Colin Kaepernick Thread and related anthem kneeling issues/news (5 Viewers)

[d1234]

Back to the messenger for a second.

Intersting that Kapaernick kneeled during the anthem tonight in San Diego and was joined by Eric Reid.  Afterwards he was hugged by several teamates.  He also shook hands immediately after the anthem with former Green Beret Nate Boyer, who wrote a very thouhtful letter that was linked to in a post here but largely ignored.  Kap invited Boyer to San Diego, spoke with him for 90 minutes about his protest and what he was doing.

He also stood with his teamates and cheered during the celebration/tribute to the military in the 2nd quarter.

I suppose somebody needs to start a thread on Reid now.

I find it odd that things have progressed from he is being disrespectful of the military (he wasn't) #VeteransForKaepernick ,  to he is unpatriotic (Standing for the anthem doesn't make you a patriot, therefore not standing for it doesn't make you unpatriotic), to an I disagree with the message argument.  

 

[VaTerp]

I suppose somebody needs to start a thread on Reid now.

I find it odd that things have progressed from he is being disrespectful of the military (he wasn't) #VeteransForKaepernick ,  to he is unpatriotic (Standing for the anthem doesn't make you a patriot, therefore not standing for it doesn't make you unpatriotic), to an I disagree with the message argument.  

Exactly.  There are many who have a legitimate disagreement with the method of his protest.  Which is very understandable.  I would just ask that those people also consider that the flag doesnt mean the same thing to everybody.  And Kap's choice of protest, as evidenced by his statements last week and actions tonight, has absolutely nothing to do with disrespecting the military.

But there is also a strong undercurrent of many who simply don't agree with the message in the first place.  Who have no understanding or desire to understand what racism in this country really means.  I started to type a long post getting into that but maybe I'll save it if I ever get over to the FFA.  I'm somewhat trying not to go too far in the SP as I appreciate how lenient the mods have been, if thats the case.

Anyway, it is interesting how sitting for the national anthem is now being packaged with support of BLM "terrorist" and delivered to you as "Thug Life" by modern day so called conservatives who now all about such matters.  GTFOH.

 

[VaTerp]

I also never felt he was intending to disrespect the military. That's probably a conservative point. He is just intending to disrespect "pigs" as are other BLM supporters. For them it's a war against pigs (and whites for some of them) even if a black man with a gun is pointing it at a black officer defending a black community.

No, he is making a point to further a conversation about injustice.  He also explained the socks, which IMO was a poor choice, but was done before his public protest.  

And again, you are showing that you have no clue what BLM is about or what it supports.  "...black man with a gun pointing it at a black officer defending the black community?"  Are you referencing a specific incident or is this just more contrived strawman stuff to serve your inaccurate narrative on all of this?

How about this?  I support BLM. Am I a terrorist, a supporter of a hate group?  why don't you ask what its about? Maybe because you don't have a genunine inteerest in understanding any of this.

 

[Short Corner]

Yes, things I'm sure of as I sit here this moment.  You are a bigot (thanks for the little msg you left me), you have no idea what racism means, you have no idea what a thug is.

Thug is the new ni##er.  When someone uses the term thug when referring to a black non-criminal, they really mean ni##er but know that it crosses the line.

 

[VaTerp]

 #1 - it doesn't matter that he explained the socks after the "protest", it shows his state of mind which is in alignment with the BLM of, cops are pigs. Of course it's a poor choice.

#2 - Milwaukee - a black criminal with a gun points it at a black police man and gets shot and the black community there, with BLM signs and chants, burns stuff, is on camera encouraging rioting suburbs, and is attacking white motorists and assaulting random whites. You didn't see this?

#3 - I didn't know you support BLM. I am willing to hear what you feel it's all about to you. At the same time I ask you, are you aware of what it means to everyone else who supports it? Because if the leadership is such that it can not control the people who come to support it to be peaceful, and those people do hateful things under it's name, like murdering police officers and attacking whites, than what does that mean for a movement like that?

1)  I don't agree with your generalization and over simplification that BLM= Cops are pigs.  You do know there are police officers, both black and white, who support BLM?  My father happens to be a recently retired police officer of 30 years.

2) I was out of the country during the Milwaukee incident and didnt really know the details.  So I apologize for my ignorance and suggestion that this was a strawman.  I did see some of the videos.  But any group of people can start a rally and chant things.  That doesnt make them part of a network or a movement.  Still waiting for the link that shows how this was associated with BLM. Any help would be appreciated.  All I can find is video on far right websites that really dont prove anything.  And I also saw where local leaders in Milwaukee said the riots were a culmination of a number of things, including the shooting of an unarmed man in 2014, and economic and segregation conditions that see Milwaukee ranked as one of the worst cities for black Americans to live in based on a number of metrics.

3) Of course, I'm not aware of what BLM means to EVERYONE else.   Is everyone here who supports Conservatives aware of what being conservative means to the Council on Conservative Citizens, who inspired Dylan Roof to shoot 10 and murder 9 black people in their church?  Is every Trump supporter aware of the bigotry and physical violence/intimidation some of his supporters have engaged in? (Ok...maybe bad example b/c they are aware) Can their leaderships control them?  People do hateful things under the names of things all the time. You have to be careful in assigning the extreme behavior of a few to groups of people.  Particularly when those groups have official platforms.

BLM is about broadening the conversation around state violence and the ways in which black people in America are intentionally targeted and deprived of basic human rights and dignity in numerous ways throughout Ameria.  They call for a specific 10 point policy plan to address systemic issues of discriminatory policing. http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-34023751

Please point out to me where leadership of the movement has advocated for violence against anyone, let alone the police. 

 

[IheartGuinness]

Thug is the new ni##er.  When someone uses the term thug when referring to a black non-criminal, they really mean ni##er but know that it crosses the line.

Not true. There are distinct differences between the terms. "Thug" is a legitimate descriptor--thugs do exist, n###ers do not.

 

[spider321]

[squistion]Show me a video where Adolph Hitler personally killed a Jew or an autographed picture of Adolph Hitler pulling the trigger of a handgun that is pointed at a Jew's head.  Adolph Hitler loved Jews, and you have no evidence to show otherwise.[/squistion]

 

[Short Corner]

Not true. There are distinct differences between the terms. "Thug" is a legitimate descriptor--thugs do exist, n###ers do not.

While 'Thug" is a legitimate descriptor, I'd say the vast majority of the time it used incorrectly and user would have have exchanged it with 'ni##er' if not for the public scorn.  More often than not a pretty easy indicator that the person is a bigot.

 

[d1234]

#1 - over months and months of protest I've seen so many videos in cities across the country of people with BLM signs chanting slogans that say police are pigs and should die. It doesn't matter to me if you say a few former police now support that idea. I doubt the families of the police who died in Dallas from the hate that originated from the BLM movement support it.

#2 - You were out of the country, I wasn't. I watched the mayhem. I've also watched the excuses after. There are issues with things all over the country, a strong leadership of a movement would make sure those issues didn't turn into riots, hate speech and racist attacks.

#3 - When there is a movement or a group, and the leadership of said movement is not capable of effectively communicating a message to it's supporters or controlling them and keeping them peaceful, it becomes a problem.

to #2 and #3  It is not like the KKK or the Aryans Nations, there is no formal strong leadership.

Based on your statements I would assume that you believe that the organization that oversees this is a problem http://goo.gl/T57Wk6

 

[d1234]

Except there is an organization there and they exposed him.

By your own words, BLM has no strong leadership.

No they did not expose them, "They were discovered as part of a federal corruption probe into the officers. Fourteen officers, including a captain, were implicated in sending or receiving such texts"

#2 "a strong leadership of a movement would make sure those issues didn't turn into riots, hate speech and racist attacks."   your words.  It is not an organized movement, there is no formal organization.  Anybody can use the words black lives matter and then do whatever they want,  so to paint overall movement based on the actions of a few who may or may not have nay formal affiliation with the group is unfair.

#3 I go back to it being odd that the outrage over Kaepernick's actions is now being tied to BLM.  Your argument is some people in BLM bad, Kaepernick = BLM therefore Kaepernick bad.  Where is your outrage at the other athletes that have done worse than him?  Michael Phelps has done far worse than Kaepernick, yet he is the darling of the olympics.

 

[spider321]

Can this be moved to the Free-for-All board now that Kap's career is over?

 

[JuniorNB]

One by one, more guys are joining this idiot in not standing during the anthem. In a few weeks, there will be pressure from the black community and any black athlete NOT joining the sit-in will be considered an Uncle Tom. By October,  all the blacks will be sitting and all the whites will be standing. More divisiveness.  Meanwhile, people who resist arrest and fight with cops will still be getting roughed up and/or shot.  Maybe blacks should protest and call for change by uniting in deciding not to resist arrest?  Nah, that's just ridiculous.  

 

[Short Corner]

One by one, more guys are joining this idiot in not standing during the anthem. In a few weeks, there will be pressure from the black community and any black athlete NOT joining the sit-in will be considered an Uncle Tom. By October,  all the blacks will be sitting and all the whites will be standing. More divisiveness.  Meanwhile, people who resist arrest and fight with cops will still be getting roughed up and/or shot.  Maybe blacks should protest and call for change by uniting in deciding not to resist arrest?  Nah, that's just ridiculous.  

Because every confrontation that escalates between LE and blacks odd the result of resisting arrest.

 

[Tool]

One by one, more guys are joining this idiot in not standing during the anthem. In a few weeks, there will be pressure from the black community and any black athlete NOT joining the sit-in will be considered an Uncle Tom. By October,  all the blacks will be sitting and all the whites will be standing. More divisiveness.  Meanwhile, people who resist arrest and fight with cops will still be getting roughed up and/or shot.  Maybe blacks should protest and call for change by uniting in deciding not to resist arrest?  Nah, that's just ridiculous.  

With 17,000 posts I'm guessing you know something about football.   Maybe you should consider focusing your posts on that.

 

[ponchsox]

One by one, more guys are joining this idiot in not standing during the anthem. In a few weeks, there will be pressure from the black community and any black athlete NOT joining the sit-in will be considered an Uncle Tom. By October,  all the blacks will be sitting and all the whites will be standing. More divisiveness.  Meanwhile, people who resist arrest and fight with cops will still be getting roughed up and/or shot.  Maybe blacks should protest and call for change by uniting in deciding not to resist arrest?  Nah, that's just ridiculous.  

Cuz muh feels!

 

[JuniorNB]

With 17,000 posts I'm guessing you know something about football.   Maybe you should consider focusing your posts on that.

One last week. It's up to three or four this week. More next week, double it the week after.... More and more blacks being interviewed and saying they agree with his stance. Just wait. This has a very good chance of becoming 'a thing'. Not just a Keapernick thing. I'm right about most things in life. So there's a good chance I'll be right about this too.

And yes, I'll give you fantasy advice if you need it. But please use the other board.

 

[Bigboy10182000]

there will be pressure from the black community and any black athlete NOT joining the sit-in will be considered an Uncle Tom. By October,  all the blacks will be sitting and all the whites will be standing. More divisiveness.  

Bingo. And we will have divisiveness over our nation anthem. Unreal. 

Kap last week, Reid and Lane this week. Could be wrong but it seems like it will get worse before better. 

 

[JuniorNB]

Bingo. And we will have divisiveness over our nation anthem. Unreal. 

Kap last week, Reid and Lane this week. Could be wrong but it seems like it will get worse before better. 

Yup, it'll become a movement. And then the pressure to join the movement. Fun times ahead

 

[CGRdrJoe]

Yup, it'll become a movement. And then the pressure to join the movement. Fun times ahead

You mean people will actually be able to express their freedoms? Wow, who would have ever thought we would have evolved there as a Country...

 

[dutch]

Yup, it'll become a movement. And then the pressure to join the movement. Fun times ahead

Will the pressure to join Kap and friends in sit down protest be equal to the pressure to stand already being exerted by the Patriot Police?

 

[Bigboy10182000]

You mean people will actually be able to express their freedoms? Wow, who would have ever thought we would have evolved there as a Country...

You know that feeling you get when you hear a joke for the hundredth time or that same family story? That's you right now. 

 

[Boston]

You mean people will actually be able to express their freedoms? Wow, who would have ever thought we would have evolved there as a Country...

Yup...Kapernick has every right to not honor the flag or depict cops as pigs...it is his right just like it is the right of anyone to consider him a jerk for not honoring the flag or stereotyping all cops as pigs...free country...everyone can decide for themselves how they feel about him...

 

[jonessed]

You mean people will actually be able to express their freedoms? Wow, who would have ever thought we would have evolved there as a Country...

Equal rights and all.  Even oppressed multi-millionaire athletes can express themselves.

 

[Hawkeye21]

I don't like Kaepernick and never have.  It has always had to do with his personality and arrogance on the field though.  As for his current actions I was originally upset a little bit by it but the more I have learned about it the more I am fine with it.  I don't think he is doing anything wrong and by his actions he has drawn a lot of attention to a glaring issue in our nation.  If he were to try and bring this issue up in a press conference it would have been forgotten already and no one would care.

It's sad to see the amount of ignorance and hate in this country.  It's one of the reasons I dislike being around people because they are just the worst, especially large groups of people.  Educate yourselves and be open to other ideas.

 

[jonessed]

I don't like Kaepernick and never have.  It has always had to do with his personality and arrogance on the field though.  As for his current actions I was originally upset a little bit by it but the more I have learned about it the more I am fine with it.  I don't think he is doing anything wrong and by his actions he has drawn a lot of attention to a glaring issue in our nation.  If he were to try and bring this issue up in a press conference it would have been forgotten already and no one would care.

It's sad to see the amount of ignorance and hate in this country.  It's one of the reasons I dislike being around people because they are just the worst, especially large groups of people.  Educate yourselves and be open to other ideas.

That's quite the contradiction.

 

[Boston]

That's quite the contradiction.

Another person who wants people to be open to other ideas...as long as they agree with those ideas...

 

[JuniorNB]

You mean people will actually be able to express their freedoms? Wow, who would have ever thought we would have evolved there as a Country...

Having NFL teams divided and making the sports headlines about idiots like Kaepernick trying to be political? No thanks.

 

[JuniorNB]

Another person who wants people to be open to other ideas...as long as they agree with those ideas...

I don't give a rat's a## if Colin Kaepernick wears pig socks everywhere he goes and wants to sit outside of town hall with a F### the police sign on all of his days off. His opinion means absolutely nothing to me and I agree with his right to express it. The fact that I turned on Sportscenter this morning hoping to see some scores and highlights, but instead had to sit through 15 minutes of this irrelevant player spouting his opinion is what burns my ###.  His name would only be mentioned for being on the roster bubble if not for his antics. I can turn on CNN or Fox News for my politics.

 

[Hawkeye21]

Another person who wants people to be open to other ideas...as long as they agree with those ideas...

I wasn't trying to come across like that.  I just feel it's important to be open.  No one has to agree but it's important to listen.  I've always felt it's important to put yourself in another person's shoes.  Changing you perspective can be very helpful.

I live in a very Catholic town and went to Catholic school school.  The amount of hypocrisy and hate is ridiculous with most.  So judgmental also.  I fall victim to it also but try not to. 

 

[spider321]

I see an ESPY in Kap's future!

lol.

 

[Boston]

I wasn't trying to come across like that.  I just feel it's important to be open.  No one has to agree but it's important to listen.  I've always felt it's important to put yourself in another person's shoes.  Changing you perspective can be very helpful.

I live in a very Catholic town and went to Catholic school school.  The amount of hypocrisy and hate is ridiculous with most.  So judgmental also.  I fall victim to it also but try not to. 

Putting it that way I agree with you...I just hate (and that is putting it mildly) when people say we have to "have conversations" or "be open to other ideas" when what they really mean is I am right but you're too simple to understand why...

 

[JuniorNB]

Hopefully they cut this bozo before the season starts or this will be the big Week 1 story. Instead of talking about the return of football we'll have to hear the opinions on this of every analyst.

I am 100% positive that that Chip Kelly and the rest of the Niners brass would LOVE to cut this idiot. I'm just not sure they'd want the hub bub that would go along with it. They are almost trapped into keeping hi8m now. They cut this clown and al Sharpton would be pleaded to blacks to boycott their games. BLM would be demonstrating outside their stadium. This is a horrible situation for the 49ers.

 

[dutch]

Such a juxtaposition between this thread and the one in the FFA.

 

[Hawkeye21]

Putting it that way I agree with you...I just hate (and that is putting it mildly) when people say we have to "have conversations" or "be open to other ideas" when what they really mean is I am right but you're too simple to understand why...

I don't push my ideals on people often.  I'm married so I know that I'm rarely right.  I always tell my friends that I hate people, not so much individuals but just the general public.  It's more of a joke than the actual truth though.  I do get disgusted by what I see on TV when I see these rallies and Trump and Clinton events though.  It's really bringing out the worst in people.

 

[spider321]

I am 100% positive that that Chip Kelly and the rest of the Niners brass would LOVE to cut this idiot. I'm just not sure they'd want the hub bub that would go along with it. They are almost trapped into keeping hi8m now. They cut this clown and al Sharpton would be pleaded to blacks to boycott their games. BLM would be demonstrating outside their stadium. This is a horrible situation for the 49ers.

Maybe, but I'd bet the organization would lose more than a few sponsors and season ticket holders by keeping him.

 

[pghrob]

https://youtu.be/b2ff8qXa248

 

[Boston]

I don't push my ideals on people often.  I'm married so I know that I'm rarely right.  I always tell my friends that I hate people, not so much individuals but just the general public.  It's more of a joke than the actual truth though.  I do get disgusted by what I see on TV when I see these rallies and Trump and Clinton events though.  It's really bringing out the worst in people.

Unfortunately everything has turned into sports where you root for your team and hate the other teams...spilling over to too much of the everyday world...

 

[Chaka]

One by one, more guys are joining this idiot in not standing during the anthem. In a few weeks, there will be pressure from the black community and any black athlete NOT joining the sit-in will be considered an Uncle Tom. By October,  all the blacks will be sitting and all the whites will be standing. More divisiveness.  Meanwhile, people who resist arrest and fight with cops will still be getting roughed up and/or shot.  Maybe blacks should protest and call for change by uniting in deciding not to resist arrest?  Nah, that's just ridiculous.  

Really Junior?  The funny thing is that you don't realize that the reason most people stand for the anthem is not out of some deep seated sense of patriotism but because they feel a pressure from the pack mentality of everyone else standing.  It's rote.  But that doesn't bother you because it supports your viewpoint.  

And you keep pushing this narrative about resisting arrest without acknowledging all of the police killings of black people who were not resisting.  And I agree that happens, no doubt about it and there is misplaced outrage when it does but you push it as the complete narrative and ignore the ones that don't fit neatly into that wrapper: Tamir Rice, Philando Castile, Laquon McDonald, Eric Garner, John Crawford III... the list goes on and on.  

There is a problem with disproportionate use of force in policing between white and non-white people in this country and it shouldn't be ignored or dismissed with over generalized statements like you are making.  

Please stop trying to polish that turd and acknowledge that there is at least some foundation in reality and not just a bunch of black people "resisting arrest" and calling for the death of police.  If you can't do that then it is simply you choosing to ignore reality.  As much and as often as I disagree with you around here, I have always thought you were better than that.

 

[Boston]

Maybe, but I'd bet the organization would lose more than a few sponsors and season ticket holders by keeping him.

They can't win...and the tough part is he's a borderline guy who you can make a case for keeping or releasing...

 

[spider321]

They can't win...and the tough part is he's a borderline guy who you can make a case for keeping or releasing...

Imo, they will either cut him or just pay him to stay home all season, and cut him later.

i doubt they allow him to make the real games about himself.

 

[Chaka]

Having NFL teams divided and making the sports headlines about idiots like Kaepernick trying to be political? No thanks.

Meh.  I get not wanting to be forced to think about serious issues during our recreational times but the NFL is a political organization whether we want to acknowledge it or not.  Quick example is the almost pulling the Super Bowl from Arizona for trying to pass an anti-gay law or the fact that they are currently pumping money into the political campaigns of representatives reviewing concussion research.

Sure, the actions are self serving but there is no question that they use their popularity to influence politics.

 

[Chaka]

People are still talking about Kaepernick and the reasons he is doing what he is doing.  But some people want to pretend that he hasn't advanced the conversation the nation has been trying to have for far too long (and some are resisting far too much).

 

[Chaka]

Kaepernick giving $1 million to charities

 

[Chaka]

FTR the whole pig sock thing was a terrible thing for Kaepernick to do and he definitely deserves to be ridiculed for such an obviously childish and ignorant action.  And his defense of it was just awful.  I am surprised more people are not getting on him for that and instead are attacking the completely reasonable method of protest, and drawing national interest/awareness, about a topic that is important to the future of our nation.

 

[Sconch]

I am 100% positive that that Chip Kelly and the rest of the Niners brass would LOVE to cut this idiot. I'm just not sure they'd want the hub bub that would go along with it. They are almost trapped into keeping hi8m now. They cut this clown and al Sharpton would be pleaded to blacks to boycott their games. BLM would be demonstrating outside their stadium. This is a horrible situation for the 49ers.

You seem awfully triggered.  Do you need a safe-space?

 

[biju]

Some of you folks need to read Martin Luther King Jr's letter from Birmingham jail and understand the message said there.  While I don't agree with Kaepernick's specific choice here (and I really don't care for Kaepernick) I think this is actually a fantastic way to raise the issue.

 

[jonessed]

Really Junior?  The funny thing is that you don't realize that the reason most people stand for the anthem is not out of some deep seated sense of patriotism but because they feel a pressure from the pack mentality of everyone else standing.  It's rote.  But that doesn't bother you because it supports your viewpoint.  

And you keep pushing this narrative about resisting arrest without acknowledging all of the police killings of black people who were not resisting.  And I agree that happens, no doubt about it and there is misplaced outrage when it does but you push it as the complete narrative and ignore the ones that don't fit neatly into that wrapper: Tamir Rice, Philando Castile, Laquon McDonald, Eric Garner, John Crawford III... the list goes on and on.  

There is a problem with disproportionate use of force in policing between white and non-white people in this country and it shouldn't be ignored or dismissed with over generalized statements like you are making.  

Please stop trying to polish that turd and acknowledge that there is at least some foundation in reality and not just a bunch of black people "resisting arrest" and calling for the death of police.  If you can't do that then it is simply you choosing to ignore reality.  As much and as often as I disagree with you around here, I have always thought you were better than that.

Link?

 

[ponchsox]

Kap needs to watch Band of Brothers before the season starts.

 

[spider321]

Kap needs to watch Band of Brothers before the season starts.

He will have plenty of time to watch it during the season.

 

[jonessed]

FTR the whole pig sock thing was a terrible thing for Kaepernick to do and he definitely deserves to be ridiculed for such an obviously childish and ignorant action.  And his defense of it was just awful.  I am surprised more people are not getting on him for that and instead are attacking the completely reasonable method of protest, and drawing national interest/awareness, about a topic that is important to the future of our nation.

They are generally intertwined now.  The pig-police story just came out later so it doesn't lead.