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Biden Announces Plan to Remove Troops From Afghanistan by September (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter The General
- Start date
parasaurolophus
Footballguy
Probably not. This was probably just released to take focus away from adding troops in Germany.
The General
Footballguy
I hadn't heard about this. Why do you think these two stories would be linked?
parasaurolophus
Footballguy
I mean you asked "Will this happen" so you obviously must at least doubt its sincerity in some way. Now combine with the fact the announcements came out on the same day.
-jb-
Footballguy
The Pentagon will figure out a way of perpetuating our presence, likely with a "just need 6 months" bull#### narrative, until the next "just need 6 more" narrative. It needs to happen, but we continue to #### the bed on this.
ETA thx for a new post on this. it deserves it. hopefully we can avoid the pettiness as this is a pretty important topic that affects many, many lives.
ETA thx for a new post on this. it deserves it. hopefully we can avoid the pettiness as this is a pretty important topic that affects many, many lives.
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Desert_Power
Footballguy
My answer is probably on both counts. Not sure what is going to happen when we pull out, but that isn't really a justification to keep putting our troops in harms way over there.
-jb-
Footballguy
This is a good watch
3 weeks old, but still incredibly relevant. I see that Jeanne Shaheen has already weighed in on the women's rights piece.
2,300 troop deaths. $100B. 20 years. Unreal.
3 weeks old, but still incredibly relevant. I see that Jeanne Shaheen has already weighed in on the women's rights piece.
2,300 troop deaths. $100B. 20 years. Unreal.
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Desert_Power
Footballguy
The General
Footballguy
For sure I def have doubts about the ability to do this. They all say this stuff then it proves much harder to do. I'm of the get out of Afghanistan yesterday mindset.
I wouldn't have thought to link this being announced to a news dump to cover for troops being moved to Germany though (I looked this up after you mentioned it). To me that is not of note, us moving 500 people to a base of a NATO ally. Was curious why you went to that.
The General
Footballguy
-jb-
Footballguy
DocHolliday
Footballguy
I’m in the get out of most countries camp. The US has financial issues. Cuts to the military should have happened long ago.The General said:
The Commish
Footballguy
Love McConnell's response to this...he's not even trying anymore 
NorvilleBarnes
Footballguy
So he's basically implementing Trump's plan. With delays.
Will this man never run out of great ideas?
Will this man never run out of great ideas?
The Commish
Footballguy
Obviously, you have no idea how hard it is to "implement" GOP ideas while simultaneously being completely controlled by the fringe liberal left.So he's basically implementing Trump's plan. With delays.
Will this man never run out of great ideas?
shadrap
Footballguy
I hope it happens & I think it is good. It's not our country. If they want to make it a cesspool of crap let them & they will too. tired of being the world sheriff when we have immediate problems at home.
One other downside is leaving unprotected the Afghan people we sheltered from the government
-jb-
Footballguy
You could say that. I suppose you could also say that Trump was implementing Obama’s plan, with delays, as well. Or one could just realize that the Pentagon doesn’t want to give up its golden goose and has ####ed over both of those guys. But sides.NorvilleBarnes said:So he's basically implementing Trump's plan. With delays.
Will this man never run out of great ideas?
Bottom line, we should all be cautiously optimistic that it finally happens.
zoonation
Footballguy
Is it a “great” idea though? I mean, Trump would sell it as the greatest idea ever, and only one he himself could make happen, but calling it “great”? Are standards that low now?NorvilleBarnes said:So he's basically implementing Trump's plan. With delays.
Will this man never run out of great ideas?
Also, the “implementation” of the plan is where all the work has to be done. If it can be done. Simply declaring you want to get out of Afghanistan is like saying “I need to get into better shape”.
whoknew
Footballguy
The other downside is if the Taliban returns and once again terrorizes the Afghan people.
The Commish
Footballguy
Which will absolutely happen. We don't need to be there in my view. It's a sinkhole where money goes to die. The last thing I'd try in that part of the world before going full "can't stop them can only hope to contain them" mode is the humanitarian angle. That's about all that's left unfortunately.
Godsbrother
Footballguy
I like the idea of finally getting out our troops out (shouldn't have ever been there IMO) but I don't see the value in announcing when it will happen.
shadrap
Footballguy
no if about it IMO-they will return. lessons to be learned from Vietnam: we captured a VC & HE asked just how long we planned on staying, 10 years, 20 years, 30 years? He explained it didn't matter because they would still be there when the U.S. left.
whoknew
Footballguy
Makes me sad. Intellectually, I know we have to leave. We can't leave our troops there forever. We just can't afford to do that. (Though I feel dumb saying that because its not like Congress is going to cut the military budget)
But its just so awful to abandon the Afghanis to the Taliban. Horrific.
The Commish
Footballguy
There's a significantly cheaper option to helping those people and that would be helping them get to this country or other countries willing to take them in. I know many of them don't feel like they should be the ones to leave their homeland, but we could at least give them the option and if they think staying is the better option, at least it's their choice at that point. That's probably the best we can do and that's been true since this thing started 20 years ago.
I had a friend say almost the same thing to me - but he said it was dumb to announce a date. Isn’t the date likely to lower the risk of altercation? They want us out - now that we are leaving are they going to attack us and provoke us into staying?
The Commish
Footballguy
Taliban began formulating their plan for going back the day they were driven out. Their plan's been in place for decades at this point. The only thing left was to fill in the dates. This notion that we aren't to announce a date we are going to be out by has always seemed bizarre to me. All that announcing the date does vs not announcing it is does is allow them to fill that portion out on their project plan.
NorvilleBarnes
Footballguy
Welp.
The General
Footballguy
Not finished yet.
NorvilleBarnes
Footballguy
The General
Footballguy
YepSo he's basically implementing Trump's plan. With delays.
Will this man never run out of great ideas?
zoonation
Footballguy
NorvilleBarnes
Footballguy
Just curious, do you have an expiration date on the "but TrUmP" deflections? I mean, I know Biden is brand new at this and has only been on the job a few months and hasn't spent his entire life in public office or anything.
The General
Footballguy
Oh your “he’s copying Trump’s plan” was serous?
Well those quotes did make it seem like he was.
NorvilleBarnes
Footballguy
The General
Footballguy
And I was clearly mocking your post. Sorry.
This is all on Biden as he is the President.
NorvilleBarnes
Footballguy
The General
Footballguy
You’re one of the good ones, GB.No worries. I dish it out, I can take it. Cheers.
GordonGekko
Footballguy
Direct Headline: China Embraces High-Stakes Taliban Relationship as U.S. Exits
Bloomberg News August 16, 2021, 2:00 PM PDT
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-08-16/china-enters-high-stakes-relationship-with-post-u-s-afghanistan
Direct Headline: China Preparing to Recognize Taliban if Kabul Falls: Sources
The move comes at the expense of the U.S., which has held up the Taliban’s international legitimacy as its remaining source of leverage while the militant group storms across Afghanistan.
By Paul D. Shinkman Aug. 12, 2021, at 12:52 p.m.
https://www.usnews.com/news/world-report/articles/2021-08-12/china-prepared-to-recognize-taliban-if-kabul-falls-sources-say-undermining-us-threats
Direct Headline: China Embraces Taliban, Eyeing Own Interests
Jackie Northam August 14, 20215:17 PM ET
https://www.npr.org/2021/08/14/1027756566/china-embraces-taliban-eyeing-own-interests
******
War between the United States and China is all but inevitable for the near future. The last thing America needs is it's great natural open threat to become BFF with a bunch of terrorists who have been training at asymmetrical warfare for generations.
In previous World Wars, the US was lucky in that it didn't have to fight major battles on it's own soil. A war with China is different. China has no problem forcibly sterilizing the Uighurs. Then using them as slave labor, torturing them, selling them into sexual servitude and finally using them for organ harvesting. Do you think China will have a problem using chemical weapons on American soil? A problem attacking civilian targets? A problem using sniper teams, suicide bombers, sappers and activated sleeper cells to attack ports, major infrastructure, the financial districts, major trucking hubs, airports, food production, water sanitation facilities and military bases?
If there's a bunch of bullies on the schoolyard and they want pure blood and nothing else, what do you do when you are perceived as weak and the first bully tries to hard roll you.
If you don't want to fight every single day afterwards forever against the even bigger threats, you don't just punch the bully in the face. You kick out his knee with your heel, then you forearm shiver his throat, then when he's on the ground, you find the biggest rock you can and bash in his skull. Then with all the other bullies watching the spray of skull fragments and pink mist, you pick up his head, grab a broken bottle off the ground, then you cut his throat. Then you point that broken bottle at everyone else and ask who wants to see what you can do after you've warmed up and gotten limber. You send a message. If you want some of me, you can step up right now and get some of me. You can come and get all of it.
The practical strategy is to offer Taiwan as much military aid as they want. As long as they join the coalition as the US decides to wipe out the entire Taliban. If one single American soldier is killed, you strike at major civilian targets as a disproportional response. Hospitals, schools, shopping districts, water production and food production sites, everything.
Let President Xi Jinping see American soldiers and Taiwanese soldiers fighting side by side and going full scorched Earth. Let China know that if it wants a war, the US will have no problem wiping out major civilian centers.
So no, it's "not good" No half measures. Decimating the Taliban completely and whatever that costs will be cheaper in bloodshed and more effective as long term deterrent than the end of the world scenario with an open war with China.
What's the alternative? Pay off the Taliban so they don't take American hostages, so they can use that money to fuel more terrorism against America later? That's the long con move, the short con move is to use all that American military hardware left behind and sell it on the black market, where it will be used to sow terror and death around the world. Our tax dollars spent to help the Taliban get the resource base to attack us later.
Do I feel bad for the people there who are civilians and are going to get caught in the middle? Yes. Do I feel bad for the women and children over there? Yes. Do I wish there were more alternatives to help those people? Yes.
But how many of you live near a major port. Or a major trucking hub or food distribution center? A water processing facility? A major financial district? You won't feel so badly for those non Americans when a sleeper cell triggers a dirty bomb in your city. Or releases chemical warfare agents. Or just sets up a sniper team and picks off civilians for hours down below.
What makes you think Xi Jinping is going to be any more merciful to you and your kids than he is to the Uighurs?
There's a time to talk, then there's a time to fight. I'm good at talking. Elite at it. I'm better at fighting. Some of you believe every last single conflict can be resolved with a conversation. Well, it's a free country so go ahead and feel that way, and when a bunch of bullies are beating you up and stealing your lunch and running a train on you behind the portables, don't say you weren't told the truth. Sometimes you need to do your talking with bullets.
Enough of this diplomacy happy horse ####. There are American citizens trapped in hostile ground that are inches away from being hostages and casualties. It's time to start having conversations with our rifles.
Stealthycat
Footballguy
Insein
Footballguy
Well he followed through... In the most half-assed way possible. Like if you planned out how to make a bad situation a thousand times worse, I don't think you could check any more boxes than what they've done here. Announce a time table that's longer than what Trump had. Then suddenly leave sooner and abandon most of our allies still in the country. Give the enemy you spent 20 years trying to remove billions of dollars on advanced military hardware for them to hold their power.
We basically spent 20 years paying the military industrial complex trillions and the end result was putting the old regime back in power with a more fortified position. It's hard not to be a conspiracy theorist when all the conspiracies keep coming true.
The Kerminator
Footballguy
GordonGekko
Footballguy
TWEET: Ben Shapiro XX@XXbenshapiro
"The most powerful military in the (complete) history of the (entire) world does not have the capacity to drive Americans ( in harm's way) to the airport in fear of a bunch of Stone Age (Taliban) barbarians armed with (abandoned) American weapons"
( RE: SEC AUSTIN: "We don't have the capability to go out and collect large numbers of people (and bring them to safety)." )
1:19 PM · Aug 18, 2021·Twitter Web App
https://mobile.twitter.com/benshapiro/status/1428089231805722628
Direct Headline: Austin Pick Thrusts Pentagon Into Identity-Politics Debate
His confirmation would be historic. But for whom?
By Katie Bo Williams Senior National Security Correspondent December 8, 2020
https://www.defenseone.com/policy/2020/12/austin-pick-thrusts-pentagon-identity-politics-debate/170604/
******
Biden said he wants to pick his cabinet based on who "looks like America"
What about skill set?
Michele Flournoy was an Obama loyalist, fit the intersectionality requirement and was a pure warhawk who lined her pockets with money from the military industrial complex. During the end of Obama's reign, she converted her relationship with Antony Blinken to over 30 million in government military contracts. This doesn't include whatever Dark Money that comes implied within this industry. There were arguments she should be in Austin's position today. Because she's a woman.
Austin was picked because he's black. Flournoy was a controversial snub because she's a woman WITHOUT REGARD that she's pushed to quadruple down on military conflict all over the world to shovel bags of money into her own accounts.
What about skill set?
Neither of them can coordinate using the most powerful military in the world to roll out in force to go save American citizens in harm's way?
Thousands are stranded out there. Some are families. Some have children. If Biden will leave those American children to be taken hostage and/or get killed by terrorists, what will he let happen to all of your children if there's enough political capital in it for him?
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