs.

With the glut of talent at the QB spot this year, I doubt I'll be taking one prior to round 8. I think there is better value to be found at the other positions (including the bench).
I don't think going RB/RB/RB is such a bad option. Even in a 12 team league, I think Westy could fall to the 2.05 spot. Westy with Brown, Rudi, or Jordan wouldn't be bad at all. Adding a decent backup like Droughns would be a nice consolation prize and give nice depth. I would go to battle with those three. Then if you could still somehow snag Driver...wow. Now in a 12 teamer, Driver might be gone, but I would be fine if Branch (contract??) were my no. 1 and I had a couple of guys like Galloway, Rod Smith, T.J. Houz on my roster. Just talking. Maybe I am off base, but I don't mind waiting until the 4th for a WR.
RB/RB/RB is a definite possibility. In fact, if one of my top 12 or so backs falls to round 2, I will likely do just that. The key is finding the cutoff among the RBs where, in round 2, they no longer represent better value than the top 3-4 WRs. If a Cadillac Williams, Ronnie Brown, Rudi Johnson, or maybe even Westbrook falls to round 2, I will likely take him. If all that's left is Domanick Davis or McGahee, and TO, Holt, Harrison, etc.. are still around, I'll be tempted to go with the stud WR rather than the RB with question marks at pick 17.
Big mistake EG. Every draft I've been in I've seen huge value drop in rounds 3 and 4. You have to start off RB/WR to allow yourself some flexibility in round 3 and 4. What if Parker drops to three and you already have two RBs? Then in 4 Foster and Lewis are still there? Grab the stud wideout early and be prepared to scoop up the value later, don't tie your hands.
Really? I haven't been in any 12-team drafts this year yet (save for :e:, which is just starting) so I haven't seen this. I am firmly leaning towards the RB/WR combo, but if a Cadillac Williams dropped to you in round 2, you would still pass him up for a TO/Smith/Holt ?
That would be a tough question as I'd likely take Caddy over Johnson and Jordan to begin with. In your TD heavy league, Lewis and Foster may be just as vaulable as many of the late 1st/early 2nd round backs. I'd be targetting Moss or Harrison in the 2nd.
 
Evilgrin 72 said:
This prompts one of the big debates on the 8 spot this year - RB/WR or WR/RB in rounds 2 and 3? I don't think you get Cadillac in round 2 from this spot, however.
The 8 spot is very close to the breaking point for what you do in Round 2. RB in round 1 for sure. Round 2 completely depends on how things fall and whether or not you're in a PPR league. It's a tough slot to be in, but the good news is that you get to lead the pack in either the RB2 or WR1 slot. I lean towards going RB/RB to start things off. The tiers are so much more shallow at RB that it is probably going to make the most sense more often than not. I think it will be much easier to find late value at WR than it will be at RB. But getting that RB2 won't mean much if everyone else makes a run on WRs. So I guess the bottom line is: It totally depends on what you think everyone else is about to do, but since there is better depth at WR, it's probably safest to grab an RB2.

What hasn't been discussed much for this approach is going RB/RB/RB. I doubt it'd be too wise, but in a 10 team league, the DD is telling me to go that route. I have to admit, it is pretty sick if the draft wound up like this in a PPR 10 team league:

1 - RB1 - Brown

2 - RB2 - Westbrook

3 - RB3 - Droughns

4 - WR1 - Driver

5 - WR2 - Deion Branch (depending on his contract)

That is just shy of Driver's current ADP, and FBG projections have him as a potential top 10 WR. That is some powerful depth at RB, though, and you still come out with quality WRs.

With the glut of talent at the QB spot this year, I doubt I'll be taking one prior to round 8. I think there is better value to be found at the other positions (including the bench).
I don't think going RB/RB/RB is such a bad option. Even in a 12 team league, I think Westy could fall to the 2.05 spot. Westy with Brown, Rudi, or Jordan wouldn't be bad at all. Adding a decent backup like Droughns would be a nice consolation prize and give nice depth. I would go to battle with those three. Then if you could still somehow snag Driver...wow. Now in a 12 teamer, Driver might be gone, but I would be fine if Branch (contract??) were my no. 1 and I had a couple of guys like Galloway, Rod Smith, T.J. Houz on my roster. Just talking. Maybe I am off base, but I don't mind waiting until the 4th for a WR.
RB/RB/RB is a definite possibility. In fact, if one of my top 12 or so backs falls to round 2, I will likely do just that. The key is finding the cutoff among the RBs where, in round 2, they no longer represent better value than the top 3-4 WRs. If a Cadillac Williams, Ronnie Brown, Rudi Johnson, or maybe even Westbrook falls to round 2, I will likely take him. If all that's left is Domanick Davis or McGahee, and TO, Holt, Harrison, etc.. are still around, I'll be tempted to go with the stud WR rather than the RB with question marks at pick 17.
Big mistake EG. Every draft I've been in I've seen huge value drop in rounds 3 and 4. You have to start off RB/WR to allow yourself some flexibility in round 3 and 4. What if Parker drops to three and you already have two RBs? Then in 4 Foster and Lewis are still there? Grab the stud wideout early and be prepared to scoop up the value later, don't tie your hands.
Really? I haven't been in any 12-team drafts this year yet (save for :e:, which is just starting) so I haven't seen this. I am firmly leaning towards the RB/WR combo, but if a Cadillac Williams dropped to you in round 2, you would still pass him up for a TO/Smith/Holt ?
That would be a tough question as I'd likely take Caddy over Johnson and Jordan to begin with. In your TD heavy league, Lewis and Foster may be just as vaulable as many of the late 1st/early 2nd round backs. I'd be targetting Moss or Harrison in the 2nd.
I like that first comment since I just snagged Caddy at 1.11 in MBSL2, and I am high on him as well. Really ahead of Rudi in a TD-heavy? Hmm.I am targeting Owens in the 2nd, if he's gone, I might go with Harrison over Holt and CJ, assuming Steve Smith is also gone. Moss concerns me a little bit.

 
Evilgrin 72 said:
Marek said:
Evilgrin 72 said:
FWIW, Steven Jackson is typically going in the firs 6-7 picks, so a second round selection of him is likely not a possibility. Holt, on the other hand, is almost always there at 2.5.
I agree. SJ probably won't be there. But the good thing about drafting towards the back, like someone else already mentioned, is that there's an excellent chance that just one of the players higher on your projections sheets might slip through the crack. That's the dillemma to be ready for.And back on the RB/RB/RB option for the 8 spot, if it's a 10 team league, I'm becoming more convinced that is the way to go as it's only 4 more picks to get that first WR. If it's 12 team league, I think the typical RB/RB/WR might be safer, in general. Of course, who knows what players might slip through the crack in rounds 3 and 4.I think the only way you're going to go with RB/WR to lead things off is if you play with 9 other sharks that snag every one of your top 12 RBs before your round 2 pick.
In my league, historically, 13 backs have gone in the first 16 picks, with Manning and 2 WRs thrown in. If one of my top-12 backs (particularly Cadillac) falls to #17, I'd have to consider him, but at this point, I am firmly in the RB/WR camp.
Are we talking 10-team league? If so, I'd be pretty surprised if, at pick 13, more than 10-11 of your top RBs are taken. Rarely is there THAT much simillarity between projections. Also, if you *know* that your league is going to gobble up RBs like peanuts as you say, wouldn't you benefit more by being one of the leaders of that pack as opposed to the leading the less popular run on WRs? Additionally, the RB tiers are smaller so it's a touch safer to get in early there. RB/WR isn't "bad" by any stretch, but I think in most cases you're going to see slightly better value with RB/RB from the 8 spot barring a few exceptional cases.But if we're talking 12 team, then yeah, I'd probably end up RB/WR myself.
 
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Evilgrin 72 said:
BassNBrew said:
Evilgrin 72 said:
BassNBrew said:
Evilgrin 72 said:
Vikes Fan said:
Marek said:
Evilgrin 72 said:
This prompts one of the big debates on the 8 spot this year - RB/WR or WR/RB in rounds 2 and 3? I don't think you get Cadillac in round 2 from this spot, however.
The 8 spot is very close to the breaking point for what you do in Round 2. RB in round 1 for sure. Round 2 completely depends on how things fall and whether or not you're in a PPR league. It's a tough slot to be in, but the good news is that you get to lead the pack in either the RB2 or WR1 slot. I lean towards going RB/RB to start things off. The tiers are so much more shallow at RB that it is probably going to make the most sense more often than not. I think it will be much easier to find late value at WR than it will be at RB. But getting that RB2 won't mean much if everyone else makes a run on WRs. So I guess the bottom line is: It totally depends on what you think everyone else is about to do, but since there is better depth at WR, it's probably safest to grab an RB2.

What hasn't been discussed much for this approach is going RB/RB/RB. I doubt it'd be too wise, but in a 10 team league, the DD is telling me to go that route. I have to admit, it is pretty sick if the draft wound up like this in a PPR 10 team league:

1 - RB1 - Brown

2 - RB2 - Westbrook

3 - RB3 - Droughns

4 - WR1 - Driver

5 - WR2 - Deion Branch (depending on his contract)

That is just shy of Driver's current ADP, and FBG projections have him as a potential top 10 WR. That is some powerful depth at RB, though, and you still come out with quality WRs.

With the glut of talent at the QB spot this year, I doubt I'll be taking one prior to round 8. I think there is better value to be found at the other positions (including the bench).
I don't think going RB/RB/RB is such a bad option. Even in a 12 team league, I think Westy could fall to the 2.05 spot. Westy with Brown, Rudi, or Jordan wouldn't be bad at all. Adding a decent backup like Droughns would be a nice consolation prize and give nice depth. I would go to battle with those three. Then if you could still somehow snag Driver...wow. Now in a 12 teamer, Driver might be gone, but I would be fine if Branch (contract??) were my no. 1 and I had a couple of guys like Galloway, Rod Smith, T.J. Houz on my roster. Just talking. Maybe I am off base, but I don't mind waiting until the 4th for a WR.
RB/RB/RB is a definite possibility. In fact, if one of my top 12 or so backs falls to round 2, I will likely do just that. The key is finding the cutoff among the RBs where, in round 2, they no longer represent better value than the top 3-4 WRs. If a Cadillac Williams, Ronnie Brown, Rudi Johnson, or maybe even Westbrook falls to round 2, I will likely take him. If all that's left is Domanick Davis or McGahee, and TO, Holt, Harrison, etc.. are still around, I'll be tempted to go with the stud WR rather than the RB with question marks at pick 17.
Big mistake EG. Every draft I've been in I've seen huge value drop in rounds 3 and 4. You have to start off RB/WR to allow yourself some flexibility in round 3 and 4. What if Parker drops to three and you already have two RBs? Then in 4 Foster and Lewis are still there? Grab the stud wideout early and be prepared to scoop up the value later, don't tie your hands.
Really? I haven't been in any 12-team drafts this year yet (save for :e:, which is just starting) so I haven't seen this. I am firmly leaning towards the RB/WR combo, but if a Cadillac Williams dropped to you in round 2, you would still pass him up for a TO/Smith/Holt ?
That would be a tough question as I'd likely take Caddy over Johnson and Jordan to begin with. In your TD heavy league, Lewis and Foster may be just as vaulable as many of the late 1st/early 2nd round backs. I'd be targetting Moss or Harrison in the 2nd.
I like that first comment since I just snagged Caddy at 1.11 in MBSL2, and I am high on him as well. Really ahead of Rudi in a TD-heavy? Hmm.I am targeting Owens in the 2nd, if he's gone, I might go with Harrison over Holt and CJ, assuming Steve Smith is also gone. Moss concerns me a little bit.
Forgot about Owens...with your scoring he's the #1 WR on my draft board.
 
Evilgrin 72 said:
BassNBrew said:
Evilgrin 72 said:
BassNBrew said:
Evilgrin 72 said:
Vikes Fan said:
Marek said:
Evilgrin 72 said:
This prompts one of the big debates on the 8 spot this year - RB/WR or WR/RB in rounds 2 and 3? I don't think you get Cadillac in round 2 from this spot, however.
The 8 spot is very close to the breaking point for what you do in Round 2. RB in round 1 for sure. Round 2 completely depends on how things fall and whether or not you're in a PPR league. It's a tough slot to be in, but the good news is that you get to lead the pack in either the RB2 or WR1 slot. I lean towards going RB/RB to start things off. The tiers are so much more shallow at RB that it is probably going to make the most sense more often than not. I think it will be much easier to find late value at WR than it will be at RB. But getting that RB2 won't mean much if everyone else makes a run on WRs. So I guess the bottom line is: It totally depends on what you think everyone else is about to do, but since there is better depth at WR, it's probably safest to grab an RB2.

What hasn't been discussed much for this approach is going RB/RB/RB. I doubt it'd be too wise, but in a 10 team league, the DD is telling me to go that route. I have to admit, it is pretty sick if the draft wound up like this in a PPR 10 team league:

1 - RB1 - Brown

2 - RB2 - Westbrook

3 - RB3 - Droughns

4 - WR1 - Driver

5 - WR2 - Deion Branch (depending on his contract)

That is just shy of Driver's current ADP, and FBG projections have him as a potential top 10 WR. That is some powerful depth at RB, though, and you still come out with quality WRs.

With the glut of talent at the QB spot this year, I doubt I'll be taking one prior to round 8. I think there is better value to be found at the other positions (including the bench).
I don't think going RB/RB/RB is such a bad option. Even in a 12 team league, I think Westy could fall to the 2.05 spot. Westy with Brown, Rudi, or Jordan wouldn't be bad at all. Adding a decent backup like Droughns would be a nice consolation prize and give nice depth. I would go to battle with those three. Then if you could still somehow snag Driver...wow. Now in a 12 teamer, Driver might be gone, but I would be fine if Branch (contract??) were my no. 1 and I had a couple of guys like Galloway, Rod Smith, T.J. Houz on my roster. Just talking. Maybe I am off base, but I don't mind waiting until the 4th for a WR.
RB/RB/RB is a definite possibility. In fact, if one of my top 12 or so backs falls to round 2, I will likely do just that. The key is finding the cutoff among the RBs where, in round 2, they no longer represent better value than the top 3-4 WRs. If a Cadillac Williams, Ronnie Brown, Rudi Johnson, or maybe even Westbrook falls to round 2, I will likely take him. If all that's left is Domanick Davis or McGahee, and TO, Holt, Harrison, etc.. are still around, I'll be tempted to go with the stud WR rather than the RB with question marks at pick 17.
Big mistake EG. Every draft I've been in I've seen huge value drop in rounds 3 and 4. You have to start off RB/WR to allow yourself some flexibility in round 3 and 4. What if Parker drops to three and you already have two RBs? Then in 4 Foster and Lewis are still there? Grab the stud wideout early and be prepared to scoop up the value later, don't tie your hands.
Really? I haven't been in any 12-team drafts this year yet (save for :e:, which is just starting) so I haven't seen this. I am firmly leaning towards the RB/WR combo, but if a Cadillac Williams dropped to you in round 2, you would still pass him up for a TO/Smith/Holt ?
That would be a tough question as I'd likely take Caddy over Johnson and Jordan to begin with. In your TD heavy league, Lewis and Foster may be just as vaulable as many of the late 1st/early 2nd round backs. I'd be targetting Moss or Harrison in the 2nd.
I like that first comment since I just snagged Caddy at 1.11 in MBSL2, and I am high on him as well. Really ahead of Rudi in a TD-heavy? Hmm.I am targeting Owens in the 2nd, if he's gone, I might go with Harrison over Holt and CJ, assuming Steve Smith is also gone. Moss concerns me a little bit.
Forgot about Owens...with your scoring he's the #1 WR on my draft board.
Mine too. Moss is tantalizing as an upside pick, but I just don't know - he's been such a disappointment the last couple of years. Harrison, you can basically pencil in for 1,100 yards and 11-14 TDs.
 
Evilgrin 72 said:
Marek said:
Evilgrin 72 said:
FWIW, Steven Jackson is typically going in the firs 6-7 picks, so a second round selection of him is likely not a possibility. Holt, on the other hand, is almost always there at 2.5.
I agree. SJ probably won't be there. But the good thing about drafting towards the back, like someone else already mentioned, is that there's an excellent chance that just one of the players higher on your projections sheets might slip through the crack. That's the dillemma to be ready for.And back on the RB/RB/RB option for the 8 spot, if it's a 10 team league, I'm becoming more convinced that is the way to go as it's only 4 more picks to get that first WR. If it's 12 team league, I think the typical RB/RB/WR might be safer, in general. Of course, who knows what players might slip through the crack in rounds 3 and 4.I think the only way you're going to go with RB/WR to lead things off is if you play with 9 other sharks that snag every one of your top 12 RBs before your round 2 pick.
In my league, historically, 13 backs have gone in the first 16 picks, with Manning and 2 WRs thrown in. If one of my top-12 backs (particularly Cadillac) falls to #17, I'd have to consider him, but at this point, I am firmly in the RB/WR camp.
Are we talking 10-team league? If so, I'd be pretty surprised if, at pick 13, more than 10-11 of your top RBs are taken. Rarely is there THAT much simillarity between projections. Also, if you *know* that your league is going to gobble up RBs like peanuts as you say, wouldn't you benefit more by being one of the leaders of that pack as opposed to the leading the less popular run on WRs? Additionally, the RB tiers are smaller so it's a touch safer to get in early there. RB/WR isn't "bad" by any stretch, but I think in most cases you're going to see slightly better value with RB/RB from the 8 spot barring a few exceptional cases.But if we're talking 12 team, then yeah, I'd probably end up RB/WR myself.
12 team league. Pick 17 would be the second round choice, not 13.
 
Are we talking 10-team league? If so, I'd be pretty surprised if, at pick 13, more than 10-11 of your top RBs are taken.

But if we're talking 12 team, then yeah, I'd probably end up RB/WR myself.
12 team league. Pick 17 would be the second round choice, not 13.
http://www.adamsweb.us/master_obvious.JPG
:confused: What should have been obvious is whether I was referring to a 10 or 12 team league since it clearly states it in at least 2 different places, particularly the initial post.

 
:confused: What should have been obvious is whether I was referring to a 10 or 12 team league since it clearly states it in at least 2 different places, particularly the initial post.
And I clearly stated (and re-quoted for your benefit) that I was refering to a 10 team league. Good grief... We're well aware that the 8 slot doesn't have the 13th pick in a 12 man league. Even the sarcasm went over your head :D Topic derailment aside, RB/WR isn't a bad idea for a 12 team league. 10 team, you're probably going to see a RB/RB combo being the safest bet under most scoring formats barring the exceptional case of the first 12 picks being all of your top 12 RBs.
 
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:confused: What should have been obvious is whether I was referring to a 10 or 12 team league since it clearly states it in at least 2 different places, particularly the initial post.
And I clearly stated (and re-quoted for your benefit) that I was refering to a 10 team league. Good grief... We're well aware that the 8 slot doesn't have the 13th pick in a 12 man league. Even the sarcasm went over your head :D Topic derailment aside, RB/WR isn't a bad idea for a 12 team league. 10 team, you're probably going to see a RB/RB combo being the safest bet under most scoring formats barring the exceptional case of the first 12 picks being all of your top 12 RBs.
I get that, but we're not talking about ten team leagues, never were, and I have stated that a few times. Don't get all sarcastic and snippy about it. I can see you're not malicious, though, so I will take your comments in the joking spirit in which they were intended. :thumbup:
 
BassNBrew said:
Evilgrin 72 said:
Vikes Fan said:
Marek said:
Evilgrin 72 said:
This prompts one of the big debates on the 8 spot this year - RB/WR or WR/RB in rounds 2 and 3? I don't think you get Cadillac in round 2 from this spot, however.
The 8 spot is very close to the breaking point for what you do in Round 2. RB in round 1 for sure. Round 2 completely depends on how things fall and whether or not you're in a PPR league. It's a tough slot to be in, but the good news is that you get to lead the pack in either the RB2 or WR1 slot. I lean towards going RB/RB to start things off. The tiers are so much more shallow at RB that it is probably going to make the most sense more often than not. I think it will be much easier to find late value at WR than it will be at RB. But getting that RB2 won't mean much if everyone else makes a run on WRs. So I guess the bottom line is: It totally depends on what you think everyone else is about to do, but since there is better depth at WR, it's probably safest to grab an RB2.What hasn't been discussed much for this approach is going RB/RB/RB. I doubt it'd be too wise, but in a 10 team league, the DD is telling me to go that route. I have to admit, it is pretty sick if the draft wound up like this in a PPR 10 team league:1 - RB1 - Brown 2 - RB2 - Westbrook 3 - RB3 - Droughns 4 - WR1 - Driver5 - WR2 - Deion Branch (depending on his contract)That is just shy of Driver's current ADP, and FBG projections have him as a potential top 10 WR. That is some powerful depth at RB, though, and you still come out with quality WRs.With the glut of talent at the QB spot this year, I doubt I'll be taking one prior to round 8. I think there is better value to be found at the other positions (including the bench).
I don't think going RB/RB/RB is such a bad option. Even in a 12 team league, I think Westy could fall to the 2.05 spot. Westy with Brown, Rudi, or Jordan wouldn't be bad at all. Adding a decent backup like Droughns would be a nice consolation prize and give nice depth. I would go to battle with those three. Then if you could still somehow snag Driver...wow. Now in a 12 teamer, Driver might be gone, but I would be fine if Branch (contract??) were my no. 1 and I had a couple of guys like Galloway, Rod Smith, T.J. Houz on my roster. Just talking. Maybe I am off base, but I don't mind waiting until the 4th for a WR.
RB/RB/RB is a definite possibility. In fact, if one of my top 12 or so backs falls to round 2, I will likely do just that. The key is finding the cutoff among the RBs where, in round 2, they no longer represent better value than the top 3-4 WRs. If a Cadillac Williams, Ronnie Brown, Rudi Johnson, or maybe even Westbrook falls to round 2, I will likely take him. If all that's left is Domanick Davis or McGahee, and TO, Holt, Harrison, etc.. are still around, I'll be tempted to go with the stud WR rather than the RB with question marks at pick 17.
Big mistake EG. Every draft I've been in I've seen huge value drop in rounds 3 and 4. You have to start off RB/WR to allow yourself some flexibility in round 3 and 4. What if Parker drops to three and you already have two RBs? Then in 4 Foster and Lewis are still there? Grab the stud wideout early and be prepared to scoop up the value later, don't tie your hands.
I fail to understand why this would be a negative? Having three capable backs is NOT a bad thing. I know there is dropoff after the first tier WR, but I see a bigger dropoff in talent at RB. Therefore, I would rather roll the dice with a second or third tier WR corp and have depth at RB. I would rather have a backfield of say Rudi, Westy (Caddy), Dunn than have a backfield of Rudi Dunn and Foster. There are more options if there is an injury. I persopally would rather have RB depth. You can always trade a guy later!
 

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