B.Croyle Vs. T.Jackson (1 Viewer)

[Golden Mike Tomczak]

Both of these young QB's struggled last season.

They seem to be QB by default, since neither club has a better option.

Croyle at times seemed to have a good touch and a solid arm, wheras T.Jax could be a threat on the ground moreso than his passing ability.

From a fantasy standpoint, I'd go with T.Jax as my QB 2 over Croyle, he's on a better team IMO and his legs could give him added value as a point scorer.

 

[The Man with the Plan]

From a fantasy standpoint, I'd go with T.Jax as my QB 2 over Croyle, he's on a better team IMO and his legs could give him added value as a point scorer.

Me too.

 

[Iwannabeacowboybaby!]

I think Croyle is the better passer and Jackson the better athlete. Jackson may have more upside but he also has the most work to do out of the two to be a quality QB in the NFL.

 

[jurb26]

I like Croyle's situation better than Jackson's. I know Minn is a better team, but KC sucked last year and they still managed to put up 3200/17 passing the ball. Minn only got 2750/12. KC at least has a WR1 and play maker in Bowe as well as a great option at TE in Gonzo. Minn has ummm.... Berian. I also agree that Croyle is a better passer. As long as the Oline doesn't get him killed, I like Croyle.

 

[FunkyPlutos]

Don't sleep on Tarvaris...this is your last chance to get him cheap.

 

[Couch Potato]

Jackson very well could surprise. His surrounding cast will help get him fantasy points (Peterson, C Taylor, Rice, Berrian), and he'll add points with his running ability. His defense will also put him in position for shorter scoring drives. There is little risk of his backup (Frerotte) taking his job.

Croyle probably will disappoint. His OL is in rebuild mode and his protection will be iffy. He is of slight build and is a greater than average injury risk IMO. He was hurt a lot in college too. Beyond Bowe and an aging TE there is little to throw to (Webb, Franklin, Darling don't inspire much confidence). I also think Tyler Thigpen could challenge for the starting job before the season is finished, even if Croyle stays healthy.

I'd roster Jackson for his upside and see what happens. I'd avoid Croyle unless absolutely out of starting QB options.

 

[jurb26]

Jackson very well could surprise. His surrounding cast will help get him fantasy points points (Peterson, C Taylor, Rice, Berrian), and he'll add points with his running ability. His defense will also put him in position for shorter scoring drives. There is little risk of his backup (Frerotte) taking his job.

Croyle will disappoint. His OL is in rebuild mode and his protection will be iffy. He is of slight build and is a greater than average injury risk IMO. He was hurt a lot in college too. Beyond Bowe and an aging TE there is little to throw to (Webb, Franklin, Darling don't inspire much confidence). I also think Tyler Thigpen could challenge for the starting job before the season is finished, even if Croyle stays healthy.

I'd roster Jackson for his upside and see what happens. I'd avoid Croyle unless absolutely out of starting QB options.

Ummm, that alone is far more than what Jackson has.

 

[Couch Potato]

Jackson very well could surprise. His surrounding cast will help get him fantasy points points (Peterson, C Taylor, Rice, Berrian), and he'll add points with his running ability. His defense will also put him in position for shorter scoring drives. There is little risk of his backup (Frerotte) taking his job.

Croyle will disappoint. His OL is in rebuild mode and his protection will be iffy. He is of slight build and is a greater than average injury risk IMO. He was hurt a lot in college too. Beyond Bowe and an aging TE there is little to throw to (Webb, Franklin, Darling don't inspire much confidence). I also think Tyler Thigpen could challenge for the starting job before the season is finished, even if Croyle stays healthy.

I'd roster Jackson for his upside and see what happens. I'd avoid Croyle unless absolutely out of starting QB options.

Ummm, that alone is far more than what Jackson has.

That's your opinion. I don't agree.

 

[jurb26]

Jackson very well could surprise. His surrounding cast will help get him fantasy points points (Peterson, C Taylor, Rice, Berrian), and he'll add points with his running ability. His defense will also put him in position for shorter scoring drives. There is little risk of his backup (Frerotte) taking his job.

Croyle will disappoint. His OL is in rebuild mode and his protection will be iffy. He is of slight build and is a greater than average injury risk IMO. He was hurt a lot in college too. Beyond Bowe and an aging TE there is little to throw to (Webb, Franklin, Darling don't inspire much confidence). I also think Tyler Thigpen could challenge for the starting job before the season is finished, even if Croyle stays healthy.

I'd roster Jackson for his upside and see what happens. I'd avoid Croyle unless absolutely out of starting QB options.

Ummm, that alone is far more than what Jackson has.

That's your opinion. I don't agree.

So you think Rice and Berrian are better options? It seems like most of your opinion is based around the idea that Croyle will get injured or is of high risk to get injured.

 

[Couch Potato]

Jackson very well could surprise. His surrounding cast will help get him fantasy points points (Peterson, C Taylor, Rice, Berrian), and he'll add points with his running ability. His defense will also put him in position for shorter scoring drives. There is little risk of his backup (Frerotte) taking his job.

Croyle will disappoint. His OL is in rebuild mode and his protection will be iffy. He is of slight build and is a greater than average injury risk IMO. He was hurt a lot in college too. Beyond Bowe and an aging TE there is little to throw to (Webb, Franklin, Darling don't inspire much confidence). I also think Tyler Thigpen could challenge for the starting job before the season is finished, even if Croyle stays healthy.

I'd roster Jackson for his upside and see what happens. I'd avoid Croyle unless absolutely out of starting QB options.

Ummm, that alone is far more than what Jackson has.

That's your opinion. I don't agree.

So you think Rice and Berrian are better options? It seems like most of your opinion is based around the idea that Croyle will get injured or is of high risk to get injured.

No, most of my opinion is not "based around the idea that Croyle will get injured or is of high risk to get injured." It was only one part of my post, and I gave no special status to that part. You chose to interpret it that way. I also mentioned the OL. I also implied I don't think Croyle is very good, as indicated by saying "Tyler Thigpen could challenge for the starting job before the season is finished, even if Croyle stays healthy."Looking forward -- not just backward -- I see a TE in Gonzo who at 32 has now entered the decline phase of his career. Whether due to slowing or injury, I don't believe he'll again approach his 2007 numbers. Most are ranking him as though he'll be a top-4 TE, but I've done a lot of personal research on age/production curves and wouldn't touch him at that ranking for 2008. Choose to ignore that or not, it doesn't matter to me. And while Bowe got his opportunity for a very nice rookie season because Kennison went down with injury in Week 1 last year, and I have little doubt he'll be a nice WR1, I also think Sydney Rice will make his large Year 2 leap in 2008 and that Berrian will be a very nice upgrade from what MIN had last year. Wade is a decent slot guy when needed too.

So, I disagree that Croyle has far more going for him than Jackson has. And it's not because I'm assuming injury.

 

[FunkyPlutos]

I also think Sydney Rice will make his large Year 2 leap in 2008 and that Berrian will be a very nice upgrade from what MIN had last year. Wade is a decent slot guy when needed too.

Also, don't forget about Aundrae Allison. They are quietly pleased with the progress he has made from last season - going along with this is the fact that they didn't grab a WR until round 6 when many thought they would get one early (granted they didn't have much in the way of picks, but their confidence in Allison could be a reason they felt they could lose a few of the picks as well).

 

[travdogg]

I'll take the one that won't be running for his life(Jackson.)

I wouldn't want either of these guys on my team as anything more than a waiver wire pick up at this point.

FWIW, I'd rather take a shot on a guy like Matt Ryan than these guys.

 

[jurb26]

Jackson very well could surprise. His surrounding cast will help get him fantasy points points (Peterson, C Taylor, Rice, Berrian), and he'll add points with his running ability. His defense will also put him in position for shorter scoring drives. There is little risk of his backup (Frerotte) taking his job.

Croyle will disappoint. His OL is in rebuild mode and his protection will be iffy. He is of slight build and is a greater than average injury risk IMO. He was hurt a lot in college too. Beyond Bowe and an aging TE there is little to throw to (Webb, Franklin, Darling don't inspire much confidence). I also think Tyler Thigpen could challenge for the starting job before the season is finished, even if Croyle stays healthy.

I'd roster Jackson for his upside and see what happens. I'd avoid Croyle unless absolutely out of starting QB options.

Ummm, that alone is far more than what Jackson has.

That's your opinion. I don't agree.

So you think Rice and Berrian are better options? It seems like most of your opinion is based around the idea that Croyle will get injured or is of high risk to get injured.

No, most of my opinion is not "based around the idea that Croyle will get injured or is of high risk to get injured." It was only one part of my post, and I gave no special status to that part. You chose to interpret it that way. I also mentioned the OL. I also implied I don't think Croyle is very good, as indicated by saying "Tyler Thigpen could challenge for the starting job before the season is finished, even if Croyle stays healthy."Looking forward -- not just backward -- I see a TE in Gonzo who at 32 has now entered the decline phase of his career. Whether due to slowing or injury, I don't believe he'll again approach his 2007 numbers. Most are ranking him as though he'll be a top-4 TE, but I've done a lot of personal research on age/production curves and wouldn't touch him at that ranking for 2008. Choose to ignore that or not, it doesn't matter to me. And while Bowe got his opportunity for a very nice rookie season because Kennison went down with injury in Week 1 last year, and I have little doubt he'll be a nice WR1, I also think Sydney Rice will make his large Year 2 leap in 2008 and that Berrian will be a very nice upgrade from what MIN had last year. Wade is a decent slot guy when needed too.

So, I disagree that Croyle has far more going for him than Jackson has. And it's not because I'm assuming injury.

Well, I'm not really sure how else I'm supposed to interpret this "Croyle probably will disappoint. His OL is in rebuild mode and his protection will be iffy. He is of slight build and is a greater than average injury risk IMO. He was hurt a lot in college too. Beyond Bowe and an aging TE there is little to throw to (Webb, Franklin, Darling don't inspire much confidence). I also think Tyler Thigpen could challenge for the starting job before the season is finished, even if Croyle stays healthy." but I'm glad you cleared it up a bit.I don't think the Oline can really be any worse than it was last year. They added a very talented rookie and well, they were one of the worst in the NFL last year. With that Oline KC still amassed a far amount more fantasy points passing the ball than Minn. So, if both QBs are to remain starters I think things favor Croyle. I like Thigpen's athletic ability, but I'd say the odds of him beating out Croyle are rather small. It's also been stated from people that Jackosn could loose his job to Booty. I think I'd put both those events in the same realm of possibility.

I never said I didn't expect a decline from Gonzo. I agree that with his age it is likely. The fact still remains that Gonzo can have a rather significant decline in production and still beat out the likes of what Minn has IMO. He had nearly 1200 yds and 5 TDs last year. That is far greater than any Minn WR or TE put up last year and also far greater than anything I've seen projected from any Minn WR or TE this year. Gonzo could see a reduction of 75% and still likely beat the production of Minn's leading WR. On top of that, Bowe looks to be the best receiving option on the team and he too (like Rice) should see an increase in production in year 2. I think if you place any one of Bowe or Gonzo on Minn they would become the best receiving option on the team from day one.

I also find it odd that you list both RBs in Minn as reasons for optimism in Minn while never mentioning LJ and what appears to be another new receiving option out of the backfield in Charles. This seems rather selective to me as even if you have little confidence in Charles, LJ has proven he is a great RB and also a great receiving threat.

 

[Chase Stuart]

I think Berrian's a perfect fit for this offense. Dome team, great rushing attack. He should be among the leaders in YPC among WR1s in the league this year.

I like Jackson a lot, and don't like Croyle a lot. That's probably more subjective than anything, although I like Min's coaching staff a lot more than KC's for a QB. Something must have been in the water in Alabama in 1983 -- two NFL starting QBs born there.

As for Bowe/Berrian, I like Berrian a bit more. I still worry a bit about rookie WRs that excel. That's been shattered a bit in recent years, but in the last decade we've seen Clayton, Boldin, Stallworth, Antonio Bryant, Warrick, and Kevin Johnson have big rookie seasons and then suffer serious drops the next year in both FP and FP/G. In other words, I think rookie WRs have the potential to have big years without necessarily being a really good WR. That's why it's tough for me to totally get on board with the Dwayne Bowe Show. It's easy to say that Bowe is a whole lot better than Donte Stallworth, but this time five years ago, people thought Stallworth was the next big time stud WR.

 

[jurb26]

but this time five years ago, people thought Stallworth was the next big time stud WR.

Stallworth has always been able to produce, he just has never been able to stay healthy. He averages 50 yds and 0.37 Tds per game over his 84 game career despite all the injuries. Thats roughly 800/6 per year.

 

[Skanker]

Croyle has the better situation.

 

[Chase Stuart]

but this time five years ago, people thought Stallworth was the next big time stud WR.

Stallworth has always been able to produce, he just has never been able to stay healthy. He averages 50 yds and 0.37 Tds per game over his 84 game career despite all the injuries. Thats roughly 800/6 per year.

That's fair. I was more focusing on the fact that Stallworth had just 485/3 in 11 games as a sophomore.But he's rebounded from that bad year pretty well.

 

[jurb26]

but this time five years ago, people thought Stallworth was the next big time stud WR.

Stallworth has always been able to produce, he just has never been able to stay healthy. He averages 50 yds and 0.37 Tds per game over his 84 game career despite all the injuries. Thats roughly 800/6 per year.

That's fair. I was more focusing on the fact that Stallworth had just 485/3 in 11 games as a sophomore.But he's rebounded from that bad year pretty well.

I must admit, I loved this guys potential at one point. There are very few guys that I would predict a strong probability for injury, but this guy just has to be one of them. His hamstrings are a walking time bomb.

 

[Chase Stuart]

but this time five years ago, people thought Stallworth was the next big time stud WR.

Stallworth has always been able to produce, he just has never been able to stay healthy. He averages 50 yds and 0.37 Tds per game over his 84 game career despite all the injuries. Thats roughly 800/6 per year.

That's fair. I was more focusing on the fact that Stallworth had just 485/3 in 11 games as a sophomore.But he's rebounded from that bad year pretty well.

I must admit, I loved this guys potential at one point. There are very few guys that I would predict a strong probability for injury, but this guy just has to be one of them. His hamstrings are a walking time bomb.

He was no Quincy Morgan, IMO. Young WRs are a tricky bunch.

 

[MAFLcommish]

LJ will be back on the ground game to take some pressure off Brody, however the OL will be key here.

 

[Flea Flicker]

I can't believe how many people are sleeping on Tarvaris. He is going to be a decent-to-good QB2 this year. Take a look at Jackson's stats down the stretch last season and remember that 2008 will be his second season as the starter. There is hope here for T-Jack.

Croyle, otoh, is someone I'd only consider as a QB3.

 

[massraider]

I would take Jackson over Croyle, in fantasy, and in "real life".

if I have two QBs that I am concerned with, I take the one with a better team around him.

 

[menobrown]

When in doubt take the guy that can not be Herminated.

 

[Anthony Borbely]

I like Jackson a lot, and don't like Croyle a lot.

:( That's all I need to know. Croyle is terrible and I really do not see any upside. At least Tarvaris has shown some promise and people also forget that he played at a small school and thus had much farther to go than most QBs. Talent wise, it's not even close.

 

[menobrown]

I can't believe how many people are sleeping on Tarvaris. He is going to be a decent-to-good QB2 this year. Take a look at Jackson's stats down the stretch last season and remember that 2008 will be his second season as the starter.

You bring up some good points and I for one was sleeping on him but you are right he did close the season fairly decent putting up over 18 fantasy points per game over his last 6. Add in Berrian, possibe improvment from Rice and added experience and I think you are correct that a lot of people are sleeping on him.

 

[travdogg]

I can't believe how many people are sleeping on Tarvaris. He is going to be a decent-to-good QB2 this year. Take a look at Jackson's stats down the stretch last season and remember that 2008 will be his second season as the starter. There is hope here for T-Jack.Croyle, otoh, is someone I'd only consider as a QB3.

Take a look at Peterson's numbers down the stretch too. Jackson's numbers are inflated from teams completely shutting down the running game, if Jackson maintains that pace than Peterson won't be a top back.

 

[Alex96]

Two words: "jump pass."

Croyle wins by default.

 

[FunkyPlutos]

Two words: "jump pass."Croyle wins by default.

Sorry, but Favre retired.