Your implication was that they should keep their heads down and speak about nothing but football. My point is that they still live in our world, and can speak out about the world they live in.And who determines those? You?
What changes come about from kneeling for the anthem? I think we are finding out. And I'm not sure it's all good.1.Anthropomorphizing the flag is really strange.
2. Not to put words in anybody's mouth but there are some people/groups that are not proud of our nation right now.
3. Playing the dead veteran card is cheap and easy. Those people died not for the flag but so that we can live in a nation where we are not compelled to participate in patriotic demonstrations.
4. No idea what the breast cancer point is about.
5. Why do you assume that none of these players take any actions besides kneeling during the anthem?
6. Per your last paragraph: what changes come about when people stand for the anthem? What organizations have been created? Something beyond "comroderie".
So all this crap is just about playing politics?Just today?
I think kaep helped to bring even more national attention to the issue he felt passionate about.
I find it rather disingenuous to try and ask about what all the protests today accomplished as far as change given they just happened. And most today aren’t about the initial issue...they are a response to the President running his mouth.
The President of the United States called their friends and teammates sons of #####es and lobbied for them to be fired.Except that was their focus every other week as well. All of those weeks they stood on the sideline during the National Anthem. Today, they stay in the locker room. What was different about today?
Thank you. You've made my point in here better than I could. All these "protests" are doing is causing more division in our country. They're not helping ####And yet, that's exactly what happened.
My implication was they aren't obligated to protest for your vision of humanity.Your implication was that they should keep their heads down and speak about nothing but football. My point is that they still live in our world, and can speak out about the world they live in.
Kneeling is not protesting the flag actually.Yes. Both are protesting the flag.
There have been several national discussions in the issues Kaep raised...pretty much his point of doing so.No, not just today. All the times someone sat for the anthem. Who was helped by that? I'm interested in the results. I haven't seen any. Show me
So to be clear, the protests during the National Anthem today was against Trump or against social injustice?The President of the United States called their friends and teammates sons of #####es and lobbied for them to be fired.
Trump? Yes...he decided to make a crapstorm and that’s what happened.So all this crap is just about playing politics?
I was replying to a point of his. If standing doesn't change things who cares if somebody kneels?What changes come about from kneeling for the anthem? I think we are finding out. And I'm not sure it's all good.
Did you see my post on Lesean McCoy. Curious what you think about that?
Ah, discussions were had. I'm sure that those helped alotThere have been several national discussions in the issues Kaep raised...pretty much his point of doing so.
Not sure anyone knows the answer to that, including the protesters.So to be clear, the protests during the National Anthem today was against Trump or against social injustice?
Some of both.So to be clear, the protests during the National Anthem today was against Trump or against social injustice?
It's no skin off his back. He seems to like the attention.Trump? Yes...he decided to make a crapstorm and that’s what happened.
Some may have...Ah, discussions were had. I'm sure that those helped alot
My bad
Yeah...that’s what the President should be focusing on.It's no skin off his back. He seems to like the attention.
He screwed the NFL pretty good though. They are in one hell of a ####storm.
Didn't Michael Bennett say he was sitting because of segregation?Not sure anyone knows the answer to that, including the protesters.
Really? If your television is on you cant miss it. The camera shows all the "protestors" and then on top of that, the announcers point out who sat/knelt before kickoffAnd if somebody is so focused on who is standing or kneeling or stretching that's their problem.
The rioting was even more publicized and ended up doing jack. Attention just for attention's sake doesn't really do much. There has to be a link to a political action plan.Ah, discussions were had. I'm sure that those helped alot
My bad
I don't believe that. Do you?Yeah...that’s what the President should be focusing on.
Created by a disrespectful idiot posing as a hack QB.What a mess
What do you want them to do? Demonstrate so they can be pepper sprayed and tear gassed and shoved aside by army surplus tanks?Ah, discussions were had. I'm sure that those helped alot
My bad
And did the players that stood in support of those that want to kneel add to this crapstorm? This is like the Trump with North Korea. I ship has sailed on our President acting Presidential, but that doesn't mean we have to stoop to his level.Trump? Yes...he decided to make a crapstorm and that’s what happened.
Was that before or after he got caught running from the police and lying about it?Didn't Michael Bennett say he was sitting because of segregation?
Better to not discuss. Things improve by keeping quiet. Got it. ??Ah, discussions were had. I'm sure that those helped alot
My bad
If you don't understand the significance of a group saying I want to discredit those who gave their lives so that I can live freely in order to draw attention to myself, when there are literally hundreds of other ways to do it, then you don't get it.1.Anthropomorphizing the flag is really strange.
2. Not to put words in anybody's mouth but there are some people/groups that are not proud of our nation right now.
3. Playing the dead veteran card is cheap and easy. Those people died not for the flag but so that we can live in a nation where we are not compelled to participate in patriotic demonstrations.
4. No idea what the breast cancer point is about.
5. Why do you assume that none of these players take any actions besides kneeling during the anthem?
6. Per your last paragraph: what changes come about when people stand for the anthem? What organizations have been created? Something beyond "comroderie".
Apparently for his segment of protests they represent Black Panther with the fist in air which he now does after sacks?Didn't Michael Bennett say he was sitting because of segregation?
Trump backed the black men into a corner, forced a confrontation for the sake of his base.And did the players that stood in support of those that want to kneel add to this crapstorm? This is like the Trump with North Korea. I ship has sailed on our President acting Presidential, but that doesn't mean we have to stoop to his level.
An amazingly ignorant response, wasn't it?Better to not discuss. Things improve by keeping quiet. Got it. ??
Today? Yes...before today? Not really.Really? If your television is on you cant miss it. The camera shows all the "protestors" and then on top of that, the announcers point out who sat/knelt before kickoff
It takes two to tango. It was immature by both sides. The winner is the one that starts acting like a grown up.Trump backed the black men into a corner, forced a confrontation for the sake of his base.
I dont think it was a coincidence that he started his protesting right after he got benched.I don't know if kaepernick was right or wrong to protest, but he was definitely brave. He risked, and has apparently lost, a multi million dollar career to make a stand for an issue he believed was important.
I have no problem with people who say it was inappropriate to choose that platform. I have no problem with people who say it was ineffective, although I think that's debatable. I understand people saying they don't want him on their team, or that they don't want players on their team to use televised NFL games as a platform for causes they believe in.
I do have a problem with people acting like they've always stood up and taken off their cap for the anthem and never talked to a friend or been handed a beer and set it down, because I've been to games in cities all around the country and there aren't nearly as many people respecting the flag as there are people upset about someone else disrespecting the flag.
I do have a problem with people acting like standing for the anthem is the issue when they really mean they don't agree with the cause. And I have a much bigger problem with people doing that and not taking time to understand what the cause is.
And while I understand that people are upset that kaep brought politics to the anthem, I think a lot of right wing folks have pushed their agendas to make it a divisive political issue too. Because I know a lot of left wing people who have a wide range of opinions about this, but it seems like most of the fervently right wing folks i know are marching in lock step on an issue which they themselves weren't that serious until it became political. Which would be fine, if they weren't also clamoring about kaep and other players making this political. I find that closed minded and hypocritical.
No, that would be like comparing apples andIs your job in a national spotlight where you can do something to maybe get a conversation going that could create some change to what you see as an injustice?
Can we stop trying to compare an NFL job to what most of the people on this board do?
Yeah, really.Really? If your television is on you cant miss it. The camera shows all the "protestors" and then on top of that, the announcers point out who sat/knelt before kickoff
I asked for positive results. Still haven't been shown anyBetter to not discuss. Things improve by keeping quiet. Got it. ??
Seeing how trump is incapable of acting like an adult, let's talk about the players. What would an appropriate response on the part of the players looked like?It takes two to tango. It was immature by both sides. The winner is the one that starts acting like a grown up.
Or lack of..in this caseIt's not my place to judge how others demonstrate their patriotism.
Well said. This.If you don't understand the significance of a group saying I want to discredit those who gave their lives so that I can live freely in order to draw attention to myself, when there are literally hundreds of other ways to do it, then you don't get it.
Do yourself a favor. Go visit a wounded veterans facility, vets retirement home, or a military base and pitch this cause and educate yourself. You might learn something about the difference between selfless sacrifice for all versus kardashian-like spotlighting for effect
And his vote would have made such a difference in California.The guy can't even bother to vote. That's where the real power is.
We are beyond that now. Not even Trump can stop this. The NFL is going to have to figure this out on their own.It takes two to tango. It was immature by both sides. The winner is the one that starts acting like a grown up.
Or how about "it's not my place to judge if people participate in outward displays of patriotism or not".Or lack of..in this case
It probably isn't a coincidence. That doesn't mean he didn't risk a lot. He was a lock to make 8 figures over the rest of his career as an NFL backup, and he might never get paid to play football again.I dont think it was a coincidence that he started his protesting right after he got benched.