Better Rookie Running Back Class - 2014 or 2015? (1 Viewer)

[Jeremy's Spoken]

2014

Jeremy Hill

Tre Mason

Carlos Hyde

Bishop Sankey

Isaiah Crowell

Andre Williams

Charles Sims

Jerick McKinnon

Brandon Oliver

Devonta Freeman

Alfred Blue

Ka'Deem Carey

Terrence West

2015

Todd Gurley

Melvin Gordon

Tevin Coleman

Jay Ajayi

David Johnson

Duke Johnson

TJ Yeldon

Ameer Abdullah

Jeremy Langford

David Cobb

"Buck" Allen

Mike Davis

Cameron Artis-Payne

Karlos Williams

Josh Robinson

The 2015 class has been spoken about for years as a great RB class. I think that it is... There is big-time talent at the top and good depth.

The 2014 seems to have turned out better than many projected. There may be 7-8 starters (or more) that come out of this class

Which class do you think will turn out being the better class?

 

[Lott's Fingertip]

I like 2015, but not in a landslide.

 

[beef]

As prospects I like this class better and it's really not close for me. I view Gurley and Gordon as far better talents than anyone from the '14 class, and I also think some of this year's 2nd tier could rival last year's top tier.

Knowing what I know now, I still favor the '15 class. I value Hill a lot more now, but I'm not sold on Hyde or Freeman. I do think Mason is slightly undervalued though and expect Crowell to improve on his numbers too. Sankey, not sure yet but not ready to write him off. No one else really jumps out at me as being anything more than just a role player or NFL backup.

4 years from now, I think we'll see more RBs from the '15 class in the top 24 and have more studs (Fantasy #1 types) than from the '14 class. This time last year I wasn't real high on the '14 class either, and much preferred the '13 class. So it's not just a "shinny new toys of hope" line of thinking for me.

 

[Jeremy's Spoken]

Gurley > Hill

Gordon = Mason

Coleman = Crowell

Ajayi = Hyde

Duke Johnson = Sankey

David Johnson = Sims

Yeldon = Andre Williams

Abdullah = McKinnon

Langford = Oliver

Cobb = Blue

Allen = Freeman

Davis = West

Karlos Williams = Carey

Gurley is supremely talented. I'm pretty sure that he will be better than Hill (and I am a big fan of Hill and think he is ultra talented).

For all of the others, I think an argument could be made either way who is the better RB...

The 2014 class may be closer to the 2015 class than people think...

 

[spider321]

Did you really just put a "=" between Gordon and Mason?

lol

Gordon>>>>>>>>Mason

 

[Jeremy's Spoken]

Did you really just put a "=" between Gordon and Mason?

lol

Gordon>>>>>>>>Mason

Would it be better to put :

Gordon = Crowell

Coleman = Mason

Again - I used the = where I felt arguments could be made to say who's better. You could argue that Mason and Crowell are better than Gordon and vice/versa. Look at college production / combine results etc....

 

[spider321]

You could argue that Mason and Crowell are better than Gordon...

No. Just no.

 

[Freelove]

Did you really just put a "=" between Gordon and Mason?

lol

Gordon>>>>>>>>Mason

Mason, after spending a year in the NFL, has beaten out an entire roster full of competent professional running backs to put up about 900 yards from scrimmage and a fistful of TD's in a little over half a season's worth of touches, and is regarded by most as the unquestioned starter for a decent team heading into next season.

He may still have to prove it over a full season in order to get the consensus nod of approval as a franchise back, but for the time being, he's light years ahead of anybody whose entire body of work since school ended consists of running a disappointing 40 in the underwear olympics.

You might say that in your opinion, Gordon is a better prospect than Mason was. But I'd counter that on-field production is the proving ground for how correct or incorrect prospect evaluation was. And right now, it's clear we (pundits and fantasy dorks alike) were too down on Mason. Gordon's got plenty of work to do to get his evaluation up to where Mason's apparently ought to have been.

 

[tdmills]

Did you really just put a "=" between Gordon and Mason?

lol

Gordon>>>>>>>>Mason

Would it be better to put :

Gordon = Crowell

Coleman = Mason

Again - I used the = where I felt arguments could be made to say who's better. You could argue that Mason and Crowell are better than Gordon and vice/versa. Look at college production / combine results etc....

One could argue anything really. Marquess Wilson is equal to Amari Cooper...

 

[The Claymaker]

Did you really just put a "=" between Gordon and Mason?

lol

Gordon>>>>>>>>Mason

Mason, after spending a year in the NFL, has beaten out an entire roster full of competent professional running backs to put up about 900 yards from scrimmage and a fistful of TD's in a little over half a season's worth of touches, and is regarded by most as the unquestioned starter for a decent team heading into next season.

He may still have to prove it over a full season in order to get the consensus nod of approval as a franchise back, but for the time being, he's light years ahead of anybody whose entire body of work since school ended consists of running a disappointing 40 in the underwear olympics.

You might say that in your opinion, Gordon is a better prospect than Mason was. But I'd counter that on-field production is the proving ground for how correct or incorrect prospect evaluation was. And right now, it's clear we (pundits and fantasy dorks alike) were too down on Mason. Gordon's got plenty of work to do to get his evaluation up to where Mason's apparently ought to have been.

Well spoken sir.

 

[ILUVBEER99]

2015 by far. Way better prospects.

 

[Jeremy's Spoken]

Did you really just put a "=" between Gordon and Mason?

lol

Gordon>>>>>>>>Mason

Would it be better to put :Gordon = Crowell

Coleman = Mason

Again - I used the = where I felt arguments could be made to say who's better. You could argue that Mason and Crowell are better than Gordon and vice/versa. Look at college production / combine results etc....

One could argue anything really. Marquess Wilson is equal to Amari Cooper...

That argument is not very realistic.Wilson can't hold a candle to Cooper...

They are not close...

 

[tdmills]

Did you really just put a "=" between Gordon and Mason?

lol

Gordon>>>>>>>>Mason

Would it be better to put :Gordon = Crowell

Coleman = Mason

Again - I used the = where I felt arguments could be made to say who's better. You could argue that Mason and Crowell are better than Gordon and vice/versa. Look at college production / combine results etc....

One could argue anything really. Marquess Wilson is equal to Amari Cooper...

That argument is not very realistic.Wilson can't hold a candle to Cooper...

They are not close...

That wasn't the point and it wasn't to be taken literally.

Melvin Gordons adp is 10 spots higher than tre Mason. You can argue it, but that's not what the current market says.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

Did you really just put a "=" between Gordon and Mason?

lol

Gordon>>>>>>>>Mason

Mason, after spending a year in the NFL, has beaten out an entire roster full of competent professional running backs to put up about 900 yards from scrimmage and a fistful of TD's in a little over half a season's worth of touches, and is regarded by most as the unquestioned starter for a decent team heading into next season.

He may still have to prove it over a full season in order to get the consensus nod of approval as a franchise back, but for the time being, he's light years ahead of anybody whose entire body of work since school ended consists of running a disappointing 40 in the underwear olympics.

You might say that in your opinion, Gordon is a better prospect than Mason was. But I'd counter that on-field production is the proving ground for how correct or incorrect prospect evaluation was. And right now, it's clear we (pundits and fantasy dorks alike) were too down on Mason. Gordon's got plenty of work to do to get his evaluation up to where Mason's apparently ought to have been.

No one values Mason more than Mason owners, and second year guys who came in and played decently at the end of their rookie season have a horrible track record at RB, so let's drop the schtick about Gordon not having played a snap in the NFL. If someone offered me Mason for a pick that I thought would turn into Gordon I would reject it in a hot second. A 4.3ypc despite having an 89 yard run sprinkled in amidst a relatively low number of carries isn't really that impressive to me.

I don't see how this is close. 2015 >> 2014. The boost that Hill gave to 2014 is pretty well canceled out by Sankey falling flat on his face, so that's a wash in total. Crowell/Mason looked decent while other popular favorites to break out like Freeman again fell flat. I don't really see any long-term fantasy difference makers in the 2014 class other than Hill. Maybe Hyde. That doesn't really stand up to the best looking RB prospect class we've had in a while.

 

[Jeremy's Spoken]

Did you really just put a "=" between Gordon and Mason?

lol

Gordon>>>>>>>>Mason

Mason, after spending a year in the NFL, has beaten out an entire roster full of competent professional running backs to put up about 900 yards from scrimmage and a fistful of TD's in a little over half a season's worth of touches, and is regarded by most as the unquestioned starter for a decent team heading into next season.

He may still have to prove it over a full season in order to get the consensus nod of approval as a franchise back, but for the time being, he's light years ahead of anybody whose entire body of work since school ended consists of running a disappointing 40 in the underwear olympics.

You might say that in your opinion, Gordon is a better prospect than Mason was. But I'd counter that on-field production is the proving ground for how correct or incorrect prospect evaluation was. And right now, it's clear we (pundits and fantasy dorks alike) were too down on Mason. Gordon's got plenty of work to do to get his evaluation up to where Mason's apparently ought to have been.

No one values Mason more than Mason owners, and second year guys who came in and played decently at the end of their rookie season have a horrible track record at RB, so let's drop the schtick about Gordon not having played a snap in the NFL. If someone offered me Mason for a pick that I thought would turn into Gordon I would reject it in a hot second. A 4.3ypc despite having an 89 yard run sprinkled in amidst a relatively low number of carries isn't really that impressive to me.

I don't see how this is close. 2015 >> 2014. The boost that Hill gave to 2014 is pretty well canceled out by Sankey falling flat on his face, so that's a wash in total. Crowell/Mason looked decent while other popular favorites to break out like Freeman again fell flat. I don't really see any long-term fantasy difference makers in the 2014 class other than Hill. Maybe Hyde. That doesn't really stand up to the best looking RB prospect class we've had in a while.

The 2014 class may produce 7-8 starters. Will the 2015 class produce more? Maybe?

I think that the 2015 class is a great RB class, but I think that the 2014 class was a great one as well.

Mason is in a great situation on the Rams - he had record setting production at Auburn, and did well at the combine. He flashed in year one and put Stacy on the pine... What is not to believe in him as a back?

The point is that the 2014 class is comparable to the heralded 2015 class of backs.

 

[Jeremy's Spoken]

Did you really just put a "=" between Gordon and Mason?

lol

Gordon>>>>>>>>Mason

Would it be better to put :Gordon = Crowell

Coleman = Mason

Again - I used the = where I felt arguments could be made to say who's better. You could argue that Mason and Crowell are better than Gordon and vice/versa. Look at college production / combine results etc....

One could argue anything really. Marquess Wilson is equal to Amari Cooper...

That argument is not very realistic.Wilson can't hold a candle to Cooper...

They are not close...

That wasn't the point and it wasn't to be taken literally.

Melvin Gordons adp is 10 spots higher than tre Mason. You can argue it, but that's not what the current market says.

A 10 spot difference in ADP is not much of a difference. In my opinion you could draft one player or the other within 10 ADP slots and not be laughed out of the draft room for it...

 

[EastonBlues22]

If you're comparing them as prospects, then I like 2015 better by a good amount.

If you're taking the 2014 NFL season into account, then this question should have waited until the 2015 class had a chance to show what it could do in the NFL.

If Gordon had declared last year, I'm pretty confident that he would have been selected ahead of Mason both in the NFL draft and in a large majority of fantasy rookie drafts.

 

[frigid5]

Where's Brewtown when you need him?

 

[Biabreakable]

Feb 12th I posted combined rookie rankings for 2014-2015 in this thread.

Here are the RB rankings from that time for both years, so no combine information, NFL draft information, or 2014 season affecting the evaluation.

Tier 1

RB Melvin Gordon
RB Todd Gurley
RB Jay Ajayi
RB Tevin Coleman
RB Bishop Sankey
RB Carlos Hyde

Tier 2

RB Charles Sims
RB Tre Mason
RB Duke Johnson
RB TJ Yeldon
RB Ameer Abdullah
RB Lache Seastrunk
RB Devonta Freeman
RB Jeremy Hill

Tier 3

RB Isaiah Crowell
RB Terrance West
RB David Cobb
RB Andre Williams
RB Mike Davis
RB Jerick McKinnon
RB Damien Williams
RB KaDeem Carey
RB Storm Johnson
RB Stephen Houston
RB Marion Grice

I have made a few changes to 2015 rankings since that time, for example I have Gurley ahead of Gordon in tier 1 now. I have Ameer ahead of Yeldon and Duke Johnson now.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

The 2014 class may produce 7-8 starters. Will the 2015 class produce more? Maybe?

I think that the 2015 class is a great RB class, but I think that the 2014 class was a great one as well.Mason is in a great situation on the Rams - he had record setting production at Auburn, and did well at the combine. He flashed in year one and put Stacy on the pine... What is not to believe in him as a back?

The point is that the 2014 class is comparable to the heralded 2015 class of backs.

Every class "may" produce 7-8 starters. By this time next year it will be 3-4 starters. And a year later probably 1-2.

Devonta Freeman. Terrance West. Isaiah Crowell. Jerrick McKinnon. Andre Williams. Charles Sims. Alfred Blue. Most of these guys aren't going to be fantasy relevant two years from now. And even the "safe" guys like Hill, Hyde, and Mason likely won't all make it (they're hardly as highly thought of as Bernard/Ball/Richardson/Martin/Wilson were headed into year 2 and none of them made it). Delone Carter. Mikel Leshoure. Bernard Pierce. Daniel Thomas. Zac Stacy. Vick Ballard. These are the likely futures of most of those "7-8" starters.

Post-year 1 is when every draft class looks its best because everyone is excited about every guy that flashed a little bit of anything and no one is ready to write off anyone that struggled yet. It's just the typical short-term fantasy memory that we see repeated every year.

 

[Biabreakable]

Here is Lance Zierleins list from 2014-2015 by grade

This is what the grades mean-

Quote

9.00-10 Once-in-lifetime player

8.00-8.99 Perennial All-Pro
7.50-7.99 Future All-Pro
7.00-7.49 Pro Bowl-caliber player
6.50-6.99 Chance to become Pro Bowl-caliber player
6.00-6.49 Should become instant starter

5.50-5.99 Chance to become NFL starter

5.20-5.49 NFL backup or special teams potential
5.01-5.19 Better-than-average chance to make NFL roster
5.00 50-50 Chance to make NFL roster

Gurley, Todd RB 6'1" 222 Georgia 6.2
Gordon, Melvin RB 6'1" 215 Wisconsin 6.1
Hyde, Carlos RB 6'0" 230 Ohio St. Pick 25, Round 2 (57) 49ers 6.1
Coleman, Tevin RB 5'11" 206 Indiana 6

Ajayi, Jay RB 6'0" 221 Boise St. 5.8
Johnson, Duke RB 5'9" 207 Miami 5.8
Mason, Tre RB 5'8" 207 Auburn Pick 11, Round 3 (75) Rams 5.8
Abdullah, Ameer RB 5'9" 205 Nebraska 5.7
Yeldon, T.J. RB 6'1" 226 Alabama 5.6
Sankey, Bishop RB 5'9" 209 Washington Pick 22, Round 2 (54) Titans 5.6
Williams, Andre RB 5'11" 230 Boston College Pick 13, Round 4 (113) Giants 5.6
Hill, Jeremy RB 6'1" 233 LSU Pick 23, Round 2 (55) Bengals 5.5
Archer, Dri RB 5'8" 173 Kent St. Pick 33, Round 3 (97) Steelers 5.5


Johnson, David RB 6'1" 224 Northern Iowa 5.4
Davis, Mike RB 5'9" 217 South Carolina 5.4
Cobb, David RB 5'11" 229 Minnesota 5.4
Williams, Karlos RB 6'1" 230 Florida St. 5.4
Rawls, Thomas RB 5'9" 215 Central Michigan 5.4
Artis-Payne, Cameron RB 5'10" 212 Auburn 5.4
Freeman, Devonta RB 5'8" 206 Florida St. Pick 3, Round 4 (103) Falcons 5.4
Carey, Ka'Deem RB 5'9" 207 Arizona Pick 17, Round 4 (117) Bears 5.4
McKinnon, Jerick RB 5'9" 209 Georgia Southern Pick 32, Round 3 (96) Vikings 5.
Allen, Javorius RB 6'0" 221 USC 5.3
Jones, Matt RB 6'2" 231 Florida 5.3
Langford, Jeremy RB 6'0" 208 Michigan St. 5.3
Zenner, Zach RB 5'11" 223 South Dakota St. 5.3
West, Terrance RB 5'9" 225 Towson Pick 30, Round 3 (94) Browns 5.3
Thomas, De'Anthony RB 5'9" 174 Oregon Pick 24, Round 4 (124) Chiefs 5.3
Sims, Charles RB 6'0" 214 West Virginia Pick 5, Round 3 (69) Buccaneers 5.3
Williams, Trey RB 5'7" 195 Texas A&M 5.2
Agnew, Malcolm RB 5'9" 207 Southern Illinois 5.2
Varga, Tyler FB 5'11" 222 Yale 5.2
Johnson, Storm RB 6'0" 209 Central Florida Pick 7, Round 7 (222) Jaguars 5.2
Seastrunk, Lache RB 5'9" 201 Baylor Pick 10, Round 6 (186) Redskins 5.2
Taliaferro, Lorenzo RB 6'0" 229 Coastal Carolina Pick 38, Round 4 (138) Ravens 5.2
Blue, Alfred RB 6'2" 223 LSU Pick 5, Round 6 (181) Texans 5.2
Gaffney, Tyler RB 5'11" 220 Stanford Pick 28, Round 6 (204) Panthers 5.2
Andrews, Antonio RB 5'10" 225 Western Kentucky 5.2
Perkins, LaDarius RB 5'7" 195 Mississippi St. 5.2
Fluellen, David RB 5'11" 224 Toledo 5.2
Baker, James RB 6'0" 237 Idaho 5.2

Crockett, John RB 6'0" 217 North Dakota St. 5.1
Robinson, Josh RB 5'8" 217 Mississippi St. 5.1
Heard, Braylon RB 5'10" 198 Kentucky 5.1
Magee, Terrence RB 5'8" 213 LSU 5.1
Murphy, Marcus RB 5'8" 193 Missouri 5.1
Grant, Corey RB 5'11" 205 Auburn 5.1
Millard, Trey FB 6'2" 247 Oklahoma Pick 30, Round 7 (245) 49ers 5.1
Grice, Marion RB 6'0" 208 Arizona State Pick 25, Round 6 (201) Chargers 5.1
White, James RB 5'9" 204 Wisconsin Pick 30, Round 4 (130) Patriots 5.1
Neal, Rajion RB 5'11" 220 Tennessee 5.1
Crowell, Isaiah RB 5'11" 224 Alabama St. 5.1
Williams, Damien RB 5'11" 222 Oklahoma 5.1
Atkinson, George RB 6'1" 218 Notre Dame 5.1
Wilder, James RB 6'3" 232 Florida St. 5.1

 

[SproutDaddy]

Did you really just put a "=" between Gordon and Mason?

lol

Gordon>>>>>>>>Mason

I'd say Mason>>>> Gordon. Guess we'll see.

 

[spider321]

Did you really just put a "=" between Gordon and Mason?

lol

Gordon>>>>>>>>Mason

I'd say Mason>>>> Gordon. Guess we'll see.

(Obligatory wish you played in my league comment)

 

[SproutDaddy]

Did you really just put a "=" between Gordon and Mason?

lol

Gordon>>>>>>>>Mason

I'd say Mason>>>> Gordon. Guess we'll see.

(Obligatory wish you played in my league comment)

Right. Because you're an NFL scout. I'll gladly join one and make the title game.

 

[massraider]

The 2014 class may produce 7-8 starters. Will the 2015 class produce more? Maybe?

I think that the 2015 class is a great RB class, but I think that the 2014 class was a great one as well.Mason is in a great situation on the Rams - he had record setting production at Auburn, and did well at the combine. He flashed in year one and put Stacy on the pine... What is not to believe in him as a back?

The point is that the 2014 class is comparable to the heralded 2015 class of backs.

Every class "may" produce 7-8 starters. By this time next year it will be 3-4 starters. And a year later probably 1-2.

Devonta Freeman. Terrance West. Isaiah Crowell. Jerrick McKinnon. Andre Williams. Charles Sims. Alfred Blue. Most of these guys aren't going to be fantasy relevant two years from now. And even the "safe" guys like Hill, Hyde, and Mason likely won't all make it (they're hardly as highly thought of as Bernard/Ball/Richardson/Martin/Wilson were headed into year 2 and none of them made it). Delone Carter. Mikel Leshoure. Bernard Pierce. Daniel Thomas. Zac Stacy. Vick Ballard. These are the likely futures of most of those "7-8" starters.

Post-year 1 is when every draft class looks its best because everyone is excited about every guy that flashed a little bit of anything and no one is ready to write off anyone that struggled yet. It's just the typical short-term fantasy memory that we see repeated every year.

Great post.

This time last year, we could have been congratulating ourselves for snagging Zac Stacey and Montee Ball. You can find dynasty startups with that as the backfield, and the owner thinkin' he's slick.

A young guy can be the best guy on the roster one year, and get buried by a more dynamic player the next year. Backs that turn in workman-like job are always in danger of being replaced. Some of the backs on that 2014 list that looks so great are probably going to be joined by a guy on that 2015 list, and rendered useless.

It's actually a pretty good exercise for fantasy owners to do, is look back at previous draft classes, and maintain perspective.

The big land mine for fantasy owners is that a team doesn't need to spend a lot of draft or free agent currency to upgrade. You can feel good about Ben Tate's chances to get a lot of carries for the Browns, and a lousy 3rd round pick and UDFA later, and the guy isn't even on the team.

 

[Jeremy's Spoken]

The 2014 class may produce 7-8 starters. Will the 2015 class produce more? Maybe?

I think that the 2015 class is a great RB class, but I think that the 2014 class was a great one as well.

Mason is in a great situation on the Rams - he had record setting production at Auburn, and did well at the combine. He flashed in year one and put Stacy on the pine... What is not to believe in him as a back?

The point is that the 2014 class is comparable to the heralded 2015 class of backs.

Every class "may" produce 7-8 starters. By this time next year it will be 3-4 starters. And a year later probably 1-2.

Devonta Freeman. Terrance West. Isaiah Crowell. Jerrick McKinnon. Andre Williams. Charles Sims. Alfred Blue. Most of these guys aren't going to be fantasy relevant two years from now. And even the "safe" guys like Hill, Hyde, and Mason likely won't all make it (they're hardly as highly thought of as Bernard/Ball/Richardson/Martin/Wilson were headed into year 2 and none of them made it). Delone Carter. Mikel Leshoure. Bernard Pierce. Daniel Thomas. Zac Stacy. Vick Ballard. These are the likely futures of most of those "7-8" starters.

Post-year 1 is when every draft class looks its best because everyone is excited about every guy that flashed a little bit of anything and no one is ready to write off anyone that struggled yet. It's just the typical short-term fantasy memory that we see repeated every year.

Great post.

This time last year, we could have been congratulating ourselves for snagging Zac Stacey and Montee Ball. You can find dynasty startups with that as the backfield, and the owner thinkin' he's slick.

A young guy can be the best guy on the roster one year, and get buried by a more dynamic player the next year. Backs that turn in workman-like job are always in danger of being replaced. Some of the backs on that 2014 list that looks so great are probably going to be joined by a guy on that 2015 list, and rendered useless.

It's actually a pretty good exercise for fantasy owners to do, is look back at previous draft classes, and maintain perspective.

The big land mine for fantasy owners is that a team doesn't need to spend a lot of draft or free agent currency to upgrade. You can feel good about Ben Tate's chances to get a lot of carries for the Browns, and a lousy 3rd round pick and UDFA later, and the guy isn't even on the team.

Mass raider - I think that you have a point, but I also think the 2014 and 2015 classes are better and deeper than the average classes. Two RBs from the 2014 draft faced significant obsticles right out of the chute (Jeremy Hill and Isaiah Crowell). Hill was behind the talented and highly toughted Bernard, and Crowell was an UDFA theoretically behind higher drafted West. The talent rose to the top.

I think both the 2014 and 2015 class are much more talented than the average class by a long shot.

 

[Jeremy's Spoken]

Here is Lance Zierleins list from 2014-2015 by grade

This is what the grades mean-

Quote

9.00-10 Once-in-lifetime player

8.00-8.99 Perennial All-Pro

7.50-7.99 Future All-Pro

7.00-7.49 Pro Bowl-caliber player

6.50-6.99 Chance to become Pro Bowl-caliber player

6.00-6.49 Should become instant starter

5.50-5.99 Chance to become NFL starter

5.20-5.49 NFL backup or special teams potential

5.01-5.19 Better-than-average chance to make NFL roster

5.00 50-50 Chance to make NFL roster

Gurley, Todd RB 6'1" 222 Georgia 6.2

Gordon, Melvin RB 6'1" 215 Wisconsin 6.1

Hyde, Carlos RB 6'0" 230 Ohio St. Pick 25, Round 2 (57) 49ers 6.1

Coleman, Tevin RB 5'11" 206 Indiana 6

Ajayi, Jay RB 6'0" 221 Boise St. 5.8

Johnson, Duke RB 5'9" 207 Miami 5.8

Mason, Tre RB 5'8" 207 Auburn Pick 11, Round 3 (75) Rams 5.8

Abdullah, Ameer RB 5'9" 205 Nebraska 5.7

Yeldon, T.J. RB 6'1" 226 Alabama 5.6

Sankey, Bishop RB 5'9" 209 Washington Pick 22, Round 2 (54) Titans 5.6

Williams, Andre RB 5'11" 230 Boston College Pick 13, Round 4 (113) Giants 5.6

Hill, Jeremy RB 6'1" 233 LSU Pick 23, Round 2 (55) Bengals 5.5

Archer, Dri RB 5'8" 173 Kent St. Pick 33, Round 3 (97) Steelers 5.5

Johnson, David RB 6'1" 224 Northern Iowa 5.4

Davis, Mike RB 5'9" 217 South Carolina 5.4

Cobb, David RB 5'11" 229 Minnesota 5.4

Williams, Karlos RB 6'1" 230 Florida St. 5.4

Rawls, Thomas RB 5'9" 215 Central Michigan 5.4

Artis-Payne, Cameron RB 5'10" 212 Auburn 5.4

Freeman, Devonta RB 5'8" 206 Florida St. Pick 3, Round 4 (103) Falcons 5.4

Carey, Ka'Deem RB 5'9" 207 Arizona Pick 17, Round 4 (117) Bears 5.4

McKinnon, Jerick RB 5'9" 209 Georgia Southern Pick 32, Round 3 (96) Vikings 5.

Allen, Javorius RB 6'0" 221 USC 5.3

Jones, Matt RB 6'2" 231 Florida 5.3

Langford, Jeremy RB 6'0" 208 Michigan St. 5.3

Zenner, Zach RB 5'11" 223 South Dakota St. 5.3

West, Terrance RB 5'9" 225 Towson Pick 30, Round 3 (94) Browns 5.3

Thomas, De'Anthony RB 5'9" 174 Oregon Pick 24, Round 4 (124) Chiefs 5.3

Sims, Charles RB 6'0" 214 West Virginia Pick 5, Round 3 (69) Buccaneers 5.3

Williams, Trey RB 5'7" 195 Texas A&M 5.2

Agnew, Malcolm RB 5'9" 207 Southern Illinois 5.2

Varga, Tyler FB 5'11" 222 Yale 5.2

Johnson, Storm RB 6'0" 209 Central Florida Pick 7, Round 7 (222) Jaguars 5.2

Seastrunk, Lache RB 5'9" 201 Baylor Pick 10, Round 6 (186) Redskins 5.2

Taliaferro, Lorenzo RB 6'0" 229 Coastal Carolina Pick 38, Round 4 (138) Ravens 5.2

Blue, Alfred RB 6'2" 223 LSU Pick 5, Round 6 (181) Texans 5.2

Gaffney, Tyler RB 5'11" 220 Stanford Pick 28, Round 6 (204) Panthers 5.2

Andrews, Antonio RB 5'10" 225 Western Kentucky 5.2

Perkins, LaDarius RB 5'7" 195 Mississippi St. 5.2

Fluellen, David RB 5'11" 224 Toledo 5.2

Baker, James RB 6'0" 237 Idaho 5.2

Crockett, John RB 6'0" 217 North Dakota St. 5.1

Robinson, Josh RB 5'8" 217 Mississippi St. 5.1

Heard, Braylon RB 5'10" 198 Kentucky 5.1

Magee, Terrence RB 5'8" 213 LSU 5.1

Murphy, Marcus RB 5'8" 193 Missouri 5.1

Grant, Corey RB 5'11" 205 Auburn 5.1

Millard, Trey FB 6'2" 247 Oklahoma Pick 30, Round 7 (245) 49ers 5.1

Grice, Marion RB 6'0" 208 Arizona State Pick 25, Round 6 (201) Chargers 5.1

White, James RB 5'9" 204 Wisconsin Pick 30, Round 4 (130) Patriots 5.1

Neal, Rajion RB 5'11" 220 Tennessee 5.1

Crowell, Isaiah RB 5'11" 224 Alabama St. 5.1

Williams, Damien RB 5'11" 222 Oklahoma 5.1

Atkinson, George RB 6'1" 218 Notre Dame 5.1

Wilder, James RB 6'3" 232 Florida St. 5.1

How does a guy like Crowell get a grade of a 5.1 (better than average chance to make an NFL Roster).

Also how is Hill a 5.5 (chance to become NFL starter).

I don't care what his rules are or when these guys were graded:

If these rankings were done for both classes before the drafts for each - then he really missed the mark on Hill and Crowell.

If they were compiled recently then I have no idea what he was thinking.

 

[Meatwad Reloaded]

Here is Lance Zierleins list from 2014-2015 by grade

This is what the grades mean-

Quote

9.00-10 Once-in-lifetime player

8.00-8.99 Perennial All-Pro

7.50-7.99 Future All-Pro

7.00-7.49 Pro Bowl-caliber player

6.50-6.99 Chance to become Pro Bowl-caliber player

6.00-6.49 Should become instant starter

5.50-5.99 Chance to become NFL starter

5.20-5.49 NFL backup or special teams potential

5.01-5.19 Better-than-average chance to make NFL roster

5.00 50-50 Chance to make NFL roster

Gurley, Todd RB 6'1" 222 Georgia 6.2

Gordon, Melvin RB 6'1" 215 Wisconsin 6.1

Hyde, Carlos RB 6'0" 230 Ohio St. Pick 25, Round 2 (57) 49ers 6.1

Coleman, Tevin RB 5'11" 206 Indiana 6

Ajayi, Jay RB 6'0" 221 Boise St. 5.8

Johnson, Duke RB 5'9" 207 Miami 5.8

Mason, Tre RB 5'8" 207 Auburn Pick 11, Round 3 (75) Rams 5.8

Abdullah, Ameer RB 5'9" 205 Nebraska 5.7

Yeldon, T.J. RB 6'1" 226 Alabama 5.6

Sankey, Bishop RB 5'9" 209 Washington Pick 22, Round 2 (54) Titans 5.6

Williams, Andre RB 5'11" 230 Boston College Pick 13, Round 4 (113) Giants 5.6

Hill, Jeremy RB 6'1" 233 LSU Pick 23, Round 2 (55) Bengals 5.5

Archer, Dri RB 5'8" 173 Kent St. Pick 33, Round 3 (97) Steelers 5.5

Johnson, David RB 6'1" 224 Northern Iowa 5.4

Davis, Mike RB 5'9" 217 South Carolina 5.4

Cobb, David RB 5'11" 229 Minnesota 5.4

Williams, Karlos RB 6'1" 230 Florida St. 5.4

Rawls, Thomas RB 5'9" 215 Central Michigan 5.4

Artis-Payne, Cameron RB 5'10" 212 Auburn 5.4

Freeman, Devonta RB 5'8" 206 Florida St. Pick 3, Round 4 (103) Falcons 5.4

Carey, Ka'Deem RB 5'9" 207 Arizona Pick 17, Round 4 (117) Bears 5.4

McKinnon, Jerick RB 5'9" 209 Georgia Southern Pick 32, Round 3 (96) Vikings 5.

Allen, Javorius RB 6'0" 221 USC 5.3

Jones, Matt RB 6'2" 231 Florida 5.3

Langford, Jeremy RB 6'0" 208 Michigan St. 5.3

Zenner, Zach RB 5'11" 223 South Dakota St. 5.3

West, Terrance RB 5'9" 225 Towson Pick 30, Round 3 (94) Browns 5.3

Thomas, De'Anthony RB 5'9" 174 Oregon Pick 24, Round 4 (124) Chiefs 5.3

Sims, Charles RB 6'0" 214 West Virginia Pick 5, Round 3 (69) Buccaneers 5.3

Williams, Trey RB 5'7" 195 Texas A&M 5.2

Agnew, Malcolm RB 5'9" 207 Southern Illinois 5.2

Varga, Tyler FB 5'11" 222 Yale 5.2

Johnson, Storm RB 6'0" 209 Central Florida Pick 7, Round 7 (222) Jaguars 5.2

Seastrunk, Lache RB 5'9" 201 Baylor Pick 10, Round 6 (186) Redskins 5.2

Taliaferro, Lorenzo RB 6'0" 229 Coastal Carolina Pick 38, Round 4 (138) Ravens 5.2

Blue, Alfred RB 6'2" 223 LSU Pick 5, Round 6 (181) Texans 5.2

Gaffney, Tyler RB 5'11" 220 Stanford Pick 28, Round 6 (204) Panthers 5.2

Andrews, Antonio RB 5'10" 225 Western Kentucky 5.2

Perkins, LaDarius RB 5'7" 195 Mississippi St. 5.2

Fluellen, David RB 5'11" 224 Toledo 5.2

Baker, James RB 6'0" 237 Idaho 5.2

Crockett, John RB 6'0" 217 North Dakota St. 5.1

Robinson, Josh RB 5'8" 217 Mississippi St. 5.1

Heard, Braylon RB 5'10" 198 Kentucky 5.1

Magee, Terrence RB 5'8" 213 LSU 5.1

Murphy, Marcus RB 5'8" 193 Missouri 5.1

Grant, Corey RB 5'11" 205 Auburn 5.1

Millard, Trey FB 6'2" 247 Oklahoma Pick 30, Round 7 (245) 49ers 5.1

Grice, Marion RB 6'0" 208 Arizona State Pick 25, Round 6 (201) Chargers 5.1

White, James RB 5'9" 204 Wisconsin Pick 30, Round 4 (130) Patriots 5.1

Neal, Rajion RB 5'11" 220 Tennessee 5.1

Crowell, Isaiah RB 5'11" 224 Alabama St. 5.1

Williams, Damien RB 5'11" 222 Oklahoma 5.1

Atkinson, George RB 6'1" 218 Notre Dame 5.1

Wilder, James RB 6'3" 232 Florida St. 5.1

How does a guy like Crowell get a grade of a 5.1 (better than average chance to make an NFL Roster).

Also how is Hill a 5.5 (chance to become NFL starter).

I don't care what his rules are or when these guys were graded:

If these rankings were done for both classes before the drafts for each - then he really missed the mark on Hill and Crowell.

If they were compiled recently then I have no idea what he was thinking.

You should see what he thought of Manziel....6.45 His revised rating should be a 1.2

Only a 6.4 for ODB (should have been an 8) also....like any professional sports guy, he basically throws ##### at a wall in order to see what sticks.

 

[ldizzle]

Here is Lance Zierleins list from 2014-2015 by grade

This is what the grades mean-

Quote

9.00-10 Once-in-lifetime player

8.00-8.99 Perennial All-Pro

7.50-7.99 Future All-Pro

7.00-7.49 Pro Bowl-caliber player

6.50-6.99 Chance to become Pro Bowl-caliber player

6.00-6.49 Should become instant starter

5.50-5.99 Chance to become NFL starter

5.20-5.49 NFL backup or special teams potential

5.01-5.19 Better-than-average chance to make NFL roster

5.00 50-50 Chance to make NFL roster

Gurley, Todd RB 6'1" 222 Georgia 6.2

Gordon, Melvin RB 6'1" 215 Wisconsin 6.1

Hyde, Carlos RB 6'0" 230 Ohio St. Pick 25, Round 2 (57) 49ers 6.1

Coleman, Tevin RB 5'11" 206 Indiana 6

Ajayi, Jay RB 6'0" 221 Boise St. 5.8

Johnson, Duke RB 5'9" 207 Miami 5.8

Mason, Tre RB 5'8" 207 Auburn Pick 11, Round 3 (75) Rams 5.8

Abdullah, Ameer RB 5'9" 205 Nebraska 5.7

Yeldon, T.J. RB 6'1" 226 Alabama 5.6

Sankey, Bishop RB 5'9" 209 Washington Pick 22, Round 2 (54) Titans 5.6

Williams, Andre RB 5'11" 230 Boston College Pick 13, Round 4 (113) Giants 5.6

Hill, Jeremy RB 6'1" 233 LSU Pick 23, Round 2 (55) Bengals 5.5

Archer, Dri RB 5'8" 173 Kent St. Pick 33, Round 3 (97) Steelers 5.5

Johnson, David RB 6'1" 224 Northern Iowa 5.4

Davis, Mike RB 5'9" 217 South Carolina 5.4

Cobb, David RB 5'11" 229 Minnesota 5.4

Williams, Karlos RB 6'1" 230 Florida St. 5.4

Rawls, Thomas RB 5'9" 215 Central Michigan 5.4

Artis-Payne, Cameron RB 5'10" 212 Auburn 5.4

Freeman, Devonta RB 5'8" 206 Florida St. Pick 3, Round 4 (103) Falcons 5.4

Carey, Ka'Deem RB 5'9" 207 Arizona Pick 17, Round 4 (117) Bears 5.4

McKinnon, Jerick RB 5'9" 209 Georgia Southern Pick 32, Round 3 (96) Vikings 5.

Allen, Javorius RB 6'0" 221 USC 5.3

Jones, Matt RB 6'2" 231 Florida 5.3

Langford, Jeremy RB 6'0" 208 Michigan St. 5.3

Zenner, Zach RB 5'11" 223 South Dakota St. 5.3

West, Terrance RB 5'9" 225 Towson Pick 30, Round 3 (94) Browns 5.3

Thomas, De'Anthony RB 5'9" 174 Oregon Pick 24, Round 4 (124) Chiefs 5.3

Sims, Charles RB 6'0" 214 West Virginia Pick 5, Round 3 (69) Buccaneers 5.3

Williams, Trey RB 5'7" 195 Texas A&M 5.2

Agnew, Malcolm RB 5'9" 207 Southern Illinois 5.2

Varga, Tyler FB 5'11" 222 Yale 5.2

Johnson, Storm RB 6'0" 209 Central Florida Pick 7, Round 7 (222) Jaguars 5.2

Seastrunk, Lache RB 5'9" 201 Baylor Pick 10, Round 6 (186) Redskins 5.2

Taliaferro, Lorenzo RB 6'0" 229 Coastal Carolina Pick 38, Round 4 (138) Ravens 5.2

Blue, Alfred RB 6'2" 223 LSU Pick 5, Round 6 (181) Texans 5.2

Gaffney, Tyler RB 5'11" 220 Stanford Pick 28, Round 6 (204) Panthers 5.2

Andrews, Antonio RB 5'10" 225 Western Kentucky 5.2

Perkins, LaDarius RB 5'7" 195 Mississippi St. 5.2

Fluellen, David RB 5'11" 224 Toledo 5.2

Baker, James RB 6'0" 237 Idaho 5.2

Crockett, John RB 6'0" 217 North Dakota St. 5.1

Robinson, Josh RB 5'8" 217 Mississippi St. 5.1

Heard, Braylon RB 5'10" 198 Kentucky 5.1

Magee, Terrence RB 5'8" 213 LSU 5.1

Murphy, Marcus RB 5'8" 193 Missouri 5.1

Grant, Corey RB 5'11" 205 Auburn 5.1

Millard, Trey FB 6'2" 247 Oklahoma Pick 30, Round 7 (245) 49ers 5.1

Grice, Marion RB 6'0" 208 Arizona State Pick 25, Round 6 (201) Chargers 5.1

White, James RB 5'9" 204 Wisconsin Pick 30, Round 4 (130) Patriots 5.1

Neal, Rajion RB 5'11" 220 Tennessee 5.1

Crowell, Isaiah RB 5'11" 224 Alabama St. 5.1

Williams, Damien RB 5'11" 222 Oklahoma 5.1

Atkinson, George RB 6'1" 218 Notre Dame 5.1

Wilder, James RB 6'3" 232 Florida St. 5.1

How does a guy like Crowell get a grade of a 5.1 (better than average chance to make an NFL Roster).Also how is Hill a 5.5 (chance to become NFL starter).

I don't care what his rules are or when these guys were graded:

If these rankings were done for both classes before the drafts for each - then he really missed the mark on Hill and Crowell.

If they were compiled recently then I have no idea what he was thinking.

You should see what he thought of Manziel....6.45 His revised rating should be a 1.2

Only a 6.4 for ODB (should have been an 8) also....like any professional sports guy, he basically throws ##### at a wall in order to see what sticks.

obviously nobody can get everything right. I mean if he's just throwing #### at a wall why don't you do it better

 

[Biabreakable]

How does a guy like Crowell get a grade of a 5.1 (better than average chance to make an NFL Roster).Also how is Hill a 5.5 (chance to become NFL starter).

I don't care what his rules are or when these guys were graded:

If these rankings were done for both classes before the drafts for each - then he really missed the mark on Hill and Crowell.

If they were compiled recently then I have no idea what he was thinking.

You would have to ask Lance this question. I think he laid out pretty succinctly what the grades mean.

These are pre NFL draft grades and they are I think somewhat focused on where players will be drafted. A draft grade is not the same thing as predicting a players career for dynasty FF as my ranking attempts to do.

In this case I believe he was correct about Crowell who went undrafted. He still had Crowell graded as having a good chance to make a NFL roster despite expecting him to go undrafted. I consider that a pretty fair assessment.

I am obviously not the only person who did not think very highly of Jeremy Hill. I have talked about that extensively and with hindsight I would say I was wrong about him. I under-estimated his ability.

I was also wrong about Bishop Sankey's ability to translate to the NFL and I over-estimated his landing spot with the Titans being a great situation for a rookie RB. One thing I did not consider enough was the loss of Mike Munchak and the effect this had on the Titans offensive line. But then I have already talked about that quite a bit as well.

How about your view points that were wrong Brewtown?

I think it would be helpful to recognize that hind sight is 20/20 and only one year of performance for the 2014 does not tell the whole story for these players either. So we do not even have perfect hind sight yet. That won't be until 2017.

Obviously as FF players we need to make judgement calls without perfect knowledge of the future. Predicting the future is not a very easy thing to do (but it is fun).

 

[ROCKET]

Gordon will be the next in a long line of Badger rb busts. I'd take Hyde over him in a second. If it wasn't for Gurley the 2015 rb crop would be one of the worst in recent memory.

 

[ILUVBEER99]

Gordon will be the next in a long line of Badger rb busts. I'd take Hyde over him in a second. If it wasn't for Gurley the 2015 rb crop would be one of the worst in recent memory.

crazy talk. even if you removed Gurley/Gordon this class would still be on par with the past couple drafts.

 

[Alex P Keaton]

Gordon will be the next in a long line of Badger rb busts. I'd take Hyde over him in a second. If it wasn't for Gurley the 2015 rb crop would be one of the worst in recent memory.

Can you say more about what leads you to think this?

 

[spider321]

Gordon will be the next in a long line of Badger rb busts. I'd take Hyde over him in a second. If it wasn't for Gurley the 2015 rb crop would be one of the worst in recent memory.

Can you say more about what leads you to think this?

He played at Wisconsin and his combine numbers didn't jump off the page.

Watch these guys play people!!! Really, try watching their games instead of just studying combine stats.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

Gordon will be the next in a long line of Badger rb busts. I'd take Hyde over him in a second. If it wasn't for Gurley the 2015 rb crop would be one of the worst in recent memory.

Can you say more about what leads you to think this?

Wisconsin RBs will always fail. Just like Cal QBs

 

[Faust]

Is 2015 the best running back draft in years?

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/is-2015-the-best-running-back-draft-in-years/

 

[SayWhat?]

Is 2015 the best running back draft in years?

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/is-2015-the-best-running-back-draft-in-years/

I don't get the point of that article, as the author doesn't even discuss the 2015 class other than to name a few of the top prospects.

 

[Jeremy's Spoken]

How does a guy like Crowell get a grade of a 5.1 (better than average chance to make an NFL Roster).

Also how is Hill a 5.5 (chance to become NFL starter).

I don't care what his rules are or when these guys were graded:

If these rankings were done for both classes before the drafts for each - then he really missed the mark on Hill and Crowell.

If they were compiled recently then I have no idea what he was thinking.

In this case I believe he was correct about Crowell who went undrafted. He still had Crowell graded as having a good chance to make a NFL roster despite expecting him to go undrafted. I consider that a pretty fair assessment.

I am obviously not the only person who did not think very highly of Jeremy Hill. I have talked about that extensively and with hindsight I would say I was wrong about him. I under-estimated his ability.

I was also wrong about Bishop Sankey's ability to translate to the NFL and I over-estimated his landing spot with the Titans being a great situation for a rookie RB. One thing I did not consider enough was the loss of Mike Munchak and the effect this had on the Titans offensive line. But then I have already talked about that quite a bit as well.

How about your view points that were wrong Brewtown?

Obviously as FF players we need to make judgement calls without perfect knowledge of the future. Predicting the future is not a very easy thing to do (but it is fun).

I don't care if he correctly predicted that Crowell would go undrafted. Who cares... His rankings ended up misleading people...Jeremy Hill is an absolute stud.... Just ask Giovanni Bernard!

Not sure who this Brewtown fellow is, but apparently he is a remembered guy around here...

Being right and wrong is important! That's what I tell my wife!

Look out for Bishop in 2015!

Jeremy's Spoken!

ON WISCONSIN!!!

 

[jurb26]

Here is Lance Zierleins list from 2014-2015 by grade

This is what the grades mean-

Quote

9.00-10 Once-in-lifetime player

8.00-8.99 Perennial All-Pro

7.50-7.99 Future All-Pro

7.00-7.49 Pro Bowl-caliber player

6.50-6.99 Chance to become Pro Bowl-caliber player

6.00-6.49 Should become instant starter

5.50-5.99 Chance to become NFL starter

5.20-5.49 NFL backup or special teams potential

5.01-5.19 Better-than-average chance to make NFL roster

5.00 50-50 Chance to make NFL roster

Gurley, Todd RB 6'1" 222 Georgia 6.2

Gordon, Melvin RB 6'1" 215 Wisconsin 6.1

Hyde, Carlos RB 6'0" 230 Ohio St. Pick 25, Round 2 (57) 49ers 6.1

Coleman, Tevin RB 5'11" 206 Indiana 6

Ajayi, Jay RB 6'0" 221 Boise St. 5.8

Johnson, Duke RB 5'9" 207 Miami 5.8

Mason, Tre RB 5'8" 207 Auburn Pick 11, Round 3 (75) Rams 5.8

Abdullah, Ameer RB 5'9" 205 Nebraska 5.7

Yeldon, T.J. RB 6'1" 226 Alabama 5.6

Sankey, Bishop RB 5'9" 209 Washington Pick 22, Round 2 (54) Titans 5.6

Williams, Andre RB 5'11" 230 Boston College Pick 13, Round 4 (113) Giants 5.6

Hill, Jeremy RB 6'1" 233 LSU Pick 23, Round 2 (55) Bengals 5.5

Archer, Dri RB 5'8" 173 Kent St. Pick 33, Round 3 (97) Steelers 5.5

Johnson, David RB 6'1" 224 Northern Iowa 5.4

Davis, Mike RB 5'9" 217 South Carolina 5.4

Cobb, David RB 5'11" 229 Minnesota 5.4

Williams, Karlos RB 6'1" 230 Florida St. 5.4

Rawls, Thomas RB 5'9" 215 Central Michigan 5.4

Artis-Payne, Cameron RB 5'10" 212 Auburn 5.4

Freeman, Devonta RB 5'8" 206 Florida St. Pick 3, Round 4 (103) Falcons 5.4

Carey, Ka'Deem RB 5'9" 207 Arizona Pick 17, Round 4 (117) Bears 5.4

McKinnon, Jerick RB 5'9" 209 Georgia Southern Pick 32, Round 3 (96) Vikings 5.

Allen, Javorius RB 6'0" 221 USC 5.3

Jones, Matt RB 6'2" 231 Florida 5.3

Langford, Jeremy RB 6'0" 208 Michigan St. 5.3

Zenner, Zach RB 5'11" 223 South Dakota St. 5.3

West, Terrance RB 5'9" 225 Towson Pick 30, Round 3 (94) Browns 5.3

Thomas, De'Anthony RB 5'9" 174 Oregon Pick 24, Round 4 (124) Chiefs 5.3

Sims, Charles RB 6'0" 214 West Virginia Pick 5, Round 3 (69) Buccaneers 5.3

Williams, Trey RB 5'7" 195 Texas A&M 5.2

Agnew, Malcolm RB 5'9" 207 Southern Illinois 5.2

Varga, Tyler FB 5'11" 222 Yale 5.2

Johnson, Storm RB 6'0" 209 Central Florida Pick 7, Round 7 (222) Jaguars 5.2

Seastrunk, Lache RB 5'9" 201 Baylor Pick 10, Round 6 (186) Redskins 5.2

Taliaferro, Lorenzo RB 6'0" 229 Coastal Carolina Pick 38, Round 4 (138) Ravens 5.2

Blue, Alfred RB 6'2" 223 LSU Pick 5, Round 6 (181) Texans 5.2

Gaffney, Tyler RB 5'11" 220 Stanford Pick 28, Round 6 (204) Panthers 5.2

Andrews, Antonio RB 5'10" 225 Western Kentucky 5.2

Perkins, LaDarius RB 5'7" 195 Mississippi St. 5.2

Fluellen, David RB 5'11" 224 Toledo 5.2

Baker, James RB 6'0" 237 Idaho 5.2

Crockett, John RB 6'0" 217 North Dakota St. 5.1

Robinson, Josh RB 5'8" 217 Mississippi St. 5.1

Heard, Braylon RB 5'10" 198 Kentucky 5.1

Magee, Terrence RB 5'8" 213 LSU 5.1

Murphy, Marcus RB 5'8" 193 Missouri 5.1

Grant, Corey RB 5'11" 205 Auburn 5.1

Millard, Trey FB 6'2" 247 Oklahoma Pick 30, Round 7 (245) 49ers 5.1

Grice, Marion RB 6'0" 208 Arizona State Pick 25, Round 6 (201) Chargers 5.1

White, James RB 5'9" 204 Wisconsin Pick 30, Round 4 (130) Patriots 5.1

Neal, Rajion RB 5'11" 220 Tennessee 5.1

Crowell, Isaiah RB 5'11" 224 Alabama St. 5.1

Williams, Damien RB 5'11" 222 Oklahoma 5.1

Atkinson, George RB 6'1" 218 Notre Dame 5.1

Wilder, James RB 6'3" 232 Florida St. 5.1

Got a link to his overall rankings and other historical rankings. I ask because these rankings look ridiculously low and I'm curious if this is just a regular thing for him. I mean not having a single guy rated as even a Pro Bowl talent is absurd IMO.

 

[monk]

Abdullah >>> McKinnon

 

[Soulfly3]

The Mason are haters are absolutely hilarious.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/tiny.cgi?id=YaHsg

... take a nap, kids.

please, take your NFL snap-less RBs, who are in imaginary situations over a proven Savage. Please.

 

[Biabreakable]

Here is Lance Zierleins list from 2014-2015 by grade

This is what the grades mean-

Quote

9.00-10 Once-in-lifetime player

8.00-8.99 Perennial All-Pro

7.50-7.99 Future All-Pro

7.00-7.49 Pro Bowl-caliber player

6.50-6.99 Chance to become Pro Bowl-caliber player

6.00-6.49 Should become instant starter

5.50-5.99 Chance to become NFL starter

5.20-5.49 NFL backup or special teams potential

5.01-5.19 Better-than-average chance to make NFL roster

5.00 50-50 Chance to make NFL roster

Gurley, Todd RB 6'1" 222 Georgia 6.2

Gordon, Melvin RB 6'1" 215 Wisconsin 6.1

Hyde, Carlos RB 6'0" 230 Ohio St. Pick 25, Round 2 (57) 49ers 6.1

Coleman, Tevin RB 5'11" 206 Indiana 6

Ajayi, Jay RB 6'0" 221 Boise St. 5.8

Johnson, Duke RB 5'9" 207 Miami 5.8

Mason, Tre RB 5'8" 207 Auburn Pick 11, Round 3 (75) Rams 5.8

Abdullah, Ameer RB 5'9" 205 Nebraska 5.7

Yeldon, T.J. RB 6'1" 226 Alabama 5.6

Sankey, Bishop RB 5'9" 209 Washington Pick 22, Round 2 (54) Titans 5.6

Williams, Andre RB 5'11" 230 Boston College Pick 13, Round 4 (113) Giants 5.6

Hill, Jeremy RB 6'1" 233 LSU Pick 23, Round 2 (55) Bengals 5.5

Archer, Dri RB 5'8" 173 Kent St. Pick 33, Round 3 (97) Steelers 5.5

Johnson, David RB 6'1" 224 Northern Iowa 5.4

Davis, Mike RB 5'9" 217 South Carolina 5.4

Cobb, David RB 5'11" 229 Minnesota 5.4

Williams, Karlos RB 6'1" 230 Florida St. 5.4

Rawls, Thomas RB 5'9" 215 Central Michigan 5.4

Artis-Payne, Cameron RB 5'10" 212 Auburn 5.4

Freeman, Devonta RB 5'8" 206 Florida St. Pick 3, Round 4 (103) Falcons 5.4

Carey, Ka'Deem RB 5'9" 207 Arizona Pick 17, Round 4 (117) Bears 5.4

McKinnon, Jerick RB 5'9" 209 Georgia Southern Pick 32, Round 3 (96) Vikings 5.

Allen, Javorius RB 6'0" 221 USC 5.3

Jones, Matt RB 6'2" 231 Florida 5.3

Langford, Jeremy RB 6'0" 208 Michigan St. 5.3

Zenner, Zach RB 5'11" 223 South Dakota St. 5.3

West, Terrance RB 5'9" 225 Towson Pick 30, Round 3 (94) Browns 5.3

Thomas, De'Anthony RB 5'9" 174 Oregon Pick 24, Round 4 (124) Chiefs 5.3

Sims, Charles RB 6'0" 214 West Virginia Pick 5, Round 3 (69) Buccaneers 5.3

Williams, Trey RB 5'7" 195 Texas A&M 5.2

Agnew, Malcolm RB 5'9" 207 Southern Illinois 5.2

Varga, Tyler FB 5'11" 222 Yale 5.2

Johnson, Storm RB 6'0" 209 Central Florida Pick 7, Round 7 (222) Jaguars 5.2

Seastrunk, Lache RB 5'9" 201 Baylor Pick 10, Round 6 (186) Redskins 5.2

Taliaferro, Lorenzo RB 6'0" 229 Coastal Carolina Pick 38, Round 4 (138) Ravens 5.2

Blue, Alfred RB 6'2" 223 LSU Pick 5, Round 6 (181) Texans 5.2

Gaffney, Tyler RB 5'11" 220 Stanford Pick 28, Round 6 (204) Panthers 5.2

Andrews, Antonio RB 5'10" 225 Western Kentucky 5.2

Perkins, LaDarius RB 5'7" 195 Mississippi St. 5.2

Fluellen, David RB 5'11" 224 Toledo 5.2

Baker, James RB 6'0" 237 Idaho 5.2

Crockett, John RB 6'0" 217 North Dakota St. 5.1

Robinson, Josh RB 5'8" 217 Mississippi St. 5.1

Heard, Braylon RB 5'10" 198 Kentucky 5.1

Magee, Terrence RB 5'8" 213 LSU 5.1

Murphy, Marcus RB 5'8" 193 Missouri 5.1

Grant, Corey RB 5'11" 205 Auburn 5.1

Millard, Trey FB 6'2" 247 Oklahoma Pick 30, Round 7 (245) 49ers 5.1

Grice, Marion RB 6'0" 208 Arizona State Pick 25, Round 6 (201) Chargers 5.1

White, James RB 5'9" 204 Wisconsin Pick 30, Round 4 (130) Patriots 5.1

Neal, Rajion RB 5'11" 220 Tennessee 5.1

Crowell, Isaiah RB 5'11" 224 Alabama St. 5.1

Williams, Damien RB 5'11" 222 Oklahoma 5.1

Atkinson, George RB 6'1" 218 Notre Dame 5.1

Wilder, James RB 6'3" 232 Florida St. 5.1

Got a link to his overall rankings and other historical rankings.I ask because these rankings look ridiculously low and I'm curious if this is just a regular thing for him. I mean not having a single guy rated as even a Pro Bowl talent is absurd IMO.

Well I posted links to 2013-2014 grades in the other thread. He used a slightly different methodology for his grades in 2013 than he did for the last two draft classes.

Lance has been doing this for a long loooong time. There is a reason he is one of the main writers for NFL.com and he is a writer I am familiar with since before the internet.

Perhaps he is a bit too conservative? Not ranking any players are pro bowl caliber as rookies? But that seems to be pretty consistent.

 

[Biabreakable]

Why are you guys arguing over this? There is not enough data from 2014 and no data from 2015. Do you realize that you are arguing over baseless opinions? What's the point?

Just trying to share information.

I totally agree that each rookie class needs three years before one can really judge their performance.

But since FF moves at a faster pace than this, and people need to try to make judgments without 3 years of data to work with. It happens a lot.

 

[jurb26]

We aren't talking about rookies, per say. We are talking about prospects. Their potential and grades should be encompassing a career. Yeah, I think he is way too conservative with his scoring.

 

[Biabreakable]

We aren't talking about rookies, per say. We are talking about prospects. Their potential and grades should be encompassing a career. Yeah, I think he is way too conservative with his scoring.

Well at least he has a grade so that draft classes can be cross compared.

His grades from 2013 were like this:

96-100 Future Hall of Famer Top Pick A once-in-a-generation type prospect who could change how his position is played

85-95 Immediate Starter 1st An impact player with the ability/intangibles to become a Pro Bowl player. Expect to start immediately except in a unique situation (i.e. behind a veteran starter).

70-84 Eventual Starter 2nd-3rd A quality player who will contribute to the team early on and is expected to develop into a starter. A reliable player who brings value to the position.

50-69 Draftable Player 4th-7th A prospect with the ability to make team as a backup/role player. Needs to be a special teams contributor at applicable positions. Players in the high range of this category might have long-term potential.

20-49 Free Agent UDFA A player with solid measurables, intangibles, college achievements, or a developing skill that warrants an opportunity in an NFL camp. In the right situation, he could earn a place on a 53-man roster, but most likely will be a practice squad player or a camp body.

 

[ROCKET]

Gordon will be the next in a long line of Badger rb busts. I'd take Hyde over him in a second. If it wasn't for Gurley the 2015 rb crop would be one of the worst in recent memory.

Can you say more about what leads you to think this?

Can you say more about what leads you to not think this?

 

[Freelove]

Gordon will be the next in a long line of Badger rb busts. I'd take Hyde over him in a second. If it wasn't for Gurley the 2015 rb crop would be one of the worst in recent memory.

Can you say more about what leads you to think this?

Can you say more about what leads you to not think this?

Gordon appears to have skills and attributes that tend to make runners valuable to NFL franchises. Scouts and draftniks seem to believe a number of other RB's in this class do as well.

I think it's pretty clear that this is more or less the consensus position. That doesn't mean it'll be right. But it does mean that it makes it interesting to hear why others might disagree with that consensus. If you've got good reasons, I'm sure lots of us would like to hear them.

 

[bigums]

The Mason are haters are absolutely hilarious.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/tiny.cgi?id=YaHsg

... take a nap, kids.

please, take your NFL snap-less RBs, who are in imaginary situations over a proven Savage. Please.

I love Mason myself, but I have to know how long you spent trying to make that query fit him into such a small bucket. Bump most any of the metrics by a tiny bit (say, 65ypg rushing or 15 ypg receiving) and all of a sudden he falls out with the others still solidy in. Or make it 22yo and such luminaries as Steve Slaton and Dominic Rhodes join the party along with 13 others. Good stuff, though...

 

[Soulfly3]

The Mason are haters are absolutely hilarious.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/tiny.cgi?id=YaHsg

... take a nap, kids.

please, take your NFL snap-less RBs, who are in imaginary situations over a proven Savage. Please.

I love Mason myself, but I have to know how long you spent trying to make that query fit him into such a small bucket. Bump most any of the metrics by a tiny bit (say, 65ypg rushing or 15 ypg receiving) and all of a sudden he falls out with the others still solidy in. Or make it 22yo and such luminaries as Steve Slaton and Dominic Rhodes join the party along with 13 others. Good stuff, though...

I didnt create that. But the stat speaks for itself.

 

[ROCKET]

Gordon will be the next in a long line of Badger rb busts. I'd take Hyde over him in a second. If it wasn't for Gurley the 2015 rb crop would be one of the worst in recent memory.

Can you say more about what leads you to think this?

Can you say more about what leads you to not think this?

Gordon appears to have skills and attributes that tend to make runners valuable to NFL franchises. Scouts and draftniks seem to believe a number of other RB's in this class do as well.

I think it's pretty clear that this is more or less the consensus position. That doesn't mean it'll be right. But it does mean that it makes it interesting to hear why others might disagree with that consensus. If you've got good reasons, I'm sure lots of us would like to hear them.

Scouts and draftniks tout players every year, last year, this year, next year etc. They hyped Johnny Manziel last year too so who cares? The only rb that sticks out to me as having high upside is Gurley, not impressed with Gordon at all. Of course there will be outliers but I see both the '14 and '15 rb crops as being pretty thin. Last year we at least got Hyde, Hill and Mason who look like quality starters, this year who knows? Color me not impressed besides Gurley.