Anyone else on here have Gout? (1 Viewer)

[Kenny Powers]

Ive never gone to a MD and have it diagnosed, but Ive basically self diagnosed myself as having the gout. First attack was 2-3 years ago, I actually fell down the stairs into my basement and sprained my right ankle pretty bad, then a couple days later the pain in my right toe was excruciating and worse than my ankle pain so I went to a foot specialist because the pain was so bad I figured something was fractured. Xrays were negative on my ankle, he never mentioned anything about gout in the toe to my, but put me on a weeks worth of steroids and of course the toe pain was gone after a few days.

In the last year, Ive probably had 4-5 acute attacks. The first couple in that same right toe, and then the last 2-3 in my left big toe. Once it moved to my other toe, I knew I needed more than just a lot of aleve to get rid of it and got my dad to prescribe me prednisone. That definitely decreases the pain within a 6-12 hr period noticeably, and then gets totally rid of the flare up after a few days. I drink a ton of water, but also plenty of beer and liquor so Im planning on cutting down on the binges. Ive also started taking more OTC things daily (or try to daily) like vitamin packs, fish oil, flaxseed oil, glucosamine, milk thistle. Yeah I realize these supplements aren't necessarily for the gout, but I figure they'll make my body function as optimally as it can.

Interesting to hear about the cherry concentrate. In all the research Ive done I never read anything about that. I guess I'll have to give that a shot. And as for allopurinol, while it is beneficial in preventing gout attacks, when you do have a flare up you should stop taking it until that attack is gone.

 

[Kenny Powers]

after emailing a fellow board member bout the Cherry Concentrate remedy, I realized after he emailed me back, that my the Cherry farm in my town has a website and ships their product (I am amazed by this)

www.cherrylane.net if you want to check it out. I believe he said he paid 21$

Do I have to be a canuck to have this stuff shipped to me? I dont see a United States option when trying to enter my address?

 

[Balco]

I am another person who has not had any luck with cherry juice/concentrate. I have tried the juice, the concentrate, and cherry extract pills.

The baking soda remedy worked for me a little bit.

Now, since I, like pizzatyme, cut out meat, I have not had any flareups (I stopped eating beef/poultry/pork 6 months ago).

The key for me is that the moment I feel a little pain in my toe, I take a Colcris. Usually stops it, or limits the severity.

And I have had some horrible, month long attacks. In my foot, knee, elbow and wrist. Not fun.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

As for allopurinol, while it is beneficial in preventing gout attacks, when you do have a flare up you should stop taking it until that attack is gone.

This is just wrong.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

gout sux0rs. i've done 2 years of research and will share the basics of what i know.

gout is causes by a build up of uric acid in your system. as it builds up, the tiny crystals of uric acid start to stick together and crystallize into hard, solid little structures. this occurs in pockets in your body where it can accumulate, mostly your joints. it can occur anywhere in your body. it is most common in the big toe. it occurs mostly in extremities where the blood flow is less and therefore the body is colder, allowing the crystallization to occur easier. gout is related to kidney stones, the build up of uric acid that forms a kidney stone is a similar process.

I never connected gout with stones, but that makes sense.

I never had gout, but my father had kidney stones, and there were a couple times I thought maybe I was developing them, which kind of freaked me out because the kidney stone people would probably give you gout guys a good e-fight for worst pain.

so, I did a lot of googling and found out there were several varieties of stones, and that a lot of people believed in that raw bragg's apple cider vinegar, as well as lemon juice.

apparently, there's some kind of sodium citrate, or whatever, in lemon juice, lemonade, etc that gets converted into something else, and moves your ph balance into a range that discourages the formation of the more common type of stones.

also, of course drink a ton of water, as mentioned, to flush the acids from your kidneys.

so, I like lemon stuff and lemonade anyway, and drank a bunch of lemon juice and the apple cider vinegar for a few days.

the pains went away, but I really have no idea what they were to begin with, outside of paranoia, so maybe that stuff is also a paranoia cure.

just throwing it out there if people wanted to google that angle in case there's any relevance.

for example, I just googled this crap

Based on my research, there doesn't seem to be much to the Acid/Alkaline theory. However, based on my experience, there seems to be something to the theory.

My experience: I've been able to alleviate my gout attacks last three times by drinking baking soda dissolved in water. This is courtesy of anecdotal accounts of getting out of gout attacks by rapidly changing the pH.

The latest thinking is that gout attacks are not actually triggered by high fructose consumption or high serum uric acid levels but the acid-base imbalance. That is, while fructose consumption may increase uric acid levels, to actually precipitate a gout attack, you need to deviate from the narrow band of normal blood pH range: 7.35 to 7.45. Ideally you wanna be at 7.45 or slightly above. If you're close to 7.35, you would be in "acidemia" and vulnerable to gout attacks, if you're genetically susceptible to gout (I'm, according to 23andme) and/or if your uric acid is high.

For more Paleo Diet hacks: http://paleohacks.com/questions/94524/acid-alkaline-theory-does-bodys-ph-trigger-gout-at.html#ixzz2nUHaY4Jq

Follow us: @PaleoHacks on Twitter | PaleoHacks on Facebook

this crap

How Does pH Affect Gout?this guy mentions the lemon juice angle

It is important to stay well-hydrated in order to prevent attacks of gout. This will prevent the uric acid from becoming too concentrated and inhibit uric acid crystallization.

Uric acid crystallizes and forms stones in an acidic environment. One was to prevent this is by alkalinizing the urine or making it more basic. Urine alkalinization can be achieved with administration of potassium citrate or sodium bicarbonate as directed by your physician. Lemon juice stimulates the formation of calcium carbonate, which neutralizes acids like uric acid. Therefore, drinking freshly squeezed lemon in a glass of water after meals can prevent a gouty attack. Baking soda can also help alkalinize the urine. Black cohosh also has been shown to moderate blood acidity, thereby making the urine more basic.

did I already link this one?

Gout is the result of an acidic body. Your urine pH level will probably be between 5 – 5.5. That’s not good and we need to get that pH up right now. A neutral pH is 7. What you want is a pH on the alkaline side between 7.35 and 7.45. The sooner your pH goes up the sooner the attack stops and the healing process begins. You should monitor your urine pH level with pH test strips. This way you are not guessing about what’s happening in your body.

I mix in 8 oz of water the juice of 1 lemon with 1 teaspoon of baking soda and drink it. This is fast acting in reducing acidic levels.

There's more at: Kill Gout Pain Formula - Gout Cure - Changing Your Body pH http://www.healthalkaline.com/body-health/my-gout-kill-formula-changing-your-body-ph/#ixzz2nUJmJfdF

 

[Kenny Powers]

As for allopurinol, while it is beneficial in preventing gout attacks, when you do have a flare up you should stop taking it until that attack is gone.

This is just wrong.

I swear I read that from a reputable source that said during an attack allopurinol decreased the effects of other medications in overcoming an attack, but cant find it now.

Either way, it is used to prevent attacks, not treat an attack once it occurs. That is true right down to the pharmacologics since allopurinol decreases the production of uric acid. Once an attack occurs, your uric acid levels are obviously high enough to trigger an attack, so decreasing your blood uric acid levels is irrelevant in actually treating an acute attack.

So while it would appear you shouldnt stop taking allopurinol during an acute attack, doing something like increasing the dosage isnt going to treat/cure an acute attack. For an acute attack you should take either oral corticosteroids or an injection of a steroid into a joint, and/ or pain relievers (OTC ones arent effective for me during an attack) or colchicine.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Once you start taking it every day, you take it for life. You don't start and stop.

 

[Kenny Powers]

Once you start taking it every day, you take it for life. You don't start and stop.

Did you actually read what I just said?

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Once you start taking it every day, you take it for life. You don't start and stop.

Did you actually read what I just said?

Yep. Just saying your advice to stop taking it during an attack was wrong. If it's working the way it should, you won't have any attacks while you're on it. But it can trigger an attack when you start taking it. Hence my comment on your post saying to stop taking it.

 

[Kenny Powers]

Once you start taking it every day, you take it for life. You don't start and stop.

Did you actually read what I just said?

Yep. Just saying your advice to stop taking it during an attack was wrong. If it's working the way it should, you won't have any attacks while you're on it. But it can trigger an attack when you start taking it. Hence my comment on your post saying to stop taking it.

Yes, I recant that statement that you should stop taking it, but when an acute attack occurs, you should use other treatment methods/medications.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

everyone is different when it comes to the cause and the treatment. cherry everything wasn't enough to keep it at bay for me and still get to eat what i wanted(still in heavy moderation) so i take uloric as well. i might be able to stop taking it, but for now, i do. the fear of the pain is that strong.

one positive is that i drink WAY WAY less now and have lost 20 pounds due to simply changing my diet.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

As for allopurinol, while it is beneficial in preventing gout attacks, when you do have a flare up you should stop taking it until that attack is gone.

This is just wrong.

correct, you should continue to take whichever daily med you're on even through an attack.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

gout sux0rs. i've done 2 years of research and will share the basics of what i know.

gout is causes by a build up of uric acid in your system. as it builds up, the tiny crystals of uric acid start to stick together and crystallize into hard, solid little structures. this occurs in pockets in your body where it can accumulate, mostly your joints. it can occur anywhere in your body. it is most common in the big toe. it occurs mostly in extremities where the blood flow is less and therefore the body is colder, allowing the crystallization to occur easier. gout is related to kidney stones, the build up of uric acid that forms a kidney stone is a similar process.

I never connected gout with stones, but that makes sense.

I never had gout, but my father had kidney stones, and there were a couple times I thought maybe I was developing them, which kind of freaked me out because the kidney stone people would probably give you gout guys a good e-fight for worst pain.

so, I did a lot of googling and found out there were several varieties of stones, and that a lot of people believed in that raw bragg's apple cider vinegar, as well as lemon juice.

apparently, there's some kind of sodium citrate, or whatever, in lemon juice, lemonade, etc that gets converted into something else, and moves your ph balance into a range that discourages the formation of the more common type of stones.

also, of course drink a ton of water, as mentioned, to flush the acids from your kidneys.

so, I like lemon stuff and lemonade anyway, and drank a bunch of lemon juice and the apple cider vinegar for a few days.

the pains went away, but I really have no idea what they were to begin with, outside of paranoia, so maybe that stuff is also a paranoia cure.

just throwing it out there if people wanted to google that angle in case there's any relevance.

for example, I just googled this crap

Based on my research, there doesn't seem to be much to the Acid/Alkaline theory. However, based on my experience, there seems to be something to the theory.

My experience: I've been able to alleviate my gout attacks last three times by drinking baking soda dissolved in water. This is courtesy of anecdotal accounts of getting out of gout attacks by rapidly changing the pH.

The latest thinking is that gout attacks are not actually triggered by high fructose consumption or high serum uric acid levels but the acid-base imbalance. That is, while fructose consumption may increase uric acid levels, to actually precipitate a gout attack, you need to deviate from the narrow band of normal blood pH range: 7.35 to 7.45. Ideally you wanna be at 7.45 or slightly above. If you're close to 7.35, you would be in "acidemia" and vulnerable to gout attacks, if you're genetically susceptible to gout (I'm, according to 23andme) and/or if your uric acid is high.

For more Paleo Diet hacks: http://paleohacks.com/questions/94524/acid-alkaline-theory-does-bodys-ph-trigger-gout-at.html#ixzz2nUHaY4Jq

Follow us: @PaleoHacks on Twitter | PaleoHacks on Facebook

this crap

How Does pH Affect Gout?this guy mentions the lemon juice angle

It is important to stay well-hydrated in order to prevent attacks of gout. This will prevent the uric acid from becoming too concentrated and inhibit uric acid crystallization.

Uric acid crystallizes and forms stones in an acidic environment. One was to prevent this is by alkalinizing the urine or making it more basic. Urine alkalinization can be achieved with administration of potassium citrate or sodium bicarbonate as directed by your physician. Lemon juice stimulates the formation of calcium carbonate, which neutralizes acids like uric acid. Therefore, drinking freshly squeezed lemon in a glass of water after meals can prevent a gouty attack. Baking soda can also help alkalinize the urine. Black cohosh also has been shown to moderate blood acidity, thereby making the urine more basic.

did I already link this one?

Gout is the result of an acidic body. Your urine pH level will probably be between 5 – 5.5. That’s not good and we need to get that pH up right now. A neutral pH is 7. What you want is a pH on the alkaline side between 7.35 and 7.45. The sooner your pH goes up the sooner the attack stops and the healing process begins. You should monitor your urine pH level with pH test strips. This way you are not guessing about what’s happening in your body.

I mix in 8 oz of water the juice of 1 lemon with 1 teaspoon of baking soda and drink it. This is fast acting in reducing acidic levels.

There's more at: Kill Gout Pain Formula - Gout Cure - Changing Your Body pH http://www.healthalkaline.com/body-health/my-gout-kill-formula-changing-your-body-ph/#ixzz2nUJmJfdF

i've researched all of those as well. the ph balance of your body is definitely important. there are various ways to affect it, here is an alkaline/acid food chart http://www.rense.com/1.mpicons/acidalka.htm for gout sufferers there is a #### ton of conflicting data. it's hard to pin down whats good or bad. it takes a lot of experimenting to finding out what works for your body.

and with the kidney stones, if you can have them analyzed(mine never came out whole) you can find out if they're uric acid stones. there are 4 types, calcium(most common), uric acid, stuvite and cystine

 

[Brony]

While uric acid is the cause of urate crystals that are the source of gout attacks, it is hypothesized that quick fluctuations in serum uric acid levels (both up and down) contribute to a change in the crystalline structure which triggers the body's immune system. Situations like starting a urate lowering therapy or going on a crash diet can trigger an attack. So, stopping allopurinol or uloric while in the middle of an attack could trigger another attack. Missing a day or so, probably won't matter that much, but the strategy should be to keep uric acid levels low and keep em steady.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

While uric acid is the cause of urate crystals that are the source of gout attacks, it is hypothesized that quick fluctuations in serum uric acid levels (both up and down) contribute to a change in the crystalline structure which triggers the body's immune system. Situations like starting a urate lowering therapy or going on a crash diet can trigger an attack. So, stopping allopurinol or uloric while in the middle of an attack could trigger another attack. Missing a day or so, probably won't matter that much, but the strategy should be to keep uric acid levels low and keep em steady.

this.

the worst attack i ever had was when i started taking uloric. un####ingbearable pain for a week

 

[DA RAIDERS]

another tidbit, i no longer take aspirin because of the alkaline properties of it.

i also take cal/mag and especially potassium . i have yet to try milk thistle or celery root.

eventually i want to stop taking uloric, but am enjoying being able to drink a little and eat a ribeye now and again.

i know the "natural" way will work, i just want to be able to live life a little.



gout joke from the butcher: get the grass fed beef, it's better for your gout.

 

[Kenny Powers]

another tidbit, i no longer take aspirin because of the alkaline properties of it.

And definitely dont take aspirin as a pain reliever for an acute attack, it actually worsens the symptoms.

 

[Balco]

The absolute worst pain from gout is taking the first step off your bed after waking up.

 

[mr. furley]

mine would always start in my big toe and shoot up my leg like a car had run over it with molten lava tires... most excruciating pain ive ever been in

the next time it came back I started the cherry juice immediately and it never progressed and went away after 2-3 days... and since we started using it daily, it has never returned for me or my dad, (and he would get it once a year without fail)

today i learned that i have gout

####

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Welcome to the club, Furley

 

[mr. furley]

Welcome to the club, Furley

 

[boots11234]

mine would always start in my big toe and shoot up my leg like a car had run over it with molten lava tires... most excruciating pain ive ever been in

the next time it came back I started the cherry juice immediately and it never progressed and went away after 2-3 days... and since we started using it daily, it has never returned for me or my dad, (and he would get it once a year without fail)

today i learned that i have gout

####

sorry bro. It's awful. its so bad its not called 'gout' but 'the gout'. Thats the type of respect it gets. Like 'the plague', type of respect.

 

[pizzatyme]

All kinds of horrible gout pain. One of my worst was when I had it in my right thumb at a trade show. I bet I clinched my teeth and shook 200 or more hands that day.

Another bad time was in Vegas. I couldn't walk it was so bad. My mom gave me 2 Vicodin to help ease the pain (or so she thought). They were actually 2 large-dose Doxepin. I was out for more than 12 hours. Oops!

 

[ummich10]

Went to a Christmas party last night, had to pass on beer and slices of a beautiful country ham. Ate fruit instead, and got a veggie burger at Red Robin on the way home.

Balco is right, first step out of bed in the morning is always the worst. My foot and ankle swells so bad my foot has no mobility at all.

 

[steelerfeever]

Have had it for 5-7 years now... Never gets me in the toes though. It rotates knees and rotates the top of my foot. Anyone else have it in the knees? Awful pain. I take allpurinol. If I feel a flare up coming I always have some backup prednisone nearby.

 

[Binky The Doormat]

mine would always start in my big toe and shoot up my leg like a car had run over it with molten lava tires... most excruciating pain ive ever been in

the next time it came back I started the cherry juice immediately and it never progressed and went away after 2-3 days... and since we started using it daily, it has never returned for me or my dad, (and he would get it once a year without fail)

today i learned that i have gout

####

Not good for the Christmas season coming up. Usually created by lots of liquor and rich foods - red meat, shellfish.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

I've had it for probably six years but didn't identify it until about two years ago. I take Allupurinol daily and for flares, take Colchicine which works well. My condition is hereditary, my sister is just 35 and has had it for almost ten years. She's very thin and a picky eater, we just have high naturally occurring uric acid.

The worst thing about it to be is that the doctors treat me like an idiot. "You should stop eating red meat every day and drinking alcohol." Well I eat red meat three times a week and I drink alcohol a maximum of two days a week. When I first got the toe flare it was some years ago and I swear that I had turf toe. Doctors couldn't figure out what it was. Has anyone ever had fluid removed from a gout flare? That's what doctors tell me is the only way to know for sure you have gout. No way, I think I know what I have based on the symptoms and my high uric acid levels.

I have a red bump on the side of my foot near my big toe when I get a flare up, sometimes on the heal. But those are manageable, where it isn't is in my elbows and hands. I have had several broken fingers and a broken knuckle, and they hurt quite often now. I stopped drinking Orange Juice which is a trigger, and I rarely drink liquor anymore. Tomato based products are worse than meat for me, which is just not fair to an Italian. I also love Smelt and that really gives me a good flare, so I can't eat that anymore. Actually fish in general is worse for me I've found, which sucks.

It's manageable but I worry about what it's gonna be like 20 or 30 years from now.

 

[lumpy19]

I've had it for probably six years but didn't identify it until about two years ago. I take Allupurinol daily and for flares, take Colchicine which works well. My condition is hereditary, my sister is just 35 and has had it for almost ten years. She's very thin and a picky eater, we just have high naturally occurring uric acid.

The worst thing about it to be is that the doctors treat me like an idiot. "You should stop eating red meat every day and drinking alcohol." Well I eat red meat three times a week and I drink alcohol a maximum of two days a week. When I first got the toe flare it was some years ago and I swear that I had turf toe. Doctors couldn't figure out what it was. Has anyone ever had fluid removed from a gout flare? That's what doctors tell me is the only way to know for sure you have gout. No way, I think I know what I have based on the symptoms and my high uric acid levels.

I have a red bump on the side of my foot near my big toe when I get a flare up, sometimes on the heal. But those are manageable, where it isn't is in my elbows and hands. I have had several broken fingers and a broken knuckle, and they hurt quite often now. I stopped drinking Orange Juice which is a trigger, and I rarely drink liquor anymore. Tomato based products are worse than meat for me, which is just not fair to an Italian. I also love Smelt and that really gives me a good flare, so I can't eat that anymore. Actually fish in general is worse for me I've found, which sucks.

It's manageable but I worry about what it's gonna be like 20 or 30 years from now.

This is my problem. I eat red meat maybe 1-2x a month and probably drink about the same so I'm not really sure what the cause is. While my diet isn't perfect it's not THAT unhealthy.

I really ####ed up my toe ~3 months ago, it got better and then I played football on thanksgiving and that seemed to get all this crap started.

 

[Kenny Powers]

The worst thing about it to be is that the doctors treat me like an idiot. "You should stop eating red meat every day and drinking alcohol." Well I eat red meat three times a week and I drink alcohol a maximum of two days a week. When I first got the toe flare it was some years ago and I swear that I had turf toe. Doctors couldn't figure out what it was. Has anyone ever had fluid removed from a gout flare? That's what doctors tell me is the only way to know for sure you have gout. No way, I think I know what I have based on the symptoms and my high uric acid levels.

Well if they drain the fluid, they can tell you if there are uric acid crystals in there for 100% gout diagnosis. I agree, based on the medical knowledge available, interwebs and otherwise, I think it is reasonably easy to know if you have gout or not. Like I said, I pretty much self diagnosed myself.

Ive never seen a toe's synovial fluid drained, but I have seen it done to knees. In my mind doing it in your toe would be more painful, but I think that is purely from me thinking about previous gout pain in my toe. In reality it probably wouldnt hurt much and they would give you a local anesthetic anyway.

 

[pizzatyme]

The worst thing about it to be is that the doctors treat me like an idiot. "You should stop eating red meat every day and drinking alcohol." Well I eat red meat three times a week and I drink alcohol a maximum of two days a week. When I first got the toe flare it was some years ago and I swear that I had turf toe. Doctors couldn't figure out what it was. Has anyone ever had fluid removed from a gout flare? That's what doctors tell me is the only way to know for sure you have gout. No way, I think I know what I have based on the symptoms and my high uric acid levels.

Well if they drain the fluid, they can tell you if there are uric acid crystals in there for 100% gout diagnosis. I agree, based on the medical knowledge available, interwebs and otherwise, I think it is reasonably easy to know if you have gout or not. Like I said, I pretty much self diagnosed myself.

Ive never seen a toe's synovial fluid drained, but I have seen it done to knees. In my mind doing it in your toe would be more painful, but I think that is purely from me thinking about previous gout pain in my toe. In reality it probably wouldnt hurt much and they would give you a local anesthetic anyway.

I had my doc try to do it in my wrist. He was mentioning having my wrist fused and wanted to get to the bottom of the gout.

Needless to say, he rammed a ####### spike in my wrist while i was laying down and I almost jumped off the table. And to top it off, he got no fluid. He did, however, nearly get throat punched for not warning me of the ensuing pain.

Imagine chronic gout attack for 3 weeks in your wrist and then having a railroad spike driven through your wrist. Eff, it hurts thinking about it!!!

 

[Onions]

Out with gout.

 

[Chaos Commish]

The worst thing about it to be is that the doctors treat me like an idiot. "You should stop eating red meat every day and drinking alcohol." Well I eat red meat three times a week and I drink alcohol a maximum of two days a week. When I first got the toe flare it was some years ago and I swear that I had turf toe. Doctors couldn't figure out what it was. Has anyone ever had fluid removed from a gout flare? That's what doctors tell me is the only way to know for sure you have gout. No way, I think I know what I have based on the symptoms and my high uric acid levels.

Well if they drain the fluid, they can tell you if there are uric acid crystals in there for 100% gout diagnosis. I agree, based on the medical knowledge available, interwebs and otherwise, I think it is reasonably easy to know if you have gout or not. Like I said, I pretty much self diagnosed myself.

Ive never seen a toe's synovial fluid drained, but I have seen it done to knees. In my mind doing it in your toe would be more painful, but I think that is purely from me thinking about previous gout pain in my toe. In reality it probably wouldnt hurt much and they would give you a local anesthetic anyway.

I had my doc try to do it in my wrist. He was mentioning having my wrist fused and wanted to get to the bottom of the gout.

Needless to say, he rammed a ####### spike in my wrist while i was laying down and I almost jumped off the table. And to top it off, he got no fluid. He did, however, nearly get throat punched for not warning me of the ensuing pain.

Imagine chronic gout attack for 3 weeks in your wrist and then having a railroad spike driven through your wrist. Eff, it hurts thinking about it!!!

No offense but that's so absurd I'm having a difficult time believing it. I went to the ER at 4am during my first attack many years ago. Doc took one look, heard me out, and set up a metatarsophalangeal arthrocentesis. That's a removing synovial fluid from the big toe joint. He used a local anesthetic a few inches from the area, waited a few minutes and worked a little closer to the toe. I couldn't watch, but sure enough he blocked all the nerves just fine. I felt nothing and removal of some of the crystal infested fluid brings some relief.

 

[pizzatyme]

The worst thing about it to be is that the doctors treat me like an idiot. "You should stop eating red meat every day and drinking alcohol." Well I eat red meat three times a week and I drink alcohol a maximum of two days a week. When I first got the toe flare it was some years ago and I swear that I had turf toe. Doctors couldn't figure out what it was. Has anyone ever had fluid removed from a gout flare? That's what doctors tell me is the only way to know for sure you have gout. No way, I think I know what I have based on the symptoms and my high uric acid levels.

Well if they drain the fluid, they can tell you if there are uric acid crystals in there for 100% gout diagnosis. I agree, based on the medical knowledge available, interwebs and otherwise, I think it is reasonably easy to know if you have gout or not. Like I said, I pretty much self diagnosed myself.

Ive never seen a toe's synovial fluid drained, but I have seen it done to knees. In my mind doing it in your toe would be more painful, but I think that is purely from me thinking about previous gout pain in my toe. In reality it probably wouldnt hurt much and they would give you a local anesthetic anyway.

I had my doc try to do it in my wrist. He was mentioning having my wrist fused and wanted to get to the bottom of the gout.

Needless to say, he rammed a ####### spike in my wrist while i was laying down and I almost jumped off the table. And to top it off, he got no fluid. He did, however, nearly get throat punched for not warning me of the ensuing pain.

Imagine chronic gout attack for 3 weeks in your wrist and then having a railroad spike driven through your wrist. Eff, it hurts thinking about it!!!

No offense but that's so absurd I'm having a difficult time believing it. I went to the ER at 4am during my first attack many years ago. Doc took one look, heard me out, and set up a metatarsophalangeal arthrocentesis. That's a removing synovial fluid from the big toe joint. He used a local anesthetic a few inches from the area, waited a few minutes and worked a little closer to the toe. I couldn't watch, but sure enough he blocked all the nerves just fine. I felt nothing and removal of some of the crystal infested fluid brings some relief.

I would have no reason to make it up. He also used local on it, but it obviously didn't take. And that needle was beyond brutal.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

Went to a Christmas party last night, had to pass on beer and slices of a beautiful country ham. Ate fruit instead, and got a veggie burger at Red Robin on the way home.

Balco is right, first step out of bed in the morning is always the worst. My foot and ankle swells so bad my foot has no mobility at all.

went to my xmas party tonight. ate a grip of chinese food and 3-4 hours of really good beer. we shall see if the gout comes to visit............

Have had it for 5-7 years now... Never gets me in the toes though. It rotates knees and rotates the top of my foot. Anyone else have it in the knees? Awful pain. I take allpurinol. If I feel a flare up coming I always have some backup prednisone nearby.

mine starts at the top outer joint of my ankle and spreads across the top of my foot and gravity takes over and the pain radiates all the way across my foot and settles all the way along the bottom outer edge. the pain is unmanageable. i can't walk/think/sleep/anything. it's unfathomable how badly it hurts. i live in fear of it ever returning...

I've had it for probably six years but didn't identify it until about two years ago. I take Allupurinol daily and for flares, take Colchicine which works well. My condition is hereditary, my sister is just 35 and has had it for almost ten years. She's very thin and a picky eater, we just have high naturally occurring uric acid.

The worst thing about it to be is that the doctors treat me like an idiot. "You should stop eating red meat every day and drinking alcohol." Well I eat red meat three times a week and I drink alcohol a maximum of two days a week. When I first got the toe flare it was some years ago and I swear that I had turf toe. Doctors couldn't figure out what it was. Has anyone ever had fluid removed from a gout flare? That's what doctors tell me is the only way to know for sure you have gout. No way, I think I know what I have based on the symptoms and my high uric acid levels.

I have a red bump on the side of my foot near my big toe when I get a flare up, sometimes on the heal. But those are manageable, where it isn't is in my elbows and hands. I have had several broken fingers and a broken knuckle, and they hurt quite often now. I stopped drinking Orange Juice which is a trigger, and I rarely drink liquor anymore. Tomato based products are worse than meat for me, which is just not fair to an Italian. I also love Smelt and that really gives me a good flare, so I can't eat that anymore. Actually fish in general is worse for me I've found, which sucks.

It's manageable but I worry about what it's gonna be like 20 or 30 years from now.

the doctors i had were a giant group of tards. it took over 8 months to diagnose that i had THE GOUT. and then i had to listen to a bunch of spazztastic "specialists" tell me to ingest cherry products/stop all booze/no meat/take allopurinol/take colcrys for flares...expect massive diarrhea.

the red bump is probably a tophi. a side effect of gout. i had one in the nail bed of a toe. i popped it like a zit. this did not end well. ####### thing oozed sticky clear liquid(synovial fluid) for 2 years+ until i found out i had THE GOUT. after the massive diet change, it simply disappeared.

The worst thing about it to be is that the doctors treat me like an idiot. "You should stop eating red meat every day and drinking alcohol." Well I eat red meat three times a week and I drink alcohol a maximum of two days a week. When I first got the toe flare it was some years ago and I swear that I had turf toe. Doctors couldn't figure out what it was. Has anyone ever had fluid removed from a gout flare? That's what doctors tell me is the only way to know for sure you have gout. No way, I think I know what I have based on the symptoms and my high uric acid levels.

Well if they drain the fluid, they can tell you if there are uric acid crystals in there for 100% gout diagnosis. I agree, based on the medical knowledge available, interwebs and otherwise, I think it is reasonably easy to know if you have gout or not. Like I said, I pretty much self diagnosed myself.

Ive never seen a toe's synovial fluid drained, but I have seen it done to knees. In my mind doing it in your toe would be more painful, but I think that is purely from me thinking about previous gout pain in my toe. In reality it probably wouldnt hurt much and they would give you a local anesthetic anyway.

I had my doc try to do it in my wrist. He was mentioning having my wrist fused and wanted to get to the bottom of the gout.

Needless to say, he rammed a ####### spike in my wrist while i was laying down and I almost jumped off the table. And to top it off, he got no fluid. He did, however, nearly get throat punched for not warning me of the ensuing pain.

Imagine chronic gout attack for 3 weeks in your wrist and then having a railroad spike driven through your wrist. Eff, it hurts thinking about it!!!

No offense but that's so absurd I'm having a difficult time believing it. I went to the ER at 4am during my first attack many years ago. Doc took one look, heard me out, and set up a metatarsophalangeal arthrocentesis. That's a removing synovial fluid from the big toe joint. He used a local anesthetic a few inches from the area, waited a few minutes and worked a little closer to the toe. I couldn't watch, but sure enough he blocked all the nerves just fine. I felt nothing and removal of some of the crystal infested fluid brings some relief.

you were unbelievably lucky imho. it took over 8 months for my diagnosis to be clear and correct. my doctor was unwilling to drain any fluid out of my ankle. he thought it would be way too painful and more or less a crap shoot to get the right/any fluid.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

and for those of you taking allopurinol, i don't know if the docs get a kick back on this one, but it seems to be the auto default gout med. it's been around the longest for sure. it didn't work that well for me. i switched to uloric and have had no issues for nearly an entire calendar year. i was having a debilitating attack every 2-3 months previous to the uloric, even though i was taking allopurinol.

 

[Chaos Commish]

The worst thing about it to be is that the doctors treat me like an idiot. "You should stop eating red meat every day and drinking alcohol." Well I eat red meat three times a week and I drink alcohol a maximum of two days a week. When I first got the toe flare it was some years ago and I swear that I had turf toe. Doctors couldn't figure out what it was. Has anyone ever had fluid removed from a gout flare? That's what doctors tell me is the only way to know for sure you have gout. No way, I think I know what I have based on the symptoms and my high uric acid levels.

Well if they drain the fluid, they can tell you if there are uric acid crystals in there for 100% gout diagnosis. I agree, based on the medical knowledge available, interwebs and otherwise, I think it is reasonably easy to know if you have gout or not. Like I said, I pretty much self diagnosed myself.

Ive never seen a toe's synovial fluid drained, but I have seen it done to knees. In my mind doing it in your toe would be more painful, but I think that is purely from me thinking about previous gout pain in my toe. In reality it probably wouldnt hurt much and they would give you a local anesthetic anyway.

I had my doc try to do it in my wrist. He was mentioning having my wrist fused and wanted to get to the bottom of the gout.

Needless to say, he rammed a ####### spike in my wrist while i was laying down and I almost jumped off the table. And to top it off, he got no fluid. He did, however, nearly get throat punched for not warning me of the ensuing pain.

Imagine chronic gout attack for 3 weeks in your wrist and then having a railroad spike driven through your wrist. Eff, it hurts thinking about it!!!

No offense but that's so absurd I'm having a difficult time believing it. I went to the ER at 4am during my first attack many years ago. Doc took one look, heard me out, and set up a metatarsophalangeal arthrocentesis. That's a removing synovial fluid from the big toe joint. He used a local anesthetic a few inches from the area, waited a few minutes and worked a little closer to the toe. I couldn't watch, but sure enough he blocked all the nerves just fine. I felt nothing and removal of some of the crystal infested fluid brings some relief.

you were unbelievably lucky imho. it took over 8 months for my diagnosis to be clear and correct. my doctor was unwilling to drain any fluid out of my ankle. he thought it would be way too painful and more or less a crap shoot to get the right/any fluid.

I am puzzled by the pitiful care I sense reading this thread. I find it unfathomable that you had specialists talking about cherries or went months without diagnosis. Gout is not mysterious. It is one of the better understood pathologies. Primary physicians do a crappy/lazy job, I know.

I don't think I was lucky. I think I was treated appropriately by the standard of care every emergency doc is held to when common podagra limps his way. I mean it's in the book. Arthrocentesis for probable gout. It isn't uncommon for a primary doc in an office visit to diagnose without a tap. Some will go by UA levels which is not accurate. Less than 25% of us with high UA have gout. But the combination high UA with swollen red pain from hell lodged in an outer joint makes it pretty obvious. 80% of primary gout patients never have a second attack. My hunch is they lack the genetic disorder and experienced secondary gout due to some environmental oddity.

ER docs need to be 100% before treating. Numb the freaking area and be sure the patient cannot feel. Gout hurts like hell. Every doc knows this. Dentists get this right because they know teeth issues hurt like hell too. Even docs on the internet are informing us that this shouldn't hurt. I know that's a little terrifying to watch, but it's not painful. Honestly, I think I would have torn pizzat's doc's office down before I realized what I was doing. I've read every gout forum I could find going back to 07. I've never read a tap story like the one posted here.

I can't believe you popped a tophi like a zit. Madness.

My big toe tophi healed. It is gone without a trace.

I am considered cured by some and properly managed by others. Levels have been 95% sub 6 for almost three years. I eat pretty much what I want with no regard for an attack, but I'm not a heavy drinker and was a bit of a health food nut going in. I do not avoid beef, lamb, or shellfish (or anything) and use a modified primal diet to keep my sexy figure. I have a script for 80mg Uloric, but 40mg every other day has been my dose for over a year. I haven't had an attack in 2.5 years. I suffered 17 in 4 years and the last ones were polyarticular. So I understand the problem with poor management and medical care. Some of the stories in this thread just seem absurd.

There's a lot of snake oil out there on the internet, folks. If you've had an attack or two in your life and believe some diet idea is the ticket, then congrats and vaya con dios. If you've suffered from multiple eruptions, see no end in sight, and live in fear of the next one; find a rheumatologist who specializes in gout. Get the meds. Get a meter. Get your UA under six. Deal with the likely painful part of the healing process, and end the madness.

Only one other poor soul in this thread has mentioned getting his levels right. Good job, Ruds.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

and for those of you taking allopurinol, i don't know if the docs get a kick back on this one, but it seems to be the auto default gout med. it's been around the longest for sure. it didn't work that well for me. i switched to uloric and have had no issues for nearly an entire calendar year. i was having a debilitating attack every 2-3 months previous to the uloric, even though i was taking allopurinol.

how much is Uloric?

I pay $10 for 3 months of Allopurinol. Not sure why or how there could be a kickback on something so inexpensive. Seems to work for me.

 

[Chaos Commish]

and for those of you taking allopurinol, i don't know if the docs get a kick back on this one, but it seems to be the auto default gout med. it's been around the longest for sure. it didn't work that well for me. i switched to uloric and have had no issues for nearly an entire calendar year. i was having a debilitating attack every 2-3 months previous to the uloric, even though i was taking allopurinol.

Uloric is $1.50 a day at 80mgs. Under patent and very expensive. I may switch back to Allo. They do the same thing.

I didn't understand Allo when my primary put me on 300mg. I still had acute flare ups. But if those were from my UA going down, then the Allo was doing it's job, and I was just processing crystals (healing). I'm 99% sure that was the case. Allo works for 99% of everyone who sticks with it and doesn't experience bad side effects. It just lowers UA. Uloric does the same. Doctors just do a poor job explaining those crystals will mobilize when the lower UA breaks down the protein covers and frees the demons. Once you've processed all those crystals the attacks will stop and you will not make more if you keep your levels safe.

My meter says Uloric is much faster acting than Allo, but both will get me under six. I didn't have side effects with Allo.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Only one other poor soul in this thread has mentioned getting his levels right. Good job, Ruds.

my levels weren't that high (maybe 8 or so, iirc) so I was somewhat borderline. I was on allopurinol in the past but then thought I could control things with diet, exercise, etc so I stopped taking it. things were mostly fine for a couple years. If I had a flare up, I would take indeomethacin to address it.

earlier this year though, things just got out of control. in addition to some flare ups in the big toe, it migrated to my hand and wouldn't go away for a month or so. The anti-inflammatory drugs I had also weren't working as well as they had in the past. Got a colchicine RX to help, but then had another flare up in my ankle that was the worst I could remember.

went back on allopurinol and supplemented with colchicine for a couple months. took a new blood test and the new levels were "perfect". So, hoping I have it under control now.

My diagnosis was as simple as me saying "gout runs in my family". Doc took a blood test and confirmed the high levels. Bingo. Never had any fluid drained. But the first major attack I had way back when basically debilitated me for an entire summer. I thought it was turf toe or something at the time as well. Took me awhile to figure out it was gout, but once I did all the symptoms made perfect sense so in retrospect it was pretty easy to self-diagnose and the blood test just confirmed it.

 

[pizzatyme]

Uloric is expensive on my plan. $35 for a month's supply. Allopurinol is cheap and I think it may be due to the patent running out. Maybe not.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Uloric is expensive on my plan. $35 for a month's supply. Allopurinol is cheap and I think it may be due to the patent running out. Maybe not.

yeah, Allo is generic. practically free.

 

[glumpy]

I'm with the cherry juice concentrate and lotsa water crowd. That's worked for me, and friends, to where heavy meds and dietary changes have been largely unnecessary. I've even passed the kidney stone after flushing it out. Now--if your issues are so much more extreme I would suggest that both juice and water are certainly a beneficial dietary addition in any case.

As for shoes--you might check out Keen's. A few years ago when I discovered a pair of them at a beachfront shop my wife took one look and exclaimed "OH!! THAT's where your gout is!!" They swale out right at the joint and it keeps a lot of pressure off. I'm on my feet a lot and wouldn't trade them.

 

[Chaos Commish]

My UA was 10-13. I didn't get proactive with a meter and really sharp doc until winter 11. Aaron, any joint that has suffered 1 flare up is a candidate for another. Understand that is sometimes necessary to clear the joint of crystals. I guess they sometimes "dissolve" painlessly or process slowly enough to prevent a massive autoimmune response, but in my case each site flared up one last time or two. The big toe was sore for months, but not en fuego. I do recommend a meter. You should be able to get a script and even if not mine tests blood sugar, uric acid and cholesterol for $100. Handy. I check my levels once a week or so.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

My UA was 10-13. I didn't get proactive with a meter and really sharp doc until winter 11. Aaron, any joint that has suffered 1 flare up is a candidate for another. Understand that is sometimes necessary to clear the joint of crystals. I guess they sometimes "dissolve" painlessly or process slowly enough to prevent a massive autoimmune response, but in my case each site flared up one last time or two. The big toe was sore for months, but not en fuego. I do recommend a meter. You should be able to get a script and even if not mine tests blood sugar, uric acid and cholesterol for $100. Handy. I check my levels once a week or so.

Any specific one? TIA.

 

[Chaos Commish]

I'm with the cherry juice concentrate and lotsa water crowd. That's worked for me, and friends, to where heavy meds and dietary changes have been largely unnecessary. I've even passed the kidney stone after flushing it out. Now--if your issues are so much more extreme I would suggest that both juice and water are certainly a beneficial dietary addition in any case.

As for shoes--you might check out Keen's. A few years ago when I discovered a pair of them at a beachfront shop my wife took one look and exclaimed "OH!! THAT's where your gout is!!" They swale out right at the joint and it keeps a lot of pressure off. I'm on my feet a lot and wouldn't trade them.

Right. It is about extremes. In research Cherry helped 1/3rd of the subjects. So 2/3rds got nowhere. And by help that meant it made flare ups less severe (there's some anti-inflammatory chemistry to cherries), and cherry also made flare ups less frequent. I prefer no more flare ups, period. Studies with Allo and Uloric tell us that is possible. Vitamin C supps had the same basic results as Cherries, btw. Coffee and low fat dairy have larger studies with more positive results than cherry, btw. None of this stuff has been scientifically tested, just epidemiological type research.

 

[Notorious T.R.E.]

Welcome to the club, Furley

 

[Chaos Commish]

My UA was 10-13. I didn't get proactive with a meter and really sharp doc until winter 11. Aaron, any joint that has suffered 1 flare up is a candidate for another. Understand that is sometimes necessary to clear the joint of crystals. I guess they sometimes "dissolve" painlessly or process slowly enough to prevent a massive autoimmune response, but in my case each site flared up one last time or two. The big toe was sore for months, but not en fuego. I do recommend a meter. You should be able to get a script and even if not mine tests blood sugar, uric acid and cholesterol for $100. Handy. I check my levels once a week or so.

Any specific one? TIA.

This is my brand, but not my meter.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

My UA was 10-13. I didn't get proactive with a meter and really sharp doc until winter 11. Aaron, any joint that has suffered 1 flare up is a candidate for another. Understand that is sometimes necessary to clear the joint of crystals. I guess they sometimes "dissolve" painlessly or process slowly enough to prevent a massive autoimmune response, but in my case each site flared up one last time or two. The big toe was sore for months, but not en fuego. I do recommend a meter. You should be able to get a script and even if not mine tests blood sugar, uric acid and cholesterol for $100. Handy. I check my levels once a week or so.

I started seeing a rheumatologist a couple months ago. He didn't mention the meter thing. Hoping my levels are low enough that it's not something I need to monitor that closely but I'll keep it in mind.

 

[Chaos Commish]

My UA was 10-13. I didn't get proactive with a meter and really sharp doc until winter 11. Aaron, any joint that has suffered 1 flare up is a candidate for another. Understand that is sometimes necessary to clear the joint of crystals. I guess they sometimes "dissolve" painlessly or process slowly enough to prevent a massive autoimmune response, but in my case each site flared up one last time or two. The big toe was sore for months, but not en fuego. I do recommend a meter. You should be able to get a script and even if not mine tests blood sugar, uric acid and cholesterol for $100. Handy. I check my levels once a week or so.

I started seeing a rheumatologist a couple months ago. He didn't mention the meter thing. Hoping my levels are low enough that it's not something I need to monitor that closely but I'll keep it in mind.

Yeah, meters are not common in this country. I was wrong thinking you could get a script for one. Maybe someday, but for now it's a personal decision to self monitor. I went through a ton of test strips trying to isolate foods that raise and lower UA. With me it's sugar more than anything, fructose leading the charge. Most cherries raise my UA. So, there's that. The tart cherries were fine.

I also learned that diet only accounts for 10-30% of our UA content. The rest is produced by our bodies regardless of what we eat. I've personally lost 80% of my interest in dietary controls so long as I am eating healthy, avoiding processed sugars and carbs, I'm not worrying about much else. The 20% I do for UA control is not about purines and lowering my UA. It is about increasing my bodies ability to eliminate UA. 80% of gout patients do not have high UA because of what they eat or their bodies producing too much, rather their bodies do not excrete enough. I do this by alkalizing my urine. The alkaline diet fad is silly and like most similar topics loaded with false claims, but you can increase urine PH making it easier on your body to eliminate acids. But again, diet ideas are working on, not fixing, just adjusting 10-30% of the issue.

I loved this result. Vegans have higher uric acid than meat eaters and even meat and seafood eaters.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Yeah, the specialist I went to see basically said not to worry much about diet unless you're eating a ton of organ meats or something pretty unusual.

Drinking lots of water is good. I was also told to eat more salt to help your body retain the water. Getting dehydrated is I think I big trigger for me.